Guild Wars 2

“Enemies under Torment will take damage periodically; as they move, they’ll take even more damage. In looking to expand the condition diversity of thieves and mesmers, we decided to include Torment skills for those two professions as well.”

I’ll definitely be switching my Mesmer back to a condi specc, as it was my favorite way to play my Mesmer. Maybe this next patch will make us a reliable source of applicable condition damage again. I’m excited for the possibilities of Torment!

osif.8673:

“Enemies under Torment will take damage periodically; as they move, they’ll take even more damage. In looking to expand the condition diversity of thieves and mesmers, we decided to include Torment skills for those two professions as well.”

I’ll definitely be switching my Mesmer back to a condi specc, as it was my favorite way to play my Mesmer. Maybe this next patch will make us a reliable source of applicable condition damage again. I’m excited for the possibilities of Torment!

I think i’m going to do a backflip in absolute joy at the addition of this condition, it’s like my favorite skill from Rift on my Dominator(Storm Shackles)!

If it goes onto my scepter i will be a very very happy mesmer!

Durzlla.6295:

osif.8673:

“Enemies under Torment will take damage periodically; as they move, they’ll take even more damage. In looking to expand the condition diversity of thieves and mesmers, we decided to include Torment skills for those two professions as well.”

I’ll definitely be switching my Mesmer back to a condi specc, as it was my favorite way to play my Mesmer. Maybe this next patch will make us a reliable source of applicable condition damage again. I’m excited for the possibilities of Torment!

I think i’m going to do a backflip in absolute joy at the addition of this condition, it’s like my favorite skill from Rift on my Dominator(Storm Shackles)!

If it goes onto my scepter i will be a very very happy mesmer!

If I’m not mistaken that rift move was absolutely broken and OP when it first launched XD

ronpierce.2760:

Durzlla.6295:

osif.8673:

“Enemies under Torment will take damage periodically; as they move, they’ll take even more damage. In looking to expand the condition diversity of thieves and mesmers, we decided to include Torment skills for those two professions as well.”

I’ll definitely be switching my Mesmer back to a condi specc, as it was my favorite way to play my Mesmer. Maybe this next patch will make us a reliable source of applicable condition damage again. I’m excited for the possibilities of Torment!

I think i’m going to do a backflip in absolute joy at the addition of this condition, it’s like my favorite skill from Rift on my Dominator(Storm Shackles)!

If it goes onto my scepter i will be a very very happy mesmer!

If I’m not mistaken that rift move was absolutely broken and OP when it first launched XD

Oh it was lol, it did like 1/4th of their health bar every second they were moving, but it’s fixed now and remains to be my favorite xD

Durzlla.6295:

ronpierce.2760:

Durzlla.6295:

osif.8673:

“Enemies under Torment will take damage periodically; as they move, they’ll take even more damage. In looking to expand the condition diversity of thieves and mesmers, we decided to include Torment skills for those two professions as well.”

I’ll definitely be switching my Mesmer back to a condi specc, as it was my favorite way to play my Mesmer. Maybe this next patch will make us a reliable source of applicable condition damage again. I’m excited for the possibilities of Torment!

I think i’m going to do a backflip in absolute joy at the addition of this condition, it’s like my favorite skill from Rift on my Dominator(Storm Shackles)!

If it goes onto my scepter i will be a very very happy mesmer!

If I’m not mistaken that rift move was absolutely broken and OP when it first launched XD

Oh it was lol, it did like 1/4th of their health bar every second they were moving, but it’s fixed now and remains to be my favorite xD

It is a very fun concept. I will enjoy it. But I am a LITTLE worried about thief (the best mobile class in the entire game) getting an anti movement ability. Kinda makes me nervous.

ronpierce.2760:

It is a very fun concept. I will enjoy it. But I am a LITTLE worried about thief (the best mobile class in the entire game) getting an anti movement ability. Kinda makes me nervous.

I’m not. Condi thieves, like mesmers currently, are almost in a laughable state… which is why you don’t see very many. I think this is a good step in creating build diversity for thieves, (as well as mesmers now that they killed our confusion speccs) so you don’t just see a bunch of d/p thieves trolling around.

Hope we have decent application… looking forward to dusting off the rabid gear.

Torment… hmm.

Might be fun.

kitten you Anet, you always do this! Now I’m all excited for all the changes, but I’m also afraid you’ll break something at the same time :P

Plus now I have to collect a set of condi gear.

The stunbreak comment has me worried – I hope they leave decoy and blink alone.

Otherwise I can’t wait to see what they’ve done with the traits.

All I’m scared of is that something’s gonna get nerfed.. hard. If I had to guess, I’m pretty sure iLeap/swap is going to lose its stunbreak application…

I’m betting we’ll see this “Torment” on either…

Scepter auto / Staff auto / Chaos Storm / Torch Phantasm.

I’d personally love to see Scepter or Staff autoattacks get a buff.

Durzlla.6295:

Dominator(Storm Shackles)!

Seriously, that class/soul was one of the best in mmo history. and yes ss was freaking incredible, but it also roots and snared and AOE (8) lol. also Haunting Pain which was the reverse – you had to move to survive. don’t forget Traitorous Influence. so awesome.

This new condition actually fits very nicely into the mesmer theme. We are meant to restrict our opponent and punish them for doing mistakes. Confusion does this and Torment could complement it very well.

I would like to see it on the scepter and torch, both highly underused weapons for us. God replacing the chance of vulnerability with torment on the staff #1 would be so amazing, but I think the staff is fine as it is.

If they add Torment to Mantra of Pain.. (I mean, the dude yells “Agony, Torment, Pain!”)I will be devastated… Because that most likely means a higher cooldown.

Then again, “Agony” is also chanted.. and that’s a pseudo-condition.

Wouldn’t that be hilarious? They only add the condition to a Mantra, and to balance it out, nerf all our other builds somehow lol

May I ask where the quote was posted? :O

Bearlin.7238:

May I ask where the quote was posted? :O

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/upcoming-skill-and-trait-changes/

I’m hoping it scales properly. WIth a lot of +condition damage it should be something that causes an enemy (like with retaliation) to think about whether moving or eating the next attack is better. But, it can’t be too strong without +condition damage because then it would be a free move-restrictor; especially deadly in the hands of a glass-cannon thief.

Torment will scale in intensity. To what degree remains to be seen.

source: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Torment

Torment … nice. A total throwback to this GW1 skill: http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Weaken_Knees

It was one of the most debilitating hexes in the game and caused some serious damage if you couldn’t cleanse it. You just hoped you had a hex removal handy or a monk around to do it for you. Really curious at what the damage rates will be for torment.

Since it will stack in intensity, it reminds me a lot of confusion – punishing you for taking action. Imagine confusion with torment – can’t attack/can’t move without damage. I think that ‘could’ potentially put confusion into more relevance. Will have to see of course.

I wonder if you can stunbreak torment like with fear, or whether you have to use condition removal.

Curunen.8729:

I wonder if you can stunbreak torment like with fear, or whether you have to use condition removal.

It’s a condition, per Anet in the article.

“… Torment skills for those two professions as well.”

i can´t help but this sentence reads like: all profession but mesmer and thieve will get torment. but heres the good news at the end we decided to give mesmers and thieves the new condition too

a bit strange or not?

hardloop von edgehoven.8512:

“… Torment skills for those two professions as well.”

i can´t help but this sentence reads like: all profession but mesmer and thieve will get torment. but heres the good news at the end we decided to give mesmers and thieves the new condition too

a bit strange or not?

No, according to the writeup, necros were originally the only ones to get the condition, but because thief and mesmer condition builds are lacking, anet also decided to give torment to them as well.

Maybe they will fix izerker at the same time replacing the cripple effect with torment =) lol I kid, I kid

Confusion plus Torment = I can’t move or attack while you kill me. Woohoo! Not to mention if you are running with a guardian who throws up retal!

whhhait! a condition penalizing movement? movement important in pvp? positioning kind of the king in pvp for mesmers?
…….
profit!

edit: and suddenly 8 stacks of torment hits for 200/m…..

Finally! Some love for mesmer! Thank Grenth! I’m really hoping this goes into scepter / torch skills.

haha no way this would perhaps replace stakitten vulnerability? =)

Now watch …
Just watch …

Watch Torment not scale on Condition dmg at all.
Watch it scale according to Power or something else ridiculous.

I just don’t trust Anet not to giveth and taketh away.

Even if it does scale on condition damage, this won’t make cond mesmers viable. The only application, supposedly, is on the counter for the scepter. Which applies nothing else but confusion. Which sucks. And it only gives 3 stacks of torment. Which can be the equivilent of anywhere from 2.25 bleeds and 4.5 bleeds. The staff can maintain ~6 plus almost perma burning.

If you use the only weapon that can access it, you’ll do far less damage than you currently do. Which is already pretty crappy.

lol no. If vuln from WoC was removed and bleed or burn or confusion was added to scepter autos then something half decent could happen. You want condi roll an engi or look at nec is getting, nec will destroy da competition lol

Iavra.8510:

This new condition actually fits very nicely into the mesmer theme. We are meant to restrict our opponent and punish them for doing mistakes. Confusion does this and Torment could complement it very well.

Fear also fits nicely into the mesmer theme as well, though sadly even a condition that affects purely the mind is missing from the mesmer arsenal, doesn’t make sense to me.

Bas.7406:

Confusion plus Torment = I can’t move or attack while you kill me. Woohoo! Not to mention if you are running with a guardian who throws up retal!

Am I the only person who thought ‘torment then fear’? XD

Do we actually apply this with anything but Scepter #2? I understand Thieves and Mesmers will only get limited access since this will be the “Necro condition”.

Really excited about this – going to start stockpiling dungeon tokens in advance so I can switch straight to a condition build if this turns out to be good!

AFAIK it appears Torment is only present on one skill each for Necros, Thieves and Mesmers. All the same any move to make the Sceptre a condition damage weapon is a plus in my books, although I think the Ether Bolt chain still needs to output some condition damage. It seems like the buff to Malicious Sceptre is to compensate for this, but really; it doesn’t compensate for the lack of spammable condition application.

Another change I think that may balance this out is to make Sceptre Clones use the entire Ether Bolt chain (with Ether Clone not conjuring another Clone of course) to increase Bleeding application from Sharper Images… or just raise Sceptre Clone RoF.

Ether Bolt is fine as power, IMO. I mean really, the way it is right now, most damage is tilted towards power due to how many stats support it. If scepter had only condition damage that’d be meh because then power builds had no ranged 1H option.

Rather, I think both swords and scepter should provide a mix of stat-scaling so that you can scale them either with Power/Precision/Expertise, or with Malice.

Nothing official has been released. We have no clue what traits, weapons, skills, utilities, etc this will go on. The “leaked” patch notes could be fake, or incomplete.

Well, let’s be honest. How many Power builds use the Sceptre, except for Phantasm builds that want that extra OP Phantasm? Okay, Phantasm builds are really popular right now but they’re a dueling gimmick (although it looks as though that may be changing). Shatter builds always use the GS or Staff with the MH Sword.

Making Illusionary Counter a Condition Damage attack would only further serve to shift it away from the Power end (and make it even less desirable: if there are people who use the Sceptre seriously in a Power build I doubt they’d continue now), putting it pretty much right in the middle of the Power – Condition Damage spectrum. Which further reinforces the idea that it’s trying to be everything and is master of nothing.

The only reason that Power and Condition builds use it is because they have no choice: it’s the only MH other than the Sword for Power builds, and it is the only weapon other than the Staff that has some Condition Damage for Condition builds.

And I think the MH Sword actually scales better off Condition Damage than the Sceptre does ATM, simply because Sword Clones are much better at inflicting Bleeding than Sceptre Clones are and Confusion is pretty lacklustre in PvP/WvW.

Oh you’re right, right now that balance is completely bonkers. Not argueing that. It also smells that our condition damage depends soooo much on Sharper Images, to the point where only a handful of builds don’t take it. Meh.

omg omg omg conditions omg!hell kitten yes!!!!ty anet!

castlemanic.3198:

Iavra.8510:

This new condition actually fits very nicely into the mesmer theme. We are meant to restrict our opponent and punish them for doing mistakes. Confusion does this and Torment could complement it very well.

Fear also fits nicely into the mesmer theme as well, though sadly even a condition that affects purely the mind is missing from the mesmer arsenal, doesn’t make sense to me.

Bas.7406:

Confusion plus Torment = I can’t move or attack while you kill me. Woohoo! Not to mention if you are running with a guardian who throws up retal!

Am I the only person who thought ‘torment then fear’? XD

Actually, mesmers had access to Fear on their Chaos Armor and Chaos Storm, but it was “OP” on Chaos Armor and “Useless” on Chaos Storm because they’d run out of the storm, so it was flat out removed from the former, and replaced with daze on the later.

Mesmers never had Fear on Chaos Armour. The old Chaos Armour applied Regeneration or Protection on hit (casting the skill didn’t grant Protection) and inflicted the same conditions as it does now.

Embolism.8106:

Mesmers never had Fear on Chaos Armour. The old Chaos Armour applied Regeneration or Protection on hit (casting the skill didn’t grant Protection) and inflicted the same conditions as it does now.

Are you sure it wasn’t on Chaos Armor too? And it always had swiftness attached to it as one of the boons (as it still does), and i knew the prot was random. shrugs may have been wrong with that, could’ve sworn it did in BE1

Durzlla.6295:

Embolism.8106:

Mesmers never had Fear on Chaos Armour. The old Chaos Armour applied Regeneration or Protection on hit (casting the skill didn’t grant Protection) and inflicted the same conditions as it does now.

Are you sure it wasn’t on Chaos Armor too? And it always had swiftness attached to it as one of the boons (as it still does), and i knew the prot was random. shrugs may have been wrong with that, could’ve sworn it did in BE1

Swiftness was added to replace Protection as a random proc while Protection was made to be on-cast, because people complained that Chaos Armour wasn’t “armoury” enough.

Which is stupid, that was actually a nerf (since the combo version lost Protection as a proc, and back then Illusionary Membrane had no CD); but the dim-witted masses celebrated.

The idea then was that each Staff skill took care of a group of boons and conditions (and always one more condition than boons), without overlap, and together covering all conditions and boons (except Vigour, and back then Stability wasn’t a boon). Fear and Swiftness were the domain of Chaos Storm.

Clever a-net! Leek your own notes to see how the community reacts so you can alter as you see fit and do no wrong VERY CLEVER!

Richard Nixon.6573:

hardloop von edgehoven.8512:

“… Torment skills for those two professions as well.”

i can´t help but this sentence reads like: all profession but mesmer and thieve will get torment. but heres the good news at the end we decided to give mesmers and thieves the new condition too

a bit strange or not?

No, according to the writeup, necros were originally the only ones to get the condition, but because thief and mesmer condition builds are lacking, anet also decided to give torment to them as well.

ah ok.

but still my paranoid brain telling me, that the massive complaints about op 1vs1 mesmers was telling anet to give him one or two counterparts. to make it a little less obvious tehy spent mesmers torment too.
but can u imagine what a necro will do with a movement relying mesmer when he gets torment and conditions? not to speak of thieves with heavy condition/movement builds. very clever.
on the other hand …it would end the idiotic screams about op 1vs1 mesmers

I agree. If the leaked notes are true, condi mesmers still won’t be viable. Here’s to hoping they’re false! Or not complete, at least.

osif.8673:

I agree. If the leaked notes are true, condi mesmers still won’t be viable. Here’s to hoping they’re false! Or not complete, at least.

Same here. I really want to be able to use PU and the Torch and not feel like I’m gimping myself.