Guild Wars 2

In PvP they sure aren’t.

Don’t get me wrong, for group utility, yes, Gyros are better.

And it’d only take adding some group utility to them, which there is this weird resistance to.

Why are they so opposed to adding utility to necromancers to empower/aid their allies if they’re going to implement a breakbar that negates all the debuffing they can do?

I also have to ask why we got stuck with a cooldown on enfeebling shroud while the equivalent engineer trait applies 9 seconds of weakness and 5 stacks of vulnerability and has no ICD.

Zenith.7301:

And it’d only take adding some group utility to them, which there is this weird resistance to.

Why are they so opposed to adding utility to necromancers to empower/aid their allies if they’re going to implement a breakbar that negates all the debuffing they can do?

I also have to ask why we got stuck with a cooldown on enfeebling shroud while the equivalent engineer trait applies 9 seconds of weakness and 5 stacks of vulnerability and has no ICD.

Engineer trait gets stopped out by Stability, for one. I also feel that trait is going to get slammed with the nerf hammer at some point, since it’s too easy to get 36 seconds of weakness in a 2 skill combo. Land Hammer 5 and you’re guaranteed to land all three hits of Hammer 3. That’s 4 stuns/dazes.

And the necromancer trait has the built in delay of enfeeble. They each have their negatives, but the relative payout is huge for the engineer.

Just like adaptive armor is just a better version of Corrupter’s Fervor.

I just scratch my head at why the classes with already plenty of group utility and blast fields/finishers keep getting more of these utilities and blast finishers/blast fields/aoe group utility, while the necromancer keeps getting selfish skills that are only of use in PvP.

Drones will be cleaved to death.

Doesn’t matter, the most attractive utility comes from the toolbelt skills from having the drones equipped as utility, which are independent from the drone. The reflect, the water field and 5 seconds of protection. The only gyro that you actually rely on to stay alive is the shadow refuge equivalent and mobs don’t attack pets without being engaged in combat, which is where the gyro is used as a skipping tool.

So the Engineers specialisation also gets another functionality on top to its former skills. Would it be too much to ask for both shrouds available to reaper at this point?

Also Adaptive Armor is a straight up buffed version of Corrupting Fevor :/

Brujeria.7536:

So the Engineers specialisation also gets another functionality on top to its former skills. Would it be too much to ask for both shrouds available to reaper at this point?

Also Adaptive Armor is a straight up buffed version of Corrupting Fevor :/

Traits in a vacuum…

Zenith.7301:

Our shouts are pitiful compared to scrapper gyros in terms of group utility ;(

Because shouts are annihilated by enemy AoE? Because Gyro’s proc Runes of the Trooper? What am I missing here…?

Nike.2631:

Zenith.7301:

Our shouts are pitiful compared to scrapper gyros in terms of group utility ;(

Because shouts are annihilated by enemy AoE? Because Gyro’s proc Runes of the Trooper? What am I missing here…?

Do you people even bother to read? Just 3 posts back I responded to the guy saying gyros would be destroyed by saying that the attractive utility from gyros was on the toolbelt skills, which did not require the gyro to be alive.

And who the hell uses trooper runes in PvE? I’m tired of you PvP people being obtuse when I make it clear I’m talking from a PvE perspective and you guys bring in your PvP crap into the discussion.

As if your shouts will actually make you useful even in PvP. You just like them because you’re winning duels with them, the only thing you PvP people seem to care about rather than group support.

Zenith.7301:

If internally it is seen as powerful, that’s a problem with who’s testing internally and their lack of touch with the reality of how the game is played, especially at higher levels.

The bleeding from BiP is somewhat strong…
… if the person doesn’t mind keeping it on them for 30s.

no seriously, if bleeding is what keeps this skill from being stronger, then I don’t think anyone would complain if the bleeding is completely remove. The “blood” from the name of the skill is the caster’s blood anyway.

8 stacks 10s might on a 20s CD and self-inflicted 4 stacks of bleed and I buy it.

Corruption have weak direct effects + weak yet annoying self-inflicted conditions. The idea is that you are meant to transfer them, but they are too weak to justify wasting a transfer!

Zenith.7301:

And who the hell uses trooper runes in PvE? I’m tired of you PvP people being obtuse when I make it clear I’m talking from a PvE perspective and you guys bring in your PvP crap into the discussion.

Currently? Nobody. Once Heart of Thorns hits and mobs are using conditions with regularity? Will probably become more popular.

We get that Shouts suck for PvE and other professions got better PvE. Not everything can be great in PvE, and in this case they addressed a major issue we had in PvP/WvW, and a major issue we had been asking for. Gyros are cool, Shouts are also cool.

The only thing we should be salty about Scrapper is the fact that Adaptive Armor is better, and “different situations” doesn’t matter, they have the same type of traiting that would make ours too good, and the fact that Superspeed is another mechanic that is an irremovable, not possible to counterplay, counter to a heavy mechanic of Necro: soft CC.

Bhawb.7408:

We get that Shouts suck for PvE and other professions got better PvE. Not everything can be great in PvE, and in this case they addressed a major issue we had in PvP/WvW, and a major issue we had been asking for. Gyros are cool, Shouts are also cool.

The only thing we should be salty about Scrapper is the fact that Adaptive Armor is better, and “different situations” doesn’t matter, they have the same type of traiting that would make ours too good, and the fact that Superspeed is another mechanic that is an irremovable, not possible to counterplay, counter to a heavy mechanic of Necro: soft CC.

I’m afraid of how much daze a Scrapper has. Necromancer is very vulnerable to interrupt spam.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Zenith.7301:

And who the hell uses trooper runes in PvE? I’m tired of you PvP people being obtuse when I make it clear I’m talking from a PvE perspective and you guys bring in your PvP crap into the discussion.

Currently? Nobody. Once Heart of Thorns hits and mobs are using conditions with regularity? Will probably become more popular.

Keep dreaming, please. A single healing rain and guardian purging flames is all you need, without traiting for garbage runes.

Bhawb.7408:

We get that Shouts suck for PvE and other professions got better PvE. Not everything can be great in PvE, and in this case they addressed a major issue we had in PvP/WvW, and a major issue we had been asking for. Gyros are cool, Shouts are also cool.

The only thing we should be salty about Scrapper is the fact that Adaptive Armor is better, and “different situations” doesn’t matter, they have the same type of traiting that would make ours too good, and the fact that Superspeed is another mechanic that is an irremovable, not possible to counterplay, counter to a heavy mechanic of Necro: soft CC.

Necromancers were meta in WvW (GWEN). Necromancer have been middle to higher tier and still present in sPvP.

For THREE YEARS, necromancers have been unwanted in PvE. They have no group support, plenty of selfish skills, and what did we get? More selfish skills.

So what if shouts scale in WvW? They only benefit you, a reaper still won’t be desirable over a Guardian or Warrior in team based WvW. Most necromancers still will take wells for well bombing in team fights.

The only people who benefitted here were PvP roamers. Why? Why is it OK for the necromancer to toil for over three years with zero group utility, their debuffs are now neutered by defiance bar, and what little new we got is now a niche set of utilities only good for PvP, where necromancers already had PLENTY of options.

Necromancers in PvP had the option of wells, they used corrupt boon, epidemic, in some builds minions, and spectral skills.

Necromancers in PvE only had wells. So remind me again why necromancers needed yet another expansion of utilities for PvP when the PvE necromancers were far more in need of expansion?

Lich Form wasn’t even a boost in PvE as an elite, and it got NERFED for pvp reasons, being just a crappier Rampage. We have no worthwhile PvE elites — PvP has Plague, Lich, and now Chilled to the Bone (which is completely neutered in PvE by the defiance bar).

People are kittened because all the help keeps being diverted to formats where necromancers need far less help than they do in PvE where I can’t even join a kitten ed fractal 50 without being told to switch to a guardian/warrior/ele.

hmm just had an idea, what if Angury of Death had a Toughness reduction debuff upon hitting a target so the trait would look like this

Angury of Death
your shouts recharge faster for each foe hit(7% each) and demoralize each foe hit coursing them to lose X Toughness for Y seconds

it would fit the theme of making our enemies weaker, while making sure shouts would be woth bringing in a pve group.

We shouldn’t need a trait to make shouts useful in PvE. Skills need to be effective baseline; traits are supposed to complement base skills instead of being requirements for said skills to be used at all.

@Zenith its fine we get both PvE and pvP views so I agree some skills clearly suits 1 game-mode more then another. Shouts may not be were effective in PvE at all since they are mechanic as Unblockable, AoE CC, AoE Condi Cleanse and AoE Stun maybe YAAW could be semi good in PvE but I guess thats it.

Anet seems to still keep us out of Combo Field and Boon Share Meta so guess PvE Necs are all out of luck… I guess your last hope is for that Raids requires Sustain and maybe Tank a Boss. as I dont do PvE I can only guess.

“Necromancers were meta in WvW (GWEN). Necromancer have been middle to higher tier and still present in sPvP.”

WvW yes we are the famous “N” in the GWEN Meta so we bin strong there. However in sPvP we bin at the absolute bottom together with Ranger for 3y with only 2 exceptions: Terrormancer at its peak and the current Cele Signet Nec wich is there ONLY to counter the DD Ele Ebola-Meta but even that is beginning to run its course now…

Necromancer has only not been bottom bin in GWEN, out of every game mode. Anything else, even in PvP, was very specific for short periods of time, and 100% depending on singular OP things, namely Dhuumfire and Lich form. Outside of that we’ve always been bad, and everywhere, so pretending like our PvE angst is any worse, and that we should only get attention there is frankly as bad as implying the same for PvP or WvW.

They had a great theme to go with, and they chose to address one set of deficiencies we had. But an elite can’t be the only thing to float us, and making an elite solely to fix our PvE would have been really bad design.

@Zenith (sorry for long text)
I may be wrong, but I think the reason why necromancer has been bad in PvE for so long without being fixed is plain simple: the developers do not support current PvE content anymore. This is because the problem is not the necromancer, it is the PvE.

Sure, there are people who enjoy the current PvE format, but I believe you agree with me if I say that the current PvE design is particularly detrimental to necromancer more than any other profession. The problem is simply that the huge amount of powerful debuffs they are bringing are either redundant or negated by the current design while all the boons other classes provide are highly sought after. Because the meta (which is a direct result of the PvE design) does not care if you can stack 25 vuln on your own, but refuses you if you cannot give might to your team. It does not care if you can blind enemies almost continuously but will grant you a spot if you can provide well-timed team-wide aegis.

So yes, I believe the devs decided some time ago that they will not fix necromancer (or other classes for that matter) in PvE, but will create a new PvE content where necromancer will have naturally their place. A PvE content where all the mechanics of the game, including the defensive ones (condition clear, healing, maybe even tanking) will matter. A place where measuring the DPS based on “all allies stacked together, the enemy standing still and taking all the damage” is irrelevant.

And to some extent I am fine with that. However, I start to doubt this will really work. I got worried by the news about the new break bar mechanics which, even more than currently, puts all debuffs in a near-irrelevant position while still glorifying boons. The only thing which I am still hoping is that maybe there will be a large proportion of 10v10+ fights, with swarms of non-defiant mobs not dying in 2s. gw2 just does not work 5v1 or now 10v1. There is probably a way it could be made, but it currently is not working.

So in conclusion to this long and boring text of mine: “necro is bad in PvE” may not be true after HoT, not because reaper fixed the necro, but because raids fixed PvE. But I will wait and see before being fully optimistic about that.

u made souleater worthlessnow… it was ment for lifestealing build and cause its only on one skilll… it will not make up for the greatsword loss of healing…. and prouble taking chilling force up cause ill be in reapershroud most of the time.

and the reason i say this is because the only good skill on greatsword is the 5skill pull….night whatever is good for point control but we are always on the move…and gravedigger is insta cast when we hit someone under 50%health.. so taking away are cleave heal…..is a slap in the face….this is why reaper will not be useing shouts cause we will have to be in reaper shroud all the time to survive

tenklo.6104:

u made souleater worthlessnow… it was ment for lifestealing build and cause its only on one skilll… it will not make up for the greatsword loss of healing…. and prouble taking chilling force up cause ill be in reapershroud most of the time.

and the reason i say this is because the only good skill on greatsword is the 5skill pull….night whatever is good for point control but we are always on the move…and gravedigger is insta cast when we hit someone under 50%health.. so taking away are cleave heal…..is a slap in the face….this is why reaper will not be useing shouts cause we will have to be in reaper shroud all the time to survive

Essentially they flipped the components. General HP steal then cooldown dependant on GD to general cooldown to HP steal dependant on GD and its far more functional this way for anyone who wants to use gs because having flat CDR is much better. Because GS skills are so slow if you miss with the trait the way it is now it’s less punishing to you. Before if you missed you got nothing, no heal no CDR nothing.

It’s a better trait all round now for anyone using GS regularly.

Examples are if they dodge onengrwve digger its less likely they will dodge the second because of how fast it would cooldown. Better life force generation and vulnerability because of increased use of soul spiral ( recently improved t actually hit stuff now ) , 40% uptime on a dark field with well like damage, far more pulls/chills etc etc.

Robert Gee look here:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer/Death-Shroud-F1-and-Reaper-F2/first

i still prefure my 3 stab lifesteal with greatsword with bloodmagic traited was getting like 140 perhit on any skill meaning deathspiral was giving me 1400 healing, and now because of this change and nerf… im only getting 2stab lifesteal for about 80 or 800 healing off deathspiral…so to me this is a nerf

tenklo.6104:

i still prefure my 3 stab lifesteal with greatsword with bloodmagic traited was getting like 140 perhit on any skill meaning deathspiral was giving me 1400 healing, and now because of this change and nerf… im only getting 2stab lifesteal for about 80 or 800 healing off deathspiral…so to me this is a nerf

From my napkin math you actually end up leeching more health on average the way it is now plus FAR more if you can use GD constantly below 50%

Does jumping block shouts?

I ask because I’m pretty sure that a ranger without stability blocked my “fear me” in a Pvp game yesterday three times. There do exist skills, even instant cast skills, that are avoided by jumping.

(Winning Keg brawl is totally about avoiding fumbles by jumping after you used your dodges).

There aren’t a lot of offensive shouts currently in the game to test this with, but if it turns out that you can block shouts just by jumping…. That’s a serious problem.

nekretaal.6485:

Does jumping block shouts?

I ask because I’m pretty sure that a ranger without stability blocked my “fear me” in a Pvp game yesterday three times. There do exist skills, even instant cast skills, that are avoided by jumping.

(Winning Keg brawl is totally about avoiding fumbles by jumping after you used your dodges).

There aren’t a lot of offensive shouts currently in the game to test this with, but if it turns out that you can block shouts just by jumping…. That’s a serious problem.

More likely the Ranger had Shared Anguish equipped. Its cooldown is just as long as Fear Me. It’s an incredibly common PvP trait.

Silverkey.2078:

no seriously, if bleeding is what keeps this skill from being stronger, then I don’t think anyone would complain if the bleeding is completely remove. The “blood” from the name of the skill is the caster’s blood anyway.

8 stacks 10s might on a 20s CD and self-inflicted 4 stacks of bleed and I buy it.

Or a toggle that gives you a 1-2 s bleed and a decent duration might at the same time, then when you release the toggle, you cause a decent amount of direct damage plus an additional effect? That way, you’re applying a consistent amount of might, rather than a “half the time” burst.

Oh wait, that’s a necromancer version of a facet.

Robert:

Please make the elite “Chilled to the Bone” usable underwater.

Thanks!

Robert Gee.9246:

Kraav.8136:

Robert:

Please make the elite “Chilled to the Bone” usable underwater.

Thanks!

Done. Although you might not see it for BWE3 it should be in by launch.

A fine start. Now if we could only get rid of the candy-floss we use to stitch together flesh golems and maybe use twine or something so they stop falling apart when they get wet…

Sigmoid.7082:

tenklo.6104:

i still prefure my 3 stab lifesteal with greatsword with bloodmagic traited was getting like 140 perhit on any skill meaning deathspiral was giving me 1400 healing, and now because of this change and nerf… im only getting 2stab lifesteal for about 80 or 800 healing off deathspiral…so to me this is a nerf

From my napkin math you actually end up leeching more health on average the way it is now plus FAR more if you can use GD constantly below 50%

Care to show me your math? Honestly i dont believe the new lifesteal is better.

Here is some math i did:
Gravedigger has a 8 second cooldown and with the trait it would be 6.4 seconds. That means unless you hit opponents below 50% you only get 180/6.4=28.125 health per second and per opponent hit back. With those number i am pretty sure that simply autoattacking with the old value (49 per hit) alone would give you more health back…

Of course this changes if you hit opponents below 50% but keep in mind that of all GS skills gravedigger is the hardest to land and the one that your opponent wants to dodge/block etc. the most (also note that if your opponent dodges your gravedigger the cooldown is not reset even if your opponent is below 50%). With that in mind i am certain that against actual players the old lifesteal was way better then the new one.

While i do appreciate the fact we aren’t looking at the final version yet and i am very happy with some of the changes, i still like many, have an awful feeling we haven’t been given anything that will warrant our inclusion in group PvE.
I mean some very valid points and concerns have been brought into the discussions and unless things are being kept hush hush due to the whole Raid content to come i have to go back to the whole view that once again we are going to be sitting at the bottom again. Please give us something to hold onto here, it’s bloody scary seeing how poorly we will fit in and again if it’s all due to PvP or WvW then please separate the skills off it frankly isn’t fair to keep us in the doghouse any longer.

Don’t get me wrong I’m more of a small group solo kinda guy and am super excited to try some things out but we are the bottom look again in PvE group content which is kinda sad. C’mon RG give us some real purpose for PvE grouping.

Now, if they can flip Soul Eater with Deathly Chill, it’d be great.

Zenith.7301:

Now, if they can flip Soul Eater with Deathly Chill, it’d be great.

While I personally would be happy with that, they won’t due that because they don’t want the weapon and utility traits to be exclusive, and it’d be too limiting on the adepts, which is understandable. Just not real likely to happen.

What are your thoughts of making RS 3 a stun breaker?

ronpierce.2760:

Zenith.7301:

Now, if they can flip Soul Eater with Deathly Chill, it’d be great.

While I personally would be happy with that, they won’t due that because they don’t want the weapon and utility traits to be exclusive, and it’d be too limiting on the adepts, which is understandable. Just not real likely to happen.

PvE has no good adept whatsoever (Chilling Nova is the least gimmicky useless trait, but still an abysmal PvE trait nevertheless), Decimate Defenses is a must, and all the grandmasters suck.

Something needs to be done. We would have Reaper’s Onslaught if reaper shroud wasn’t a DPS loss to camping gratsword, but that’s not the case so on to the discard bin goes Reaper’s Onslaught.

So, yeah, the only positive thing a PvE necromancer player has to say about the reaper line is Decimate Defenses.

If PvE necromancers could use the greatsword without investing in the garbage reaper traitline, they would drop the reaper traitline in a heartbeat. The terrible adepts, shivers of dread, cold shoulder, mediocre grandmasters. Useless in PvE.

I would kill to have access to greatsword and still take Spite/Blood Magic/Soul Reaping (because soul reaping has a damage modifier trait, not because of vital persistence).

And the standard PvE reaper build will be Well of Suffering/Well of Corruption/Signet of Spite. Maybe switch out the Signet for Well of Power/Darkness if the situation calls for it. It will be wells all day all night until they make the other utilities, including the selfish and mediocre shouts worthwhile in PvE (and quite frankly even in WvW, I don’t see a single reaper in a Guild vs. Guild 15-20 man match taking the shouts over wells).

Shouts are for players who want to roam/duel, mostly. They don’t offer your team anything that a well doesn’t do better.

ronpierce.2760:

Zenith.7301:

Now, if they can flip Soul Eater with Deathly Chill, it’d be great.

While I personally would be happy with that, they won’t due that because they don’t want the weapon and utility traits to be exclusive, and it’d be too limiting on the adepts, which is understandable. Just not real likely to happen.

I think you meant Chilling Nova. Zenith was talking about Deathly Chill, the Grandmaster which makes chill do damage haha

I see a problem with this suggestion though, none of them is grandmaster tier worthy in my opinion. Deathly Chill has the 5 max stacks problem and Soul Eater would need something else to leave the master tier.

Ithir Darkleaf.7923:

ronpierce.2760:

Zenith.7301:

Now, if they can flip Soul Eater with Deathly Chill, it’d be great.

While I personally would be happy with that, they won’t due that because they don’t want the weapon and utility traits to be exclusive, and it’d be too limiting on the adepts, which is understandable. Just not real likely to happen.

I think you meant Chilling Nova. Zenith was talking about Deathly Chill, the Grandmaster which makes chill do damage haha

I see a problem with this suggestion though, none of them is grandmaster tier worthy in my opinion. Deathly Chill has the 5 max stacks problem and Soul Eater would need something else to leave the master tier.

Ah yeah. Too many chilly names. :P My bad. What can I say, I’m a noob. Ignore me.

ClawofBeta.8015:

What are your thoughts of making RS 3 a stun breaker?

It would definitely be too strong as a stun breaker. As it is now, it’s basically 11 seconds of CC immunity, like a souped-up defiance bar with no downside, on a 20 second cooldown, with an aoe fear. Reapers need to be not completely immune to CC, and since we already have 33/66% reduction to snares, and 11 seconds of immunity to CC, making it a stunbreak would push it over the top. The counterplay to a Reaper is to run away, and if caught, to quickly smack us with a stun before we’re ready and then run away. Making it a stunbreak that doesn’t use up a utility slot would be insanely powerful, which is something that only Guardians have, and only if traited, and on a very long cooldown.

Captain Unusual.9163:

ClawofBeta.8015:

What are your thoughts of making RS 3 a stun breaker?

It would definitely be too strong as a stun breaker. As it is now, it’s basically 11 seconds of CC immunity, like a souped-up defiance bar with no downside, on a 20 second cooldown, with an aoe fear. Reapers need to be not completely immune to CC, and since we already have 33/66% reduction to snares, and 11 seconds of immunity to CC, making it a stunbreak would push it over the top. The counterplay to a Reaper is to run away, and if caught, to quickly smack us with a stun before we’re ready and then run away. Making it a stunbreak that doesn’t use up a utility slot would be insanely powerful, which is something that only Guardians have, and only if traited, and on a very long cooldown.

And on top of these reasons, we have a trait called Foot in the grave which would mean we would have 2 stun breaks on RS.

Captain Unusual.9163:

ClawofBeta.8015:

What are your thoughts of making RS 3 a stun breaker?

It would definitely be too strong as a stun breaker. As it is now, it’s basically 11 seconds of CC immunity, like a souped-up defiance bar with no downside, on a 20 second cooldown, with an aoe fear. Reapers need to be not completely immune to CC, and since we already have 33/66% reduction to snares, and 11 seconds of immunity to CC, making it a stunbreak would push it over the top. The counterplay to a Reaper is to run away, and if caught, to quickly smack us with a stun before we’re ready and then run away. Making it a stunbreak that doesn’t use up a utility slot would be insanely powerful, which is something that only Guardians have, and only if traited, and on a very long cooldown.

Revenant stunbreaks on legend swap, which is low cooldown as well, in fact lower than Infusing Terror.

And that’s on top of their utility skills which all also legend swap.

And it just so happens revenant has generous access to stability as well.

We might also look at the berserker and daredevil stunbreaks, 10 sec cd with a knockdown upon block for the daredevil, and a 15 sec cd stunbreak for the berserker.

Bpth of these classes supremely more mobile than the reaper.

And in the case of a warrior they’re just as if not more durable than a necromancer in team fights.

Zenith.7301:

Captain Unusual.9163:

ClawofBeta.8015:

What are your thoughts of making RS 3 a stun breaker?

It would definitely be too strong as a stun breaker. As it is now, it’s basically 11 seconds of CC immunity, like a souped-up defiance bar with no downside, on a 20 second cooldown, with an aoe fear. Reapers need to be not completely immune to CC, and since we already have 33/66% reduction to snares, and 11 seconds of immunity to CC, making it a stunbreak would push it over the top. The counterplay to a Reaper is to run away, and if caught, to quickly smack us with a stun before we’re ready and then run away. Making it a stunbreak that doesn’t use up a utility slot would be insanely powerful, which is something that only Guardians have, and only if traited, and on a very long cooldown.

Revenant stunbreaks on legend swap, which is low cooldown as well, in fact lower than Infusing Terror.

And that’s on top of their utility skills which all also legend swap.

And it just so happens revenant has generous access to stability as well.

We might also look at the berserker and daredevil stunbreaks, 10 sec cd with a knockdown upon block for the daredevil, and a 15 sec cd stunbreak for the berserker.

Bpth of these classes supremely more mobile than the reaper.

And in the case of a warrior they’re just as if not more durable than a necromancer in team fights.

Look at the psot literally one above yours. We have Foot in the grave, which gives us a stunbreak + 1 stack stab on DS/RS entry, which is the same CD as Revenant’s stunbreak, so having ANOTHER stunbreak on In fusing Terror is not needed. At all. This would lead to “NERF NECRO” all over again, and we still are suffering from the overnerfs from beta compared to release, aswell as from overnerfing because of Dhuumfire.

anduriell.6280:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Forgetting Executioner’s Scythe? We have a buttload of Chill in Reaper’s Shroud thanks to that ice field and finishers. It’s very, very easy as a Reaper to have high Chill uptime.

Executioner’s Scythe only apply 1 second of chill that last the same as the Stun it applies. I think the chill there is just to give a nice touch to the skill more than actual utility.

In my tests i couldn’t get any uptime with chilled in gameplay, no theorycrafting here. The base of our chill uptime is the Chilling Scythe but that AA chain is so slow that your target is out of reach most of the times. I think i could land it like 10 times in pvE none in WvW.

Thats why the duration would be better lol. You can get a max of 50% chill duration meaning one second turns into 1.5 3 seconds turn into 4.5 and 5 seconds becomes 7.5 seconds if you can land your chills that’s your problem don’t go suggesting things like chill on crit which would come with a horrible ICD. There will be builds out there that counter chill its gonna happen, I’ve aready seen it happen. For people like that you just have to realize you cant fight them easily. But chill on crit at a 33% chance is not the way to go.

Ithir Darkleaf.7923:

ronpierce.2760:

Zenith.7301:

Now, if they can flip Soul Eater with Deathly Chill, it’d be great.

While I personally would be happy with that, they won’t due that because they don’t want the weapon and utility traits to be exclusive, and it’d be too limiting on the adepts, which is understandable. Just not real likely to happen.

I think you meant Chilling Nova. Zenith was talking about Deathly Chill, the Grandmaster which makes chill do damage haha

I see a problem with this suggestion though, none of them is grandmaster tier worthy in my opinion. Deathly Chill has the 5 max stacks problem and Soul Eater would need something else to leave the master tier.

This means chill damage would be reduced. Reaper is the only profession that can make chill do damage and since it was buffed its rightfully fitting fora grand master. To put it back down to th the master slot would mean that have to make it less impactful so it won’t be as effective. Besides Decimate defences too gud in master trait spot anyways …. ._. Deathly chill is a big game changer and should remain in the grand master spot. It fits well there.

You can get a max of 50% chill duration

In pvp you can get a max of 70% on a reaper. 20% from cold shoulder, 30% from runes of ice or grenth, 20% from sigil of chilling. 1s-> 1.7s , 2s -> 3.4s , 3s-> 5.1s , 4s -> 6.8s, 5s -> 8.5s

While the actual duration of a condition is never rounded, the display in a skill’s tooltip will show the duration rounded to the nearest quarter of a second (0s, ¼, ½, ¾ and 1s).

@About Deathly Chill
I would say it wont ever do more damage than terror because how easy chill is to access compared to fear. Though terror is also master tier so who knows.

Sigmoid.7082:

You can get a max of 50% chill duration

In pvp you can get a max of 70% on a reaper. 20% from cold shoulder, 30% from runes of ice or grenth, 20% from sigil of chilling. 1s-> 1.7s , 2s -> 3.4s , 3s-> 5.1s , 4s -> 6.8s, 5s -> 8.5s

While the actual duration of a condition is never rounded, the display in a skill’s tooltip will show the duration rounded to the nearest quarter of a second (0s, ¼, ½, ¾ and 1s).

@About Deathly Chill
I would say it wont ever do more damage than terror because how easy chill is to access compared to fear. Though terror is also master tier so who knows.

I was pretty sure the cap even though you can equip stuff for more than 50% was 50% though? (Butttt… i could be wrong I just know i never felt that i needed more than bonus 50% total for my build to be effective.

ZDragon.3046:

Sigmoid.7082:

You can get a max of 50% chill duration

In pvp you can get a max of 70% on a reaper. 20% from cold shoulder, 30% from runes of ice or grenth, 20% from sigil of chilling. 1s-> 1.7s , 2s -> 3.4s , 3s-> 5.1s , 4s -> 6.8s, 5s -> 8.5s

While the actual duration of a condition is never rounded, the display in a skill’s tooltip will show the duration rounded to the nearest quarter of a second (0s, ¼, ½, ¾ and 1s).

@About Deathly Chill
I would say it wont ever do more damage than terror because how easy chill is to access compared to fear. Though terror is also master tier so who knows.

I was pretty sure the cap even though you can equip stuff for more than 50% was 50% though? (Butttt… i could be wrong I just know i never felt that i needed more than bonus 50% total for my build to be effective.

Condition Duration Wiki

Condition duration from runes isn’t shown in the skill’s tooltip, but does correctly increase duration. Condition duration cannot be increased beyond 100%

You dont really need it but means you can take other rune sets or sigils etc. Ex:- you can have 40% with reaper and sigil only, frees up rune choice.

Sigmoid.7082:

You can get a max of 50% chill duration

In pvp you can get a max of 70% on a reaper. 20% from cold shoulder, 30% from runes of ice or grenth, 20% from sigil of chilling. 1s-> 1.7s , 2s -> 3.4s , 3s-> 5.1s , 4s -> 6.8s, 5s -> 8.5s

While the actual duration of a condition is never rounded, the display in a skill’s tooltip will show the duration rounded to the nearest quarter of a second (0s, ¼, ½, ¾ and 1s).

@About Deathly Chill
I would say it wont ever do more damage than terror because how easy chill is to access compared to fear. Though terror is also master tier so who knows.

Remember that damage from “special” conditions (terror and deathly chill) do not benefit from the condition changes, and do not recognize partial seconds. 1s of chill does the same amount of damage as 1.9s of chill. You can not get partial ticks of the special conditions, and thus it is almost never advantageous to spec into additional duration of those unless it boosts you to the next full second. Even then it is iffy. even with a 70% increase, a 2 → 3.4s chill only gains you ~800 damage. Contrast that to an 80% increase in bleed duration, in which a 10s bleed becomes an 18s bleed giving you an extra ~1600 damage per stack. Always take bleed duration over chill duration.

Remember that damage from “special” conditions (terror and deathly chill) do not benefit from the condition changes, and do not recognize partial seconds. 1s of chill does the same amount of damage as 1.9s of chill. You can not get partial ticks of the special conditions, and thus it is almost never advantageous to spec into additional duration of those unless it boosts you to the next full second.

This is incorrect. Literally you can just hop into game and test this. I just did this and using reapers mark and the fear of death trait. A 1.5s fear will tick twice. Once for full damage and the second time for partial damage. Doom, a 2.25s fear, will tick three times. twice for full damage and once again for partial damage. So yes, traits that make conditions do damage have partial ticks.

Always take bleed duration over chill duration.

Again this is from a totally condition perspective. I was in no way relating chill duration to the chill damage trait when stating you can get 70% duration. The two things are totally separate in my post. The only reason i brought up bitter chill at all was to state that because chill is more common than fear that bitter chill wont do more damage than terror. That it. There would be no real point on taking bleed duration on a power build focused on chill would there?