Guild Wars 2

Interesting… However, I’m only giving constructive criticism, albeit harsh criticism at that. But in that regard, how am I to highly rate material that is so sporadic and discombobulated, that it would fail to publish a child’s book? If Guild Wars 2 offers us with quality content, they will receive tremendously accommodating feedback. As it is, they should be satisfied that we are so rough with them, as a little rough love stirs improvement.

harsh and constructive criticism could be opposing things depending on your delivery.
Could you not simply just give criticism instead of “harsh” and get your message through? Why the need to lash the whip to move the cow when the cow will come to you if you offer it hay? (I’ll admit I’m pushing hard for these analogies but it is kind of fun ;p ).

There was a post earlier that detailed all the ingame mail messages in chronological sequence which spelled out the storyline really well. So maybe the material is worth praise but the reception is somehow lost on us.

Either it is the delivery or it is the listener but there is for sure a disconnect. First rule of public speaking though is to know your audience, so if “we” don’t get it, no matter how good the story is, they need to change delivery of the story so we “can” get it.

There is both positive and negative reinforcement, knowing when to use which is critical.

Also if you ever study group dynamics or had to sit through a marriage counseling or a office team building exercise, you will see that maybe our baseline emotional outbursts are really deconstructive and immature. Part of being an adult is self control. Something my kids of very little of, but I now know how to manage enough that I can function in a group and play nice with others.

We are a team/community. With each other as players and with anet who develops our game. Communication is key to success in a team. There are some phases in group dynamics that every group goes through at different paces: Forming, Storming, Norming, Performing.

Forming was fun and new, but right now we are stuck in storming. I hope this phase doesn’t break us.

I agree.

I also agree with some of the criticism (and made some myself), but man, people are harsh.

People are losing patience. I’ll bet if you took a moment to go through someones post history things started out much better. But, after months of being screwed over/dissapointed, good will starts to wear thin.

Actually I do go through some people’s post history if I see them post a lot of negativity and many times they have always been negative. It is that persons perception which colors in the events that they view. Change of perception does wonders for your attitude.

Back to why we are upset in the first place though. Yes this event from a players point of view had holes in it and seemed inconsistent and choppy. I think this is an artifact of the developers not putting themselves in the players position and thinking from the top of the hill too much. Again a change of perception is needed.

After secondary analysis I see what they were doing and how it goes together, but most of us are not willing to take the time to stop to think for some of these things it seems. So back to the first rule of public speaking, know your audience.

blackgoat.5172:

People are losing patience.

Pure and simple.

Personally I even upgraded my hardware for around 400€ so far, to overcome the unoptimized mess that this client is.
Only to still find similar unpolished messes in the game itself too.
AFTER 8 Months!

HawkMeister.4758:

Personally I even upgraded my hardware for around 400€ so far, to overcome the unoptimized mess that this client is.
Only to still find similar unpolished messes in the game itself too.
AFTER 8 Months!

You guys can are of course free to say whatever you want about this game; there are certainly no shortage of things to criticize. But I don’t know how anyone can say the game is unpolished. Even with all the bugs in the game (you’re talking to a guy who has had Scope slotted in his major trait slot on his Engineer since the moment he unlocked it on the assumption that one day it will be fixed), I just don’t see a lack of polish.

Hawk, went through your posts and from the first day on the forum you were having problems with your computer and this game. Some of it was resolved with patches and some not.

I did notice you are continuously frustrated and you say “frickin” a lot. I kind of imagine you waving your arms around with a loud voice wondering what the hell is going on with everyone now a days and why is everyone on your grass

But going back to your point about people are losing patience. You started the game with little to no patience. Through the duration you had ups and downs, but the trend was consistent.

Although I am sure no one likes getting analysed by some random person and I have plenty of faults on my own. So sorry if I offended you, but trying to make my case about maybe we should change how we talk and interact and it will make for a better community.

Ah, I admit if you search the recesses of my forum history here, you will find naught but complaints. However, that is merely because I joined the forum rather recently, for the explicit purpose of expressing my dissatisfaction with F&F. The marketing campaign had us reigned in to this amazing living story, and then they send us out to fix sign post. I think its reasonable that I was less than cordial with this development. And then, and amazing thing happened, Braham and Rox’s instances, and the MA Dungeon; finally, the pace was picking up. It was not to last.

They had learned how to deliver a story, but in the very next chapter discarded everything they had underwent harsh criticism to create. Needless to say, I was once again forced to express my displeasure. After doing a little research I will agree with you that a story does exist, however they are failing to deliver it properly, and least they amend this hollow vessel, I cannot take pleasure in sailing on it. So in that regard how am I to express anything but criticism? They asked for our thoughts, and so I gave them mine; simply, I am not enjoying this so called ‘story’.

As a general rule, if a game is going well for a person, they play it and go on about their way. Forums are notorious, in this game and all others, for bringing out the complainers. Some have valid points, some don’t, but everyone thinks that theirs are the ones that are. Developers have learned through the trials and errors of doing this which ones are the people who have meaningful comments or suggestions to help improve the game, and which ones are there to cry and moan that the game is sub-par to THEIR expectations, which a lot of time isn’t the feeling of the masses in general. The criers and complainers get put into one bin, the helpers another. It isn’t hard to tell who falls into which……just read the posts.

Overall, I am glad that you guys took the time to stop and read. Also I hope that more people can express themselves the way Mia just did.

I agree, flame and frost felt really well put together on the last half and then they did a 180 and this is causing unrest in the community.

What I think it comes down to is that the developers are failing to take their big ideas and bring them down to connect with the players with the game updates and world development. This is causing unrest within the community and that is a problem.

Lol, when you said, “I hope that more people can express themselves the way Mia just did,” an image flashed through my eyes.

“Hi, I’m Mia, and I’m a game-a-holic,” -Mia.
“Hi Mia~” -other players sitting in a circle.

XD

I don’t think this is the proper forum for this thread.

Sorry…..next time I’ll complain more

Whattman.5841:

Sorry…..next time I’ll complain more

what a contradiction… I think I’m going to do something sensible and log off already, lol

MMO communities are always going to be massive congregations of frustrated people pulling in different directions. You’ll see it in every single game: world of warcraft’s casual players and ‘hardcore’ players verbally slaying each other in order to keep/throw away looking for raid, Rift’s playerbase simultaneously lamenting and loving the recent free to play change, and SWTOR’s players clashing over more instanced group content and single player story missions. I have seen this happen with every single MMO I’ve ever played.

I think the fundamental issue here is a miscommunication between this game’s developers and its community, though. Dungeons of incredibly different levels of size and quality are both labeled as “Story Dungeons”, which leaves players to expect the same thing from Canach’s lair as they did from the molten facility. Original manifesto promises of no gear treadmill had players believing that they would never have to work at level 80 to better their character and get into more content, but ascended gear changed this. We’re being told that we’re going to be receiving consistent living story content, but the month-to-month additions vary wildly in quality and never last. It’s not an issue of GW2 being a bad game – it’s that Arenanet needs to make sure they’re communicating their goals clearly ahead of time.

I also think Arenanet needs to stop listening to every facet of the player base. Is having to put in the minimal effort to get a group together for living story content REALLY such a barrier that arenanet should make singe-player-only dungeon excursions? I don’t believe so, but it seems like they’re trying to cater to as many people as they possibly can, which is not good.

That being said, they can still pull this off. They gave us molten facility, and I believe if they stop trying to please us every month and focus more effort into bigger, more quality patches like F&F patch 3 and 4 then we will see strong improvements to the game. And here’s to hoping that some of this living story stuff sticks around!

CMF.5461:

/philosophical soap box to try to better humanity through the internet….maybe a lost cause.

MMOs are not good games. They are not meant to be good games, most of the time. GW2 was trying to be one, but the issue is now out of a developer’s hands – those who are left playing MMOs are those who don’t want a good game, rather those who want a grind.

This is obvious in Southsun. Good storytelling, interesting dynamic events, a deep change to the world? No, 200% Magic Find and some unique looking items if you do some achievements, plus the good old RNG boxes. That’s what ArenaNet gave its community because that’s what the GW2 community wanted – you can easily see how the most played aspects of the game are those that this community grinds and farms. Fractals, CoF path 1, farming events in Orr, farming the dragon events? That’s where you will see the highest concentration of players.

A sane developer give its players what they want. The GW2 community has made very clear that they want loot and grind, not a good game.

Erasculio.2914:

CMF.5461:

/philosophical soap box to try to better humanity through the internet….maybe a lost cause.

MMOs are not good games. They are not meant to be good games, most of the time. GW2 was trying to be one, but the issue is now out of a developer’s hands – those who are left playing MMOs are those who don’t want a good game, rather those who want a grind.

This is obvious in Southsun. Good storytelling, interesting dynamic events, a deep change to the world? No, 200% Magic Find and some unique looking items if you do some achievements, plus the good old RNG boxes. That’s what ArenaNet gave its community because that’s what the GW2 community wanted – you can easily see how the most played aspects of the game are those that this community grinds and farms. Fractals, CoF path 1, farming events in Orr, farming the dragon events? That’s where you will see the highest concentration of players.

A sane developer give its players what they want. The GW2 community has made very clear that they want loot and grind, not a good game.

While this is true for many players, it can most certainly be attributed to the fact that after completing story, dungeons, and map, there is nothing left to do but grind for gold, weapons, armor, and legendarys. I sincerely doubt that most farmers spend all their time farming simply because they like running in circles killing the same mobs in endless repetition. It is boring, but they do it regardless because there is nothing else to do but collect profits until they’ve finally had enough and quit the game. On the other hand, if we are provided with quality content, I truly believe the band wagon would jump on it.

Mia Lunarfang.5826:

I sincerely doubt that most farmers spend all their time farming simply because they like running in circles killing the same mobs in endless repetition.

I disagree with you. I believe farmers spend their time farming because they enjoy getting those rewards. MMOs have been built on the foundation that the only requirement for getting rewards is time, not skill or intelligence or knowledge; that’s a relic from the pay to play games in which the goal was to keep people playing longer, but that’s what MMO players got used to. As a result, what those players seek are mindless, easy and repetitive activities that will give them their “fix” (be it a +1 to some random stats – which they call “progression” – or some kind of unique item or just more in-game money), without worrying if the process of earning said “fix” is fun or not.

Skinner’s rat, human edition.

It works. It sells. In fact, it sells millions, as WoW has shown us. Developers have been trying to get a slice of the WoW pie for years now. More disturbingly, those players who think being a Skinner’s rat actually equals playing a game have associated this kind of lifestyle to MMOs. That’s what they expect when a new MMO is released, that is what they demand from a MMO developer, and that’s what they ultimately want, to the detriment of everything else.

Thus, that’s what MMOs are. Players who want something else don’t even bother to try MMOs anymore, and the few who do soon find themselves swimming in a sea of rats. Unfortunatelly for game developers, there aren’t enough people in the world willing to accept this kind of “game” in order to keep multiple MMOs afloat, hence the failure of MMO after MMO – is there anything still pay to play other than WoW? Even Rift is going free to play.

There is no salvation for MMORPGs because the MMORPG players are the core of the issue right now. Until the genre dies and its style of “play” is gone, so it can have a rebirth, I doubt very much we will see any MMO being and keeping itself as more than “Grinding 101”.

CMF.5461:

but trying to make my case about maybe we should change how we talk and interact and it will make for a better community.

Well your case may have been worthy if the main “perpetrator” would be on the same page as you. Namely ANet themselves.

There are some feeble attempts by the Devs to post and engage in discussions with their “fans”, but clicking that Dev Tracker on any given (non-patch)day and mainly finding Gaile or Ashley´s posts is a pretty good indicator to their wish of engaging their customers.

And when they actually do I have rarely seen any type of abuse hurled towards the “brave” Dev.
What I frequently see though is pretty decent feedback and great suggestions pointed towards the Dev, which makes their avoidance of the fora even more baffling.

BTW, I´m trying really hard not to comment harshly on your pretty unfair synopsis of my posting history.
CONTEXT is the key here and apart from my last admittedly shrill posts on this(for some reason) really aggravating Canach fight, I don´t pull punches just to preserve some mythical “cumbaya vibe” on the fora.
Which never existed in the first place anyway.

I remember very well that on that insanely rushed launch the fora wasn´t even ready! So the many people that couldn´t even install the game properly(me included) had to crowdsource their support from teh internetz instead of the actual programmers.

I think GW2 is a great game, the best MMO I have played to date.

Erasculio.2914:

Mia Lunarfang.5826:

I sincerely doubt that most farmers spend all their time farming simply because they like running in circles killing the same mobs in endless repetition.

I disagree with you. I believe farmers spend their time farming because they enjoy getting those rewards. MMOs have been built on the foundation that the only requirement for getting rewards is time, not skill or intelligence or knowledge; that’s a relic from the pay to play games in which the goal was to keep people playing longer, but that’s what MMO players got used to. As a result, what those players seek are mindless, easy and repetitive activities that will give them their “fix” (be it a +1 to some random stats – which they call “progression” – or some kind of unique item or just more in-game money), without worrying if the process of earning said “fix” is fun or not.

Skinner’s rat, human edition.

It works. It sells. In fact, it sells millions, as WoW has shown us. Developers have been trying to get a slice of the WoW pie for years now. More disturbingly, those players who think being a Skinner’s rat actually equals playing a game have associated this kind of lifestyle to MMOs. That’s what they expect when a new MMO is released, that is what they demand from a MMO developer, and that’s what they ultimately want, to the detriment of everything else.

Thus, that’s what MMOs are. Players who want something else don’t even bother to try MMOs anymore, and the few who do soon find themselves swimming in a sea of rats. Unfortunatelly for game developers, there aren’t enough people in the world willing to accept this kind of “game” in order to keep multiple MMOs afloat, hence the failure of MMO after MMO – is there anything still pay to play other than WoW? Even Rift is going free to play.

There is no salvation for MMORPGs because the MMORPG players are the core of the issue right now. Until the genre dies and its style of “play” is gone, so it can have a rebirth, I doubt very much we will see any MMO being and keeping itself as more than “Grinding 101”.

Players DO wish to obtain these rewards -as indeed even I would love a legendary, an exotic, cultural, dungeon, and temple armor set, and a mountain of gold per character- but that doesn’t mean they love or desire the method of procuring them. So if developers change the method, but maintain the rewards, players would have no problem. In fact, many would be enthused… a good story and rewards?! How can you complain?

I for one have always hated farming, its the most boring factor in gaming aside from leveling… which brings me to another point, if players love grinding so much, then why did they take away level grinding? Its the same concept; in one you’re farming for gold and in the other for a level, both are grueling and tedious months of wasted time and effort. So why did they take it away? The answer is simple, players get sick of it and quit. Then its on to the next game until that too becomes monotonous.

And lets be honest, by name alone, shouldn’t a legendary weapon come with a legend? To have a history and mystery, one that you have to complete a challenging and complex lengthy story plot, or even uncover a hidden area with an outrageous puzzle to obtain, and not be something you simply create? For example, there could be a sword from a great hero that died in a world cataclysmic battle long past. Then after death, his possessions were stored in a secret tomb that was later uncovered and used by ignorant bandits as a hide out. They ransacked some of the lesser weapons making them a formidable force, but could never uncover the innermost chamber lost to history. Then, as the player you either have to fight through them in your exploration to find the chamber, or perhaps kill a bandit who finds the weapon, using it to usurp power and growing ever more ruthless, on the verge of being possessed by the weapon.

At any rate we have deviated extremely far off topic.

CMF.5461:

harsh and constructive criticism could be opposing things depending on your delivery.
Could you not simply just give criticism instead of “harsh” and get your message through? Why the need to lash the whip to move the cow when the cow will come to you if you offer it hay? (I’ll admit I’m pushing hard for these analogies but it is kind of fun ;p ).

There was a post earlier that detailed all the ingame mail messages in chronological sequence which spelled out the storyline really well. So maybe the material is worth praise but the reception is somehow lost on us.

Either it is the delivery or it is the listener but there is for sure a disconnect. First rule of public speaking though is to know your audience, so if “we” don’t get it, no matter how good the story is, they need to change delivery of the story so we “can” get it.

There is both positive and negative reinforcement, knowing when to use which is critical.

Also if you ever study group dynamics or had to sit through a marriage counseling or a office team building exercise, you will see that maybe our baseline emotional outbursts are really deconstructive and immature. Part of being an adult is self control. Something my kids of very little of, but I now know how to manage enough that I can function in a group and play nice with others.

We are a team/community. With each other as players and with anet who develops our game. Communication is key to success in a team. There are some phases in group dynamics that every group goes through at different paces: Forming, Storming, Norming, Performing.

Forming was fun and new, but right now we are stuck in storming. I hope this phase doesn’t break us.

If the cow doesnt want to move, nothing you do will make it move, other than tranking the cow and dragging it. Personally I would just have a nice steak dinner, rather than have a stubborn cow in my herd, regardless of emotional outbursts. Hows that for an analogy?

Barring the violent imagery, it’s exactly how I feel towards this game and the direction that it has taken.

Mia Lunarfang.5826:

Interesting… However, I’m only giving constructive criticism, albeit harsh criticism at that. But in that regard, how am I to highly rate material that is so sporadic and discombobulated, that it would fail to publish a child’s book? If Guild Wars 2 offers us with quality content, they will receive tremendously accommodating feedback. As it is, they should be satisfied that we are so rough with them, as a little rough love stirs improvement.

1. Harsh criticism? Try constructive criticism. It’s better.
2. That is your opinion. I happen to really enjoy what Arenanet brings to the table. I have liked all of their material so far, except maybe that crabtacular achievement.

Khal Drogo.9631:

CMF.5461:

harsh and constructive criticism could be opposing things depending on your delivery.
Could you not simply just give criticism instead of “harsh” and get your message through? Why the need to lash the whip to move the cow when the cow will come to you if you offer it hay? (I’ll admit I’m pushing hard for these analogies but it is kind of fun ;p ).

There was a post earlier that detailed all the ingame mail messages in chronological sequence which spelled out the storyline really well. So maybe the material is worth praise but the reception is somehow lost on us.

Either it is the delivery or it is the listener but there is for sure a disconnect. First rule of public speaking though is to know your audience, so if “we” don’t get it, no matter how good the story is, they need to change delivery of the story so we “can” get it.

There is both positive and negative reinforcement, knowing when to use which is critical.

Also if you ever study group dynamics or had to sit through a marriage counseling or a office team building exercise, you will see that maybe our baseline emotional outbursts are really deconstructive and immature. Part of being an adult is self control. Something my kids of very little of, but I now know how to manage enough that I can function in a group and play nice with others.

We are a team/community. With each other as players and with anet who develops our game. Communication is key to success in a team. There are some phases in group dynamics that every group goes through at different paces: Forming, Storming, Norming, Performing.

Forming was fun and new, but right now we are stuck in storming. I hope this phase doesn’t break us.

If the cow doesnt want to move, nothing you do will make it move, other than tranking the cow and dragging it. Personally I would just have a nice steak dinner, rather than have a stubborn cow in my herd, regardless of emotional outbursts. Hows that for an analogy?

Barring the violent imagery, it’s exactly how I feel towards this game and the direction that it has taken.

Also wrong. You can get a cow to move by waving her favorite treat in front of her face.

There’s no denying that any type of game official forum is usually populated by the majority of people that are discontented with something, and this is specifically true for MMOs. Why? Because people who enjoy content play the content andhave no time to argue about little things on said forum.

What is more is that people can’t make up their mind. There seriously were people who found it an issue that F&F was finalized with a 5-man story mode dungeon and stated they’d rather thave something they could do at an individual level. So Anet does in fact listen to this and makes a 1-man fight against Canach + a 5-man version that takes 10 min to finish to which people, surprise surprise, complain that it’s too hard/too easy/unfair/has good or bad mechanics etc etc.

The bottom line in my opinion to this whole ordeal is that no matter how much care or attention you put into things haters are gonna hate, trolls will troll and whiners will whine. Hell, half of the people who complain about “bugs”, “issues” or “things lacking” don’t even know that what they’re pointing at is actually a game mechanic or design decision rather than an actual problem and that it says more about the lack of character/quality amongst themselves than about the game.

GW2 is by no means perfect, what is after all? It is in my opinion however the best MMO I’ve played to date and I can’t wait to see what they’re going to incorporate next.

People invest two things into an MMO, time and money. Time spent in game is often poorly rewarded. Players are not asking for a gear treadmill and accept that they have to make their own goals. However those goals can sometimes seem impossible to achieve whether it’s a cosmetic, a mini, or anything else. Dailies eat a lot of time and are a treadmill. Extra money spent on the game in the shop is often poorly rewarded. Again players can set their own goals but purchasing chests is an extremely random way to achieve anything.

So ultimately, whatever players are investing in the game they are beginning to feel it is not worth it. Like every other game, GW2 needs more content for players to invest time for fun.

I would suggest not coming to the forums at all. When I want to play with enthusiastic interested people, I go play the game. When I forget myself and want to communicate out of the game, I come to the forum and become immediately reminded that all the enthusiastic interested people are still in the game, not here.

Someone in this thread said: “because I joined the forum rather recently, for the explicit purpose of expressing my dissatisfaction…”

I think that pretty much says it all.

Chief.5928:

There’s no denying that any type of game official forum is usually populated by the majority of people that are discontented with something, and this is specifically true for MMOs. Why? Because people who enjoy content play the content andhave no time to argue about little things on said forum.

What is more is that people can’t make up their mind. There seriously were people who found it an issue that F&F was finalized with a 5-man story mode dungeon and stated they’d rather thave something they could do at an individual level. So Anet does in fact listen to this and makes a 1-man fight against Canach + a 5-man version that takes 10 min to finish to which people, surprise surprise, complain that it’s too hard/too easy/unfair/has good or bad mechanics etc etc.

The bottom line in my opinion to this whole ordeal is that no matter how much care or attention you put into things haters are gonna hate, trolls will troll and whiners will whine. Hell, half of the people who complain about “bugs”, “issues” or “things lacking” don’t even know that what they’re pointing at is actually a game mechanic or design decision rather than an actual problem and that it says more about the lack of character/quality amongst themselves than about the game.

GW2 is by no means perfect, what is after all? It is in my opinion however the best MMO I’ve played to date and I can’t wait to see what they’re going to incorporate next.

Bugs are bugs, u mean there are other kinds of bugs? Or do you mean people who find bugs in GW2 don’t know what they are talking about? I am so confused. Like the “cannot swap weapon set bug that occurs because of cut scenes” that existed since beta?

If lacking features is a “design decision”, then sorry GW2 is not the game for me. Its not true that people who enjoy content have no time to post on forums – look at SAB for example or the numerous fans or astroturf who defend Anet and GW2 and slam NCSoft for GW2’s creative direction. On the flip side, people who have already left the game won’t be posting on the forums either.

Haters gonna hate and trolls gonna troll, thats true – they will give a 0 on Metacritic before even playing a game and not after thousands of hours spent on a game.

@Khal Drogo.9631

I never stated that the game doesn’t have bugs or that reporting such bugs is a bad thing. All I’m trying to point out is that some things that people report are done so without first looking into it properly whether it’s a true issue or not.

A typical example is the Canach fight, where people reported ‘OMG green mines blow me up when I run over them’ whereas we now know that Canach has an ability that will reset a mine from green to red causing the player to then set it off.

On the other hand we have seen proper bug reports, like Canach being right on top of a green mine but not activating it. I just wish people would look a bit more into things before accusing the developers of slacking/having no skill in designing a game etc.

That’s all

Something else to remember as well……content has been put out every 2 weeks or so for a while. Content takes time……the more time taken, the better the content will be. It brings up an interesting choice, do we want more, or do we want better? With all of the layoffs happening industry-wide, putting more people on it is not really an option any more.
There is no sub fee. All of the cash shop items are optional, no buy-to-win here. And we still have the most beautiful world of any MMO, with new content coming at a steady pace. Admittedly some content is better, but better or worse, it is there.

To comment on the initial question……I think the community is fine. Some of the best in any MMO I have played, and I play a lot .

Agreed, I played several MMOs before this one and GW2 has by far the best of the communities.

Two days ago it was for the first time since the launch day that I actually ran into someone who was being so belligerent towards his party members that I reported him for abusive language. And I’ve clocked well over 1100 hours in this game.

The community will praise just as hard as it will criticise as proven by some of the more recent releases, what you will always get is the pitchforks if the users feel the developers are trying to pull a fast one, the most recent is the unlimited use sickle.

It’s impossible to please everybody all the time. Some decisions made can and will frustrate people to no end. For example, the RNG factor in the crates in regards to weapon skins. I think most would agree, that Anet at the very least should allow these things to be sold straight up for gems; because they are not, people get aggravated, and for good reason.

With that said, when you compare Gw2 to other games currently on the market; this game is heads above the rest. You look at other game’s forums (like D3), where 85% of the threads are complaining about one thing or another, consider ourselves lucky for what we have here.

Danomeon.3201:

… it seems like they’re trying to cater to as many people as they possibly can, which is not good.

I love it that they are trying to cater to as many people as possible, and I’m very glad they put in an option an instance for people who enjoy solo play. My complaint is that when they implemented it they “forced” people who don’t enjoy solo play to play it, too — I can’t get to the group content unless I play the solo content. If both types of play exist (and they do) why not simply offer separate rewards (and they have) and not make either be a requirement or gate to the other. Really, it’s okay for them to make both groups happy, and to make people who enjoy both types of content even happier.

No less important.. but, this is just one of thousands of the same discussions on the same topic that have been occurring since 1996.

A game can’t change the Community. Only the Community can change the Community.

WatchTheShow.7203:

Mia Lunarfang.5826:

Interesting… However, I’m only giving constructive criticism, albeit harsh criticism at that. But in that regard, how am I to highly rate material that is so sporadic and discombobulated, that it would fail to publish a child’s book? If Guild Wars 2 offers us with quality content, they will receive tremendously accommodating feedback. As it is, they should be satisfied that we are so rough with them, as a little rough love stirs improvement.

1. Harsh criticism? Try constructive criticism. It’s better.
2. That is your opinion. I happen to really enjoy what Arenanet brings to the table. I have liked all of their material so far, except maybe that crabtacular achievement.

“However, I’m only giving constructive criticism, albeit harsh criticism at that.” -Mia. Its interesting how you quoted this exact sentence but failed to release that the very word you suggest I inhibit was already implored in that very same sentence.

Let’s go over the definition of constructive criticism, shall we? A critique in which one breaks everything down to show, not only whats wrong with something, but to suggest how to improve or fix it. As for harsh, that’s an adjective that describes the overly negative nature in which someone presents an issue. I admit that I was overly negative, but that is simply because the issue in which i’m regarding, (the story aspect of living story) has little to be positive about. Thus while constructive, my criticism is also harsh. Problem?

Disclaimer: I didn’t read any of the responses, I’m only responding to the OP.

As far as I remember the forum was exactly the same during the beta, except people were more likely to assume Anet were falling over themselves to please us and everything they didn’t like would be changed for release so they got a bit less worked up about it.

And from what I’ve seen (on Desolation and recently EU overflows in Southsun) the majority of players do seem to be genuinely enjoying the game. It’s only on the forums that the general attitude seems to be so negative.

As many people have said before it’s probably because people who like the game and are happy with it are busy playing the game whilst people who are annoyed about something are more likely to come here to voice their frustration, and sometimes stick around to post in other threads whilst still feeling annoyed and frustrated.

I agree.

I myself gravitate towards glass half-full thinking people (in real life too). Somehow playing a game with crabby people just doesn’t sound like fun to me. It is, after all, just a game.

My advice to new players – avoid the forums like the plague. Play the game from start to finish and form your own opinions. You’ll enjoy the game much more that way.

it makes sense.. At the begining there where only a couple of entusiasts, now that the general population has come to the game this community is no different to other MMO communities. There are the helpful people, the people that bring their pet peeves to every thread, oldtimers that say that the game is degrading, people spelling “DOOM” at every patch, etc, etc, etc.

But as I say, half the fun in an MMO is reading the Forums, with all the drama

As the number of people grow, the drama will grow.

8 months down the track and the stealth mechanic is still overpowered with no counter.

this tends to make me complain a lot. Also the living story is a bit weak and poorly delivered. The Molten Facility dungeon was amazing, might of raised the bar a bit too high. The latest chapter in the story is Soooooooo boring.

After 8+ months of constructive feedback, on certain issues, we’re just realizing our suggestions are being ignored, for more important things, such as, randomized content via lotto-boxes & temporary content.

SPvP has only gotten 2 maps with no new gametype on the horizon. WvW finally got some goals though, which is a plus.
Dungeons are still chaotic with non-trinity gameplay.
Still no trait templates.
Still no LFG tool.
Dynamic Events aren’t so dynamic.
No new heart tasks. The world hasn’t changed in old zones, even though Living Story was supposed to change it.
Loot is still terrible and non-rewarding.
Crafting hasn’t changed.

Cash shop items are always added though. Where is the new gear at? I’m talking about new sets, not 1-piece gloves from Molten Facility, or backpacks from Holiday Events, etc.

Don’t take my word for it though, just go read the suggestions forum and go back pages, and you will find 90% of them ignored.

nexxe.7081:

After 8+ months of constructive feedback, on certain issues, we’re just realizing our suggestions are being ignored, for more important things, such as, randomized content via lotto-boxes & temporary content.

SPvP has only gotten 2 maps with no new gametype on the horizon. WvW finally got some goals though, which is a plus.
Dungeons are still chaotic with non-trinity gameplay.
Still no trait templates.
Still no LFG tool.
Dynamic Events aren’t so dynamic.
No new heart tasks. The world hasn’t changed in old zones, even though Living Story was supposed to change it.
Loot is still terrible and non-rewarding.
Crafting hasn’t changed.

Cash shop items are always added though. Where is the new gear at? I’m talking about new sets, not 1-piece gloves from Molten Facility, or backpacks from Holiday Events, etc.

Don’t take my word for it though, just go read the suggestions forum and go back pages, and you will find 90% of them ignored.

There’s a difference between ignoring and working on it. I see a devteam that listens to their customers. For example a solo instance on ssc. They improved tooltips, skills etc. For rangers they improved pet AI. They made wvw more rewarding. Ascended stuff in wvw etc etc, just read the patchnotes. They took away EBJP so don’t take up que. And many more things that are great improvements based on what we as the community gave as feedback.

The fact that Anet prioritizes differently from u is not a reason to define them as ignoring u.
And some of the points u added are ur own opinion. U miss the trinity for having a pt role. Here it’s working together and combining ur skills to do more damage (so that’s using class benefits too, albeit in a different way from what u know and apparently expect). Trait templates would rock, but are not critical. And i love the loot, i come from another MMO, in which drops sucked and to think i even played on a X4 server and drops sucked there too.

And to add to the analogy: you can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar

Only point of constructive criticism i can think of, is posting more in the forum, to make it more clear to ppl what they can expect from suggestions.
Maybe give topics tags like:
- Will be discussed in dev team
- Will never be implemented
- Will go to suggestionslist
etc etc.

Cuz what i see the most on this forum is ppl thinking Anet isn’t listening, though they are. Why? Cuz ppl don’t see the reply to the post they made and therefore think Anet does diddle with it.
Which I can imagine, since they’re so actively working on making added content to the game.

Erasculio.2914:

This is obvious in Southsun. Good storytelling, interesting dynamic events, a deep change to the world? No, 200% Magic Find and some unique looking items if you do some achievements, plus the good old RNG boxes. That’s what ArenaNet gave its community because that’s what the GW2 community wanted.

From what I can tell from the long list of threads frustrated with RNG boxes, including myself, the community does not like RNG boxes and would love to see them go away. Especially locking weapon skins behind them has to be the worse and most hated move ever on A.Net’s part. I have yet to meet anyone in game that actually likes the stupid things.

Getting rewarded for exploring the island with curious and fun items, i can get beyond that – though the diving into lava bit seem awkward and out of place for an achievement to me, though did get a chuckle getting a friend of mine to do it not knowing what the dire results were going to be.

I think what happened is the community is feeling a bit frustrated. I can see it mainly starting when the fused ticket weapon fiasco happened. And now it is happening again with the new weapon skins. There has been no direct or indirect feedback on the issue from any rep of A.Net. No response to the great dislike of it. And it is starting to make certain parts of the community feel ignored. And the frustration spreads from those people to the rest of the community.

Lets not forget the lack of social tools as well. Lack of emotes, lack of interaction with the environment (i.e. not being able to sit in chairs). And costly character customization – requiring gems to change the character’s appearance or armor to match stats. It adds up.

I think the OP makes a good point. People do seem to complain a lot, and in a fairly abrasive tone. If we want our wishes for the game to be realized, we also need to keep in mind that there are actual people on the recieving end of our complaints. People who are proud of their work and the world they have created. They too know that there is room for improvement, but no-one wants to engage with 20 rude and angry people on an issue they may want to comment on.

I know there are a lot of issues that should be resolved, and that it’s easy to get impatient (sometimes rightfully so). But being angry, rude and abrasive is not the most constructive way to deal with other people.

That being said, I usually follow the forums of games I play and they’re all like this. Battlefield, Saints Row, even Minecraft sometimes.

I try my best in all my videos and posts to offer soultions to the problems I have encoutnered. Yes, I citisise GW2 for it’s faults, but only so that thoese faults can be worked apon to improve the game.
My hope for Aner actualy working on these faults and ever achiving what was promised in the manifesto and development does get less and less with each patch. Each patch seems to keep building apon the flaws in GW2 (espicially PvE) instead of fixing thoese flaws and then working from a more solid foundation.

I don’t imagine that arguing in here about whether or not we like the game will get anywhere, so I won’t bother.

In any case, I think it’s just up to expectations being met (or not).
Every time a new MMO comes out that looks decent, people flock to look through the windows in hopes that the game meets what they like to see in an MMO game. Thus the initial hopefulness.

The problem is, everyone seems to have pretty drastically different opinions on what makes a good MMO. When a new MMO comes out, different people will be satisfied to different degrees.

For me personally, I’ve stuck with GW2 because it meets just about every interest I could have in an MMO. High customization, particularly in the appearance department. Interesting races and professions, and (in my opinion) a relatively solid balance between professions. Sure, there are things that I don’t like and things I think they should do differently, but at every one of those angles someone could come along and disagree with me. Because they’re different people with different wants and expectations.

I guess what I’m trying to say is that after sticking with a game that doesn’t much meet their expectations for this long, people start to get frustrated and on the verge of leaving (or flat out leaving altogether). They misunderstand that just because there’s something they don’t like about the game, that means that there’s something wrong with the game.

My two cents.
/shrug

In response of the OP, as you can see reading my post, yes, they are all about how I think they are wrong, but.

• Hours spent on game 2100+
• Legendary made
• Dungeons made still got bored
• Spend 2h on sPvP and another 2h on WvW nearly everyday
• Over 7500 achievement points

I used to farm CoF not because i liked it, its because its the only profitable way to get money “fast” i spend hours and ours doing nearly nothing more than “siteseeing” the game, but the rewwards are poor and my patience to waste time is running, Skins also nearly the only motivation i have to play the game but, thwe way the introduce them in the game is by RNG boxes, I thought at begining coundt blame them, farme them, bhought them (with In game money not real life one), more than 100 crates opened 0 tickets.

By the way, i also tried reporting the same bug since beta, my char cant see “instanced portals” like the “home” in every starting city, i can enter them but, no way to exit without going to the mist of spending money on a TP, i reported it at least 30 times via game including screeshots option, no response from them.

Got 2 items that theorically i can sell them (halloween infinite transformation potion, solid potion(the one from orr boxes), the reallity says i CANT seel them because are bounded to my char, and i reported it, again, no response.

Over all the hours os patience, time spent and inverted, and wating, at beginig because “the game just realeased” and not “they are working on it but, its not a priority” burned my patience and just left the taste of ash in my mouth.

Summing that to some problem with the acounts at the begining that they treat me poorly, sorry if i speak harsh, but sometimes you get what you sow (i think thats the phrase).

Sorry about my english as its not my mother lenguage.

Back to topic and trying to put some advise to improve:

- People liked Molten Dungeong mechanics, as well as AC rework, do more stuff liek that

- New dungeons could use new Weapon or armor skin in a way its not token grind (achivements, unique way to kill bosses, or bosses killing order, with a 20% of droping skin)

- RNG unique skins made tradeable, so the BLT is more “lively”, some people that dont want to farm can try gambling for a great reward as they can sell it.

- the game was not made from grinding but in fact, people just do that, make some “farm” spot in a fun way, farming is not bad, just another game facet, in GW they were solo/Group challenges that the reward were thouse mats, a way to get mats via challenges is not that horrible, is it?

- Forget about Zonmoros, Mystic forge is ok, but dont make special skins out of that, people dont feel anything in the way they obtain the precusors or special skins like Dwaynas bow, make them to be crafted in a palce out there, like forging Vulcan in Mounts volcano dwaynas bow at her temple and so, you invigorate some forgoten by god but not farmers places this way.

Make some other sPvP modes like DeathMatch, Mini WvW maps for GvG (25vs25) and rank them, the PvP in GW" needs more love and not in a chest form, people want diversity.

About MMOs i played, GW1 is the best one i played, sorry but for me the “good old” gw1 system was awesome and skill based self-rewarded as you can see you could control the situations without random smashing buttons (seeing a cast bar could help that feeling to be back, as you cant really see what you interrupt besides spam the skill everytime the other char rises the arm)

Again sorry about my bad eng.

Hello,

As this thread is not inviting to constructive and healthy discussion, it is now closed.