Guild Wars 2

Jedge.3619:

Kelthien.8593:

First, Robert Gee is our “class dude”, as far as I can tell. Rubi, the presenter, doesn’t have a ton to do with class development, so it doesn’t matter too much if she “likes” the profession or not. Robert’s our man, our main man dude.

I think Robert did an excellent job on the new class design – including the baseline traits offered and changes to others. The problem was the professionalism of the presentation and the fact that we were not shown our traits.

Some of the new guardian abilities are way over the top especially the 17second CD tether virtue, insane burning damage (it will also probably track you through stealth). 25 Instant stacks of vulnerability trap?

Also, why are they asking guardians if they like the changes to their traits? Whatever happened to asking us about the mimic rework for example?

I’ll call water under the bridge if they at least take note (dont even need to respond) to the thread about Echo of Time-

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Shield-Echo-of-Time-The-real-Big-point/first#

^

You say water under the bridge, I say water off a duck’s back!!!

Please make sure pCaptainAmerica is reliable as a phantasm skill.

Josh Davis.6015:

Peters and I discussed the chronomancer traits thing today. We’ll try to get something out to you guys as soon as we can (next week at the earliest, obviously).

Gonna jump subforums for a moment for this topic and this response, because I’m very glad to see that mesmers (and my alt) will get the information desired.

But, could you maybe pass on to the PoI crew that they should follow suit with future reveals? Like, talk about information that’s relevant and show some traits and tooltips.

Be sure to emphasize things like relevant and on-topic and ideas like functionality and mechanics>animations and random things that are distracting that people (a person) needs to talk about.

Would just be very nice for every reveal to be equally informative and… making “economic” use of the viewers time? Yeah, that’s the way to say that.

jcbroe.4329:

Josh Davis.6015:

Peters and I discussed the chronomancer traits thing today. We’ll try to get something out to you guys as soon as we can (next week at the earliest, obviously).

Gonna jump subforums for a moment for this topic and this response, because I’m very glad to see that mesmers (and my alt) will get the information desired.

But, could you maybe pass on to the PoI crew that they should follow suit with future reveals? Like, talk about information that’s relevant and show some traits and tooltips.

Be sure to emphasize things like relevant and on-topic and ideas like functionality and mechanics>animations and random things that are distracting that people (a person) needs to talk about.

Would just be very nice for every reveal to be equally informative and… making “economic” use of the viewers time? Yeah, that’s the way to say that.

So jroh, since the next specialization will be in POI again, which maybe will be crap again, so have a guess who’s the next profession in line next week?

Might be rangers or necros.

StickerHappy.8052:

jcbroe.4329:

Josh Davis.6015:

Peters and I discussed the chronomancer traits thing today. We’ll try to get something out to you guys as soon as we can (next week at the earliest, obviously).

Gonna jump subforums for a moment for this topic and this response, because I’m very glad to see that mesmers (and my alt) will get the information desired.

But, could you maybe pass on to the PoI crew that they should follow suit with future reveals? Like, talk about information that’s relevant and show some traits and tooltips.

Be sure to emphasize things like relevant and on-topic and ideas like functionality and mechanics>animations and random things that are distracting that people (a person) needs to talk about.

Would just be very nice for every reveal to be equally informative and… making “economic” use of the viewers time? Yeah, that’s the way to say that.

So jroh, since the next specialization will be in POI again, which maybe will be crap again, so have a guess who’s the next profession in line next week?

Might be rangers or necros.

If it’s a pattern, medium armor would be next.

If it’s rangers, I’ll bite the bullet and take some information over no information, but seeing as how traps and spirits weren’t even ready for reveal on the core specialization discussion, I think that it it’s a medium armor profession, we might get engineer or thieves even.

That not being the case, we might get whatever class is getting shouts, in which case, still wouldn’t be rangers.

Regardless though, they should do this like the last time I can remember that they did an information reveal through livestreams, which would just doing Ready Up every week for these reveals.

It’s certainly more effective, which is the nice way of saying it, because my fellow podcasters are very much being subjected to my less than satisfied response with the way information was presented for Mesmer.

Josh Davis.6015:

Peters and I discussed the chronomancer traits thing today. We’ll try to get something out to you guys as soon as we can (next week at the earliest, obviously).

Thank you for popping in to clarify this and help put to rest some of the concerns players were having.

Perhaps Karl could present with Rubi when doing these sorts of things on POI and devs with a little less experience on live shows could go with Josh. This way the less experienced devs can be eased in and guided by a presenter I feel shows off classes better. Karl seems really connected to what people want to know and efficiently shows it off, I think pairing him and Rubi up could be very effective in the future for other reveals.

What? An arenanet post in the mesmer forums? I think i am dreaming, brb dripping my head in cold water.

Josh Davis.6015:

Peters and I discussed the chronomancer traits thing today. We’ll try to get something out to you guys as soon as we can (next week at the earliest, obviously).

Thank you very much Grouch. Take your time, we’re in no hurry.

The main issue is, that we would’ve liked to have a presenter that is passionate and well-versed about the profession. Robert was great, and I like Rubi in general. However, she wasn’t the right person to present the Chronomancer.

I think that it’s best, if possible, that all future specialization reveals would be done by the Ready Up guys, and not the POI’s. POI should be more about general features, rather than things that’re related to balance in PvP .

Knockback+cripple on a 7s cd…

Looking for Chronomancer’s “Something just as good”

Revamped profession mechanics- Guard’s mechanics were already useful in all mediums of play. Meanwhile Mes mechanics are ignored in many builds, and basically useless in PvE. BUT we need to stop being lazy and use shatters anyway because blowing up half our damage and a good portion of our utility is a good thing! (???)

2-hand weapon- Enough said.

More damage modifiers- Because Guard struggled to keep a place in the meta (right? right?)

Thematically and graphically, I love what they did with Mes; extremely cool, but the traits are going to have to be OUTSTANDING to compete with the only other Elite we’ve seen so far…. and I’m highly doubting that to be the case.

Then we have alacrity… but from our presentation it looked like we’ll have extremely limited access to it, and for ‘balance’ purposes they’ve put long cooldowns on shield and well skills nullifying its benefit.

Am i missing something? Maybe i need to watch the videos again.

PS- sorry for all the sarcasm. I know it doesn’t always translate well in text.

Josh Davis.6015:

Peters and I discussed the chronomancer traits thing today. We’ll try to get something out to you guys as soon as we can (next week at the earliest, obviously).

Thanks for the info! It’s appretiated.

I don’t know much about the devs individual play… But the entire vid had the air of: ‘Rubi got rekt and now thinks mes is OP despite it’s current meta placement, and counter play.’

I could be totally wrong or misinterpreting… or is some joke I didn’t pay attention to so am not in on.

But if the Devs have a bias of that of ‘the QQers’ I think we have a problem, if it’s in relation to it’s development. :/

Mikkel.8427:

Looking for Chronomancer’s “Something just as good”

Revamped profession mechanics- Even though Guard’s mechanics were already useful in all mediums of play. While Mes mechanics are ignored in many builds, and basically useless in PvE. BUT we need to stop being lazy and use shatters anyway because blowing up half our damage and a good portion of our utility is a good thing! (???)

2-hand weapon- Enough said.

More damage modifiers- Because Guard struggled to keep a place in the meta (right? right?)

Thematically and graphically, I love what they did with Mes; extremely cool. The traits are going to have to be OUTSTANDING to compete with the only other Elite we’ve seen so far…. and I’m highly doubting that to be the case.

Then we have alacrity… but from our presentation it looked like we’ll have extremely limited access to it, and for ‘balance’ purposes they’ve put long cooldowns on shield and well skills nullifying its benefit.

Am i missing something? Maybe i need to watch the videos again.

You missed the fact that guardian got 3 whole new f-skills. While we got 1 new f-skill… which doesn’t really make it any better.

Edit: not that i care, i honestly don’t mind as long as the chronomancer is fun

It is a bit disheartening when we’re told that a 60 sec cool down might change because it might be too overpowered and similiar statements.

Then watch another profession and see “4 second cool downs” and “instant 25 stacks of vulnerability”, and “knock back & cripple on 7 sec cd”.

But I play Mesmer because it’s just fun to play. I may not steamroll thru mobs like other classes, but I’m playing with a smile the whole time.

Mikkel.8427:

Looking for Chronomancer’s “Something just as good”

Revamped profession mechanics- Even though Guard’s mechanics were already useful in all mediums of play. While Mes mechanics are ignored in many builds, and basically useless in PvE. BUT we need to stop being lazy and use shatters anyway because blowing up half our damage and a good portion of our utility is a good thing! (???)

2-hand weapon- Enough said.

More damage modifiers- Because Guard struggled to keep a place in the meta (right? right?)

Thematically and graphically, I love what they did with Mes; extremely cool. The traits are going to have to be OUTSTANDING to compete with the only other Elite we’ve seen so far…. and I’m highly doubting that to be the case.

Then we have alacrity… but from our presentation it looked like we’ll have extremely limited access to it, and for ‘balance’ purposes they’ve put long cooldowns on shield and well skills nullifying its benefit.

Am i missing something? Maybe i need to watch the videos again.

Mesmers are overrating alacrity and F5. Alacrity is a, plain, cooldown reduction. I don’t know but the new weapon traits cooldown reduction look like a nerf to me. GS : 2% cooldown reduction on Spatial Surge (You have 3 phantasms ? Oh well, sucks for you), Interrupting on Pistol recharges 50 % (Did you miss your interrupt ? Though luck, get better), Staff and Chaos Armor (Go in the fields and get your Chaos Armor ! Oops, you got a Fire Aura instead), Scepter and Confusion. It’s like they made Alacrity to make up for it. Nerf you somehwere and give you an another mechanic to compensate. More active play I guess.

F5 is a reset button that leave you some seconds to do your stuff and rewind back. Interesting, but that’s it.

Let’s look at the shield now. A shatter fodder phantasm on block. It needs a charging time and it blocks ONE TIME. 2 if you block (Deja Vu). Why can’t we get long blocks (old mimic) ? Guardians, Warrior, Rangers, Engi have it ? If you’re familiar with off hand sword block and scepter block, there’s an after cast. If you don’t let your character do the after cast, it doesn’t do any damage. While you block ONE attack, you receive other damage sources. Super clunky. I bet the phantasm damage will suck like iMage, iDefender, iDesenchanter because it’s a ’’support’’ phantasm.

Tides of Time is a long cooldown skill. Oh yeah, let’s use that F5 to reduce your cooldown to 20 secs instead of 30 secs. The AA from the guardian longbow do the same damage as this skill. THE AA.

Then we get wells. Traps is constant damage (We don’t know yet about the arming time). Well is huge damage at the end. They want to remove Gravity Well (120s cooldown) float, but yet Dragon’s Maw (60s cooldown) have a 4 secs barrier and do more damage than Gravity Well. I know, it’s a clunky comparison (apples and oranges), but I just want to make you guys see the differences.

Guardians got a Virtue rework. We got ONE new shatter.

Where is our something as good for having an off hand ? I don’t see it either.

Krispera.5087:

Mikkel.8427:

Looking for Chronomancer’s “Something just as good”

Revamped profession mechanics- Even though Guard’s mechanics were already useful in all mediums of play. While Mes mechanics are ignored in many builds, and basically useless in PvE. BUT we need to stop being lazy and use shatters anyway because blowing up half our damage and a good portion of our utility is a good thing! (???)

2-hand weapon- Enough said.

More damage modifiers- Because Guard struggled to keep a place in the meta (right? right?)

Thematically and graphically, I love what they did with Mes; extremely cool. The traits are going to have to be OUTSTANDING to compete with the only other Elite we’ve seen so far…. and I’m highly doubting that to be the case.

Then we have alacrity… but from our presentation it looked like we’ll have extremely limited access to it, and for ‘balance’ purposes they’ve put long cooldowns on shield and well skills nullifying its benefit.

Am i missing something? Maybe i need to watch the videos again.

Mesmers are overrating alacrity and F5. Alacrity is a, plain, cooldown reduction. I don’t know but the new weapon traits cooldown reduction look like a nerf to me. GS : 2% cooldown reduction on Spatial Surge (You have 3 phantasms ? Oh well, sucks for you), Interrupting on Pistol recharges 50 % (Did you miss your interrupt ? Though luck, get better), Staff and Chaos Armor (Go in the fields and get your Chaos Armor ! Oops, you got a Fire Aura instead), Scepter and Confusion. It’s like they made Alacrity to make up for it. Nerf you somehwere and give you an another mechanic to compensate. More active play I guess.

F5 is a reset button that leave you some seconds to do your stuff and rewind back. Interesting, but that’s it.

Let’s look at the shield now. A shatter fodder phantasm on block. It needs a charging time and it blocks ONE TIME. 2 if you block (Deja Vu). Why can’t we get long blocks (old mimic) ? Guardians, Warrior, Rangers, Engi have it ? If you’re familiar with off hand sword block and scepter block, there’s an after cast. If you don’t let your character do the after cast, it doesn’t do any damage. While you block ONE attack, you receive other damage sources. Super clunky. I bet the phantasm damage will suck like iMage, iDefender, iDesenchanter because it’s a ’’support’’ phantasm.

Tides of Time is a long cooldown skill. Oh yeah, let’s use that F5 to reduce your cooldown to 20 secs instead of 30 secs. The AA from the guardian longbow do the same damage as this skill. THE AA.

Then we get wells. Traps is constant damage (We don’t know yet about the arming time). Well is huge damage at the end. They want to remove Gravity Well (120s cooldown) float, but yet Dragon’s Maw (60s cooldown) have a 4 secs barrier and do more damage than Gravity Well. I know, it’s a clunky comparison (apples and oranges), but I just want to make you guys see the differences.

Guardians got a Virtue rework. We got ONE new shatter.

Where is our something as good for having an off hand ? I don’t see it either.

Well the pistol and staff traits are really good, the other im not sure about.

This is not fair whatsoever.

Most are complaining about how the presentation of dragon hunter is way better than our Chronomancer, this am also kittened at but I on the other hand am more concerned at how they have made a very powerful class and made it into a more Super powerful class.

Yes we will still have to wait till all other class specialization have been reviled plus new skills and trails, test them out against each other before making a finial judgement, but as things stands right now, Dragon Hunter out class our Chronomancer.

I can just see it right now, new Hambow or super bunker class.

Quadox.7834:

I feel like with the changes we know of so far, dragonhunter is much stronger than chronomancer. I feel like they need to remove the crystal that instantly cancels the mesmer’s f5, i have this gut feeling that it will get absolutely destroyed by a gs guardian using spin or similar. Then it will be fair. I can’t even imagine using chronomancer f5 in wvwvw since the crystal will die instantly. Funnily enough, this is EXACTLY the problem mesmer already has in larger fights- phantasms and clones die. So Anet decided – “Hey, let’s add more things that die in 1 second due to Aoe cleave to the mesmer class!”

I understand the concern. However, maybe there will be some traits connected to this, to make it more resilient. It also depends on how it actually works. If it’s like engie turrets, it will be immune to conditions. And if it has some decent HP, it might just survive long enough to be useful.

TyPin.9860:

I understand the concern. However, maybe there will be some traits connected to this, to make it more resilient. It also depends on how it actually works. If it’s like engie turrets, it will be immune to conditions. And if it has some decent HP, it might just survive long enough to be useful.

Weren’t turrets made to take damage from condi in the last patch, and can be critically hit?

Regardless, I think having to trait to use the thing is commitment enough without adding another to actually make it useful as opposed to useless. I don’t mind buffing or adding functionality like how engy traits do to turrets, but adding traits to make the sprite more resilient (which may feel required) is just bad.

I also do echo the concerns of an earlier poster about alacrity and the way Mesmer cool downs are being reworked. It seems to be folded in on this alacrity, where other classes will get a flat cool down reduction you must work for yours, as such I would expect its potential to be much greater. I know theory crafters are saying chaos armour looks great but that GS one looks bad. Pistol trait is hit and miss for me, it’s a net loss currently for PvE.

TyPin.9860:

If it’s like engie turrets used to be, it will be immune to conditions..

Minor correction.

TyPin.9860:

Quadox.7834:

I feel like with the changes we know of so far, dragonhunter is much stronger than chronomancer. I feel like they need to remove the crystal that instantly cancels the mesmer’s f5, i have this gut feeling that it will get absolutely destroyed by a gs guardian using spin or similar. Then it will be fair. I can’t even imagine using chronomancer f5 in wvwvw since the crystal will die instantly. Funnily enough, this is EXACTLY the problem mesmer already has in larger fights- phantasms and clones die. So Anet decided – “Hey, let’s add more things that die in 1 second due to Aoe cleave to the mesmer class!”

I understand the concern. However, maybe there will be some traits connected to this, to make it more resilient. It also depends on how it actually works. If it’s like engie turrets, it will be immune to conditions. And if it has some decent HP, it might just survive long enough to be useful.

This is the mesmer class (well, that can be disscussed) you are talking about. And even if it will be as you say, even if we got a trait which said “your time crystal thing is invulnerable”, it would probably be in grandmaster tier :P

Quadox.7834:

TyPin.9860:

Quadox.7834:

I feel like with the changes we know of so far, dragonhunter is much stronger than chronomancer. I feel like they need to remove the crystal that instantly cancels the mesmer’s f5, i have this gut feeling that it will get absolutely destroyed by a gs guardian using spin or similar. Then it will be fair. I can’t even imagine using chronomancer f5 in wvwvw since the crystal will die instantly. Funnily enough, this is EXACTLY the problem mesmer already has in larger fights- phantasms and clones die. So Anet decided – “Hey, let’s add more things that die in 1 second due to Aoe cleave to the mesmer class!”

I understand the concern. However, maybe there will be some traits connected to this, to make it more resilient. It also depends on how it actually works. If it’s like engie turrets, it will be immune to conditions. And if it has some decent HP, it might just survive long enough to be useful.

This is the mesmer class (well, that can be disscussed) you are talking about. And even if it will be as you say, even if we got a trait which said “your time crystal thing is invulnerable”, it would probably be in grandmaster tier :P

i could imagine it to be immune to crit and have like 7-10k hp and a trait which increases it by 25/40/50% in eigher adept/master/grandmaster tier

as a said, i would prefer to not have to take a trait to use my profession mechanic

Quadox.7834:

as a said, i would prefer to not have to take a trait to use my profession mechanic

they said that it can be destroyed. yes. but who the hell knows how long that will take? I don’t think that it’s cleaved in less than 4 hits. you are a little bit too hasty with your “have to take a trait to use” -.-

the only thing I really dislike is that it prevents point capture. it can be destroyed why the hell should it denie point capturing??

Quadox.7834:

as a said, i would prefer to not have to take a trait to use my profession mechanic

Which makes it all more insulting when you look at chronophantasm. Needing a trait to not make shatters a DPS loss in PvE as a grandmaster trait to boot.

Hey, probably when they reveal rangers they’ll make it so pets can hit moving targets and have aoe resistance in a grandmaster druid trait.

Please just take out the cleavable f5 mechanic…This mechanic makes us cornered as roaming/dueling classes since it’ll obviously be useless in WvW AoE spams…

Chaos Archangel speaking in another thread about an interrupt build:

" Make sure you’re running with Debilitating dissipation in Chaos, AoE weakness is nothing to overlook. "

HAHAHA After the pasting that I have taken in the forums for advocating for Clone Death traits. Here is one of the best of the “skilled gameplay” players advocating Clone Death traits in one of those “skilled” builds.

Does this make his build “cancer?” Is he a bad person? a whiner? A bad player? I’ve been called all of that and more.

Maybe the knee jerk reactionaries failed to consider the beam in their eyes when they castigated me for the mote in mine.

I’d say I told you so about Mesmer/Chrono but you know who will burst in and start harrasing me. Instead I will leave him to blindly defend this while arguing with you guys.

Yeah, you guys are soooooooo oppressed. Better get Amnesty International in here ASAP.

tobascodagama.2961:

Yeah, you guys are soooooooo oppressed. Better get Amnesty International in here ASAP.

LOL

Be nice everyone!!

Me Games Ma.8426:

Quadox.7834:

as a said, i would prefer to not have to take a trait to use my profession mechanic

they said that it can be destroyed. yes. but who the hell knows how long that will take? I don’t think that it’s cleaved in less than 4 hits. you are a little bit too hasty with your “have to take a trait to use” -.-

the only thing I really dislike is that it prevents point capture. it can be destroyed why the hell should it denie point capturing??

…which is why i only said i have a gut feeling that this is what might happen. They need to be very very careful.

Not to rain of everyone’s parade of tears, but there are a lot of people exaggerating so much it’s just ridiculous. Let’s just put aside that Anet said all the balancing is still totally open, that they made it very clear that we’re looking more at mechanics and basic ideas, rather than final values and finished abilities.

People are speculating about how Chrono abilities “obviously” are inferior and DH abilities are clearly superior, without having actually tested either of them. Take the whole 25 Vulnerability thing. I bet people would actually whine about this if it were put on a Well, because “Wah we already put out so much Vuln, and so does everyone else, this is so useless! Engie stack 20+ in an instant, then this ability will do nothing!”

Alacrity is also obviously bad or supposedly not as good as many may think, although we all know how strong Chill’s slowing effect is!?

The other CD reducing effects are probably a hidden nerf, although math clearly shows that they can be stronger (if used well aka SKILL) then the current flat reductions.

Thieves will still be a hard counter despite a huge amount of survivability, spike damage, condie damage, etc. being added.

Mostly a lot of stuff being said here is simply “grass is greener” spam, that sadly always happens when another class’ goodies are revealed. While strong, I saw nothing of the Guardian that makes me think I’m going to give up my Mesmer and play a Guardian. I have a strong feeling that to get the DH goodies, you end up having to kitten a lot of what makes Guardians strong right now. (aka TRADE OFFS)

Windwalker.7421:

Not to rain of everyone’s parade of tears, but there are a lot of people exaggerating so much it’s just ridiculous. Let’s just put aside that Anet said all the balancing is still totally open, that they made it very clear that we’re looking more at mechanics and basic ideas, rather than final values and finished abilities.

People are speculating about how Chrono abilities “obviously” are inferior and DH abilities are clearly superior, without having actually tested either of them. Take the whole 25 Vulnerability thing. I bet people would actually whine about this if it were put on a Well, because “Wah we already put out so much Vuln, and so does everyone else, this is so useless! Engie stack 20+ in an instant, then this ability will do nothing!”

Alacrity is also obviously bad or supposedly not as good as many may think, although we all know how strong Chill’s slowing effect is!?

The other CD reducing effects are probably a hidden nerf, although math clearly shows that they can be stronger (if used well aka SKILL) then the current flat reductions.

Thieves will still be a hard counter despite a huge amount of survivability, spike damage, condie damage, etc. being added.

Mostly a lot of stuff being said here is simply “grass is greener” spam, that sadly always happens when another class’ goodies are revealed. While strong, I saw nothing of the Guardian that makes me think I’m going to give up my Mesmer and play a Guardian. I have a strong feeling that to get the DH goodies, you end up having to kitten a lot of what makes Guardians strong right now. (aka TRADE OFFS)

I have no issue on other classes mechanics or other goodies they get, I am only mad on how they presented the mesmer feature which clearly lacks tact and other necessary information. Why did that happen? Why is DH presentation painfully better, well presented, gave all necessary information to those people who main and play guardian?

Now look at ours, till now its all speculation, no explanation or whatsoever for giving justification to their ideas, etc. So..why is that?

StickerHappy.8052:

Windwalker.7421:

Not to rain of everyone’s parade of tears, but there are a lot of people exaggerating so much it’s just ridiculous. Let’s just put aside that Anet said all the balancing is still totally open, that they made it very clear that we’re looking more at mechanics and basic ideas, rather than final values and finished abilities.

People are speculating about how Chrono abilities “obviously” are inferior and DH abilities are clearly superior, without having actually tested either of them. Take the whole 25 Vulnerability thing. I bet people would actually whine about this if it were put on a Well, because “Wah we already put out so much Vuln, and so does everyone else, this is so useless! Engie stack 20+ in an instant, then this ability will do nothing!”

Alacrity is also obviously bad or supposedly not as good as many may think, although we all know how strong Chill’s slowing effect is!?

The other CD reducing effects are probably a hidden nerf, although math clearly shows that they can be stronger (if used well aka SKILL) then the current flat reductions.

Thieves will still be a hard counter despite a huge amount of survivability, spike damage, condie damage, etc. being added.

Mostly a lot of stuff being said here is simply “grass is greener” spam, that sadly always happens when another class’ goodies are revealed. While strong, I saw nothing of the Guardian that makes me think I’m going to give up my Mesmer and play a Guardian. I have a strong feeling that to get the DH goodies, you end up having to kitten a lot of what makes Guardians strong right now. (aka TRADE OFFS)

I have no issue on other classes mechanics or other goodies they get, I am only mad on how they presented the mesmer feature which clearly lacks tact and other necessary information. Why did that happen? Why is DH presentation painfully better, well presented, gave all necessary information to those people who main and play guardian?

Now look at ours, till now its all speculation, no explanation or whatsoever for giving justification to their ideas, etc. So..why is that?

Simple, our was a point of interest, aka not pvp blance focused. Which sucks.

Quadox.7834:

StickerHappy.8052:

Windwalker.7421:

Not to rain of everyone’s parade of tears, but there are a lot of people exaggerating so much it’s just ridiculous. Let’s just put aside that Anet said all the balancing is still totally open, that they made it very clear that we’re looking more at mechanics and basic ideas, rather than final values and finished abilities.

People are speculating about how Chrono abilities “obviously” are inferior and DH abilities are clearly superior, without having actually tested either of them. Take the whole 25 Vulnerability thing. I bet people would actually whine about this if it were put on a Well, because “Wah we already put out so much Vuln, and so does everyone else, this is so useless! Engie stack 20+ in an instant, then this ability will do nothing!”

Alacrity is also obviously bad or supposedly not as good as many may think, although we all know how strong Chill’s slowing effect is!?

The other CD reducing effects are probably a hidden nerf, although math clearly shows that they can be stronger (if used well aka SKILL) then the current flat reductions.

Thieves will still be a hard counter despite a huge amount of survivability, spike damage, condie damage, etc. being added.

Mostly a lot of stuff being said here is simply “grass is greener” spam, that sadly always happens when another class’ goodies are revealed. While strong, I saw nothing of the Guardian that makes me think I’m going to give up my Mesmer and play a Guardian. I have a strong feeling that to get the DH goodies, you end up having to kitten a lot of what makes Guardians strong right now. (aka TRADE OFFS)

I have no issue on other classes mechanics or other goodies they get, I am only mad on how they presented the mesmer feature which clearly lacks tact and other necessary information. Why did that happen? Why is DH presentation painfully better, well presented, gave all necessary information to those people who main and play guardian?

Now look at ours, till now its all speculation, no explanation or whatsoever for giving justification to their ideas, etc. So..why is that?

Simple, our was a point of interest, aka not pvp blance focused. Which sucks.

If the POI next week ends being up being a good one for whoever is next. Well I’ll be kitten ed.

People always jumping to the worst conclusions they can think of, then looking foolish later on.

Ithilwen.1529:

Chaos Archangel speaking in another thread about an interrupt build:

" Make sure you’re running with Debilitating dissipation in Chaos, AoE weakness is nothing to overlook. "

HAHAHA After the pasting that I have taken in the forums for advocating for Clone Death traits. Here is one of the best of the “skilled gameplay” players advocating Clone Death traits in one of those “skilled” builds.

Does this make his build “cancer?” Is he a bad person? a whiner? A bad player? I’ve been called all of that and more.

Maybe the knee jerk reactionaries failed to consider the beam in their eyes when they castigated me for the mote in mine.

Hey dude,

For one, I saw the lambasting you got in the PvP forums while I was suspended. A big reason I don’t post in those forums much is because of how close-minded and bandwagon-hopping people like to be there, but I don’t think a lot of those comments against you were justified.

And Countless has been a champion of clone-death builds forever. He brings up a good point about how they contradict themselves in removing clone death but buff the stealth of PU. I personally never thought clone death was too passive, but the PU play style of conditions + stealth + clone death is no fun to fight.

Regardless when you make a good build you take what works for that build. Debilitating Dissipation is an excellent trait for any build that can afford it -power or condi- anyone who tries to put that fact down is either a parrot or overcompensating for lack of skill.

Levetty.1279:

I’d say I told you so about Mesmer/Chrono but you know who will burst in and start harrasing me. Instead I will leave him to blindly defend this while arguing with you guys.

What the eff.

I thought we’d made peace and agreed to disagree Levetty?

Never expect anything out of Anet and mesmers and you will never be disappointed.

Windwalker.7421:

Mostly a lot of stuff being said here is simply “grass is greener” spam, that sadly always happens when another class’ goodies are revealed.

This couldn’t be emphasised any more. It happened during the original class reveals, and it’s happening again. It happened during the Chrono reveal too. It’s as if these people don’t even look at the other sub-forums.

Knox.8462:

Windwalker.7421:

Mostly a lot of stuff being said here is simply “grass is greener” spam, that sadly always happens when another class’ goodies are revealed.

This couldn’t be emphasised any more. It happened during the original class reveals, and it’s happening again. It happened during the Chrono reveal too. It’s as if these people don’t even look at the other sub-forums.

Seriously, go to Reddit or the Guardian forum and check how many people have been saying “Why can’t we get something cool like the Chrono?” They’ve mostly quieted down since Ready Up, but they’re still out there.

I’m just going to lay this one out there.

• Elementalist : Developer = Karl Mclain
• Thief : Developer = Karl Mclain
• Guardian : Developer = Karl Mclain

What do these classes have in common?

• They are desired in every meta … except Thief in GWEN for WvW … but in WvW Thief is often touted as the king of zerker meta … and Thieves are sick as roamers / scouts / havoc
• They are so good in the metas that they are stacked (usually 2 eles … but sometimes 2 Thieves) … they seem to be above the other classes on the power curve
• They all seem to have the same developer.

It’s just something I noticed … hoping a coincidence …

StickerHappy.8052:

Guardians get in depth features on their elite spec.

While mesmers get 2 traits. Rubi also mentioned she does not like mesmer that much.

Not blaming her entirely but our feature lacked professionalism.

i agree, guardian had a real live gameplay shown whereas mesmer was just pre recorded, it was handled very badly and the girl had no interest at all, she looked bored with no care at all, that ticked me off the most, we should have had actual mesmer enthusiast introducing chronomancer, not some girl who could give a kitten about mesmer and is just waiting for the show to end, screw her

also gw2 philosophy of classes are, the most played classes will get the most attention, classes like mesmer will recieve less attention and bugs wont be fixed since not as much people play it, this is a ridiculous way to handle classes and I praise other games that don’t pull that kind of crap on us, people will continue to play those other classes since arenanet doesnt fix anything about mesmer, it’s a vicious cycle that they dont seem to have an regard on breaking, screw arenanet

what a god awful concept of classes on only fixing and buffing classes that people play the most, what kind of dumb developer does that? especially a big one like arena net, so disappointed, Going back to WoW, at least they dont neglect their classes, no matter how much people play it

Sebrent.3625:

I’m just going to lay this one out there.

• Elementalist : Developer = Karl Mclain
• Thief : Developer = Karl Mclain
• Guardian : Developer = Karl Mclain

What do these classes have in common?

• They are desired in every meta … except Thief in GWEN for WvW … but in WvW Thief is often touted as the king of zerker meta … and Thieves are sick as roamers / scouts / havoc
• They are so good in the metas that they are stacked (usually 2 eles … but sometimes 2 Thieves) … they seem to be above the other classes on the power curve
• They all seem to have the same developer.

It’s just something I noticed … hoping a coincidence …

Robert’s fantastic. I think he’s been working on the mesmer since GW1. In fact, I think he’s responsible for a lot of the GW1 changes that made the mesmer awesome. I want to say he mentioned the Wastrels skills as part of his contribution.

I have no doubt in his capabilities for class balance. Dating-wise, I’d pick Karl for the hot muscle-ginger thing, but I’m perfectly happy to have Robert as our class dev. <3

@Kelthien:
I have no reason to question whether or not Robert is capable of delivering a Mesmer that is reasonable and balanced.

I’m more pointing out why I have a reason to question Karl’s ability to deliver classes that are reasonable and balanced since his 3 classes have been dominant in the metas since release.

Sebrent.3625:

@Kelthien:
I have no reason to question whether or not Robert is capable of delivering a Mesmer that is reasonable and balanced.

I’m more pointing out why I have a reason to question Karl’s ability to deliver classes that are reasonable and balanced since his 3 classes have been dominant in the metas since release.

And I totally agree with you. Karl’s classes have been straightforward, direct, and balanced. Roberts classes are sometimes trickier. Mesmer, both in GW1 and GW2, has been a thematically simple but mechanically difficult profession.

Personally, I’d say mesmer mechanics are ‘too challenging’ for players compared with guardians. Look at that crap. Guards simply press an F1 button and get huge burn damage. Mesmers, in change, need to use missable weapon skills to build up fragile illusions which represent charges, then command those charges to execute small AoE effects, assuming they’re lucky enough to survive and reach their target.

In short, a Dragonhunter presses a button and gets several targets with DD and massive burn damage. A mesmer must execute 3 illusion generation skills before we hit F1, pray that our illusions survive, hope our illusions explode before our target has moved.

I think mesmer fans chose a more challenging class. I’d love for us to be rewarded for it. I think the chrono goes a long way towards giving us more rapid recharge on our skills and more ‘fire and forget’ Well skills.

Are we there? probably not. Are we closer? for sure.

So what you are saying is we need to swap Devs with the theif?

I agree.

Levetty.1279:

So what you are saying is we need to swap Devs with the theif?

I agree.

Tbh robert is doing a magnificent job..

Chaos Archangel.5071:

What the eff.

I thought we’d made peace and agreed to disagree Levetty?

This is him doing it to himself. Don’t sweat it, Eagle Scout. Gotta see things for how they are.

Nah, I think Robert is doing great.

I think their balance team might want to put a shorter leash elsewhere though.

Kelthien is right, though … it could just be that those classes are more straightforward than Mesmer … pretty muche very class is … but if you compare Ele/Guard/Thief to Ranger/Necro/Engineer … what is less straightforward there?

Quadox.7834:

StickerHappy.8052:

Windwalker.7421:

Not to rain of everyone’s parade of tears, but there are a lot of people exaggerating so much it’s just ridiculous. Let’s just put aside that Anet said all the balancing is still totally open, that they made it very clear that we’re looking more at mechanics and basic ideas, rather than final values and finished abilities.

People are speculating about how Chrono abilities “obviously” are inferior and DH abilities are clearly superior, without having actually tested either of them. Take the whole 25 Vulnerability thing. I bet people would actually whine about this if it were put on a Well, because “Wah we already put out so much Vuln, and so does everyone else, this is so useless! Engie stack 20+ in an instant, then this ability will do nothing!”

Alacrity is also obviously bad or supposedly not as good as many may think, although we all know how strong Chill’s slowing effect is!?

The other CD reducing effects are probably a hidden nerf, although math clearly shows that they can be stronger (if used well aka SKILL) then the current flat reductions.

Thieves will still be a hard counter despite a huge amount of survivability, spike damage, condie damage, etc. being added.

Mostly a lot of stuff being said here is simply “grass is greener” spam, that sadly always happens when another class’ goodies are revealed. While strong, I saw nothing of the Guardian that makes me think I’m going to give up my Mesmer and play a Guardian. I have a strong feeling that to get the DH goodies, you end up having to kitten a lot of what makes Guardians strong right now. (aka TRADE OFFS)

I have no issue on other classes mechanics or other goodies they get, I am only mad on how they presented the mesmer feature which clearly lacks tact and other necessary information. Why did that happen? Why is DH presentation painfully better, well presented, gave all necessary information to those people who main and play guardian?

Now look at ours, till now its all speculation, no explanation or whatsoever for giving justification to their ideas, etc. So..why is that?

Simple, our was a point of interest, aka not pvp blance focused. Which sucks.

Um, he was using staff, a pvp weapon totally worthless in PvE and large scale WvW.

He was using shatters, worthless in pve.

I don’t know where you get the idea that this wasn’t a pvp balance presentation considering he spent a lot of his time explaining all the dumb restrictions and drawbacks imposed on the new skills for the sake of their precious PvP balance.

End product is the same, mesmer will be a burst class eclipsed by thief but people hate all burst classes so mesmer will eat a couple of nerfs to cooldowns and durations of skills and remain a gimmick class in PvE as a result and a deficient competitive PvP class relative to thief and guardian.