Guild Wars 2

Maniac Magee.2643:

Lol, playing with myself a bit for sure. Obviously Apharma this post is a prolonged pet project of mine. But it’s ok. At least this kinda masturbation is satisfying. Commenting on people’s post with needless jabs is the kind of thing teenage kids do…it’s so old hat and boring.

No need to take it personally it was just for a bit of fun, it was a reference to how you seem to be mostly replying to yourself at multiple times. Your build and some of the replies you posted especially the quoted looks to me that you’re trying to be different for the sake of being different.

Sceptre, ok I guess you can justify it for the extra condition pressure at the cost of blurred frenzy but torch over shield? If you’re going for a dueling spec and have chrono then shield is by far more useful and is even more useful when numbers climb from 1v1 to team fights. I just don’t think there’s any reason to use torch even with the pledge.

You said you found allies don’t stand in the well for its heal, yes this happens but if your allies are too dumb to benefit, stop using it for them and use it for you. You’re taking the cleanse mantra but if you took well of eternity and used it properly you wouldn’t need the mantra and can instead slot something more useful in a fight. Decoy or portal would work well in this build even if you don’t want the signet of illusions which is great both offensively and defensively.

Gravity well, that’s personal preference I guess but there is definitely an advantage to being able to moa an ele and snowball a fight by which time CS is off cool down.

Ross was referring to how the majority of your build is close to the meta, there are some differences, albeit worse choices, but your role, the way you do damage and a large amount of the traits are the same.

Maniac Magee.2643:

Myren, you haven’t even really read. Here’s the ways I think you don’t understand:

1) I’m not using Torch anymore
2) I listed the differences between this and Chronophantasma meta. I even gave a brief strategic assesment of WHY those differences mattered.
3) Um…#2 was so ignored by you and detailed enough that I think it bears repetition.

Also, I absolutely wreck DHs (at least the meta ones) so I don’t know why you mentioned them.

And Mirror Images is a GREAT skill. The AoE doesn’t matter, because its use is mainly to get instant use (often paired with Phase Retreat) out of F4 or F5.

The utilities I have that Chronophantasma doesn’t are SO key. Not having the Signet to recharge my Fs is a big big difference by itself.

I’m gonna go back to points 2 and 3 here because you really don’t understand. Without portal I HAVE to stay in the fight. This ALONE puts me in a different role than Chronophantasma. I have further widened the gap between my role and the meta’s role by adding more sustain on my Utility bar and more focused dmg on my main hand. I definitely can bust out every skill I got for a big burst (and occasionally I do when it’s appropriate) but most of the time I cycle through my skills in a slower, more reactive manner than the meta build. My set-up does not work well if you have a “skill rotation”.

So, this’s different in: Role, Attack Pattern, Defense, Load-out, and General Mindset. What more can I say? That’s different in every meaningful way. Just because they’re both condi mesmer doesn’t make them the same. Just because it shares some traits and an amulet (which almost should be chosen for ANY mesmer condi set-up) Doesn’t make it execute at all the same.

This entire explanation, I’m sorry, is basically rendered useless because you’re using the meta Chronomancer Traits, the Meta Inspiration traits, and like two different traits for Illusions. Mantra of Resolve is a wasted utility as you have enough Cleanse as is. Gravity Well is my favorite elite but with your setup, is also useless. Moa is much more effective in this scenario. Your “role” is basically the same except less effective. Mirror images is a great skill in 1v1 and even then, is outclassed by Decoy. You try to use mirror images in a team fight and your clones will die right away. You can sprinkle as much “difference” as you want, but its still a Chronophantasma build.

Myren, I’m so dissapointed. You say I’m “running the meta” but then basically say i’m not lol. This self contradictory reasoning just means you’ve not read or thought through this set-up. I really shouldn’t be replying, because this post is for people who have my mindset but haven’t been playing long enough to put it all together right, not for nay-sayers who can’t even put enough thought into what they’re saying to not contradict themselves.

I share a skeleton with the Meta because, lets face it, if you want to run condi there are a few things you HAVE to have. But the Meta is not condi, it is a specific condi load-out, with a specific play-style in mind.

Lets get to your contradictions and lack of reading. If I was running Meta, then yes I’d have enough cleanse to not want the Mantra. But I’m not running meta (don’t have Sig of Inspiration to recharge my shatters/cleanses, which is a big DEFINING part of the meta) so the Mantra helps me AND my team. Also if i was running Meta I wouldn’t gain 2.5k hp on use of the mantra. But I’m not, so I do.

Next: I ALREADY SAID THAT I DON’T CARE ABOUT THE ENEMY AoE KILLING THE CLONES FROM MIRROR IMAGES, BECAUSE I USE IT TO CHARGE F4 AND F5. It’s instant. And those things work GREAT in 1v1 OR team fights. Because i can Chaos Storm/Gravity Well, then do it again. And w/e you say that’s great in a team fight. Both great skills. Or I can use the f4 and f5 for other things, the point is that with mirror images I can always have enough illusions to pop those two things meaningfully – offensively, defensively, or supportively. The Meta build has no such guarantee. Wow, it’s different than the meta. Like I’ve been saying. hmm….

Now for your use of “meta chronomancer Traits”, “Meta Inspiration traits” etcetc. Omg dude. The meta build is a synergistic amalgamation of traits, skills, and equipement. As for the ‘Trait choices’ one makes….lets face it there’re good and bad traits. There’s variability in effective BUILDS, but sometimes in the trait tiers (adept, master, and grandmaster) where you have 3 choices each there’s only 1 or 2 that are any good at all. So, sometimes trait choices can coincide with the “meta” but not be part of a “meta-build”.

What ignorance. I could go on and on, but you probably won’t read, and definitely wouldn’t understand. So w/e. Hopefully some mesmer out there who likes condi, but isn’t a fan of always doing the meta thing, will read this. They will get value out of it and that’s what matters. Explaining myself to insistent-but-ignorant people is not what I’m here for, so I’ll leave it at this until someone asks a legit question.

Apharma. Thanks for the apology. People troll and talk kitten all the time, but yea i get that sometimes it’s just for yuks. As for a reply assessing what you’ve said, just read what I’ve posted. And if you still disagree then w/e people are entitled to their opinion.

Maniac Magee.2643:

Apharma. Thanks for the apology. People troll and talk kitten all the time, but yea i get that sometimes it’s just for yuks. As for a reply assessing what you’ve said, just read what I’ve posted. And if you still disagree then w/e people are entitled to their opinion.

It wasn’t an apology, I make no such thing for what I said or the way I say it. As for your build, the mantra healing trait is a really bad thing to take because impacting disruption thieves will eat you for breakfast, same with the heal and you don’t have enough stealth for both.

Torch is factually worse than shield for “having to stay in the fight” as you put it, torch will let the node get decapped without really giving you much else other than a really long cast phantasm and stealth to channel your easily interrupted heals. The shield however gives you a double block for 3s total on a 25-35s CD (factoring alacrity and celerity) as well as a double stun with projectile block and quickness.

Using well of eternity means it’s harder to interrupt, gives you nearly the same healing as ether feast without clones but with the bonus of cleansing per pulse (5 total conditions removed with inspiration line) and an ally heal if they’re smart.

If you want to play this build go ahead but don’t try to pass off bad decisions the way you are doing. If you were to use a mantra for healing, pain or distraction would yield better results. If you need it for cleanses as I say you should use well of eternity then slot a better utility, even phantasmal disenchanter wouldn’t be that bad an idea in this meta. Stealth doesn’t help you stay in a fight or keep a node yours/contested.

I think calling this build ‘basically the meta build’ is going a bit far. The traits are identical, and that does mean that the way this build fights in a very general sense, i.e. you use shatters to apply conditions while sustaining, will be the same. However, other parts of the build make it a bit distinct.

The scepter choice means that you’ll have a much harder time landing shatters without the immobilization of iLeap. However, it also means you have the potentially for a much more powerful spike between confusing images and the block.

The torch choice means that you’ll have far less pressure and point-holding sustain than shield. However, it does give you the opportunity for shatters from stealth, and provides and excellent gtfo tool if the occasion demands it.

Personally I disagree with the MI and mantra choices in this build, but they do have impacts on various matchups. Fighting a necro becomes quite safe with the mantra, while the normal meta build needs to proceed with substantial caution in that matchup. MI lets you do interesting things with instant burst, particularly in conjunction with CS. You lose the mobility of portal, but you can potentially make up for that by instakilling somebody with a powerful alpha burst.

So yeah. Is it a completely different build than the meta? No, not really. But neither is it ‘just another meta clone’.

Ok, for the sake of argument I’ll grant you it’s a different build regardless of if it’s traits, role, and playstyle are almost entirely the same (with a few obvious degrees of difference in offense vs defense etc).

The question is: is it better at the same job? You mention Helseth and high level play. Don’t worry, I know all about Helseth. I also know all about Mesmer. I also know all about appropriately balancing out offensive and defensive features in a build, and that you take as much as you need and anything more is waste. The power of portal and why it doesn’t matter if you’re forced to flee the point if you have it. The synergy of mes traits, shatters, and sig of illusions. I know all of this. Which is why when I look at your build I see a condi chrono mesmer, albiet non-meta variant, which is why I state “So in the end you’re just playing meta condi chrono but with the on point sustain weapon set swapped out for some more direct damage condi.” I could have added much more I guess, seeing as this build has vast limitations when we do a comparison.

Have I made some sort of factually inaccurate statement?

Anyway, I’m sorry if you feel trolled. Here’s a fun and factually accurate meme to show I both know my mesmering, plus related trivia, and have done so for a long time!

Oh this isn’t trolling, this is just me stating an opinion that the build is a tweaked Chronophantasma build. That’s what I said and what I continue to say. I offered suggestions to make the build better/different by taking Chaos or even Dueling for a purely offensive use with Mistrust. Moa is a much better alternative to gravity well because you can land ur burst more effectively. Insults aside, this build isn’t really helpful to any of us except telling us what not to use. It seems to be working for you which I applaud since you’re so vibrantly passionate about it. If I came across as trolling, I’m sorry. But you have three other mesmers here suggesting improvements and you kind of just “Meh I AM THE MANIAC MAGEE FEAR ME” whatever man enjoy the 50 condi cleanses.

Ross it’s role and playstyle are not at all like the Chronophantasma. There are too many things I can do that ChronoP can’t and vice-versa. I feel like I’ve already explained this suffieciently. So people who say otherwise either haven’t read or don’t get it. But w/e. The people I spvp with regularly tell me It doesn’t feel like playing alongside a meta mesmer. I don’t make the same choices in the match (rotation, targeting, disengaging etc). But like I just said, either you haven’t read or you don’t understand.

So, better at same job? duh the answer is no. But I don’t do the same job. omg I’m the one playing it so I know i’m not rolling around acting like a sub-par-set-up Meta.

I love how you say “I look at your build I see a condi chono mesmer, albiet non-meta variant…..your’e just playing meta condi” How are all you people saying it’s meta but then ALSO saying it’s not meta? I just don’t get it. reasoning with you guys is like reasoning with a 4yr old that “knows” a wrong fact. oh well. glhf out there.

oh my god myren. moa for better burst…Ive said I’m not burst oriented. you guys have no idea at all. AND MYREN IF YOU ACTUALLY READ YOU’LL SE THAT I STARTED OUT WITH CHAOS OMG LOLOLOLOL

gotta love when idiots make a suggestion and you’ve been telling them to actually read the post and their suggestion is your prototype that you’ve since tweaked lolol

Fay ty you’re always reasonable. ty ty. But, i’m not using torch anymore.

Guys, if you won’t listen to me listen to Fay. Other than the torch thing he seems to understand some of the differences between this and meta (like me being able to rip apart necros safely while meta has to use much caution)

Fay you say landing the shatters will be harder without imob but that i have higher burst. It’s not like that. that’s not the proper use of this most of the time. I send out a shatter or 2 spacing weapon attacks between, keeping substantial stacks (not burst high stacks but enough to really hurt) on the foes, so that even if they clear it’s re-applied. So missing out on the sword really just means I don’t have Blurred Frenzy. That is def a shame, but whatchya gonna do? no build has everything.

Here is the build YOU posted, the newly “updated” loadout you’re playing. It’s what I looked at. It’s why I commented the way I did.

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW7fnknBFphdqBmpBEgilXj6sICijDNAypjoeYP2lF-TJxHABz+EAMqMwO7PAwFBAA

If you’ll notice, it has things like torch selected. So if you’re wondering why you’re getting the responses you’re getting, it might have something to do with you! :D

And if you will, can you state what the role of this build is (roaming DPS, bruiser, support, etc) and in brief the playstyle.

Maniac Magee.2643:

Guys, if you won’t listen to me listen to Fay. Other than the torch thing he seems to understand some of the differences between this and meta (like me being able to rip apart necros safely while meta has to use much caution)

Fay you say landing the shatters will be harder without imob but that i have higher burst. It’s not like that. that’s not the proper use of this most of the time. I send out a shatter or 2 spacing weapon attacks between, keeping substantial stacks (not burst high stacks but enough to really hurt) on the foes, so that even if they clear it’s re-applied. So missing out on the sword really just means I don’t have Blurred Frenzy. That is def a shame, but whatchya gonna do? no build has everything.

Maniac Magee.2643:

oh my god myren. moa for better burst…Ive said I’m not burst oriented. you guys have no idea at all. AND MYREN IF YOU ACTUALLY READ YOU’LL SE THAT I STARTED OUT WITH CHAOS OMG LOLOLOLOL

gotta love when idiots make a suggestion and you’ve been telling them to actually read the post and their suggestion is your prototype that you’ve since tweaked lolol

I don’t think you even know what this build is supposed to do.

Maniac Magee.2643:

Ross it’s role and playstyle are not at all like the Chronophantasma. There are too many things I can do that ChronoP can’t and vice-versa. I feel like I’ve already explained this suffieciently. So people who say otherwise either haven’t read or don’t get it. But w/e. They people I spvp with regularly tell me It doesn’t feel like playing alongside a meta mesmer. I don’t make the same choices in the match (rotation, targeting, disengaging etc). But like I just said, either you haven’t read or you don’t understand.

So, better at same job? duh the answer is no. But I don’t do the same job. omg I’m the one playing it so I know i’m not rolling around acting like a sub-par-set-up Meta.

I love how you say “I look at your build I see a condi chono mesmer, albiet non-meta variant…..your’e just playing meta condi” How are all you people saying it’s meta but then ALSO saying it’s not meta? I just don’t get it. reasoning with you guys is like reasoning with a 4yr old that “knows” a wrong fact. oh well. glhf out there.

Don’t listen to them, anything that has condi is considered meta. for example i will post my own build, which is unique in its way and has its own playstyle fitted to my needs and i BET you, people will say its just the metabuild.

anyways my build (i know trolls will come at me now) : http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWl0nhG1YZawWNwsGLOH1ZAMAJGajtPPQdhmoNKA-TJRHABAcKAq9JAgUZAh2fAA

Beautilation.7915:

Maniac Magee.2643:

Ross it’s role and playstyle are not at all like the Chronophantasma. There are too many things I can do that ChronoP can’t and vice-versa. I feel like I’ve already explained this suffieciently. So people who say otherwise either haven’t read or don’t get it. But w/e. They people I spvp with regularly tell me It doesn’t feel like playing alongside a meta mesmer. I don’t make the same choices in the match (rotation, targeting, disengaging etc). But like I just said, either you haven’t read or you don’t understand.

So, better at same job? duh the answer is no. But I don’t do the same job. omg I’m the one playing it so I know i’m not rolling around acting like a sub-par-set-up Meta.

I love how you say “I look at your build I see a condi chono mesmer, albiet non-meta variant…..your’e just playing meta condi” How are all you people saying it’s meta but then ALSO saying it’s not meta? I just don’t get it. reasoning with you guys is like reasoning with a 4yr old that “knows” a wrong fact. oh well. glhf out there.

Don’t listen to them, anything that has condi is considered meta. for example i will post my own build, which is unique in its way and has its own playstyle fitted to my needs and i BET you, people will say its just the metabuild.

anyways my build (i know trolls will come at me now) : http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWl0nhG1YZawWNwsGLOH1ZAMAJGajtPPQdhmoNKA-TJRHABAcKAq9JAgUZAh2fAA

This one is CLEARLY not the meta build. The change, though subtle, diverts incredibly far from what we know as a meta condi chrono build.

Please, stop being over dramatic.

XD

Ross Biddle.2367:

Beautilation.7915:

Maniac Magee.2643:

Ross it’s role and playstyle are not at all like the Chronophantasma. There are too many things I can do that ChronoP can’t and vice-versa. I feel like I’ve already explained this suffieciently. So people who say otherwise either haven’t read or don’t get it. But w/e. They people I spvp with regularly tell me It doesn’t feel like playing alongside a meta mesmer. I don’t make the same choices in the match (rotation, targeting, disengaging etc). But like I just said, either you haven’t read or you don’t understand.

So, better at same job? duh the answer is no. But I don’t do the same job. omg I’m the one playing it so I know i’m not rolling around acting like a sub-par-set-up Meta.

I love how you say “I look at your build I see a condi chono mesmer, albiet non-meta variant…..your’e just playing meta condi” How are all you people saying it’s meta but then ALSO saying it’s not meta? I just don’t get it. reasoning with you guys is like reasoning with a 4yr old that “knows” a wrong fact. oh well. glhf out there.

Don’t listen to them, anything that has condi is considered meta. for example i will post my own build, which is unique in its way and has its own playstyle fitted to my needs and i BET you, people will say its just the metabuild.

anyways my build (i know trolls will come at me now) : http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWl0nhG1YZawWNwsGLOH1ZAMAJGajtPPQdhmoNKA-TJRHABAcKAq9JAgUZAh2fAA

This one is CLEARLY not the meta build. The change, though subtle, diverts incredibly far from what we know as a meta condi chrono build.

Please, stop being over dramatic.

XD

I think it’s great that you can acknowledge the unique identity of my build, may you also do the same to Maniac Magee? I think his build offers even more diversity

It’s shame, but when I updated my build after a couple of weeks I didn’t change the torch to shield in the load-out. Woops. But I DID say to you guys that I was now using shield. Instead being intelligent and present-in-the-conversation you guys just kept saying “but torch”.

oh well

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW7enknBFphdqBmpBEgiFnjCtx2nEouQT0G9MAGgED-TJxHAB7s/wsPBAAuIA1XGAA

Beautilation thanks for jumping in. I like you’re set-up. I’ve long wanted to use the mantra heal. I like the idea of the insta-cast while in combat. Every time I put it in a build I fail. It must be that I just don’t use it correctly when in actual combat. I get interrupted too much when trying to charge it (so I guess I make bad choices for when to charge it up).

As for your trait choices I like that you punish the enemy when you are being defensive. That’s a neat trick that people probably hate.

Ross you really must be the biggest troll ever. Especially after saying “I’m sorry if you feel trolled”. You acknowlege Beaut’s build and not mine. Gonna quote Beautilation here:

“I think it’s great that you can acknowledge the unique identity of my build, may you also do the same to Maniac Magee? I think his build offers even more diversity.”

Thanks Beautilation.

Lastly someone said I don’t even know what my own build is for. I don’t feel like scrolling up to remember who it was. That’s just silly.

Ross Biddle.2367:

And if you will, can you state what the role of this build is (roaming DPS, bruiser, support, etc) and in brief the playstyle.

I have already talked in some detail about how what I do DURING a match differs from the Chronophantasma.

Maniac Magee.2643:

Fay you say landing the shatters will be harder without imob but that i have higher burst. It’s not like that. that’s not the proper use of this most of the time. I send out a shatter or 2 spacing weapon attacks between, keeping substantial stacks (not burst high stacks but enough to really hurt) on the foes, so that even if they clear it’s re-applied. So missing out on the sword really just means I don’t have Blurred Frenzy. That is def a shame, but whatchya gonna do? no build has everything.

That’s certainly one way to use it. Regardless though, landing the block is a quite powerful burst since it’s equivalent to roughly 2 full 4 clone shatters landing due to the duration and stack size. That’s why I always view scepter as a higher risk/reward mainhand for a condie build. It’s got less defense and less utility for landing shatters, but it has unmatched raw burst pressure if you land the skills.

I understand what you are saying Fay. When Illusionary Counter triggers Mental Defenses and a mesmer follows up with Cry of Frustration and Mind Wrack many people simply melt. It’s nasty to be sure.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Beautilation.7915:

Maniac Magee.2643:

Ross it’s role and playstyle are not at all like the Chronophantasma. There are too many things I can do that ChronoP can’t and vice-versa. I feel like I’ve already explained this suffieciently. So people who say otherwise either haven’t read or don’t get it. But w/e. They people I spvp with regularly tell me It doesn’t feel like playing alongside a meta mesmer. I don’t make the same choices in the match (rotation, targeting, disengaging etc). But like I just said, either you haven’t read or you don’t understand.

So, better at same job? duh the answer is no. But I don’t do the same job. omg I’m the one playing it so I know i’m not rolling around acting like a sub-par-set-up Meta.

I love how you say “I look at your build I see a condi chono mesmer, albiet non-meta variant…..your’e just playing meta condi” How are all you people saying it’s meta but then ALSO saying it’s not meta? I just don’t get it. reasoning with you guys is like reasoning with a 4yr old that “knows” a wrong fact. oh well. glhf out there.

Don’t listen to them, anything that has condi is considered meta. for example i will post my own build, which is unique in its way and has its own playstyle fitted to my needs and i BET you, people will say its just the metabuild.

anyways my build (i know trolls will come at me now) : http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWl0nhG1YZawWNwsGLOH1ZAMAJGajtPPQdhmoNKA-TJRHABAcKAq9JAgUZAh2fAA

This one is CLEARLY not the meta build. The change, though subtle, diverts incredibly far from what we know as a meta condi chrono build.

Please, stop being over dramatic.

XD

Lmaaaaooo