Guild Wars 2

The Engi was the first class I rolled. I recently leveled it to 80, but ever since my earliest levels I’ve felt like this class had been added as an afterthought by Arenanet.

Let’s do an analysis of the class, shall we? If you just want to see my suggestions for improvements to the engi, go to the next post.

Skill Types

Engineers have a unique skill types, like all the other professions.
-Elixirs, which are like magic potions, grant boons or other positive effects
-Turrets are stationary deployables that periodically fire off an effect and can be overcharged to temporarily become more powerful.
-Gadgets are various tools that can be activated
-Kits replace the engineer’s weapon skills

Class Mechanic

Engineers have the toolbelt as their class mechanic. It’s a set of skills, determined by their utility skills, that can be activated using the four profession skill keys.

My problem with this is that the toolbelt in its current state is not anywhere near as useful as Death Shroud for necros, Adrenaline for warriors, or Virtues for guardians. Its simply a set of four extra skills, and quite often those skills don’t synergize with their counterpart on the main skill bar.

Elixirs

These are actually not so bad. Elixir B gives several useful boons, Elixir S lets you shrink yourself, and Elixir R’s toolbelt skill lets you revive a downed ally.

Unfortunately, Arenanet decided to give us a heavy dose of RNG, which is out of place and extremely frustrating in a game which is supposed to be moving away from the problems present in most MMOs. Toss Elixir B (the toolbelt for Elixir B ) doesn’t give a guaranteed boon; instead, it gives a RANDOM BOON from the normal skill. It’s totally useless, because the boons are varied in their application. You might get a useless 1 stack of might, or you could get retaliation when you’re not even getting attacked. Toss Elixir H is even worse.

And worst of all, Elixir X (AN ELITE SKILL) gives us a random elite FROM ANOTHER PROFESSION. So this elite isn’t even unique to our class.

Turrets

Abso-kitten-lutely useless. They’re bugged to hell, they have barely any health, the hitboxes are massive, they do almost no damage, and… I think you get the point. The health of turrets needs to be doubled, and the Metal-Plated Turrets trait needs to give extreme AOE resistance to our turrets.

Gadgets

Mediocre at best. Rocket Boots and Slick Shoes synergize pretty well, but the latter has a huge cooldown that makes this synergy almost worthless, and the skills themselves aren’t great to start with. The others are rarely worth taking in your build.

Kits

The bread and butter of engineers, kits are the only thing that is truly worthwhile with engineers. And then Anet went and slapped them with the nerf bat. There are some things that need tweaking, but the kits are more solid than everything else about Engis.

Downed Skills

Dear god. 1 applies a random condition, so it lacks the damage output to finish off an enemy while down. 2 is an invitation to stomp you. 3 is nice, but not worth the huge warmup.

Traits

Engineer traits are largely a joke. The Alchemy line of traits is fine, but the others need serious work. Our Grandmaster traits especially need help. You know that trait “Adrenal Implant”? It’s a Grandmaster trait in the Tools line.

Well, rangers get that as a minor adept trait.

That’s just insulting.

We were given a minor trait as our grandmaster trait.

We have just as much need for mobility and dodging, if not more, than Rangers. They’re already more mobile than us without Natural Vigor.

I’ll post specific improvements as I get around to them.

Suggested Improvements

Gadgets

Three things.

1. Rocket Kick specifically should be changed to have better synergy with Rocket Boots. Adding a knockdown effect would be better suited and also add more synergy to the gadget skill set, which seems largely control-oriented.
2. Reduce the cooldown of gadgets and their toolbelt skills. They don’t give effects good enough to justify their current cooldowns, and reducing them would make gadgets a more fun and viable skill set. For example, Slick Shoes has a cooldown of 60 seconds, which is ridiculous.
3. More gadget traits in the Tools line. Scope in particular could be replaced, as it only really helps the Rifle auto attack and has a negligible effect.

Turrets

Turrets just need lots of love in general.

1. Increase the health of all turrets by at least 50%.
2. Add a trait, “Blast Shield”, that reduces AOE damage to turrets by 50% and AOE damage to the player by 10%. It could be under explosives or inventions. AOE would be defined as “creates a red circle on the ground” or “is targeted with a green circle”.
3. FIX TURRET SCALING. I don’t know if it’s a bug, but turrets don’t scale with the stats of the player. For instance, power doesn’t make them do more damage and toughness doesn’t make them tougher.
4. MORE TURRET TRAITS. My suggestion is a new trait “Mechanical Attunement”, which increases the toughness of you and your turrets for each turret you have deployed, up to a maximum of four. This could replace “Rifled Turret Barrels”.

Kits

Flamethrower: First, switch Smoke Vent to slot 4 for consistency. It has a lower cooldown than Napalm. Also increase the radius slightly and add a smoke combo field to it. The lack of a combo field seems like an oversight.
Elixir Gun: Acidic Elixirs and HGH don’t apply to elixir gun skills, which is probably an oversight. The last two skills and the toolbelt are marked as elixirs.

Elites

Mortar: This needs a lot of work. Seriously increase the health. This is an elite, and it’s just as squishy as normal turrets. Also increase the base range to at least 1800. A mortar should have longer range than grenades, and the fact that it doesn’t makes using it pointless. I’m also pretty sure that the Elite Supplies trait is bugged and doesn’t apply to mortars at the moment.
Elixir X: Totally revamp it. Turn it into a mega-elixir, instead of a random elite from another class. It could even have some RNG if ANet really wants that. How about Stability, 5 stacks of might, and 3 three other random boons? All of them would last for 15 seconds by default. Elixir X also has an issue. The duration from Elite Supplies doesn’t stack with Potent Elixirs, which is another oversight, I would assume.

Downed Skills

The worst downed skills of any profession. As I said in the first post, 1 is more RNG, and doesn’t provide the crucial damage needed for a rally. 2 invites players to stomp you. 3 has such a long warmup and cooldown for such a medicore effect. The other classes can all escape or heal while downed. Engineers can’t. We need to change that, or give them something unique.

A suggestion I saw was that the 3 skill be moved to the 2 slot (with the same warmup and cooldown as the current 2 skill), and the 3 skill be replaced with “Break Elixir”, which grants rapid regeneration, or stealths and teleports you.

Traits

There are flaws with many traits and the trait trees. Many lack synergy or aren’t worth the points put into them.

Acidic Elixirs (Explosives Major Adept I): Change the boon removal effect to the conversion of a random boon to a condition, like the reverse of Toss Elixir C.
Exploit Weakness: (Explosives Major Adept VI): This is just a bad trait. Replace it with something useful.
Short Fuse (Explosives Major Master VIII): Make it apply to mines as well.
Accelerant-Packed Turrets (Explosives Major Master IX): Add bonus damage to turret explosions.
Coated Bullets (Firearms Major Master VII): Add 10% bonus damage for Pistols.
Target the Maimed (Firearms Minor Grandmaster): Make it also apply to targets with Weakness, Crippled, or Vulnerability.
Stabilized Armor (Inventions Major Adept IV): Change the effects. Make it apply Stability for 3 seconds when the user recovers from being disabled, with a cooldown of 30 seconds. Essentially it’s an anti-stunlock trait with these changes.
Cloaking Device (Inventions Major Adept VI): Reduce the cooldown to 20s and make it also work when crippled or chilled.
Power Shoes (Inventions Major Master VIII): Make it provide a 25% speed boost at all times (unless engineers receive a better source of speed, we need something like this). You could also swap it with Rifled Turret Barrels (a Grandmaster trait), which would really be better suited as a Master trait.
Autotool Installation (Inventions Major Master X): Speed up the rate of repair.

I remember sometime ago, a developer told our comunity about a revamp project about elixiers.
They wanted to get rid of the rng of elixiers.They started with toss elixier U removing the stealth chance.
Then they forgot about that project :P.
I don’t know if anyone is able to find that developer’s thread.
About kits , elixier gun , flamethrower can get some improvements in my opinion.
About gadgets…i really don’t find any use for them apart rocket boots to jump here and there , i would never use another gadget considering i can equip a kit+elixier S.
Turrets….mmmhh…..just lol.
Double lol , if i think they made an update focused on turrets to make them finally viable .
That said, i still have fun with my engie…even if from 1 month i lose every 1 vs 1 when i meet a skilled enemy.But i think it’s just me and my bad month.

All those things are wrong with us but we still perform great. This tells me that there is something missing from the thread.

VIVorcha.7853:

You know that trait “Adrenal Implant”? It’s a Grandmaster trait in the Tools line.

Well, rangers get that as a minor adept trait.

That’s just insulting.

We were given a minor trait as our grandmaster trait.

Making these kinds of comparisons in a vacuum is really not very informative, and borders on deceptive. Are you really trying to claim that rangers have a massive and obvious advantage over engineers?

As a good counterpoint, the engineer adept trait Incendiary Powder is an exact copy of a necromancer grandmaster trait. Who’s being insulted now?

Basically, there are hundreds of differences between any two professions in the game. Cherrypicking one specific comparison that puts your favorite character at a disadvantage and acting as if everything else was equal is reductive and silly.

Stice.5204:

VIVorcha.7853:

You know that trait “Adrenal Implant”? It’s a Grandmaster trait in the Tools line.

Well, rangers get that as a minor adept trait.

That’s just insulting.

We were given a minor trait as our grandmaster trait.

Making these kinds of comparisons in a vacuum is really not very informative, and borders on deceptive. Are you really trying to claim that rangers have a massive and obvious advantage over engineers?

As a good counterpoint, the engineer adept trait Incendiary Powder is an exact copy of a necromancer grandmaster trait. Who’s being insulted now?

Basically, there are hundreds of differences between any two professions in the game. Cherrypicking one specific comparison that puts your favorite character at a disadvantage and acting as if everything else was equal is reductive and silly.

In fact, every class has a massive advantage over the engineer.

No other class has such useless trait trees and such a subpar class mechanic.

You can paint a class as “requiring more skill to play” but the difficulty of use and the effectiveness are in no way related. Turrets are useless, gadgets are underpowered, elixirs are an RNG fest, most of our elites suck, and the downed skills invite people to stomp you.

Our effectiveness is great. So how can engineers be so good with so many disadvantages?

VIVorcha.7853:

In fact, every class has a massive advantage over the engineer.

This is a pretty bold claim to be making when the only evidence you have is a few cherry-picked examples of bad traits and underpowered utility skills. Do you actually have any statistical evidence, like representative breakdowns from sPvP tournaments or high-level fractals or something?

So engineers suck because nobody wants to use turrets or most of the gadgets? Guardians don’t use spirit weapons. Rangers don’t use their shouts. Necromancers don’t use their blood magic trait line. Mesmers rarely use signets or mantras. Every profession has a bunch of underpowererd traits nobody in their right mind ever slots.

If you want to ask for general buffs to turrets and gadgets and the useless traits, go ahead, but you’re not going to convince many people that the entire profession is at a “massive disadvantage.” The engineer has about as many competitive builds as every other class and is decently well represented in every area of the game by players using those builds.

We have builds that work, of that there is no denaying. My personal issue with the engineer is that I cant use a build that focuses on what I consider to be engineer skills, like turrets and gadgets. The only effective builds revolve around using magic potions and militarty weapon kits. Things I dont feel should have ever been added to the engineer.

Now when I say I cant use them I dont mean there “not viable” which has come to mean “Not as good as our best build”. I mean cant use in that my turrets spend more time on cooldown than out.

I really hope we get a bug fix and balance patch that breaths new life into turrets, but iv played enough mmos to know thats not going to happen.

Fellow Engineers, don’t give up!

I love this class. It’s DIFFERENT. It’s not your standard Sword and Sorcery Profession that we see all across this game.

We ARE effective. Though we may have some mechanics issues with the class that could use some improvement, I’ve seen some Engineers really hold their own.

As for builds, get creative! Try everything! I have really good success with a Rifle/Accelerant Packed Turrets/Tool Kit/Supply Crate build in both sPvP and WvW. There are others out there who play this class and make us all look “OP”, hahaha. I’ve personally had several /whispers from folks saying some nasty things because I won the match, or praise, asking about the Engineer. I’m sure many of you have had the same experience.

We are a mixed bag, capable of such great utility. But again, there is some room for improvement

Regards,

Gearstrip Jones

Stice.5204:

VIVorcha.7853:

In fact, every class has a massive advantage over the engineer.

This is a pretty bold claim to be making when the only evidence you have is a few cherry-picked examples of bad traits and underpowered utility skills. Do you actually have any statistical evidence, like representative breakdowns from sPvP tournaments or high-level fractals or something?

So engineers suck because nobody wants to use turrets or most of the gadgets? Guardians don’t use spirit weapons. Rangers don’t use their shouts. Necromancers don’t use their blood magic trait line. Mesmers rarely use signets or mantras. Every profession has a bunch of underpowererd traits nobody in their right mind ever slots.

If you want to ask for general buffs to turrets and gadgets and the useless traits, go ahead, but you’re not going to convince many people that the entire profession is at a “massive disadvantage.” The engineer has about as many competitive builds as every other class and is decently well represented in every area of the game by players using those builds.

If more than half the profession is undisputedly underpowered, I would consider that a massive disadvantage. Especially when those are the only really defining features of the class.

Also, it’s a huge problem that even more of the skills become useless if not traited. Notably our Toss Elixir skills, which give terrible effects by default and can only be used for anything if you spec for HGH or Cleansing Formula.

A quick look at the elixirs.

Elixir H: Heals, and randomly grants swiftness, protection, or regeneration. The healing is good, but the RNG makes the boon aspect pretty bad. Especially since swiftness is not a direct survivability boon.
-Toss Elixir H: Toss to grant protection, regeneration, or vigor. Again, the RNG. And why is vigor in this one? That’s ALSO not a direct survivability boon. It’s not even that useful if the person doesn’t anticipate it.

Elixir B: Grants fury, might, retaliation, and swiftness. This is a skill I like, but it has really short duration on the swiftness and fury. Pretty good all-in-all, though.
-Toss Elixir B: Randomly grants fury, might, retaliation, or swiftness. Also has a tiny radius. So we have RNG that you can’t even apply over a usefully large area. My huge issue with this one is that the boons are so varied in application that you will often get one you don’t need.

Elixir C: Converts your conditions into boons. It’s a standard condition removal, but since we have this, I don’t see why the Cleansing Formula is available as a trait. It renders this skill useless and actually reduces the positive effects.
-Toss Elixir C: Convert a random condition into a boon for allies. Only one is kind of disappointing, but at least the RNG here makes sense. You have no way to prioritize the conditions.

Elixir R: Drink to refill your endurance. This is pretty straightforward… I kind of like this one, except that it makes me feel inclined to waste dodges just so I have an excuse to use it. That’s not the fault of the skill, though.
-Toss Elixir R: Revives downed allies and cures conditions.This is the only really, REALLY good Toss Elixir skill. You drop it right before you go down to self revive, or you can use it on a teammate. It’s also a condition removal.

Elixir S: Drink to shrink yourself, break stun, and become invulnerable. This is a fun skill, and one of the better ones, in my opinion.
-Toss Elixir S: Make an ally grow and grant them stability, or grant them stealth. This is good until you see the “stealth” part. What? This should have been the engineer’s stability skill. I DON’T WANT RNG.

Elixir U: Gain quickness and a random debuff from another class. RNG again…. AND stealing from another class. If I wanted to have the abilities of another class, I would play that class.
-Toss Elixir U: Creates a random wall that blocks projectiles. I have no problem with the RNG here, because all results have a similar effect.

…and last but not least, the biggest offender.

Elixir X: Become a Tornado (Elementalist elite) or gain Rampage (Warrior elite). Underwater, you become a Whirlpool (Elementalist underwater elite) or a Withering Plague (Necromancer elite). This skill is flawed on so many levels. It combines RNG with stealing from other classes. This isn’t an engineer elite, this is the elite of three other classes, with one randomly given to you. Why would I ever want this? Not that it’s a secret that our elites mostly suck.

Six of these are flawed in serious ways. One of them is an elite. That’s almost half of the elixir skills.

What I am hearing is that people are upset that Elixir X results in an elite from another profession as if that is such a big flaw. I don’t see Elixir X that way and find it odd that it would be considered “broken” because of that. Elixir X is my most reliable access to stability and I use it frequently. Most importantly, engineer can gain access to those other elites MORE EFFICIENTLY than the source professions when traited. Those elites on 84 second cooldown compared with 150-180 seconds? Check.

Elixir X does not suck. I’ve seen engineers break up blobs and scatter the enemy almost entirely solo when used right, done it myself even.

Nice Review VIVorcha, Great job at poiting out the elixir flaws. All but the biggest flaw imo.
And thats; WTF is an engineer doing with magic potions?

Ok my hatred for these thing aside, once you add in the defective turrets and subpar gadgets its starting to lookt pretty bad.

Luckly engineers have weapon kits that are more powerfun than our real weapons. Then sprinking in an elixir or gadget that stun breaks and thats your build.

XelNigma.6315:

Nice Review VIVorcha, Great job at poiting out the elixir flaws. All but the biggest flaw imo.
And thats; WTF is an engineer doing with magic potions?

Ok my hatred for these thing aside, once you add in the defective turrets and subpar gadgets its starting to lookt pretty bad.

Luckly engineers have weapon kits that are more powerfun than our real weapons. Then sprinking in an elixir or gadget that stun breaks and thats your build.

I’ve asked people why engineers have magic potions, and I got told “It’s technology because it’s like chemistry.”

But alchemy isn’t chemistry. Alchemy was people in funny pants who didn’t understand how the universe works.

It’s a game. Where does the engineer stuff that giant ram’s head that pops out even when naked?

Chaba.5410:

It’s a game. Where does the engineer stuff that giant ram’s head that pops out even when naked?

Nerf pants.

Chaba.5410:

What I am hearing is that people are upset that Elixir X results in an elite from another profession as if that is such a big flaw. I don’t see Elixir X that way and find it odd that it would be considered “broken” because of that. Elixir X is my most reliable access to stability and I use it frequently. Most importantly, engineer can gain access to those other elites MORE EFFICIENTLY than the source professions when traited. Those elites on 84 second cooldown compared with 150-180 seconds? Check.

Elixir X does not suck. I’ve seen engineers break up blobs and scatter the enemy almost entirely solo when used right, done it myself even.

QFT

However most players aren’t going to understand this. Elixir X is actually one of the best elites in the game if you use it correctly.

TheGuy.3568:

Chaba.5410:

What I am hearing is that people are upset that Elixir X results in an elite from another profession as if that is such a big flaw. I don’t see Elixir X that way and find it odd that it would be considered “broken” because of that. Elixir X is my most reliable access to stability and I use it frequently. Most importantly, engineer can gain access to those other elites MORE EFFICIENTLY than the source professions when traited. Those elites on 84 second cooldown compared with 150-180 seconds? Check.

Elixir X does not suck. I’ve seen engineers break up blobs and scatter the enemy almost entirely solo when used right, done it myself even.

QFT

However most players aren’t going to understand this. Elixir X is actually one of the best elites in the game if you use it correctly.

Class elites should be unique to the class. If you wanted elites from another class, then go roll that class.

VIVorcha.7853:

TheGuy.3568:

Chaba.5410:

What I am hearing is that people are upset that Elixir X results in an elite from another profession as if that is such a big flaw. I don’t see Elixir X that way and find it odd that it would be considered “broken” because of that. Elixir X is my most reliable access to stability and I use it frequently. Most importantly, engineer can gain access to those other elites MORE EFFICIENTLY than the source professions when traited. Those elites on 84 second cooldown compared with 150-180 seconds? Check.

Elixir X does not suck. I’ve seen engineers break up blobs and scatter the enemy almost entirely solo when used right, done it myself even.

QFT

However most players aren’t going to understand this. Elixir X is actually one of the best elites in the game if you use it correctly.

Class elites should be unique to the class. If you wanted elites from another class, then go roll that class.

That’s a great argument for why for why elixir X is “bad skill”. Because it gives you access to 2 elites on a shorter cd than the the classes that naturally have them. Truly your argument is brilliant. We should give up a great elite because we need to feel “special”. That logic is great. Warriors should kitten about signet of rage it just a better version of elixir B without the retal. Next all traits should be class unique.

BTW I have a fully leveled warrior and ele (my necro is only level 20). I do not use those elites on those classes. I use the other better elites they have access too.

If you do not like it do not use it but do not pretend like because it has a copy function the skill is bad. You have 2 other class unique elites use one of those if elixir X rubs you the wrong way.

three things need to happen to the engineer to bring it back to the PVE balance it had at the beginning of the game:

1: trait redux entirely so that it’s actually an adventurer class with clear skills for dps and burst dps improvements across the board.

2: the restoration of the original condition damage figures that were changed prior to november and prior to their separating the changes between PVE and PVP when attempting to balance the game.

3: if the traits aren’t fixed the only alternative is to make engis a heavy armor soldier class like they were originally thought of before the game launched so that they have enough defense to be viable again without having to stack buffs.

Until they do that engis will continue to be second class in this game in PVE doesn’t matter how many bug fixes they come out with until they fix the PVE figures it’s useless and it doesn’t matter how many times leetists claim the L2P mantra it will still remain true for the class.

It’s literally so noticeable that new players have commented on having stopped playing the class when they’ve reached level 50 because something happens to the damage ratios at that point that makes the class take three times as long to kill anything so they move on to something else.

Why should class elites be unique to that class? Class traits are not necessarily unique to classes so why should elites be? Why would being a non-unique skill make it suck? I fail to see the reasoning. Skills suck when they are useless not whether they are unique. Elixir X has uses, especially if you need reliable access to stability.

And like Kor noted, those classes don’t even necessarily use those elites. Warrior typically uses Signet of Rage or Battle Standard. You’ll be hard-pressed to find a warrior using Rampage.

Chaba.5410:

Why should class elites be unique to that class? Class traits are not necessarily unique to classes so why should elites be? Why would being a non-unique skill make it suck? I fail to see the reasoning. Skills suck when they are useless not whether they are unique. Elixir X has uses, especially if you need reliable access to stability.

And like Kor noted, those classes don’t even necessarily use those elites. Warrior typically uses Signet of Rage or Battle Standard. You’ll be hard-pressed to find a warrior using Rampage.

You’ll also be hard pressed to find an engineer using Elixir X.

Most Engineers use Supply Crate.

Anyway, unpredictability in a game that is supposed to be skill based is a disadvantage. You don’t want to get something you weren’t expecting. That’s not the thing you want in a skill that’s supposed to turn the tide of battle.

Each profession is supposed to be uniquely defined, and making the most powerful skills of a profession copy-pasted is not the way to do that.

VIVorcha.7853:

My problem with this is that the toolbelt in its current state is not anywhere near as useful as Adrenaline for warriors.

I stopped reading here.

Adrenaline is probably the worst example you could’ve picked considering most Warriors do absolutely nothing with their Adrenaline but stack it and sit on it for Critical Hit Chance and Damage boosts from Heightened Focus and Berserker’s Power. Because of that, burning your Adrenaline by using Burst skills often results in a DPS loss for Warriors, adding yet another passive mechanic for a class that is already filled with banners, shouts, and signets that promotes an overwhelmingly passive (see: boring) style of play.

I do love my Warrior, but to suggest that toolbelt skills as they’re currently designed are less useful than a glorified damage meter is total bullspit. Our toolbelt abilities are some of the best the class has, including a 10-second projectile wall (Elixir U) and a 1200 range area revive (Elixir R). Many toolbelt skills can be traited to deal damage (Static Discharge), remove conditions (Cleansing Formula 409), and remove boons (Acidic Elixirs). It’s easily one of the most adaptive and diverse aspects about the Engineer, and really shows the depth and complexity of the Engineer as a class; because of toolbelts, utilities effectively become two skills in one slot. This adds a lot more weight to every decision you make constructing your build, but it also makes the process more experimental (see: fun).

If you’re not happy with the class, that’s your problem. But there are many of us that enjoy the depth of the Engineer, especially when we’ve found so many different combinations that are quite intuitive and really speak volumes about the amount of effort ArenaNet put into this class. You suggest the Engineer was designed as an afterthought, but compare how the Engineer Shield is to the Guardian or Warrior Shield. It’s so much more complex and versatile in use. I’d say they definitely put a lot more thought into the Engineer than a class like Warrior where you drop banners and then do nothing with most of them.

There’s issues with the Engineer, of course, but you’re being way overcritical of a class that is a well-recognized top-tier PvP profession, proficient WvW roamer, and a Vulnerability/Buff Battery in PvE.

Phineas Poe.3018:

VIVorcha.7853:

My problem with this is that the toolbelt in its current state is not anywhere near as useful as Adrenaline for warriors.

I stopped reading here.

Adrenaline is probably the worst example you could’ve picked considering most Warriors do absolutely nothing with their Adrenaline but stack it and sit on it for Critical Hit Chance and Damage boosts from Heightened Focus and Berserker’s Power. Because of that, burning your Adrenaline by using Burst skills often results in a DPS loss for Warriors, adding yet another passive mechanic for a class that is already filled with banners, shouts, and signets that promotes an overwhelmingly passive (see: boring) style of play.

I do love my Warrior, but to suggest that toolbelt skills as they’re currently designed are less useful than a glorified damage meter is total bullspit. Our toolbelt abilities are some of the best the class has, including a 10-second projectile wall (Elixir U) and a 1200 range area revive (Elixir R). Many toolbelt skills can be traited to deal damage (Static Discharge), remove conditions (Cleansing Formula 409), and remove boons (Acidic Elixirs). It’s easily one of the most adaptive and diverse aspects about the Engineer, and really shows the depth and complexity of the Engineer as a class; because of toolbelts, utilities effectively become two skills in one slot. This adds a lot more weight to every decision you make constructing your build, but it also makes the process more experimental (see: not boring).

You shouldn’t need to trait into something for it to be viable. It should stand alone.

As I mentioned above, several of the Toss Elixir skills employ RNG that renders them ineffective (notably H and.

I have a warrior, and I actually found the Adrenaline meter to be an incredibly fun and powerful mechanic, but maybe that’s me. I’ve tried multiple other classes, and all of them were way more fun and effective than the engineer. Especially the Ranger.

Maybe a handful of the toolbelts are useful, but the rest are only good as a means of delivering trait effects (such as Static Discharge) and they have far too long cooldowns.

Okay, I just saw your edit, and that really confused me. Are you trying to say that the Engineer in its current state is not in need of any changes? That the uselessness of Gadgets and Turrets is perfectly fine? And the fact that we only have one good elite (Supply Crate)?

You can also say that we have lots of “intuitive builds”, but they all boil down to one of three things:

HGH
Static Discharge
Grenades

It might be better if they fixed all the bugs, such as turret scaling, but until then, the class is seriously in need of help.

VIVorcha.7853:

Okay, I just saw your edit, and that really confused me. Are you trying to say that the Engineer in its current state is not in need of any changes? That the uselessness of Gadgets and Turrets is perfectly fine? And the fact that we only have one good elite (Supply Crate)?

Well, this is just my own opinion, but I think gadgets and turrets are far from useless. Rocket Boots is a common aspect of many builds these days across all areas of the game. The Blast finisher is great in PvE, and it’s a very useful escape in WvW/PvP.

VIVorcha.7853:

You can also say that we have lots of “intuitive builds”, but they all boil down to one of three things:

HGH
Static Discharge
Grenades

No they don’t.

Phineas Poe.3018:

VIVorcha.7853:

Okay, I just saw your edit, and that really confused me. Are you trying to say that the Engineer in its current state is not in need of any changes? That the uselessness of Gadgets and Turrets is perfectly fine? And the fact that we only have one good elite (Supply Crate)?

Well, this is just my own opinion, but I think gadgets and turrets are far from useless. Rocket Boots is a common aspect of many builds these days across all areas of the game. The Blast finisher is great in PvE, and it’s a very useful escape in WvW/PvP.

VIVorcha.7853:

You can also say that we have lots of “intuitive builds”, but they all boil down to one of three things:

HGH
Static Discharge
Grenades

No they don’t.

Our traits and skills notably lack synergy compared to other classes. Alchemy is one of the only trees with really good synergy.

If you look at other classes, skills and traits within one group tend to synergize or at least go along with each other. The gadget skills, Tools traits, and Inventions traits really fail at that.

VIVorcha.7853:

You know that trait “Adrenal Implant”? It’s a Grandmaster trait in the Tools line.

Well, rangers get that as a minor adept trait.

That’s just insulting.

We were given a minor trait as our grandmaster trait.

If you have played WvW or PvP in any capacity then you know that Endurance and dodges is life – and that it should be Rangers, not Engineers, that should have to slot that in Grandmaster. We are actually balanced with how that trait sits, not the other way around.

I will also go ahead and echo what others have said in this thread as well – plucking 2 traits from different professions and putting them head to head is a pointless exercise. It fails to take into account:

• The weapon skills
• Other traits
• Profession specific mechanic
• Profession strengths and weaknesses

So whilst I may have agreed with you 6 months ago, I will have to refute your statement as it is now – because it simply is not that straightforward.

I will also have to disagree on the continuing sentiment that Gadgets should be a “Signet” analogue for other classes, granting passive benefits. As an Engineer you should be proud of the fact that nigh on all of our capabilities – defense, DPS, healing and support – require smart, active play and improvisation.

Passives aren’t counterplayable, don’t add depth to a class, and worsens balance issues. You only have to look at the recent buff to the Healing Signet to see that giving passives to utilities will always result in 2 things:

1. The passive is too weak and the utility too “meh”, so no-one takes it
2. The passive is too strong and the utility just “good enough” so people leave it on cooldown and howls of OP! OP! OP! ensue (See: Signet of Restoration nerf and the howls of indignation after because it also crushed Staff ele using Resto signet)

I, for one, do not want to see Engineer being put into the same volatile spot balance wise when we have as a class worked so hard throughout the games history to make active play a necessity to be effective and survive.

What would be better would be Traits that instead give additional utility to Gadgets:

• Using a Gadget Toolbelt skill transfers conditions to foes
• Gadgets have an additional property – Personal Battering Ram is now 130 radius PBAoE Launch and a Whirl Finisher, Rocket Kick is a Leap finisher and deals double damage, Slick Shoes oil can be ignited with GTAoE Burning to cause a Fire Field, etc.
• Proccing conditions on foes with Gadget skills – Slick Shoes causes Weakness to knocked down foes, etc.
• Proccing Boons with gadget skills – Stability for example
• More boon hate – Gadgets remove a boon on foes, Utility goggles forces Revealed on Stealthed players
• Synergy for taking multiple gadgets – Slick Shoes with Rocket Boots lets you set the oil on fire, Throw Mine and Utility Goggles makes Mine Field inflict 10 stacks of Vulnerability, Rocket Boots and PBR makes your Rocket Kick knockback as well, etc.

There are a ton of ideas that do not involve putting in passives to Gadgets that would round out what Engineer currently lacks as a class right now and would reinforce the active play that playing an Engineer should bring.

If you wanted to run all passives and still be effective you should be rerolling Warrior and running 5 signets – or Spirit Ranger and 3-4 spirits. There should be a place for low APM builds in GW2 – but even with Engineer (Especially for engineer) – there needs to be critical thought as to when to activate abilities, and Signets subvert that thought process.

Elixir X does not suck. I’ve seen engineers break up blobs and scatter the enemy almost entirely solo when used right, done it myself even.[/quote]

QFT

However most players aren’t going to understand this. Elixir X is actually one of the best elites in the game if you use it correctly.

Really?
You reckon that funny moment in WvW when with your entire zerg You rush upon enemies, enter among them and pop up Elixir X hoping that “this time it shall be AoE tornado”…
…and instead You get a single target slow giant that is soooo easy to target, without any resistances, or extra heals.
You all that are so confident about engii being so kitten ’ good at anything do A TEST:
- go to PvP,
- pick a warrior, build it
- pick a rifle
- train with a golems
- do the same with engii + rifle
- compare damage output.
…And warrior is a HEAVY ARMOR class.

ps: someone mentioned that engii trait “incecndiary powder” is on ADEPT tier, while necro “dhuumfire” is on grandmaster…
Instead of making Yourself a completly ignorant just READ what You post- how many conditions does engii have ( except granade build) and now compare that to necro.
Answer is – necro goes slighly better while engii’s condition output is based on LUCK ( see elixirs).

VIVorcha.7853:

Traits
Engineer traits are largely a joke. The Alchemy line of traits is fine, but the others need serious work. Our Grandmaster traits especially need help. You know that trait “Adrenal Implant”? It’s a Grandmaster trait in the Tools line.

Well, rangers get that as a minor adept trait.

That’s just insulting.

We were given a minor trait as our grandmaster trait.

Rangers are not Engineers. Engineers aren’t naturally built to be evasive, Rangers are. That is why they have that trait as a minor.

All classes are not equal. Quit thinking like that or you’ll just end up homogenizing the heck out of this game.

VIVorcha.7853:

Okay, I just saw your edit, and that really confused me. Are you trying to say that the Engineer in its current state is not in need of any changes? That the uselessness of Gadgets and Turrets is perfectly fine? And the fact that we only have one good elite (Supply Crate)?

You can also say that we have lots of “intuitive builds”, but they all boil down to one of three things:

HGH
Static Discharge
Grenades

It might be better if they fixed all the bugs, such as turret scaling, but until then, the class is seriously in need of help.

I make builds and post them on youtube. Here’s my Engineer playlist;

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLtEsG2yvx3EtLgtQ7oJlUfbIwwVo7JZd0

What you will not find is two of the 3 things you listed.

The most popular builds contain SD, Grenades and HGH BUT that is by no means the only builds available to us. We’re the class with THE LARGEST amount of build possibilities, even with a crappy set of turrets.

@VIVorcha:
I do agree that Engineer requires changes, although probably not in the way you think. Engineer’s big damage remains squarely at close range, but there are insufficient rewards for the risk at the moment, unlike other classes. That being said, Engineer is clearly competitive – it just isn’t easy. Power Engineer builds remain one of the riskiest builds to play due to relatively low condi-cleanse and vulnerability to chain CC – but the damage is there.

Dirame.8521:

I make builds and post them on youtube. Here’s my Engineer playlist;

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLtEsG2yvx3EtLgtQ7oJlUfbIwwVo7JZd0

What you will not find is two of the 3 things you listed.

The most popular builds contain SD, Grenades and HGH BUT that is by no means the only builds available to us. We’re the class with THE LARGEST amount of build possibilities, even with a crappy set of turrets.

@Dirame:
Since you’ve been making videos of builds, I have Swagg’s Bombgineer build to recommend .

It’s a BK/EG/Rifle Turret with Rifle build using Sitting Duck and Cripple spam to keep people in range of bombs and SD procs. I’ve been using it to good success in PvE and WvW; people don’t expect the triple Water Field Blast taking you to 100% health, or Might Stacking the Big Ol’ Bomb to deal big damage.

Get good.

15 characters.

VIVorcha.7853:

Phineas Poe.3018:

VIVorcha.7853:

Okay, I just saw your edit, and that really confused me. Are you trying to say that the Engineer in its current state is not in need of any changes? That the uselessness of Gadgets and Turrets is perfectly fine? And the fact that we only have one good elite (Supply Crate)?

Well, this is just my own opinion, but I think gadgets and turrets are far from useless. Rocket Boots is a common aspect of many builds these days across all areas of the game. The Blast finisher is great in PvE, and it’s a very useful escape in WvW/PvP.

VIVorcha.7853:

You can also say that we have lots of “intuitive builds”, but they all boil down to one of three things:

HGH
Static Discharge
Grenades

No they don’t.

Our traits and skills notably lack synergy compared to other classes. Alchemy is one of the only trees with really good synergy.

If you look at other classes, skills and traits within one group tend to synergize or at least go along with each other. The gadget skills, Tools traits, and Inventions traits really fail at that.

You have a bad habit of painting in broad strokes.

My only problem with the Engineer is the massive amounts of diversity to play with.

Engineers are just too kitten fun!

“I have so many crazy toys, I dunno what to do with ’em!”

Seriously though, no gripes. I’ve been able to hold my own in sPvP (Rifle/Turret/Tool Kit Build; I LOVE CCs. LOVE. THEM LOL). I am decent at open field in WvW(I tend to do stupid things, like charge into a group of ten KNOWING I’LL GET SMASHED).

As for Elixir X? Heck, it’s AWESOME. As my fellow [NERF] member, Chaba said, it’s great for breaking up the ‘Blob’(especially with Tornado). It’s an awesome elite skill

What are you all on about? Engineer has more builds than other classes…that’s false. Its got a few good builds like any other class.

Conan.8046:

What are you all on about? Engineer has more builds than other classes…that’s false.

It’s really not, though.

Pretty much every Warrior runs some kind of variant of the Axe/Mace rotation. Some mix in the Greatsword as their secondary set. Others mix in the Sword offhand. But they all pretty much boil down to sinking 30 points into Strength for Berserker’s Power and choosing between 25 Arms + 15 Discipline to bolster their Greatsword or 30 Discipline + 10 Tactics to get Heightened Focus/Sharpened Axes.

Pretty much every Guardian runs some kind of AHEM Anchor variant or runs a Radiance DPS build. DPS Hammer builds usually end up something like 15/15/0/30/10 while Hammer/GS AHEM is always 0/X/30/30/X, putting either 10 points in Virtues or Radiance. DPS Sword build is pretty much always 30 Radiance and Valor for Empowering Might.

But what about Engineers? Well, you could run a Grenade Kit build, but the only real standard is 30 Explosives for Grenadier. Some people put the rest of their points into Alchemy for HGH. Some people put the rest of their points into Tools. Some people put a mix of their points into Firearms and one of the two trees, but each of these decisions makes a pretty big difference in how things play out. Bomb Kit builds can centralize a focus around Explosives or Inventions, greatly affecting how they’re used—either for DPS or party-wide group support. Flamethrower builds generally focus on Firearms and Alchemy, but the distribution of how that ends up really is up to the player. And then there’s Static Discharge with the Rifle.

While most classes are whittling their options down to 1-2 builds, Engineers have 4+ viable specs that not only are all incredibly useful but play very differently from one another. You may choose to play a DPS Guardian over an AHEM Guardian, but you’re still going to be using a lot of the same utilities. You’re still going to be using projectile walls in fractals and shouts in dungeons for stun breakers and condition removal.

VIVorcha.7853:

The Engi was the first class I rolled. I recently leveled it to 80, but ever since my earliest levels I’ve felt like this class had been added as an afterthought by Arenanet.

You should know that this profession has a long history of “we’re underpowered” threads, and that the engineer profession has some very skilled, very passionate defenders who will disagree with you.

First off, this first statement is correct. Engineers were designed very late, which is one reason there were so many bugs at start.

Second, your analysis of utility skills is somewhat correct: kits>elixirs>gadgets>turrets.

Turrets have actually been buffed enough, and their only problem is that they don’t work correctly. If the bugs get fixed, they’ll become popular.
Gadgets just need lower cooldowns.
Elixirs are pretty good the way they are, and give the profession a less-hardcore build (i.e. not everyone likes kit swapping like a maniac).
Kits are great and incredibly fun the way they are. My only lament is the loss of kit refinement.

…And that’s about all there is to say, really. In tournaments, we’re quite well-balanced, probably fourth best—and the professions above us currently can expect nerfs. In WvW, we have good zerg and roaming builds. I don’t do a ton of PvE, but we have at least two good dps builds (grenades and SD) and at least one good support build (bombs/elixir gun). That’s more than some professions can say.

Pretty much every Warrior runs some kind of variant of the Axe/Mace rotation. Some mix in the Greatsword as their secondary set. Others mix in the Sword offhand. But they all pretty much boil down to sinking 30 points into Strength for Berserker’s Power and choosing between 25 Arms + 15 Discipline to bolster their Greatsword or 30 Discipline + 10 Tactics to get Heightened Focus/Sharpened Axes.

You speak of broad strokes…you just did exactly what you criticised VIVorcha for. There are a huge amount of good builds for warrior and they are nothing like what you described.

I already spoke about the argument that “our class requires more skill”. If your playstyle is more difficult, you should get a better result, not be in the middle of the pack or barely scraping by.

Compared to other classes, our class lacks so much in survivability that we really need dodges, and our tools trait tree gives us a means of restoring it.

I HATE elixirs, but they’re constantly forced upon me. 70% of the builds I’ve looked at involve elixirs, because your only viable other option is kits.

Just look at gadgets and tell me they’re balanced. Rocket boots is pretty good, and I slide that into my builds, just for the blast finisher and comedy value. Slick Shoes, on the other hand, is a 60 second cool down for such a mediocre effect. The toolbelt is a five second burst of speed+stunbreaker, which isn’t long enough to get real mileage (literally), unless you’re using rocket boots.

The thing that bugs me about the toolbelt, is that none of our skills relate to it in any way. If you look at almost every class, their class mechanic is affected by their main skills.

Maybe using skills and their toolbelt together rapidly should produce a new effect?

VIVorcha.7853:

I already spoke about the argument that “our class requires more skill”. If your playstyle is more difficult, you should get a better result, not be in the middle of the pack or barely scraping by.

So the profession that’s the hardest to play should be OP?

If you want to continue a balance discussion, you’ll need to clarify whether you’re talking about PvE, WvW, or PvP.

I’m not someone who constantly defends the engineer profession, since the truth is that it has a lot of bugs and design flaws. But we need to frame our arguments better, and push for simple, reasonable changes. For starters, engineers don’t need a massive design change—and that’s never going to happen anyway. I’d recommend emphasizing:

—Turret bugfixes and targeting
—Gadget effectiveness as alternate weapons (I honestly think that lower cooldowns would practically solve the problem)
—Small changes to traits to de-emphasize RNG

NevirSayDie.6235:

VIVorcha.7853:

I already spoke about the argument that “our class requires more skill”. If your playstyle is more difficult, you should get a better result, not be in the middle of the pack or barely scraping by.

So the profession that’s the hardest to play should be OP?

If you want to continue a balance discussion, you’ll need to clarify whether you’re talking about PvE, WvW, or PvP.

I’m not someone who constantly defends the engineer profession, since the truth is that it has a lot of bugs and design flaws. But we need to frame our arguments better, and push for simple, reasonable changes. For starters, engineers don’t need a massive design change—and that’s never going to happen anyway. I’d recommend emphasizing:

—Turret bugfixes and targeting
—Gadget effectiveness as alternate weapons (I honestly think that lower cooldowns would practically solve the problem)
—Small changes to traits to de-emphasize RNG

It’s most noticeable in WvW, where everything is fast-paced, but I’ve struggled significantly in PVE content, and it feels like it’s because of my class.

I notice you don’t consider our downed skills being useless to be a serious problem, even though elementalists got a revamp for them shortly after the game was released.

And no, I don’t feel that Engineers should be overpowered, I think they should be easier to play, so that we don’t need to be working harder than the other classes for the same result.

Another QQ thread. I can’t even be bothered with reading through it completely. The tone is completely wrong.

Engineers are effing awesome. Love mine, way more than the other classes.

“Elixirs are an RNG fest” Not really. They all grant an offensive or defensive boon and all of em are great. I like the RNG of it, having me adapt sometimes to a certain situation when the boon I ‘need’ does not come. Also with HGH Elixiris you always gain Might with it. Pretty kitten good.

“Traits suck qq” And 0 suggestions. Nice.

Bah I can’t even go on. Please fix your tone if you actually want to be helpful. Suggestions are all fine and yes there are things to be done to some of the class mechanics but don’t act like Engineer is oh so terrible and blabla. I think we can all agree the Rangers have more ‘right’ to than Engineers.

VIVorcha.7853:

It would seem that for you, the wrong “tone” is one of reason and disagreement with your opinion.

Anybody who uses “effing”, “em”, and “bah” in a single post has immediately lost all right to participate meaningfully in the discussion.

Not to mention you’re defending something that goes against the very ideas that Guild Wars 2 is trying to promote in MMOs.

Rangers are not bad, they’re amazing. My new character is a Ranger and after playing him, I feel slow and clunky on my Engineer compared to the mobility and evasion provided by Greatsword, Longbow, Lightning Reflexes, and Signet of the Hunt.

Haha say that to the rest of the rangers on the forum and you’ll start a flame wars. I’m defending something I like. The RNG adds a little flavour to it all, it’s nothing gamebreaking. They already took a few RNG elements out of those Elixirs.

And no, your tone does not matter for agreement or disagreement. You should try a more positive tone with valuable suggestions and well articulated reasons not “Traits suck.” That does not help out anyone.

Oh wait.. I wasn’t allowed here anymore. Can we still be friends?

VIVorcha.7853:

It would seem that for you, the wrong “tone” is one of reason and disagreement with your opinion.

Anybody who uses “effing”, “em”, and “bah” in a single post has immediately lost all right to participate meaningfully in the discussion.

Not to mention you’re defending something that goes against the very ideas that Guild Wars 2 is trying to promote in MMOs.

Rangers are not bad, they’re amazing. My new character is a Ranger and after playing him, I feel slow and clunky on my Engineer compared to the mobility and evasion provided by Greatsword, Longbow, Lightning Reflexes, and Signet of the Hunt.

Good point about mobility. I made a build last night and forgot to put my MANDATORY 10 points in Tools for speedy kits. Big mistake in wvw.

VIVorcha.7853:

It would seem that for you, the wrong “tone” is one of reason and disagreement with your opinion.

Anybody who uses “effing”, “em”, and “bah” in a single post has immediately lost all right to participate meaningfully in the discussion.

Not to mention you’re defending something that goes against the very ideas that Guild Wars 2 is trying to promote in MMOs.

Rangers are not bad, they’re amazing. My new character is a Ranger and after playing him, I feel slow and clunky on my Engineer compared to the mobility and evasion provided by Greatsword, Longbow, Lightning Reflexes, and Signet of the Hunt.

Well unlike the rest of these guys who can’t see the forest for the tree’s, I totally agree with you. Engineer has been my main since release I have tried Mesmer/Ranger/Warrior and thief….and they were all easier to do much better.

Reason most people don’t say anything is because it will be called “QQ” or “whine” but the facts speak for themselves. When necromancer got buffed you suddenly had necro’s coming out the walls because they were op….where as before you seen very few.

We are least played class for a good reason.

Conan.8046

Reason most people don’t say anything is because it will be called “QQ” or “whine” but the facts speak for themselves. When necromancer got buffed you suddenly had necro’s coming out the walls because they were op….where as before you seen very few.

We are least played class for a good reason.

EXACTLY. We’re the least played class, and Arenanet has adopted the stance of nerfing our viable builds instead of buffing our non-viable ones.

RNG is bad indeed – especially when it is applied to situational boons. And half of our tossed elixir are like that (H,B and S specifically).
Regarding Elixir X, i don’t like it being a recycle of other elites. It lacks personality.
Still, before touching those matters, they should fix what is broken right now. So let’s see if they’ll finally fix turrets with the incoming patch.
Albeit, being one of the least played classes, they won’t necessarily spend much time about us.

VIVorcha.7853:

It’s most noticeable in WvW, where everything is fast-paced, but I’ve struggled significantly in PVE content, and it feels like it’s because of my class.

I notice you don’t consider our downed skills being useless to be a serious problem, even though elementalists got a revamp for them shortly after the game was released.

And no, I don’t feel that Engineers should be overpowered, I think they should be easier to play, so that we don’t need to be working harder than the other classes for the same result.

Thanks, that’s very clear and reasonable. Remember that you’re posting in a forum full of die-hard engineer players who like their profession, even if they see its flaws.

I again agree with you in a lot of ways. A few months ago, engineers gained a reputation as a PvP-centered profession for hardcore players only. It wasn’t entirely true, but the reputation was there for a reason. So yes, I’d say some builds with a lower skill floor would be helpful to the profession as a whole. I don’t know if there’s an easy way to do that, except to fix turrets (since that’s what new engineers often start with) and lower the cooldowns on gadgets.

Yes, the downed skills are bad compared to most other professions. I don’t think downed state plays a huge role in any profession’s balance, so I didn’t address that.

PvE is difficult to make balance statements from—warriors and guardians feel so incredibly easy that every other profession will feel a little weak. For WvW, engineers have several very effective builds. None of them are easy like guardian or necro, though. Engineers are also unforgiving to people creating their own builds: there are a lot of ways to make an awful engineer build. Most of the people you see defending engineers on the forums have spent hours fine-tuning their builds. Many still tweak their personal build regularly to fit the changing meta (I changed my trait choices significantly last week, and I’ve played since beta).

Helcor.9527:

VIVorcha.7853:

It would seem that for you, the wrong “tone” is one of reason and disagreement with your opinion.

Anybody who uses “effing”, “em”, and “bah” in a single post has immediately lost all right to participate meaningfully in the discussion.

Not to mention you’re defending something that goes against the very ideas that Guild Wars 2 is trying to promote in MMOs.

Rangers are not bad, they’re amazing. My new character is a Ranger and after playing him, I feel slow and clunky on my Engineer compared to the mobility and evasion provided by Greatsword, Longbow, Lightning Reflexes, and Signet of the Hunt.

Good point about mobility. I made a build last night and forgot to put my MANDATORY 10 points in Tools for speedy kits. Big mistake in wvw.

Feels like ANet should just give everyone a out of combat swiftness boon and call it a day, at least in WvW.

As for PVE, outside of the overhanging issue of health fat mobs that spam spike damage making anything but DPS a no go, i think our biggest issue is boring ranged options. We have 1 weapon (rifle) and 1 kit (grenades) that reach out the general max range (1200), and the rifle only has that for #1 while grenades will eventually wear out your wrist unless you use something that can hammer the keys for you (sometimes i wonder if ANet even tested this game without hardcore gaming hardware and third party VOIP services).

Ok, there is a third option, mortar, but anyone picking that over the supply drop is insane. I guess a fix there would be if we could pick it up like a warrior banner and bring it along when the battle moves.

All in all ,for a game built with mobility as a focus the engineer is painfully static.

digiowl.9620:

All in all ,for a game built with mobility as a focus the engineer is painfully static.

Games that have a class that focus on turrets make that class to be static.
Lets look at other games. TF2 is well known, This game is very mobile, you have people running and jumping and even rocket jumping all over the place. But then you have the engineer class, designed not to do any of that stuff, cant move quick, cant jump high. His role is to control an area and make it his. Often known as “Area denial”.

Lets look at another game, Global Agenda. This game is even more mobile than TF2 seeing as every one has jetpacks. Like before you have a class thats designed to set in 1 spot and control an area with turrets and buff stations.

These kind of classes focus on haveing a zone of control that hurts/debuffs enemys and heal/buffs allies. This is the kind of class I was hopeing the Gw2 Engineer was.
We have the tools; the healing turret, several combat turrets for different situation, even gadgets like mines and a bomb kit that all say “This is my spot, Get out!”
Even an elite that drops a realy built base on the head of our enemys.

Hey I dont make the rules.
Warriors are almost always the masters of melee combat.
Rangers are almost always the masters of ranged combat.
Spellcasters are almost always the masters of AoEs
Thiefs are almost always the masters of Spike Damage.
And Engineers are almost always the masters of Zone of Control.

Of corse this doesnt always have to be true. You could easly have a class that summons demons and demonic spires to function like turrets and healing stations.
But most game devs dont tend to be that creative, so it defaults to the engieer with his turrets that get the job of Zone of Control. Less confusing for the player base that way too.

To wrap up this rambling, Being static should be to the classes advantage.