Guild Wars 2

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Tequatl is now Elite content.

It’s been said a million times already.
Unless there is some way to ensure that the people manning the turrets aren’t paste eaters or some implementation of more ways to debuff the dragon and dispel the poison, this event is broken until the masses give up and Teq becomes an informal “guilds only” boss.

Yeni.3507:

Dawdler.8521:

Elite content?

Tequatl is in a mid-level zone and the “first” dragon boss many new players encounter – a world boss version of the Claw Island mission. How exactly is he even supposed to be elite content to begin with!?! I understand if it would have been bloody Jormag, but not the noob dragon.

Next thing people are going to come with the same argument as AC… “Oh but you dont need to be 80 in exotic gear, you can beat him with level 55 characters in greens, us elite players do it all the time!”.

Can a boss be hard? Sure, we like difficult content. But Tequatl is too hard for the zone he is in. People that cant see that are completely blind. They could have made a new Zhaitan world boss in Cursed Shore like this and alot fewer would have complained!

Actually, first dragon boss is the Shatterer, which is still a spam #1 world boss at the moment and only thing patch ever did was triple his hp pool.

As for is Tequatl too hard for the zone he is in?

I think everyone should already know how to dodge by the time of AC(lv30ish) and everyone know how to read(lv???) by defult right? So the only problem is learn the fight and stop just lay there when you are fully dead.

Really thats its? a group of lvl 55 players in green gear that know how to dodge and read is all it takes? I’d like to see that video please.

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

I agree, TEQ is now elite content for GW2. Compared to any other MMO, it’s about equivalent to your average 25-man raid encounter, on normal mode…with no dedicated healers, so it’s more painful. Good job Anet!

Smooth Penguin.5294:

BrotherBelial.3094:

Just tried him/her/it on my server. What I noticed;
1. People didn’t know what they where suppose to be doing.
2. The amount of people needed is crazy. By the time we had inflicted about 5% damage the timer ran out.
3. It would also apear that this content has already be pleased in the too much effort category, on my server at any rate, judging by he 20-30 people who where attempting to take it down.
From what I’ve read on the forum, the amount of planning and specific gear/build requirements for the zone level is just silly. I’m all up for difficult content. But when this is an open world event where everyone and anyone can join something needs to give. Maybe the timer should only be a factor if there are a lot of people in the map. Or as people have said move the encounter to a level 80 zone. I really like Guild Wars 2, but it just seems like some updates are well planed and others are kitten.

That just means your server isn’t ready for him. Remember – Elite Content. That means it’s not for everyone, or anyone just randomly strolling by the zone.

Essence Snow.3194:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Essence Snow.3194:

Haven’t you been advocating (for some time) that exotic and ascended gears were only wants, that we didn’t need those?

If so can 100 players do this event in all masterwork gears (w/o voice coms ofc as it’s 3rd party)?

You don’t need to have them, just as you don’t need to fight Tequatl. This is for the Elites who want to actually beat him. We choose to have the gear.

So it’s perfectly acceptable to have gear gated content now?

When was it ever not ok to have the best gear?

If its not content for everyone, then It should be instanced. As you WILL have everyone and anyone joining in the battle. So called elite content should be in lvl 80 zones or instanced. Having elite content in a scaled down to lvl66 is BS. His is the first dragon players should be taking out. Not coming back to once they are level 80 and exotic or acended out.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Shemsu.8721:

Yeni.3507:

Dawdler.8521:

Elite content?

Tequatl is in a mid-level zone and the “first” dragon boss many new players encounter – a world boss version of the Claw Island mission. How exactly is he even supposed to be elite content to begin with!?! I understand if it would have been bloody Jormag, but not the noob dragon.

Next thing people are going to come with the same argument as AC… “Oh but you dont need to be 80 in exotic gear, you can beat him with level 55 characters in greens, us elite players do it all the time!”.

Can a boss be hard? Sure, we like difficult content. But Tequatl is too hard for the zone he is in. People that cant see that are completely blind. They could have made a new Zhaitan world boss in Cursed Shore like this and alot fewer would have complained!

Actually, first dragon boss is the Shatterer, which is still a spam #1 world boss at the moment and only thing patch ever did was triple his hp pool.

As for is Tequatl too hard for the zone he is in?

I think everyone should already know how to dodge by the time of AC(lv30ish) and everyone know how to read(lv???) by defult right? So the only problem is learn the fight and stop just lay there when you are fully dead.

Really thats its? a group of lvl 55 players in green gear that know how to dodge and read is all it takes? I’d like to see that video please, or share whatever your smoking

Well I don’t what you are smoking, but pretty sure you mean “Really? That is it?” in your first sentence.

In theory a group of level 65*(which is the actual level of Tequatl and the event, obviously in this thread some people have no idea what they are talking about) that know the fight and waypoint whenever they are fully dead can defeat the new Tequatl.

Which at this moment is near impossible since I still see people shouting Teq is bug on the map chat by random lv80 who mostly just afk by the turret.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

Elite content is for elite people. But being an Elite means to protect and guide those who aren’t.

With great power comes great responsibility.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

makes this one of the best free content additions to the game.

I agree with the OP except for this part. This is not an addition to the game. The devs altered a more casual encounter to be more difficult. This removes content for some players while adding content for others. Its a zero sum patch (depending on whether or not more people gain than lose).

Ashen.2907:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

makes this one of the best free content additions to the game.

I agree with the OP except for this part. This is not an addition to the game. The devs altered a more casual encounter to be more difficult. This removes content for some players while adding content for others. Its a zero sum patch (depending on whether or not more people gain than lose).

So true!

Ashen.2907:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

makes this one of the best free content additions to the game.

I agree with the OP except for this part. This is not an addition to the game. The devs altered a more casual encounter to be more difficult. This removes content for some players while adding content for others. Its a zero sum patch (depending on whether or not more people gain than lose).

Then I shall amend to say “this is the best free content update to the game”.

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

And yet you have no ability or right to exclude those who are not elite from participating if they so choose.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

I bet you are playing on Blackgate? As for most other servers, I think you are underestimating the effort put in by certain people to organize things and to get everyone to follow certain tactics while at the same time you are overestimating the willingness or ability of many to follow tactics.

I’m not busy organizing, I join TS and try to talk sense into people in mapchat. So I’m not talking for myself here, but I think pretty much everything you said is being rather disrespectful to those that are putting in a massive effort on other servers, but are getting dragged down by afk’ers at turrets or half the map running around like chickens with their head cut off.

This is exactly content exclusion. Those people trying their kitten ed best to organize things can’t prevent people unwilling to add to the fight from joining in and are thus prevented from progression or getting even close to finishing the fight. Instanced raids don’t exclude people, they make it possible for everyone to do it at their own pace without getting dragged down by people who aren’t ready for it yet.

A lot people on my server are making a valiant effort to organize the herd, but unlike on your server I doubt it’s actually possible. That doesn’t mean that their efforts are worse or deserve less credit.

“Try harder” really doesn’t apply here.

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This, too, is my core issue with the new Tequatl encounter. It didn’t take long for the elitists to crawl out of the woodwork, start telling everyone else what builds, weapons, and play styles they must have, and exclaim that anyone who didn’t follow those specific instructions are somehow inept.

The encounter seems to further this kind of play, which is what drove many of us from other games to this game – a game that promised, as part of its own marketing, to do away with the rigid roles, tiered gear requirements, and forced play styles that made “Tank, DPS, Heals” practically an axiom. But, I don’t think that’s the fault of the encounter itself.

The sad part about this “elitist” nonsense is that, so far, the “elitists” on all but two servers have failed to kill Tequatl. It takes more than just the “elitists” to do the job, and those “elitists” will figure it out when they’re the only ones standing in front of Tequatl in two weeks, puzzled as to why the 30 or 40 of them that showed up couldn’t take him down.

The worst part about this “elitist” nonsense is that Tequatl is actually a fairly engaging, interesting fight. (It does tend to screw melee classes, but that’s been a trend for a while now.) All in all, it’s a large-scale, optional raid encounter that requires some degree of coordination, and that’s not a bad idea – it’s not the encounter itself ruining the entertainment value, it’s the “elitists” screaming at each other and at everyone else, intent on using this encounter to reinstill the stupidity that has halted the growth of many other games.

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

And yet you have no ability or right to exclude those who are not elite from participating if they so choose.

I have the right to invite whoever I want to my group, and so do you for your group. In this scenario, it does not matter at all.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

Elite content is for elite people. But being an Elite means to protect and guide those who aren’t.

With great power comes great responsibility.

Elite by definition implies exclusivity. You’re asking for difficult content that is accessible to everyone, or for players to carry everyone around them whether they want to or not. That’s not what elite content is.

It’s not elite if it’s not exclusive and doable by people that aren’t skilled enough to do it.

TurtleDragon.3108:

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

And yet you have no ability or right to exclude those who are not elite from participating if they so choose.

I have the right to invite whoever I want to my group, and so do you for your group. In this scenario, it does not matter at all.

Yeah, because your group of 5 and/or my group of 5 cancels out the remaining 80-100 players with varying skill levels and motivations.

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

And yet you have no ability or right to exclude those who are not elite from participating if they so choose.

I have the right to invite whoever I want to my group, and so do you for your group. In this scenario, it does not matter at all.

Yeah, because your group of 5 and/or my group of 5 cancels out the remaining 80-100 players with varying skill levels and motivations.

Did you even read the 2nd sentence in my response?

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

Elite content is for elite people. But being an Elite means to protect and guide those who aren’t.

With great power comes great responsibility.

Elite by definition implies exclusivity. You’re asking for difficult content that is accessible to everyone, or for players to carry everyone around them whether they want to or not. That’s not what elite content is.

It’s not elite if it’s not exclusive and doable by people that aren’t skilled enough to do it.

Which is exactly why many server’s aren’t able to do it. There are a lot of people who don’t know how to do it, thus will not succeed. Thus it’s exclusive. Thus it’s Elite. In a roundabout way, you just proved my point.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

Elite content is for elite people. But being an Elite means to protect and guide those who aren’t.

With great power comes great responsibility.

Elite by definition implies exclusivity. You’re asking for difficult content that is accessible to everyone, or for players to carry everyone around them whether they want to or not. That’s not what elite content is.

It’s not elite if it’s not exclusive and doable by people that aren’t skilled enough to do it.

Which is exactly why many server’s aren’t able to do it. There are a lot of people who don’t know how to do it, thus will not succeed. Thus it’s exclusive. Thus it’s Elite. In a roundabout way, you just proved my point.

It’s not elite when people can guest over to black gate, lock people out of their own server, and AFK for the fight. I know several people who’ve done this already.

No. If you think this is elite content, then you have no idea wth you are talking about.

My biggest issue with the content is not the content itself. OK,I think it still needs a little tuning to be challenging yet accessible, but my real issue is more with certain elements o the community and their reaction to players after a day or so of it being out.

The armchair generals are out in force, insulting, dispensing expert advice in a very patronising manner, usually coupled with expletives or telling large swathes of people they clearly have special educational needs.

This is a lower level levelling zone. There are still people coming through their who are perhaps new t the game, the mechanics, the encounter and the zone itself. Why should they be attacked for not knowing what is happening? Co-ordinating so many experienced players is bad enough, but to do that with people who need some help to understand what is going on is a challenge, and some people tend to take their frustrations out on the so-called bads.

Not to mention that some people on lower-end computers may struggle with so many things going on.

I hope they keep the difficulty as it is for now, as a sort of uber-challenge, but once the intial buzz has faded, gradually reduce to numbers and difficulty a little to create a challenging yet accessible encounter.

TurtleDragon.3108:

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

And yet you have no ability or right to exclude those who are not elite from participating if they so choose.

I have the right to invite whoever I want to my group, and so do you for your group. In this scenario, it does not matter at all.

Yeah, because your group of 5 and/or my group of 5 cancels out the remaining 80-100 players with varying skill levels and motivations.

Did you even read the 2nd sentence in my response?

Sure did. Was making sure you understood my original point.

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

And yet you have no ability or right to exclude those who are not elite from participating if they so choose.

I have the right to invite whoever I want to my group, and so do you for your group. In this scenario, it does not matter at all.

Yeah, because your group of 5 and/or my group of 5 cancels out the remaining 80-100 players with varying skill levels and motivations.

Did you even read the 2nd sentence in my response?

Sure did. Was making sure you understood my original point.

I don’t think you understood mine then. You responded to my group exclusion comments IN INSTANCED CONTENT with an OPEN WORLD EXAMPLE. Of course 5 players can’t compensate for the other 95 players in a zerg.

No matter what the group size is (5, 10, whatever), I want to decide who joins my group.

TurtleDragon.3108:

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

CalvinHobbes.3541:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

And yet you have no ability or right to exclude those who are not elite from participating if they so choose.

I have the right to invite whoever I want to my group, and so do you for your group. In this scenario, it does not matter at all.

Yeah, because your group of 5 and/or my group of 5 cancels out the remaining 80-100 players with varying skill levels and motivations.

Did you even read the 2nd sentence in my response?

Sure did. Was making sure you understood my original point.

I don’t think you understood mine then. You responded to my group exclusion comments IN INSTANCED CONTENT with an OPEN WORLD EXAMPLE. Of course 5 players can’t compensate for the other 95 players in a zerg.

No matter what the group size is (5, 10, whatever), I want to decide who joins my group.

Perhaps I didn’t. I thought you were implying that this boss encounter is for elite players only and anyone else need not apply. If that is not the case then the error is mine. I scramble things sometimes which is why the “elite” title will never apply to me.

carabidus.6214:

I do not disagree with any part of this list. Nevertheless, Teq is now raid-caliber content and it does not belong in the open world. Scale this as a 24 man instance and then I’ll congratulate Anet on a job well done. To require uber-gear and tactics for open world content in a level 58 zone is irresponsible. Sorry guys, but all of the QQ is completely justified in this case, and I don’t normally side with the complainers.

I see no problem with obviously difficult content being placed in low or mid level zones. It’s not like the dragon lands in front of the newbie spawn point in the starting area. A new character stumbling into the Maw is likely to die from the whirlwinds or one-shot for being in melee, and that’s level 10. In this area, at level 60ish, I expect a player to be able to kitten the situation and decide to join the fight or avoid it.

This is raid-caliber content, I agree. So is Jormag, Balthazar and Grenth, and so on. But it doesnt belong in an instance just because it is difficult. If I wanted to play a game where everything is neatly tucked away into into seperated instances I would play one of the many games that offer that gameplay. GW2 promised to create open world gameplay – and challenging, hard to win encounters should be a part of that world.

Bubi.7942:

Rebound.3409:

I don’t see what’s elite about being lucky to get on main server and not in an overflow.

What they did is good, i love it…but till they either fix/enlarge or remove the concept of overflows this is a failed attempt for me.

This event honestly entices me to get an autoclicker and afk on that map. Well thought out system der’

The weak shall fall the strong will survive!

(read: eventually people will who have failed, ot too ‘casual’ will leave the event. After that the dediacated people will remain on your server and will succeed! Mark my words, they WILL succeed!)

And after those guys succeed, then what?

Are they going to try it on a daily basis? Are the people who were deemed “to casual”?

So you had your fun, you had your challenge. You rose upto it, and beat it. Congratulations. The elites already beat it, the casuals cant, and the reward is to kitten to bother with the frustration.
And now whats going to happen to Tequatl?

Either it ends up getting a massive nerf, a massive loot buff, or it simply becomes a forgotten world boss.

rjnemer.7816:

No. If you think this is elite content, then you have no idea wth you are talking about.

Tequatl would like to have a word with you.

Mastruq.2463:

carabidus.6214:

I do not disagree with any part of this list. Nevertheless, Teq is now raid-caliber content and it does not belong in the open world. Scale this as a 24 man instance and then I’ll congratulate Anet on a job well done. To require uber-gear and tactics for open world content in a level 58 zone is irresponsible. Sorry guys, but all of the QQ is completely justified in this case, and I don’t normally side with the complainers.

I see no problem with obviously difficult content being placed in low or mid level zones. It’s not like the dragon lands in front of the newbie spawn point in the starting area. A new character stumbling into the Maw is likely to die from the whirlwinds or one-shot for being in melee, and that’s level 10. In this area, at level 60ish, I expect a player to be able to kitten the situation and decide to join the fight or avoid it.

This is raid-caliber content, I agree. So is Jormag, Balthazar and Grenth, and so on. But it doesnt belong in an instance just because it is difficult. If I wanted to play a game where everything is neatly tucked away into into seperated instances I would play one of the many games that offer that gameplay. GW2 promised to create open world gameplay – and challenging, hard to win encounters should be a part of that world.

Problem with the open world is the technical limitation and the random player factor. You are at the mercy of the servers, griefers or new players. Content where one new player who doesn’t know what he can doing can ruin the experience is bad design. Instancing encounters like this give you much more control over the experience without straining your system or the servers.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion. I can just see it now, nothing but mesmers eles guards and wars in this instance all having to show their ascendeds at the door. I came to GW2 from other games SPECIFICALLY to avoid content exclusion. I’ve had enough of it. There is nothing in this game that is out of reach to me. I can join anything I want without being excluded. This is the game they presented and hope they continue to build toward.

This is exactly why Teq is Elite Content in Open World. He’s hard. He requires organization. But he doesn’t prevent anyone from trying. That’s why I mention that while gear is important, we don’t require people to run it, or leave the map.

The ultimate griefing would be if there’s a 100 man raid in an instance, and the Commander kicks the pugs out for guildies to get credit at the end. THAT would kill the game. (Yes I know it happens in FotM and Dungeons, but on a smaller scale)

Being instanced doesn’t prevent people from trying, they can still join a group.

Read the last paragraph in my quoted post.

It doesn’t happen nearly as often as people think it does. There are many things Anet could do to make reporting players that do that easier. A few kittenbags in the community should not influence the way Anet handles content.

That said, Dextra makes a valid point about inclusion. No one is kicked out or prevented from participating, because this is an Open World event. Having to go into an instance means someone has to accept you into the raid group in order to participate.

You could also make your own raid group, or join a guild interested in running these types of content. I am arguing that it should exclude people and be tuned appropriately. Elite content shouldn’t be zergable and you should have control over people who decide to contribute as little as possible.

Then you put the power of the content in the hands of a select few players who can weed out people who aren’t geared to their liking, or kick out people they don’t like.

Should everyone be geared the best for this content? Heck yeah. But should someone dictate who can participate or not? Nooooooooo.

Elite content for elite people.

Elite content is for elite people. But being an Elite means to protect and guide those who aren’t.

With great power comes great responsibility.

Elite by definition implies exclusivity. You’re asking for difficult content that is accessible to everyone, or for players to carry everyone around them whether they want to or not. That’s not what elite content is.

It’s not elite if it’s not exclusive and doable by people that aren’t skilled enough to do it.

Which is exactly why many server’s aren’t able to do it. There are a lot of people who don’t know how to do it, thus will not succeed. Thus it’s exclusive. Thus it’s Elite. In a roundabout way, you just proved my point.

Only in the same way as nobility is “elite”. You are born that way (or you happen to be on a server) and no matter how bad you are, you are priviliged to live in a better environment. Whereas if you are born as a commoner (or a more casual, lower populated server) you can be as talented of a leader or as skilled as anyone else, you are doomed from the get go.

Overflow servers contain people from multiple servers, correct?

How are these people supposed to “hop on mumble” and organize within 15 minutes? This is where I see a huge gap between home servers and overflows with this event.

Science.6709:

Overflow servers contain people from multiple servers, correct?

How are these people supposed to “hop on mumble” and organize within 15 minutes? This is where I see a huge gap between home servers and overflows with this event.

Pretty much this, one of Anets big things has always been no third party programs, now they design a game without any built in voice communications (and rickety guild/chat system at that) then top it with content that literally REQUIRES either a third party program or built voice comm.

Personally I love the fight and the mechanics of it, i’ve done it 6 times now, the last 3 times I didnt die, the waves are great, taco’s attacks are amazing, its just literally impossible to coordinate enough on an overflow server with 100 random people of random languages from random other servers with random gear and random experience, see where thats leading? If you land on an overflow, you will fail, there is no try, there is only fail.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

rjnemer.7816:

No. If you think this is elite content, then you have no idea wth you are talking about.

Tequatl would like to have a word with you.

Nope, teqault only wants to talk to the casuals who only know how to spam 1. If it was instanced and you could pick 100 good players to do it with he could be beaten in masterwork gear.

The problem is the majority of the population has only been trained in spamming 1 in zergs. So alas, he is hard but only because the baddies are bringing you down

Shemsu.8721:

Science.6709:

Overflow servers contain people from multiple servers, correct?

How are these people supposed to “hop on mumble” and organize within 15 minutes? This is where I see a huge gap between home servers and overflows with this event.

Pretty much this, one of Anets big things has always been no third party programs, now they design a game without any built in voice communications (and rickety guild/chat system at that) then top it with content that literally REQUIRES either a third party program or built voice comm.

Just a side bar here. You’re misunderstanding the policy. The 3rd Party programs part of the User Agreement does not apply to programs that do not directly interact with the game. Voice comms run in the background of your OS, not as a part of the game. You can find this under section 8, part e-i of the User Agreement: “any service that interacts with the Software”. Things like zoom hacks, macros, bots, etc. are things that count towards the 3rd Party clause. If we went by what you just said, no one would be able to play GW2 with an Anti-virus prog running, or a firewall, or even Windows.

There is absolutely nothing “elite” about zergs stacking on commander icons to beat a boss. It isn’t elite in WvW when it’s used to death there and it isn’t elite in PvE. It’s a tactic that I wish would simply go away and become unfeasible in every area of the game. It’s counter-intuitive, boring, and goes against the entire combat system in this game, which puts emphasis on movement. “Let’s all stand closely together to avoid massive AoE damage!” Um, ok. But since the entire tactic was designed around a targeting limitation, I highly doubt it will be going away anytime soon (if ever).

I love that this boss has been given a revamp to actually make him challenging. It needs some more work. That doesn’t mean it needs a nerf. It just means it needs more work. Far too much emphasis is placed on the 6 people manning the turrets. Either make the turrets do more damage or include other ways to remove the poison clouds and stacks of Hardened Scales. Make the event harder without the use of the turrets to encourage their use if necessary. Just do something to make it possible to beat if you end up with really poor players on the turrets that don’t know what they’re doing. As it stands, this event is far too easy to grief, either intentionally or unintentionally. Regardless of whether it’s “elite content,” this is a serious design problem in a game that encourages cooperation and teamwork.

Dextra.8162:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

TurtleDragon.3108:

Elite content should be instanced, not open world.

World events = Open world.

Elite World events = still open world

And im saying the 2nd one shouldn’t exist. Elite content belongs in an instance where you have control over who you bring and the content is not leechable, gated by overflows or having immense server lag with 100+ ppl.

And then GW2 will become like every other MMO with class/build/guild exclusion.

This event is already like that. Must be done with the right guilds, levels, classes and gear. And preferably with as much of random casuals excluded as possible.
Look at Smooth Penguin, one of the most vocal promoters of “green gear is okay for everything, why are you worrying about ascended, gear doesn’t matter” ideology. He’s clearly saying, that yes, you can run any gear you want – but if you want to succeed, you’d better go with BiS.

Better if such type of behavious happened in an instance, than in open world area where unrelated people have every right to be present. Of course, such behaviour not happening at all would be best, but it seems that “for the good of community” we must divide that community first. For some reason.

Tequatl and all of his boss-brethren needed an update badly.
Standing around spamming 1 was terrible design.
I love his new mechanics. Jumping the waves is amazingly fun. The turrets being essential is great. Requiring players to both attack and defend is fantastic.

That said, this is too hard for open-world content. Even if this was Zhaitan himself, no open-world content should be designed that a ‘regular’ group of players can’t complete it given some effort. That means that Tequatl should be able to be beaten by a group of 30~ lvl 65~ players in green~ lvl 65~ gear.

This dragon as is would be amazing in an instance. He puts Zhaitan to shame.
However in the open world, it just doesn’t fit the game that ArenaNet said they were making, and even as a player who enjoys challenging content (SAB Trib Mode, Liadri <3), I doubt I’ll continue to pursue this as-is.

JNetRocks.3652:

Tequatl and all of his boss-brethren needed an update badly.
Standing around spamming 1 was terrible design.
I love his new mechanics. Jumping the waves is amazingly fun. The turrets being essential is great. Requiring players to both attack and defend is fantastic.

That said, this is too hard for open-world content. Even if this was Zhaitan himself, no open-world content should be designed that a ‘regular’ group of players can’t complete it given some effort. That means that Tequatl should be able to be beaten by a group of 30~ lvl 65~ players in green~ lvl 65~ gear.

This dragon as is would be amazing in an instance. He puts Zhaitan to shame.
However in the open world, it just doesn’t fit the game that ArenaNet said they were making, and even as a player who enjoys challenging content (SAB Trib Mode, Liadri <3), I doubt I’ll continue to pursue this as-is.

If it would only take 30 people to kill Teq, then it’s no longer an Elite Boss fight. At that point, you just made “Easy Mode” Tequatl. You might as well ask for the old Teq back, where you just stand under him and spam “1”.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

If it would only take 30 people to kill Teq, then it’s no longer an Elite Boss fight. At that point, you just made “Easy Mode” Tequatl. You might as well ask for the old Teq back, where you just stand under him and spam “1”.

Yeah, having a higher player requirement than 30 makes sense for a world boss like Tequatl. But if 60 players show up, then they shouldn’t fail simply for needing at least 130+ players. So I can see both sides to this. It should scale based on the number of players that are there, but it shouldn’t be so easy that a small band of players can easily take him down.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

JNetRocks.3652:

Tequatl and all of his boss-brethren needed an update badly.
Standing around spamming 1 was terrible design.
I love his new mechanics. Jumping the waves is amazingly fun. The turrets being essential is great. Requiring players to both attack and defend is fantastic.

That said, this is too hard for open-world content. Even if this was Zhaitan himself, no open-world content should be designed that a ‘regular’ group of players can’t complete it given some effort. That means that Tequatl should be able to be beaten by a group of 30~ lvl 65~ players in green~ lvl 65~ gear.

This dragon as is would be amazing in an instance. He puts Zhaitan to shame.
However in the open world, it just doesn’t fit the game that ArenaNet said they were making, and even as a player who enjoys challenging content (SAB Trib Mode, Liadri <3), I doubt I’ll continue to pursue this as-is.

If it would only take 30 people to kill Teq, then it’s no longer an Elite Boss fight. At that point, you just made “Easy Mode” Tequatl. You might as well ask for the old Teq back, where you just stand under him and spam “1”.

Clearly “hard mode” bosses in your book are just stationary foes with 2 attacks and a MASSIVE health pool. No other way to make a boss fun/“elite”(such a stupid saying) right? This ISN’T HARD, why can noone get that through their thick skulls, all it takes is a HUGE group in a precise location SPAMMING 1 just like how you say you don’t want bosses to be. So plz kitten and sit down.

SmoothPenguin:

No, not really. More numbers does not necessarily make the fight harder or easier. Liadri was a very challenging solo fight. Lupi is a very challenging solo (or group) fight.

Tequatl, like any open-world boss, should scale with the number of players present and shouldn’t require more than 30 as a starting point. That doesn’t mean they can’t keep the same mechanics.

sirflamesword.3896:

Clearly “hard mode” bosses in your book are just stationary foes with 2 attacks and a MASSIVE health pool. No other way to make a boss fun/“elite”(such a stupid saying) right? This ISN’T HARD, why can noone get that through their thick skulls, all it takes is a HUGE group in a precise location SPAMMING 1 just like how you say you don’t want bosses to be. So plz kitten and sit down.

Clearly you are missing the point that Penguin was making. Whether Tequatl is a simple stationary boss with limited attacks is irrelevant to the minimum player requirement.

I think more than 30 players is a reasonable requirement for a world boss, which was the point that Penguin was making I think. And I agree with him. But I disagree that the minimum player requirement should be as high as it is now. 130+ players is a bit much. Hell, 80+ is already a lot.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

sirflamesword.3896:

Clearly “hard mode” bosses in your book are just stationary foes with 2 attacks and a MASSIVE health pool. No other way to make a boss fun/“elite”(such a stupid saying) right? This ISN’T HARD, why can noone get that through their thick skulls, all it takes is a HUGE group in a precise location SPAMMING 1 just like how you say you don’t want bosses to be. So plz kitten and sit down.

Clearly you are missing the point that Penguin was making. Whether Tequatl is a simple stationary boss with limited attacks is irrelevant to the minimum player requirement.

I think more than 30 players is a reasonable requirement for a world boss, which was the point that Penguin was making I think. And I agree with him. But I disagree that the minimum player requirement should be as high as it is now. 130+ players is a bit much. Hell, 80+ is already a lot.

I’ll agree with you that 30 is too low, and that 130+ is too high. I’m more against the rest of his posts, basically I think his opinion is crap.

Hey Malafide. I went to one of your Horrorween events in GW1. Good times!

I agree. Stationary/limited attacks is irrelevant. The mechanics are solid for this dragon fight. He is much more challenging and interesting. However, I still believe that open-world content should be designed that a group of ‘regular’ players should (with effort) be able to defeat it.