Guild Wars 2

Hi all! I was kinda hesitant to post this at first because no one might reply and leave it like another dead thread but here goes.

I am reading a lot of [REWORK] for the weapon skills which is really good! Although The BUG FIXES are a priority too, It kinda makes me feel good that people are sharing their ideas to improve the mesmer class. This an opinion but i feel some people are complacent with the state of the mesmer now.

So here I am, wanting to start a brainstorming thread with our Traits. I feel that some of the traits are overlooked and only the popular ones and the new ones are getting attention.

So here are my ideas:

Wastrel’s Punishment

GM minor, costs 25 points for a meager 5% increase in damage for foes not using a skill. (stunned or dazed or just not doing anything)

Too underwhelming for 25 points, Sigil of impact by itself provides 10% more damage for stunned foes.

Suggestion:

Change the functionality of it to something else, current effect is too situational.
Ideas?

Confusing Combatants

GM minor, again 25 points for 1 stack of confusion for BOTH clones and phantasms.
Debilitating Dissipation provides 3 stacks of bleeds for an Adept Major trait, although RNG. Much easier to get going along the tree.

Suggestion:

Destroy #6 Rune effect of Perplexity.

Confusing Combatants now does: Current effect and 5 stacks of confusion on interrupt (CD: 10 secs)

No more other classes applying it higher than mesmers which confusion is our main condition after all. No more perplexity rune nerfs. Also, the fact that it is a GM minor trait, not all condi builds would be able to abuse it because it would require you to go deep into the dueling tree.

Protected Mantras

Gain 600 toughness when channeling a mantra. Dueling Major.

Another preference trait.

Suggestion:

Reduce channel time of mantras by 0.75 or 1 sec. Why would you need toughness if you could just channel it faster so you would not have to take that many hits as opposed to the duration it has now?

Pretty balanced IMO because it would compete with DE on a major slot. This makes mantras viable than it is now.

Blinding Befuddlement

Foes get a stack of confusion when they are blinded. ICD 5 secs.

Untraited confusion and without condition duration, confusion it procs is only 4 secs, meaning in a 5 secs you could only proc it one time. Which is again a waste for a major slot.

We only have few blinds to begin with:

Prestige
Signet of Midnight
Chaotic Interruption (which is RNG)
Counterspell (1 or the other, torment or blind)
Magic Bullet (which is only on 3rd traget)

2 of which are on 30 sec cds
2 which are RNG
and Counterspell which you have trade 5 stacks of torment for it.

Sugesstion:

1.) Remove ICD or Keep ICD but raise the stacks of confusion
2.)Merge the effect of Dazzling Glamours and Blinding Befuddlement.

Confusing Enchantments

Major trait for only 1 stack of confusion again and only on ENTERING or EXITING

Suggestion:

1.) Raise it a minimum of 3 stacks OR
2.) Make the effect pulse every 1 second (1 stack per every 1 second a foe is inside a Glamour skill)

Furious Interruption

Gain quickness when you interrupt a foe. ICD 15secs.

The effect is really good but with the ICD it’s kinda meh.

Suggestion:

1.) Quickness also affects your phantasms OR
2.) Gain quickness and fury. (Remove Fury on Bountiful interruption and replace it with stability.

Chaotic Interruption

Immoblize and grant a random condition(blind, cripple, chill) whenever you interrupt a foe.
My favorite trait but it could use some improvements.

Suggestion:

1.) Change cripple with poison (Although cripple lasts longer than the original immobilize, you could only see its difference when you focus on condition duration, making the disparity between the length of time with immo and cripple slightly bigger.

OR

2.) Retain Current effect but,. Random Condition is only triggered after the Immobilize.

PS I have a lot of ideas with confusion, some might find it OP yes but my way of reasoning is that confusion has already been nerfed so buffing confusion stacks would not make it a big deal. I hope.

-Reserved for traits and skills-
-On going testing-

I like the idea of fury as well as quickness for FI. I agree the cripple seems kind of redundant on CI, and poison would be nice

Random thought: it would be really nice if we could trait for something that meant we don’t feel like we need to always have blink + decoy.

Wastrel’s Punishment: This is certainly an odd one, but I think it should remain a damage modifier trait like so many other classes have. To that end, maybe make the 5% modifier global, and 10% if foe has vulnerability (synergy with domination line).

Confusing Enchantments: I think 3 stacks is too high, maybe 2.

The rest I have a list I personally maintain – some that go with your ideas, some a bit different:

Confusing Combatants: I was thinking to have 2 stacks of confusion applied per illusion. I like your idea of the confusion proc on interrupt, but it doesn’t really match the trait title.

Protected Mantras: I honestly think the mantra channel reduction time shouldn’t go in this trait – should go in Mantra Mastery. Regarding this trait though, I think we should get 1s of stability each mantra charge in addition to maybe a lesser amount of toughness. Then for Mantra Mastery, I think .75 or 1s is too OP; I would go something like 2s as a shave (currently 2.75s). You would definitely notice that difference. With those changes, I’d swap Protected Mantras and Mantra Mastery in their trait locations.

Furious Interruption: I like your #2 suggestion (except the BI one, I think that stays). This was my thought – Gain 3 seconds of quickness and fury when you interrupt a foe, 12 second recharge. The current effect is just meh.

Chaotic Interruption: I like the fact this trait is focused primarily on impairing movement, so I wouldn’t want to add poison. To that end, your #2 sounds good but I often wonder if that would be too OP. My thought would be to always immobilize 2s and chill 3s. You still get the benefit of skill cooldowns increased by 66% while they’re immobilized. This would be immensely better than current – if they get crippled while immob’d (useless) or blinded (better, but not nearly as good as chilled).

Blinding Befuddlement: Completely agree with your #1. I say they start with that and see where we go from there. You also missed a couple important blind proc’ing sources in 1) chaos armor, and 2) if you take dazzling glamours that adds up to 3 more. All put together that’s a lot of potential blind applicators one could spam, so you’d have to be careful with this trait.

First, they’d need to UN-Nerf Blinding Befuddlement. That Trait used to have no ICD, at all. It was a casualty of the WvW Confusion Debacle.

I can agree with Confusing Enchantments. Hell, if you wanted to make it 3/per, simply make it a GM Trait.

Chaotic Interruption could work as follows: Always procs Immobilize, random chance of Chill/Blind/or Confusion. It would finally place a “Confusion on Interrupt” Trait in the (correct!) hands of Mesmers, without reliance on Perplexity 6/6.
Or: Hell, it’s a kittening GM Trait. A stack of Confusion and the Immobilize, with random chance of Chill/Blind … I would think is “workable.” (I say one stack Confusion, since I’d rather avoid Yet. Another. ICD. That bullkitten ruins otherwise good Traits, y’know.)

Wastrel’s could keep the 5%, but also apply Weakness?

As for the rest, I’m not the best Mantra-mes out there. I’ll leave those to someone a bit more <ahem> experienced.
I’d prefer to merely modify the stack number for Confusing Combatants, since it is pretty good in clone-death specs.

Neurophen.9738:

I like the idea of fury as well as quickness for FI. I agree the cripple seems kind of redundant on CI, and poison would be nice

Random thought: it would be really nice if we could trait for something that meant we don’t feel like we need to always have blink + decoy.

I agree. I always feel that blink and decoy is a must on the utility bar. Thats 2 spaces already meaning the last one would for sure go to cleanse

@Scam

That Protected Mantras Idea is great

Protected Mantras

Charging a mantra now gives stability/protection.

I wish more people would join in especially Chaos and Pyro.

>>Diversity is here but the problem is some of the traits not only suck but they would be never be chosen, whereas if they were somewhat improved or changed then that would add a little diversity.

Masterful Reflection

As I recall this only works with f4, not sure if it works with Blurred Inscriptions

1.) Either make it work through other distortion means IF they would add more viable ways. ( Bec. No more BF distortion, 1 is a GM trait :/ )
2.) Ideas?

Harmonious Mantras

Again a GM major trait for 1 additional charge.
I would see people disagreeing with me here but 1 charge is meh for putting 30 points in a trait line.

Suggestion:

1.) Make Mantras 3 charges by default. OR
2.) New effect:

Activating a mantra also grants you the effect of other mantras equipped (Except the heal of course)

Kinda OP but! To get that full effect you gotta build around putting mantras in the utility bar, meaning you would have to choose them over blink, decoy etc. Even if you put 2 mantras, the only max achievable combo is 2 effects (daze+ stability/
daze+cleanse or cleanse/stab) With an ICD of course

IMO this would make building around a mantra build viable!

Mantra Mastery

As skcamow suggested a channel decrease on this trait would be priceless.

Please mesmer forum people join in!

skcamow.3527:

Confusing Combatants: I was thinking to have 2 stacks of confusion applied per illusion. I like your idea of the confusion proc on interrupt, but it doesn’t really match the trait title.

Just the change of the trait name then
But seriously, the interrupt trait should be for mesmers alone. I don’t like the idea that a class that is supposed to specialize in a condition get outclassed by other classes.

I don’t see any class apply fear better than necros, they also have the damage trait,.
I don’t see any class apply blind better than thieves without building a build around it.

Only thing I would absolutely love to see is traits that have to do with clone death be switched to shatter.

So Confusing Combatants and DD and the likes, make them proc on shatter.

That way you fix the OH MA GAWD PU OP!!!11! problem and you make condi shatter really viable.

Ramiel.4931:

Only thing I would absolutely love to see is traits that have to do with clone death be switched to shatter.

So Confusing Combatants and DD and the likes, make them proc on shatter.

That way you fix the OH MA GAWD PU OP!!!11! problem and you make condi shatter really viable.

Wow that would be OP haha.

a great thread. tons of brainstorm potential.
although rather that improving or changing the functionality of traits to improve diversity i would rather suggest a change to how traits work in regards to minor traits to improve diversity.
what i mean is moving some traits in to lower minor traits. particularly weapon traits or other such traits. and for the ability to use minor traits in higher major trait tiers.
this would skyrocket build diversity based on what is placed in the minor trait sections.

so for example in the dueling tree. lets say duelist discipline(pistol trait) was placed in the master minor tier. blade training(sword trait) was placed in the adept minor tier.
from just this alone you could perhaps trade critical infusion for blade training. and grab something else in the adept section. or run deceptive evasion in the master tier and duelist discipline in the master minor tier.

StickerHappy.8052:

Ramiel.4931:

Only thing I would absolutely love to see is traits that have to do with clone death be switched to shatter.

So Confusing Combatants and DD and the likes, make them proc on shatter.

That way you fix the OH MA GAWD PU OP!!!11! problem and you make condi shatter really viable.

Wow that would be OP haha.

No, that wouldn’t solve a thing. People just switch to OH MA GAWD SHATTER OP!!!
Whiners will eventually find something to whine about mesmers, no matter what.

Chaos.3579:

a great thread. tons of brainstorm potential.
although rather that improving or changing the functionality of traits to improve diversity i would rather suggest a change to how traits work in regards to minor traits to improve diversity.
what i mean is moving some traits in to lower minor traits. particularly weapon traits or other such traits. and for the ability to use minor traits in higher major trait tiers.
this would skyrocket build diversity based on what is placed in the minor trait sections.

so for example in the dueling tree. lets say duelist discipline(pistol trait) was placed in the master minor tier. blade training(sword trait) was placed in the adept minor tier.
from just this alone you could perhaps trade critical infusion for blade training. and grab something else in the adept section. or run deceptive evasion in the master tier and duelist discipline in the master minor tier.

Hmm what a nice approach. So you mean instead of minor being constant, do you propose them to be changeable?

But if that was to happen, the hierarchy of traits would be ruined.

StickerHappy.8052:

skcamow.3527:

Confusing Combatants: I was thinking to have 2 stacks of confusion applied per illusion. I like your idea of the confusion proc on interrupt, but it doesn’t really match the trait title.

Just the change of the trait name then
But seriously, the interrupt trait should be for mesmers alone. I don’t like the idea that a class that is supposed to specialize in a condition get outclassed by other classes.

I don’t see any class apply fear better than necros, they also have the damage trait,.
I don’t see any class apply blind better than thieves without building a build around it.

Hey StickerHappy,
Not sure if u’r aware, warriors have a trait called Distracting Strikes that proc 4 stacks of confusion on interrupt. What the hell? Right? It makes no sense.

Maybe I’m greedy but not only I want Confusing Combatants inflict 2 stacks of confusion to bring it up to par with shatter-version CoF, but I also want your take of inflicting confusion on interrupt as well, just put it somewhere else. Maybe it can replace Wastrel’s Punishment?

As for perp rune #6 effect, that can stay as long as we have our own version in the traits.

@Keenlam

I know. Changing the interrupt effect or being greedy as you said to implement the effect to the trait, I mean cmon!! it is a GM minor trait. Requires you to go 25 pts down a trait line. and What do i get, 1 stack of confusion per illusion killed. what the hell. This would be viable if we are talking about pre-confusion nerf.

Raising the stacks is an obvious change too.

Also I don’t see why other classes can put out confusion better than us. Engies Bomb + the wrench 10 stacks already. 2 attacks. With the rune, 15 stacks for the interrupt.

Might as well give fear to mesmers then.

Wastrel’s Punishment: Should be totally changed to something else. At the moment all these ‘’extra damage while inactive’’ buffs only promote daze/stun spamming.
Example: You have mantra of distraction ready to use. You can either use it for:;
1. Interrupting an important skill you actually focussed on to interrupt. Or
2. Use it the moment you’re about to do a shatter or phantasm to gain 5% more damage.
Imagine if this minor trait would be 10%. Would you start picking #2? Probably yes. Kinda my problem. Passive over passive over passive, which pokemon am I? Keeping it’s function and buffing that would come down like that.
Change it to ‘’interrupt causing X’’. This could be weakness, chill or maybe even confusion, though I prefer to gain more access to no-damage conditions.

Confusing Combatants:
Well.. As much as I agree perplexity was one of worst mistakes they’ve made in this game… I don’t think giving mesmer the viability to gain the #6 of the rune for only 5 more points than spent usually (since people always go 20 in dueling) is a very good idea. I like Debilitating Dissipation as clone death trait, but mainly because it applies weakness. Other than that I’m no big fan of clone death traits since it’s very passive play.
I honestly don’t really know much rework for this trait myself.

Protected Mantras:
How sure are you think will make mantra’s viable? 1 second shorter cooldown would make restorative mantra’s a lot stronger. Sure it will make them viable… but maybe a little bit ‘’too viable’‘. I’ve suggested earlier to give stability on channeling the mantra (or at least some sort of passive effect to not get CC’ed) though people wouldnt agree on that due that mantra’s are ‘’there to be interrutped’‘. As that is supposed to be one of their weakness’. I do, however, still disagree on this. The trait ain’t gonna be op if this will happen and neither are people mass gonna use them. Mantra’s are already quite low on the list of the meta and getting interrupted during the cast is not the main problem of them anyway. So yeah, I’ll just throw it in again ; Gain stability/Become immune when channeling a mantra.

Blinding Befuddlement: You forgot the most important one : Chaos armor.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=skSICaJ2vtY&list=PL8ED62A3D9F4A3742
You can see how people just randomly died without me doing anything to them. I do, however, think that this will not be as strong as before since the 50% confusion nerf, but it sure gonna cause some… problems. At least it would make condition mesmer-tank more viable in zerging and staff would become more viable in roaming.

Confusing Enchantments:
Wowowow, 3 stacks? No thanks. This was pre-nerf the easiest way of dealing damage. Drop 2 skills and go afk for the next 20 seconds while applying massive damage. I think 1 stack is more than good enough. Maybe have it’s duration increased by 1 second would come down as a better result. Especially if BB would get un-nerfed.

As for the other 2 I somewhat agree.

@Black Devil.

I agree with some of your points, Wastrel’s Punishment should be changed to something else.

For the confusing enchantments, Maybe 2? I mean confusion was already nerfed so buffing the stacks wouldn’t be so bad right?

Also, Using BB with Dazzling Glamours and Confusing Enchantments, Only. 1 stack of confusion will apply. That’s 2 Master Traits for 1 stack.

@StickerHappy, BlackDevil:
In case I haven’t made myself clear earlier, Wastrel’s Punishment can be changed to proc confusion on interrupt. It’s a minor GM trait, so it should be somewhat powerful.

BlackDevil.9268:

Change it to ‘’interrupt causing X’’. This could be weakness, chill or maybe even confusion, though I prefer to gain more access to no-damage conditions.

Yes please. I need more on-interrupt traits, I didn’t feel pigeonholed enough yet.

I mean the idea is nice, but really, we got so many on-interrupt things (especially with all the Vulnerability Domination causes with it, anyhow), last thing I want is more at this point.

The trait already synergizes well with interrupting. Target is interrupt → not using a skill, or more likely not to → more damage. What you state as the “dilemma” is a positive thing, it gives the player something to pick between. Do you want the guaranteed extra damage, or the ability to interrupt. Risk vs reward.

@Carighan

I get your point but at the same time the 5% increase only affects Shatters and Direct damage. IMO, its too situational at the heat of battle you won’t be able to to tell if it really does something because majority of our damage comes from phants.

Ex. I daze a target, so he can’t use skills, for how many seconds? will that span of time open me to burst with that 5% increase damage? Probably. But how probable would it be?

Amywho, what is your suggestion then?

keenlam.4753:

@StickerHappy, BlackDevil:
In case I haven’t made myself clear earlier, Wastrel’s Punishment can be changed to proc confusion on interrupt. It’s a minor GM trait, so it should be somewhat powerful.

I agree with you. It’s either that or Confusing combatants. A lot of good points here, like Carighan said but at the same I just don’t think it is a good synergy with everything else unless you get Confounding Suggestions, that “Not attacking or doing something” Is granted for sure. if it procs. Your foe can’t dodge too.

A dazed opponent can still dodge.
Immobilized can still allow your foe to do something.

StickerHappy.8052:

@Black Devil.

I agree with some of your points, Wastrel’s Punishment should be changed to something else.

For the confusing enchantments, Maybe 2? I mean confusion was already nerfed so buffing the stacks wouldn’t be so bad right?

Also, Using BB with Dazzling Glamours and Confusing Enchantments, Only. 1 stack of confusion will apply. That’s 2 Master Traits for 1 stack.

That would put it on the same damage before nerf, so erm.. nah thanks :<

@Carighan
No it promotes random cc spam to do more damage. That’s how warriors do their job, just spam that cc baby, cba about interrupting imporant kitten because CC spam and passive effect stacking is so much more rewarding.
Also, mots of our bursts have a quite ‘’building up’’ process. It’s not like; okay stun now and 0.25 sec later i do a massive burst’’. Meaning 3/4 of your CC will be worthless with this trait because you will never be fast enough to gain profit from it as the person you just CC’ed is already out of the CC the moment you deal damage to him.
The only way this trait would be somewhat usefull is with shatter specs and hey, who the hell uses 25-30 in domination with shatter? You need 30 in illusions and 20 in dueling. There’s no space for that ’’extra’’ damage. Even halting strike deals like 10 times the damage you gain from that ’’extra’’ 5 %.

keenlam.4753:

@StickerHappy, BlackDevil:
In case I haven’t made myself clear earlier, Wastrel’s Punishment can be changed to proc confusion on interrupt. It’s a minor GM trait, so it should be somewhat powerful.

How about blind on interrupt? Say 3s. That would help vs thieves.

If they would remove the BB ICD I guess yeah. I also somewhat think its wierd we don’t
have something like eles, where they get extra x% of damage for every boon they have, seeing the amount of boon skill/traits we have.

StickerHappy.8052:

Chaos.3579:

a great thread. tons of brainstorm potential.
although rather that improving or changing the functionality of traits to improve diversity i would rather suggest a change to how traits work in regards to minor traits to improve diversity.
what i mean is moving some traits in to lower minor traits. particularly weapon traits or other such traits. and for the ability to use minor traits in higher major trait tiers.
this would skyrocket build diversity based on what is placed in the minor trait sections.

so for example in the dueling tree. lets say duelist discipline(pistol trait) was placed in the master minor tier. blade training(sword trait) was placed in the adept minor tier.
from just this alone you could perhaps trade critical infusion for blade training. and grab something else in the adept section. or run deceptive evasion in the master tier and duelist discipline in the master minor tier.

Hmm what a nice approach. So you mean instead of minor being constant, do you propose them to be changeable?

But if that was to happen, the hierarchy of traits would be ruined.

yes in some way. altough the basic idea is for there to be options of the trait selected instead of a fixed trait. thus putting a new spin of diversity.

although for hierarchy balance i should assume that traits in the minor trait options should be available to be used in major trait sections. HOWEVER major trait options should not be usable within the minor trait sections.

although if that were to take place alot of traits need to be moved to the minor trait sections such as weapon skill traits so as too allow another choice and allow slightly more diversity with a trade off

Neurophen.9738:

keenlam.4753:

@StickerHappy, BlackDevil:
In case I haven’t made myself clear earlier, Wastrel’s Punishment can be changed to proc confusion on interrupt. It’s a minor GM trait, so it should be somewhat powerful.

How about blind on interrupt? Say 3s. That would help vs thieves.

Chaotic interruption already has the blind although its rng

True. A different approach with the same net result would be to gain ageis on interrupt.

^ICD yes maybe. OR just make it that Daze now pierce stability. It is a GM minor trait anyway.

Chaos.3579:

StickerHappy.8052:

Chaos.3579:

a great thread. tons of brainstorm potential.
although rather that improving or changing the functionality of traits to improve diversity i would rather suggest a change to how traits work in regards to minor traits to improve diversity.
what i mean is moving some traits in to lower minor traits. particularly weapon traits or other such traits. and for the ability to use minor traits in higher major trait tiers.
this would skyrocket build diversity based on what is placed in the minor trait sections.

so for example in the dueling tree. lets say duelist discipline(pistol trait) was placed in the master minor tier. blade training(sword trait) was placed in the adept minor tier.
from just this alone you could perhaps trade critical infusion for blade training. and grab something else in the adept section. or run deceptive evasion in the master tier and duelist discipline in the master minor tier.

Hmm what a nice approach. So you mean instead of minor being constant, do you propose them to be changeable?

But if that was to happen, the hierarchy of traits would be ruined.

yes in some way. altough the basic idea is for there to be options of the trait selected instead of a fixed trait. thus putting a new spin of diversity.

although for hierarchy balance i should assume that traits in the minor trait options should be available to be used in major trait sections. HOWEVER major trait options should not be usable within the minor trait sections.

although if that were to take place alot of traits need to be moved to the minor trait sections such as weapon skill traits so as too allow another choice and allow slightly more diversity with a trade off

Hmm there something I’m missing here. Although the idea is nice, but how would that justify diversity?

EX: Dueling line

Adept Minor Trait Vigor
Master Minor Sharper Images.

Yes I will be able to put the Vigor trait on the master Minor slot, but what would you put in the adept then? Since you can’t put master traits into the minor slot.

Ok, this’ll be real quick because I don’t have a lot of time atm.

Domination Line

• Empowering Mantras is now the Grandmaster Minor trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment is now a Grandmaster Major trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment: On interrupt, refresh the cooldown of the skill that caused the interrupt.

This will heavily promote both lockdown and skilled play in the same trait, and is one of the only possible ways I can see an interrupt build ever really becoming a lockdown build instead of a ‘spam interrupts on downed players’ build.

Pyroathiest.4168:

Ok, this’ll be real quick because I don’t have a lot of time atm.

Domination Line

• Empowering Mantras is now the Grandmaster Minor trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment is now a Grandmaster Major trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment: On interrupt, refresh the cooldown of the skill that caused the interrupt.

This will heavily promote both lockdown and skilled play in the same trait, and is one of the only possible ways I can see an interrupt build ever really becoming a lockdown build instead of a ‘spam interrupts on downed players’ build.

Wow, this is really good.

But how would it affect Mantra of Distraction if I still have a charge left after interrupting?

StickerHappy.8052:

Pyroathiest.4168:

Ok, this’ll be real quick because I don’t have a lot of time atm.

Domination Line

• Empowering Mantras is now the Grandmaster Minor trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment is now a Grandmaster Major trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment: On interrupt, refresh the cooldown of the skill that caused the interrupt.

This will heavily promote both lockdown and skilled play in the same trait, and is one of the only possible ways I can see an interrupt build ever really becoming a lockdown build instead of a ‘spam interrupts on downed players’ build.

Wow, this is really good.

But how would it affect Mantra of Distraction if I still have a charge left after interrupting?

MoD has a 5 second cooldown between charge uses in addition to its main cooldown.

Ohh I see. If your Idea gets put through, kitten .. It would be a dream come true.

I like the idea of making wastrel’s punishment a trait you can choose and I like the effect pyro mentioned as well. It creates another interesting build focus around interrupts. Not sure how it would work in practice – it might be OP for some skills such as chaos storm for example and might need an ICD. You can imagine chaos storm constantly refreshing xD.

I don’t really like putting EM in grandmaster minor – it’s too specific of a trait that affects a small number of builds.

Also some food for thought, the spirit of wastrel’s punishment is about punishing the foe for being idle (whether they are or you put them there). I know this isn’t GW1 but there was a skill called wastrel’s worry which punished your target and nearby foes with significant AE damage if they didn’t use a skill within 3 seconds after getting hexed with it. So I would guess the devs want to keep that type of flavor to this skill.

Of course the trait can be whatever they want it to be too, but a suggestion more along the lines of the original intent might ultimately be more well received.

skcamow.3527:

I like the idea of making wastrel’s punishment a trait you can choose and I like the effect pyro mentioned as well. It creates another interesting build focus around interrupts. Not sure how it would work in practice – it might be OP for some skills such as chaos storm for example and might need an ICD. You can imagine chaos storm constantly refreshing xD.

I don’t really like putting EM in grandmaster minor – it’s too specific of a trait that affects a small number of builds.

Also some food for thought, the spirit of wastrel’s punishment is about punishing the foe for being idle (whether they are or you put them there). I know this isn’t GW1 but there was a skill called wastrel’s worry which punished your target and nearby foes with significant AE damage if they didn’t use a skill within 3 seconds after getting hexed with it. So I would guess the devs want to keep that type of flavor to this skill.

Of course the trait can be whatever they want it to be too, but a suggestion more along the lines of the original intent might ultimately be more well received.

I forgot about Wastrel’s worry. You know honestly our class could be greatly improved (same goes for others) if they would just fix the trait hierarchy.

Put GM major worthy traits or GM minor worthy traits or Adept, etc. It seems like the traits are like “just put whatever”. Introducing new traits, I could see their nice intent but meh. I mean cmon..

If the Devs would look at every other classes suggestions regarding traits.

The reason why I think diversity is so low here is because the traits too choose from is so whack, limiting people’s choices.

Anywho back on topic.

BlackDevil.9268:

StickerHappy.8052:

@Black Devil.

I agree with some of your points, Wastrel’s Punishment should be changed to something else.

For the confusing enchantments, Maybe 2? I mean confusion was already nerfed so buffing the stacks wouldn’t be so bad right?

Also, Using BB with Dazzling Glamours and Confusing Enchantments, Only. 1 stack of confusion will apply. That’s 2 Master Traits for 1 stack.

That would put it on the same damage before nerf, so erm.. nah thanks :<

@Carighan
No it promotes random cc spam to do more damage. That’s how warriors do their job, just spam that cc baby, cba about interrupting imporant kitten because CC spam and passive effect stacking is so much more rewarding.
Also, mots of our bursts have a quite ‘’building up’’ process. It’s not like; okay stun now and 0.25 sec later i do a massive burst’’. Meaning 3/4 of your CC will be worthless with this trait because you will never be fast enough to gain profit from it as the person you just CC’ed is already out of the CC the moment you deal damage to him.
The only way this trait would be somewhat usefull is with shatter specs and hey, who the hell uses 25-30 in domination with shatter? You need 30 in illusions and 20 in dueling. There’s no space for that ’’extra’’ damage. Even halting strike deals like 10 times the damage you gain from that ’’extra’’ 5 %.

No it would not put confusion like the way it was pre-nerf. like how? for 3 stacks?

As I said before engies can put 15 stacks in 3 skills.

5 Stacks Pry Bar 15 secs CD
5 Stacks Concussion Bomb 18 secs CD
Pull from Perplexity 5 Stacks 15 secs CD
Plus not to mention if you hit them 3 stacks More

Thats A total of 18 Stacks. Even without perplexity it’s still 10 stacks. And confusion was supposed to be our themed condition.

Pyroathiest.4168:

Ok, this’ll be real quick because I don’t have a lot of time atm.

Domination Line

• Empowering Mantras is now the Grandmaster Minor trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment is now a Grandmaster Major trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment: On interrupt, refresh the cooldown of the skill that caused the interrupt.

This will heavily promote both lockdown and skilled play in the same trait, and is one of the only possible ways I can see an interrupt build ever really becoming a lockdown build instead of a ‘spam interrupts on downed players’ build.

I drop chaos storm in a zerg, what will happen? Exactly, this will not really work, sorry pyro.
This trait would only be balanced with single target cc’s.

BlackDevil.9268:

Pyroathiest.4168:

Ok, this’ll be real quick because I don’t have a lot of time atm.

Domination Line

• Empowering Mantras is now the Grandmaster Minor trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment is now a Grandmaster Major trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment: On interrupt, refresh the cooldown of the skill that caused the interrupt.

This will heavily promote both lockdown and skilled play in the same trait, and is one of the only possible ways I can see an interrupt build ever really becoming a lockdown build instead of a ‘spam interrupts on downed players’ build.

I drop chaos storm in a zerg, what will happen? Exactly, this will not really work, sorry pyro.
This trait would only be balanced with single target cc’s.

Agreed I stated the same a couple posts up, but I think maybe if it decreased CD’s by 20% that would be really nice. Then you have these powerful interrupt proc’ing skills (temporal curtain, illusionary wave, chaos storm, magic bullet, etc) not refreshed but on lower CD, AND that could stack with weapon specific traits. I could really get excited about something like that and don’t think it’d be OP.

This is very much in line with what I’ve been saying Anet should do with Imbued Diversion – if you successfully land an interrupt with Diversion, decrease the Diversion cooldown by an additional 20%.

BlackDevil.9268:

Pyroathiest.4168:

Ok, this’ll be real quick because I don’t have a lot of time atm.

Domination Line

• Empowering Mantras is now the Grandmaster Minor trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment is now a Grandmaster Major trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment: On interrupt, refresh the cooldown of the skill that caused the interrupt.

This will heavily promote both lockdown and skilled play in the same trait, and is one of the only possible ways I can see an interrupt build ever really becoming a lockdown build instead of a ‘spam interrupts on downed players’ build.

I drop chaos storm in a zerg, what will happen? Exactly, this will not really work, sorry pyro.
This trait would only be balanced with single target cc’s.

So put icd of 15 seconds per skill on it. This way you can’t constantly spam chaos storm into a Zerg, and you’d be forced to use a skill rotation for a full lockdown.

^Gets me excited too. And yeah it would not be OP, considering it is still far along the trait line.

What I do not agree on That it should be a major trait. Retain it being a Minor, Then Fix Power block.

Any suggestions for power block aside from the original no ICD? I mean the Reduced charges from Wastrels + A new Power Block, woooo!

A lot of awesome ideas here.

One thing I’m hoping to get changed are these ridiculous “downed” traits that I’m sure not even the Anet devs have ever used.

• Chaotic Revival (Chaos Armor when you rally)

• Retaliatory Demise (Gain retal when downed)

Both of these traits aren’t even as good as any minor on any of our traitlines. I think that the only way I’d ever consider grabbing a trait like this would be something like:

Chaotic Revival: 10% increased revive speed, summon a chaos storm when reviving.

or

Chaotic Revival: 10% revive speed, gain Chaos Armor when Reviving an ally, copy all current boons onto ally when revived.

And even THEN I’m not sure if it’d be worth it. Other things I’d like to see (though I haven’t given too much thought from a balance perspective)…

- Temporal Enchanter & Glamour Mastery merged.
- Restorative Illusions’ heal improved to how it is with iPersona
- Compounding Celerity reworked (something silly like 25% chance for 5s AoE swiftness on phantasm summon)
- Shattered Conditions moved to Master Tier
- Vengeful Images’ Retaliation duration increased to 15s

Pyroathiest.4168:

BlackDevil.9268:

Pyroathiest.4168:

Ok, this’ll be real quick because I don’t have a lot of time atm.

Domination Line

• Empowering Mantras is now the Grandmaster Minor trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment is now a Grandmaster Major trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment: On interrupt, refresh the cooldown of the skill that caused the interrupt.

This will heavily promote both lockdown and skilled play in the same trait, and is one of the only possible ways I can see an interrupt build ever really becoming a lockdown build instead of a ‘spam interrupts on downed players’ build.

I drop chaos storm in a zerg, what will happen? Exactly, this will not really work, sorry pyro.
This trait would only be balanced with single target cc’s.

So put icd of 15 seconds per skill on it. This way you can’t constantly spam chaos storm into a Zerg, and you’d be forced to use a skill rotation for a full lockdown.

Will cost anet too much time and doubt they got the ’’tech’’ for it yet as such things are nowhere to be found in the game. We got ICD on traits, icd on skills but theres no such thing as them both combined.

Chaos Archangel.5071:

A lot of awesome ideas here.

One thing I’m hoping to get changed are these ridiculous “downed” traits that I’m sure not even the Anet devs have ever used.

• Chaotic Revival (Chaos Armor when you rally)

• Retaliatory Demise (Gain retal when downed)

Both of these traits aren’t even as good as any minor on any of our traitlines. I think that the only way I’d ever consider grabbing a trait like this would be something like:

---

Chaotic Revival: 10% increased revive speed, summon a chaos storm when reviving.

or

Chaotic Revival: 10% revive speed, gain Chaos Armor when Reviving an ally, copy all current boons onto ally when revived.

---

And even THEN I’m not sure if it’d be worth it. Other things I’d like to see (though I haven’t given too much thought from a balance perspective)…

- Temporal Enchanter & Glamour Mastery merged.
- Restorative Illusions’ heal improved to how it is with iPersona
- Compounding Celerity reworked (something silly like 25% chance for 5s AoE swiftness on phantasm summon)
- Shattered Conditions moved to Master Tier
- Vengeful Images’ Retaliation duration increased to 15s

I agree with the death traits. They are really bad unless you plan on dying every time to make the most out of them. LOL

Vengeful Images: Just Revert it back to the Original One

StickerHappy.8052:

Vengeful Images: Just Revert it back to the Original One

Yes please. They won’t do it though.

I really like Pyro’s suggestion. It opens up pve builds a bit too seeing as how they changed our traits so abruptly.

I actually really want something similar done to Imbued Diversion like skcamow suggested. Actually it’s like he read my mind lol. My only thing is that it could conflict with Illusionary Invigoration, but I guess that could be a weakness of picking it.

Edit: Also I personally think Wastrel’s Punishment should actually be Power Block, but I’m 100% sure that will never happen.

Raunchy.6891:

I actually really want something similar done to Imbued Diversion like skcamow suggested. Actually it’s like he read my mind lol. My only thing is that it could conflict with Illusionary Invigoration, but I guess that could be a weakness of picking it.

Assuming you mean it will potentially be redundant by having two recharge reducing traits – whether imbued diversion is a full 35s recharge or 28s, I’ll take the refresh from illusionary invigoration =)

I’ve also thought maybe it should be a flat 20% diversion recharge reduction versus requiring the interrupt proc, but wouldn’t mind either.

Pyroathiest.4168:

Ok, this’ll be real quick because I don’t have a lot of time atm.

Domination Line

• Empowering Mantras is now the Grandmaster Minor trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment is now a Grandmaster Major trait
• Wastrel’s Punishment: On interrupt, refresh the cooldown of the skill that caused the interrupt.

This will heavily promote both lockdown and skilled play in the same trait, and is one of the only possible ways I can see an interrupt build ever really becoming a lockdown build instead of a ‘spam interrupts on downed players’ build.

Brilliant idea on Wastrel’s Punishment. Do u think it needs an icd?
Anyway, my Sig of Dom and Magic Bullet would totally love this trait.

skcamow.3527:

I’ve also thought maybe it should be a flat 20% diversion recharge reduction versus requiring the interrupt proc, but wouldn’t mind either.

Ok, this. I want this to happen. Anet I’m begging.

I like the proposed change to Furious Interruption
I would just do minor change to your proposal.

1.) Your phantasms gain quickness on next attack.

2 Traits that I would love to see on the mesmer.

1 – Your projectiles and your illusion projectiles have pierce.

This would give us a bit of more aoe potential.
It’s not perfect but could be great. For example your duelist is firing and in line of his target he has 2 more guys, so he hits 3 guys.

2 – Your illusions have swiftness, something like the phantasmal fury.

This way if you shatter your illusions have more chance to reach their target (I know the Triangle theory on shattering,but is not always the best choice especially in battles that are not 1 vs 1)

Also your phantasms would have a better chance to reach runners and would position faster to their attacks.

I like scam’s and pyro’s suggestion but at the same time, i think we would still be stuck on the current trait template for a long time. I wish either Pyro or Scam or Chaos to apply as one of the devs to fix the traits!