Guild Wars 2

I got hit by a warrior for 13k in one shot at range (rifle). Yeah…heaviest armor, largest hit point pool, rifle, 13k.

And people complain about the 5k a phantasm ‘might’ put out in a single shot ? (at the end of which the phantasm is invariably destroyed in WvW). So…5k every 18s or so.

All that AND we still have a ton of LOS bugs (ever try to destroy oil siege? ‘obstructed view’ or ‘out of range’ is all we can do…

Truly…FIX stuff before you NERF stuff.

Its easier for them to read complaints / suggestions about a recent patch in a combined thread. Instead of searching through many.

Wow, just wow.
Phantasms are not what was making us nasty. It was people not knowing how to spot the real mes.

This is just nuts, time to park my 80 mes for a while. Thief got a minor nerf, looks like warriors R us is incoming

Kushtaka.5640:

Did they change the name of this thread? I thought it was “Is this patch a joke?” or something….

Unconstructive thread title.

Granted, it would draw more negative feedback than generally constructive feedback.

Well I’m surprised mesmer received a bunch of nerfs. 0.o

The only thing affecting me is the duelist which gained 3s cooldown, but it’s not a huge issue as a sword user. Sucks to be a staff user tho, they practically wants everyone to use GS in 1 of their set now, which I won’t do.

If they nerfed shatter builds, I wouldnt care, but its the fact that they nerfed NON shatter builds that makes me so upset.

FYI for all reading this.

Illusions Shredding (Shatter) Recharge Rate got hit by a bug. Currently 30 in Illusions is supposed to decrease the Cooldowns of our Shatter by 30%. Instead, its only decreasing it by about 23%. I had similar lack of the full CD decrease at 20 Illusions as well.

Gotta find the NEW bugs they threw at us, apparently, along with the nerfing. Who knows what else they broke with this the Bloody Nerfing Monday. …

About now I would add so they could fix the bugs, but … sigh I’m starting to loose hope on that one.

The phantasm cooldowns getting longer does indeed hurt, but that shatter bug is killing me as I run a Illusionary Persona build. All of these things makes me very sad right now. Please Anet, please go through that bug thread and work on fixing that lot before we get any more nerfs. Please?

I can only assume they want us to use 3 different phantasms during a fight instead of popping 3 warlocks. Not a big deal, only sucks when your warlock gets killed early. Maybe I’ll have a reason to switch between weapons now.

3 different phantasms? Unless your using the 2 from Utility spells, you can only get 2 different. And honestly using the 2 from Utility would be a waste

I really do not understand the phantasm changes.

I haven’t done a ton of structured play on my Mesmer, but I wasn’t under the impression that the phantasm build was overpoweringly strong at this point. Even if it was, I sure as heck don’t see how a phantasm focused build would be overpowered in PvE.

So why in the world is the cooldown being increased?

In PvP, I’ll still have them up for the start of every fight, and shouldn’t have a major change in maintaining 2-3 phantasm uptime with pistol and greatsword. In champion fights of sufficient length, I’ll have the same ability to keep up a pair of phantasms and a cycling clone in many fights

Increasing the cooldown, to me, only seems to serve as a nerf to our general PvE ability against multiple normal mobs, and I don’t know how anyone could view mesmers as overpowered in that situation right now. Are we just not supposed to use phantasm traits unless we’re doing dungeons or PvP? Is that the intention? Because I’m going to keep my phantasm setup for general PvE usage, but it feels a lot like ANet doesn’t actually want me to play that way.

Me thinks whatever Dev thought to increase the Recharge Rate on those Phantasms probably looked at the Recharge timers on Phantasmal Berserk and Phantasmal Warden, and thought “Hey, thats too big of a gap, these other Phantasms need a longer CD.”

And completely and utterly forgot the two Phantasms on weapons with a Long CD are AoE, while the rest are Single Target.

I was going to level my mesmer for the challenge of it. Post-patch, I decided to have fun instead.

MLieBennett.9031:

Me thinks whatever Dev thought to increase the Recharge Rate on those Phantasms probably looked at the Recharge timers on Phantasmal Berserk and Phantasmal Warden, and thought “Hey, thats too big of a gap, these other Phantasms need a longer CD.”

And completely and utterly forgot the two Phantasms on weapons with a Long CD are AoE, while the rest are Single Target.

What about iMage? Even bigger gap.. If that’s what they thought, then it’s just a question of time until every phantasms goes above 25s cd, lol!

this means the iwarlock and iduelist have the same recharge at izerker with and without traits.

yes it’s a nerf, but it’s not huge.

I agree mesmers are one of the most op classes in pvp but phantasms are not the reason for it. Out of everything someone can complain about the mesmer class in pvp, why on earth would it be about phantasms?

Not to mention we were already terrible in pve and this just made it worse. Maybe it was for the sake of “balancing” but if they can’t properly balance pvp and pve at the same time then anything they do is pretty redundant. What is the point of balancing one aspect when at the time time unbalancing another? At this point it seems they’re just making changes for the sake of making them since there haven’t been any bug fixes.

People keep saying a 4-6 second increase in cooldown isnt much. But your wrong.

As a warrior, if your main ability gets nerfed 4-6 seconds. Ok no problem.
As a mesmer, if your main ability gets nerfed 4-6 seconds, AND can die before it even does its damage / effect. Thats a problem. if every 16-20 seconds my main ability can be shutdown by massive boss AOE and other abilities, before it can even do its damage. Thats where it becomes unfair. A warriors only potential problem is him missing. Though assuming he knows what hes doing. I doubt he will miss.

Zyrhan.3180:

I really do not understand the phantasm changes.

I haven’t done a ton of structured play on my Mesmer, but I wasn’t under the impression that the phantasm build was overpoweringly strong at this point. Even if it was, I sure as heck don’t see how a phantasm focused build would be overpowered in PvE.

So why in the world is the cooldown being increased?

In PvP, I’ll still have them up for the start of every fight, and shouldn’t have a major change in maintaining 2-3 phantasm uptime with pistol and greatsword. In champion fights of sufficient length, I’ll have the same ability to keep up a pair of phantasms and a cycling clone in many fights

Increasing the cooldown, to me, only seems to serve as a nerf to our general PvE ability against multiple normal mobs, and I don’t know how anyone could view mesmers as overpowered in that situation right now. Are we just not supposed to use phantasm traits unless we’re doing dungeons or PvP? Is that the intention? Because I’m going to keep my phantasm setup for general PvE usage, but it feels a lot like ANet doesn’t actually want me to play that way.

Exactly.

I really don’t get this as the deployment of phantasms in most PVP situations hasn’t changed at all. So Phantasm builds are basic the same specially in 1vs1 situations. Anyways you can kill noobs much faster using a shatter build.

But the changes significantly impact Mesmers in PVE which they are already very subpar (I haven’t leveled a necro or hunter or thief yet).

So if the nerf was for pvp has no one heard of conditional programming?? You go into pvp increase buff time, your in pve, set values on recharge to y. I guess something like this is to hard for anet to do.

I think they gave a reason why they haven’t split PvE and PvP, I don’t remember from where, but this is something needed desperately in game. GW1 was amazing because of this. Mesmers in PvE did not deserve this nerf on their phantasms.

Somehow I see it as an overlook on their part in the first place, such as the new 20% recharge on weapons, phantasms now gains 40% reduction instead of 20%. so 15 used to drop to 12s. Now 20 – 40% = 12s.

No, the Weapon recharge doesnt stack with illusion recharge. They never were 40%.

I rly loved the idea of phantasms and clones being the hexes from GW1. But now i kinda just hate it atleast in PvP. They just die to quickly and the CD is too long for them to be usefull. Kinda hoping for a weapon without clones and phantasms now… That has good AoE as well! But till then im loving my engineer

Shade.8971:

I think they gave a reason why they haven’t split PvE and PvP, I don’t remember from where, but this is something needed desperately in game. GW1 was amazing because of this. Mesmers in PvE did not deserve this nerf on their phantasms.

It is as pvp issues are now affecting pve in a way that is detrimental to this class. I was out in Orr after the patch and forget it with all these events and my aoe at 28 secs now I can’t do enough damage to random trash mobs to get loot. If it were not for veterans I doubt I could get any event loot.

DiogoSilva.7089:

You guys are too frail. The mesmer is one of the strongest professions for pvp at the moment, and more nerfs will come. Phantasms cooldowns were too short, they were too spammable, and the consequences for killing phantasms were questionable.

Changing one build from overpowered to reasonably strong is not going to destroy that build, unless mesmers still have other overpowered builds, which might be the case.

But the unfortunate thing is any changes they make in PvP affects PvE as well.

Mesmer is sort of the odd duck in that the class seems like it was built more with PvP in mind than PvE. Certain things that are very viable in PvP to the point where Mesmer is really powerful are sort of lackluster when taken into the PvE environment. Shatters, for example, are a good example. Since stuff in PvE generally doesn’t live as long (DEs, especially), it’s not as easy for us to work to our full potential.

There is this really delicate balance between how Mesmer works in PvP and PvE. I think it’s something that they’re going to need to address at some point, because they’re either going to swing things too far in one direction where the Mesmer is really underpowered in PvE to keep him balanced in PvP or they’ll swing things in the other direction where he’ll be really overpowered in PvP to keep him balanced in PvE. I don’t think just finagling our numbers is ever going to bring PvP and PvE in line.

Asylum.3259:

No, the Weapon recharge doesnt stack with illusion recharge. They never were 40%.

They do and always did, it’s just the tooltip that isn’t updated.

The recharge on my warlock increased from 18s to 20s (11%), and there was a net change in my chaos causing skills of 0. Time to demand the firstborn sons of everyone at Anet.

Killua.8041:

Asylum.3259:

No, the Weapon recharge doesnt stack with illusion recharge. They never were 40%.

They do and always did, it’s just the tooltip that isn’t updated.

Ill have to do some testing, but for sure, the tooltip doesnt update

This is just disgusting quite frankly, nerfing the weakest PvE class because some PvP whiners have less intelligence then a PvE mob. I paid just as much money as them to play the game, why should I be treated like a second class citizen? Then to rub salt into the wound add some more bugs. And why the hell was Chaos Storm nerfed?

Looks like its time to make Warrior and Engineer characters now, obviously what they want us to play.

Fozee.1083

ANet doesn’t make changes that weren’t very carefully thought out and implemented.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Smiter%27s_Boon_

Saw the mesmer nerf in spvp coming from a mile away, but the PvE ones are unjustified.

Asylum.3259:

People keep saying a 4-6 second increase in cooldown isnt much. But your wrong.

As a warrior, if your main ability gets nerfed 4-6 seconds. Ok no problem.
As a mesmer, if your main ability gets nerfed 4-6 seconds, AND can die before it even does its damage / effect. Thats a problem. if every 16-20 seconds my main ability can be shutdown by massive boss AOE and other abilities, before it can even do its damage. Thats where it becomes unfair. A warriors only potential problem is him missing. Though assuming he knows what hes doing. I doubt he will miss.

Exactly this^

The issue with increased cooldowns is the phantasms can easily never get to do anything at all, because they get insta killed.

This nerf is not a properly-considered adjustment. The phantasms are already full of potential fail each time we spawn the stupid things.

They need to take away the hp bar from phantasms and make them like guardian spirit weapons (spawned, have no hp so aren’t killable, last as long as the tooltip says).

The thing that irks me the most is we have a laundry list of bugged traits/tool tips. I can’t even make an informed decision on what i should change my build to if a lot of my traits don’t overlap or do what the tooltip says.

I need to check the wiki, then reference the stickied thread here (which is a joke imo) and hope i land with a build that can get me through pve.

Then i go duo with my thief friend who kills things before my now 20 second CD phantasm attacks twice.

I don’t like the changes but the whole separation of pvp and pve concerns is stupid. I wish they would just come out and say this is a pvp game and pve is just there as something to fill in between. I’m tired of non pvpers buying and playing obviously pvp based games and then complaining about how pvp affects pve.

Warriors didn’t get any nerfs this patch. They probably also didn’t have any new bugs introduced, if they have any at all.

I think I know what I’m playing this week (It’s a warrior).

Esham.4203:

The thing that irks me the most is we have a laundry list of bugged traits/tool tips. I can’t even make an informed decision on what i should change my build to if a lot of my traits don’t overlap or do what the tooltip says.

I need to check the wiki, then reference the stickied thread here (which is a joke imo) and hope i land with a build that can get me through pve.

Then i go duo with my thief friend who kills things before my now 20 second CD phantasm attacks twice.

The 20 second cooldown phantasm that dies after two hits…90% of the time lucky if it lives long enough to attack once.

What is the reason behind increase recharge time for chaos storm?
Its only AoE skill mesmer had…and I already think it was too long pre-patch…
Now I dont know what to do on my staff mesmer…Just spam skill 1 and wait for all the CDs? XD

Bead.8609:

I’m tired of non pvpers buying and playing obviously pvp based games and then complaining about how pvp affects pve.

I’m tired of PvP community ruining games for people who play them to have fun and acting like they are better then everybody else.

I agree we (mesmers) are just a little bit overpowered in PVP. But, in PVE, no matter what build we suck. Now, we got more F’d in PVE. But, when you separated PVE and PVP, please, keep separated nerfs/buffs. You guys (Anet) just doing same crap as Blizzard, nerfing class because of PVP, making it much worse in PVE.

Edit: Guess I was right long ago when I said they don’t know how to balance professions.

All I can say is thank kitten I already leveled my mesmer to 80, just leaving it parked on farm mode now. Cheers >.<

Bead.8609:

I don’t like the changes but the whole separation of pvp and pve concerns is stupid. I wish they would just come out and say this is a pvp game and pve is just there as something to fill in between. I’m tired of non pvpers buying and playing obviously pvp based games and then complaining about how pvp affects pve.

Answer me this why make suchs a huge PvE worlds with so many elements and dungeons with several ways to play them, if the game is pvp based? Seems like alot of work gone in to something thats in your eyes worth less then the PvP.

Hey guys did you know we pwnd face in pvp so much so that we were the most played class that did the most damage and just melted face on everyone and thing we touched, that this nerf was warranted…..

Thank you anet for this well thought out change, hours and hours must have been spent crunching the numbers to get it right to where we would suck in both environments. I thank you for the dedication to your mission of reshaping mmo’s and making this such a unique experience…….

Mystik.9561:

Hey guys did you know we pwnd face in pvp so much so that we were the most played class that did the most damage and just melted face on everyone and thing we touched, that this nerf was warranted…..

Thank you anet for this well thought out change, hours and hours must have been spent crunching the numbers to get it right to where we would suck in both environments. I thank you for the dedication to your mission of reshaping mmo’s and making his such a unique experience…….

If they spent hours crunching numbers they should have found the various bugs that make these changes more of a nerf than they should be. Your sucking up is unwarranted and irrational.

Turtles All The Way Down.5608:

Mystik.9561:

Hey guys did you know we pwnd face in pvp so much so that we were the most played class that did the most damage and just melted face on everyone and thing we touched, that this nerf was warranted…..

Thank you anet for this well thought out change, hours and hours must have been spent crunching the numbers to get it right to where we would suck in both environments. I thank you for the dedication to your mission of reshaping mmo’s and making his such a unique experience…….

If they spent hours crunching numbers they should have found the various bugs that make these changes more of a nerf than they should be. Your sucking up is unwarranted and irrational.

Oh did you not notice how drenched in sarcasm my statement was??

O_o

I can’t help but fear that we’re still looking at the tip of the iceberg…

Woah !
I didn’t realize I was that powerfull in PVE that I needed to be hit smashed with Nerf Hammer. (seems also we are the only one with such a nerf in this patch)

I thought Annette has learned their lesson with GW1.
Why not bringing back the PvP versions of skills ?
Easy to balance one side of the game without obliterating the other one.
But, that would be a smart move…

RIP Phantasm Build Mesmer
You will be missed.

Re-rolling to Ranger.

Week after week after week, I’ve been waiting on numerous skill and trait bug fix for the Mesmer, but the progress has been really slow. I am too very disappointed in this week’s patch note that fixed ZERO skill and trait related bugs.

I’ve roughly 600+ hours played on my Mesmer and I still haven’t finished my personal storyline. Why? It’s because I still want to play the game slow for hoping one day I will be able to fully enjoy playing a bug free profession that I’ve my heart set on Aug 25th.

At this rate, I’m starting to doubt if I’ll ever get a chance to fully enjoy playing the Mesmer without bugs. I have my list of goals and accomplishments set out in this game and everyday I’m making a small progress. I really don’t want this game to end for me with all those bugs not getting fixed.

Please, developers, if you’re reading this, “please fix the bugs in order of their severity before balancing takes priority.”

As a true legitimate gamer, I’ve never used a single exploit in the past. I know there are a lot player who will appreciate the fix on Mesmer portal exploit in WvW.

At last, let’s not forget how long it took devs to fix bugs and make balance changes in GW1. I started my GW1 legacy since Oct 2009 and played the game extensively for almost 3 years. Overall it gave me a stellar gaming experience, but then the game had years to correct its flaws. I’m sure by 2015, new players to GW2 will have an absolutely incredible gaming experience. I understand games as complicated as this will take time. Like Arena Net’s official response earlier, “no player’s time is more valuable than others.” I just hope that we don’t have to endure too much longer for the best gaming experience possible.

While my first reaction was certainly one of dismay for the direction taken, I think the actual changes are probably quite reasonable.

I would say that the phantasms affected (and certainly warlock/duelist/swordsman are all leagues above the other phantasms, except maybe warden) could have been seen as a little too good for passive DPS minions, and a few seconds of extra delay before summoning new ones could be a preferable solution to simply reducing the damage output directly.

The chaos storm/chaos armour change does seem a bit disappointing, but I don’t see a five second increase killing its usefulness. I’d like to wait and see how that changes the feel of staff combat, if at all.

Oh, and does anyone else still have a warlock on an 18 second recharge? Has that change not gone through yet?

Edit: Also, I love the fact that casting times are now visible on skills. Unclear tooltips has been a long-standing issue, and that’s definitely a welcome improvement.

Mystik.9561

Oh did you not notice how drenched in sarcasm my statement was??

I did not, mainly because it’s the kind of thing I would expect someone out there to actually say. On that regard in this case I was mistaken.

As a PvE mesmer, this is just depressing. I checked the patch notes right after the update, hoping it might have fixed at least some of the traits that are bugged. Maybe I should just expect the worst with each update though, because they have been mostly bad news every time. Arenanet had PvE and PvP skills separate in some cases for Guild Wars, why couldn’t they have done that here rather than further weaken the already weak PvE mesmer to balance PvP? It just boggles the mind…

For now, I’ll play alts until something changes I think. Playing my mesmer was already a chore compared to my other characters, and it seems its only getting worse.