Guild Wars 2

+9000 for jamesdolla.3954

No thank you. If you dont like it stay off it. I love it.

there should be a revote . The only people i see there is people doing dailes or people who are stuck in queues …..

Foghladha.2506:

No thank you. If you dont like it stay off it. I love it.

As much i actually like the map as well, the map its to buggy, we all can gltich to inside tower and keeps, Anet never fixed that its like they are in hope we ktrain via those glitches -.-".

I could point out other issue but that would be talking about wvw generally.. the game mode that lacks alot, reason people only ktrain.

Just reopen stackgate already

They gave it a bit of a band aid slap fix but it needed more. The whole middle part of the map should have been removed and replaced with bloodlust points. Like the other BL’s, because as it is, it’s just no-mans land empty space. Makes it feel like a half finished map.

The northeast and northwest towers serve a strategic purpose on the Alpine maps as you can treb Garri from them, they are a worthwhile capture for those who enjoy the take and hold play. What are the purpose of these 2 towers on DBL? Except for PPT bragging rights they seem pointless.

Opening up the navigation around the map by clearing some areas around fire and air was good. They removed a lot of the aggravating rock walls, the barriers you had to beat down etc which was all good.

Chorazin.4107, slap fix? u can still enter directly to center keep or glitch inside keeps and towers…

I love DBL. Sorry. I roam it often and it’s my favorite to zerg train on.

I dislike the map and wouldn’t shed a tear if it were to disappear. However, there are others who enjoy that rotten map and I don’t want to deny them their fun. Options are a good thing.

Its great map, enjoying it last 24h as Blackgater

Enable gliding and it would become my favorite map

Underwater map would be nice if they unlock all the skills for usage and balance

That adds an extra dimension and imagine how well a small zerg or roamer can hid with that extra dimension. I do remember doing that very thing as a roamer the zerg was going through the underwater tunnel and I was in a nook above them and literally watched the entire thing swim buy before I popped out and nixed the stragglers.

Desert BDL looks like it was built for mounts which is odd since this game has no such thing and we can’t glide their either…

It should be removed and re purposed for PVE

Foghladha.2506:

No thank you. If you dont like it stay off it. I love it.

Of course you like it. you can pvd on DBL without anyone responding. Doesn’t change the fact that the map just isn’t working out.

jamesdolla.3954:

Foghladha.2506:

No thank you. If you dont like it stay off it. I love it.

Of course you like it. you can pvd on DBL without anyone responding. Doesn’t change the fact that the map just isn’t working out.

jamesdolla, offcorse u want 3 alpine maps, easy to ktrain with lesser effort than ktrain the DBL right… ?

Why not request a tune/change/Fix to the map, post what are the map issues? instead of giving QQ, and want it out of the game w/o pointing valid reasons?

And the map is easy to get arround as much as alpine, the issue is for defenders in that map…and besides u can ktrain much faster if u use the “tricks” Anet refuses to fix, if no one is watching its fine.

Move on to more productive topics peeps, dbl was voted in by majority and it’s not going anywhere…

Swagger.1459, it needs alot of changes, the overall design ideia is there but theres alot of wrong done in that map its to much for the game and also the WvW mechanics are to dull to support a map that does not offer much besides size… the glitches and keeps that can get bombarded by siege +1200 meter above the keep… its a very flawed concept as well.
Map needs to loose alot of the vertical design and, and be more chanllanging on the horizontal, wich just some minor aditions.

Aeolus.3615:

Swagger.1459, it needs alot of changes, the overall design ideia is there but theres alot of wrong done in that map its to much for the game and also the WvW mechanics are to dull to support a map that does not offer much besides size… the glitches and keeps that can get bombarded by siege +1200 meter above the keep… its a very flawed concept as well.
Map needs to loose alot of the vertical design and, and be more chanllanging on the horizontal, wich just some minor aditions.

Then start a thread detailing very specific changes y’all want. Submit bug and exploit reports to the team with screenshots and details… Dbl is not going away.

Taxidriver.2043:

no kidding ppl who voted to keep it dont even play that map they go queue EB first.

That’s because they polled everyone in GW2. A lot of PVE folks voted cause they thought it was cool. The WvW peeps mostly did not want it. At least that has been what I have noticed.

Taxidriver.2043:

no kidding ppl who voted to keep it dont even play that map they go queue EB first.

wondering where that Teon kid went who would rage and defend the DBL poll results back then and flamed whoever dismissed the poll results. He probably quit the game once DBL came back too.

I mean, look at T1. any team that gets it is at a horrible disadvantage. No bloodlust + no one wants to go there and defend it. At best they could give it to the server that has the highest glicko or something. The bosses are super easy to solo so the small man groups will take any objective before you can even show up. What’s up with the bloodlust? they ever gonna do anything about that? Super lazy. If they’re not going to fix the massive issues on the map they might as well just get rid of it till they fix it at least.

Most people I know who voted for it were just trolling. Theres a reason its the least played map on every tier. Even on reset night its basically just overflow for people to kitten around until their queue pops on a different bl

oh kitten , how on earth is the first reply an implication that desert bl disaffection is some sort of mags specific thing? yes, the election was rigged.

it’s a pretty map, but it isn’t balanced for a game struggling with balance. some people like it which is ok, most don’t and voted accordingly.

the map doesn’t even attract map-squatting duelists which would actually make it useful for something.

i give credit to it’s prettiness. it’s lovely to wander through if you’re too stoned to play normally or get up and do something useful—and yeah it’s legit fun for some ways of playing, but since it’s a very play preference specific map it does affect balance. i’m not saying all the work put into it should be thrown in the garbage, but its current use isn’t giving it due credit but rather making people hate it. as an unlock achieved by player population turn out it would make more sense, or as its own separate map—whoever takes garri claims the citadel and the map periodically renames according to who holds it? or whatever, there has to be better ideas over the current situation that would be workable given there have been pretty decent improvements. idk if the same can be said for still extant map glitches, but while map work is being done for ls episodes maybe it wouldn’t be too taxing a stretch?

skogkatt.7586:

some people like it which is ok, most don’t and voted accordingly.

Then why it won?

jamesdolla.3954:

I mean, look at T1. any team that gets it is at a horrible disadvantage. No bloodlust + no one wants to go there and defend it. At best they could give it to the server that has the highest glicko or something. The bosses are super easy to solo so the small man groups will take any objective before you can even show up. What’s up with the bloodlust? they ever gonna do anything about that? Super lazy. If they’re not going to fix the massive issues on the map they might as well just get rid of it till they fix it at least.

1. Give DBL to highest glicko server, because most times their home BL has T3 towers and keeps anyway.
2. High glicko server won’t automatically get bloodlust. It’s easier for high glicko server to get bloodlust from other maps than it is for lowest glicko server to get bloodlust from the other two maps.
3. Make DBL scoring bonuses only for the other two servers. This will force the high glicko server to defend an empty map. Eventually the overstacked high glicko server’s players will be so bored that they will transfer out (rebalance) to a server that isn’t dominating their match.

Jeknar.6184:

skogkatt.7586:

some people like it which is ok, most don’t and voted accordingly.

Then why it won?

…

McKenna Berdrow.2759:

The poll has ended! After removing all votes for “Don’t Count My Vote” the final results are:

78.5% Simultaneous Borderlands

21.5% Rotating Borderlands quarterly

This means that the team will add the Desert Borderlands back into play as one of the Borderlands maps and will keep the other two maps as the Alpine Borderlands. Thank you to everyone who voted!

Desert BL gives an advantage to the home team not a disadvantage. Using this week in Tier 1 to state your claim isn’t right. Map politics in the current match make it so TC can’t hold the map because BG pressures it when TC has very little numbers.

Bloodlust is actually a pretty big deal even that 1 point. Because thats 1 point per stomp up to 5 people and killing someone grants 1 point anyway. Thus this is a total of 10 points. In a skirmish that last 2 hours then end scores look around 3k to 5k thus a single person with 5 people and netting 10 per kill is a pretty big thing that can determine skirmishes.

One issue with every BL map that we have is that they’re all mechanically broken. Alpine was designed around the orb and since the removal I feel like the map meta has degraded and became very stale. The Desert map has an entire center that takes up a large portion of the map that’s simply useless.

I also believe the keep lords are to hard to kill on Desert STILL, simply because how defensive the keeps are on the map and their special abilities added with things like EWPs make it very hard to assault and take any T3 keep on that map thats defended by large numbers.

I find the Desert BL fights better to be honest. The issue is certain servers tend to avoid the map and because of this even the people who voted for the map avoid it because there is no one to find out on it. This week in Tier 1 is a prime example of that, MAG avoids the map like the plague and it’s largely a battleground for TC and BG.

MaLeVoLenT.8129, atackers can place siege were the defenders cant reach, only by blobbing the adversary, i ocmpletelly agree with maps being atm abit broken as well since even apline lost its main charateristic.

And keep lords are super easy, just bring a group good in CC, and EWP’s if your groups is fast eneught getting on the inside, EWP can be turned a bag farm .

You have to be specific. What keep are you referring to.

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

You have to be specific. What keep are you referring to.

Mostly Air keep, alttough fire has those places as well.

The only thing I can think of is the huge mountain inside Air keep that you can treb inner from. The only way to counter it effectively is by sending forces up narrow stairs.
However, I think that spot is a necessity and there are ways to prevent the enemy from capturing your keep when they utilize it.

I believe it’s a necessity, because Air keep inner is pretty hard to take down because of the very high walls and the respawns when you have the jump pads make it easy to get back. Because this keep has very high walls, the mountain in my opinion is a viable option.

In Fire keep, I haven’t seen anything thats not counter-able. Unless you’re talking about trebbing from the top of the desert down to the keep walls. But even that’s counter-able when you use the towers that poke up from the desert overtop. They even have mortars placed there for this purpose.

(edit) cant reach that ladder on the rock were i saw people with catas -.-" for some reason i dont do jumping puzles….

Interesting i think i missed those mortars that can hit the desert, meanwhile the issue with the game might not be the keeps design, maybe its because even if a server has players they are all stacked in one map, cause theres no point on defending, almost no one cares about ppt.

All maps have spots where attackers can sit and long siege and the best way the enemy can stop them is by sending forces to them, or countering it outside the keep. I believe this is intended. I find sieging Desert BL way more strategic than sieging Alpine. Alpine is very basic and straight forward.

Aeolus.3615:

lets see if i can reach thsoe places to take a screenshot w/o being killed, playing on a low pop server vs yakslappers blobers… i migh zerger any momment lol…

lol good luck out there!!

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

All maps have spots where attackers can sit and long siege and the best way the enemy can stop them is by sending forces to them, or countering it outside the keep. I believe this is intended. I find sieging Desert BL way more strategic than sieging Alpine. Alpine is very basic and straight forward.

oh yeah completelly agree with you.

Aeolus.3615:

(edit) cant reach that ladder on the rock were i saw people with catas -.-" for some reason i dont do jumping puzles….

Interesting i think i missed those mortars that can hit the desert, meanwhile the issue with the game might not be the keeps design, maybe its because even if a server has players they are all stacked in one map, cause theres no point on defending, almost no one cares about ppt.

Yeah, there is a lack of reason to care for PPT or just winning or playing competitively in general. Because of this map mechanics and dynamics break down. One of the biggest mistakes Arena Net made with Desert is releasing the map without giving the communities a reason to play on it competitively. When they released it, everyones main focus was finding the ease of fights and the fighters of this game tend to just roam for the fights and stay away from objectives even though objective can grant fights. Yet, if they had released the map during a WvW season for instanced we’d get the true feel of what the map is suppose to be.

The game is so stale right now, without goals and reasons to stay competitive everything breaks down.

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

Desert BL gives an advantage to the home team not a disadvantage. Using this week in Tier 1 to state your claim isn’t right. Map politics in the current match make it so TC can’t hold the map because BG pressures it when TC has very little numbers.

Bloodlust is actually a pretty big deal even that 1 point. Because thats 1 point per stomp up to 5 people and killing someone grants 1 point anyway. Thus this is a total of 10 points. In a skirmish that last 2 hours then end scores look around 3k to 5k thus a single person with 5 people and netting 10 per kill is a pretty big thing that can determine skirmishes.

One issue with every BL map that we have is that they’re all mechanically broken. Alpine was designed around the orb and since the removal I feel like the map meta has degraded and became very stale. The Desert map has an entire center that takes up a large portion of the map that’s simply useless.

I also believe the keep lords are to hard to kill on Desert STILL, simply because how defensive the keeps are on the map and their special abilities added with things like EWPs make it very hard to assault and take any T3 keep on that map thats defended by large numbers.

I find the Desert BL fights better to be honest. The issue is certain servers tend to avoid the map and because of this even the people who voted for the map avoid it because there is no one to find out on it. This week in Tier 1 is a prime example of that, MAG avoids the map like the plague and it’s largely a battleground for TC and BG.

the lords are ez to kill. I can solo the whole freaking bl with ease. air and fire keep can be trebbed from sec and swc. Don’t think you can counter that without a yolo push. The only advantage home team has is how fast structures upgrade or if enemy team hates the map and doesn’t go to it(mostly the case accept for BG). You can literally take a few small man groups and cap the entire bl before anyone can even respond m8. Does anyone wanna do that? hell no. well BG does, that’s it.

-Population is the issue due how is being distributed over several servers.
-stack alot aoe and CC classes makes the “clear path” much easy migh be a issue the CC spam wars + AoE
-Servers cant hold that many players as maps require, at least desert Bl be a good experience.
-Gameplay enforces stacking in one group, while ppt is useless, and structures even t3 are easy to get, due the reason theres no defenders 80% of the time.

There are alot of bad things in WvW that makes the game run this way.

So i dont think the issue is desert BL itself.

I don’t think the siege that you can’t counter is a valid complaint. Many spots on ABL giving same (dis)advantage.

jamesdolla.3954:

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

Desert BL gives an advantage to the home team not a disadvantage. Using this week in Tier 1 to state your claim isn’t right. Map politics in the current match make it so TC can’t hold the map because BG pressures it when TC has very little numbers.

Bloodlust is actually a pretty big deal even that 1 point. Because thats 1 point per stomp up to 5 people and killing someone grants 1 point anyway. Thus this is a total of 10 points. In a skirmish that last 2 hours then end scores look around 3k to 5k thus a single person with 5 people and netting 10 per kill is a pretty big thing that can determine skirmishes.

One issue with every BL map that we have is that they’re all mechanically broken. Alpine was designed around the orb and since the removal I feel like the map meta has degraded and became very stale. The Desert map has an entire center that takes up a large portion of the map that’s simply useless.

I also believe the keep lords are to hard to kill on Desert STILL, simply because how defensive the keeps are on the map and their special abilities added with things like EWPs make it very hard to assault and take any T3 keep on that map thats defended by large numbers.

I find the Desert BL fights better to be honest. The issue is certain servers tend to avoid the map and because of this even the people who voted for the map avoid it because there is no one to find out on it. This week in Tier 1 is a prime example of that, MAG avoids the map like the plague and it’s largely a battleground for TC and BG.

the lords are ez to kill. I can solo the whole freaking bl with ease. air and fire keep can be trebbed from sec and swc. Don’t think you can counter that without a yolo push. The only advantage home team has is how fast structures upgrade or if enemy team hates the map and doesn’t go to it(mostly the case accept for BG). You can literally take a few small man groups and cap the entire bl before anyone can even respond m8. Does anyone wanna do that? hell no. well BG does, that’s it.

The lords are not easy to kill when they are defended. Your examples talk about soloing a map, that means the map isn’t being defended. That means the lord isn’t scaled either. Hence the easiness. Yet, the lords are way harder to kill by mechanics than that of the alpine borderlands. The hardest keep lord to kill by far is the Earth keep lord. The defenders of Earth keep has a greater advantage than the keep lord on Alpine Garrison.

Furthermore comparing Earth keep to Garrison, you’d find that the portals and shrines make it easier for re spawns to gather. The chokes surrounding the keep lord also make it easier to defend and the rock walls can protect the EWP respawns where as the Garrison keep lord is just a tank and spank, the Earth keep lord requires tactics when properly defended. Your example of soloing a desert map isn’t a good example as to how attackers have the advantage.

Air keep trebs from South-east camp can be countered without going next to them. I’ve seen it done many times. Most noticeably is the guild [JOY] currently on BG, they are renown with siege placement and counters.

Fire keep South west camp trebs can also be countered without rushing them.

Yet, still even if you couldn’t counter these things, from inside the the keep, there are ways to counter a long siege with trebs from the outside. Now to compare the Alpine map, there are places you can long siege that cant be countered from inside the keep very easily. One famous spot that’s hard to counter, is the trebs to hit inner Bay in south west camp, which is similar to the trebs on South-east camp that can hit inner air keep wall.

The only way to counter Bay camp trebs, is by building a treb on the outer wall that can be easily hazed.

Another example is North East tower on ABL. You can treb garrison and sit comfortably from the tower. In fact, the best way to counter these trebs is either leaving garrison and going to the camp below or even below the tower, or rushing the tower yourself. In fact, the towers are one of the biggest complaints about Desert BL, because they provide no benefit for the attackers other than PPT gains. Thus it empowers the defenders because they simply do not have to worry about them. Yet, on ABL if an enemy sits in your north tower, they have the ability to cut off your supply and siege your garrison easier.

Again tactically speaking you can’t use SEC and SWC on DBL as an example as to why DBL should be removed when all maps have ways of sieging keeps/towers that arent counter able without leaving your own keep or tower.

A huge example of this is SMC trebs on third floor can paper every single near by tower.

this thread again.

@jamesdolla.3954 and anyone that shares the same viewpoint, I’ll say this the way I said it before. If you don’t like the map, don’t go on it. If you hate it so much that you want to quit then post your feedback in a constructive manner and quit already. Stop moaning, complaining and ruining the experience for everyone else that enjoys it.

Stop saying no one plays the map, or no one enjoys the map. I see lots of people on Red BL all the time. It’s a roamers haven, and it’s built to slow down zergs and the numbers reflect that.

Its been proven despite how vocal a few are against dbl, the overwhelming majority is fine with it and the community has spoken twice with votes.We still have the map and it’s not going anywhere. Pushing anet for a third vote would be a waste of resources and time.

Polls are only a tool that allows decisions to be made that will either help or harm WvW.

Please ask yourself:

What’s the past history on how effective have these polls been in Helping WvW?

Personally I like the DBL for selfish reasons, but given the current state of WvW…I’d probably want to use it when things improve…population numbers & balance wise.

From a Dev’s point of view…I’d have different reasons on when & why I’d choose to implement it…in relation to the state of WvW.

Creating a healthy & robust WvW…is similar to making chocolate…you have to add the right ingredients at the right time/temperature. If you miss the timing/temperature…the taste of the chocolate is affected/ruined & you can’t undo the result.

We’re still missing the Right ingredients also…imho

Tofu Turkey anyone?

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Diku.2546:

Please ask yourself:

What’s the past history on how effective have these polls been in Helping WvW?

Better than just being ignored. At least someone’s opinion will be taken in consideration.

Jeknar.6184:

Diku.2546:

Please ask yourself:

What’s the past history on how effective have these polls been in Helping WvW?

Better than just being ignored. At least someone’s opinion will be taken in consideration.

Some decisions should not be entrusted to players to choose.

Some Polls are like the Pandora Genie in the Crack Bottle that should never have been opened.

You can’t ask an addict/child how much “WvW fun” they want…and then Not expect them to reply they want as much as you can give them…until they overdose & kill the fun.

Sometimes back seat drivers will give you the wrong directions…and we’ll end up driving off a cliff.

Sometimes it’s better to let the Airplane Pilot fly & land the plane….their fiduciary duty to players on keeping it fun…imho

I agree…it’s nice that we’re not being ignored.

Devs that are in-tune with their customer’s taste in chocolate…and can create the right flavor & amount of sweet that we’re craving…is what I hope these polls will allow ANet to create.

However, ANet seems to be missing a Willy Wonka with a vision…to lead their wonderful candy shop…imho

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

One issue with every BL map that we have is that they’re all mechanically broken. Alpine was designed around the orb and since the removal I feel like the map meta has degraded and became very stale. The Desert map has an entire center that takes up a large portion of the map that’s simply useless.

This guy understands. Ignoring the concerns of “siege gameplay” being a timegate in regards to the defensive feature creep like guild upgrades, the major flaw of the current maps is this: they’re all about sitting in circles over and over again to a fault. Once they removed the unique features of BL’s, they lost an different mechanic to fight over.

As far as the map design itself, overall I hate BL’s asymmetrical design for it leads to the need to copy it 3 times in order to maintain matchup balance in a 1v1v1 scenario. I described these Map design issues already…:

Chinchilla.1785:

…
If you did not care about balance, and a consistent matchup, then yes you could have whatever team arrangements you wanted.

Once you break out of the 1v1 you start to lose flexibility in map design. 1v1 can be a line (or more) that bend to the designers whims as if it were a path to travel upon. You can achieve far more distinct combinations in this match up.

Beyond 1v1:

When you add in 3 teams, it forms a triangle, 4 would be a rectangle (assuming square is a type of rectangle), 5 would be a pentagon.

Show Spoiler

hide spoiler

As you add pass 2 teams, you start restricting yourself to a ring. Often this ring lends itself to k-training as we see now on current maps.

Ultimately, you end up with two options by a symmetrical map design for 1v1v+More. As demonstrated in these Starcraft 1 maps: http://classic.battle.net/images/battle/scc/lp/3/xm.jpg and http://classic.battle.net/images/battle/scc/lp/3/xtk.jpg

First where teams are evenly spread outside, and the second where teams are clustered into the center with long obstructions to separate them. Both still create a ring.

Attempting to Introduce Asymmetry:

These are shapes, they’re rigid, and cannot bend unless you’re willing to introduce asymmetry. The caveats of an asymmetrical map design mean you disrupt balance. However…

Show Spoiler

hide spoiler

In our case, WvWvW, the asymmetrical borderland maps had to be repeated/copied 3 times as we know them now. This would mean with 4 teams, there would be a fourth copy to fulfill the need of a balanced match up. 5 would be 5 copies. All of this promotes staleness fast…regardless of where you are positioned on your team you are still playing 1 of N copied maps.

Research:

If you define W in WvW as a number, you can widen your perspective, and simulate this scenario in strategy games. In this case, I looked at Starcraft I maps here: http://classic.battle.net/scc/lp/3.shtml

Show Spoiler

hide spoiler

What you are looking for is the amount of significant variety in 2 teams compared to 3 teams compared to 4 teams, and so on. If you analyze it, 4 team scenarios end up always having the teams in the corners over, and over again. Keep in mind, you could have locked Alliances in that game that would then become effectively 1v1 (if you cared about balance).

TLDR: spoilers added for this reason. Read at your will!

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

jamesdolla.3954:

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

Desert BL gives an advantage to the home team not a disadvantage. Using this week in Tier 1 to state your claim isn’t right. Map politics in the current match make it so TC can’t hold the map because BG pressures it when TC has very little numbers.

Bloodlust is actually a pretty big deal even that 1 point. Because thats 1 point per stomp up to 5 people and killing someone grants 1 point anyway. Thus this is a total of 10 points. In a skirmish that last 2 hours then end scores look around 3k to 5k thus a single person with 5 people and netting 10 per kill is a pretty big thing that can determine skirmishes.

One issue with every BL map that we have is that they’re all mechanically broken. Alpine was designed around the orb and since the removal I feel like the map meta has degraded and became very stale. The Desert map has an entire center that takes up a large portion of the map that’s simply useless.

I also believe the keep lords are to hard to kill on Desert STILL, simply because how defensive the keeps are on the map and their special abilities added with things like EWPs make it very hard to assault and take any T3 keep on that map thats defended by large numbers.

I find the Desert BL fights better to be honest. The issue is certain servers tend to avoid the map and because of this even the people who voted for the map avoid it because there is no one to find out on it. This week in Tier 1 is a prime example of that, MAG avoids the map like the plague and it’s largely a battleground for TC and BG.

the lords are ez to kill. I can solo the whole freaking bl with ease. air and fire keep can be trebbed from sec and swc. Don’t think you can counter that without a yolo push. The only advantage home team has is how fast structures upgrade or if enemy team hates the map and doesn’t go to it(mostly the case accept for BG). You can literally take a few small man groups and cap the entire bl before anyone can even respond m8. Does anyone wanna do that? hell no. well BG does, that’s it.

The lords are not easy to kill when they are defended. Your examples talk about soloing a map, that means the map isn’t being defended. That means the lord isn’t scaled either. Hence the easiness. Yet, the lords are way harder to kill by mechanics than that of the alpine borderlands. The hardest keep lord to kill by far is the Earth keep lord. The defenders of Earth keep has a greater advantage than the keep lord on Alpine Garrison.

When is the map defended? Reset night? That’s about it. Should be called the deserted bl instead of desert. Lords are the same as any others with break bar and hp. maybe you can say they are more of an aoe offensive threat but killing them aint hard compared to other lords since everyone of them scales.

I defend the map everyday. I believe you’re trying to hard too push your claims but no one is buying it man.

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

I defend the map everyday. I believe you’re trying to hard too push your claims but no one is buying it man.

What claim? That the map sucks and most people hate it? That’s a fact.

jamesdolla.3954:

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

I defend the map everyday. I believe you’re trying to hard too push your claims but no one is buying it man.

What claim? That the map sucks and most people hate it? That’s a fact.

The claim that, the map is too easy to attack. The claim that no one defends the map. These are false and fallacies.

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

jamesdolla.3954:

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

I defend the map everyday. I believe you’re trying to hard too push your claims but no one is buying it man.

What claim? That the map sucks and most people hate it? That’s a fact.

The claim that, the map is too easy to attack. The claim that no one defends the map. These are false and fallacies.

Sorry a few guys defend it like mal and his blob and some tryhard BG. my mistake.