Guild Wars 2

Now here is the thing that has been bugging me. People who test damage on dummies and calculate the DPS output of the class and compare it against another class. This is not actually accurate and the result will not actually show you the DPS of te class in a “Live” situation

One thing you have to consider is that warriors or thieves are melee classes. This means that they will spend quite a bit of their time dodging and rolling and moving weaving their way in and out of AoE’s. This reduces the amount of actual DPS. The tests people do are mainly against unmoving targets that do not hit back. It is possible to get extremely high numbers if you stand and attack something for 30 seconds however, it is a very rare occassion where you will be able to do such thing in the actual game itself.

The Ranger is equipped with very good ranged weapons. This allows them to maintain max and still keep the damage flowing. Using a LB with extended range, the ranger is completely clear from the combat area. The damage that is done from rangers is a constant that does not stop. Both bows allow for good consistent damage at any range.

I’ve been running dungeons constantly with the Ranger and have found this class to be amazingly versatile and by simply switching utilities for the right encounter (am I going to be a turret or do I need to kite) The speed does not decrease.

Even in WvW I don’t know why people QQ about the Ranger. Even against thieves we have utilities that allow us to have the advantage (protect me and SoS means thier bursts do no damage to you) The only down side I see is people speccing as a glass cannon then moan when they die so easily.

For those who do not believe, I will do a video soon. I am relatively new to the Ranger class and Im not that great a player either, but if someone like me can do it…. anyoe can. It’s not all about damage.

I run a condition ranger build and I love it

Of course there are people who would rather see huge numbers than multiple smaller numbers and that’s fine but there are also perfectionist who complain about any detail they see unfit

IMO it’s hard for rangers to run away from huge zergs as we really have no escaping skills

I love my ranger and pets because they couple quite well with my build and the traps I use compliment my pets (also it’s almost impossible to lose a 1v1 fight when you’re both downed, the pet heal is kinda OP lol)

The thing is, many melee classes can engage close combat with rangers very easily (leaps, blinks and pulls). That is when ranger starts dodging and melee classes can just swing their weapons. Also don’t forget CC.

Talking about DPS.. I really hate it that we don’t see the damage output of our pet in the combatlog.

KensaiZen.3740:

One thing you have to consider is that warriors or thieves are melee classes. This means that they will spend quite a bit of their time dodging and rolling and moving weaving their way in and out of AoE’s. This reduces the amount of actual DPS.

There is no such thing as a melee class in gw2. Everyone has ranged and melee options, ranger included, only that in our case melee damage is lower or on par with ranged damage, while other classes usually do more ar melee range, for the reasons you explained. A SB thief can spam AoE blast finishers nonstop, a LB war has blast, fire, cripple and bleed, an untraited rifle war has the same damage output of a traited LB ranger, arguably even more if running a ranged setup (but why should he?)

The Ranger is equipped with very good ranged weapons. This allows them to maintain max and still keep the damage flowing. Using a LB with extended range, the ranger is completely clear from the combat area. The damage that is done from rangers is a constant that does not stop. Both bows allow for good consistent damage at any range.

That playstyle is what makes other classes discriminate rangers, and generally have the idea of “all rangers are nubs”. Staying at max ranger with longbow is NOT what any half competent ranger should do, unless very specific situations (where everyone goes ranged ). At that range you can’t support your team, can’t use healing spring/warhorn to help your melee guys, can’t rez, and everytime you have to switch pet you lose a good chuck of dps due to him having to run for 1500 before doing damage again (or you use a ranged pet, lessen the problem but get half the pet dps you would get with melee’s)

I’ve been running dungeons constantly with the Ranger and have found this class to be amazingly versatile and by simply switching utilities for the right encounter (am I going to be a turret or do I need to kite) The speed does not decrease.

You have many different options, true, but none of those compare to the utility and flexibility of other classes, that don’t even have to sacrifice damage to achieve. I REALLY suggest you to make a guardian (or any other class, except maybe engineer), like i did, helps alot to see things in perspective.

I won’t talk about wvw because i lack experience with the ranger there, stopped using him after i realized what could my guardian or AoE stunlock war do instead. But LB 1500 range with piercing is supposedly good there (well, was before quickness nerf, not sure now)

KensaiZen.3740:

Now here is the thing that has been bugging me. People who test damage on dummies and calculate the DPS output of the class and compare it against another class. This is not actually accurate and the result will not actually show you the DPS of te class in a “Live” situation

One thing you have to consider is that warriors or thieves are melee classes. This means that they will spend quite a bit of their time dodging and rolling and moving weaving their way in and out of AoE’s. This reduces the amount of actual DPS. The tests people do are mainly against unmoving targets that do not hit back. It is possible to get extremely high numbers if you stand and attack something for 30 seconds however, it is a very rare occassion where you will be able to do such thing in the actual game itself.

The Ranger is equipped with very good ranged weapons. This allows them to maintain max and still keep the damage flowing. Using a LB with extended range, the ranger is completely clear from the combat area. The damage that is done from rangers is a constant that does not stop. Both bows allow for good consistent damage at any range.

I’ve been running dungeons constantly with the Ranger and have found this class to be amazingly versatile and by simply switching utilities for the right encounter (am I going to be a turret or do I need to kite) The speed does not decrease.

Even in WvW I don’t know why people QQ about the Ranger. Even against thieves we have utilities that allow us to have the advantage (protect me and SoS means thier bursts do no damage to you) The only down side I see is people speccing as a glass cannon then moan when they die so easily.

For those who do not believe, I will do a video soon. I am relatively new to the Ranger class and Im not that great a player either, but if someone like me can do it…. anyoe can. It’s not all about damage.

what bugs me is when players have very little experience with a profession and understanding of the meta make a thread claiming to know more than experienced players who have invested a lot of time playing and analyzing profession capabilities and mechanics.

sure rangers can perform well under certain circumstances, but so can any profession, if not better. all professions need work but there are other professions who will outperform rangers when manned by players of equal skill level. also, your videos will prove nothing except that you are capable of ranging things in dungeons when you don’t have aggro and are beating up noobie quality players in wvw.

I’ve mained as a Guardian since launch. I know what it feels like to be pretty OP.

The Rangers damage is comparable to the Guardians damage. A normal attack is around the 700-800 (1st trait line maxed) crits for about 1300-1400 (berserker earrings and amulet and knights rings)

This is comparable to the Guardian with full berserkers accessories. And as we all know, Guardians may not hit as had as warriors, but they have no trouble killing any other classes.

Now some may say “well its because they have high toughness and armour value”. Well, the figures I used just now f the Ranger was from also having 30 in wilderness survival bringing the rangers toughness to a nice 1600 (with the right runes and knights armour) enough staying power to survive bursts from even a Thief.

Now this s the other thing to factor in. Pet damage. Wit only 5 points in BM the jaguar is still capable of hitting over 2000 damage per crit. Birds can still do their 4000 burst F2 skill. So before we factor in the damage of the pets we can see that the damage i already comparable to a class that is considered one of the strongest in the game. Sure its not as high as the thief or warrior, but does it need to be? no.

As for supporting your team at 1500? its called pet management. Pets have AoE support skills that can be used to help support your team. Who says the Ranger was only limited to healing spring to help support the team? You can maintain a good amount of regen if you use 2 pets that have them. The uptime on the regen is pretty good overall. The other aspect of staying at max range is that you do not tke any damage or agro. This allows you to use healing skills like heal as one or troll ungent purely for your pets survival. By keeping your pet alive longer it allows it to deal more dmg thus increasing your overall DPS.

“Staying at max ranger with longbow is NOT what any half competent ranger should do, unless very specific situations”

There is a reason why the weapon is designed to penalise you if you go in too close. It is so obvious that its painful to see people who suck at using a LB and complain that the weapon is broken. For 600-1200 range skirmishes there is the shortbow which is perfectly designed for closer encounters and suffers no penalty. Notice why most people feel that the SB is a far more practical weapon in WvW? it is because it has a massively lower learning curve.

Rangers like in GW1 are for controlling the flow of battle. They are the masters of conditions and crowd control. It is a class that requires a lot of deep thinking in strategy and placements. You have think of a good firing position, a good place to plant traps, a secure place to set spirits. Do you see the trend? Rangers can still play “shut out” like they did in GW1 though I do have to admit it is a bit harder in GW2 but it can be done.

Oh and here is another thing I noticed. The rangers absolutely rubbish condition removals and counter CC skills. Yes, I know this is the case. But I also notice that the rune of the nature goddess helps to reduce condition duration and stun duration. I am used to running full Melandru set with lemongrass poultry soup for -65% condition duration. You simply do not worry about being CC’ed.

Current set up being tested in WvW 30/0/30/5/5. Knights melandru armour. LB/GS. Jaguar/Wolf.

KensaiZen.3740:

The Rangers damage is comparable to the Guardians damage. A normal attack is around the 700-800 (1st trait line maxed) crits for about 1300-1400 (berserker earrings and amulet and knights rings)

This is comparable to the Guardian with full berserkers accessories. And as we all know, Guardians may not hit as had as warriors, but they have no trouble killing any other classes.

Guardians (In mostly Zerker gear) hit for much more than that. Sword (One hander) auto attack crits for 2k on the normal swings and 3x 1k on the finisher.

~6-7k on the short channel attack.

The rest of your post is nonsense, but yeah, if you want to cheerleader a broken class go for it.

those who do not play WvW a lot, or does not do WvW at all will never see the real shortcomings of this class, so you should just shut up and read quietly.

Those who do WvW and complain got the right to do so.

Those who do WvW, in GC builds dependent on QZ should just shut up and read quietly.

Those who Q_Q about QZ for the sake of Q_Q’ing doesnt even know what their on about.

Those who Q_Q about rangers in melee fights should go buy a greatsword and some proper armor (not glass cannon)

Those who think zerker warrior/guardian/elementalist/thief DPS matters in a real open world 1v1 setting are lacking skills.

There, find the flaw in my arguments and deal with it.

Just to be clear, your entire post is saying that everyone should shut up and that everyone is wrong.

Did you plan to actually contribute something?

If everyone is wrong, how are you different? Do you have suggestions or just criticisms?

OP you make a notable effort, but ranger’s are hardly godly. While I don’t subscribe to the QQ that so many others do with regards to rangers, I also do not consider them to be a premiere dps class. Too much of the ranger’s damage is tied to their pet, so when a pet can’t be used your damage will be some of the lowest in the game.

Ranger’s are great at roaming and dueling but this isn’t because of their high dps.

KensaiZen.3740:

You can maintain a good amount of regen if you use 2 pets that have them.

Ranger pets on land with Regen for group:
(1) Fern Hound
(2) N/A

Do please explain what you’re talking about here. I’d love to know what “2 pets that use them” (regen) you’re talking about.

Yes I like using longbow with the range trait in WvW. It’s great to use while being part of a zerg or while standing on a wall.

I think pets are meant to take 40-50% of our dps, simply to reduce our potential damage at range in WvW. If we did 100% damage with the longbow, we might simply be too powerful. Hitting like a truck from 1500 range while safely hiding behind a wall of team-members. We have great survivability while being part of a zerg.

However, it’s really bad in situations where you’re alone in WvW, but that’s where the pet is supposed to come into play and be less worthless.

So, we have pets to reduce our potential ranged damage in WvW. If this is not by design, then it needs a fix. Otherwise, it’s simply working as intended. If you’re not using a traited longbow in WvW, then you need to use your pet.

And this is where the complaints come from. Because the pet isn’t useful enough to take 40-50% of our dps. It all boils down to it being a computer controlled entity with slow attack animations that roots them into place and bad pathing and it can be easily avoided along with most of the open world PvE content. In order for pets to live up to their 40-50% damage potential, they need to be significantly better than their PvE versions.

Swagger.1459:

KensaiZen.3740:

Now here is the thing that has been bugging me. People who test damage on dummies and calculate the DPS output of the class and compare it against another class. This is not actually accurate and the result will not actually show you the DPS of te class in a “Live” situation

One thing you have to consider is that warriors or thieves are melee classes. This means that they will spend quite a bit of their time dodging and rolling and moving weaving their way in and out of AoE’s. This reduces the amount of actual DPS. The tests people do are mainly against unmoving targets that do not hit back. It is possible to get extremely high numbers if you stand and attack something for 30 seconds however, it is a very rare occassion where you will be able to do such thing in the actual game itself.

The Ranger is equipped with very good ranged weapons. This allows them to maintain max and still keep the damage flowing. Using a LB with extended range, the ranger is completely clear from the combat area. The damage that is done from rangers is a constant that does not stop. Both bows allow for good consistent damage at any range.

I’ve been running dungeons constantly with the Ranger and have found this class to be amazingly versatile and by simply switching utilities for the right encounter (am I going to be a turret or do I need to kite) The speed does not decrease.

Even in WvW I don’t know why people QQ about the Ranger. Even against thieves we have utilities that allow us to have the advantage (protect me and SoS means thier bursts do no damage to you) The only down side I see is people speccing as a glass cannon then moan when they die so easily.

For those who do not believe, I will do a video soon. I am relatively new to the Ranger class and Im not that great a player either, but if someone like me can do it…. anyoe can. It’s not all about damage.

what bugs me is when players have very little experience with a profession and understanding of the meta make a thread claiming to know more than experienced players who have invested a lot of time playing and analyzing profession capabilities and mechanics.

sure rangers can perform well under certain circumstances, but so can any profession, if not better. all professions need work but there are other professions who will outperform rangers when manned by players of equal skill level. also, your videos will prove nothing except that you are capable of ranging things in dungeons when you don’t have aggro and are beating up noobie quality players in wvw.

If this is the case then rangers would not be considered the best duelist in the game. It’s definitely not the class that’s unplayable. I strongly believe its just people trying to do something with it that its not designed for.

Sebrent.3625:

KensaiZen.3740:

You can maintain a good amount of regen if you use 2 pets that have them.

Ranger pets on land with Regen for group:
(1) Fern Hound
(2) N/A

Do please explain what you’re talking about here. I’d love to know what “2 pets that use them” (regen) you’re talking about.

Oh my bad, not 2 pets with regen. Just 1 regen and one outright AoE heal. So thats one regen and a little burst healing. I never claim to be a master at the class and know everything. But like I said. If a noob Ranger like me can do it, whats stopping you pros?

Neb.4170:

KensaiZen.3740:

The Rangers damage is comparable to the Guardians damage. A normal attack is around the 700-800 (1st trait line maxed) crits for about 1300-1400 (berserker earrings and amulet and knights rings)

This is comparable to the Guardian with full berserkers accessories. And as we all know, Guardians may not hit as had as warriors, but they have no trouble killing any other classes.

Guardians (In mostly Zerker gear) hit for much more than that. Sword (One hander) auto attack crits for 2k on the normal swings and 3x 1k on the finisher.

~6-7k on the short channel attack.

The rest of your post is nonsense, but yeah, if you want to cheerleader a broken class go for it.

Your comparing a glass cannon 1h sword Guardian to a non glass cannon Ranger. well done.

LB2 hits for 6-7k non glass cannon build at a range of 1500 (traited) and can hit up to 5 people at the same time.

See the difference?

I will continue to experiment with the Class to see how “broken” it really is. Just to throw it out there though I have worked in QA in one of the largest games developer/publishers for over 4 years and do have some merit in knowing what is as designed and what is broken.

There is a reason different pets do different damage scales. As designed.

Semil.8279:

Just to be clear, your entire post is saying that everyone should shut up and that everyone is wrong.

Did you plan to actually contribute something?

If everyone is wrong, how are you different? Do you have suggestions or just criticisms?

Read it again.

KensaiZen.3740:

Neb.4170:

KensaiZen.3740:

The Rangers damage is comparable to the Guardians damage. A normal attack is around the 700-800 (1st trait line maxed) crits for about 1300-1400 (berserker earrings and amulet and knights rings)

This is comparable to the Guardian with full berserkers accessories. And as we all know, Guardians may not hit as had as warriors, but they have no trouble killing any other classes.

Guardians (In mostly Zerker gear) hit for much more than that. Sword (One hander) auto attack crits for 2k on the normal swings and 3x 1k on the finisher.

~6-7k on the short channel attack.

The rest of your post is nonsense, but yeah, if you want to cheerleader a broken class go for it.

Your comparing a glass cannon 1h sword Guardian to a non glass cannon Ranger. well done.

LB2 hits for 6-7k non glass cannon build at a range of 1500 (traited) and can hit up to 5 people at the same time.

See the difference?

I will continue to experiment with the Class to see how “broken” it really is. Just to throw it out there though I have worked in QA in one of the largest games developer/publishers for over 4 years and do have some merit in knowing what is as designed and what is broken.

There is a reason different pets do different damage scales. As designed.

Uhhh.. You’re the one who gave the guardian example. I was simply correcting your wrong numbers.
Also, ‘can hit up to 5 people’ if they just so happen to stand in line for the entire duration of an extremely slow channel with an extremely long flight time… hahahahaha.

KensaiZen.3740:

Neb.4170:

KensaiZen.3740:

The Rangers damage is comparable to the Guardians damage. A normal attack is around the 700-800 (1st trait line maxed) crits for about 1300-1400 (berserker earrings and amulet and knights rings)

This is comparable to the Guardian with full berserkers accessories. And as we all know, Guardians may not hit as had as warriors, but they have no trouble killing any other classes.

Guardians (In mostly Zerker gear) hit for much more than that. Sword (One hander) auto attack crits for 2k on the normal swings and 3x 1k on the finisher.

~6-7k on the short channel attack.

The rest of your post is nonsense, but yeah, if you want to cheerleader a broken class go for it.

Your comparing a glass cannon 1h sword Guardian to a non glass cannon Ranger. well done.

LB2 hits for 6-7k non glass cannon build at a range of 1500 (traited) and can hit up to 5 people at the same time.

See the difference?

I will continue to experiment with the Class to see how “broken” it really is. Just to throw it out there though I have worked in QA in one of the largest games developer/publishers for over 4 years and do have some merit in knowing what is as designed and what is broken.

There is a reason different pets do different damage scales. As designed.

this forum community is broken, the class is quite ok… not OP, but far far from worthless.

People simply think rangers should be warriors, and warriors should be rangers, and thiefs shouldnt backstab, but rangers should stealth.

Wanna play a ranger really good? Go play it. Don’t whine.

KensaiZen.3740:

Sebrent.3625:

KensaiZen.3740:

You can maintain a good amount of regen if you use 2 pets that have them.

Ranger pets on land with Regen for group:
(1) Fern Hound
(2) N/A

Do please explain what you’re talking about here. I’d love to know what “2 pets that use them” (regen) you’re talking about.

Oh my bad, not 2 pets with regen. Just 1 regen and one outright AoE heal. So thats one regen and a little burst healing. I never claim to be a master at the class and know everything. But like I said. If a noob Ranger like me can do it, whats stopping you pros?

What exactly is this “it” you’re able to do?

When it comes to comparing my Ranger to my Mesmer, people want my Mesmer, they couldn’t care less about the Ranger (even prefer it to not be there).

My Mesmer can be extremely useful in both 1v1, skirmishes, and zergs with one build. My Ranger cannot.

kidbs.8920:

OP you make a notable effort, but ranger’s are hardly godly. While I don’t subscribe to the QQ that so many others do with regards to rangers, I also do not consider them to be a premiere dps class. Too much of the ranger’s damage is tied to their pet, so when a pet can’t be used your damage will be some of the lowest in the game.

Ranger’s are great at roaming and dueling but this isn’t because of their high dps.

This is where I disagree. Rangers sustained damage without the pet is quite high as it is. And the bonus is that because of the playstyle of the Ranger (master of ranged) that dps does not drop due to factor such as being CC’ed or having to dodge or try to kite when attracting agro of a champion or boss.

Rangers may not be Godly in terms of getting high numbers for damage. But their potential AoE damage compared to single target DPs numbers is phenomenal.

I don’t get the QQing at all. The only time I actually thought there as merit tot eh QQing was when I rolled a GC build which worked in PvE then went and got slaughtered in WvW.

Neb.4170:

KensaiZen.3740:

Neb.4170:

KensaiZen.3740:

The Rangers damage is comparable to the Guardians damage. A normal attack is around the 700-800 (1st trait line maxed) crits for about 1300-1400 (berserker earrings and amulet and knights rings)

This is comparable to the Guardian with full berserkers accessories. And as we all know, Guardians may not hit as had as warriors, but they have no trouble killing any other classes.

Guardians (In mostly Zerker gear) hit for much more than that. Sword (One hander) auto attack crits for 2k on the normal swings and 3x 1k on the finisher.

~6-7k on the short channel attack.

The rest of your post is nonsense, but yeah, if you want to cheerleader a broken class go for it.

Your comparing a glass cannon 1h sword Guardian to a non glass cannon Ranger. well done.

LB2 hits for 6-7k non glass cannon build at a range of 1500 (traited) and can hit up to 5 people at the same time.

See the difference?

I will continue to experiment with the Class to see how “broken” it really is. Just to throw it out there though I have worked in QA in one of the largest games developer/publishers for over 4 years and do have some merit in knowing what is as designed and what is broken.

There is a reason different pets do different damage scales. As designed.

Uhhh.. You’re the one who gave the guardian example. I was simply correcting your wrong numbers.
Also, ‘can hit up to 5 people’ if they just so happen to stand in line for the entire duration of an extremely slow channel with an extremely long flight time… hahahahaha.

And which idiot stands and lets the Guardian with a 1h sword get his entire combo out on him?

“Can hit up to 5 people” does not mean it will always hit 5 people. There other part of this is player positioning. Position yourself so that your piercing arrows hits as many people as possible. You are not rooted when using LB2. Add all this damage together and you will get way more potential damage then a sword guardian.

Now its a good point that you mention why did i bring a comparison to guardian. Guardians are considered quite OP but their damage is comparable to Rangers (without adding in pet damage).

KensaiZen.3740:

I’ve been running dungeons constantly with the Ranger and have found this class to be amazingly versatile and by simply switching utilities for the right encounter (am I going to be a turret or do I need to kite) The speed does not decrease.

I’ve been running CoF path 1 constantly with my ranger, guardian, ele, and engi. I can tell you that ranger comes out last even all classes go zerker build. It’s impossible to clear it under 6 minutes with 4 rangers and a mesmer…. well, let’s just say this, any combination of classes are faster than 4 rangers. I would really like to see a video of dungeon runs other than CoF path 1 where pets never die, because let’s face it, that path is just too easy.

Neb.4170:

KensaiZen.3740:

The Rangers damage is comparable to the Guardians damage. A normal attack is around the 700-800 (1st trait line maxed) crits for about 1300-1400 (berserker earrings and amulet and knights rings)

This is comparable to the Guardian with full berserkers accessories. And as we all know, Guardians may not hit as had as warriors, but they have no trouble killing any other classes.

Guardians (In mostly Zerker gear) hit for much more than that. Sword (One hander) auto attack crits for 2k on the normal swings and 3x 1k on the finisher.

~6-7k on the short channel attack.

The rest of your post is nonsense, but yeah, if you want to cheerleader a broken class go for it.

I read this then ignored everything else this guy had to say in this thread.

Sebrent.3625:

KensaiZen.3740:

Sebrent.3625:

KensaiZen.3740:

You can maintain a good amount of regen if you use 2 pets that have them.

Ranger pets on land with Regen for group:
(1) Fern Hound
(2) N/A

Do please explain what you’re talking about here. I’d love to know what “2 pets that use them” (regen) you’re talking about.

Oh my bad, not 2 pets with regen. Just 1 regen and one outright AoE heal. So thats one regen and a little burst healing. I never claim to be a master at the class and know everything. But like I said. If a noob Ranger like me can do it, whats stopping you pros?

What exactly is this “it” you’re able to do?

When it comes to comparing my Ranger to my Mesmer, people want my Mesmer, they couldn’t care less about the Ranger (even prefer it to not be there).

My Mesmer can be extremely useful in both 1v1, skirmishes, and zergs with one build. My Ranger cannot.

I am pretty sure You and I know what Mesmers are good for. But can you enlighten me as o the role Rangers play in WvW?

Recycle.5493:

KensaiZen.3740:

I’ve been running dungeons constantly with the Ranger and have found this class to be amazingly versatile and by simply switching utilities for the right encounter (am I going to be a turret or do I need to kite) The speed does not decrease.

I’ve been running CoF path 1 constantly with my ranger, guardian, ele, and engi. I can tell you that ranger comes out last even all classes go zerker build. It’s impossible to clear it under 6 minutes with 4 rangers and a mesmer…. well, let’s just say this, any combination of classes are faster than 4 rangers. I would really like to see a video of dungeon runs other than CoF path 1 where pets never die, because let’s face it, that path is just too easy.

This is the point I am trying to make. I don’t believe the Ranger class was designed to be Uber DPS kill everything in 3 hits type of class. Which is why if you compare it with a test that tests DPS… the results are obvious.

Its like judging how good a fish is by making it climb a tree.

KensaiZen.3740:

This is the point I am trying to make. I don’t believe the Ranger class was designed to be Uber DPS kill everything in 3 hits type of class. Which is why if you compare it with a test that tests DPS… the results are obvious.

Its like judging how good a fish is by making it climb a tree.

So you’re saying Anet’s advertisement of “any class can do anything” is basically a lie?

KensaiZen.3740:

Neb.4170:

KensaiZen.3740:

Neb.4170:

KensaiZen.3740:

The Rangers damage is comparable to the Guardians damage. A normal attack is around the 700-800 (1st trait line maxed) crits for about 1300-1400 (berserker earrings and amulet and knights rings)

This is comparable to the Guardian with full berserkers accessories. And as we all know, Guardians may not hit as had as warriors, but they have no trouble killing any other classes.

Guardians (In mostly Zerker gear) hit for much more than that. Sword (One hander) auto attack crits for 2k on the normal swings and 3x 1k on the finisher.

~6-7k on the short channel attack.

The rest of your post is nonsense, but yeah, if you want to cheerleader a broken class go for it.

Your comparing a glass cannon 1h sword Guardian to a non glass cannon Ranger. well done.

LB2 hits for 6-7k non glass cannon build at a range of 1500 (traited) and can hit up to 5 people at the same time.

See the difference?

I will continue to experiment with the Class to see how “broken” it really is. Just to throw it out there though I have worked in QA in one of the largest games developer/publishers for over 4 years and do have some merit in knowing what is as designed and what is broken.

There is a reason different pets do different damage scales. As designed.

Uhhh.. You’re the one who gave the guardian example. I was simply correcting your wrong numbers.
Also, ‘can hit up to 5 people’ if they just so happen to stand in line for the entire duration of an extremely slow channel with an extremely long flight time… hahahahaha.

And which idiot stands and lets the Guardian with a 1h sword get his entire combo out on him?

“Can hit up to 5 people” does not mean it will always hit 5 people. There other part of this is player positioning. Position yourself so that your piercing arrows hits as many people as possible. You are not rooted when using LB2. Add all this damage together and you will get way more potential damage then a sword guardian.

Now its a good point that you mention why did i bring a comparison to guardian. Guardians are considered quite OP but their damage is comparable to Rangers (without adding in pet damage).

So… The guardian swords attacks are easily avoidable, to get hit by them you’d have to be an ’idiot.

The ranger longbow attacks are somehow… not?

Your arguments run counter to themselves. I don’t even know what to say.

Also no one thinks guardian’s are ‘OP’ because of their damage output. They have decent damage with extremely good staying power and extremely good group support + a metric kitten ton of condi removal.

Neb.4170:

So… The guardian swords attacks are easily avoidable, to get hit by them you’d have to be an ’idiot.

The ranger longbow attacks are somehow… not?

Your arguments run counter to themselves. I don’t even know what to say.

Also no one thinks guardian’s are ‘OP’ because of their damage output. They have decent damage with extremely good staying power and extremely good group support + a metric kitten ton of condi removal.

One dodge roll and there goes half of your rapid fire, another for your barrage. Try dodge the guardians sword combo. Guess what, you’re still waiting the 4 second cool down, he already caught up with you using flashing blade and judge’s intervention.

Recycle.5493:

Neb.4170:

So… The guardian swords attacks are easily avoidable, to get hit by them you’d have to be an ’idiot.

The ranger longbow attacks are somehow… not?

Your arguments run counter to themselves. I don’t even know what to say.

Also no one thinks guardian’s are ‘OP’ because of their damage output. They have decent damage with extremely good staying power and extremely good group support + a metric kitten ton of condi removal.

One dodge roll and there goes half of your rapid fire, another for your barrage. Try dodge the guardians sword combo. Guess what, you’re still waiting the 4 second cool down, he already caught up with you using flashing blade and judge’s intervention.

Not sure if you quoted the wrong person, but essentially you’re agreeing with me.

Also, to anyone who doesn’t believe my post about guardian damage numbers(Ryan), you can refer to this thread with information from other people

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Frac40-High-DPS-Support-build/first#post1648449

If you hit with your River Drakes F2 skill and Rapid Fire, at the same time, your damage is godly, yes. However, if your opponent is running around, avoiding your pets damage, and he just dodged most of your Rapid Fire attack, your dps becomes ridiculously low.

KensaiZen.3740:

Sebrent.3625:

KensaiZen.3740:

Sebrent.3625:

KensaiZen.3740:

You can maintain a good amount of regen if you use 2 pets that have them.

Ranger pets on land with Regen for group:
(1) Fern Hound
(2) N/A

Do please explain what you’re talking about here. I’d love to know what “2 pets that use them” (regen) you’re talking about.

Oh my bad, not 2 pets with regen. Just 1 regen and one outright AoE heal. So thats one regen and a little burst healing. I never claim to be a master at the class and know everything. But like I said. If a noob Ranger like me can do it, whats stopping you pros?

What exactly is this “it” you’re able to do?

When it comes to comparing my Ranger to my Mesmer, people want my Mesmer, they couldn’t care less about the Ranger (even prefer it to not be there).

My Mesmer can be extremely useful in both 1v1, skirmishes, and zergs with one build. My Ranger cannot.

I am pretty sure You and I know what Mesmers are good for. But can you enlighten me as o the role Rangers play in WvW?

Sure thing.
The roles I’ve been able to get my Ranger to be able to fulfill in large battles without making myself suck at 1v1 and skirmishes is area denial via traps, control via traps & entangle, and picking off solo targets. I almost always have shortbow equipped and depending on if I’m denying an area defensively or offensively and which set of gear I’m wearing dictates my other weapon set.

The problem with the offensive denial is that you can get lit up quite quickly trying to throw 600 range traps on part of an enemy zerg.
The problem defensively is that often you’ll have a pet/minion run over your traps.

When it comes to picking off solo targets, that isn’t very helpful in zerg fights compared to being able to completely nullify enemy boons/conditions, projectiles, mass invis, mass AOE, etc.

Piercing arrows can be nice, but you’re not going to hit the same multiple people with it consistently. It’s really best at making sure as long as you’re in range of your target that you still hit them even if others get in the way.

… now, back to my question … what is this “it” you’re saying you’re able to accomplish.

Recycle.5493:

KensaiZen.3740:

I’ve been running dungeons constantly with the Ranger and have found this class to be amazingly versatile and by simply switching utilities for the right encounter (am I going to be a turret or do I need to kite) The speed does not decrease.

I’ve been running CoF path 1 constantly with my ranger, guardian, ele, and engi. I can tell you that ranger comes out last even all classes go zerker build. It’s impossible to clear it under 6 minutes with 4 rangers and a mesmer…. well, let’s just say this, any combination of classes are faster than 4 rangers. I would really like to see a video of dungeon runs other than CoF path 1 where pets never die, because let’s face it, that path is just too easy.

CoF path 1 =/= the whole game

just sayin…. there is more to this game then a broken dungeon

Rangers seem fine in smaller fights. 1v1 or 5v5ish, mainly fights that are small enough so that your pet actually has a noticeable effect. In larger scale battles is where the ranger suffers. Your DPS is balanced with the DPS of your pet factored in. So anytime your pet is dead or not in the fight (fairly often in large scale combat) you are doing substandard DPS.

If you are a skilled player, can you still do respectable DPS? Yes. Can you provide a noticeable benefit to your group? Of course. But you will have to work twice as hard as most other classes to get the same amount of performance.

Prysin.8542:

Recycle.5493:

KensaiZen.3740:

I’ve been running dungeons constantly with the Ranger and have found this class to be amazingly versatile and by simply switching utilities for the right encounter (am I going to be a turret or do I need to kite) The speed does not decrease.

I’ve been running CoF path 1 constantly with my ranger, guardian, ele, and engi. I can tell you that ranger comes out last even all classes go zerker build. It’s impossible to clear it under 6 minutes with 4 rangers and a mesmer…. well, let’s just say this, any combination of classes are faster than 4 rangers. I would really like to see a video of dungeon runs other than CoF path 1 where pets never die, because let’s face it, that path is just too easy.

CoF path 1 =/= the whole game

just sayin…. there is more to this game then a broken dungeon

I’ve made my point in bold, hope that helps you seeing it.

The more I stick around this forum, the more I start to see that most of the really competent rangers have left this class…

It’s really starting to be a class predominantly occupied by people who are too motivated in reinforcing their own view of rangers being great just because they’re not totally useless.

Kasama.8941:

If you hit with your River Drakes F2 skill and Rapid Fire, at the same time, your damage is godly, yes. However, if your opponent is running around, avoiding your pets damage, and he just dodged most of your Rapid Fire attack, your dps becomes ridiculously low.

Every class is exactly like this. Basically the point of the combat system is to learn when to do that to your enemy, and how to recover from that yourself.

The Rooster.2615:

If you are a skilled player, can you still do respectable DPS? Yes. Can you provide a noticeable benefit to your group? Of course. But you will have to work twice as hard as most other classes to get the same amount of performance.

That exact statement has been said in every single class forum. Engineers are probably the ones with the best claim to it though.

As usual, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle. The class certainly isn’t pie-in-the-sky, but it’s also certainly not the dog some of you make it out to be. But in all honesty, if you’re that unhappy it’s not difficult at all to level up another character or two.

Recycle.5493:

Prysin.8542:

Recycle.5493:

KensaiZen.3740:

I’ve been running dungeons constantly with the Ranger and have found this class to be amazingly versatile and by simply switching utilities for the right encounter (am I going to be a turret or do I need to kite) The speed does not decrease.

I’ve been running CoF path 1 constantly with my ranger, guardian, ele, and engi. I can tell you that ranger comes out last even all classes go zerker build. It’s impossible to clear it under 6 minutes with 4 rangers and a mesmer…. well, let’s just say this, any combination of classes are faster than 4 rangers. I would really like to see a video of dungeon runs other than CoF path 1 where pets never die, because let’s face it, that path is just too easy.

CoF path 1 =/= the whole game

just sayin…. there is more to this game then a broken dungeon

I’ve made my point in bold, hope that helps you seeing it.

can you enlarge it too. so i can distinguish it from the huge wall of COF PATH 1 part?

Prysin.8542:

Recycle.5493:

Prysin.8542:

Recycle.5493:

KensaiZen.3740:

I’ve been running dungeons constantly with the Ranger and have found this class to be amazingly versatile and by simply switching utilities for the right encounter (am I going to be a turret or do I need to kite) The speed does not decrease.

I’ve been running CoF path 1 constantly with my ranger, guardian, ele, and engi. I can tell you that ranger comes out last even all classes go zerker build. It’s impossible to clear it under 6 minutes with 4 rangers and a mesmer…. well, let’s just say this, any combination of classes are faster than 4 rangers. I would really like to see a video of dungeon runs other than CoF path 1 where pets never die, because let’s face it, that path is just too easy.

CoF path 1 =/= the whole game

just sayin…. there is more to this game then a broken dungeon

I’ve made my point in bold, hope that helps you seeing it.

can you enlarge it too. so i can distinguish it from the huge wall of COF PATH 1 part?

Maybe he should copy and paste the words ‘OTHER THAN’ a few hundred times.

Will you get it then?

Mister Mustard.7203:

The Rooster.2615:

If you are a skilled player, can you still do respectable DPS? Yes. Can you provide a noticeable benefit to your group? Of course. But you will have to work twice as hard as most other classes to get the same amount of performance.

That exact statement has been said in every single class forum. Engineers are probably the ones with the best claim to it though.

Every other class doesn’t rely on an NPC to contribute to their DPS.

Prysin.8542:

Recycle.5493:

• I
• like
• to see
• video
• dungeon
• other than CoF
• pets
• no dead

can you enlarge it too. so i can distinguish it from the huge wall of COF PATH 1 part?

I can’t enlarge texts, but I hope this helps, since it seems you can’t read sentences.

Anyways, back on topic before you all get yourselves reported …

• The issue with pets is that they die quite easily in specific parts of dungeons.
• The issue with fixing this by reducing the damage pets take in dungeons is that pets could then theoretically enable 2+ rangers to trivially take on bosses through pet tanking
• Nothing in GW2 is supposed to be able to tank (including pets)

It seems like a logical solution would be to make the pets more tanky but change enemy AI to ignore pets in favor of attacking rangers and their allies. This solves the issue of pets dying too much (they are tankier and aren’t getting aggro) and prevents the issue of pet tanking trivializing content (pets aren’t taking aggro that could be directed at players).

We want our pets alive for their damage and utility, this gives it to us. If you want the pet to take hits, stand behind it and let projectiles hit it instead of you.

Sebrent.3625:

• The issue with fixing this by reducing the damage pets take in dungeons is that pets could then theoretically enable 2+ rangers to trivially take on bosses through pet tanking

easily avoidable by adding different types of resistance/defenses towards different damage classes.

All you need is add 3 types of damage in dungeons
Minion damage (hi pet defense, normal player defense)
Trap damage (pet invulnerable, pet non-trigger, normal player defense)
Boss damage (normal pet defense, normal player defense)

and you are done… takes some work, but totally possible to pull off

KensaiZen.3740:

Neb.4170:

KensaiZen.3740:

The Rangers damage is comparable to the Guardians damage. A normal attack is around the 700-800 (1st trait line maxed) crits for about 1300-1400 (berserker earrings and amulet and knights rings)

This is comparable to the Guardian with full berserkers accessories. And as we all know, Guardians may not hit as had as warriors, but they have no trouble killing any other classes.

Guardians (In mostly Zerker gear) hit for much more than that. Sword (One hander) auto attack crits for 2k on the normal swings and 3x 1k on the finisher.

~6-7k on the short channel attack.

The rest of your post is nonsense, but yeah, if you want to cheerleader a broken class go for it.

Your comparing a glass cannon 1h sword Guardian to a non glass cannon Ranger. well done.

LB2 hits for 6-7k non glass cannon build at a range of 1500 (traited) and can hit up to 5 people at the same time.

See the difference?

I will continue to experiment with the Class to see how “broken” it really is. Just to throw it out there though I have worked in QA in one of the largest games developer/publishers for over 4 years and do have some merit in knowing what is as designed and what is broken.

There is a reason different pets do different damage scales. As designed.

And I can hit for 6-8k with whirling wrath on up to 5 targets as well with my non-glass cannon Guardian. I don’t think he was comparing a glass cannon guardian b/c I can certainly hit those numbers while keeping a decent amount of armor (2.6k+ armor).

KensaiZen.3740:

kidbs.8920:

OP you make a notable effort, but ranger’s are hardly godly. While I don’t subscribe to the QQ that so many others do with regards to rangers, I also do not consider them to be a premiere dps class. Too much of the ranger’s damage is tied to their pet, so when a pet can’t be used your damage will be some of the lowest in the game.

Ranger’s are great at roaming and dueling but this isn’t because of their high dps.

This is where I disagree. Rangers sustained damage without the pet is quite high as it is. And the bonus is that because of the playstyle of the Ranger (master of ranged) that dps does not drop due to factor such as being CC’ed or having to dodge or try to kite when attracting agro of a champion or boss.

Rangers may not be Godly in terms of getting high numbers for damage. But their potential AoE damage compared to single target DPs numbers is phenomenal.

I don’t get the QQing at all. The only time I actually thought there as merit tot eh QQing was when I rolled a GC build which worked in PvE then went and got slaughtered in WvW.

Rangers can do decent AoE damage but I don’t think I would classify it as phenomenal. I’ll definitely outdps my ranger with my power necro when it comes to AoE damage. Also, don’t forget that other classes have ranged builds that also don’t have to worry about CC as much, so Ranger’s aren’t even the tops when it comes to ranged damage.

I’m not QQing, I’m just saying…

Rangers are really good when it comes to sustained damage . On the other hand their burst fails

Recycle.5493:

Prysin.8542:

Recycle.5493:

• I
• like
• to see
• video
• dungeon
• other than CoF
• pets
• no dead

can you enlarge it too. so i can distinguish it from the huge wall of COF PATH 1 part?

I can’t enlarge texts, but I hope this helps, since it seems you can’t read sentences.

I need it to be pink.

Recycle.5493:

KensaiZen.3740:

This is the point I am trying to make. I don’t believe the Ranger class was designed to be Uber DPS kill everything in 3 hits type of class. Which is why if you compare it with a test that tests DPS… the results are obvious.

Its like judging how good a fish is by making it climb a tree.

So you’re saying Anet’s advertisement of “any class can do anything” is basically a lie?

They didnt lie at all. People just jumped to conclusion that “any class can do anything” translates as “every class is good at everything”

kidbs.8920:

KensaiZen.3740:

Neb.4170:

KensaiZen.3740:

The Rangers damage is comparable to the Guardians damage. A normal attack is around the 700-800 (1st trait line maxed) crits for about 1300-1400 (berserker earrings and amulet and knights rings)

This is comparable to the Guardian with full berserkers accessories. And as we all know, Guardians may not hit as had as warriors, but they have no trouble killing any other classes.

Guardians (In mostly Zerker gear) hit for much more than that. Sword (One hander) auto attack crits for 2k on the normal swings and 3x 1k on the finisher.

~6-7k on the short channel attack.

The rest of your post is nonsense, but yeah, if you want to cheerleader a broken class go for it.

Your comparing a glass cannon 1h sword Guardian to a non glass cannon Ranger. well done.

LB2 hits for 6-7k non glass cannon build at a range of 1500 (traited) and can hit up to 5 people at the same time.

See the difference?

I will continue to experiment with the Class to see how “broken” it really is. Just to throw it out there though I have worked in QA in one of the largest games developer/publishers for over 4 years and do have some merit in knowing what is as designed and what is broken.

There is a reason different pets do different damage scales. As designed.

And I can hit for 6-8k with whirling wrath on up to 5 targets as well with my non-glass cannon Guardian. I don’t think he was comparing a glass cannon guardian b/c I can certainly hit those numbers while keeping a decent amount of armor (2.6k+ armor).

Well thats great isnt it. Rangers and guardians are on par for burst damage from their channelled skill.

Now add in pet damage for the Ranger. It doesnt have to be a jaguar or bird for higher numbers. Even adding a bear or devourer damage will increase ranger damage considerably.

Though tbh getting those figures on a guardian you would need to be loaded with crit dmg %. 2600 armour on a guardian is on the low end of the spectrum.

iitwinz.1420:

I run a condition ranger build and I love it

IMO it’s hard for rangers to run away from huge zergs as we really have no escaping skills

No one can run away from huge zergs except for thieves. Rangers have great escaping skills in lightening reflexes, Sword #2 and GS #3. Swoop has saved my life many times by using it to escape small melee’s I am losing.