Guild Wars 2

Kal Spiro.9745:

Enundr.9305:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Enundr.9305:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

This shouldn’t be surprising to anyone, they’ve done it before and they’ll keep doing it more and more because as you can see people love being taken advantage of.

This is why you should always play games with a sub if you can. They don’t charge you for convenience, they put it right in the game. They don’t charge you for new armor, they put it right in the game. Content is permanent in sub games because you pay a sub for it. You get expansions because they don’t need to waste all their development making cash grabs because you pay a steady fee. P2P games will always be better than F2P games.

your right about most of it , the P2P always being better is always up in the air , this game was good but now that were seeing cash grabs the F2P aspect (the bad one you see from companies like EA) is starting to rear its ugly head , as much as people like to say “just go to another city” thats even more loading screen time i didnt have to deal with , and im still trying to grasp where ppl think running around in LA was slower then dealing with a loading screen , cause ive never seen that….pop swiftness , dont be a kitten and ignore obvious short cuts , and it was FAR faster then the loading screens. This is a cash grab people , get over it.

You know what, fine, it’s a cash grab. Unfortunately for them it’s a really weak one. I mean they’re giving away access to the place for free just for playing the game. And most of the people who play the game don’t need to use every single little thing that existed in LA and are still not buying the ticket.

See a real cash grab, that’s when you remove crafting or the mystic fountain from the game and force people to pay to use it at all. This isn’t that.

weak one or not , the very moment one is allowed to set root , more will follow , far worse ones. cull the weeds before they spread.

I didn’t realize we actually had any power to dictate terms to them in what they can and cannot put into their game.

The best you can do is boycott tickets. I know I’ve never bought one and never will. If it matters so much to you then I recommend the same.

the customer always has the power to dictate stuff like this , whether they try to supress people from knowing or not , when they start losing active players , especially at a drastic level , they look bad to their higher ups , just cause theres no monthly sub it shows theyre losing potential money.

DoctorToxn.4925:

All these discussions are sidetracking us from the core reason this topic was begun. Nobody is arguing that they should have not taken away LA. This is a fresh new change to the world and it brings a new dynamic that people have to adapt to. This discussion is about the air ship replacement that costs gems. Do you not see that taking something away from the game that is free and replacing it with something that (Potentially) costs money is a bad road to start down?

Also, the people arguing that you can do the same thing in other cities, your argument is null and void. It has nothing to do with this topic. If Arena Net thought that people could do everything they wanted in other cities, WHY would they release a new place for all your needs that costs money?

No, we get it. But, I don’t think you get it. They didn’t “replace” anything. They offered a “superior” service for a fee. Instead of whining about how anet gouged us for money, go start an economical revolution so we don’t have to deal with capitalist BS like this. Or, enjoy what we have and be thankful we can enjoy them to begin with. Good day.

DoctorToxn.4925:

If Arena Net thought that people could do everything they wanted in other cities, WHY would they release a new place for all your needs that costs money?

For convenience. Look at the permanent mining picks. Can you or can you not mining without getting a permanent one? Why would they release the permanent one then?

Enundr.9305:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Enundr.9305:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Enundr.9305:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

This shouldn’t be surprising to anyone, they’ve done it before and they’ll keep doing it more and more because as you can see people love being taken advantage of.

This is why you should always play games with a sub if you can. They don’t charge you for convenience, they put it right in the game. They don’t charge you for new armor, they put it right in the game. Content is permanent in sub games because you pay a sub for it. You get expansions because they don’t need to waste all their development making cash grabs because you pay a steady fee. P2P games will always be better than F2P games.

your right about most of it , the P2P always being better is always up in the air , this game was good but now that were seeing cash grabs the F2P aspect (the bad one you see from companies like EA) is starting to rear its ugly head , as much as people like to say “just go to another city” thats even more loading screen time i didnt have to deal with , and im still trying to grasp where ppl think running around in LA was slower then dealing with a loading screen , cause ive never seen that….pop swiftness , dont be a kitten and ignore obvious short cuts , and it was FAR faster then the loading screens. This is a cash grab people , get over it.

You know what, fine, it’s a cash grab. Unfortunately for them it’s a really weak one. I mean they’re giving away access to the place for free just for playing the game. And most of the people who play the game don’t need to use every single little thing that existed in LA and are still not buying the ticket.

See a real cash grab, that’s when you remove crafting or the mystic fountain from the game and force people to pay to use it at all. This isn’t that.

weak one or not , the very moment one is allowed to set root , more will follow , far worse ones. cull the weeds before they spread.

I didn’t realize we actually had any power to dictate terms to them in what they can and cannot put into their game.

The best you can do is boycott tickets. I know I’ve never bought one and never will. If it matters so much to you then I recommend the same.

the customer always has the power to dictate stuff like this , whether they try to supress people from knowing or not , when they start losing active players , especially at a drastic level , they look bad to their higher ups , just cause theres no monthly sub it shows theyre losing potential money.

Ok, bye then. Have fun playing something else. Can I have your stuff?

Kal Spiro.9745:

DoctorToxn.4925:

All these discussions are sidetracking us from the core reason this topic was begun. Nobody is arguing that they should have not taken away LA. This is a fresh new change to the world and it brings a new dynamic that people have to adapt to. This discussion is about the air ship replacement that costs gems. Do you not see that taking something away from the game that is free and replacing it with something that (Potentially) costs money is a bad road to start down?

Also, the people arguing that you can do the same thing in other cities, your argument is null and void. It has nothing to do with this topic. If Arena Net thought that people could do everything they wanted in other cities, WHY would they release a new place for all your needs that costs money?

No, you’re the one that isn’t following the discussion.

Nothing in the game was removed. Not a single service in the game is gated behind a requirement to pay. Every single service that existed in LA still exists in the game for free.

That is the real true point that makes this a completely worthless and pointless thread. Nothing was lost. Nothing is being forced on anyone.

Oh, so the air ship does not exist and did not come out at the same time that LA was destroyed? Sorry, I guess I was mistaken about all of that then. </sarcasm>

It is people like this that like to distract from the main point of topics and to change the subject.

DoctorToxn.4925:

Kal Spiro.9745:

DoctorToxn.4925:

All these discussions are sidetracking us from the core reason this topic was begun. Nobody is arguing that they should have not taken away LA. This is a fresh new change to the world and it brings a new dynamic that people have to adapt to. This discussion is about the air ship replacement that costs gems. Do you not see that taking something away from the game that is free and replacing it with something that (Potentially) costs money is a bad road to start down?

Also, the people arguing that you can do the same thing in other cities, your argument is null and void. It has nothing to do with this topic. If Arena Net thought that people could do everything they wanted in other cities, WHY would they release a new place for all your needs that costs money?

No, you’re the one that isn’t following the discussion.

Nothing in the game was removed. Not a single service in the game is gated behind a requirement to pay. Every single service that existed in LA still exists in the game for free.

That is the real true point that makes this a completely worthless and pointless thread. Nothing was lost. Nothing is being forced on anyone.

Oh, so the air ship does not exist and did not come out at the same time that LA was destroyed? Sorry, I guess I was mistaken about all of that then. </sarcasm>

It is people like this that like to distract from the main point of topics and to change the subject.

The point of the topic and that people like you will whine about any little thing no matter how little it actually effects them or the game and want to take any opportunity to make a big stink about it.

You come back when the mystic forge is only available in the game through payment and I’ll be behind your complaint 100%. This is not that. Your complaint is irrelevant.

i can’t believe people are actually crying over a couple silver and maybe another 30 seconds of travel time.

is real life that boring that this ruckus is necessary?

Mirta.5029:

DoctorToxn.4925:

If Arena Net thought that people could do everything they wanted in other cities, WHY would they release a new place for all your needs that costs money?

For convenience. Look at the permanent mining picks. Can you or can you not mining without getting a permanent one? Why would they release the permanent one then?

Bad analogy. Nothing changed with the mining picks/axes/harvesters in the world when they released the unlimited version that you could purchase. If LA was not destroyed, then yes, it would just be an added convenience.

The main point that nobody is defending here is why changes coincided with each other.

DoctorToxn.4925:

Bad analogy. Nothing changed with the mining picks/axes/harvesters in the world when they released the unlimited version that you could purchase. If LA was not destroyed, then yes, it would just be an added convenience.

The main point that nobody is defending here is why changes coincided with each other.

So they did. So what? Can you or can you not access all of the services without paying? Yes you can. Can you do that for free? Yes you can.

Kal Spiro.9745:

DoctorToxn.4925:

Kal Spiro.9745:

DoctorToxn.4925:

All these discussions are sidetracking us from the core reason this topic was begun. Nobody is arguing that they should have not taken away LA. This is a fresh new change to the world and it brings a new dynamic that people have to adapt to. This discussion is about the air ship replacement that costs gems. Do you not see that taking something away from the game that is free and replacing it with something that (Potentially) costs money is a bad road to start down?

Also, the people arguing that you can do the same thing in other cities, your argument is null and void. It has nothing to do with this topic. If Arena Net thought that people could do everything they wanted in other cities, WHY would they release a new place for all your needs that costs money?

No, you’re the one that isn’t following the discussion.

Nothing in the game was removed. Not a single service in the game is gated behind a requirement to pay. Every single service that existed in LA still exists in the game for free.

That is the real true point that makes this a completely worthless and pointless thread. Nothing was lost. Nothing is being forced on anyone.

Oh, so the air ship does not exist and did not come out at the same time that LA was destroyed? Sorry, I guess I was mistaken about all of that then. </sarcasm>

It is people like this that like to distract from the main point of topics and to change the subject.

The point of the topic and that people like you will whine about any little thing no matter how little it actually effects them or the game and want to take any opportunity to make a big stink about it.

You come back when the mystic forge is only available in the game through payment and I’ll be behind your complaint 100%. This is not that. Your complaint is irrelevant.

If nobody calls out something that they see wrong, what will happen? It is easier to stop a small snowball rolling down from the top of a hill than it is when it is at the bottom and still rolling. I would much rather this be the only time Arena Net tries this than it becoming a typical event.

DoctorToxn.4925:

The main point that nobody is defending here is why changes coincided with each other.

The story blew up Lion’s Arch. There was no reason for there to be any changes before hand. To make this change after the fact would have involved no Mystic Forge and no Vendors for weeks or more.

Why would they not do this now? Your conjecture makes no sense.

The people defending here are missing the point, the debate about selling convienence items has always been that the game builds in inconvenience, in order to make the convienence items sell better.

What we have here is a situation where this update removes convienence and then sells it back to you. If this was not a mistake, if this was done by design, then you as a user should evaluate the situation and give accurate feedback.

the idea is simple, is it ok to remove existing convienence and then sell it back to the players?
Is it absolutely not ok, or is it a matter of how much convienece is lost

If you think its dependent on how much is lost, what would be an example of too much in your mind.

phys.7689:

The people defending here are missing the point, the debate about selling convienence items has always been that the game builds in inconvenience, in order to make the convienence items sell better.

What we have here is a situation where this update removes convienence and then sells it back to you. If this was not a mistake, if this was done by design, then you as a user should evaluate the situation and give accurate feedback.

the idea is simple, is it ok to remove existing convienence and then sell it back to the players?
Is it absolutely not ok, or is it a matter of how much convienece is lost

If you think its dependent on how much is lost, what would be an example of too much in your mind.

If the inconvenience is minor and only effects a small subset of the population, and is also available for free by playing the released content, then yes, it’s completely ok.

DoctorToxn.4925:

Kal Spiro.9745:

DoctorToxn.4925::

Kal Spiro.9745:

DoctorToxn.4925:

All these discussions are sidetracking us from the core reason this topic was begun. Nobody is arguing that they should have not taken away LA. This is a fresh new change to the world and it brings a new dynamic that people have to adapt to. This discussion is about the air ship replacement that costs gems. Do you not see that taking something away from the game that is free and replacing it with something that (Potentially) costs money is a bad road to start pdown?

Also, the people arguing that you can do the same thing in other cities, your argument is null and void. It has nothing to do with this topic. If Arena Net thought that people could do everything they wanted in other cities, WHY would they release a new place for all your needs that costs money?

No, you’re the one that isn’t following the discussion.

Nothing in the game was removed. Not a single service in the game is gated behind a requirement to pay. Every single service that existed in LA still exists in the game for free.

That is the real true point that makes this a completely worthless and pointless thread. Nothing was lost. Nothing is being forced on anyone.

Oh, so the air ship does not exist and did not come out at the same time that LA was destroyed? Sorry, I guess I was mistaken about all of that then. </sarcasm>

It is people like this that like to distract from the main point of topics and to change the subject.

The point of the topic and that people like you will whine about any little thing no matter how little it actually effects them or the game and want to take any opportunity to make a big stink about it.

You come back when the mystic forge is only available in the game through payment and I’ll be behind your complaint 100%. This is not that. Your complaint is irrelevant.

If nobody calls out something that they see wrong, what will happen? It is easier to stop a small snowball rolling down from the top of a hill than it is when it is at the bottom and still rolling. I would much rather this be the only time Arena Net tries this than it becoming a typical event.

OK in all seriousness, what exactly is wrong here…. I just don’t understand how or why you think making a convenience a gem shop item is so wrong. Before you tout the “they replaced LA with gem shop stuff” no, the airship is easily more superior to the accessibility that was LA. I could stand and have my bank, forge, tp, and the forge merchant open all at once. This is a standard model of marketing generated at making money. But what about the crafting tables? Yes, its slightly annoying that I have to wp to DR to craft, but oh well. It could be 10 worse. I see the reason behind not including them. Its fairly obvious that they want to make more money off the passes. So we have standard business practices here. Now what they did next was more bizarre I think. The dropped passes from the bags! Why the heck would they undo what they did all this for? YOU. People that feel they are wronged when a company tries to make money off them. WELCOME TO AMERICA. At least they give you the decency to offer the paid services as a drop outright regardless if its RNG. I also don’t expect them to release a statement about this at all either. Its unspoken rules of business. They need to make money, and we should be thankful they are making it off PURE convenience. I applaud them for their business decisions as it adds to the longevity of the game we all love to play. Next time, find a real wrong to right.

Kal Spiro.9745:

phys.7689:

The people defending here are missing the point, the debate about selling convienence items has always been that the game builds in inconvenience, in order to make the convienence items sell better.

What we have here is a situation where this update removes convienence and then sells it back to you. If this was not a mistake, if this was done by design, then you as a user should evaluate the situation and give accurate feedback.

the idea is simple, is it ok to remove existing convienence and then sell it back to the players?
Is it absolutely not ok, or is it a matter of how much convienece is lost

If you think its dependent on how much is lost, what would be an example of too much in your mind.

If the inconvenience is minor and only effects a small subset of the population, and is also available for free by playing the released content, then yes, it’s completely ok.

DING DING DING WE HAVE A WINNER! Give this man the door prize!

But really, those of you complaining this has been paywalled…Inigo Montoya has some words for you.

PattyCakeChamp.5268:

DoctorToxn.4925:

Kal Spiro.9745:

DoctorToxn.4925::

Kal Spiro.9745:

DoctorToxn.4925:

All these discussions are sidetracking us from the core reason this topic was begun. Nobody is arguing that they should have not taken away LA. This is a fresh new change to the world and it brings a new dynamic that people have to adapt to. This discussion is about the air ship replacement that costs gems. Do you not see that taking something away from the game that is free and replacing it with something that (Potentially) costs money is a bad road to start pdown?

Also, the people arguing that you can do the same thing in other cities, your argument is null and void. It has nothing to do with this topic. If Arena Net thought that people could do everything they wanted in other cities, WHY would they release a new place for all your needs that costs money?

No, you’re the one that isn’t following the discussion.

Nothing in the game was removed. Not a single service in the game is gated behind a requirement to pay. Every single service that existed in LA still exists in the game for free.

That is the real true point that makes this a completely worthless and pointless thread. Nothing was lost. Nothing is being forced on anyone.

Oh, so the air ship does not exist and did not come out at the same time that LA was destroyed? Sorry, I guess I was mistaken about all of that then. </sarcasm>

It is people like this that like to distract from the main point of topics and to change the subject.

The point of the topic and that people like you will whine about any little thing no matter how little it actually effects them or the game and want to take any opportunity to make a big stink about it.

You come back when the mystic forge is only available in the game through payment and I’ll be behind your complaint 100%. This is not that. Your complaint is irrelevant.

If nobody calls out something that they see wrong, what will happen? It is easier to stop a small snowball rolling down from the top of a hill than it is when it is at the bottom and still rolling. I would much rather this be the only time Arena Net tries this than it becoming a typical event.

OK in all seriousness, what exactly is wrong here…. I just don’t understand how or why you think making a convenience a gem shop item is so wrong. Before you tout the “they replaced LA with gem shop stuff” no, the airship is easily more superior to the accessibility that was LA. I could stand and have my bank, forge, tp, and the forge merchant open all at once. This is a standard model of marketing generated at making money. But what about the crafting tables? Yes, its slightly annoying that I have to wp to DR to craft, but oh well. It could be 10 worse. I see the reason behind not including them. Its fairly obvious that they want to make more money off the passes. So we have standard business practices here. Now what they did next was more bizarre I think. The dropped passes from the bags! Why the heck would they undo what they did all this for? YOU. People that feel they are wronged when a company tries to make money off them. WELCOME TO AMERICA. At least they give you the decency to offer the paid services as a drop outright regardless if its RNG. I also don’t expect them to release a statement about this at all either. Its unspoken rules of business. They need to make money, and we should be thankful they are making it off PURE convenience. I applaud them for their business decisions as it adds to the longevity of the game we all love to play. Next time, find a real wrong to right.

+1

phys.7689:

The people defending here are missing the point, the debate about selling convienence items has always been that the game builds in inconvenience, in order to make the convienence items sell better.

What we have here is a situation where this update removes convienence and then sells it back to you. If this was not a mistake, if this was done by design, then you as a user should evaluate the situation and give accurate feedback.

the idea is simple, is it ok to remove existing convienence and then sell it back to the players?
Is it absolutely not ok, or is it a matter of how much convienece is lost

If you think its dependent on how much is lost, what would be an example of too much in your mind.

Except that this is only an issue because people have no patience. At all. We’re talking about removed convenience for, what, 2 weeks, 4?
It’s not a permanent change, so they are more or less charging people that simply cannot wait or don’t want some extra loading times.

The day Anet starts to permanently remove features and then sell them back at players, complaints are justified. This however ties in with the LS, which finally has a somewhat lasting impact on the world, and makes sense. And everything will be back to normal before everyone knows it and then these complaints will be lost in archives because they are irrelevant.

Kal Spiro.9745:

DoctorToxn.4925:

All these discussions are sidetracking us from the core reason this topic was begun. Nobody is arguing that they should have not taken away LA. This is a fresh new change to the world and it brings a new dynamic that people have to adapt to. This discussion is about the air ship replacement that costs gems. Do you not see that taking something away from the game that is free and replacing it with something that (Potentially) costs money is a bad road to start down?

Also, the people arguing that you can do the same thing in other cities, your argument is null and void. It has nothing to do with this topic. If Arena Net thought that people could do everything they wanted in other cities, WHY would they release a new place for all your needs that costs money?

No, you’re the one that isn’t following the discussion.

Nothing in the game was removed. Not a single service in the game is gated behind a requirement to pay. Every single service that existed in LA still exists in the game for free.

That is the real true point that makes this a completely worthless and pointless thread. Nothing was lost. Nothing is being forced on anyone.

Exactly this. The fact that ANET is trying to make money in a manner that’s DOESN’T gate services and content behind a requirement to pay is something people should be praising them for. Yet here we have someone who has the smallest inconvenience of taking one extra portal OCCASIONALLY when the situation calls for someone to need to access everything at once, and they come on the forums and make it sound like a crime was committed.

It’s laughable and everyone seems to see it save a few people.

Elricht Kaltwind.8796:

All the services in the game are available between Vigil Keep and Rata Sum for free. For someone whose computer meets the recommended specs the travel time from the mystic forge in Vigil Keep to the crafting tables in Rata Sum is barely any longer than the time it took to run between the two points in Lion’s Arch.

This. So much this.

Enundr.9305:

Mirta.5029:

Carzor Stelatis.9435:

You now have to pay waypoint costs, whereas you didn’t before (openworld -> WvW = free, Asura gate from WvW -> LA = free).

Vigil’s keep -> mystic forge -> asura gate to Rata Sum. You can repeat the process in reverse too. No costs for anything. Also Vigil’s keep -> WvW free and WvW -> character select -> vigil’s keep free

yes cause i totally want to spend most of my time in the loading screen rather then doing stuff in the game ;-)

Loading screens for waypointing inside LA often were longer than the ones you have between Vigil Keep and Rata Sum. And there’s no loading screen at all for waypointing inside Rata Sum. Add to this that everything is much closer together in those two places than it was in LA (which saves a lot of running time), we now actually have MORE convenience than before.

Aedelric.1287:

The op raises very good points, it is quite obviously a shameless cashgrab, their is nothing anyone can say to defend such actions by Arena Net.

It’s ANet’s game they can do what they want. Also, Anet is a business and the primary goal of a business is to make money. If you don’t like the idea of a business making money, feel free to move to Cuba or North Korea.

DarcShriek.5829:

Aedelric.1287:

The op raises very good points, it is quite obviously a shameless cashgrab, their is nothing anyone can say to defend such actions by Arena Net.

It’s ANet’s game they can do what they want. Also, Anet is a business and the primary goal of a business is to make money. If you don’t like the idea of a business making money, feel free to move to Cuba or North Korea.

and your job as a consumer is too try to make the business give you an experience/item how you want it.
Point is capitialism is supposed to be limited by the consumers descions on what they are willing to accept. Capitalism henges on the idea that the consumer will in fact make demands, and limit the money making potential of business based around their own desires and greed as a customer.

point is,
dont hate on the customer for saying what they want with their money, and what they want to give up money for. You can disagree that its important, but its stupid to say they arent a part of the process, everyone playing this game has given the company money, and a great money will give them more. They are currently a highly profitable asset, many people have given them money. Its far from socialism for the customer to demand things, its very capitalist

CrockD.8257:

Those who (rather sycophantically) defended Arenanet made some of the following arguments:

You can just go to other cities:
Yes, but none of the other cities offer the same level of convenience as Lion’s Arch (in terms of number of services offered and proximity of services to each other, not to mention gate travel) , that’s why LA was consistently the most visited location.

Yeaa…NOOO. Why does everyone go to LA? Because it’s the main city where everyone chills and hangs out, but it is NOT the most convienient city. Sure, it’s got extra things like dungeon venders, mystic forge, etc…I’ll give you that.

But come on! Rata Sum is waaay better for crafting and such. The bank, black lion merchants, and regular merchants are right next to each other!!! Plus, getting more supplies for crafting is faster because you can waypoint to the TP, then run back in about 15 seconds.

So by taking out LA, we’re really not missing a whole lot. In fact, now it’s better, because people are more spread out and using different cities to do transactions and such, instead of just making LA a giant lagg fest.

Saturn.6591:

Elricht Kaltwind.8796:

All the services in the game are available between Vigil Keep and Rata Sum for free. For someone whose computer meets the recommended specs the travel time from the mystic forge in Vigil Keep to the crafting tables in Rata Sum is barely any longer than the time it took to run between the two points in Lion’s Arch.

This. So much this.

Enundr.9305:

Mirta.5029:

Carzor Stelatis.9435:

You now have to pay waypoint costs, whereas you didn’t before (openworld -> WvW = free, Asura gate from WvW -> LA = free).

Vigil’s keep -> mystic forge -> asura gate to Rata Sum. You can repeat the process in reverse too. No costs for anything. Also Vigil’s keep -> WvW free and WvW -> character select -> vigil’s keep free

yes cause i totally want to spend most of my time in the loading screen rather then doing stuff in the game ;-)

Loading screens for waypointing inside LA often were longer than the ones you have between Vigil Keep and Rata Sum. And there’s no loading screen at all for waypointing inside Rata Sum. Add to this that everything is much closer together in those two places than it was in LA (which saves a lot of running time), we now actually have MORE convenience than before.

im sorry if you actually read my posts here i never said i WPed constantly inside LA , i RAN and it was faster then the average loading screen. most people think it takes forever to get inbetween all the stations in LA , it doesnt , odds are they wanted to WP everywhere instead when running was far faster , especially if you didnt try to take the long way around stuff.

LA still wasn’t as convenient as parking an alt I’d raised crafting on in a city or other crafting hub and using the old WvW express to deposit materials or stuff into the bank to transfer later. Or maybe use a bank express (I keep getting them from doing the Daily – gimme keys darnit!) . . .

And the Mystic Forge was something I could put off until I had a ton of stuff to do in it, rather than “hard stop, must handle MF stuff now”. It wound up working out more efficiently. Also more efficient? Selling greens instead of throwing them in the toilet. Pays my waypoint fees easily enough.

Making it 50-100 gems shouldn’t be a problem, will just cost a week’s worth of gold. 1,000 is too much unless your paying real cash.

Avascar.9237:

Making it 50-100 gems shouldn’t be a problem, will just cost a week’s worth of gold. 1,000 is too much unless your paying real cash.

If you really need it farm iron. Very god kitten boring, but quite profitable at the moment. Yesterday after dedicating one day, I farmed 1150 gems, or a bit over 90 gold to get the zodiac armour and a total makeover kit.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Iron_Ore_
I have 8 characters so I can just farm rich iron nodes alone, but if you don’t have many, I would suggest mining all of the zones clean then combining that with a bit of dungeoning and eventing.

In short, if you dedicate a single full day, it’s more than possible, but really boring.

(Also when it comes to making money this way, if you have 8 characters you need to make barely over 1 gold a zone, if you have 9, it’s exactly 1 gold a zone, if you have 1 character it’s about 10 gold a zone that you would need to make, so like I said, you would need to literally bleed a zone dry if you’re playing on a single toon)

there’s only 1 thing i’m missing in other cities that i’ve found only in that kitten airship… guild commendations vendor… crappy move anet

Estarioll.5781:

there’s only 1 thing i’m missing in other cities that i’ve found only in that kitten airship… guild commendations vendor… crappy move anet

vigil’s keep. Port there, open your map and there it is! Should I provide a screenshot?

might be that my brain is on holiday… ran around vigil keep yesterday trying to find it and saw it nowhere… looked on wiki… wiki said Ariship: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Guild_Commendation_Trader

will search again later when i get ig…

Estarioll.5781:

might be that my brain is on holiday… ran around vigil keep yesterday trying to find it and saw it nowhere… looked on wiki… wiki said Ariship: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Guild_Commendation_Trader

will search again later when i get ig…

http://dulfy.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/gw2-selfless-and-thoughtless-potions.jpg

It’s that shield icon next to the personal story icon. (ignore the red square, I’m borrowing the picture from dulfy)

O_o must have passed right next to it and never noticed it!

ty very much!

Lol this is still going on.

Well I’m back from picketing walmarts decision to move the twinkes back 2 aisles annnnnddd it went nothing like I thought would happen. I thought I’d be get support from thousands as we marched onto Walmart to face this oppression and chant proudly " no we will not walk 2 more aisles to get twinkes, that is a pure cash grab" to be honest I was a bit fearful that I’d start a riot.

Instead I got a little support from a few heavyset people that wanted access to the twinkes to be at the doorway, but they quickly tired out. The most common response was it only 2 isles it’s not that bad. I told them in a sneering manner it’s not the point it’s the principle of the matter. You let them get away with this, then the next thing you know the milk will be moved 2 isles.

One man even had the audacity to say that the gas station across the street has the twinkes directly in front of the door. I shut him down quickly by saying the two left turns adds 7 seconds to the trip. Do you know how badly that would just wreck my schedule ??? That’s about a minute of my day just wasted.

Had they removed services everywhere, then it’d be a valid complaint. They are not so this really is just a silly jab.

You would of prolly had better results if you were just to ask to have crafting benches and skill trainers put into the vigil keep

echo.2053:

Lol this is still going on.

Well I’m back from picketing walmarts decision to move the twinkes back 2 aisles annnnnddd it went nothing like I thought would happen. I thought I’d be get support from thousands as we marched onto Walmart to face this oppression and chant proudly " no we will not walk 2 more aisles to get twinkes, that is a pure cash grab" to be honest I was a bit fearful that I’d start a riot.

Instead I got a little support from a few heavyset people that wanted access to the twinkes to be at the doorway, but they quickly tired out. The most common response was it only 2 isles it’s not that bad. I told them in a sneering manner it’s not the point it’s the principle of the matter. You let them get away with this, then the next thing you know the milk will be moved 2 isles.

One man even had the audacity to say that the gas station across the street has the twinkes directly in front of the door. I shut him down quickly by saying the two left turns adds 7 seconds to the trip. Do you know how badly that would just wreck my schedule ??? That’s about a minute of my day just wasted.

Had they removed services everywhere, then it’d be a valid complaint. They are not so this really is just a silly jab.

You would of prolly had better results if you were just to ask to have crafting benches and skill trainers put into the vigil keep

rofl, this ^

I think it has more to do with implementation strategy and the social context more than whether or not the change has a significant effect on gameplay mechanics regarding accessibility to key merchants and services.

ANet could have avoided some flak by selling the airship pass earlier, taken it off the market, and then placed it back on due to the destruction of LA. It’s a superior service which could have attracted some customers before, and would reduce complaints/the possibility in public opinion that this was intended to be a money-grabber.

That said, I do not believe such changes are positive for the social community. For many players, such destruction effectively ended their “home” (I don’t think ANYONE is happy about the Kryta changes caused by this event chain, for the rolling foothills and centaur conflict which is supposed to be relevant in Human backstory is no longer relevent, the mobs difficult due to low-level condition-dealers, powerful bosses, etc.), not to mention just how critical LA plays into the personal story that I don’t believe it was a prime candidate for such destruction. Especially when there’s no form of LS defense or something (say again on Claw Island or other surrounding outposts) which would have allowed this to be preventable. Frankly, aside from interest in the Achievement points, aesthetic benefits and actual interest in the living story, there’s no incentive for players to actually care about it. Allowing players to have an incentive far beyond the scope of boasting their aesthetics and creating a sense of community unification at a cost if people were to fail would lead to significantly better participation and interest.

While the lack of convenience is there, it’s not so prominent to the point where performing errands becomes so much more difficult, but the implementation of the patch (and in my honest opinion, all of the LS elements) is blatantly poor in design.

I actually just bought a pair of new sunglasses because the white knights in this forum were blinding me.

echo.2053:

Lol this is still going on.

Well I’m back from picketing walmarts decision to move the twinkes back 2 aisles annnnnddd it went nothing like I thought would happen. I thought I’d be get support from thousands as we marched onto Walmart to face this oppression and chant proudly " no we will not walk 2 more aisles to get twinkes, that is a pure cash grab" to be honest I was a bit fearful that I’d start a riot.

Instead I got a little support from a few heavyset people that wanted access to the twinkes to be at the doorway, but they quickly tired out. The most common response was it only 2 isles it’s not that bad. I told them in a sneering manner it’s not the point it’s the principle of the matter. You let them get away with this, then the next thing you know the milk will be moved 2 isles.

One man even had the audacity to say that the gas station across the street has the twinkes directly in front of the door. I shut him down quickly by saying the two left turns adds 7 seconds to the trip. Do you know how badly that would just wreck my schedule ??? That’s about a minute of my day just wasted.

Had they removed services everywhere, then it’d be a valid complaint. They are not so this really is just a silly jab.

You would of prolly had better results if you were just to ask to have crafting benches and skill trainers put into the vigil keep

interesting analogy, isnt walmart known in general for evil business practices? This would seem to suggest that the guy who is moving twinkies to the back then selling the ones in front for more, is also in other facets a shady business practioner.

Almost makes you think you should beef before they become impossible to effect/change.

I mean if anet said it was an error, and they are going to give free access to the ship until they have a place which offers what LA did, i think everyone would applaud them.

But it seems like it was intentional. If it is intentional, they are essentially saying ok guys, we have decided that we are going to more fully embrace creating inconvience to sell convienence. This is step one. Depending on your response, we ll see how and when to implement step 2.

I really should stop reading this thread. It makes me want to facepalm harder than my head would be able to bear. Some people really will put on tinfoil hats and complain about anything, just for the sake of complaining; no matter how ridiculous the “reason” actually is.

IF, and that’s really one big “if”; IF I would really need to run around between bank, TP, mystic forge, dungeon vendors, laurel merchant and guild commendations trader like 100 times in one or two hours… IF that would be the case, it would be faster now than it would have been in LA. This due to shorter distances and less/shorter loading screens.

And now excuse me; I need to convince my hands to not move towards my forehead with increased speed.

CrockD.8257:

Yes this is another complaint thread on the Captain’s Airship Pass.

For those who didn’t read the other thread: A lot of people got upset that the loss of Lions’s Arch represented the loss of the most useful and convenient hub for BLT, Bank, Crafting Stations, Mystic Forge, Skill Trainers and Vendors. It also had Asura gates to all the major cities. In its place we got two things, Vigil’s Keep (which does not have crafting stations, gate travel and far less vendors) and Havoc’s Heir Airship. The airship is a one stop shop for everything BUT costs 1000 gems for a lifetime pass, 1000 gems equals $12.50 in USD.

Those who (rather sycophantically) defended Arenanet made some of the following arguments:

You can just go to other cities:
Yes, but none of the other cities offer the same level of convenience as Lion’s Arch (in terms of number of services offered and proximity of services to each other, not to mention gate travel) , that’s why LA was consistently the most visited location. If you do a lot of crafting, or are trying to make a legendary or use the BLT a lot you absolutely know what I mean. Time is money and you will be losing a lot of time from this loss of convenience.

It’s part of the story/times change/you fear something new:
No. I love what they are doing with the story BUT when you take that convenience away and ask for money for its replacement, it is an OBVIOUS bait and switch.

Cashing in is not Arenanet’s intention:
Really? Then why did the 1,000 gem lifetime pass come with this new content as a “promoted item” in the gem store? To think otherwise is naive.

Look, I love this game and there’s much to praise Arenanet for, but i’m not just going to drink the Kool Aid either. Removing LA’s conveniences and charging $12.50 to get it back is wrong. It’s something I expect from Electronic Arts, not from Arenanet who by and large are the good guys.

Will I stop playing? Of course not! This represents an annoyance and a fairly pricey one at that but overall the game is still fantastic. I just offer this thread as a venue for people to raise their hand politely and say they don’t agree with this move and that they think Arenanet is better than this. Aside from this, the new content is awesome, love that they shook the game up this way, keep up the rest of the good work!

well you know in the amount of time it took you to type this you could have taken the asuran gate back and forth from rata sum to vigil keep 10-15 times.

stop being a little kitten and man up. people like the OP I really wonder how they get by in life when this is how they are when faced with adversity or a slight inconvienience

For 90% of my game time I have been crafting in Rata Sum, it was just more convenient to do so. And now I do the same. Everything else in Vigil Keep is even better than LA in terms of walking distance.

So while it would have been nice to have crafting right there it is also a non-issue.

I have crafted in every city as many have stated they do, but when I’m crafting swords for the forge I did so exclusively in LA. I hope they rebuild LA with the same amenities as before regardless of what it looks like. Removing that map while having this pass ready to sell is why many see trouble.

I can see the arguments of those who dislike the change, but to them, I say simply “be patient”. Lion’s Arch will almost certainly become the world’s game hub again in the future once the Living Story is concluded. In the meantime, use your WvW Borderlands for crafting.

I think the bigger issue here is that ANet has offered a new gem store item that basically supersedes the Royal Terrace pass. It has a Black Lion weapon merchant and the Daily Activity NPC, both of which are missing from the Terrace, and it can also be accessed from anywhere in the world. It’s superior in all aspects to the Terrace pass except (possibly) for aesthetics. It’s this “power creep” in the Watchwork Pick and now the Airship Pass for convenience items that has me worried.

I’m really glad this thread exists so that I can laugh at all the crying and complaining. The part that particularly makes me fall out of my chair is the “OBVIOUS bait and switch” part. XD

But anyway, just go to another city. To suggest that the extra time it takes to waypoint to another city or between a city and the Mystic Forge will result in loss of income is completely absurd and again, laughable. You probably could have waypointed 100 times between the Mystic Forge and DR or RS in the time it took to post this thread.

I missed the retrainer a lot more than crafting stations tbh. but even then, at least we can get quickly to the other cities – sucks for those who have a slow pc, 1min+ loading times can be extremely annoying if they have to keep using multiple portals. instead of investing in a gem store item you feel was created to rip you off, invest in an SSD instead.

but since LA will probably come back, why cry about a useless gem store item? if every char of mine would get a pass, then I’d certainly buy it, but just for one char, not a chance. it’s interesting to see some people think it’s coincidence this item got in the shop the same time the most convenient hub of all services got closed – ANet is a company and they need to make money, I just hope they realize that some people with disposable income would pay gladly for good services (namely stuff that makes living with 10 chars easier, not harder)

slightly besides the point: it looks like LA is on a completely different plane of existence now – we can’t see the other maps and port there, which looks to me like they just reconnected the three portals to a completely different map (like they did with the mad kings labyrinth) and after the LS is through, they’ll just reconnect LA again (probably with some changes). it could be deliberate and LA really is gone, but until proven otherwise I’ll assume LA will be back within a month or so when the story is finished.

Kaellok.8143:

I’m really glad this thread exists so that I can laugh at all the crying and complaining. The part that particularly makes me fall out of my chair is the “OBVIOUS bait and switch” part. XD

yes, laugh at others peoples concerns, they do not deserve to have fun or be heard, their opinion is different from yours and thus invalid.
I mean really, it doesn’t bug you, great for you, have fun, others have other priorities and some seem to feel betrayed, when this happens to you in a future patch, do you want others to act as immature as you do here?

echo.2053:

Lol this is still going on.

Well I’m back from picketing walmarts decision to move the twinkes back 2 aisles annnnnddd it went nothing like I thought would happen. I thought I’d be get support from thousands as we marched onto Walmart to face this oppression and chant proudly " no we will not walk 2 more aisles to get twinkes, that is a pure cash grab" to be honest I was a bit fearful that I’d start a riot.

Instead I got a little support from a few heavyset people that wanted access to the twinkes to be at the doorway, but they quickly tired out. The most common response was it only 2 isles it’s not that bad. I told them in a sneering manner it’s not the point it’s the principle of the matter. You let them get away with this, then the next thing you know the milk will be moved 2 isles.

One man even had the audacity to say that the gas station across the street has the twinkes directly in front of the door. I shut him down quickly by saying the two left turns adds 7 seconds to the trip. Do you know how badly that would just wreck my schedule ??? That’s about a minute of my day just wasted.

Had they removed services everywhere, then it’d be a valid complaint. They are not so this really is just a silly jab.

You would of prolly had better results if you were just to ask to have crafting benches and skill trainers put into the vigil keep

This was a good example, but the key point you missed, is this is America, and I will just go to the store where they sell them by the door. Options people, thats what we are missing here.

Oranisagu.3706:

yes, laugh at others peoples concerns, they do not deserve to have fun or be heard, their opinion is different from yours and thus invalid.
I mean really, it doesn’t bug you, great for you, have fun, others have other priorities and some seem to feel betrayed, when this happens to you in a future patch, do you want others to act as immature as you do here?

With clientèle being insulted over the smallest of things it’s clear that developers should not develop an MMO. Because MMO is always changing. And every time when you change something you have such a negative percentage talking about being “betrayed”.

phys.7689:

DarcShriek.5829:

Aedelric.1287:

The op raises very good points, it is quite obviously a shameless cashgrab, their is nothing anyone can say to defend such actions by Arena Net.

It’s ANet’s game they can do what they want. Also, Anet is a business and the primary goal of a business is to make money. If you don’t like the idea of a business making money, feel free to move to Cuba or North Korea.

and your job as a consumer is too try to make the business give you an experience/item how you want it.
Point is capitialism is supposed to be limited by the consumers descions on what they are willing to accept. Capitalism henges on the idea that the consumer will in fact make demands, and limit the money making potential of business based around their own desires and greed as a customer.

point is,
dont hate on the customer for saying what they want with their money, and what they want to give up money for. You can disagree that its important, but its stupid to say they arent a part of the process, everyone playing this game has given the company money, and a great money will give them more. They are currently a highly profitable asset, many people have given them money. Its far from socialism for the customer to demand things, its very capitalist

As a consumer, if there’s something I don’t want, I don’t buy it. It is not the consumer’s role to harangue a producer into producing what the consumer wants. It’s the consumer’s juob to buy the product that fits his/her needs at the best value. If you don’t like the pass, then simply don’t buy it. I have 3 2-week passes and have yet to use any simply because the product doesn’t interest me. You seem to want to convince me that because I’m not interested in the product, that I should harass Anet simply for making it.

Mirta.5029:

Oranisagu.3706:

yes, laugh at others peoples concerns, they do not deserve to have fun or be heard, their opinion is different from yours and thus invalid.
I mean really, it doesn’t bug you, great for you, have fun, others have other priorities and some seem to feel betrayed, when this happens to you in a future patch, do you want others to act as immature as you do here?

With clientèle being insulted over the smallest of things it’s clear that developers should not develop an MMO. Because MMO is always changing. And every time when you change something you have such a negative percentage talking about being “betrayed”.

If I was in charge of developing an MMO, I would never allow my developers to read the forums attached to it. I would hire communtiy managers whose sole function is to filter the information. If I found anyone involved in the actual development of the project on the forum, I would consider it grounds for dismissal.

I noticed this the first time when I was searching the Laurel Vendor in the Vigil Keep, of course the only one I can see is in the airship. Something tells me this was on purpose, to force people to buy the ticket.

Keep going at it ANet, you’re doing the very best you can to lose players.

Hey, if people want to spend real money to not have to stare at a loading screen once in a while for these few weeks, I don’t see a problem. If it helps keep ANet trucking along, great. Buy tons of them.

I still find it a waste of money / in-game gold, but that’s only relevant to my own decision regarding the pass.

Is it really up for debate that this is a cash grab? There’s a reason your PvP —> Lion’s Arch waypoint doesn’t have crafting anymore, and it’s to entice users to buy the airship pass.

…is this even a question? The only question is if you’re ok with it.