Elrik Noj (Norn Guardian, Kaineng [SIN][Owls])
“Understanding is a three edged sword: your side, their side, and the truth.”
“The objective is to win. The goal is to have fun.”
It is all fun and games until you log on one day and get the message, ’300 people from (Insert your Server name here) have already logged in and claimed this as their home Server. Please Select a new server from the list of Available Servers.
However, now that Anet has announced this, they need to implement it asap because the time between this was announced and the moment the changes go live, nobody will transfer to lower tier servers. Why pay for a very high transfer price now, when you cant wait until it becomes medium price?
The change is awesome, now if we can actually get some kind of change in the servers we fight. Fighting the same server over and over gets very boring .
Forever Against Stacked Servers
Virual [VRUS] Alien Lunatics [StFu] Nocturnal Sxaddx [Nuts] Ft. Aspenwood
That which is dead may eternally lie, but with great aeons even death may die.
It is all fun and games until you log on one day and get the message, ’300 people from (Insert your Server name here) have already logged in and claimed this as their home Server. Please Select a new server from the list of Available Servers.
If I were kicked off the server I’ve been on cuz of this I would just quit gw2. Glad I didn’t pay for the expansion yet.
Forever Against Stacked Servers
Virual [VRUS] Alien Lunatics [StFu] Nocturnal Sxaddx [Nuts] Ft. Aspenwood
That which is dead may eternally lie, but with great aeons even death may die.
This change won’t really help lower tier servers – who’s going to transfer to a desert with 3 roamers on it, apart from maybe a guild that’s decided it wants to dominate a server rather than have even or outnumbered fights..
It doesn’t do anything to address any of the real issues on population imbalance or the lack of attention to wvw which has driven so many players away.
Okay, let´s say it: This is the first half of a step in a better future!
I don´t wanna be too long, so a few suggestions, you have totally forgotten:
Deserting your own WvW server to get on a higher ranked WvW server should be punished harder (as you are starting to do soon). But deserting to one of the competing servers in the match / tier should have even higher (temporary) costs.
PvE players mostly don´t care about the server name, who is or how many are on that server. Delete the WvW boni for PvE players and offer them a gem bonus for the transfer on a low populated server: You will see, how rapidly the servers will get even. If you offer a free transfer: Why would anyone lift a finger and lose the WvW boni?
Some PvE and casual WvW players (at least for dailys and tournaments) got to like their old server name and got to dislike / mock the others. Get the PvE and PvP players their own server with the permant guest on a WvW server. If they want to play WvW they will get to join that server temporarily in the match. If you want to change your permanent guest server, you have to pay too – considering the WvW ranking as any WvW player would have to. WvW enemys will see only the WvW server name, your own people can see your PvE server name to help the commanders. Why would you stay on a PvE server or a WvW server? Only on a PvE server you´ll get the WvW boni but from the best WvW server in the match. On the other hand in the queue for the map every WvW server inhabitant is preferred to a PvE server inhabitant.
Finally getting something that should have been done when the PvE megaserver system was implemented eh? Guess its better late than never.
Without also changing the transfer costs it wont affect server population one bit though. At best – and what I guess Anet is hoping for – people will see how hopelessly outmanned they are in their tier, which will make them spend cash to move to another server, messing up population issues further. The best result that can happen from this is that it depopulate low tier servers so much they have to close a tier.
Ohhh it’s great news. I’m on Seafarer Rest and it’s sometimes boring when we always win. I want exelent fights, I want time when Blacktide Underworld or Fow will be hard opponent. When Expansion will launch, with this uptade, WvW will be my second home again
This is all very well but it has no direct effect on those of us whose loyalty is to the Server we chose back in beta. It’s like following a sports team – whether the team is top of the league or fighting relegation makes absolutely no difference to your connection with it. You stick with your team no matter what.
I always thought allowing server transfers of any kind was a mistake but clearly most people aren’t interested in who they play for or support, just whether they win or get good fights or whatever.
I always thought allowing server transfers of any kind was a mistake but clearly most people aren’t interested in who they play for or support, just whether they win or get good fights or whatever.
Or maybe people have issues with certain people on your current server and needs to either stop playing or change server?
Or maybe they want to have less queues?
Or maybe they want to join their friends in WvW that started playing on another server?
There are many reasons to change servers. Not just “I change because I want to be on the winning server!!”
Some PvE and casual WvW players (at least for dailys and tournaments) got to like their old server name and got to dislike / mock the others. Get the PvE and PvP players their own server with the permant guest on a WvW server. If they want to play WvW they will get to join that server temporarily in the match. If you want to change your permanent guest server, you have to pay too – considering the WvW ranking as any WvW player would have to. WvW enemys will see only the WvW server name, your own people can see your PvE server name to help the commanders. Why would you stay on a PvE server or a WvW server? Only on a PvE server you´ll get the WvW boni but from the best WvW server in the match. On the other hand in the queue for the map every WvW server inhabitant is preferred to a PvE server inhabitant.
Agreed. Good to see that the biggest problem is being addressed .. positive.
The information they gather from it could be the solution to a lot of problems, if up till now we haven’t been counted separately to the PvE, it would explain a lot too.
Thank you for the response .. even if we gotta hunt down the extra detail .. kudos to the Dev for showing up!
Is this any way in response to NA Fort Aspenwood’s WvW population being larger than even the tier 1 servers? And the other tier 2 servers that get locked in against them dying out because there’s no way they can deal with that? A pretty jabbing observation I know, but one that’s nonetheless true.
Yumiko Togashii
Commander to [SLVR], Housepet to [GH]
No, EotM won’t be counted towards WvW. I don’t think it’s the same experience, and you can always enter it since it can have as many instances as needed, so there’s really not that same population problem as in “core” WvW.
Sorry, this made me laugh, and not in a good way.
Here is a snap shot of what it like facing off green on eotm. Do some caps with your zerg of 15 -30 (dependent whether your blue or red), then see roughly 100 green come screaming towards you. Next you get the odd comment on map chat, along the lines of, ‘really hope we are green next week!’.
By the way that not an exaggeration, that’s exactly what happens!
(before anyone says ‘ohhh but eotm doesn’t count, its not wvw,—- the dev brought it up, not me, so it does by that very fact, even though vested interests in some wvw corners would like to keep the balancing just as it is)
Is this any way in response to NA Fort Aspenwood’s WvW population being larger than even the tier 1 servers? And the other tier 2 servers that get locked in against them dying out because there’s no way they can deal with that? A pretty jabbing observation I know, but one that’s nonetheless true.
Whaaaaat? YB matches FA population, FA has been losing guilds for a little while now because they got so fat the queues went to hell, it’s back to manageable levels. If anything this is in response to SoS, DB, DH all being on full status while not even being in T1. SoS has been on full for months with gaps here and there when it opens, but it’s population is probably less than half of FA and YB, that’s how many pve players they have.
DB has dropped almost 10 ranks in ratings because of their full status and unable to recruit, they lost a bunch of wvw players and still remain locked for the majority of the time. DH is locked even though they’re a mid ranking server. That’s how much of a difference the pve numbers make. Pve players have no reason to move ever again, which makes it very restrictive to wvw populations on any server.
P.S if you haven’t read the news this week, YB just got a truckload of players from T1, their NA queues are higher than FA, 50+ queues on every bl last night. They’re still open while FA and SoS are locked.
Another derailing post. ^^ North Keep: One of the village residents will now flee if their home is destroyed.
“Game over man, Game Over!” – RIP Bill
No, EotM won’t be counted towards WvW. I don’t think it’s the same experience, and you can always enter it since it can have as many instances as needed, so there’s really not that same population problem as in “core” WvW.
Sorry, this made me laugh, and not in a good way.
Here is a snap shot of what it like facing off green on eotm. Do some caps with your zerg of 15 -30 (dependent whether your blue or red), then see roughly 100 green come screaming towards you. Next you get the odd comment on map chat, along the lines of, ‘really hope we are green next week!’.
By the way that not an exaggeration, that’s exactly what happens!
(before anyone says ‘ohhh but eotm doesn’t count, its not wvw,—- the dev brought it up, not me, so it does by that very fact, even though vested interests in some wvw corners would like to keep the balancing just as it is)
Actually that made me smile even more and actually shows me that they do realize EoTM is not the same as WvW.
P.S if you haven’t read the news this week, YB just got a truckload of players from T1, their NA queues are higher than FA, 50+ queues on every bl last night. They’re still open while FA and SoS are locked.
So once again players are trying to make more imbalanced match ups is what you are really saying..
Sorry, this made me laugh, and not in a good way.
Here is a snap shot of what it like facing off green on eotm. Do some caps with your zerg of 15 -30 (dependent whether your blue or red), then see roughly 100 green come screaming towards you. Next you get the odd comment on map chat, along the lines of, ‘really hope we are green next week!’.
By the way that not an exaggeration, that’s exactly what happens!
(before anyone says ‘ohhh but eotm doesn’t count, its not wvw,—- the dev brought it up, not me, so it does by that very fact, even though vested interests in some wvw corners would like to keep the balancing just as it is)
Eotm is the way it is today because red and blue sides allowed green to walk all over them, over and over again, week after week. They have a strategy, they rush red keep early on, then they camp out keep for a little bit wiping red zerg over and over because it’s predictable on what red will do next, eg pretty sure you’re going for scorpions, pretty sure you’re coming back for the keep.
They get wiped again and pushed to spawn. Red gets demoralized and begins to lose half their force, because players want an easy ride, understandable, since it’s a leveling area for most of them. Green’s work is done, they have an easy side to overrun for the rest of the game.
Red and Blue players need to stick it out, weather the storm, stop falling for the same trap and then double team green. Get smart or get run over, this hasn’t been happening from day 1.
Another derailing post. ^^ North Keep: One of the village residents will now flee if their home is destroyed.
“Game over man, Game Over!” – RIP Bill
No, EotM won’t be counted towards WvW. I don’t think it’s the same experience, and you can always enter it since it can have as many instances as needed, so there’s really not that same population problem as in “core” WvW.
Sorry, this made me laugh, and not in a good way.
Here is a snap shot of what it like facing off green on eotm. Do some caps with your zerg of 15 -30 (dependent whether your blue or red), then see roughly 100 green come screaming towards you. Next you get the odd comment on map chat, along the lines of, ‘really hope we are green next week!’.
By the way that not an exaggeration, that’s exactly what happens!
(before anyone says ‘ohhh but eotm doesn’t count, its not wvw,—- the dev brought it up, not me, so it does by that very fact, even though vested interests in some wvw corners would like to keep the balancing just as it is)
Actually that made me smile even more and actually shows me that they do realize EoTM is not the same as WvW.
I was not stating that wvw is the exact same thing as wvw, which it is not. But that does take away the fact that there has always been a balancing issue in eotm. It was never envisioned as a karma/ wxp train for the privileged few, who happen to be green on a particular week!
P.S if you haven’t read the news this week, YB just got a truckload of players from T1, their NA queues are higher than FA, 50+ queues on every bl last night. They’re still open while FA and SoS are locked.
So once again players are trying to make more imbalanced match ups is what you are really saying..
They said they’re trying to push YB to kitten break the T1/2 barrier and and get T1/2 rotation matches again since T1 is getting stale. But this is from the same people who kept T1 out of reach from T2 in the first place.
Another derailing post. ^^ North Keep: One of the village residents will now flee if their home is destroyed.
“Game over man, Game Over!” – RIP Bill
Reagrdlesss of anything +1 for message from the devs! Yoohoo!!!! Parteeeeeey!
Welcomed changes: really hope that maybe a price dropping (even a free transfer?) would be considered for the very low servers (UW ofc but I think others are also in the same state).
Ofc that after the new system is tested for a bit I guess.
Nonetheless, GLAD to have some activity on this forum and someone talking to us!
Please keep it up Samuel : )
This is all very well but it has no direct effect on those of us whose loyalty is to the Server we chose back in beta. It’s like following a sports team – whether the team is top of the league or fighting relegation makes absolutely no difference to your connection with it. You stick with your team no matter what.
I always thought allowing server transfers of any kind was a mistake but clearly most people aren’t interested in who they play for or support, just whether they win or get good fights or whatever.
Well, maybe people can transfer to yours not just because you aren’t winning but because your community can provide something others can’t. As more and more people buy the game, some may not want to wvw, and as HoT rolls along there’s a chance that some deserving servers might hit “full” status. Those communities should be allowed to grow, receiving players not just from transfers but also from new buyers as well. Certainly, servers that manage to do this deserve better IMO.
But this is only step 1 of course. There’s many other issues in regards, but the main idea is to recognize that in the context of servers, wvw comes first. There can’t be server loyalty without the concept of a server itself, I say.
For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards,
for there you have been and there you will long to return.
Personally I don’t care which tier I play in as long as the fights are fun, and I can find something to do when I’m on.
Was on CD back in the T5 days, and it just wasn’t active enough for me so bounced around T3/T4 servers for awhile. Now I’m on a T2 server(for the last 8 months), and this is just right for me.
This change will allow people to find the tier that is right for them, whether it’s T1 or T8, based on noted population. It’s a welcome change.
There should be something lower than “Medium” …. you know like “Empty” for Eredon Terrace and just make transfers free into our server.
I think the reason why ever server seems high or whatever is probably due to the large amount of inactives/non-wvw’ers. Hopefully this will change.
Although the idea that blackouts could be used to exploit the new system is a definite issue. That means the measurements cannot be fickle and be drastically affected by short term movements.
For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards,
for there you have been and there you will long to return.
But because World versus World is the only game mode to which worlds apply these days, we have developed a better model that exclusively uses WvW data to determine population levels and transfer costs.
Nice… speaking of which is the “Guest” button even doing anything these days, if so what…
Yeah… I tried coming up w/ stuff for this, but that all got shot down.
What if world bonuses are reduced the more stacked a server is? Players stacking like world war z zombies in T1 would probably go, omg our magic find is nerfed because everybody’s bandwagoning here, lets try balance tiers out.
Thoughts? (i know server stackers/badwagoners will flame me, but bring it on).
HoT = Grind Wars 2
HoT = WvW players forced to PVE
Whaaaaat? YB matches FA population, FA has been losing guilds for a little while now because they got so fat the queues went to hell, it’s back to manageable levels. If anything this is in response to SoS, DB, DH all being on full status while not even being in T1. SoS has been on full for months with gaps here and there when it opens, but it’s population is probably less than half of FA and YB, that’s how many pve players they have.
Oh I know. Our guild was one of the major WvW guilds for SoS that bailed about a month or so ago. It was literally a mass exodus off the server into lower tiers. We got so tired of being red every week, facing blobs that were fielding sometimes 60+ or more. While we often had as few as single digit numbers on our home BL during the non-NA prime hours. There was little we could do to deal with that. What was worse, after some glicko calculations, we discovered that we were still gaining points and even IF SoS completely left WvW alone and as a server didn’t even bother to show up it would still be weeks or even months before SoS had any hopes of dropping into more stable tiers. And yet, even if we did drop we were too strong for tier 3 and would inevitably end up right back up there. That’s how huge the differences are in just two tier sets.
The basic gist of the problem is overall server population needs to have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with balance calculations for WvW. It would also be really nice if said calculations took into consideration the waxing and waning WvW populations per server during red vs green match-ups. As many fairweather players only show up to WvW on green weeks.
Yumiko Togashii
Commander to [SLVR], Housepet to [GH]
YB …They’re still open while FA and SoS are locked.
Yep, it works both ways. YB should be full given how their WvW population was roughly matching FA’s before the recent T1 transfers. And SoS should be not full. But PvE players…. One of the things that caused FA to go full was a very large gaming community based around a streamer choosing FA as their GW2 home for HoT when it was announced. Those players mostly play PvE. With FA’s NA queueing four maps though it might have been that those PvE players couldn’t have picked FA in the first place if this new system had been in place then.
Chaba Tangnu
Founding member of [NERF] Fort Engineer and driver for [TLC] The Legion of Charrs
RIP [SIC] Strident Iconoclast
I always thought allowing server transfers of any kind was a mistake but clearly most people aren’t interested in who they play for or support, just whether they win or get good fights or whatever.
Or maybe people have issues with certain people on your current server and needs to either stop playing or change server?
Or maybe they want to have less queues?
Or maybe they want to join their friends in WvW that started playing on another server?
There are many reasons to change servers. Not just “I change because I want to be on the winning server!!”
Sure, there are many legitimate reasons to change servers but not so much when it comes to world hopping every other month or bouncing back and forth between a few in the same tier. It should cost more the more often an account transfers and there ought to be a temporary penalty of some kind like getting your originating worlds rewards/bonuses for a few matches maybe so these are not decisions people make lightly with their daddy’s credit card. ANET has done so little support individual world communities that anything at all would be a bonus.
~Xylla~ [oG] on Ehmry Bay [PiXi]
Xyleia Luxuria / Sweet Little Agony / Morning Glory Wine / Precious Illusionz /
Near Fanstastica /Ocean at the End / Blue Eyed Hexe / Andro Queen / Indie Cindee . . .
Anet has a chance to invigorate the health of WvW with this system along with HoT if all is prepared for and done properly. If the top 6+ servers manage to maintain healthy and similar WvW populations after the HoT launch simmers a bit, then we might be looking at a fun fresh rotation of match-ups. We can only hope!
Thanks for this effort, Anet!
– [Phalanx Formation] Jade Quarry Guard
“Ah, the mind of an irrational gamer, where injustice abounds.”
yes, it is a good change and way beyond needed…… but
How can you all cheer them on this for a job well done? Seriously, this should have been done like the WvW population has been asking over 730 days ago. Yes over two years and they ….finally… get enough time to spare 20 minutes to rewrite some code…
This isn’t a job well done. I would have sacked everyone who didn’t bother working on this about 750 days ago. However, the snide remarks being said, because someone had to, i am glad they finally got around to doing it.
Also, don’t get me wrong, i’m sure upper management is fully to blame and and not an individual dev. Considering how blatant and full of disregard the you tube video showed of an ANET “suit” totally blowing us off in an interview, it’s no wonder their WvW customer service is so poor.
PvE players mostly don´t care about the server name, who is or how many are on that server. Delete the WvW boni for PvE players and offer them a gem bonus for the transfer on a low populated server: You will see, how rapidly the servers will get even. If you offer a free transfer: Why would anyone lift a finger and lose the WvW boni?
I think the fact that these wvw bonuses exist need to be advertised more to the PvE crowd. Some of them might not realize they even exist, or how they’re achieved. It might get more people into PvE on the lower pop servers so they can help out and get themselves better bonuses. At least it would get more people aware that WvW still exists, and actually does effect them in some way.
I fully expect that BG, JQ, TC, YB, and FA will remain/become full if it’s truly based on WvW population. SoS needs to come off of full for sure, as they cannot queue more than one map many weeknights.
I also really hope that the system they put in place is responsive without being game-able. That is, it would be really terrible if a server can do a blackout to game the system.
That is, it would be really terrible if a server can do a blackout to game the system.
From dev comments on reddit reposted earlier in this thread, it sounded like the new calculation smooths out “rapidly changing artifacts like timezones or matchups”. So for example a server with a T2 population dropping to a T3 match and bringing out all the fairweathers won’t suddenly go full. With regards to timezone force discrepancies though I hope it doesn’t make it worse and prevent a weak timezone from getting new WvW players.
Chaba Tangnu
Founding member of [NERF] Fort Engineer and driver for [TLC] The Legion of Charrs
RIP [SIC] Strident Iconoclast
OMA GURD! They heard our cries, the skies opened up, and a ray of sun fell upon our WvW heads.
Okies now that I got that out of the way (and TY redtags) I have a question: Will we be able to bridge with other time zones for 24/7 presence on the BF? And again a big thank you.
I absolutely love that we are getting feedback from a red name. I’m hesitant that there’s a lack of details, yet the devil-for-punishment WvWer is grateful for the interaction.
I’d wait on laying the laurels, until you find out exactly what this entails.
I’m truly hoping that it involves informing the community, seeking feedback for various pitfalls, instead of blindly (and stubbornly) plugging ahead with a plan.
I love Anet, but man, some of the choices could have had way less drama with community input.
I am surprised by how many people support this. If PvE players do not have to pay to transfer to an active PvE server, then we should not have to pay anything to transfer either!
This is just us WvW players still being ripped off!
Complained about WvW before it became cool.
I used to be a PvE player like you, then I played Guild Wars 2
