Guild Wars 2

doesnt even matter, wvw is literally as easy if not easier than pve anyway … just farm the pips and get your rewards and stop crying

the kids that play wvw are near braindead and with the random dodge rolling and 1 pushes you’ll most likely farm it over time very easily

then you can leave and go back to pve

Felipe.1807:

Wrong, new and old players who step on PvE will get the same number of AP for completing some achievement, will get the same reward for finishing a Dungeon, Fractals, Raid and other events on general.
WvW players allready have a advantage that the new players dont have, they can use the old WvW tickets from the past tournaments.
People have the right to complain when they see something wrong as this, we all bought this game, so i am just doing my right as a custumer…if you really believe that somone have to play for 40h+ during the week(a second job basically) while other person have to play for way less then 20h to complete the weekely rewards(Wooden to Diamond chest), then theres something really wrong with you.
You say that WvW veterans should be more awarded then new players….as a veteran myself (been playing since 2012) I honestly dont find that to be right or fair, reason is, no other game mode follow that same principle. But if Anet really wanna reward its true veterans and all the Edge of the Mist farmers, then to hell with it, they can do it…but dont do it in a way that gonna affect everyones rewards as well…i dont care if since day one of the patch “vets” would be running around with legend backpack or the new shiny armor, because Anet would think that those players deserve it for whatever reason. But what I do care is when Anet say that my play time is nowhere near as worth as other player.

Wrong, new players don’t have the same AP, magic find, etc as vets regardless if they can do the same achievements. New wvw’rs can grind the same ranks vets did. This argument is about pips but if they got the ranks, they would get the same pips(extra gold from kills, chance at better loot) as vets.

You can stand on your argument from authority fallacy all you want but as a lowly silver rank, I can do the same. I don’t have a problem with gold/plat/mithril/diamond getting faster pips. Why? Because even as a silver player, I got my 6/6 diamond chest on monday and have since finished it 3 more times. The point is, just because these veterans wvw’rs get pips faster doesn’t take any pips away from me. The system is not a zero-sum game. Vets are not stopping me from maxing out for the week. All these people spending, what seems like hours, arguing and writing essays about what’s fair? Imagine if they took this time to get their pips.

Jasonbdj.4021:

I thought it was a good example but ok –

Fractals – Why should a level 100 get more reward than a level 1 if that person has the gear to complete level 100?

Skill Points – Why should a character who collected all skill points from map exploring unlock full elite spec sooner than a character who hasn’t?

PVP – At start people could unlock better skins with a higher rank but it all changed a while ago. Rewards could change again when the updates arrive.

Legendary – Why should people who saved gold and collected mats create new legendary weapons sooner than someone who has none?

Raid – Why should people who has 999 LI can find a group easier then someone with only 2 LI?

WvW had a really poor reward system but still the loyal WvW people still continue to play WvW even though they have not been happy with the reward system. This system was needed since day 1 to reward loyal WvW players. Why should all loyal WvW players start back down at the bottom of the rewards scheme when they already put a lot of time into WvW? Loyal WvW should not have to invest double the time more than a new WvW player to gain a higher rewards when those people did not care/bothered about the WvW before. Now they have improved the WvW rewards with unique skins etc and now the new WvW players are moaning that the loyal players should start at the bottom like them.

1º Fractals- You are comparing a lv 100 fractals with a lv 1? If thats the case, its obvious that a lv 100 fractals should be more rewarding, thats not what it is up to debate, but the fact is that if two diferent players complete whatever is a lv 100 or lv 1 they will get both the same rewards.

2ºHero Points- Yes, someone who have map comp will be able to unlock(or get really close to it) a full elite espec…but the diference between hero points per hero challanges are diferent for a veteran player then it was for a new player? Example: I as veteran would get 5 hero points for a Hero Challange where a new player would get only 1 hero point for the same Hero Challange?

3ºPvP- Rewards on PvP used to be skins for PvP only use(couldnt use your PvE skins on PvP), titles and finishers. With the introduction of the Wardrobe, Anet did awarded PvP players with all the skins they had on the game mode to be used on PvE, also transmutations charges. But still, these same players dont have a boost on the Reward Track or the pips gain during the League.

4ºLegendary- Honestly your arguments make no sense at all…its obvious that someone who plays this game since 2012 will have more then enough materials to craft a legendary weapon…but the point is that if a new account or a old account start to farm they will most likely end up with the same results(even if the old account would have a high magic find and a extra % on gold gain).

5ºRaid- Here you talking about someone getting accepted on Raid easier then someone else…this is a human behavior not imposed by the Raid System, just like on the old days people would kick you out for not using full berzerker gear , even if most of the dungeons can be easily soloed.

All of the game modes when compared to what they used to be to what they are now, you will realize that by today standards they were all terrible unrewarding, thats a fact.
This whole thing just show how selfish some people are, its hard to believe that someone would even defend a reward system that can easily put to shame any mega grinding asians MMO out there.
This update have nothing to do with pleasing the vets, but atract new playerbase to WvW, but how do you think people gonna react when they find out they have to put 2,3,4 even 7 times more work then other players just to achieve the same level of rewards, basically having to make GW2 WvW their second job. Not sure about other people, but last night when i played, didnt have a single map with a queue, even got EB with outnumbered.
In the end will be up to Anet to choose what they think is best for the game, but when people start leaving the game mode, dont start complaining that the devs give zero attention to WvW and all the maps are deserts with nobody to play with.

tuvok.7806:

Wrong, new players don’t have the same AP, magic find, etc as vets regardless if they can do the same achievements. New wvw’rs can grind the same ranks vets did. This argument is about pips but if they got the ranks, they would get the same pips(extra gold from kills, chance at better loot) as vets.

You can stand on your argument from authority fallacy all you want but as a lowly silver rank, I can do the same. I don’t have a problem with gold/plat/mithril/diamond getting faster pips. Why? Because even as a silver player, I got my 6/6 diamond chest on monday and have since finished it 3 more times. The point is, just because these veterans wvw’rs get pips faster doesn’t take any pips away from me. The system is not a zero-sum game. Vets are not stopping me from maxing out for the week. All these people spending, what seems like hours, arguing and writing essays about what’s fair? Imagine if they took this time to get their pips.

Yeah, its true that a Veteran player have more AP then a new one…but if a Vet do a Jumping Puzzle, for example, he will get twice or more AP’s just for the fact that he is a Veteran?
You said you are silver players(so am I by the way) and you finished your diamond chest for the 3º time?! A simple question, how many hours per day you spend on GW2 WvW?

Id be perfectly ok with less bonus pips if the diamond last chest continued giving some tickets per go round, even if it’s less than the first time.

Felipe.1807:

Jasonbdj.4021:

I thought it was a good example but ok –

Fractals – Why should a level 100 get more reward than a level 1 if that person has the gear to complete level 100?

Skill Points – Why should a character who collected all skill points from map exploring unlock full elite spec sooner than a character who hasn’t?

PVP – At start people could unlock better skins with a higher rank but it all changed a while ago. Rewards could change again when the updates arrive.

Legendary – Why should people who saved gold and collected mats create new legendary weapons sooner than someone who has none?

Raid – Why should people who has 999 LI can find a group easier then someone with only 2 LI?

WvW had a really poor reward system but still the loyal WvW people still continue to play WvW even though they have not been happy with the reward system. This system was needed since day 1 to reward loyal WvW players. Why should all loyal WvW players start back down at the bottom of the rewards scheme when they already put a lot of time into WvW? Loyal WvW should not have to invest double the time more than a new WvW player to gain a higher rewards when those people did not care/bothered about the WvW before. Now they have improved the WvW rewards with unique skins etc and now the new WvW players are moaning that the loyal players should start at the bottom like them.

1º Fractals- You are comparing a lv 100 fractals with a lv 1? If thats the case, its obvious that a lv 100 fractals should be more rewarding, thats not what it is up to debate, but the fact is that if two diferent players complete whatever is a lv 100 or lv 1 they will get both the same rewards.

2ºHero Points- Yes, someone who have map comp will be able to unlock(or get really close to it) a full elite espec…but the diference between hero points per hero challanges are diferent for a veteran player then it was for a new player? Example: I as veteran would get 5 hero points for a Hero Challange where a new player would get only 1 hero point for the same Hero Challange?

3ºPvP- Rewards on PvP used to be skins for PvP only use(couldnt use your PvE skins on PvP), titles and finishers. With the introduction of the Wardrobe, Anet did awarded PvP players with all the skins they had on the game mode to be used on PvE, also transmutations charges. But still, these same players dont have a boost on the Reward Track or the pips gain during the League.

4ºLegendary- Honestly your arguments make no sense at all…its obvious that someone who plays this game since 2012 will have more then enough materials to craft a legendary weapon…but the point is that if a new account or a old account start to farm they will most likely end up with the same results(even if the old account would have a high magic find and a extra % on gold gain).

5ºRaid- Here you talking about someone getting accepted on Raid easier then someone else…this is a human behavior not imposed by the Raid System, just like on the old days people would kick you out for not using full berzerker gear , even if most of the dungeons can be easily soloed.

All of the game modes when compared to what they used to be to what they are now, you will realize that by today standards they were all terrible unrewarding, thats a fact.
This whole thing just show how selfish some people are, its hard to believe that someone would even defend a reward system that can easily put to shame any mega grinding asians MMO out there.
This update have nothing to do with pleasing the vets, but atract new playerbase to WvW, but how do you think people gonna react when they find out they have to put 2,3,4 even 7 times more work then other players just to achieve the same level of rewards, basically having to make GW2 WvW their second job. Not sure about other people, but last night when i played, didnt have a single map with a queue, even got EB with outnumbered.
In the end will be up to Anet to choose what they think is best for the game, but when people start leaving the game mode, dont start complaining that the devs give zero attention to WvW and all the maps are deserts with nobody to play with.

1 Fractals: "With Dessa’s authorization, gain access to additional daily achievements ", “Prolonged exposure to agony will result in improved rewards inside fractal dungeons.”, “Greater attunement with the fractals will grant bonus rewards from Chests of the Mists as well as Unlocked Fractal Encryptions.”

2 Hero points: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/List_of_hero_challenges_in_the_Heart_of_Maguuma Required Masteries: Gliding Basics, Updraft Use, Bouncing Mushroom, Lean Techniques, Nuhoch Wallows, Poison Lore, Exalted Markings, Leyline Gliding

3 PvP: PIP progression based on player’s choice of playing more games. Cannot play more than 1 WvW match per week on a single account.

4 Legendary: “if a new account or a old account start to farm they will most likely end up with the same results(even if the old account would have a high magic find and a extra % on gold gain)” Exactly. WvW pip progression ends up with same result and old account gets bonuses. As new account plays they are also gaining WXP rank. Same result.

5 Raid: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/A-Note-about-the-Next-Raid-Wing/first, “Learn to safely launch to great heights with an explosive blast, without singeing your socks.”, "Those who possess this Mastery can wash away their ailments and afflictions when the opportunity presents itself. "

Leave it the way it is

Chaba.5410:

A new player can go play the “same” full meta in Verdant Brink without gliding unlocked yet. It isn’t easy and they are locked out of being able to finish certain achievements and other activities. Players who already have full masteries will find the meta easier to play. No one is posting how unfair this is to a new player because everyone understands that there is an equal access to progression for all accounts given enough time spent playing (recall that the base rate of progression had to be adjusted in HoT).

You are all basically complaining about the existence of an end-game progression system in WvW. There was a time when this game didn’t have ANY end-game progression. You hit rank 80 and that was it. It was boring and players wanted end-game progression.

No, nono, this comparaison doesn’t stand.
First of all, gliding takes, like, 20min to unlock, add to that 40min and you have updrafts unlocked. Compared to the time required to get the wvw masteries, it’s on a completely different level.
And even if you find someone who doing a VB meta without gliding, he’ll still get rewarded like everyone else. And when there’s events or achievements/hero challenges that requires gliding he simply can’t do it, there’s no getting less rewards for doing the same, he don’t do the same.

A better comparaison would be masteries in raids. If you do Escort in W3 but you don’t have ley-line gliding it’s fine, you simply don’t get to clear the towers. You’re not leeching of of the ones with ley-line gliding, you’re pulling your weight and doing your job. You are and rightfully so getting the same rewards as everyone else.
Same story with Sabetha, you don’t have the cannon mastery? You don’t do the cannon, but you are entitled to the exact same rewards as the ones doing the cannons.
VG without mushroom? You still get the same rewards.
Xera without ley-line gliding? Well no, you can’t participate without ley-line gliding (well, you can get carried or semi exploit, but let’s leave that aside), you’re locked out so you naturaly don’t get rewards. Is that fair? To me it is, as it’s no different than having to get spvp rank 20 to participate in ranked, or to level to 80 to do the level 80 content. It’s the same as the spvp reward system at launch, getting higher rank didn’t give you more rewards or more glory, it gave you access to new skins, it was a rank requirement.

With the wvw pips, you have players participating in the same content with various degree of ‘impact’ and being rewarded partly based on an a rank obtained through their ‘time investement’ (which really doesn’t represent time invested accurately but whatever).

So yes, I am complaining about ‘end-game reward progression in wvw’. I’m complaining that the curve rewards/time in wvw is now exponential instead of linear. I’m complaining that if i ‘do my job’ properly for 2h in wvw, i’m not rewarded the same way as someone else who’s ‘doing his job’ properly for 2h in wvw. All this complaining because i don’t find this fair for anyone.
But i’ll say it again because reading this thread, it’s clear that you and others still did not get the message : No one is against rewarding veteran wvw players based on their rank or whatever metric fits them. But it needs to be fair*, it needs to be “you played this for X amount of time, you get Y*X reward, not Y^X reward”.

*fair being of course subjective here, as both sides have a different vision.

Chaba.5410:

Felipe.1807:

Jasonbdj.4021:

I thought it was a good example but ok –

Fractals – Why should a level 100 get more reward than a level 1 if that person has the gear to complete level 100?

Skill Points – Why should a character who collected all skill points from map exploring unlock full elite spec sooner than a character who hasn’t?

PVP – At start people could unlock better skins with a higher rank but it all changed a while ago. Rewards could change again when the updates arrive.

Legendary – Why should people who saved gold and collected mats create new legendary weapons sooner than someone who has none?

Raid – Why should people who has 999 LI can find a group easier then someone with only 2 LI?

WvW had a really poor reward system but still the loyal WvW people still continue to play WvW even though they have not been happy with the reward system. This system was needed since day 1 to reward loyal WvW players. Why should all loyal WvW players start back down at the bottom of the rewards scheme when they already put a lot of time into WvW? Loyal WvW should not have to invest double the time more than a new WvW player to gain a higher rewards when those people did not care/bothered about the WvW before. Now they have improved the WvW rewards with unique skins etc and now the new WvW players are moaning that the loyal players should start at the bottom like them.

1º Fractals- You are comparing a lv 100 fractals with a lv 1? If thats the case, its obvious that a lv 100 fractals should be more rewarding, thats not what it is up to debate, but the fact is that if two diferent players complete whatever is a lv 100 or lv 1 they will get both the same rewards.

2ºHero Points- Yes, someone who have map comp will be able to unlock(or get really close to it) a full elite espec…but the diference between hero points per hero challanges are diferent for a veteran player then it was for a new player? Example: I as veteran would get 5 hero points for a Hero Challange where a new player would get only 1 hero point for the same Hero Challange?

3ºPvP- Rewards on PvP used to be skins for PvP only use(couldnt use your PvE skins on PvP), titles and finishers. With the introduction of the Wardrobe, Anet did awarded PvP players with all the skins they had on the game mode to be used on PvE, also transmutations charges. But still, these same players dont have a boost on the Reward Track or the pips gain during the League.

4ºLegendary- Honestly your arguments make no sense at all…its obvious that someone who plays this game since 2012 will have more then enough materials to craft a legendary weapon…but the point is that if a new account or a old account start to farm they will most likely end up with the same results(even if the old account would have a high magic find and a extra % on gold gain).

5ºRaid- Here you talking about someone getting accepted on Raid easier then someone else…this is a human behavior not imposed by the Raid System, just like on the old days people would kick you out for not using full berzerker gear , even if most of the dungeons can be easily soloed.

All of the game modes when compared to what they used to be to what they are now, you will realize that by today standards they were all terrible unrewarding, thats a fact.
This whole thing just show how selfish some people are, its hard to believe that someone would even defend a reward system that can easily put to shame any mega grinding asians MMO out there.
This update have nothing to do with pleasing the vets, but atract new playerbase to WvW, but how do you think people gonna react when they find out they have to put 2,3,4 even 7 times more work then other players just to achieve the same level of rewards, basically having to make GW2 WvW their second job. Not sure about other people, but last night when i played, didnt have a single map with a queue, even got EB with outnumbered.
In the end will be up to Anet to choose what they think is best for the game, but when people start leaving the game mode, dont start complaining that the devs give zero attention to WvW and all the maps are deserts with nobody to play with.

1 Fractals: "With Dessa’s authorization, gain access to additional daily achievements ", “Prolonged exposure to agony will result in improved rewards inside fractal dungeons.”, “Greater attunement with the fractals will grant bonus rewards from Chests of the Mists as well as Unlocked Fractal Encryptions.”

2 Hero points: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/List_of_hero_challenges_in_the_Heart_of_Maguuma Required Masteries: Gliding Basics, Updraft Use, Bouncing Mushroom, Lean Techniques, Nuhoch Wallows, Poison Lore, Exalted Markings, Leyline Gliding

3 PvP: PIP progression based on player’s choice of playing more games. Cannot play more than 1 WvW match per week on a single account.

4 Legendary: “if a new account or a old account start to farm they will most likely end up with the same results(even if the old account would have a high magic find and a extra % on gold gain)” Exactly. WvW pip progression ends up with same result and old account gets bonuses. As new account plays they are also gaining WXP rank. Same result.

5 Raid: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/A-Note-about-the-Next-Raid-Wing/first, “Learn to safely launch to great heights with an explosive blast, without singeing your socks.”, "Those who possess this Mastery can wash away their ailments and afflictions when the opportunity presents itself. "

1 Fractals: A new player can only access level Scales 1-25 in LFG at start plus a personal level 1 account will not get the same reward as a personal level 100 account on a level 100 run if that player manage to get into a high level party. New player has to do 100 runs until he able to get full rewards.

Felipe.1807:

Yeah, its true that a Veteran player have more AP then a new one…but if a Vet do a Jumping Puzzle, for example, he will get twice or more AP’s just for the fact that he is a Veteran?
You said you are silver players(so am I by the way) and you finished your diamond chest for the 3º time?! A simple question, how many hours per day you spend on GW2 WvW?

You’re comparing AP to reward. It’s not. I’m comparing AP to rank(experience). So to answer your question, no.

3-4. IDK, I might be on my 5th. I stopped counting after I hit the limit. 2,535 total pips. I don’t know exactly but I played the most the weekend and managed to get it when I logged in monday. After that, I realized I’ll max it next week and so forth by normal playing. That’s the thing, if you love the game mode, you’re not going to count the hours. You’re just going to play. Instead of playing and see how far they get, they just complain, or afk outnumbered.

And before others saying my outnumbered is a little high, I just play and if I get it, I get it. I was even accused of map hopping by some dude waiting at spawn when I logged in with 0% participation. Like really? I don’t need any more pips. These extra chests are just horded now. Instead of roaming or zerging, pve’rs are now filling a new role: spawn gatekeeping. It’s pathetic. Just play the game.

Spoichiche.1290:

Xera without ley-line gliding? Well no, you can’t participate without ley-line gliding (well, you can get carried or semi exploit, but let’s leave that aside), you’re locked out so you naturaly don’t get rewards.

You don’t get to leave that aside simply because it doesn’t fit your argument. All the other things I listed also have ways of getting around including WXP gain. You can run boosters and go farm WXP rank in EOTM that are not reflective of your time spent learning WvW maps and strategies at all. Can PvP do that? If you don’t have catapult shield bubble, you can stand by and let a player who does have that unlocked use it and you are still getting WXP and loot from the capture (something sPvP doesn’t have – i.e. no loot bags per player kill). In the end, a new player still needs to take the time and effort to farm XP and gain the HoT mastery points in order to unlock all HoT content and be able to “do the same” as veteran player. It doesn’t take “only 20 minutes” nor should WvW.

I also like how no one who is trying to argue about “doing the same” has addressed that base pips are awarded based on score. You can’t attack veteran bonus pips with this flawed argument while ignoring the base pips. Aren’t all three teams “doing the same”?

No one is against rewarding veteran wvw players based on their rank or whatever metric fits them.

Reread the OP!

The extra pips gained from high rank wvwer is not the issue. Its the base about of pips and outmanned pips that are an issue. No one should have to play more than 40hr to complete the reward track before the loyal pip. A-net should increase the amount of pips gained (2/3/4). Outmanned should work like bloodlust and be global, reduce the amount of pips gained to 1 per borderland outmanned. This change would create an issue with server maybe deciding to give up on 2 borderland for the buff but its better than a player swapping borderlands just to get the buff. It would also create better fights and may improve server pride for those 2 borderland they decide to defend.

With that logic, I should be able to walk into a high level fractal with pure exotics and 0 agony resistance and be able to get ascended drops just like everyone else in fractals 100.

Anet, I applaud you for rewarding people loyal to the game mode. Sorry pugs, but you’ll have to show how loyal you are by putting the time in like everyone else. -_- kids these days, always expect to have things handed to them.

Beezlebub.1538:

With that logic, I should be able to walk into a high level fractal with pure exotics and 0 agony resistance and be able to get ascended drops just like everyone else in fractals 100.

Anet, I applaud you for rewarding people loyal to the game mode. Sorry pugs, but you’ll have to show how loyal you are by putting the time in like everyone else. -_- kids these days, always expect to have things handed to them.

Unfortunately this: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Social-engineering-and-MMO-forums/first#post5852682

Blodeuyn.2751:

Fifth.8169:

Blodeuyn.2751:

It’s not discrimination. It is rewarding those who’ve played wvw for years. Why should new players, who might leave wvw altogether when they have their rewards, get the same amount of pips as those loyal to the game mode?

I welcome everyone new to wvw, and hope you find it fun, but you have to earn your ranks and rewards like the rest of us. Wvw has been neglected for ages, so it is past time for those of us playing this game mode to get something from it.

Please remember, someone else’s rank doesn’t take away from your fun and rewards. Stick with wvw and you’ll get there soon enough yourself!

Your post is the very essence of discrimination. You played WVW those years ago for what is was back then and you gained numerous hours of game-play and enjoyment. Giving you EXTRA rewards literally every 5 minute tick is too much. Rewarding extra for the content you enjoyed in the past is wrong. You have already had a head start on the achievement points and so giving you permanent boost in your pips is simply outlandish. .

Your logic is seriously flawed. Let me help: you didn’t invest in the wvw game mode and now you want instant gratification. Since you cant get that, no one should have it.

I’m going to pop into PVE now, I get insta raid armor, right? Insta map completion? Oh, I don’t? Well darn, guess I will have to put in some effort! The horror! Call the ACLU!

Edit: you could have had 2 ranks in the time it took you to complain here. If you’re on EBay msg me and we can get you ranks.

So let’s say I’ve been a pve player for over 4 years and you haven’t touched it. Lets now say they add legendary armor that you absolutely love. The cost is 500 legendary insights. As a new player, you would earn 1 legendary insight shard per boss kill. At 10 shards you can trade them in for 1 legendary insight. Now even though I’ve already earned the rewards for the past 4 years of playing, I am automatically rewarded 4 legendary insights per boss kill just for being a special snowflake. Why should the same content provide me with faster NEW rewards based on played time? It doesn’t matter how long you have or have not played pve. If you want legendary armor you will earn 1 li per boss like every other vet that has played pve since launch. It will still require effort but we as the vets arent entitled to rewards based on seniority like many wvwers feel they are.

PvE players always complain the loudest when the other game modes get new shinies.

Their need for instant gratification is astounding

Honestly, in general speaking

Pip acquisition and ammount has to be reviewed

Blodeuyn.2751:

It’s not discrimination. It is rewarding those who’ve played wvw for years. Why should new players, who might leave wvw altogether when they have their rewards, get the same amount of pips as those loyal to the game mode?

Because repeating the same cycle of capturing towers over and over and over to unlock one item isn’t everyone’s idea of fun…

Tsumiju.3071:

Because repeating the same cycle of capturing towers over and over and over to unlock one item isn’t everyone’s idea of fun…

Then go back to killing pocket raptors in pve-land. Why should the game reward you with loot in a game mode you don’t enjoy? Entitlement.

Set.7461:

Tsumiju.3071:

Because repeating the same cycle of capturing towers over and over and over to unlock one item isn’t everyone’s idea of fun…

Then go back to killing pocket raptors in pve-land. Why should the game reward you with loot in a game mode you don’t enjoy? Entitlement.

bUt MuH sCrIpTeD aI iS hArDcOrE cOnTeNt

atheria.2837:

Blodeuyn.2751:

It’s not discrimination. It is rewarding those who’ve played wvw for years. Why should new players, who might leave wvw altogether when they have their rewards, get the same amount of pips as those loyal to the game mode?

I welcome everyone new to wvw, and hope you find it fun, but you have to earn your ranks and rewards like the rest of us. Wvw has been neglected for ages, so it is past time for those of us playing this game mode to get something from it.

Please remember, someone else’s rank doesn’t take away from your fun and rewards. Stick with wvw and you’ll get there soon enough yourself!

I have to strongly disagree for one very specific reason that Anet hasn’t taken into account at all.

Rank does not always mean ‘time in WvW or EOTM’.

Nope.

Back in the day when WvW was younger and we still had tournaments, we had World Experience Potions [
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Keg_of_Liquid_World_Experience ]

From Drop to Thimble to Taste to Swig to Jug of Liquid Experience, people bought their way up the ranks and did a lot less WvW than many for their ranks.

So, I believe it is fair to say that the system just implemented isn’t fair at all.

And no I am not a new WvW’er or new player, but since I’ve been playing since pre-release, I can see where newer players and those just now being tempted to come into WvW would be and are upset.

And rightfully so.

Those wxp potions you mention are still around, they jsut get added straight away instead of getting in your bags.

Tsumiju.3071:

Because repeating the same cycle of capturing towers over and over and over to unlock one item isn’t everyone’s idea of fun…

It’s not my idea of fun to do PVE raids, I hardcore raided in WoW for many years so I do not bother to touch it here since I do not find that fun anymore, so guess what, if you do not find something fun do not do it, its as simple as that.

Veteran players have better gear. Getting full ascended is a significant advantage, especially in raids where it is mandatory and getting full ascended takes months. A clear advantage for Veteran players over new players, who first have to get their full set of gear (for the right build!) before they can embark on the many months it will take to start getting Legendary armor.

In addition, failure still counts as progress in WvW. You can get wiped all night and still grow your WvW rank, pips, tokens, whatever. I wonder, can i get full Legendary in raids by only wiping?

What a bunch of sooks… unbelievable.

Just add these items to PvE to stop the whining.

There’s no game mode other than wvw where vets are rewarded more just for being vets. In every other game mode vets get more rewards because they simply play more than other people. Rewards haven’t been I don’t get extra Lis in raids just because I’ve played the game since beta. Someone brand new to the game will earn Lis at the same rate as me and with the same effort. You hardcore wvw players feel entitled to fast rewards but only on the contingency that EVERYONE else that played any other game mode more seriously than wvw does not have access to even reasonable pip acquisition. You basically want to be special because you’re gw2 hipsters that played wvw before there were decent rewards. Get over it

Zalavaaris.5329:

There’s no game mode other than wvw where vets are rewarded more just for being vets. In every other game mode vets get more rewards because they simply play more than other people. Rewards haven’t been I don’t get extra Lis in raids just because I’ve played the game since beta. Someone brand new to the game will earn Lis at the same rate as me and with the same effort. You hardcore wvw players feel entitled to fast rewards but only on the contingency that EVERYONE else that played any other game mode more seriously than wvw does not have access to even reasonable pip acquisition. You basically want to be special because you’re gw2 hipsters that played wvw before there were decent rewards. Get over it

First of it’s patently false, secondly you have to actually succesfully argue that it is even a bad thing. You don’t just get to skip that part of the discussion and assume your position is correct.

Terrahero.9358:

Zalavaaris.5329:

There’s no game mode other than wvw where vets are rewarded more just for being vets. In every other game mode vets get more rewards because they simply play more than other people. Rewards haven’t been I don’t get extra Lis in raids just because I’ve played the game since beta. Someone brand new to the game will earn Lis at the same rate as me and with the same effort. You hardcore wvw players feel entitled to fast rewards but only on the contingency that EVERYONE else that played any other game mode more seriously than wvw does not have access to even reasonable pip acquisition. You basically want to be special because you’re gw2 hipsters that played wvw before there were decent rewards. Get over it

First of it’s patently false, secondly you have to actually succesfully argue that it is even a bad thing. You don’t just get to skip that part of the discussion and assume your position is correct.

You’re going to claim I’m stating a falsity without details? You tell me then… how are pve vets rewarded more for previous time played? If you and I step into a raid right now I will earn just as much LI and magnetite shards that you will. I don’t get bonuses because I’ve been playing pve since beta. So please… enlighten me with facts

Zalavaaris.5329:

Terrahero.9358:

Zalavaaris.5329:

There’s no game mode other than wvw where vets are rewarded more just for being vets. In every other game mode vets get more rewards because they simply play more than other people. Rewards haven’t been I don’t get extra Lis in raids just because I’ve played the game since beta. Someone brand new to the game will earn Lis at the same rate as me and with the same effort. You hardcore wvw players feel entitled to fast rewards but only on the contingency that EVERYONE else that played any other game mode more seriously than wvw does not have access to even reasonable pip acquisition. You basically want to be special because you’re gw2 hipsters that played wvw before there were decent rewards. Get over it

First of it’s patently false, secondly you have to actually succesfully argue that it is even a bad thing. You don’t just get to skip that part of the discussion and assume your position is correct.

You’re going to claim I’m stating a falsity without details? You tell me then… how are pve vets rewarded more for previous time played? If you and I step into a raid right now I will earn just as much LI and magnetite shards that you will. I don’t get bonuses because I’ve been playing pve since beta. So please… enlighten me with facts

Anyone that has already done a lot of FotM will be able to earn their Legendary backslot a lot faster. Because that is what this boils down to, Veteran players get to the “end goal” faster and the “end goal” can be a range of things.
Also, you cannot just step into a raid as a new player. That is grossly oversimplifying things. You need ascended gear, the proper build, all of that takes time. Quite a lot of time. Having that headstart sure helps earn something faster.

Then they launch new Legendaries. You need Masteries to even start working on Legendary weapons. Veterans have these Mastery tracks unlocked and will earn their Legendary faster. While new players do not.

You also still haven’t actually argued why this is a bad thing. I get the distinct impression you, nor anyone making this argument, actually care about “the new player”. It is just a convenient excuse to try and argue to lower the requirement that you want to see lowered for yourself.
Last i checked new players did not appoint anyone as their representative of what they do or do not want. Infact i’d wager you just about none of the new players would even care. They got other things to worry about. Like unlocked their skill slots and traits.

If you really wanted to make things easier for new players you’d not worry about some long-term cosmetic item but instead you’d argue about greatly reducing the cost of Ascended gear. All of the Ascended gear. It takes a new players months and untill then they are disadvantages in pve and wvw. Now there is a big practical disadvantage. So lets instead make Ascended gear available for, lets say, 2g a piece. Then a new player can be full Ascended and compete in all content without any hard statistical disadvantages compared to Veteran players in a week or two. After that we can revisit the concept for items that are purely cosmetic in nature.

Terrahero.9358:

Zalavaaris.5329:

Terrahero.9358:

Zalavaaris.5329:

There’s no game mode other than wvw where vets are rewarded more just for being vets. In every other game mode vets get more rewards because they simply play more than other people. Rewards haven’t been I don’t get extra Lis in raids just because I’ve played the game since beta. Someone brand new to the game will earn Lis at the same rate as me and with the same effort. You hardcore wvw players feel entitled to fast rewards but only on the contingency that EVERYONE else that played any other game mode more seriously than wvw does not have access to even reasonable pip acquisition. You basically want to be special because you’re gw2 hipsters that played wvw before there were decent rewards. Get over it

First of it’s patently false, secondly you have to actually succesfully argue that it is even a bad thing. You don’t just get to skip that part of the discussion and assume your position is correct.

You’re going to claim I’m stating a falsity without details? You tell me then… how are pve vets rewarded more for previous time played? If you and I step into a raid right now I will earn just as much LI and magnetite shards that you will. I don’t get bonuses because I’ve been playing pve since beta. So please… enlighten me with facts

Anyone that has already done a lot of FotM will be able to earn their Legendary backslot a lot faster. Because that is what this boils down to, Veteran players get to the “end goal” faster and the “end goal” can be a range of things.
Also, you cannot just step into a raid as a new player. That is grossly oversimplifying things. You need ascended gear, the proper build, all of that takes time. Quite a lot of time. Having that headstart sure helps earn something faster.

Then they launch new Legendaries. You need Masteries to even start working on Legendary weapons. Veterans have these Mastery tracks unlocked and will earn their Legendary faster. While new players do not.

You also still haven’t actually argued why this is a bad thing. I get the distinct impression you, nor anyone making this argument, actually care about “the new player”. It is just a convenient excuse to try and argue to lower the requirement that you want to see lowered for yourself.
Last i checked new players did not appoint anyone as their representative of what they do or do not want. Infact i’d wager you just about none of the new players would even care. They got other things to worry about. Like unlocked their skill slots and traits.

If you really wanted to make things easier for new players you’d not worry about some long-term cosmetic item but instead you’d argue about greatly reducing the cost of Ascended gear. All of the Ascended gear. It takes a new players months and untill then they are disadvantages in pve and wvw. Now there is a big practical disadvantage. So lets instead make Ascended gear available for, lets say, 2g a piece. Then a new player can be full Ascended and compete in all content without any hard statistical disadvantages compared to Veteran players in a week or two. After that we can revisit the concept for items that are purely cosmetic in nature.

You’re wrong…. you get the same journal pages that EVERYONE else does as a vet. We don’t get 5 journal pages per daily recommended fractal while new players get .5 or some crap. You’re absolutely wrong.

Oh you’re also wrong about raiding. You can do it in exotic. Oh also, if you do that you still only get 1 LI per boss regardless of how many bday presents a net has given you.

One more thing, you can’t use gear as an argument as gear helps in all modes (other than pvp). Having gear will help you with fractals, raids, and wvw but this is obtainable quite quickly. There is an artificial time gate through the game itself limiting ANYONE who hasn’t only played wvw for the past few years. So don’t try to use that as an argument.

Zalavaaris.5329:

Terrahero.9358:

Zalavaaris.5329:

Terrahero.9358:

Zalavaaris.5329:

There’s no game mode other than wvw where vets are rewarded more just for being vets. In every other game mode vets get more rewards because they simply play more than other people. Rewards haven’t been I don’t get extra Lis in raids just because I’ve played the game since beta. Someone brand new to the game will earn Lis at the same rate as me and with the same effort. You hardcore wvw players feel entitled to fast rewards but only on the contingency that EVERYONE else that played any other game mode more seriously than wvw does not have access to even reasonable pip acquisition. You basically want to be special because you’re gw2 hipsters that played wvw before there were decent rewards. Get over it

First of it’s patently false, secondly you have to actually succesfully argue that it is even a bad thing. You don’t just get to skip that part of the discussion and assume your position is correct.

You’re going to claim I’m stating a falsity without details? You tell me then… how are pve vets rewarded more for previous time played? If you and I step into a raid right now I will earn just as much LI and magnetite shards that you will. I don’t get bonuses because I’ve been playing pve since beta. So please… enlighten me with facts

Anyone that has already done a lot of FotM will be able to earn their Legendary backslot a lot faster. Because that is what this boils down to, Veteran players get to the “end goal” faster and the “end goal” can be a range of things.
Also, you cannot just step into a raid as a new player. That is grossly oversimplifying things. You need ascended gear, the proper build, all of that takes time. Quite a lot of time. Having that headstart sure helps earn something faster.

Then they launch new Legendaries. You need Masteries to even start working on Legendary weapons. Veterans have these Mastery tracks unlocked and will earn their Legendary faster. While new players do not.

You also still haven’t actually argued why this is a bad thing. I get the distinct impression you, nor anyone making this argument, actually care about “the new player”. It is just a convenient excuse to try and argue to lower the requirement that you want to see lowered for yourself.
Last i checked new players did not appoint anyone as their representative of what they do or do not want. Infact i’d wager you just about none of the new players would even care. They got other things to worry about. Like unlocked their skill slots and traits.

If you really wanted to make things easier for new players you’d not worry about some long-term cosmetic item but instead you’d argue about greatly reducing the cost of Ascended gear. All of the Ascended gear. It takes a new players months and untill then they are disadvantages in pve and wvw. Now there is a big practical disadvantage. So lets instead make Ascended gear available for, lets say, 2g a piece. Then a new player can be full Ascended and compete in all content without any hard statistical disadvantages compared to Veteran players in a week or two. After that we can revisit the concept for items that are purely cosmetic in nature.

You’re wrong…. you get the same journal pages that EVERYONE else does as a vet. We don’t get 5 journal pages per daily recommended fractal while new players get .5 or some crap. You’re absolutely wrong.

Oh you’re also wrong about raiding. You can do it in exotic. Oh also, if you do that you still only get 1 LI per boss regardless of how many bday presents a net has given you.

One more thing, you can’t use gear as an argument as gear helps in all modes (other than pvp). Having gear will help you with fractals, raids, and wvw but this is obtainable quite quickly. There is an artificial time gate through the game itself limiting ANYONE who hasn’t only played wvw for the past few years. So don’t try to use that as an argument.

Certain items needed for the Legendary backslot only drop from higher fractal levels, so, you are wrong.

I’m also right about raiding. Just because you can in theory walk into a raid naked doesn’t mean its something you can just do.

Of course i can use gear as an argument. The fact that it helps in other game modes only makes it a more compelling argument. It’s functional advantage vs cosmetic. Clearly the former is more important to get.
You’re also full of it if you think getting Ascended gear is something you do “quick”. These advantages are real.

You also have still to actually succesfully argue that this is even a bad thing, or how you aren’t just cynically argueing out of self-interest thinly veiled as altruism towards new players.

To your first point. You are correct that you need items from higher level fractals. However, you don’t have to have been playing pve for 3 years to be able to obtain said items. I had a friend start playing just recently and he got to 80, got his ascended gear through a mix of playing and buying good, and then got into fractals. There is a slight curve to getting in but it’s nothing close to the time gate for new wvw players.

To your second point, you present an argument about being able to walk into a raid naked and not succeed. You are being hyperbolic as you absolutely CAN raid in exotic gear. Especially if you get the easily obtainable ascended accessories from bitter frost.

You’re providing a straw man when what we are talking about are rewards that are being retrofit to players based purely on play time in a specific mode. When new rewards come out it makes sense to require a lot of work to attain. But the work should be from after the rewards are released. You aren’t owed anything from a net because you play more wvw than pve or PvP. If it takes 20 hours a week to max out claim tickets that is fine with me. The hardcore will get it way before me. But it should take 20 hours a week for 4 months for EVERYONE. Not 13 hours a week for the hardcore and 40 for the new. It would take me 40 hours a week to max out my claim tickets. You bet I have self interest. No game should require I work as if it were a full time job for half a year to get a cosmetic item. You asked why I think this is a bad thing. I will leave, others will leave, and all the while the hardcore wvwers will praise a net for getting rid of the pve filth. Then your mode will die and you can enjoy the one item you get for the next 5 years too. You want better server support? You want more content? More maps? Then it requires something called an ROI for a net. They will get that through the swarm of new and excited players. I think you all can take a hit to being an entitled snowflake to support the game mode you all claim to love. By the way, ROI stands for return on investment for those that didn’t know.

Avigrus.2871:

Just add these items to PvE to stop the whining.

Complainers of this sort will just find something else to complain about. Caving to the complaints only sets a precedent for the next time. It’s one reason why we see entitled demands so much.

I get the frustration behind your comment. However, PvE-preference players with “gotta get it now” attitudes should think about why it’s good for the health of the game for some rewards to be put into other modes. Not that I expect all such people to get it, but maybe some do.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Avigrus.2871:

Just add these items to PvE to stop the whining.

Complainers of this sort will just find something else to complain about. Caving to the complaints only sets a precedent for the next time. It’s one reason why we see entitled demands so much.

I get the frustration behind your comment. However, PvE-preference players with “gotta get it now” attitudes should think about why it’s good for the health of the game for some rewards to be put into other modes. Not that I expect all such people to get it, but maybe some do.

Not wanting to play 40 hours a week for a year to get a reward =\= wanting it now

Zalavaaris.5329:

how are pve vets rewarded more for previous time played?

This question has been answered already in this thread numerous times in various ways. Waste of time to keep repeating it at this point if readers like yourself keep ignoring those answers.

Why don’t you go obtain one of those free-to-play accounts and show us all how you are able to be completely new and do the same as vets, get the same rewards with it “quick”? Don’t forget to include magic find, gold, and mastery bonuses! I wonder how long it will take to build the karma to unlock all the karma vendor skins…

The work should be from after the rewards are released

Maybe you are right and Anet should reset everyone’s karma back to 0 when they release new karma vendor items whenever a new Living Story map is rolled out. It would only be fair to new players!

I feel the pips are good the way they are. But I think they should add maybe two more pips one where if you play 2+ hrs you are given an additonal pip the other one would be you gain an additional pip only while activly defending towers and keeps on your borderland. This will help us with defense and will help new comers get additional pips.

I’m a PvEr mainly, WvW second and PvP third. 186 Mastery, 172 Rank, 82 Dragon. I think the pips aquisition is fine.

First week I dipped in and just got out of Wood. Second week I played a bit longer and got partway into Gold. It certainly wasn’t 20 hours worth. Maybe a couple of hours

It varied from 2-8 pips the first week and second week it was mostly baseline 4 pips with the occasional 9 from being outnumbered.

Let’s not forget next week also sees the loyalty pip kick in which means it’ll be a minimum of 3 pips for everyone who remains loyal to a single server on every tick which means 36 pips/hour once T3 participation is established.

The only change I would suggest making is increasing loyalty pips up to 3 times so after 3 weeks you get 1 bonus, six weeks it goes up to 2 and 3 for staying 9+ weeks loyal to your server.

Avigrus.2871:

What a bunch of sooks… unbelievable.

Just add these items to PvE to stop the whining.

Pve’rs are the biggest whiners in the game.

“I don’t want to run around opening chest in SW!”
“I hate how I HAVE to multi-map in AB because the loot is TOO good”
“Why is that necro getting more karma compared to me by using his class mechanic?”
“Engis are doing the same? NERF!!!”
“I want the Gift of Battle but I hate WvW!! Plz ANET”

Now it’s, “Why are people that kept WvW on life support for 4 years getting tickets faster than me?”

Geez pve’rs… this is embarassing…

Chaba.5410:

Zalavaaris.5329:

how are pve vets rewarded more for previous time played?

This question has been answered already in this thread numerous times in various ways. Waste of time to keep repeating it at this point if readers like yourself keep ignoring those answers.

Why don’t you go obtain one of those free-to-play accounts and show us all how you are able to be completely new and do the same as vets, get the same rewards with it “quick”? Don’t forget to include magic find, gold, and mastery bonuses! I wonder how long it will take to build the karma to unlock all the karma vendor skins…

The work should be from after the rewards are released

Maybe you are right and Anet should reset everyone’s karma back to 0 when they release new karma vendor items whenever a new Living Story map is rolled out. It would only be fair to new players!

Wow….. straw….man….. I’m not talking about new to guild wars… I’m talking about new to the game mode. Oh and you don’t need mastery unlocked to raid… You need updrafts. ALSO, karma isn’t exclusively a pve concept so don’t even try that. It’s clear this won’t go anywhere with your lack of arguments. You can’t make a good point so it’s a waste of my valuable time typing this. You think I’m an entitled pve player and I think you don’t fully understand that you hardcore wvwets are actually an entitled snowflake more than anyone else who is noticing the game making bad game design decisions. You aren’t changing my mind and I certainly am unable to open yours. Good day.

Lahmia.2193:

Good to see pve entitlement is alive and well.

As a pve player, I agree with you. This is ridiculous. These rewards are clearly aimed towards the people who have been keeping an entire game mode alive for years and that’s how it should be.

Set.7461:

Avigrus.2871:

What a bunch of sooks… unbelievable.
Just add these items to PvE to stop the whining.

Now it’s, “Why are people that kept WvW on life support for 4 years getting tickets faster than me?”

It actually goes against Anet marketing of Guild Wars, that was to rewards players based on their skill rather than their playtime. SPVP, PVE, even Raids don’t do that.
So if you’re asking why… well I’d suggest you put yourself in other people shoes.
It’s less a problem of PvE players being whiny than it is with pvp players being kitteny.

I am sorry but Zalavaaris is right. Fractals won’t take you nearly as long to get to T4. If you’re good, you progress fast. You will get to T4 before a WvW “new” player gets their diamond chest.
Fractals players don’t get additional rewards because they keep fractals alive, they get as much as anyone else at T4. T4 is not even a week of hard WvW work. That’s a fact.
Raids are based on skills. Yes it does take time to learn, but the rewards are not gated behind something that will take you ages to get no matter your skill, it’s the same for everyone.

WvW is another concept entirely. You can be level 10k and have “cheesed” your way there, it will still require the same amount of skill… to get a lot more pips.
That is what is broken here. You aren’t rewarded because you’re better, you’re rewarded because you played more.
Now getting rewarded for taking forts, wiping big groups of enemies, being a good dps/support etc, that would have to do with skills and could potentially be a reason for additional pips. But this? Seriously? No. The amount of time required in this mode every week is a lot for veterans, and is absolutely insane for newcomers, much, much mode than what is required from any other mode.

The least they could do, since they throw pve stuff at WvW players constantly (tome of knowledge) is to make them somehow usable for WvW as well. If not getting one level for one tome, they could make a recipe for tomes + proof of heroes or whatever.

Another suggestion would be to give higher ranks discount on stuff rather than additional pips. What would it change? Well everything. You could choose to either pay more in tickets/proofs/badges now to get your stuff or play more and earn discounts.

Oh, and did the OP realize that if you want to get the Legendary Backpack you need a commander’s tag. 300 gold. Can’t wait to hear the complaints about having to buy something they don’t even want to use.

Zalavaaris.5329:

Wow….. straw….man….. I’m not talking about new to guild wars… I’m talking about new to the game mode.

If you aren’t including the “new to guild wars” player/account, you don’t have any argument about “new to game mode” either. Saying they don’t count is a clear attempt to dismiss the bonuses towards rewards that you get for having an older “built up” account. Those making a claim about getting same rewards in other game modes should prove that claim by making a new account. We can already predict it won’t be “same rewards” because of features like account-based magic find which increases chance of getting rare drops and more valuable crafting materials!

I don’t intend to change your mind. I intend to show everyone reading this the flaws of your argument by taking it to its logical conclusion.

Moreover, why are you attacking just the rank bonus pips when the base pips also provide differential pip gain? When the loyalty pip bonus comes into effect, will you also post about how unfair that is?

I would argue that the main issue is the slow progression with the base number of pips that causes a new player or new to game mode player to have to play an inordinate amount of time compared to other game modes. That makes much more sense than trying to push the “same rewards” argument and attack other players for having played this game mode more than you.

Zalavaaris.5329:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Avigrus.2871:

Just add these items to PvE to stop the whining.

Complainers of this sort will just find something else to complain about. Caving to the complaints only sets a precedent for the next time. It’s one reason why we see entitled demands so much.

I get the frustration behind your comment. However, PvE-preference players with “gotta get it now” attitudes should think about why it’s good for the health of the game for some rewards to be put into other modes. Not that I expect all such people to get it, but maybe some do.

Not wanting to play 40 hours a week for a year to get a reward =\= wanting it now

Thanks for proving my point. Maybe, just maybe pip acquisition is as it is to reward people who’ve been playing WvW for years with little reward. The fact that someone who hasn’t put in that time in the mode can get it with — in many cases — a lot less of a time commitment than many of those WvW vets have already put in is already more than fair. If the time needed is too much for you, then maybe, just maybe, this reward is not for you.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Zalavaaris.5329:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Avigrus.2871:

Just add these items to PvE to stop the whining.

Complainers of this sort will just find something else to complain about. Caving to the complaints only sets a precedent for the next time. It’s one reason why we see entitled demands so much.

I get the frustration behind your comment. However, PvE-preference players with “gotta get it now” attitudes should think about why it’s good for the health of the game for some rewards to be put into other modes. Not that I expect all such people to get it, but maybe some do.

Not wanting to play 40 hours a week for a year to get a reward =\= wanting it now

Thanks for proving my point. Maybe, just maybe pip acquisition is at it is to reward people who’ve been playing WvW for years with little reward. The fact that someone who hasn’t put in that time in the mode can get it with — in many cases — a lot less of a time commitment than many of those WvW vets have already put in is already more than fair. If the time needed is too much for you, then maybe, just maybe, this reward is not for you.

One of the things that ANeT removed from the game that used to be at the vendor in WvW is the WVW EXP potions. You should complain to them for removing those. It was a quick to gain Ranks back in the day.

As for complaining about the number of pips received by veteran players, you should direct your goal to raising the number of basic pips you receive before ranks. Do that instead of trying to bring down other players and maybe you might garner support from veterans who see this thread as non-wvw players trying to get pips easily instead of putting in the work we’ve done. ANeT actually made ranks mean something, other than a target for the enemy to take down.

I’m a Mithril Assaulter(around 4250 rank) – I play all modes except pvp. I also have nearly 28500 AP. I played primarily pve up until 2 years ago. I dabbled in WvW when I had the time. Whenever new content is released WvW becomes secondary. But needless to say, I’ve put in my time, earned my rank and command 3-4 times a week. For the OP to come in and say that high ranked players shouldn’t get the bonuses ANeT has set is a complete insult to all who have put in hours playing WvW. Like I said, the OP should argue for more basic pip points not the bringing down of players to his/her level.

Heibi.4251:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Zalavaaris.5329:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Avigrus.2871:

Just add these items to PvE to stop the whining.

Complainers of this sort will just find something else to complain about. Caving to the complaints only sets a precedent for the next time. It’s one reason why we see entitled demands so much.

I get the frustration behind your comment. However, PvE-preference players with “gotta get it now” attitudes should think about why it’s good for the health of the game for some rewards to be put into other modes. Not that I expect all such people to get it, but maybe some do.

Not wanting to play 40 hours a week for a year to get a reward =\= wanting it now

Thanks for proving my point. Maybe, just maybe pip acquisition is at it is to reward people who’ve been playing WvW for years with little reward. The fact that someone who hasn’t put in that time in the mode can get it with — in many cases — a lot less of a time commitment than many of those WvW vets have already put in is already more than fair. If the time needed is too much for you, then maybe, just maybe, this reward is not for you.

One of the things that ANeT removed from the game that used to be at the vendor in WvW is the WVW EXP potions. You should complain to them for removing those. It was a quick to gain Ranks back in the day.

As for complaining about the number of pips received by veteran players, you should direct your goal to raising the number of basic pips you receive before ranks. Do that instead of trying to bring down other players and maybe you might garner support from veterans who see this thread as non-wvw players trying to get pips easily instead of putting in the work we’ve done. ANeT actually made ranks mean something, other than a target for the enemy to take down.

I’m a Mithril Assaulter(around 4250 rank) – I play all modes except pvp. I also have nearly 28500 AP. I played primarily pve up until 2 years ago. I dabbled in WvW when I had the time. Whenever new content is released WvW becomes secondary. But needless to say, I’ve put in my time, earned my rank and command 3-4 times a week. For the OP to come in and say that high ranked players shouldn’t get the bonuses ANeT has set is a complete insult to all who have put in hours playing WvW. Like I said, the OP should argue for more basic pip points not the bringing down of players to his/her level.

I agree, but why address me? I’m on the, “Pip differential is OK as is.” side.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Heibi.4251:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Zalavaaris.5329:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Avigrus.2871:

Just add these items to PvE to stop the whining.

Complainers of this sort will just find something else to complain about. Caving to the complaints only sets a precedent for the next time. It’s one reason why we see entitled demands so much.

I get the frustration behind your comment. However, PvE-preference players with “gotta get it now” attitudes should think about why it’s good for the health of the game for some rewards to be put into other modes. Not that I expect all such people to get it, but maybe some do.

Not wanting to play 40 hours a week for a year to get a reward =\= wanting it now

Thanks for proving my point. Maybe, just maybe pip acquisition is at it is to reward people who’ve been playing WvW for years with little reward. The fact that someone who hasn’t put in that time in the mode can get it with — in many cases — a lot less of a time commitment than many of those WvW vets have already put in is already more than fair. If the time needed is too much for you, then maybe, just maybe, this reward is not for you.

One of the things that ANeT removed from the game that used to be at the vendor in WvW is the WVW EXP potions. You should complain to them for removing those. It was a quick to gain Ranks back in the day.

As for complaining about the number of pips received by veteran players, you should direct your goal to raising the number of basic pips you receive before ranks. Do that instead of trying to bring down other players and maybe you might garner support from veterans who see this thread as non-wvw players trying to get pips easily instead of putting in the work we’ve done. ANeT actually made ranks mean something, other than a target for the enemy to take down.

I’m a Mithril Assaulter(around 4250 rank) – I play all modes except pvp. I also have nearly 28500 AP. I played primarily pve up until 2 years ago. I dabbled in WvW when I had the time. Whenever new content is released WvW becomes secondary. But needless to say, I’ve put in my time, earned my rank and command 3-4 times a week. For the OP to come in and say that high ranked players shouldn’t get the bonuses ANeT has set is a complete insult to all who have put in hours playing WvW. Like I said, the OP should argue for more basic pip points not the bringing down of players to his/her level.

I agree, but why address me? I’m on the, “Pip differential is OK as is.” side.

Not aimed at you in particular. More of a continuation of your answer.

Deihnyx.6318:

It actually goes against Anet marketing of Guild Wars, that was to rewards players based on their skill rather than their playtime. SPVP, PVE, even Raids don’t do that.
So if you’re asking why… well I’d suggest you put yourself in other people shoes.
It’s less a problem of PvE players being whiny than it is with pvp players being kitteny.

I am sorry but Zalavaaris is right. Fractals won’t take you nearly as long to get to T4. If you’re good, you progress fast. You will get to T4 before a WvW “new” player gets their diamond chest.
Fractals players don’t get additional rewards because they keep fractals alive, they get as much as anyone else at T4. T4 is not even a week of hard WvW work. That’s a fact.
Raids are based on skills. Yes it does take time to learn, but the rewards are not gated behind something that will take you ages to get no matter your skill, it’s the same for everyone.

WvW is another concept entirely. You can be level 10k and have “cheesed” your way there, it will still require the same amount of skill… to get a lot more pips.
That is what is broken here. You aren’t rewarded because you’re better, you’re rewarded because you played more.
Now getting rewarded for taking forts, wiping big groups of enemies, being a good dps/support etc, that would have to do with skills and could potentially be a reason for additional pips. But this? Seriously? No. The amount of time required in this mode every week is a lot for veterans, and is absolutely insane for newcomers, much, much mode than what is required from any other mode.

The least they could do, since they throw pve stuff at WvW players constantly (tome of knowledge) is to make them somehow usable for WvW as well. If not getting one level for one tome, they could make a recipe for tomes + proof of heroes or whatever.

Another suggestion would be to give higher ranks discount on stuff rather than additional pips. What would it change? Well everything. You could choose to either pay more in tickets/proofs/badges now to get your stuff or play more and earn discounts.

Sorry for what? We can discuss fractals, sure. I stepped into fractals when I had to make C&C. What I noticed is it’s instanced. Some fractals is as simple as killing 1 boss. Sure, with a game mode so compartmentalized, it’s easy to measure “skill”.

The problem with WvW is there’s so much more to it than taking towers. There’s roaming, escaping outnumbered, blobbing, taking camps, bleeding supply, havoc groups, commanding, etc. How would you measure this? How would you even go about ranking these aspects in the game mode? Unless you’re some awesome programmer with savant-like algorithm knowledge, you break it down to what we have right now which is WXP. Like it or not, the game mode doesn’t have a metric to determine individual skill. In place, they use the war score so you have to contribute collectively.

This is something you need to get over. It’s not Player vs Player(sPvP), it’s World vs World so of course individual skill means less. That’s where ranking comes in. In no way is it an indication of skill, but it is a fair system which awards experience. And that experienced is measured in ranking. Want higher ranking? Get more WXP. Are you better at that random Gold Recruit you just jumped and killed? Sure you may think so, but you might be a thief and he might be running zerg gear. You talk about cheesing rank as if that’s exclusive to WvW. All the game modes can be cheesed. I addressed this earlier but the higher tier vets are not taking tickets away from me. Sure, they’ll get their’s faster but I’ll get them too.

How to fix pips:

Reduce outnumbered pip bonus from 5 to 2, or at most 3.

Server in 1st place gets 7 baseline pips, server in 2nd place gets 5 baseline pips, server in 3rd place gets 3 baseline pips

Loyalty, world rank, and commander bonus pips remain the same.

Everybody wins.