"Developers expect more Conjure ele"

"Developers expect more Conjure ele"

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Posted by: Knighthonor.4061

Knighthonor.4061

I heard this form somebody in the game. can somebody explain?

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Posted by: Bluefox.9580

Bluefox.9580

Sounds like they didn’t finish their line. “Developers expect more Conjure eles to spiral down the drain” is likely more accurate until we have more information and see one hell of a buff to the entire line after the statement of nerfing the only ones used.

Bluefox Matari – Elementalist – Maguuma

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Posted by: Provost.6210

Provost.6210

Sounds like they didn’t finish their line. “Developers expect more Conjure eles to spiral down the drain” is likely more accurate until we have more information and see one hell of a buff to the entire line after the statement of nerfing the only ones used.

Pretty much this.

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Posted by: rabidsmiles.5926

rabidsmiles.5926

Dunno how they expect people to use conjures if they are going to nerf them into the ground. Gonna miss my ice bow

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Posted by: OreoWolf.3157

OreoWolf.3157

At least we still have Flame Axe… Right?… RIGHT?!

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Posted by: Iris Ng.9845

Iris Ng.9845

At least we still have Flame Axe… Right?… RIGHT?!

Lol. Go back to your earth shield and leave my axe alone.

“Raids are like fortune cookies. You eat the cookie and then read the paper scraps.”

- doranduck, 2016 on Lore in Raids

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Posted by: robertul.3679

robertul.3679

Well lets think this through. A long time ago, eles has icebow, fgs, lightning hammer as strong conjures with flame axe borderline useful(at least fire field, blast finisher) and earth shield almost useless except nieche situations.
Then they nerfed fgs. They said they will nerf lightning hammer and icebow.
Soon ele will have 0 useful conjures.
Conjures were already pretty bad in pvp/wvw. Now they are utterly useless.

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Posted by: Vissarion.6509

Vissarion.6509

Add that they dont have any support through traits (except ofc the 10more stacks, meh).

They called us TEMPESTs, but we can use our elite to cheat death instead

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Posted by: Zelyhn Lekovitch.2867

Zelyhn Lekovitch.2867

I never understood why they insist on giving conjures charges and limited time when we only use them for one skill then ditch them (ok maybe not LH).

Zelyhn.8069 [rT]
Retired elementalist theorycrafter

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Posted by: Aerathnor.8305

Aerathnor.8305

I never understood why they insist on giving conjures charges and limited time when we only use them for one skill then ditch them (ok maybe not LH).

Hey, I use 3 skills on my frost bow before tossing it (3,4, and 5) and I generally use my FGS until it wears off as it is simply a mobility cd I use to run from zergs or get across the map quickly :p

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Posted by: rotten.9753

rotten.9753

I never understood why they insist on giving conjures charges and limited time when we only use them for one skill then ditch them (ok maybe not LH).

Because with great power comes great responsibility.

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Posted by: scerevisiae.1972

scerevisiae.1972

No , your friend is mistaken. conjures (and conjure traits) have been buffed more than any other skill in the game, and they’re still widely regarded as crap outside of PVE.

The mechanics are just too clunky and giving up 20 skills plus a utility slot just to get 5 mediocre skills is a terrible, terrible tradeoff.

downed state is bad for PVP

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Posted by: Kaleban.9834

Kaleban.9834

The quote is incomplete.

The full line is: “Developers expect more Conjure Ele to commit seppuku. All 5 of the new sword skills insta gib the user.”

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Posted by: lLobo.7960

lLobo.7960

If they could change the conjurer trait to improve charges and stats of conjure weapons.
And then made Air Line half decent.
Conjure Ele could be a good option for pve (fire/air/water) with all the dmg boosts and camping water for maximum dmg modifiers (10% against burning, 20% against CCed, 20% against low hp, 20% against foes with vulnerability, 10% if you are above 90%hp…) so LH might still be viable.

Would be nice to see some of proposed changes as they could open room for other conjure eles…

Might-stacking with flame axe when fire fields are not viable. (If flame axe bounced and give might for every hit, like rangers axe)

Tank ele camping earth and use flame axe for might stacks and burn.
Tank ele using LH for dmg…

Earth shield… no idea
If Pyromancer Puissance worked with skills (not spells) camping fire and using earth shield could be viable for a condi build based on bleeds and burn… maybe?

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Posted by: Sleepcoma.9487

Sleepcoma.9487

Remember at launch when everyone laughed about how terrible conjured weaps were? Maybe we’re going full circle and will get our awesome Ride the Lightning functionality back.

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Posted by: jingkangtan.6752

jingkangtan.6752

long ago the 4 conjured weapons lived together in harmony. then everything changed when arenanet attacked.

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Posted by: Xillllix.3485

Xillllix.3485

A class that relies on boons just to stay alive using conjure weapons that do not even integrate with the class mechanics and doesn’t give any protection boons…
Tell me how that’s going to work.

Unless they buff the damage by like 200%-300% the risk will never be worth it.

RIght now conjure weapons for ele are:
Ice bow: press 4 and discard in PvE or zerg farming
Fiery Greatsword: press 3 to run back to your group or run away

Every other conjure weapon is completely useless, instead of being generally useless.

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Posted by: Pepsi.8907

Pepsi.8907

Don’t forget ice bow five and 2 and fgs 4

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Posted by: BlackBeard.2873

BlackBeard.2873

You can use earth shield in Mai Trin if your group has no warrior to stand on the other side of the room and block her teleport.

I know its grasping at straws, but….

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Posted by: Yelloweyedemon.2860

Yelloweyedemon.2860

I heard this form somebody in the game

You heard it from some random dude on the internet. It’s true. Don’t even question it. Trust me!

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Posted by: Xillllix.3485

Xillllix.3485

Don’t forget ice bow five and 2 and fgs 4

Or you can just drop it and use a skill that does more damage, like water auto-attack on staff.

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Posted by: Sirbeaumerdier.3740

Sirbeaumerdier.3740

How can they expect eles to go for conjures when almost all other options are better and they keep nerfing what was barely used save for some specific context?

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Posted by: PlatinumMember.5274

PlatinumMember.5274

I heard this form somebody in the game

You heard it from some random dude on the internet. It’s true. Don’t even question it. Trust me!

Making up stuff is part of his M.O so is creating lot of unnecessary threads with.

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Posted by: Palindrome.8904

Palindrome.8904

They said they are toning down some aspects of LH and FB that they see as too cheesy (using FB for the AoE and ditching it), but they said they are looking to improve other conjures to be… possibly useful.

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Posted by: BlackBeard.2873

BlackBeard.2873

They said they are toning down some aspects of LH and FB that they see as too cheesy (using FB for the AoE and ditching it), but they said they are looking to improve other conjures to be… possibly useful.

The reason this causes such a big stink for eles is:
1. LH is in NO WAY cheesy. It actually takes a decent amount of skill to play within the constraints of the conjure system. It is probably the most balanced conjure b/c it has a niche use in pve that is more than just “use 1 skill then drop it”

2. The way they “fixed” conjures in the past, like FGS, resulted in complete deletion of its ability to do decent damage. They were promised damage on the primary hit of the 4 skill, which was never received.

3. They have NO IDEA what makes a conjure “good.” Icebow is used precisely because it has 1-2 OP skills (way better than weapon skills), making it worth giving up extremely valuable utility slots. Lightning hammer likewise has a very strong auto-attack, making it powerful in the right setup to make up for scepter’s abysmal sustained damage. If all of the skills on a conjure don’t really do anything special, there is NO REASON to take them (see: flame axe).

4. They are hampered by long cast times (see: earth shield) on top of regular weapon-skills, preventing them from being used like an engineer kit with hella long CD. The short CD is part of the reason Icebow is taken (1/4s doesn’t hurt too much).

5. The charge system is incredibly dumb. In situations where the conjure can be used like a primary weapon (like Lightning hammer), it makes the ability unusable without a trait. In every other situation, you will have to drop the conjure before 15 skill uses b/c it is locking you out of all your other weapon skills.

In the end, the ele already has access to plenty of versatility in weapon skills. Conjures need to do something very special that weapon-skills can’t. Combined with past conjure nerfs, and the general ineptitude in balancing class, most eles realize that they are killing yet another utility type (we already only have like 5 USABLE utilities to start).

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Posted by: Pepsi.8907

Pepsi.8907

Don’t forget ice bow five and 2 and fgs 4

Or you can just drop it and use a skill that does more damage, like water auto-attack on staff.

Yeah but those conjures though!!
Went with a friend in hot join with no weapon and only conjure
It was awesome until people arrived of course

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Posted by: PlatinumMember.5274

PlatinumMember.5274

How to improve conjure just slightly remove charge, combine all into one weapon to allow attainment change, profit.

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Posted by: Sirendor.1394

Sirendor.1394

Eh? They plan on nerfing all the other specs so they become as bad as conjures? If not, I doubt anyone will run conjures unless they buff them up, and not just a little, but a lot.

Gandara – Vabbi – Ring of Fire – Fissure of Woe – Vabbi
SPvP as Standalone All is Vain

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Posted by: Pepsi.8907

Pepsi.8907

How to improve conjure just slightly remove charge, combine all into one weapon to allow attainment change, profit.

I’d actually see that as an elite if buffed properly
Remove all conjure
mix them up into one elite
?
profit!!

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Posted by: PlatinumMember.5274

PlatinumMember.5274

Or do to conjures what they did to tomes. It is funny arena net is willing to change tomes function for a class that needs no help but not for ele. Not cool

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Posted by: Provost.6210

Provost.6210

Or do to conjures what they did to tomes. It is funny arena net is willing to change tomes function for a class that needs no help but not for ele. Not cool

Welcome to ArenaNet, where they could buff every other class and still nerf the elementalist because one managed to take their ranger by surprise once in WvW three months ago.

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Posted by: Azel.4786

Azel.4786

Or do to conjures what they did to tomes. It is funny arena net is willing to change tomes function for a class that needs no help but not for ele. Not cool

No… I really really hope that ANET listens to the good idea that several ppl have posted already about combining all the conjures – ditching axe though – into a single elite skill. that would be the best course of action and what needs to be done.

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Posted by: GreyWraith.8394

GreyWraith.8394

No , your friend is mistaken. conjures (and conjure traits) have been buffed more than any other skill in the game, and they’re still widely regarded as crap outside of PVE.

The mechanics are just too clunky and giving up 20 skills plus a utility slot just to get 5 mediocre skills is a terrible, terrible tradeoff.

This is why I’m not a fan of conjures/transforms in general from a design standpoint. The way they lock you out of so many other skills is just punishing.

End of the Dream by Evanescence
unofficial theme song of the Nightmare Court

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Posted by: GreyWraith.8394

GreyWraith.8394

Or do to conjures what they did to tomes. It is funny arena net is willing to change tomes function for a class that needs no help but not for ele. Not cool

Or let them work more like kits.

End of the Dream by Evanescence
unofficial theme song of the Nightmare Court

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Posted by: BlackBeard.2873

BlackBeard.2873

Or do to conjures what they did to tomes. It is funny arena net is willing to change tomes function for a class that needs no help but not for ele. Not cool

Or let them work more like kits.

The more I think about it, this is really the only way to make them work how Anet wants them to. If you have to pay a cast-time penalty to get a conjure, and only have access to the conjure for a very short period with long increments in-between (after dropping it b/c you can’t camp 1 skillset), it will only ever see use if it has 1-2 OP skills then dropped. If all the skills are going to be on-par with weapon skills, the conjures must be instant-cast and be available much more frequently (maximum of 20s CD, probably none). Even then, the conjure has to give skills not available to (i.e. stronger than) a base weapon-set as nobody is going to sacrifice a valuable utility slot to do more of the same garbage.

(edited by BlackBeard.2873)

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Posted by: Juclesia Elcritian.8410

Juclesia Elcritian.8410

I hate conjure weapons. I hope the ele specialization doesn’t focus on them. They’re just bad for reasons already stated:
• preventing access to 15 other skills
• only have 1-2 useful skills and then being dropped
• extremely long cooldowns

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Posted by: Markin.9167

Markin.9167

LOL

They nerfed the FGS

Will nerfe the hammer and the icebow

How can they expect more Conjure ele!!

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Posted by: BlackBeard.2873

BlackBeard.2873

LOL

They nerfed the FGS

Will nerfe the hammer and the icebow

How can they expect more Conjure ele!!

By nerfing everything else so that conjures are better by comparison!! A little sarcastic, but that is the kind of balance logic generally applied to eles.

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Posted by: Elorna.5329

Elorna.5329

Conjures are probably getting nerfed because of two reasons, the first being the obvious strength of IB 4 and 5, and second because they might get added as a utility skill category for one of the other elite specializations. On a related note, LH shouldn’t be nerfed tbh, since that’s just forcing the already boring staff build as the only real PvE build, scepter gets shafted.

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