Guild Wars 2

Vaxx.3178:

I assume with some of the issues brought up….the REAL issues….has scared the dev away.

Sit back, and wait for some dev replies next year I guess.

Mostly just people who saw the red icon and figured it would be a good time to rant and rave like lunatics and kill all sense of polite discourse.

We actually got him to consider a possible semi-fix for the 1H sword…

Substance E.4852:

Vaxx.3178:

I assume with some of the issues brought up….the REAL issues….has scared the dev away.

Sit back, and wait for some dev replies next year I guess.

Mostly just people who saw the red icon and figured it would be a good time to rant and rave like lunatics and kill all sense of polite discourse.

We actually got him to consider a possible semi-fix for the 1H sword…

Are you implying the complaints aren’t justified? Did you miss where he said they know about our problems but can’t be bothered to fix them because they aren’t easy fixes? Despite the game being out a year?

I’m sorry but THE core mechanic this whole class is designed and balanced around doesn’t work and they have told us quite clearly it’s not on their radar despite these issues being around since beta.

Atherakhia.4086:

Substance E.4852:

Vaxx.3178:

I assume with some of the issues brought up….the REAL issues….has scared the dev away.

Sit back, and wait for some dev replies next year I guess.

Mostly just people who saw the red icon and figured it would be a good time to rant and rave like lunatics and kill all sense of polite discourse.

We actually got him to consider a possible semi-fix for the 1H sword…

Are you implying the complaints aren’t justified? Did you miss where he said they know about our problems but can’t be bothered to fix them because they aren’t easy fixes? Despite the game being out a year?

I’m sorry but THE core mechanic this whole class is designed and balanced around doesn’t work and they have told us quite clearly it’s not on their radar despite these issues being around since beta.

Also we have gotten no response on all the “low hanging fruit” suggestions that people have made (trait merging, trait position swapping, etc…) or various suggestions on Natural Vigor and the recently pointed out incorrect math, which Mr Peters may have not seen.

Atherakhia.4086:

Substance E.4852:

Vaxx.3178:

I assume with some of the issues brought up….the REAL issues….has scared the dev away.

Sit back, and wait for some dev replies next year I guess.

Mostly just people who saw the red icon and figured it would be a good time to rant and rave like lunatics and kill all sense of polite discourse.

We actually got him to consider a possible semi-fix for the 1H sword…

Are you implying the complaints aren’t justified? Did you miss where he said they know about our problems but can’t be bothered to fix them because they aren’t easy fixes? Despite the game being out a year?

I’m sorry but THE core mechanic this whole class is designed and balanced around doesn’t work and they have told us quite clearly it’s not on their radar despite these issues being around since beta.

Exactly this…
Got him to consider…? Its plain as day.

With all the issues, it’s not his place to see sorting the ranger class as a “consideration”, that is his job and his responsibility to make rangers ( and all classes) battle viable to battle any class pretty reasonably.
Look at the weapon issues as a starting point, the 1H sword rooting is a joke like the short bow nerf, the awful damage on axes that don’t know if they are hard damage or condition (both suck anyways for ranger), the pets that don’t hit despite the Anet vision where pet DPS is 40% of your damage. Someone made those decisions as bad as they were, to the point the class really is a mess. When they actually should have been nerfing and dumbing down other classes to make the ranger viable, they did the opposite and now find there are no easy fixes, even though there are some easy ones available to them – bump the damage up for one.

Secondly… tongue in cheek or otherwise, critique is critique. If the facts were not there to poke holes they would not be on this forum now. The problem why people feel so strongly is because that these class balancing issues were not so apparent as newbies when the game launched. Now we know better because we are taking part in the game fully and we now realize these choices could have been rectified with a re-roll early on. But because you really have to bump to 80 to get the full potential of your class and started battling other classes in PVP or WVW. It is here you see the unfair class balance and by that time its far too late as you invested time, gold, real money for gems etc.
And it is here that where sorting the ranger problems are far more than a consideration, it’s a customer responsibility to its player base. That is the bottom line. If Anet developers actually did something considerably good for us for once instead of senseless nerfs to an already underperforming class, then perhaps the critique would not be so big. Unfortunately only they can solve that, however credit where credit is due… I am so pleased they are considering a nerf to perm stealth thieves and are understanding it was being abused in builds. So that is something at least.

mzt.3270:

Atherakhia.4086:

Substance E.4852:

Vaxx.3178:

I assume with some of the issues brought up….the REAL issues….has scared the dev away.

Sit back, and wait for some dev replies next year I guess.

Mostly just people who saw the red icon and figured it would be a good time to rant and rave like lunatics and kill all sense of polite discourse.

We actually got him to consider a possible semi-fix for the 1H sword…

Are you implying the complaints aren’t justified? Did you miss where he said they know about our problems but can’t be bothered to fix them because they aren’t easy fixes? Despite the game being out a year?

I’m sorry but THE core mechanic this whole class is designed and balanced around doesn’t work and they have told us quite clearly it’s not on their radar despite these issues being around since beta.

Exactly this…
Got him to consider…? Its plain as day.

With all the issues, it’s not his place to see sorting the ranger class as a “consideration”, that is his job and his responsibility to make rangers ( and all classes) battle viable to battle any class pretty reasonably.
Look at the weapon issues as a starting point, the 1H sword rooting is a joke like the short bow nerf, the awful damage on axes that don’t know if they are hard damage or condition (both suck anyways for ranger), the pets that don’t hit despite the Anet vision where pet DPS is 40% of your damage. Someone made those decisions as bad as they were, to the point the class really is a mess. When they actually should have been nerfing and dumbing down other classes to make the ranger viable, they did the opposite and now find there are no easy fixes, even though there are some easy ones available to them – bump the damage up for one.

Secondly… tongue in cheek or otherwise, critique is critique. If the facts were not there to poke holes they would not be on this forum now. The problem why people feel so strongly is because that these class balancing issues were not so apparent as newbies when the game launched. Now we know better because we are taking part in the game fully and we now realize these choices could have been rectified with a re-roll early on. But because you really have to bump to 80 to get the full potential of your class and started battling other classes in PVP or WVW. It is here you see the unfair class balance and by that time its far too late as you invested time, gold, real money for gems etc.
And it is here that where sorting the ranger problems are far more than a consideration, it’s a customer responsibility to its player base. That is the bottom line. If Anet developers actually did something considerably good for us for once instead of senseless nerfs to an already underperforming class, then perhaps the critique would not be so big. Unfortunately only they can solve that, however credit where credit is due… I am so pleased they are considering a nerf to perm stealth thieves and are understanding it was being abused in builds. So that is something at least.

Very well written, i agree 100%

The Pats and the 40% dmg outcome is a joke, because something that dosent live long enough to to dmg is simply not exsitant, thats a fact. So we the rangers are batteling with 40% less dmg than any other class by default in wvw. My biggest problem with the ranger is the fact that it was descriped as a MASTER of the Bows, but it is so sadly and true that in endgame only a full deffensife ranger with Longsword is somehow usable. But if i wanted to play a mele class, than i would have put all my time money and effort to lvl up a mele class. So it is a fact for me that Anet cheated on me when describing a ranger. They took all my time and money i could have invested in other games and the outcome is a range class best played as a mele class.

mzt.3270:

Atherakhia.4086:

Substance E.4852:

Vaxx.3178:

I assume with some of the issues brought up….the REAL issues….has scared the dev away.

Sit back, and wait for some dev replies next year I guess.

Mostly just people who saw the red icon and figured it would be a good time to rant and rave like lunatics and kill all sense of polite discourse.

We actually got him to consider a possible semi-fix for the 1H sword…

Are you implying the complaints aren’t justified? Did you miss where he said they know about our problems but can’t be bothered to fix them because they aren’t easy fixes? Despite the game being out a year?

I’m sorry but THE core mechanic this whole class is designed and balanced around doesn’t work and they have told us quite clearly it’s not on their radar despite these issues being around since beta.

Exactly this…
Got him to consider…? Its plain as day.

With all the issues, it’s not his place to see sorting the ranger class as a “consideration”, that is his job and his responsibility to make rangers ( and all classes) battle viable to battle any class pretty reasonably.
Look at the weapon issues as a starting point, the 1H sword rooting is a joke like the short bow nerf, the awful damage on axes that don’t know if they are hard damage or condition (both suck anyways for ranger), the pets that don’t hit despite the Anet vision where pet DPS is 40% of your damage. Someone made those decisions as bad as they were, to the point the class really is a mess. When they actually should have been nerfing and dumbing down other classes to make the ranger viable, they did the opposite and now find there are no easy fixes, even though there are some easy ones available to them – bump the damage up for one.

Secondly… tongue in cheek or otherwise, critique is critique. If the facts were not there to poke holes they would not be on this forum now. The problem why people feel so strongly is because that these class balancing issues were not so apparent as newbies when the game launched. Now we know better because we are taking part in the game fully and we now realize these choices could have been rectified with a re-roll early on. But because you really have to bump to 80 to get the full potential of your class and started battling other classes in PVP or WVW. It is here you see the unfair class balance and by that time its far too late as you invested time, gold, real money for gems etc.
And it is here that where sorting the ranger problems are far more than a consideration, it’s a customer responsibility to its player base. That is the bottom line. If Anet developers actually did something considerably good for us for once instead of senseless nerfs to an already underperforming class, then perhaps the critique would not be so big. Unfortunately only they can solve that, however credit where credit is due… I am so pleased they are considering a nerf to perm stealth thieves and are understanding it was being abused in builds. So that is something at least.

^ Articulate and self aware. Very nice.

Agreed to this…except to perma-stealth thieves.

Dahkeus.8243:

mzt.3270:

Atherakhia.4086:

Substance E.4852:

Vaxx.3178:

I assume with some of the issues brought up….the REAL issues….has scared the dev away.

Sit back, and wait for some dev replies next year I guess.

Mostly just people who saw the red icon and figured it would be a good time to rant and rave like lunatics and kill all sense of polite discourse.

We actually got him to consider a possible semi-fix for the 1H sword…

Are you implying the complaints aren’t justified? Did you miss where he said they know about our problems but can’t be bothered to fix them because they aren’t easy fixes? Despite the game being out a year?

I’m sorry but THE core mechanic this whole class is designed and balanced around doesn’t work and they have told us quite clearly it’s not on their radar despite these issues being around since beta.

Exactly this…
Got him to consider…? Its plain as day.

With all the issues, it’s not his place to see sorting the ranger class as a “consideration”, that is his job and his responsibility to make rangers ( and all classes) battle viable to battle any class pretty reasonably.
Look at the weapon issues as a starting point, the 1H sword rooting is a joke like the short bow nerf, the awful damage on axes that don’t know if they are hard damage or condition (both suck anyways for ranger), the pets that don’t hit despite the Anet vision where pet DPS is 40% of your damage. Someone made those decisions as bad as they were, to the point the class really is a mess. When they actually should have been nerfing and dumbing down other classes to make the ranger viable, they did the opposite and now find there are no easy fixes, even though there are some easy ones available to them – bump the damage up for one.

Secondly… tongue in cheek or otherwise, critique is critique. If the facts were not there to poke holes they would not be on this forum now. The problem why people feel so strongly is because that these class balancing issues were not so apparent as newbies when the game launched. Now we know better because we are taking part in the game fully and we now realize these choices could have been rectified with a re-roll early on. But because you really have to bump to 80 to get the full potential of your class and started battling other classes in PVP or WVW. It is here you see the unfair class balance and by that time its far too late as you invested time, gold, real money for gems etc.
And it is here that where sorting the ranger problems are far more than a consideration, it’s a customer responsibility to its player base. That is the bottom line. If Anet developers actually did something considerably good for us for once instead of senseless nerfs to an already underperforming class, then perhaps the critique would not be so big. Unfortunately only they can solve that, however credit where credit is due… I am so pleased they are considering a nerf to perm stealth thieves and are understanding it was being abused in builds. So that is something at least.

^ Articulate and self aware. Very nice.

Agreed to this…except to perma-stealth thieves.

Aww TY, well I do feel strongly about it. I am sure the thieves are feeling the pinch too, I don’t place any grudge on thieves at all, many are great players. Unfortunately again its Anets inability to balance classes that has in the end ( may or may not) force them to change builds. For that I really feel sorry for all thief class players who may feel they need to do this.
As for Jon, well if you are listening I am a disgruntled player who feels you are not doing enough to force better class development for rangers and I would like some compensation to re-roll or indeed sort my chosen class I have invested in. Seeing customer service won’t entertain my request, I would appreciate for you to take the time out to discuss this matter ( and the £300 of gem store purchases I made for my ranger over the past couple of months ) Thanks XD

Holland.9351:

kitten nic Touch.7960:

Wilderness 5 Natural Vigor. Reduced the increased endurance regeneration from 50% to 25%.

This really ruins it for me. Again a big nerf out of nowhere.

Let me add it to the list:
- endurance regen nerfed from 50% to 25%
- Healing Spring no longer gives vigor each tick and water field duration reduced
- shortbow nerfed from 1200 to 900 range
- damage skills from many pets reduced by 50%
- pet leash range reduced drastically
- “Search & Rescue” can’t revive dead players anymore
- quickness on pet swap moved from Minor Adept to Major Grandmaster (swapped with worthless trait)
- “Guard” no longer works up or down ledges
- “Signet of the Beastmaster” moved from Adept to Grandmaster.

I probably missed some.

Other unsesolved issues:
- Guard is a shout, but has a 1 second cast time
- Nearly all AoE attacks hit 3 targets instead of 5
- Require grandmaster traits to make signets, shouts, traps and spirits useful.
- Require grandmaster trait to have relatively useful condition removal.
- “Sic ’em” gets cancelled if the pet is told to activate another skill or told to change target.
- Signet of Renewal fails if pet is out of range.
- a healing skill (Healing Spring) is the only reliable on-demand condition removal rangers have.
- pets f2 often doesn’t activate or very late.
- sword auto-attack has too many leaps and makes the character feel out of control and prevents dodging.
- shortbow auto-attack bleed requires a flank.
- longbow Barrage too long cooldown.
- longbow requires to spend 50 trait points to get its basic traits (20% cooldown, piercing arrows, 1500 range)
- skirmishing has too many bad traits.

If these were fixed/changed we might actually be getting somewhere with this class.

100000000% well said. I’m with you on all of your points.

Holland.9351:

kitten nic Touch.7960:

Wilderness 5 Natural Vigor. Reduced the increased endurance regeneration from 50% to 25%.

This really ruins it for me. Again a big nerf out of nowhere.

Let me add it to the list:
- endurance regen nerfed from 50% to 25%
- Healing Spring no longer gives vigor each tick and water field duration reduced
- shortbow nerfed from 1200 to 900 range
- damage skills from many pets reduced by 50%
- pet leash range reduced drastically
- “Search & Rescue” can’t revive dead players anymore
- quickness on pet swap moved from Minor Adept to Major Grandmaster (swapped with worthless trait)
- “Guard” no longer works up or down ledges
- “Signet of the Beastmaster” moved from Adept to Grandmaster.

I probably missed some.

Other unsesolved issues:
- Guard is a shout, but has a 1 second cast time
- Nearly all AoE attacks hit 3 targets instead of 5
- Require grandmaster traits to make signets, shouts, traps and spirits useful.
- Require grandmaster trait to have relatively useful condition removal.
- “Sic ’em” gets cancelled if the pet is told to activate another skill or told to change target.
- Signet of Renewal fails if pet is out of range.
- a healing skill (Healing Spring) is the only reliable on-demand condition removal rangers have.
- pets f2 often doesn’t activate or very late.
- sword auto-attack has too many leaps and makes the character feel out of control and prevents dodging.
- shortbow auto-attack bleed requires a flank.
- longbow Barrage too long cooldown.
- longbow requires to spend 50 trait points to get its basic traits (20% cooldown, piercing arrows, 1500 range)
- skirmishing has too many bad traits.

If these were fixed/changed we might actually be getting somewhere with this class.

I missed this post… looking at all of these ridiculous nerfs in one spot really illustrates the disconnect between players and developers. It’s kind of sad to see such drastic changes to a class that’s always under performed compared to other classes. I cannot even begin to grasp their thought process with some of these changes.

You pretty much nailed it. But I do not expect them to address any of this.

mzt.3270:

Lévis.5489:

Remember the giant thread from last year? Hope it won’t end up like it.
http://youtu.be/htHRErZM7QM

Hahaha, This said it all. I hope Jon actually watches this. !!

And you know what is sad? Most of it still make sense, one year later.

kitten nic Touch.7960:

Holland.9351:

kitten nic Touch.7960:

Wilderness 5 Natural Vigor. Reduced the increased endurance regeneration from 50% to 25%.

This really ruins it for me. Again a big nerf out of nowhere.

Let me add it to the list:
- endurance regen nerfed from 50% to 25%
- Healing Spring no longer gives vigor each tick and water field duration reduced
- shortbow nerfed from 1200 to 900 range
- damage skills from many pets reduced by 50%
- pet leash range reduced drastically
- “Search & Rescue” can’t revive dead players anymore
- quickness on pet swap moved from Minor Adept to Major Grandmaster (swapped with worthless trait)
- “Guard” no longer works up or down ledges
- “Signet of the Beastmaster” moved from Adept to Grandmaster.

I probably missed some.

Other unsesolved issues:
- Guard is a shout, but has a 1 second cast time
- Nearly all AoE attacks hit 3 targets instead of 5
- Require grandmaster traits to make signets, shouts, traps and spirits useful.
- Require grandmaster trait to have relatively useful condition removal.
- “Sic ’em” gets cancelled if the pet is told to activate another skill or told to change target.
- Signet of Renewal fails if pet is out of range.
- a healing skill (Healing Spring) is the only reliable on-demand condition removal rangers have.
- pets f2 often doesn’t activate or very late.
- sword auto-attack has too many leaps and makes the character feel out of control and prevents dodging.
- shortbow auto-attack bleed requires a flank.
- longbow Barrage too long cooldown.
- longbow requires to spend 50 trait points to get its basic traits (20% cooldown, piercing arrows, 1500 range)
- skirmishing has too many bad traits.

If these were fixed/changed we might actually be getting somewhere with this class.

I missed this post… looking at all of these ridiculous nerfs in one spot really illustrates the disconnect between players and developers. It’s kind of sad to see such drastic changes to a class that’s always under performed compared to other classes. I cannot even begin to grasp their thought process with some of these changes.

You pretty much nailed it. But I do not expect them to address any of this.

Yeah its really sad when you see it all addressed down like this. This was a good post.

Lévis.5489:

mzt.3270:

Lévis.5489:

Remember the giant thread from last year? Hope it won’t end up like it.
http://youtu.be/htHRErZM7QM

Hahaha, This said it all. I hope Jon actually watches this. !!

And you know what is sad? Most of it still make sense, one year later.

This is brilliant, and it pretty much still sums up the Ranger………… Yes and after a year it’s very sad that the Ranger is still in this position.

I think Mr Peters has left the building………

I can get their thought process . In every SOTG we have players of other classes complaining about ranger builds , first it was the beastmaster now its the spiritmaster . Note that these players are tools to boot . Hence the predicament we are in

If pets won’t reach the potential they were meant to be in the near future, how about considering more traits that revolve around our pets dying/taking damage? It would help out those that don’t want a pet, and we would receive some positives for having a class mechanic that doesn’t work all the time. I don’t mean a whole trait line, but if our pets get quickness when we get downed, maybe we could get mor stuff out of our pets dying. 1-2 more traits would make it soooo much better. For example how about making heal as one a signet. Passive would be to heal every time our pet takes damage (similar to thief heal signet).

Chokolata.1870:

I can get their thought process . In every SOTG we have players of other classes complaining about ranger builds , first it was the beastmaster now its the spiritmaster . Note that these players are tools to boot . Hence the predicament we are in

In another word: sPvP.

Greatsword buff is awesome! Can finally drop the warhorn and run with more defense and poisen with Greatsword / Sword, Dagger. New OP Greatsword video INC but I feel this new one is going to be a viable tournament roamer.

As for the other changes, THANK YOU for sooo many options!

Do you all agree that Ranger Greatsword is the funnest weapon in this game!?

Not sure if Jon is still reading here or not as the discussion has devolved from ideas and discussion to complaints (justified/warranted) or not. If you are sir, Kudos to you. If not, then here goes with me long-windedly spewing forth my personal (and/or others ideas) with/without some modifications. Before I proceed however I’d like to request the community to return to polite discussion rather than demands and name calling. We’ll get farther with civility and tact then with name calling and disrespect. Just like in the real world instead of internet forums.

1.) Weapon alterations.
Jon, I personally dislike the idea of losing evade on chain 3. I agree it needs something, but that something is damage. If we agree and know that the estimated 30% damage from our pets is not being realized in most formats, then truthfully I don’t see where there should be a concern for doing such. The other alternative would be a 1 second weakness on chain 3, establishing a decrease to our personal chance of avoidance, but assisting our allies. Probably overpowered with the cleave, but perhaps slightly mitigated if you coded it to only proc on first target. Just a suggestion.
Longbow: Hunter’s shot is neat, but feels like it belongs on short bow. Longbow 3 can then be Splinter Shot, AoE damage with a couple bleeds. Why? With ranged weapons we are very limited on attacks with no target. If a character slips into stealth all we have with a chance of hitting is barrage.
Shortbow.: Skill 3 gets Hunter’s shot. Quick arrow followed by stealth.
MH Axe: Damage co-efficients up per pet inconsistencies, otherwise fine.

2.)Signet of The Beast master
I know the balance team dislikes the idea of making the signets inherently affect the Ranger. +25 or +50% damage added even for one attack is relatively high for a single utility skill, especially when affecting 70% of our output instead of only 30%. I suggest decreasing the starting values of the signets active affects and altering them with a new signet trait. Adept trait remains cool down %, master improves them to before change stats, grandmaster gives passive effects to allies and activating will produce 3 stacks of might for the party. I like the ring of Signet of the Alpha. Makes you feel like the pack leader. I see this as a low hanging fruit as the only signets that’d need heavy coding is signet of the hunt/renewal. Wild could be copy pasted from guard’s virtue of resolve (for the passive), stone is like their defense trait. The alpha trait could essentially just be a if activated then for great justice effect lol. That’s probably not how your code works but who knows.

3.) Pet Survival
Companions Defense trait- Ranger gains 2 sec protection, pet 2 secs of invuln. Now it has your dodge.
Rampage as One- Added clause, Revive your pet eliminating CD. Remains the same except pet stability is changed to invuln. This gives us an “Oh crap my pet died rendering my Elite skill useless” button. Sorely needed. Also makes for an active way to increase pet survival against bosses and zerg attrition. They lose stability as this would become far too overpowered.

Shouts
Our shouts are kind of lackluster as they only benefit our pet, unless gm traited for some regent and swiftness. I suggest some alterations as follows.
Search and Rescue – “All for one” Revives pet and up to 3 allies. If Ranger is still up after 10 secs allies remain up, if he drops at any point in the 10 seconds everyone drops back to downed state. Probably a hard code, but more in line with Mesmers or Necros rez.
Protect Me- Pet gains counterattack knock back effect for 10 seconds, taking damage for you and knocking foes away. Could also be an absorb effect and pulse a knock back AOE every 2 seconds.
Sic Em – Remains the Same. Remove Target, AoE reveal radius 1500, Reveal 5seconds.
Guard! – Allies gain protection and retaliation. Pet goes ghostly as animation but runs at Rangers side. (It is immune to incoming damage at this point, but also can not attack.)
5.) Traits
Marksmanship
Signet changes as above.
QuickDraw moved from skirmishing and mated with piercing arrows. Take their offspring “eagle eye” down to adept tier. Alpha Strike married to opening strike. Gm minor – masters minor. Remorseless to gm minor. New GM trait, Marksman’s Mastery. +10% Increased attack speed while using a bow. I’d have put 25%, but I’d probably be laughed at. It’d just be nice to get short bow back to where it was, and help the channel on Rapid Shot/Barrage.
Skirmishing:
Bye bye trap traits, hello martial mastery, off hand training, and new gm trait, Skirmisher’s Passion. 10% IAS when equipping melee weapons.
Wilderness Survival: Hello traps, goodbye martial weapons, goodbye bark skin.
Nature Magic: Goodbye Nature’s Voice, Hello Bark skin.
BeastMastery: Goodbye something… Hello Nature’s Voice. Master tier of course. Heck, move Natural Healing down to Master and Nature’s Voice GM. It’s cool with me.
Obviously I could write more, but this is probably too much already and shall go unread. Whee.

I also find it kind of funny that they are using the too much endurance from traits bit * when warriors can get so much more sustain from just healing signet and a 15 point trait . This is on the level of 600 hp/sec without any healing power gear . Obscene . Hypocrits

I’d already be more then happy if they could merge / swap some of our traits for more build variety.

I dont like having to go 30 MM for usefull signets. The traitline has way to much. Its has traits for a full signet build, full long bow build , on top of flat percentage bonuses to damage and a passive group buff on top of that.

Imo the signets actives could be toned down to be inline with the other proffessions, then they would primairly activate for us, and we could have a grandmaster/master trait which gives our pet the effects to.

Or 30 skirmishing for optimal traps which arent really optimal because the line doesnt give a condition duration or damage bonus.

Also some of the traits are way too specific (looking at you pet family traits) is there a reason they just cant give every pet the effect?

Or another example opening strike. Why do i have to invest an additional 10 point in MM for my pet to have it? We are supposed to be the companion/pet class right?

Its very taxing on the trait points to have to trait for BOTH your pet and yourself.

I’d like to suggest to have more traits such as Bountifull Hunter (NM 25) it gives a (smaller) damage bonus for both you and your pet. Or companions defense which has a effect for both you and your pet.

The on weapon swap trait from skirmishing could easily affect you and your companion.

Eagle eye could easily increase the range for both our bows and our long range pets

Alpha training could easily be merged with opening strike. Then for example move precise strike to MM 15, and remorseless to MM 25.

Aglity training could include a smaller speed bonus for the ranger himself.

And a ‘reverse fortyfying bond’ trait would do wonders for BM/boon builds.

My point being there are to many ‘pet only’ and ‘ranger’ only traits for a class that is supposed to be a beastmaster.

At the moment i dont feel like a master of beasts i feel like a watered down warrior with a companion(who i have to sacrifice potentially many of my traits points for)

Edit:

On the topic of the greatsword i do like the evade on auto attack alot. But my 2 cents would that i (in pve) only use the 1-3 skills. Skill 4 and 5 see very little play maybe give them some kind of damage bonus/effect/lower cooldowns to make them more used?

Some kind of boon for our pet on auto attack would be nice too maybe make the evade on our attack also go for our pet?

(and as everyone else said a damage bonus would be nice to GS needs a bit of "POW’ from something other then maul.)

Imaginos.3756:

Sina.9208:

The build I use doesn’t have Natural Vigor in it. It took me a while to get used to it, but we have sooo many dodge skills on weapons it’s crazy.

Longbow has no dodge/evade.
Main Axe has no dodge/evade.
Offhand Axe doesn’t have one either
Offhand Torch also doesn’t have one.
Offhand Warhorn also doesn’t have a dodge/evade.

Only 4 of our weapons have a dodge/evade. Greatsword, Sword, Dagger and Shortbow.

Kain Francois.4328:

The GS Traits in Nature Magic should be moved to Skirmishing, since it focuses on dealing damage anyways.

Or in to Wilderness Survival where the other greatsword trait is.

Our traits are a mess and all over the place. They need compression and a few to be moved into more logical spots.

If you are using longbow you need to dodge a LOT less than a melee player & the stealth is also able to help you in pve too. (not that LB is a real option in organized pve) Main hand axe is just really bad atm& if you still wanted to play it you could combine it with an offhand dagger for the extra dodge.

If you play the meta build with sword mainhand & shortbow as a safety “getoutofmelee” weapon (in pve) you will have a LOT of dodges & having endurance regen as well is nothing short of OP.

I understand that the ranger has lots of problems, but endurance is not one of them & it won’t be either after dec 10., this is a nerf that is perfectly logical.

@ Spectre.
Your post was excellent, some fantastic suggestions there too although I do have to state that I feel most people have been more than civil in this forum post. The issue lies that Jon has just proposed a number of changes to the ranger mainly regen and greatsword, this being the only viable skill rangers had left in wvw and pve (even despite its mediocre damage) is now being proposed and ushered to the guillotine in a future patch.
Nobody has disrespected any developer , if anything it is the other way around: as for a whole year there has been nothing but nerf after nerf to ranger class , whittling the class to the poorest damage and little more than cryptic elaborate statements for these changes, when all we ask for is layman’s terms to why the Anet team have have nerfed this class continually DESPITE having much lower damage and fluidity than other classes. Also ponder the scenario that time after time promises are made to sort Rangers and then near the time state " rangers are fine" when everyone else in the player community is saying otherwise and then carelessly in no certain terms, saying they are too lazy to fix the class properly and with enough positive improvements to warrant an actual patch change .
As I have stated, people have placed critique and nothing more. That being said if I were Mr Peters, I would be utterly ashamed that I let things go as long as they have done and instead of whittling off terms of " low hanging fruit", most of which are now shrivelled like raisins. Just do what’s right and give this class a much needed helping hand instead to pandering to already generous buffed guardians and warriors.
All people have stated to developers is to stop and rethink what he is proposing and handing down what the ranger community have advised him to do many times over.

Nobody is saying that GW2 is not a fantastic game, nobody is really downing devs either; but they certainly are not helping their own case by placing more senseless nerfs to a class that’s already fighting to be support at best.
People who are playing rangers are being given a massive dis-service continually and I for one feel it’s only right a proper explanation is made to all the nerfs over the year and what ( and when) they are going to put things right for this class. In the meantime give us the damage output, set things right and Anet developers would find the ranger community starting to warm to them.
Respect is a two way partnership, Respect is earned not given & earning a way is admitting failures and putting things right. I have not seen anyone disrespecting developers here, if anything it’s the other way around by developers passing down unacceptable developments to this already underperforming and broken class, putting hands in the air and stating there are too many issues to sort. Yet in the same breath are doing nothing positive to rectify things and again punishing this class further due to issues , none of which have been properly explained .

Sina.9208:

Imaginos.3756:

Sina.9208:

The build I use doesn’t have Natural Vigor in it. It took me a while to get used to it, but we have sooo many dodge skills on weapons it’s crazy.

Longbow has no dodge/evade.
Main Axe has no dodge/evade.
Offhand Axe doesn’t have one either
Offhand Torch also doesn’t have one.
Offhand Warhorn also doesn’t have a dodge/evade.

Only 4 of our weapons have a dodge/evade. Greatsword, Sword, Dagger and Shortbow.

Kain Francois.4328:

The GS Traits in Nature Magic should be moved to Skirmishing, since it focuses on dealing damage anyways.

Or in to Wilderness Survival where the other greatsword trait is.

Our traits are a mess and all over the place. They need compression and a few to be moved into more logical spots.

If you are using longbow you need to dodge a LOT less than a melee player & the stealth is also able to help you in pve too. (not that LB is a real option in organized pve) Main hand axe is just really bad atm& if you still wanted to play it you could combine it with an offhand dagger for the extra dodge.

If you play the meta build with sword mainhand & shortbow as a safety “getoutofmelee” weapon (in pve) you will have a LOT of dodges & having endurance regen as well is nothing short of OP.

I understand that the ranger has lots of problems, but endurance is not one of them & it won’t be either after dec 10., this is a nerf that is perfectly logical.

No it’s not logical at all. Stop being an Anet apologist. Logical would be to turn this trait into the very same 5pt trait that other classes get on crit or turning their trait into the same version we get.

Either way it’s irrelevant because Peters isn’t going to come back here and say anything. They’ll do exactly what they planned to do and we’ll get to suffer from it on top of all the other broken crap with our class that they won’t fix. Real great “balance” there Anet.

Imaginos.3756:

Sina.9208:

Imaginos.3756:

Sina.9208:

The build I use doesn’t have Natural Vigor in it. It took me a while to get used to it, but we have sooo many dodge skills on weapons it’s crazy.

Longbow has no dodge/evade.
Main Axe has no dodge/evade.
Offhand Axe doesn’t have one either
Offhand Torch also doesn’t have one.
Offhand Warhorn also doesn’t have a dodge/evade.

Only 4 of our weapons have a dodge/evade. Greatsword, Sword, Dagger and Shortbow.

Kain Francois.4328:

The GS Traits in Nature Magic should be moved to Skirmishing, since it focuses on dealing damage anyways.

Or in to Wilderness Survival where the other greatsword trait is.

Our traits are a mess and all over the place. They need compression and a few to be moved into more logical spots.

If you are using longbow you need to dodge a LOT less than a melee player & the stealth is also able to help you in pve too. (not that LB is a real option in organized pve) Main hand axe is just really bad atm& if you still wanted to play it you could combine it with an offhand dagger for the extra dodge.

If you play the meta build with sword mainhand & shortbow as a safety “getoutofmelee” weapon (in pve) you will have a LOT of dodges & having endurance regen as well is nothing short of OP.

I understand that the ranger has lots of problems, but endurance is not one of them & it won’t be either after dec 10., this is a nerf that is perfectly logical.

No it’s not logical at all. Stop being an Anet apologist. Logical would be to turn this trait into the very same 5pt trait that other classes get on crit or turning their trait into the same version we get.

Either way it’s irrelevant because Peters isn’t going to come back here and say anything. They’ll do exactly what they planned to do and we’ll get to suffer from it on top of all the other broken crap with our class that they won’t fix. Real great “balance” there Anet.

Agreed, this is not logical and you are right to state this was an Anet apologist.
The very statement " you will have a LOT of dodges & having endurance regen as well is nothing short of OP " is a pile of codswallop. The rooted 1hand sword is the most useless weapon in GW for ranger, not only for its poor damage but it roots you on the floor, that the only option you have for an evade is that one dagger skill on a cooldown. It is like sticking your feet in superglue, tying a firecracker to your shoes and trying to light with a damp match, hoping for a lucky strike to get you free whilst smacking a very angry Komodo dragon with a wet noodle. As for OP, I think you confused GW2 ranger in another game, there ain’t nothing OP about the ranger in any way or form.

@MZT

Perception is a very tricky thing I guess and what you or I see as hostile, disrespectful, or tactless can easily be very different. I won’t post names but there have been a few individuals who I personally think could have been much, much, more delicate in their presentation than they have been. Again, perception.

The main focus I want to highlight is that Jon in this situation has been extremely respectful and very earnest with the community. Remember admitting fault is extremely hard and rare for people to do. Regardless he has addressed a lot of issues in his posts here that have been burning Rangers for a year. Why are our pets in the shape they are? Long story short, they currently lack the resources to accomplish what they intended from the outset. From bandwidth limitations to processing limitations, right down the line to AI limitations due to scripting issues. He didn’t give us too much information as the company likes holding it’s cards close to its chest, but he explained why. I imagine they’ve tried work around and picture the reason for no near future fix is because they still need to establish if they CAN fix it, and if not, HOW to fix it. I guess I give them a bit more credit as I see all the places they have succeeded in establishing innovative mechanics, this one just ended up being more than they handle. They tried, and continued to try. Hopefully now the company can move forward now that they’ve essentially admitted defeat in this regard. I’m hopeful.

The other note is that Jon specifically said he didn’t have to change GS, he was asking the community IF, we thought that removing the “RNG Evade” for a dedicated evade would be more attractive. I personally don’t like it as I enjoy using the 3rd evade in succession with quickening zephyr for a more often and controllable evade, while others like the idea. If it gets “needed” we only have the community to thank. As it wasn’t on the chopping block until we put it there.

The key I’m getting at in the end is just this, would you phrase and state the same things the same way if you were talking face to face with the Jon in a closed office? If not, perhaps mind your phrasing (not you specifically) before posting.

Holland.9351:

I want to call some attention to Hide in Plain Sight while I can.

It gives 3 seconds of camouflage, which is like stealth that breaks if you move. 3 seconds is very short and you often break it instantly because you are moving.

Is there any chance to make this 3 seconds of stealth? This would allow some movement and it could combo with Remorseless, which resets Opening Strike. Currently Remorseless only works with Longbow Hunter’s Shot.

Otherwise, is it possible to make it like 10 seconds of camouflage? You can’t move after all.

A utility skill that provides long duration camouflage has been on my wish list since release. Are you willing to give Ranger more camouflage? Or otherwise, please make it stealth and let’s move on.

15 seconds of stealth or get out. It’s a master tier trait that you have to give up for it. Camouflage is a self-immobilize.

The current Hide in Plain Sight is complete garbage anywhere except maybe in PvE. And even there I don’t think it’s worth the master slot.

This skill needs a serious buff. I wouldn’t consider it useful as an adept trait, let alone a master one how it’s set up at present.

@Spectre.6821

Your ideas are rly not bad. But i can see some problems. Switching all “dps” traits into 2 trees will overload them. And buildvaritiy will be smaller then now.

And skirmishing would be…all the pet traits are rly strong there. Fortifying Bond in nature´s magic have to be baseline (but it would weaken nature´s magic).

For what martial mastery in skimishing? why? their is no reason 30% petcriticals and might for your pet is stronger. Spotter is strong. So 40 Points are fix (if u want to play meleeweapons).
From a view of bows…awesome. 30/25/015/0 will be a new meta. And meleeweapons (especially greatsword) are losing dmg/utility.
If Fortifying Bond would be baseline. Nature´s magic will get weak. So some utility+dps trait should stay there. If all dps brining is traitable in 2 traits.

U´ll have 2 or 3 builds. 30/30/…..for dmg. ….30/30…defensive, and something mixed. Is this your goal?
A lot ideas are great, but the traitswaps are not so easy to solve.

And in my opinion Beastmastery needs some love too.

And pls to all, stay at the 10th dez discussion. And Pets are not broken, they have problems and need AoE reduction in large scale WvsW and dungeons/PvE Champs. But they are not broken.

Even if they wouldn´t die in bigfights, rangers would be weaker. Why? Easy, 99% of all Pet attacks are singeltarget only. So even if they will stay alive (rangepets are doing this often) the rangers dmgoutput will be about 70 or 80% of other classes.
So deal with it. If u hate your pet´s the ranger is not the right for u. And this was clear before the game came out.
Improving skills build around the pet´s will help alot (like shouts). To ask for to get a buff without pet is like a thief would ask to use skills without initiave?

@ Spectre.
Totally spot on, I do agree with you on this. I know some have in the past and if I have missed some bad comments towards the dev team, then I have to admit lack of foresight here and apologize myself

As much as Developers have a very difficult job, the issues surrounding the unhealthy “lust” for warriors and guardians is basically the fuel to the fire with some people on the frustrations. There have been numerous buffs to these classes for over a year, buffs that already bolted more survivability and damage to what they had to make them pretty elite. I think maybe now if there an admittance to the failing, I agree its a start. But looking back on past decisions and paths, it’s very unlikely unless an Anet developer states so. A whole year has past, there were nerfs that really should never have happened and for all the while Ranger was being cut with a scalpel, other classes continued to get stronger.

Just yesterday in WvW , I fought a necro solo on my hybrid condition build. It was so close that I actually fell before him and knocked him down with a knocked down skill. The opposing player was good but as necros apply better conditions, I have to say my playstyle was much more advanced. You kinda have to be with the bad set up Anet have given us.
Anyways it was coming down to knock to knock, he eventually won… why??? The reason was my Pet. My pet was not crippled or immobilized but simply was far too slow to get to me and respond to the healing skill. He won by sucking the life pool out of me , very fast and furious. I was really annoyed because I felt my abilities as a player were being hindered by that pet. I also felt cheated because all the while some developer who has no idea on how the ranger state truly is more or less says " Its fine, its all in your head" to rangers. And because of this ( in my opinion) Mr Peters has no real right to state the ranger is good, not when players are losing because of a very broken pet Ai etc. And if he is admitting its broken, at least come back and say " Ok guys I heard you, not gonna say much but wait and see what I can do" would be far better than a proposal of nerfs.

Now safe to say there has been some admittance there are problems, what will be interesting is what stance they will take to this patch change. I honestly do hope that if Jon has not left , then please please, increase the condition and base damage to our class; to at least give the Anet team time to sort out what else needs sorted and give us viability in all areas of GW play . I for one don’t want to lose to necros etc because of my classes inadequate damage nor my broken pet. make it fair and make it enjoyable, this is why we chose to play in GW2. Do not let us down

Holland.9351:

kitten nic Touch.7960:

Wilderness 5 Natural Vigor. Reduced the increased endurance regeneration from 50% to 25%.

This really ruins it for me. Again a big nerf out of nowhere.

Let me add it to the list:
- endurance regen nerfed from 50% to 25%
- Healing Spring no longer gives vigor each tick and water field duration reduced
- shortbow nerfed from 1200 to 900 range
- damage skills from many pets reduced by 50%
- pet leash range reduced drastically
- “Search & Rescue” can’t revive dead players anymore
- quickness on pet swap moved from Minor Adept to Major Grandmaster (swapped with worthless trait)
- “Guard” no longer works up or down ledges
- “Signet of the Beastmaster” moved from Adept to Grandmaster.

I probably missed some.

Other unsesolved issues:
- Guard is a shout, but has a 1 second cast time
- Nearly all AoE attacks hit 3 targets instead of 5
- Require grandmaster traits to make signets, shouts, traps and spirits useful.
- Require grandmaster trait to have relatively useful condition removal.
- “Sic ’em” gets cancelled if the pet is told to activate another skill or told to change target.
- Signet of Renewal fails if pet is out of range.
- a healing skill (Healing Spring) is the only reliable on-demand condition removal rangers have.
- pets f2 often doesn’t activate or very late.
- sword auto-attack has too many leaps and makes the character feel out of control and prevents dodging.
- shortbow auto-attack bleed requires a flank.
- longbow Barrage too long cooldown.
- longbow requires to spend 50 trait points to get its basic traits (20% cooldown, piercing arrows, 1500 range)
- skirmishing has too many bad traits.

If these were fixed/changed we might actually be getting somewhere with this class.

I missed this post myself, and it’s full of our many problems.

cafard.8953:

Chokolata.1870:

I can get their thought process . In every SOTG we have players of other classes complaining about ranger builds , first it was the beastmaster now its the spiritmaster . Note that these players are tools to boot . Hence the predicament we are in

In another word: sPvP.

Basically. Jon really needs to realize that sPvP in this game will never be an eSport when the only mode is capture, which we already get out of WvW. Hell, WvW is closer to an eSport than sPvP ever will be. You can set up GvG type deals in WvW, you can have 1v1, you can have capture, you basically have deathmatches, etc. It makes you wonder…why aren’t they balancing around WvW instead?

mzt.3270:

Imaginos.3756:

Sina.9208:

Imaginos.3756:

Sina.9208:

The build I use doesn’t have Natural Vigor in it. It took me a while to get used to it, but we have sooo many dodge skills on weapons it’s crazy.

Longbow has no dodge/evade.
Main Axe has no dodge/evade.
Offhand Axe doesn’t have one either
Offhand Torch also doesn’t have one.
Offhand Warhorn also doesn’t have a dodge/evade.

Only 4 of our weapons have a dodge/evade. Greatsword, Sword, Dagger and Shortbow.

Kain Francois.4328:

The GS Traits in Nature Magic should be moved to Skirmishing, since it focuses on dealing damage anyways.

Or in to Wilderness Survival where the other greatsword trait is.

Our traits are a mess and all over the place. They need compression and a few to be moved into more logical spots.

If you are using longbow you need to dodge a LOT less than a melee player & the stealth is also able to help you in pve too. (not that LB is a real option in organized pve) Main hand axe is just really bad atm& if you still wanted to play it you could combine it with an offhand dagger for the extra dodge.

If you play the meta build with sword mainhand & shortbow as a safety “getoutofmelee” weapon (in pve) you will have a LOT of dodges & having endurance regen as well is nothing short of OP.

I understand that the ranger has lots of problems, but endurance is not one of them & it won’t be either after dec 10., this is a nerf that is perfectly logical.

No it’s not logical at all. Stop being an Anet apologist. Logical would be to turn this trait into the very same 5pt trait that other classes get on crit or turning their trait into the same version we get.

Either way it’s irrelevant because Peters isn’t going to come back here and say anything. They’ll do exactly what they planned to do and we’ll get to suffer from it on top of all the other broken crap with our class that they won’t fix. Real great “balance” there Anet.

Agreed, this is not logical and you are right to state this was an Anet apologist.
The very statement " you will have a LOT of dodges & having endurance regen as well is nothing short of OP " is a pile of codswallop. The rooted 1hand sword is the most useless weapon in GW for ranger, not only for its poor damage but it roots you on the floor, that the only option you have for an evade is that one dagger skill on a cooldown. It is like sticking your feet in superglue, tying a firecracker to your shoes and trying to light with a damp match, hoping for a lucky strike to get you free whilst smacking a very angry Komodo dragon with a wet noodle. As for OP, I think you confused GW2 ranger in another game, there ain’t nothing OP about the ranger in any way or form.

I meant OP only for the endruance regen / amount of dodges on weapons. Yes the MH sword is broken, but more endurance regen wouldn’t help that now would it.

Sina.9208:

mzt.3270:

Imaginos.3756:

Sina.9208:

Imaginos.3756:

Sina.9208:

The build I use doesn’t have Natural Vigor in it. It took me a while to get used to it, but we have sooo many dodge skills on weapons it’s crazy.

Longbow has no dodge/evade.
Main Axe has no dodge/evade.
Offhand Axe doesn’t have one either
Offhand Torch also doesn’t have one.
Offhand Warhorn also doesn’t have a dodge/evade.

Only 4 of our weapons have a dodge/evade. Greatsword, Sword, Dagger and Shortbow.

Kain Francois.4328:

The GS Traits in Nature Magic should be moved to Skirmishing, since it focuses on dealing damage anyways.

Or in to Wilderness Survival where the other greatsword trait is.

Our traits are a mess and all over the place. They need compression and a few to be moved into more logical spots.

If you are using longbow you need to dodge a LOT less than a melee player & the stealth is also able to help you in pve too. (not that LB is a real option in organized pve) Main hand axe is just really bad atm& if you still wanted to play it you could combine it with an offhand dagger for the extra dodge.

If you play the meta build with sword mainhand & shortbow as a safety “getoutofmelee” weapon (in pve) you will have a LOT of dodges & having endurance regen as well is nothing short of OP.

I understand that the ranger has lots of problems, but endurance is not one of them & it won’t be either after dec 10., this is a nerf that is perfectly logical.

No it’s not logical at all. Stop being an Anet apologist. Logical would be to turn this trait into the very same 5pt trait that other classes get on crit or turning their trait into the same version we get.

Either way it’s irrelevant because Peters isn’t going to come back here and say anything. They’ll do exactly what they planned to do and we’ll get to suffer from it on top of all the other broken crap with our class that they won’t fix. Real great “balance” there Anet.

Agreed, this is not logical and you are right to state this was an Anet apologist.
The very statement " you will have a LOT of dodges & having endurance regen as well is nothing short of OP " is a pile of codswallop. The rooted 1hand sword is the most useless weapon in GW for ranger, not only for its poor damage but it roots you on the floor, that the only option you have for an evade is that one dagger skill on a cooldown. It is like sticking your feet in superglue, tying a firecracker to your shoes and trying to light with a damp match, hoping for a lucky strike to get you free whilst smacking a very angry Komodo dragon with a wet noodle. As for OP, I think you confused GW2 ranger in another game, there ain’t nothing OP about the ranger in any way or form.

I meant OP only for the endruance regen / amount of dodges on weapons. Yes the MH sword is broken, but more endurance regen wouldn’t help that now would it.

No… a but a lot more damage and the weapon performance would help ,which is something we should be pushing for . Stating something is “OP” when its really not , taking into consideration the bad offence to defense balance, is pretty much stating it needs nerfed rather to what we need raised right now. It is only OP if the offense to defense is balanced and it is far from that ATM.

I’m new to MMOs and GW2 (only been playing for a little over 2 months) and I was never big into video games to begin with. I chose to be a Ranger, because after reading what all the classes do, it was the one that really appealed to me. I love this game. I’ve had a fantastic time learning as I go, exploring, and I’ve been lucky enough to make some friends who know the game and have helped me out with armor, builds, trait suggestions, you name it.

Whenever I was asked what I wanted from a build, my answer was always the same; “I want to survive the fight”. I thought I was downed or died too often, whether it was WvW or PvE. I got better armor, weapons, sigils, the whole nine yards and I was still dying. I was dodging to the best of my abilities, moving in circles, back and forth, and I was still dying. Keep in mind that until I started playing GW2, WASD were just letters on the keyboard to me. I have improved greatly, but I will never be on par with a lot of the players in this game.

I got tired of being killed, hunted down and jumped by groups in WvW. I now play PvE exclusively. I still feel I die too much, but at least I no longer have to suffer being laughed at or my corpse danced on in victory. (not everyone did this, but it was embarrasing for me to watch)

Like I said, new to all this and when one of my friends explained to me what the regen reduction would do in terms of survivability (for myself) my first thought was “I’m dead in the water”.

I can deal with my pet (weird as it is at times), the weapons I can deal with too as I wasn’t around when the other changes to them took place. I play B/B only after having tried other combinations. I can even deal with being slightly “squishy” in terms of armor. (love my pimp coat and hat)

But having my ability to get out of the line of fire cut in half? Come December 10th, I’ll be spending most of my time wandering around solo and avoiding group events. And ultimately having much less fun. I want to be able to help others in a fight, not become another corpse on the battlefield.

Shrimpkin.4851:

I’m new to MMOs and GW2 (only been playing for a little over 2 months) and I was never big into video games to begin with. I chose to be a Ranger, because after reading what all the classes do, it was the one that really appealed to me. I love this game. I’ve had a fantastic time learning as I go, exploring, and I’ve been lucky enough to make some friends who know the game and have helped me out with armor, builds, trait suggestions, you name it.

Whenever I was asked what I wanted from a build, my answer was always the same; “I want to survive the fight”. I thought I was downed or died too often, whether it was WvW or PvE. I got better armor, weapons, sigils, the whole nine yards and I was still dying. I was dodging to the best of my abilities, moving in circles, back and forth, and I was still dying. Keep in mind that until I started playing GW2, WASD were just letters on the keyboard to me. I have improved greatly, but I will never be on par with a lot of the players in this game.

I got tired of being killed, hunted down and jumped by groups in WvW. I now play PvE exclusively. I still feel I die too much, but at least I no longer have to suffer being laughed at or my corpse danced on in victory. (not everyone did this, but it was embarrasing for me to watch)

Like I said, new to all this and when one of my friends explained to me what the regen reduction would do in terms of survivability (for myself) my first thought was “I’m dead in the water”.

I can deal with my pet (weird as it is at times), the weapons I can deal with too as I wasn’t around when the other changes to them took place. I play B/B only after having tried other combinations. I can even deal with being slightly “squishy” in terms of armor. (love my pimp coat and hat)

But having my ability to get out of the line of fire cut in half? Come December 10th, I’ll be spending most of my time wandering around solo and avoiding group events. And ultimately having much less fun. I want to be able to help others in a fight, not become another corpse on the battlefield.

If they’re dancing on your corpse, you probably sufficiently rustled their jimmies to warrant the response. Well done!

It’s not going to be the biggest hit in the world. If you’re exclusively PvE, even less so.

Come the patch supplement the trait with stamina food and you’ll be at where we are today, if not a little over.

You’ll otherwise benefit from everything else which will be a buff. If you’re rocking a survivalist/bunker set up, Bark Skin will be right up your ally.

mzt.3270:

Sina.9208:

mzt.3270:

Imaginos.3756:

Sina.9208:

Imaginos.3756:

Sina.9208:

The build I use doesn’t have Natural Vigor in it. It took me a while to get used to it, but we have sooo many dodge skills on weapons it’s crazy.

Longbow has no dodge/evade.
Main Axe has no dodge/evade.
Offhand Axe doesn’t have one either
Offhand Torch also doesn’t have one.
Offhand Warhorn also doesn’t have a dodge/evade.

Only 4 of our weapons have a dodge/evade. Greatsword, Sword, Dagger and Shortbow.

Kain Francois.4328:

The GS Traits in Nature Magic should be moved to Skirmishing, since it focuses on dealing damage anyways.

Or in to Wilderness Survival where the other greatsword trait is.

Our traits are a mess and all over the place. They need compression and a few to be moved into more logical spots.

If you are using longbow you need to dodge a LOT less than a melee player & the stealth is also able to help you in pve too. (not that LB is a real option in organized pve) Main hand axe is just really bad atm& if you still wanted to play it you could combine it with an offhand dagger for the extra dodge.

If you play the meta build with sword mainhand & shortbow as a safety “getoutofmelee” weapon (in pve) you will have a LOT of dodges & having endurance regen as well is nothing short of OP.

I understand that the ranger has lots of problems, but endurance is not one of them & it won’t be either after dec 10., this is a nerf that is perfectly logical.

No it’s not logical at all. Stop being an Anet apologist. Logical would be to turn this trait into the very same 5pt trait that other classes get on crit or turning their trait into the same version we get.

Either way it’s irrelevant because Peters isn’t going to come back here and say anything. They’ll do exactly what they planned to do and we’ll get to suffer from it on top of all the other broken crap with our class that they won’t fix. Real great “balance” there Anet.

Agreed, this is not logical and you are right to state this was an Anet apologist.
The very statement " you will have a LOT of dodges & having endurance regen as well is nothing short of OP " is a pile of codswallop. The rooted 1hand sword is the most useless weapon in GW for ranger, not only for its poor damage but it roots you on the floor, that the only option you have for an evade is that one dagger skill on a cooldown. It is like sticking your feet in superglue, tying a firecracker to your shoes and trying to light with a damp match, hoping for a lucky strike to get you free whilst smacking a very angry Komodo dragon with a wet noodle. As for OP, I think you confused GW2 ranger in another game, there ain’t nothing OP about the ranger in any way or form.

I meant OP only for the endruance regen / amount of dodges on weapons. Yes the MH sword is broken, but more endurance regen wouldn’t help that now would it.

No… a but a lot more damage and the weapon performance would help ,which is something we should be pushing for . Stating something is “OP” when its really not , taking into consideration the bad offence to defense balance, is pretty much stating it needs nerfed rather to what we need raised right now. It is only OP if the offense to defense is balanced and it is far from that ATM.

You have a point, my comment was poorly phrased.

Chokolata.1870:

I also find it kind of funny that they are using the too much endurance from traits bit * when warriors can get so much more sustain from just healing signet and a 15 point trait . This is on the level of 600 hp/sec without any healing power gear . Obscene . Hypocrits

Ranger’s just aren’t allowed to have anything that make’s people go “Wow, that’s really useful/good!”

I mean, we used to back when Panthers we worth a kitten , Sb was a sinew powered minigun, and pets could climb wvw walls but we all know how that stuff turned out.

Agility Training: Pets move faster.

Change to:
Agility Training: Pets move faster. Melee pets teleport behind your target (10 sec cd)

Jow.4385:

Agility Training: Pets move faster.

Change to:
Agility Training: Pets move faster. Melee pets teleport behind your target (10 sec cd)

40% speed instead of 30% would be great too.
30% is less than Swiftness buff and 40% is the same as Sic ’em utility.

we still need some traits merged it seems marks VIII and X would do a lot better if merged as well as Marks IV and IX as many other classes already have similar traits that have both effects… or they could have their traits split that would balance the game too :P… the IV and IX necromancer and thief have similar traits that have the combined effect of both. I don’t pay enough attention of other classes to see if there is more examples.

Holland.9351:

Jow.4385:

Agility Training: Pets move faster.

Change to:
Agility Training: Pets move faster. Melee pets teleport behind your target (10 sec cd)

40% speed instead of 30% would be great too.
30% is less than Swiftness buff and 40% is the same as Sic ’em utility.

It’s also only 5% more than SoH which so many already use anyway.

50% would be much better and hardly game breaking since they reduced leash range by so much.

kitten nic Touch.7960:

Holland.9351:

kitten nic Touch.7960:

Wilderness 5 Natural Vigor. Reduced the increased endurance regeneration from 50% to 25%.

This really ruins it for me. Again a big nerf out of nowhere.

Let me add it to the list:
- endurance regen nerfed from 50% to 25%
- Healing Spring no longer gives vigor each tick and water field duration reduced
- shortbow nerfed from 1200 to 900 range
- damage skills from many pets reduced by 50%
- pet leash range reduced drastically
- “Search & Rescue” can’t revive dead players anymore
- quickness on pet swap moved from Minor Adept to Major Grandmaster (swapped with worthless trait)
- “Guard” no longer works up or down ledges
- “Signet of the Beastmaster” moved from Adept to Grandmaster.

I probably missed some.

Other unsesolved issues:
- Guard is a shout, but has a 1 second cast time
- Nearly all AoE attacks hit 3 targets instead of 5
- Require grandmaster traits to make signets, shouts, traps and spirits useful.
- Require grandmaster trait to have relatively useful condition removal.
- “Sic ’em” gets cancelled if the pet is told to activate another skill or told to change target.
- Signet of Renewal fails if pet is out of range.
- a healing skill (Healing Spring) is the only reliable on-demand condition removal rangers have.
- pets f2 often doesn’t activate or very late.
- sword auto-attack has too many leaps and makes the character feel out of control and prevents dodging.
- shortbow auto-attack bleed requires a flank.
- longbow Barrage too long cooldown.
- longbow requires to spend 50 trait points to get its basic traits (20% cooldown, piercing arrows, 1500 range)
- skirmishing has too many bad traits.

If these were fixed/changed we might actually be getting somewhere with this class.

I missed this post… looking at all of these ridiculous nerfs in one spot really illustrates the disconnect between players and developers. It’s kind of sad to see such drastic changes to a class that’s always under performed compared to other classes. I cannot even begin to grasp their thought process with some of these changes.

You pretty much nailed it. But I do not expect them to address any of this.

I agree with everything you said, you did miss 1 nerf however.. the one that bothered me the most.

They cut barrage damage in half (or possibly more) from what it used to be. For me, it went from doing 1800-2600 damage per hit down to 800-1300. To get those damage numbers, one has to be in full berserker gear which obviously is a disadvantage in itself. This is why I felt the nerf was completely unnecessary, as I’m basically rooting myself for this attack with the possibility of getting killed in 1-3 hits.

>“One idea we talked about for Greatsword would be to take the evade off of the 3rd attack of the auto-chain and put it on swoop. This would give you a second on-demand defensive skill and instead we put something less timing based (for example a whirl finisher) on that third attack to empower it.”

I believe taking the evade off GS1 chain will generally lower the effective survivability in the weapon, you’re getting some crazy amounts of evade uptime if i understand correctly: 1s evade/2.56s of gs1 chain. that’s like 40% uptime.
to generate an equivalent exchange to swoop it’d need something like 4 or 5 s of evade which would be at odds with the animation.

if you have to move it, i’d suggest putting it on the counterstrike. let it protect the counter attack which often gets me killed when i get pounded by multiple melee attacks. to keep things close i’d swap counterstrike with maul and boost maul’s damage in step with its new 15s recharge.

counterstrike block would drop to something like 1.5s. makes it less useful as a missile shield, but with the new low recharge it’d offer an interesting interplay, you’d pop in and out of it trying to bait strikes to counter which would either trigger automatic stabilities or blocks (aegis) or actually knock opponents down setting up maul or hilt bash.
the problem then would seem to be the auto attack chain which looks a little uninspiring, boosting the damage or adding additional effects might solve that. (move the vuln from maul here?)

overall effect i’d guess would be weaker, but still strong defense. but slightly stronger attack. you pick up more blocks with safe counter attacks (probably wasted in 1v1, but immeasurably better in 1vX) a more bursty maul and some modification on the GS1 chain. in exchange you lose a bunch of evade uptime (much of it wasted) and concentrate maul effect into a single longer cooldown (which would still be easy to read and avoid).

this breaks from your concept of 2 on demand defense, but improves the existing while also giving slightly better access to it.

on a strategic level i’d guess the faster availability of the block might add a bit of a guessing game.

another thought, to improve the hit rate on maul, would it be possible to add a 1/4 s cripple/snare at the beginning of the cast? thoughts on effect?

DeadlySynz.3471

“They cut barrage damage in half (or possibly more) from what it used to be. For me, it went from doing 1800-2600 damage per hit down to 800-1300. To get those damage numbers, one has to be in full berserker gear which obviously is a disadvantage in itself. This is why I felt the nerf was completely unnecessary, as I’m basically rooting myself for this attack with the possibility of getting killed in 1-3 hits.”

Yes barrage got a massive nerf the last so called “patch”.

It used to do really good damage, and hit a large number of mobs, but now it’s pathetic.

During an invasion if I use it on lets say 50 mobs all crowded together, I’m lucky if I hit 3 of them.

What would the impact be if the Moment of Clarity trait replaced the attack of opportunity buff with “on interrupt, reset weapon swap cooldown”?

I have seen a number of posts in this thread regarding server issues creating the problem with pet skill delays. I can’t help but wonder, why is the ranger pet like any other beast in the game to begin with? It is a player-controlled object and should have a completely different AI from any other beast in the game because of that.

Why is the F2 ability in any way using the pet’s AI? There is absolutely no reason for any F2 ability to have an animation generated by the pet’s object if that is the reason for the delays.

Make the ranger’s F2 ability a skill that the RANGER casts, not the pet.

Here’s an example: let’s take a look at the wolf. The wolf’s F2 ability is, like other canines, a howl. The wolf may or may not decide to actually respond at all but if it does follow your command it will stand still and begin a lengthy cast time. The cast time of the canine howls is so long that an enemy player can literally walk out of their range before it lands.

In the example of the wolf, lets look at how making the ranger cast the ability in the game mechanics can change this:

When the ranger presses F2, an effect is generated by the ranger instead of the pet that is instant cast area fear on the pet’s current location. To make the effects look as if the pet cast the skill (even though the ranger generates the effect, NOT THE PET) create a separate animation independent of the pet that looks like the particle effects for other shout-like abilities on the pet’s current location. If you can make an animation for the pet gaining regeneration, you can make an animation for the pet gaining a "howl aura" too.

Essentially, what I’m saying is to make the wolf’s F2 behave exactly like warrior’s Fear Me shout in its activation, but to center the location of the fear on the pet instead of the player.

Also, it would be silly if the pet shouted "FEAR ME!"

Edit: I should note that this is more of a band-aid than a permanent solution because pets need to actually hit their targets instead of running around randomly when they get close. In the end, the pet AI is the root of the problem BUT making the AI better later will not break this proposed solution since the F2 would be independent of the pet AI.

1. About the traits and pets. When it comes to traits that affects the pet, it seems like they are spread over all sort of trait lines… This creates confusion and makes traiting u’r pet hard.
It would be nice if pets had either their own traitline or were collected under “beastmastey”.

2. Pets attackspeed. Make the autoattack have the same speed as the ranger’s autoattack. Not attack, pause, attack…

3. Animals turning. When animals turn into a different direction it looks incredibly ugly… “Blip” – turned… Whatabout creating turning animations. It would make things look SO alive! Espacially large creatures such as whales drakes and similar things (both NPC creatures and pets).

Maybe not the things that will be touched in this patch. But stilll… Thanks for Reading!

This, as a reminder we’ve been allready told we gonna have nice changes and see what happened? Nothing, we got even more worse.

And this video was posted on the 16 november 2012 ! After the ébig changes for ranger" we never had…

So you can still listen to promise of Jon, personnaly i’m rerolling engineer who are closer of what i’m thinking about a ranged class…and without a kitten worthless pet to worry about…

Oh and btw, if you want to see a real ranger class and how it should be worked on, i suggest you to test the next module on neverwinter…the archer/ranger is awesome on it…

hmm, i like this changes, but the pet problem really makes me sad… a good change will be ranger get extra stats bonus for the pet he is using, for example:

eagle: 180 precision, 10% critical
canine: 180 healing, 10% boon duration

Gorwald.6170:

Oh and btw, if you want to see a real ranger class and how it should be worked on, i suggest you to test the next module on neverwinter…the archer/ranger is awesome on it…

Archer is very different from ranger you know…
Ranger means more synergy with nature than bow-master…

Yeah… When search&rescue lost it’s ability to res defeated players I started disliking my pets because it made up for many of the short comings. It only snowballed from there. Before that nerf people wanted me to bring my Ranger because that one utility was incredibly useful to my guild. I think it was within two weeks of that nerf patch that I started my Warrior to run dungeons with.

As far as that GS thing goes, it doesn’t need vigor or any other crap, what it needs is the damage buff. 90% of the rangers I know aren’t going to use the GS for anything other than getting from one place to another (champ trains for example). All but one Ranger I know runs sword+horn or sword+dagger/SB or LB and that’s because he refuses to do anything other than Beastmaster Archer as he said, “Why would I roll a ranger if I wasn’t going to use bows?” If the Devs want me or anyone I know who plays a Ranger to use a GS you guys better bring the damage up to par with the Sword or else no. This game is about doing as much damage as possible as fast as possible and mitgating damage through dodging, that’s why Zerker Power builds are so popular. And no, after the 10th time of running the same content I’m playing it solely for the rewards, as it is no longer going to hold any replay value beyond that. If you think it does you are obviously a glutton for punishment.

Disclaimer: I only play PVE and dungeons and the people I play with are 90-99% PVE/Dungeons.