Guild Wars 2

Whelp.. got linked to the same server, with a third dead server added, another week of 1 pip.. and no claim tickets…..

Dawdler.8521:

Falkor.7932:

Outnumbered is so ridiculously delicious. When I got my first outnumbered tick with even just bronze WvW rank (+1), I wondered why it didn’t always feel that good.

My Recommendation is to reduce outnumbered to doubling your current war score placement pips. As for the two pips removed from outnumbered, I would add additional Commitment levels for bronze and silver, totaling +3 possible.

Wouldnt that give more points to the dominating server (when outmanned vs lesser servers) and less point to the weaker servers (when outmanned vs the dominating server)?

Sounds sort of opposite to how it should be…

I had the same thought.

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Your math i’s stuck where you get three pips and i get one pip

Then eotm ktrain up to level 150 and cut your week in half giving you a better shot at atleast 2 per tick thus giving you a better shot at finishing wood thus giving you 3 per tick the next week, or map hop for the outnumbered, or transfer to a better server, or continue to wallow and devote your entire week to a fruitless effort.

The power to do better than 1 should is always in their hands just as their own time management is their problem not that of those that are a hundred levels higher.

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Your math i’s stuck where you get three pips and i get one pip

Ok. There are 100 pips in the wood chest.

At 1 pip per tick, that’s 500 minutes. Assuming that you only get one pip per tick the entire time.

500 minutes = 8.33 hours.

That’s a little over 2 hours a day for four days.

Do I think that’s too much time for the wood chest? Yes.

But that’s not an entire work week, unless you work a lot less in a week than I do.

Do that for one week.
The next week, you’ll get the loyalty pip, which will get you 2 pips a tick. So 250 minutes, or a bit over 4 hours. Now you’re down to 2 2-ish hour runs, again assuming only 2 pips per tick.

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Your math i’s stuck where you get three pips and i get one pip

Ok. There are 100 pips in the wood chest.

At 1 pip per tick, that’s 500 minutes. Assuming that you only get one pip per tick the entire time.

500 minutes = 8.33 hours.

That’s a little over 2 hours a day for four days.

Do I think that’s too much time for the wood chest? Yes.

But that’s not an entire work week, unless you work a lot less in a week than I do.

Do that for one week.
The next week, you’ll get the loyalty pip, which will get you 2 pips a tick. So 250 minutes, or a bit over 4 hours. Now you’re down to 2 2-ish hour runs, again assuming only 2 pips per tick.

This.

Mix in the occasional outnumbered bonus and, soon enough, an additional pip for rank to see yourself completing wood in a single play session.

My problem with the pips is that they are passive.

When I play a PvP match, win or lose I will be awarded a certain number of pips at the end of the match – more if I win, less if I lose. I don’t really feel like I’m actually “achieving” these WvW pips, if it makes sense; just sorta passively gaining them. And it’s boring.

Ark Bladesteele.2943:

My problem with the pips is that they are passive.

When I play a PvP match, win or lose I will be awarded a certain number of pips at the end of the match – more if I win, less if I lose. I don’t really feel like I’m actually “achieving” these WvW pips, if it makes sense; just sorta passively gaining them. And it’s boring.

Work for ranks instead, then, or for targeting specific objectives.

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Your math i’s stuck where you get three pips and i get one pip

Ok. There are 100 pips in the wood chest.

At 1 pip per tick, that’s 500 minutes. Assuming that you only get one pip per tick the entire time.

500 minutes = 8.33 hours.

That’s a little over 2 hours a day for four days.

Do I think that’s too much time for the wood chest? Yes.

But that’s not an entire work week, unless you work a lot less in a week than I do.

Do that for one week.
The next week, you’ll get the loyalty pip, which will get you 2 pips a tick. So 250 minutes, or a bit over 4 hours. Now you’re down to 2 2-ish hour runs, again assuming only 2 pips per tick.

If i work all week i have an hour, maybe 2 in the evening. I dont always want to dedicate all my evenings to one game, much less one game mode. 8 hours on a weekend day is also harsh, i want to go out with my friends on the weekends.
In pve i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In pvp i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In wvw i can’t do bits of things because only complete things are rewarded and then reset.

Now that I think about, wouldnt it make sense for the pips to reset every 4 weeks with the matchmaking, rather than weekly? Just like the pvp track resets per season and not per week

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Your math i’s stuck where you get three pips and i get one pip

Ok. There are 100 pips in the wood chest.

At 1 pip per tick, that’s 500 minutes. Assuming that you only get one pip per tick the entire time.

500 minutes = 8.33 hours.

That’s a little over 2 hours a day for four days.

Do I think that’s too much time for the wood chest? Yes.

But that’s not an entire work week, unless you work a lot less in a week than I do.

Do that for one week.
The next week, you’ll get the loyalty pip, which will get you 2 pips a tick. So 250 minutes, or a bit over 4 hours. Now you’re down to 2 2-ish hour runs, again assuming only 2 pips per tick.

If i work all week i have an hour, maybe 2 in the evening. I dont always want to dedicate all my evenings to one game, much less one game mode. 8 hours on a weekend day is also harsh, i want to go out with my friends on the weekends.
In pve i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In pvp i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In wvw i can’t do bits of things because only complete things are rewarded and then reset.

Now that I think about, wouldnt it make sense for the pips to reset every 4 weeks with the matchmaking, rather than weekly? Just like the pvp track resets per season and not per week

Dear me, seems you’ve made choices that are good for you. Why should the game be changed to match your personal choices?

You can still earn pips, just at a slower pace. And that’s your choice.

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Your math i’s stuck where you get three pips and i get one pip

Ok. There are 100 pips in the wood chest.

At 1 pip per tick, that’s 500 minutes. Assuming that you only get one pip per tick the entire time.

500 minutes = 8.33 hours.

That’s a little over 2 hours a day for four days.

Do I think that’s too much time for the wood chest? Yes.

But that’s not an entire work week, unless you work a lot less in a week than I do.

Do that for one week.
The next week, you’ll get the loyalty pip, which will get you 2 pips a tick. So 250 minutes, or a bit over 4 hours. Now you’re down to 2 2-ish hour runs, again assuming only 2 pips per tick.

If i work all week i have an hour, maybe 2 in the evening. I dont always want to dedicate all my evenings to one game, much less one game mode. 8 hours on a weekend day is also harsh, i want to go out with my friends on the weekends.
In pve i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In pvp i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In wvw i can’t do bits of things because only complete things are rewarded and then reset.

Now that I think about, wouldnt it make sense for the pips to reset every 4 weeks with the matchmaking, rather than weekly? Just like the pvp track resets per season and not per week

I commend you for playing Real Life and Outside instead of WvW.

I would suggest that you pop boosters and work on rank up first, then. That will get you to 150, and two pips. Then a single week at four hours for the loyalty pip, and you can maintain wood at two ish hours a week.

Unless Anet decides to up the base pip game, that’s how the pip farm works…

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Your math i’s stuck where you get three pips and i get one pip

Ok. There are 100 pips in the wood chest.

At 1 pip per tick, that’s 500 minutes. Assuming that you only get one pip per tick the entire time.

500 minutes = 8.33 hours.

That’s a little over 2 hours a day for four days.

Do I think that’s too much time for the wood chest? Yes.

But that’s not an entire work week, unless you work a lot less in a week than I do.

Do that for one week.
The next week, you’ll get the loyalty pip, which will get you 2 pips a tick. So 250 minutes, or a bit over 4 hours. Now you’re down to 2 2-ish hour runs, again assuming only 2 pips per tick.

If i work all week i have an hour, maybe 2 in the evening. I dont always want to dedicate all my evenings to one game, much less one game mode. 8 hours on a weekend day is also harsh, i want to go out with my friends on the weekends.
In pve i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In pvp i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In wvw i can’t do bits of things because only complete things are rewarded and then reset.

Now that I think about, wouldnt it make sense for the pips to reset every 4 weeks with the matchmaking, rather than weekly? Just like the pvp track resets per season and not per week

Actually you can earn rewards in WvW with a bit of play at a time just like in PvE.

Drops from kills, reward track chests, etc.

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Your math i’s stuck where you get three pips and i get one pip

Ok. There are 100 pips in the wood chest.

At 1 pip per tick, that’s 500 minutes. Assuming that you only get one pip per tick the entire time.

500 minutes = 8.33 hours.

That’s a little over 2 hours a day for four days.

Do I think that’s too much time for the wood chest? Yes.

But that’s not an entire work week, unless you work a lot less in a week than I do.

Do that for one week.
The next week, you’ll get the loyalty pip, which will get you 2 pips a tick. So 250 minutes, or a bit over 4 hours. Now you’re down to 2 2-ish hour runs, again assuming only 2 pips per tick.

If i work all week i have an hour, maybe 2 in the evening. I dont always want to dedicate all my evenings to one game, much less one game mode. 8 hours on a weekend day is also harsh, i want to go out with my friends on the weekends.
In pve i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In pvp i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In wvw i can’t do bits of things because only complete things are rewarded and then reset.

Now that I think about, wouldnt it make sense for the pips to reset every 4 weeks with the matchmaking, rather than weekly? Just like the pvp track resets per season and not per week

?4 week matchmaking? Do you mean the 8 – 9 week relinkings?

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Your math i’s stuck where you get three pips and i get one pip

Ok. There are 100 pips in the wood chest.

At 1 pip per tick, that’s 500 minutes. Assuming that you only get one pip per tick the entire time.

500 minutes = 8.33 hours.

That’s a little over 2 hours a day for four days.

Do I think that’s too much time for the wood chest? Yes.

But that’s not an entire work week, unless you work a lot less in a week than I do.

Do that for one week.
The next week, you’ll get the loyalty pip, which will get you 2 pips a tick. So 250 minutes, or a bit over 4 hours. Now you’re down to 2 2-ish hour runs, again assuming only 2 pips per tick.

If i work all week i have an hour, maybe 2 in the evening. I dont always want to dedicate all my evenings to one game, much less one game mode. 8 hours on a weekend day is also harsh, i want to go out with my friends on the weekends.
In pve i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In pvp i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In wvw i can’t do bits of things because only complete things are rewarded and then reset.

Now that I think about, wouldnt it make sense for the pips to reset every 4 weeks with the matchmaking, rather than weekly? Just like the pvp track resets per season and not per week

You’re a casual at least by the time spent playing definition.

I’m also a casual by the time spent playing definition.

We casuals can’t expect all rewards to be earned in a reasonable time frame for us. And that the rewards aren’t worth the time and/or effort required.

Like for me. I’d love legendary armor. But I don’t have the desire to put forth the effort to learn raids at the moment. Nor do I have the inclination to pay to be carried. So for me, legendary armor just isn’t obtainable for me. And it’s something that I accept and I don’t cry to ANet to make it obtainable for me.

And unlike for legendary armor, rewards earned by what you get from PIPS is just earned more slowly for you than others. So make those rewards your long term goals. Shorter term goals could include increasing your WvW rank to make PIP earning faster.

Jayne.9251:

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Your math i’s stuck where you get three pips and i get one pip

Ok. There are 100 pips in the wood chest.

At 1 pip per tick, that’s 500 minutes. Assuming that you only get one pip per tick the entire time.

500 minutes = 8.33 hours.

That’s a little over 2 hours a day for four days.

Do I think that’s too much time for the wood chest? Yes.

But that’s not an entire work week, unless you work a lot less in a week than I do.

Do that for one week.
The next week, you’ll get the loyalty pip, which will get you 2 pips a tick. So 250 minutes, or a bit over 4 hours. Now you’re down to 2 2-ish hour runs, again assuming only 2 pips per tick.

If i work all week i have an hour, maybe 2 in the evening. I dont always want to dedicate all my evenings to one game, much less one game mode. 8 hours on a weekend day is also harsh, i want to go out with my friends on the weekends.
In pve i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In pvp i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In wvw i can’t do bits of things because only complete things are rewarded and then reset.

Now that I think about, wouldnt it make sense for the pips to reset every 4 weeks with the matchmaking, rather than weekly? Just like the pvp track resets per season and not per week

Dear me, seems you’ve made choices that are good for you. Why should the game be changed to match your personal choices?

You can still earn pips, just at a slower pace. And that’s your choice.

I earn pips at a slower rate, and that is FINE, it really is. I agree, less time played should be less reward.
>HOWEVER<
Unlike PvE and PvP, you can’t earn slow rewards in WvW, you can only earn it all, or nothing of it.
90 of 100 pips doesn’t mean 90% of the reward, it means 0% of the reward
1-99 pips = nothing
100 pips = the full reward

this is my problem, if you cannot make the minimum hours anet wants you to play, which is 500 minutes a week, you get ZERO reward, not a fraction of the reward, not a slower progress, you get nil, nada, zero, negative.

PvP, I can do 3 matches a day, I can do 20 matches a day, it will change the speed at which I progress the path of ascension.
In PvE, I can do 1 fractal a day or them all, I can choose to kill 1 raid boss a week or all 13, I will earn fractions or all of the rewards,
but in WvW I cannot choose do some work today, and some work next week, no, you have to do a complete track within the allocated time or you get NOTHING and you can kiss the door on your way out…. so…. yeaa….

Amaimon.7823:

Jayne.9251:

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Sarika.3756:

Amaimon.7823:

Chaba.5410:

Amaimon.7823:

if you’re not rank 3000 by now, there’s no way in seven realms of oblivion and the gazing abyss behind it that you can complete the wooden chest in one week.

No need for the hyperbole. I finished Silver on an account with rank 780 in 6-8 hours of WvW by getting either 3 pips per tick (2 for rank, 1 for third place) or 8 with outnumbered buff.

Except when youre on a skritt server that is just active enough to never have the outnumbered bonus, but inactive enough to always fail, so im cursed with 1 pip per tick, meaning i have to sacrifice my entire working week for getting the wooden chest, and thats just ridiculously disproportionate

I have a level 150 ish alt on a server that’s often in third place. I can expect 3 pips at a time, one for rank, one for placement, one for loyalty. I usually get the wood chest at the end of the first nights guild raid.

I don’t see how getting wood on a low level account can take an entire work week. Where is my math wrong here?

Your math i’s stuck where you get three pips and i get one pip

Ok. There are 100 pips in the wood chest.

At 1 pip per tick, that’s 500 minutes. Assuming that you only get one pip per tick the entire time.

500 minutes = 8.33 hours.

That’s a little over 2 hours a day for four days.

Do I think that’s too much time for the wood chest? Yes.

But that’s not an entire work week, unless you work a lot less in a week than I do.

Do that for one week.
The next week, you’ll get the loyalty pip, which will get you 2 pips a tick. So 250 minutes, or a bit over 4 hours. Now you’re down to 2 2-ish hour runs, again assuming only 2 pips per tick.

If i work all week i have an hour, maybe 2 in the evening. I dont always want to dedicate all my evenings to one game, much less one game mode. 8 hours on a weekend day is also harsh, i want to go out with my friends on the weekends.
In pve i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In pvp i can do bits of things, the rewards pile up.
In wvw i can’t do bits of things because only complete things are rewarded and then reset.

Now that I think about, wouldnt it make sense for the pips to reset every 4 weeks with the matchmaking, rather than weekly? Just like the pvp track resets per season and not per week

Dear me, seems you’ve made choices that are good for you. Why should the game be changed to match your personal choices?

You can still earn pips, just at a slower pace. And that’s your choice.

I earn pips at a slower rate, and that is FINE, it really is. I agree, less time played should be less reward.
>HOWEVER<
Unlike PvE and PvP, you can’t earn slow rewards in WvW, you can only earn it all, or nothing of it.
90 of 100 pips doesn’t mean 90% of the reward, it means 0% of the reward
1-99 pips = nothing
100 pips = the full reward

this is my problem, if you cannot make the minimum hours anet wants you to play, which is 500 minutes a week, you get ZERO reward, not a fraction of the reward, not a slower progress, you get nil, nada, zero, negative.

PvP, I can do 3 matches a day, I can do 20 matches a day, it will change the speed at which I progress the path of ascension.
In PvE, I can do 1 fractal a day or them all, I can choose to kill 1 raid boss a week or all 13, I will earn fractions or all of the rewards,
but in WvW I cannot choose do some work today, and some work next week, no, you have to do a complete track within the allocated time or you get NOTHING and you can kiss the door on your way out…. so…. yeaa….

Even if you cannot play 500 minutes per week you most certainly do not get ZERO rewards.

There are drops, individual skirmish chests, reward track progress, rank up chests, etc.

Ignoring the rewards that do come does not mean that they dont exist.

Rank up. Get to 2 pips per tick. Perhaps even look for the outnumbered bonus for a couple of play sessions. Complete bronze once with these extra pips and you are at less than three hours per week to complete bronze in subsequent weeks.

All the while you will be earning rewards.

Sarrs.4831:

morrolan.9608:

Some more feedback. Its probably been said already but how do anet justify T3 armour taking far longer than legendary armour to acquire when its just ascended, albeit good looking ascended armor.

There’s no skill element to it.

Grinding rank and earning pips have no fundamental group or personal skill requirement. There’s no absolute skill required to pip well; you just need to do better than your opponents. You don’t even need to actually play- many people are earning many pips by afking.

You can’t AFK the legendary armor unless you’re obscenely rich. You can’t lowskill the legendary armor unless you’re obscenely rich.

Sure you can, you know guilds sell raid runs right. And thats leaving aside the fact that raids dont require a lot of skill anyway.

They need to place less emphasis on pips based on wvw rank, and award more pips by doing things. Like capping structures, being outnumbered and killing enemy players. We need a lot more pips coming in so that it doesn’t take 30-40 hrs of wvw play per week to hit ticket cap. It should be on par with spvps pip/league tickets in terms of hours required per week.

Jumpin Lumpix.6108:

They need to place less emphasis on pips based on wvw rank, and award more pips by doing things. Like capping structures, being outnumbered and killing enemy players. We need a lot more pips coming in so that it doesn’t take 30-40 hrs of wvw play per week to hit ticket cap. It should be on par with spvps pip/league tickets in terms of hours required per week.

For the umptienth time, you cant do this without encouraging karma training and exploits. Just like PPT, pip tick is necessary for a balanced playing field.

That said, I still think the rank pips should be boosted by +2 across all ranks while outnumbered is reduced to +2. Wouldnt hurt if the commitment pip was +2 as well. System is fine, numbers need some tweaks.

Here’s an idea. If everyone’s all about the tickets. What if, for the lower tiers, wood, and mithril, I think it’s mithril… What if you take a portion of the tickets from the end chest and put them in each chest?

Final wood chest gives 10 tickies, no? What if, in the 4 chests, they gave 1, 1, 3, and 5 tickets. And the same in mithril, 1, 1, 3, and 10? Same rewards in total, just spread out a little to give that little bit of incentive all the PvE’rs are wanting.
>__o¿
That way, if they don’t have ‘time’ to finish a block completely, they still get something from it.

Edit: I say only the first couple, because if you’re going to play enough to get past the first 2 tiers, you can play enough to go balls out and finish the rest of the tiers like you’re not there for just the skins.

Please note that I have not read this thread in it’s entirety, I simply have a suggestion I’d like to add to address one of the issues of the pip system, specifically in regards to the Outnumbered buff.

Dedicated thread to the suggestion here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Suggestion-Outnumbered-Pip-Rework/first#post6637017

In summary, remove the pips from the Outnumbered buff which will return it to it’s previous state, and remains as a map by map entity. Instead, move these pips into a new Team Outnumbered buff that takes all four maps into account, and divide it into tiers ranging from minor, which would award +1, to significantly outnumbered, which would award +5.

This eliminates map hopping to find an outnumbered map as well as the issue of people not doing call outs because they don’t want to lose the buff. You can play on what ever map you want, and because the buff is team wide, if you’re outnumbered it feels more like a bonus when you have it, rather than feeling like you’re not being as efficient as you could be if you were actively seeking out the buff.

So much Outmanned pip whinging. This is more venting than constructive, but…

Outmanned is there for a reason. It has 5 pips for a reason.

Why do people want it nerfed or removed? Do you not want people to be incentivized to play against you, even if you have an overwhelming advantage?

AngelDiscarnate.5489:

Here’s an idea. If everyone’s all about the tickets. What if, for the lower tiers, wood, and mithril, I think it’s mithril… What if you take a portion of the tickets from the end chest and put them in each chest?

Final wood chest gives 10 tickies, no? What if, in the 4 chests, they gave 1, 1, 3, and 5 tickets. And the same in mithril, 1, 1, 3, and 10? Same rewards in total, just spread out a little to give that little bit of incentive all the PvE’rs are wanting.
>__o¿
That way, if they don’t have ‘time’ to finish a block completely, they still get something from it.

+1
+10
+58732747041472511379480465

Sarrs.4831:

So much Outmanned pip whinging. This is more venting than constructive, but…

Outmanned is there for a reason. It has 5 pips for a reason.

Why do people want it nerfed or removed? Do you not want people to be incentivized to play against you, even if you have an overwhelming advantage?

The problem is Outmanned PIP bonus is having the exact opposite affect on WvW play.

When WvW #pipstress farmers are on a map, most have a tendency to not call out that a map is outmanned (or wait as long as possible) even though objectives are being taken non-stop including keeps being lost because it hinders their own PIP reward progression.

Secondly, #pipstress farmers are basically afk-in-usefulness players. That #pipstress farmer is there for the reward tick and switch back to whatever map can give them active participation again.

TL;DR Outmanned PIP bonus is detrimental to WvW coordinated team play.

Artaz.3819:

Sarrs.4831:

So much Outmanned pip whinging. This is more venting than constructive, but…

Outmanned is there for a reason. It has 5 pips for a reason.

Why do people want it nerfed or removed? Do you not want people to be incentivized to play against you, even if you have an overwhelming advantage?

The problem is Outmanned PIP bonus is having the exact opposite affect on WvW play.

When WvW #pipstress farmers are on a map, most have a tendency to not call out that a map is outmanned (or wait as long as possible) even though objectives are being taken non-stop including keeps being lost because it hinders their own PIP reward progression.

Secondly, #pipstress farmers are basically afk-in-usefulness players. That #pipstress farmer is there for the reward tick and switch back to whatever map can give them active participation again.

TL;DR Outmanned PIP bonus is detrimental to WvW coordinated team play.

First off, haven’t seen this. Second not certain these same people would have called out before anyway. This sound more of an issue of scouts and not having any that are really scouts. In either case if people are in doubt and are cross map watching they should be sending people over to take a look for themselves if they aren’t getting real reports.

Wait.
Are there people REALLY complaining about the fact that -vets- are receiving more rewards because they have been around longer?
Are you actually kidding me?
I am a new player to WvW (Rank 22), been playing PVE and PVP for about a year and a half, going on two.
Are you literally going to sit there and try to justify the fact that because you did not grind, work for, or earn ranks you are going to whine and cry?
That is like me crying about the fact that most VET PVErs (which most of you complainers are, I have no DOUBT in my mind), have the kitten Tequatl Wings backpiece, or the Chainsaw Greatsword that costs over 1k gold on the market, or the Crimson Wurm Head mini that was completely -removed- from the game and only again, say it with me now, -vets- have?
How you all even sit there (especially you veteran PVErs) sit there, and trying to even justify this?!
Does it take you only a week to build a legendary if you are starting a new account?
Does it take you only a week to build ascended? Or to do the storymodes, or getting enough AR to climb to t4 fractals?
So -why- in Dwayna’s name do you want to be spoonfed?
Have you not play any form an MMO that requires -work-, -time-, -effort? Are those not principles anymore?

I am actually ashamed to see people trying to reap more reward than they even remotely deserve. I will fully admit. I was -kittened- that I had to grind for the Gift of Battle because, at the time, the thought of going up against full tier maps and just getting farmed on depressed me. But going in with friends (mind you they did not even have as much PVP knowledge as me), allowed us to -have- fun. My friend who -hated- PVP now loves it because of WvW. He knows how to be a proper scout, to do call-outs, to hell even now become an ele main because he was so determined to help our little 5-man party out. Even the kitten PVEr of the group who only played support druid had more fun with a bit of cooperation from the more PVP-experienced ones. The rewards should -not- be the big priority. It should be the kitten experiences and skills that you can apply to other gamemodes to make -you- as a player better at the game.

Moral of the rant: I have no sympathy for those who want insta-gratification.

Artaz.3819:

The problem is Outmanned PIP bonus is having the exact opposite affect on WvW play.

When WvW #pipstress farmers are on a map, most have a tendency to not call out that a map is outmanned (or wait as long as possible) even though objectives are being taken non-stop including keeps being lost because it hinders their own PIP reward progression.

Secondly, #pipstress farmers are basically afk-in-usefulness players. That #pipstress farmer is there for the reward tick and switch back to whatever map can give them active participation again.

TL;DR Outmanned PIP bonus is detrimental to WvW coordinated team play.

This seems like a really minor issue.

If you have outmanned on your map and it’s strategically prudent to call it, call it. Convince other people to do the same. But expecting the system to be changed because of this seems a bit unreasonable. Pruning out this system because of the chance it’ll cause goofballs to not make calls for defense seems like throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

AFK pip farmers aren’t actually detrimental unless they’re forcing Outmanned to drop on a map with lots of roamer deaths (in which case they’re not getting Outmanned pips anyway) or forcing a mapcap (in which case from whence cometh outmanned). Guys sitting around afk in spawn… Aren’t doing anything, by definition.

Sarrs.4831:

This seems like a really minor issue.

If you have outmanned on your map and it’s strategically prudent to call it, call it. Convince other people to do the same. But expecting the system to be changed because of this seems a bit unreasonable. Pruning out this system because of the chance it’ll cause goofballs to not make calls for defense seems like throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

AFK pip farmers aren’t actually detrimental unless they’re forcing Outmanned to drop on a map with lots of roamer deaths (in which case they’re not getting Outmanned pips anyway) or forcing a mapcap (in which case from whence cometh outmanned). Guys sitting around afk in spawn… Aren’t doing anything, by definition.

In my experience, it’s the fact that there are a number of people that hop around to find an outmanned map just before the tick to get the buff, because that +5 bonus to pips is just too big to ignore, which invariably takes away the outmanned buff from those that have been there for hours trying to fight the good fight as people rushing the map push it over the limit, and they only stay in spawn just long enough to muck it up then pop back to whatever map they came from. So it’s not just those that afk, it’s active players, too.

Don’t know if that’s been proposed before?

How about increasing pips… or base experience, the longer you hold things?
Like for example, holding smc for > 1 hour = +1 pip, but any team taking smc back after a long period of time gets more wxp out of it?

Such things that rewards holding towers, forts, and smc for a long time could maybe work against karma trains.

Deihnyx.6318:

Don’t know if that’s been proposed before?

How about increasing pips… or base experience, the longer you hold things?
Like for example, holding smc for > 1 hour = +1 pip, but any team taking smc back after a long period of time gets more wxp out of it?

Such things that rewards holding towers, forts, and smc for a long time could maybe work against karma trains.

This would just reward the strongest server even more.

It also would reward the servers which have the most people during off times.

You would see 20+ arrowcarts in a fully upgraded smc.
In generall you’ll see more people sitting in keeps behind arrow carts that don’t want to come out and fight.

It would increase toxic behavior:
People already don’t like it, when a “fight commander” with a full squad and queue doesn’t jump maps to defend a t3 hill or bay.
If people would lose pips because of a lost keep…

Everyone plays wvw differently. There are roamers, fighting guilds, people just following the tag for ktrain, people looking for zerg fights, people looking for upgrading and defending structures, people fighting for ppt to win, people that don’t care for ppt and just want fights and so on.

No one should be “forced” into a specific gameplay.

One thing that is quite noticeable lately is that many players tend to only participate in WvW for the outnumbered buff. Why? Easy pips of course. This results in players going afk, stop participating almost completely (until they get to Tier 3), and keep their outnumbered buff a secret from other players.

My suggestion would be the complete removal of the outnumbered buff and make it to where they can get pips based on their server placement in the current match. Loyalty pips and rank pips would also be included.

For example: If a server is in 3rd place, everyone would earn 3 pips. Depending on their rank and loyalty, they would most likely get more. If a server is in 2nd place, they would get 5 pips. And 1st place server would get 7 pips.

These numbers (3, 5, and 7) could be altered in any way. (Please don’t make it 1 pip)

This would, in my opinion, bring more people together to earn more pips. It would give them something to work towards depending on how strong of a desire they have for getting the legendary back piece. If a server wants to get it sooner, they would have to work together and try to push for keeps and towers. This might even bring more commanders out and possibly more WvW guilds.

Now, people will probably still go afk once they reach tier 3 in the participation track, but it won’t help them get the back piece any faster and it won’t help the server. Lets say if the server got 1st place and people start going afk, their placement will most likely go down. They would have to help maintain their placement. Also, for time zone purposes, their server would most likely drop down to 3rd place depending on the time of day, but they can help out and get them back up to 2nd or even 1st again.

For those who cannot afford to spend 40+ hours a week playing WvW (lets face it, we all have a job and a life), they can simply log on, see a commander, and join them for a bit to earn pips. If their server does well, then they can get more.

Overall idea is to make players work together to earn pips instead of waiting around for the outnumbered buff.

I’m sure Anet can add more to this suggestion if they would like.

Tl;dr : Remove outnumbered buff. Add pips depending on server placement in current match. Loyalty and Rank pips included. Work together. Win.

Edit: The participation bar will still remain the same.

Simple! just add 1 or more pips to the server placement, everyone happy.

Akidra.2564:

My suggestion would be the complete removal of the outnumbered buff and make it to where they can get pips based on their server placement in the current match. Loyalty pips and rank pips would also be included.

For example: If a server is in 3rd place, everyone would earn 3 pips. Depending on their rank and loyalty, they would most likely get more. If a server is in 2nd place, they would get 5 pips. And 1st place server would get 7 pips.

These numbers (3, 5, and 7) could be altered in any way. (Please don’t make it 1 pip)

How to convince your playerbase to server stack in one practical step

I’m rank 130. It took me 252 ticks (21 hours) to complete the diamond chest this week. I have no issues with how many hours it takes to complete. Those that have more time should be able to earn it while those who don’t, shouldn’t. On a typical week, I only have enough time to complete the gold chest.

My biggest issue is the fact that I have to heavily rely on the outnumbered bonus. Look at my picture for proof. 690 pips came from the outnumbered bonus. When I’m on an outnumbered map, I’m not contributing anything to my team. Most of the time I’m just running around killing dolyaks, sentries, guards, and capturing camps. If my world need helps on another map, I’m ignoring them unless they have the outnumbered bonus there. The outnumbered bonus is toxic and needs to be reduced/removed. In return, the commitment and war score bonuses need to be increased.

Vagrant.8613:

I’m rank 130. It took me 252 ticks (21 hours) to complete the diamond chest this week. I have no issues with how many hours it takes to complete. Those that have more time should be able to earn it while those who don’t, shouldn’t. On a typical week, I only have enough time to complete the gold chest.

My biggest issue is the fact that I have to heavily rely on the outnumbered bonus. Look at my picture for proof. 690 pips came from the outnumbered bonus. When I’m on an outnumbered map, I’m not contributing anything to my team. Most of the time I’m just running around killing dolyaks, sentries, guards, and capturing camps. If my world need helps on another map, I’m ignoring them unless they have the outnumbered bonus there. The outnumbered bonus is toxic and needs to be reduced/removed. In return, the commitment and war score bonuses need to be increased.

Thank you for your honesty. It is also what I’ve concluded about the outnumbered buff so far. It is obvious to anyone who care to look, really.

It is nice to incentivise people to move on all maps instead of staying in one big ball, but what’s the point when the contribution of these “nomad” players is close to null because pips are what moved players rather than the will to win.

It may have already been suggested in the many pages here, but I wonder if it might help the pip acquisition pace to award pips for objective captures.

1 pip for a camp
2 pips for a tower
3 pips for a keep
4 pips for stonemist

It doesn’t seem like it would add too many pips for the people who already get a lot, and it would encourage people who are mostly pip-farming to keep taking objectives versus just killing an occasional guard or yak to maintain participation and then going back to spawn.

eldenbri.1059:

It may have already been suggested in the many pages here, but I wonder if it might help the pip acquisition pace to award pips for objective captures.

1 pip for a camp
2 pips for a tower
3 pips for a keep
4 pips for stonemist

It doesn’t seem like it would add too many pips for the people who already get a lot, and it would encourage people who are mostly pip-farming to keep taking objectives versus just killing an occasional guard or yak to maintain participation and then going back to spawn.

I’d rather have the points go to escorting yaks. Doing it as you suggested would only result in a pve champ karma train map. It would wreck WvW.

How about:

T3: 1 pip
T4: 2 pips, shorter grace period before going back to T3
T5: 3 pips, much shorter grace period before going back to T4
T6: 4 pips, much much shorter grace period before going back to T5
And increase participate needed to reach these higher tiers.

If not shorter grace period, surely they are ways to detect if a player has been doing the same actions (like waiting to flip the same camps) over and over, granting less participation and causing participate to go back to T3/T4.

Maybe it could fix the basepip issue while also preventing half-afking.

As I see it, the pip system is way too grindy for newer WvW players, and not rewarding enough for veterans.

—Adding diminishing returns to Pip Ranks could help, T1 +3 T2 +2 T3 +2 T4 +1 etc.

—Also once Vets get to Diamond, they are done getting tickets. There should be a way for them to keep getting rewarded such as +5 tickets for repeating diamond.

**A new reward that could be super helpful for WvW: an item or NPC that would change the stats of an ascended piece using WvW currency, instead of having to use the Mystic Forge recipe. Having something unique like this other than just skins would be a great way to promote the game-mode.

Akidra.2564:

This would, in my opinion, bring more people together to earn more pips. It would give them something to work towards depending on how strong of a desire they have for getting the legendary back piece. If a server wants to get it sooner, they would have to work together and try to push for keeps and towers. This might even bring more commanders out and possibly more WvW guilds.

Putting more pip emphasis on the matchup/skirmish assumes a fair matchup/skirmish 24/7.

Thats just not reality.

Such a change would make it incredibly unfair to play against dominating offtime servers that has T3 objectives… even if they put up little resistance in the current skirmish. It makes comebacks unrewarding since what you do skirmish X will pip reward those doing skirmish X+1 or skirmish X+2 rather than you.

I most definetly oppose this and to reiterate my opinion just because I still have some hope Anet can and have the will to tweak this (though its WvW, so maybe in 3 years):
- Outmanned decreased to 2
- Commitment increased to 2
- All ranks increased with +2 although I would also settle for +1 here
- Done

One the things that I find absolutely ludicrous is that there’s no pip increase for continuously playing at tier 6

So a month in and Anet reward system has utterly failed in attracting permanent new blood. There is currently a 60 queue for ebg. Yes, slightly more then before the reward update, but hardly something that you want to write home about. It is also the only queue on a Saturday evening at prime time. It will drop more and more again as time passes. This is T1 EU and my server is winning.

So where did it fail? It has been mentioned plenty already. The time needed is far to great to justify a longterm commitment for people that like to play multiple gamemodes. On top of that the disproportionate difference between veterans and new players is discouraging to new players on top of the to long of a commitment.

I just can’t fathom why people argue against making it more fair for new players. The gamemode needs fresh blood desperately and people are arguing against it because they feel entitled to more/better loot? Why, because they were here for years already? These people didn’t play for loot before so why do they suddenly care now?

Linking only works so and so to get the servers balanced as anet needs to redip in the same pool over and over and try and make the matchups not total onesided blowouts. More people means it is easier to balance out. Yes linking is a bandage solution, but it is better then nothing. There is only one solution and you can dig through my post history for that.

Honestly I doubt WvW can recover the already lost people that thought the current system is unfavorable. Anet just screwed it up by implementing a serverly biased reward system.

The system might have been able to keep more players if it had look something like this
1-5 pips for veterans capped at around 4k rank
1 pip for each week you get the wood chest with a max of 3
2 pips for outnumbered, player need to have been actively playing on the outnumbered map for 2 min
1 pip for participation rank 3. 1 extra pip for max participation.
1 pip for commanding

All armor rank cut in half.

Playing actively needs to be the thing that gets rewarded, not time spent in the past. With the goal being feasible in something that is reasonable and not a years in the future. The game is 5 years old and it will only lose players as time progresses so giving them an extra push out is beyond stupid.

I like the new reward system! As a bronze vet, (yup we exist!). I have zero problem with pip gains on rank and outnumbered. Vets have been playing a game mode they enjoy for years and not getting rewarded for it. Now they are.

As far as outnumbered goes, keep it as is! It’s perfect. The outnumbered buff “counters” itself, so to speak. All the bonuses trigger the players to quickly show up, eliminating the buff and thus solving the “problem”. It’s pretty crafty on Anets part lol.

To pvers, as a fellow pver sorry but I disagree. This system is pretty good. Its not demoralizing, vets are capped at diamond like everyone else. They just get faster. And that’s fine because they put their time and effort over the years.

JTGuevara.9018:

I like the new reward system! As a bronze vet, (yup we exist!). I have zero problem with pip gains on rank and outnumbered. Vets have been playing a game mode they enjoy for years and not getting rewarded for it. Now they are.

As far as outnumbered goes, keep it as is! It’s perfect. The outnumbered buff “counters” itself, so to speak. All the bonuses trigger the players to quickly show up, eliminating the buff and thus solving the “problem”. It’s pretty crafty on Anets part lol.

To pvers, as a fellow pver sorry but I disagree. This system is pretty good. Its not demoralizing, vets are capped at diamond like everyone else. They just get faster. And that’s fine because they put their time and effort over the years.

Too bad it’s going to be changed soon – no word on what exactly they are changing to outnumbered pips though.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/How-to-stop-outnumbered-abuse/6640269

How exactly is it unfair to new people though?

I started casually wvw’ing with a rank 20ish alt in mid April and am up to rank 333 right now. Thats very little weekly time investment (maybe 20 hours), mainly solo capping and most often in T3 or T4 matches. Yet you have people that say at 40 hours a week (presumably zerging it up) it’s going to take them 2 years to get to rank 2000. You know what takes 2+ years to get? Trying to rank to 2000 in a T7-T8 match without doing eotm! I know this because thats what happened with my main. We don’t have T7 or T8 matches anymore, so it’s not going to take anyone 2+ years to achieve 2000 even if they’re starting at 0.

I’m averaging 100 levels a month at about 20 hours a week, I haven’t finished the pip track yet on any acct, though I’ve gotten to platinum twice now on that low acct without outnumbered most ticks.

What’s unfair is that the new people don’t seem to be playing like this, they’re probably farming outnumbered most times in their 40 hour play week and finishing the pip track, but not gaining ranks because they’re only keeping up minium participation!

So after a few good discussion with friends and guildmates, I’ve come to the conclusion that the outnumbered buff was a great idea stemming from good intentions (logically speaking, players in an inherently more challenging situation should be given more rewards for sticking it out, right?) . However, the idea that someone playing on an outnumbered map should be given extra rewards because they are outmanned may sound good in theory, but the resulting abuse of the buff and negativity surrounding the slower acquisition of rewards for those actively playing in populated maps highlight the flaws. What if both the outnumbered issue and the rate of rewards for populated maps could be addressed in one fell swoop?

My proposition is to add a buff earned through active gameplay (similar to earning participation) that is mutually exclusive to the outnumbered buff. This buff would stack up to +5 pip aquisition, allowing for anyone playing WvW in the usual manner to earn pips at an increased rate and also leaving outnumbered as a reasonable alternative when the odds are against the player. This would change outnumbered to something that closes the gap for players in unfair situations as opposed to offering greater rewards, which would eliminate the incentive for the majority of players to abuse the system. This would also increase the rate at which pips are earned for the majority of the playerbase by a reasonable amount, but (if my math is right) it will still require 12 or more hours for the average player to complete the full skirmish reward track. And for those players that don’t have enough time for the full thing, they’d still theoretically progress at a faster rate while getting to focus on how the game mode was intended to be played (rather than map-hopping) and hopefully enjoy themselves more as a result.

At this point a dev has already posted there is a change happening to how outnumbered is acquired, but if the only change is to reduce how easily outnumbered is earned / maintained, several issues are still left on the table. I truly feel that with how pips can be earned as a whole, if players had a way to earn an equivalent amount of pips through active gameplay then there would be an excellent balance between rewarding players fairly for their contribution and cushioning rewards for players in more challenging situations. In turn, I think this would be a great QoL improvement for WvW as a whole.

There have been many other suggestions about specific elements I’ve read (rewards based on defense, the tier of structure being taken into account, removing degradation of rewards for a small timeframe when outside of WvW, etc.) that I’m sure are being looked at as well, and I’m sure there would be ways to work these elements into my proposition. I’m genuinely curious about how you guys feel about this idea!

Conner.4702:

So a month in and Anet reward system has utterly failed in attracting permanent new blood. There is currently a 60 queue for ebg. Yes, slightly more then before the reward update, but hardly something that you want to write home about. It is also the only queue on a Saturday evening at prime time. It will drop more and more again as time passes. This is T1 EU and my server is winning.

Lol you think thats bad? FSP had literally no queue to EB on reset. Yesterday primetime we had enough to populate one border, the others where outmanned. The links matter a fair bit. Well that and its now summertime.

The problem I see with the rewards is that there is… a conflict of interest… the harder it is to get them. I still had vacation a couple of weeks ago, could get some more playtime in and reached diamond every week but now I am back to work and I find it a bore to do this. I dont want to play WvW all the time. I want to play PvP and PvE as well, but WvW aint letting me. Not if I want the weekly rewards.

Sigh… it really has become a full time job.

When the first person gets the full backpack and 5 others follow, then 10, then 20 and the feedback from this thread has altered outnumbered and ticket acquisition so much that new pepole will be able to purchase everything at any level for however many tickets they’ve accumalated, I think it’ll be nice because then I’ll be able to take a shrine without running into a 50 man blob chanting BAG BAG BAG!

I haven’t read this entire thread, but here’s my 2 cents:

- The outnumbered buff is really poorly implemented. Either it needs to be calculated on all four maps at once or revamped somehow. Right now it leads too too much grief and drama. People should never be discouraged from inviting team members to their map.

- People with higher WvW rank should earn more pips, but the current spread is far too wide. It should not amount to a 20+ hour difference between new players and veteran players.

- There is currently no reward for maintaining max participation and there should be.

- I support spreading out the skirmish tickets across all chests on the reward track. It feels really bad when you aren’t able to completely finish one of the ranks and that effort goes nowhere. As someone else pointed out, other rewards in other game modes are more linear in that they grant steady predictable progress for each hour you play.