Guild Wars 2

So, here it is. Your chance to defend healing signet. I find this skill to be the most ridiculous skill in the game, yet warriors claim its necessary and not unbalanced.

Lets look at the base stats for warrior’s healing signet, keeping in mind that the warrior has the highest base toughness and health pool in the game.

Healing signet (pve): Base 392 health per second with a .05 healing power modifier.
Healing signet (pvp): same thing.

Now lets look at the elementalist, the class with the lowest base toughness and hp pool in the game:

Signet of Restoration: 202 base health per cast with a healing modifier of .1.
Signet of Restoration (PVP): 168 base health per cast with a healing modifier of .08.

I just don’t see how you can justify this healing signet. It’s almost twice as good as the elementalist’s signet for base passive healing. It is also PER SECOND. That means when your running away, casting a long skill, or blocking using the endure pain, your still gaining health…

Feel free to defend or berate this healing signet. I’m curious to hear the arguments for and against it.

Reminder: “Warriors need more sustain” is a 3 months old argument.

Also, upcoming patch packs buffs to Healing Shouts and Shout + Warhorn CD traits (you will be able to pick both).

“Warriors need more sustain”. While now you got it. The class with the most armor and hp in the game, the second most mobility in the game, immunity to conditions for 8 seconds, and auto stability when needed now has the most sustain.

Do other classes need a sustain buff when not specced into healing power too?

Total healing is far higher for ele than war

dan.3618:

Total healing is far higher for ele than war

But elementalists/other classes actually have to cast their heals. Warriors can just keep on attacking. while healing. You also have to spec around healing as an elementalist/other class whereas warriors can just slap on the healing signet and call it a day.

how about you l2p , warrior is 90% fixed and in good shape you can’t faceroll him anymore as what used to be before.

honovi.7893:

“Warriors need more sustain”. While now you got it. The class with the most armor and hp in the game, the second most mobility in the game, immunity to conditions for 8 seconds, and auto stability when needed now has the most sustain.

Uh, just saying, mine was a “Warrior defending HS, the sustain argument is not valid”, not the opposite.

I do not use SIG anymore. Stopped using it before the patch. Its not as good as surge.

Signet is fine because it’s specialised to help a warrior in fights of attrition. Against a thief ganking you it will just do nothing, whereas healing surge would give you the nice burst heal. If the meta moves towards power builds spiking you down, signet will stop being used.

AndrewSX.3794:

honovi.7893:

“Warriors need more sustain”. While now you got it. The class with the most armor and hp in the game, the second most mobility in the game, immunity to conditions for 8 seconds, and auto stability when needed now has the most sustain.

Uh, just saying, mine was a “Warrior defending HS, the sustain argument is not valid”, not the opposite.

Ignoring the other two posts. What are you trying to say here? I am not following.

honovi.7893:

AndrewSX.3794:

honovi.7893:

“Warriors need more sustain”. While now you got it. The class with the most armor and hp in the game, the second most mobility in the game, immunity to conditions for 8 seconds, and auto stability when needed now has the most sustain.

Uh, just saying, mine was a “Warrior defending HS, the sustain argument is not valid”, not the opposite.

Ignoring the other two posts. What are you trying to say here? I am not following.

You made a post “defend healing sig”.

I was just adding to your post: “warrior needs more sustain” is no longer a valid argument in defence of HSig since last big update, and because upcoming one have additional buffs to heal/sustain, nerfing HS is totally ok.

Because trust me, there are ppl that will/would istantly reply that to your post about HS.

I guess i just don’t see how its op… I mean you compare us to the ele sig, not really fare. Sure the sig has half the healing but it considered auto attacks from weapons as a “cast” so you can cast 3-4 skills per second effectively doubling the effectiveness of there heal while in combat. Then add the fact that they have… just… so many other heals at there disposal just from there weapon set.

Same thing goes for THF and there sig its insane HPS when done correctly the healing sig was taken from a broken “useless” state and made viable. On a beefy tank it does its job quite well but there is no reason you should not be able to out DPS 400 HPS because other than that we have no burst healing.

BTW my main is an Engi and i also play Necro and Ele so dont misunderstand im not overly pro WAR (i only use mine in PvE) but this is not one of the issues anyone should take with them.

Not sure comparing warrior and elementalist healing signets is fair. Healing signet is one of the more powerful options for a warrior to take in PvP… but how often do elementalists take theirs? Could it be easily argued that Elementalists are in general underpowered in PvP, and in need of some buffs on their own? If so, comparing abilities between a recently-buffed class and a potentially-underpowered class is bound to show a disparity.

On another note: In theory, I would consider Warrior Healing Signet to be powerful, but not OP. It’s passive healing is ~2% of a warriors max health pool if he isn’t stacking vit, can be countered by any sustained damage or poison application, and can be burst through without really being noticed. Of course, warriors have ways to mitigate those factors through condition cleanses, dodging, blocking, and cooldowns like Endure Pain, but on it’s own that’s pretty much on-par with the defensive options of most classes.

However: In practice Healing Signet has led to a lot of warriors playing as if they were Thieves… Only attacking when they can lockdown and burst their opponent, and using mobility and defensive options to prevent themselves from taking damage should their burst fail. It’s cowardly and abuses both healing signet and warrior mobility (each, on their own, have solid arguments as to why they’re needed for the class). But unfortunately it’s also effective, and Healing Signet is one of the reasons why.

Personally, I’d like to see changes promoting build diversity FIRST, and then have Anet start looking at Healing Signet to see if it is still ‘overpowered’. Let’s see warriors in WvW/Spvp running Rifles or combinations like sword/axe or axe/mace instead of mace/shield+greatsword. Let’s see more useful traits and passives that aren’t all in the Crit or Toughness trees so that every Warrior with healing signet doesn’t automatically have Adrenal Health as well. Let’s see classes that haven’t gotten improvements lately brought up to par if need be, and THEN let’s look back at individual abilities and see if they are what’s OP, or if it’s the cookie-cutter build that uses them.

Agreed with Darren for the most part. Healing signet is not OP but it seems that way because of the sneak up and obliterate play style that most warriors have to adopt to successfully play that way and kill their adversary.

For example here’s another one that looks OP but isn’t:
A thief can pick up the valkyrie gem and put on their signet. Then find a group and dagger storm in it. Suddenly the thief is unkillable as he’s healing a ton, has stability, reflects projectiles and is doing a ton of damage.

But take away the ability to attack and we all know that signet sucks.

Take away a warrior’s ability to regen effectively by way of poison or burst and the same thing happens. All you have to do is get the warrior out of where that healing isn’t advantageous and you’ll win. Fail to do so or apply enough pressure on him and he’ll win.

So first, lets fix up other classes (like the now poor old Ele) and then review healing signet rather than continued complaining about how warriors can now finally have sustain AND some damage instead of either/or, unlike most classes which also have sustain and some damage.

I hope this post doesn’t get ignored in favor of whining, however I will defend this skill.

The new Shout Improvements we are getting will not help our sustain, shouts will and always will be utility. It will not improve the current 0/X/30/X/30s.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/warrior/Grandmaster-Trait-Idea-Adrenal-Recovery/first#post2924952

We need our sustain spread around like other classes have theirs, our traits are mostly lack-luster compared to what other classes receive.

We need a Grand-master Sustain trait. This would allow us to spread our healing around so its not locked to single skill.

The reason for example: “Healing Signet.” gets so much attention, is because of the raw healing it gives, if it gave less healing then our sustain is nerfed to the ground, because we really have nothing else right now. Adrenal Health is alright, however since we are constantly using our adrenaline, the skill becomes worthless (40 hp/s) for a long bit then decent, it fluctuates so much its not reliable.

Healing Signets weakness is poison and burst. The current meta does not support it, however as you seen at the tournament yesterday, when they brought burst classes against the signet warrior he literally melted, due to not being able to shrug off non-condition damage.

As shown here, I play a necromancer in SPVP (Necromancer/Ranger heals far more then warriors do by the way, do to their traits.)

If you can keep pressure/poison/damage on the warrior (which those classes above have access to.) Then you can destroy a warrior.

Healing Signet is fine, however if they add more healing traits to the warrior. (And not Shouts, Shouts are support… I mean PURE healing traits.) then I feel that it may be toned down slightly. However right now I feel that our other heals should be toned up.

The other thing about it is, you KNOW he cannot have a burst heal when he runs Healing Signet, which means he is weak to burst.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Mending-HSurge-Suggestions/first#post2925043

Mending (20 second cooldown.)
You and regenerate health over time. Cures a condition every second.
Health per second: 1612 (0.25)?
Duration: 5 s

(383 Hp/S) (Good heal for using, cures conditions over time.)

Healing Surge (30 second cooldown.)
Healing: 9,820 (1.50)?
Protection: 6 s
Regeneration: 6 s (780 health.)
Adrenaline: 30

(341 Hp/S) (Good burst heal, less HPS but offers some support for 6 seconds.)

I know we shouldn’t get protection, however there is almost no way to make this skill different from the other ones without giving it something unique, and the only thing I can think of is protection. Why use Surge over the other heals when it heals less? It needs something like Hide in Shadows cures conditions AND stealths, I want this to be a burst of help like that.

The reason Signet of Restoration is so bad, is because your comparing it to a class that has so much and many other ways to heal itself its not funny, in fact it used to be broken. The other reason is Opportunity Cost, the Elementalist can use up to 7 spells a second, making that heal go off more then once per second.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Signet-of-Restoration-Revamp/first#post2910970
I tried to make a post to make it up to par with ours a bit and even better. however the problem is it would need an internal cool-down.

You could also say, that healing signet heals less then other healing spells in the game. You realize that all it does is heal us? Other healing spells in the game give boons, prevent damage, heal everyone around them. Hell… http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Troll_Unguent heals a lot too (the class also has more condition removal!) Not only does it heal the ranger a lot, but also the rangers pet, that is two functions in one. They also don’t carry a big sign saying: Hey i’m weak to burst because I have no burst healing!

Also consider the damage to PvE when you nerf healing ability’s. One of the builds i enjoy is a Bunker PvE warrior (just for fun) and i rely heavy on the sig for sustain.

tattoohead.3217:

Also consider the damage to PvE when you nerf healing ability’s. One of the builds i enjoy is a Bunker PvE warrior (just for fun) and i rely heavy on the sig for sustain.

Yes, well its really the only thing we have.

We don’t have skills/traits that heal us heavily.
We don’t have class mechanics that heal us.
We don’t have protection. (an extra 2750 armor, stupid ain’t it?)
We don’t have aegis.
We don’t have stealth.
We don’t have perma-vigor on-crit traits.
We can’t spam blinds.
Our minor traits are very lack-luster compared to other classes.

The reason healing signet gets so much attention, is literally all of our sustain was put into one skill, rather then giving us new traits that heal us.

Daecollo.9578:

tattoohead.3217:

Also consider the damage to PvE when you nerf healing ability’s. One of the builds i enjoy is a Bunker PvE warrior (just for fun) and i rely heavy on the sig for sustain.

Yes, well its really the only thing we have.

We don’t have skills/traits that heal us heavily.
We don’t have class mechanics that heal us.
We don’t have protection. (an extra 2750 armor, stupid ain’t it?)
We don’t have aegis.
We don’t have stealth.
We don’t have perma-vigor on-crit traits.
We can’t spam blinds.
Our minor traits are very lack-luster compared to other classes.

The reason healing signet gets so much attention, is literally all of our sustain was put into one skill, rather then giving us new traits that heal us.

Don’t u been the one saying that signet should heal for at least 400/s? Just saying..xD
As for different sources of healing we got shouts/banners/sitting on adrenaline to take advantage of adrenal health (should become GM trait)

Scoobaniec.9561:

Daecollo.9578:

tattoohead.3217:

Also consider the damage to PvE when you nerf healing ability’s. One of the builds i enjoy is a Bunker PvE warrior (just for fun) and i rely heavy on the sig for sustain.

Yes, well its really the only thing we have.

We don’t have skills/traits that heal us heavily.
We don’t have class mechanics that heal us.
We don’t have protection. (an extra 2750 armor, stupid ain’t it?)
We don’t have aegis.
We don’t have stealth.
We don’t have perma-vigor on-crit traits.
We can’t spam blinds.
Our minor traits are very lack-luster compared to other classes.

The reason healing signet gets so much attention, is literally all of our sustain was put into one skill, rather then giving us new traits that heal us.

Don’t u been the one saying that signet should heal for at least 400/s? Just saying..xD
As for different sources of healing we got shouts/banners/sitting on adrenaline to take advantage of adrenal health (should become GM trait)

Shout/Banners are support healing, that is an entirely different spec.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Monk%27s_Focus
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Altruistic_Healing
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Selfless_Daring
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Evasive_Arcana
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Virtue_of_Resolve
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Elemental_Attunement
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vampiric
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bloodthirst
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vampiric_Master
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vampiric_Precision

These are the kind of traits we do not have that make those classes powerful. Support heals are very different.

Please re-read the thread above.

@ Darren – I agree with what you are saying. Warriors (and guardians but n/a) are supposed to be the heaviest class in the game, yet the have the most mobility out of anyone. This allows them to strike, run, strike, run, etc… If you want to have good sustain, you should not be able to escape a fight easier than almost every other class in the game.

@ Ottohi – I disagree. Of course a thief specced around his elite skill will be hard to kill and deal subpar damage for a short amount of time. Daggerstorm is a garbage skill and we all know that. I partially agree with your second statement. Warriors can be beaten by poison but what about all the ways they have to mitigate it? The current meta warrior has a lot of condi removal, stability, and pressure. It is hard to use skills that poison a warrior when you are being stunned every 8 seconds, the warrior has constant pressure because of his absurd mobility, and the warrior has good condition removal. With that being said, there are some fairly good counters to these warriors such as AFK-spec phantasm/condition mesmers or skilled necromancers.

@ Daecello – First of all, the current meta completely supports poison. Necromancers? Rangers? Engineers? They all have an abundance of poison skills. You also say that warriors are weak against burst. I disagree. Warriors have endure pain, stability when needed from traits, berserkers stance, and an absurd amount of mobility. I do agree with what you have to say about elementalists. When specced for it, elementalists (and guardians) have a lot of healing and a decent amount of damage. However, the "
opportunity cost" you speak of is simply nonexistent. Warriors can heal while they are running away whereas elementalists have to spam their 1 key and blow skills they shouldnt have to blow if they want to heal on the run. When you talk about rangers, i don’t think you know what you are talking about… Troll unguent has a pretty long cast time and it garbage when compared to healing spring (unless running a beastmaster build). Rangers also dont have good condi removal unless running healing spring or specced 30 into a tree where the rest of the major traits suck.

@daecello #2 – its not the only thing you have. What about the stability you guys get that other classes lack? What about the base health and toughness that other classes dont have? The ridiculous mobility? The crowd control?

@ tattoohead – Yeah i 100% know what you mean. Pve and WvW are completely different but that’s a whole different story.

Anyways, good points by everyone. I look forward to seeing what more people have to say.

Mathematically speaking, healing signet only becomes more powerful than healing surge at 25 seconds into a fight assuming you haven’t been poisoned at any point during the fight.

Base value = 392 HPS
(392health/sec)*(25seconds) = 9200 health

Base heal for healing surge = 9280 on a 30 second cooldown. So healing signet becomes more powerful than healing surge at the 26-29 second range assuming you weren’t poisoned during the fight which would have dropped the heal for however many seconds to only 2/3 effectiveness.

Daecollo.9578:

Honestly. They should just completely remove the active portion if we are going to have this problem/argument. Signets should be used for there passive effects and the active should be an emergency that shuts down the active for awile.

Healing Signet (Cooldown: 30 seconds.)
Passive: Grants regeneration.
Active: Heal yourself.
Healing Signet: 575 heal per sec (0.15*Healing Power.)
Healing: 1150 heal per sec for 10 seconds. (0.3)?

There, now you have an emergency that is worth it. The healing should be powerful due to the lack of endurance gain and evasion and protection the warrior has.

I think u missed something.. Right when signet heals for 400/s u asking for seconds options to increase healing abilities. As it is now we don’t need more healing, nor nerf to them.. If anything maybe mending buffed a bit but thats about it

honovi.7893:

So, here it is. Your chance to defend healing signet. I find this skill to be the most ridiculous skill in the game, yet warriors claim its necessary and not unbalanced.

Lets look at the base stats for warrior’s healing signet, keeping in mind that the warrior has the highest base toughness and health pool in the game.

Healing signet (pve): Base 392 health per second with a .05 healing power modifier.
Healing signet (pvp): same thing.

Now lets look at the elementalist, the class with the lowest base toughness and hp pool in the game:

I stopped here. This is a flawed analysis. You cannot compare warrior’s healing signet to an elementalist’s heal. Elementalists, unlike warriors, always have access to other healing abilities purely by switching to water attunement, regardless of equipment and traits. Anet atleast tries to balance elementalist’s 6 heal with those from their weapon skills.

I just wanted to point out to a couple people that when comparing heals, do keep in mind that most are equally affected by poison. Poison isn’t just healing signet’s weakness, it’s the weakness of all healing skills.
Also, because of all the condition removal/immunity that warriors have, poison is more a weakness to other classes than to warrior.

Saying poison is healing signet’s weakness is like saying [insert overpowered attack here] can be dodged, therefore there is no problem.

Scoobaniec.9561:

Daecollo.9578:

Honestly. They should just completely remove the active portion if we are going to have this problem/argument. Signets should be used for there passive effects and the active should be an emergency that shuts down the active for awile.

Healing Signet (Cooldown: 30 seconds.)
Passive: Grants regeneration.
Active: Heal yourself.
Healing Signet: 575 heal per sec (0.15*Healing Power.)
Healing: 1150 heal per sec for 10 seconds. (0.3)?

There, now you have an emergency that is worth it. The healing should be powerful due to the lack of endurance gain and evasion and protection the warrior has.

I think u missed something.. Right when signet heals for 400/s u asking for seconds options to increase healing abilities. As it is now we don’t need more healing, nor nerf to them.. If anything maybe mending buffed a bit but thats about it

I disagree i feel like we could use a “slight” healing buff (I know kill me now lol) the only change I would make is with the 2 grand master traits in the Tactics line. Banners grant regeneration & shouts heal. Split thees up so we can take both.

i know i going to get ripped after saying this but i think the warrior class and guardian class both need a heavy redo as they make no sense what so ever. I understand people have some weird believe that weight shouldn’t affect movement, but if you think about it, why does a warrior in HEAVY gear move around fast then someone has less weight on them? If you want warriors to be all about tanking and dealing powerful hits when the get close then to make them balanced you have to cut back their mobility. If the warriors had less mobility then we would be having this talk at all because even if they tank if you evade them correctly they shouldn’t be able to finish you so they would therefore have to pick. tank or powerhouse. no other class has the ability to have both and i know you going to say i am just QQing but then again you just don’t want your warrior to be nerfed. Just my thoughts solet the ripping begin.

porkchop.6458:

i know i going to get ripped after saying this but i think the warrior class and guardian class both need a heavy redo as they make no sense what so ever. I understand people have some weird believe that weight shouldn’t affect movement, but if you think about it, why does a warrior in HEAVY gear move around fast then someone has less weight on them? If you want warriors to be all about tanking and dealing powerful hits when the get close then to make them balanced you have to cut back their mobility. If the warriors had less mobility then we would be having this talk at all because even if they tank if you evade them correctly they shouldn’t be able to finish you so they would therefore have to pick. tank or powerhouse. no other class has the ability to have both and i know you going to say i am just QQing but then again you just don’t want your warrior to be nerfed. Just my thoughts so they the ripping begin.

I understand cloth, however plate armor isn’t all that movement hindering. Some of the coats weight more and are more hindering then Plate armor would be.

sinzer.4018:

honovi.7893:

So, here it is. Your chance to defend healing signet. I find this skill to be the most ridiculous skill in the game, yet warriors claim its necessary and not unbalanced.

Lets look at the base stats for warrior’s healing signet, keeping in mind that the warrior has the highest base toughness and health pool in the game.

Healing signet (pve): Base 392 health per second with a .05 healing power modifier.
Healing signet (pvp): same thing.

Now lets look at the elementalist, the class with the lowest base toughness and hp pool in the game:

I stopped here. This is a flawed analysis. You cannot compare warrior’s healing signet to an elementalist’s heal. Elementalists, unlike warriors, always have access to other healing abilities purely by switching to water attunement, regardless of equipment and traits. Anet atleast tries to balance elementalist’s 6 heal with those from their weapon skills.

I have said this before. The elementalist’s skill need either 30 in arcane or 15 in water to get that “ridiculous healing” and our dagger healing skill has a cast time. All the warrior needs to do his put his healing signet on.

honovi.7893:

sinzer.4018:

honovi.7893:

So, here it is. Your chance to defend healing signet. I find this skill to be the most ridiculous skill in the game, yet warriors claim its necessary and not unbalanced.

Lets look at the base stats for warrior’s healing signet, keeping in mind that the warrior has the highest base toughness and health pool in the game.

Healing signet (pve): Base 392 health per second with a .05 healing power modifier.
Healing signet (pvp): same thing.

Now lets look at the elementalist, the class with the lowest base toughness and hp pool in the game:

I stopped here. This is a flawed analysis. You cannot compare warrior’s healing signet to an elementalist’s heal. Elementalists, unlike warriors, always have access to other healing abilities purely by switching to water attunement, regardless of equipment and traits. Anet atleast tries to balance elementalist’s 6 heal with those from their weapon skills.

I have said this before. The elementalist’s skill need either 30 in arcane or 15 in water to get that “ridiculous healing” and our dagger healing skill has a cast time. All the warrior needs to do his put his healing signet on.

But that is comparing a ‘6’ skill to traits/skills.

Daecollo.9578:

porkchop.6458:

i know i going to get ripped after saying this but i think the warrior class and guardian class both need a heavy redo as they make no sense what so ever. I understand people have some weird believe that weight shouldn’t affect movement, but if you think about it, why does a warrior in HEAVY gear move around fast then someone has less weight on them? If you want warriors to be all about tanking and dealing powerful hits when the get close then to make them balanced you have to cut back their mobility. If the warriors had less mobility then we would be having this talk at all because even if they tank if you evade them correctly they shouldn’t be able to finish you so they would therefore have to pick. tank or powerhouse. no other class has the ability to have both and i know you going to say i am just QQing but then again you just don’t want your warrior to be nerfed. Just my thoughts so they the ripping begin.

I understand cloth, however plate armor isn’t all that movement hindering. Some of the coats weight more and are more hindering then Plate armor would be.

-.- wtf coat are you wearing that weights more then plate armour?
you may as well say leather amour weights as much has the moon that was just stupid mate.

Lower the base heal, and make it scale higher with healing power

porkchop.6458:

Daecollo.9578:

porkchop.6458:

i know i going to get ripped after saying this but i think the warrior class and guardian class both need a heavy redo as they make no sense what so ever. I understand people have some weird believe that weight shouldn’t affect movement, but if you think about it, why does a warrior in HEAVY gear move around fast then someone has less weight on them? If you want warriors to be all about tanking and dealing powerful hits when the get close then to make them balanced you have to cut back their mobility. If the warriors had less mobility then we would be having this talk at all because even if they tank if you evade them correctly they shouldn’t be able to finish you so they would therefore have to pick. tank or powerhouse. no other class has the ability to have both and i know you going to say i am just QQing but then again you just don’t want your warrior to be nerfed. Just my thoughts so they the ripping begin.

I understand cloth, however plate armor isn’t all that movement hindering. Some of the coats weight more and are more hindering then Plate armor would be.

-.- wtf coat are you wearing that weights more then plate armour?
you may as well say leather amour weights as much has the moon that was just stupid mate.

A soldier’s gear (currently.) weighs almost 2 times more then what a medieval knight would wear.

Heavy Coats and Gear weighs a lot.

honovi.7893:

So, here it is. Your chance to defend healing signet. I find this skill to be the most ridiculous skill in the game, yet warriors claim its necessary and not unbalanced.

Why is this our chance? Who the crap are you? I don’t have to defend Healing Signet to yet another whiny player who still doesn’t have the skill to defeat the most predictable and telegraphed class in the game.

Daecollo.9578:

Heavy Coats and Gear weighs a lot.

Speaking as someone who owns a full suit of custom fitted plate, I give this a +1. I can do cartwheels in my armor.

kiwituatara.6053:

Lower the base heal, and make it scale higher with healing power

Agree.

honovi.7893:

kiwituatara.6053:

Lower the base heal, and make it scale higher with healing power

Agree.

Healing Signets base is fine. It needs more Healing Power adjustment (0.15 from 0.05) and lowered slightly in PvP like the other Signets were. (about 20%.)

honovi.7893:

kiwituatara.6053:

Lower the base heal, and make it scale higher with healing power

Agree.

Disagree. If thats the logic, apply it to every healing skill ingame.

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

kiwituatara.6053:

Lower the base heal, and make it scale higher with healing power

Agree.

Disagree. If thats the logic, apply it to every healing skill ingame.

Agreed, why should http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Troll_Unguent heal for a lot, AND have a secondary component that also heals the pet be more Hp/S then healing signet, which just heals the warrior and gives you a big giant target that says Hey I have no burst healing, I am Suspectable to all forms of burst damage!

Healing Power improves its heal by about 10-15%.
Healing Power improves healing signets heal by about 10-15%.

If you wanna make Healing Signet special, change every heal in the entire game.

Healing Power should be a Bonus not a Requirement.

Healing Signet is fine, DEAL with it. I have.

Daecollo.9578:

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

kiwituatara.6053:

Lower the base heal, and make it scale higher with healing power

Agree.

Disagree. If thats the logic, apply it to every healing skill ingame.

Agreed, why should http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Troll_Unguent heal for a lot, AND have a secondary component that also heals the pet be more Hp/S then healing signet, which just heals the warrior and gives you a big giant target that says Hey I have no burst healing, I am Suspectable to all forms of burst damage!

Healing Power improves its heal by about 10-15%.
Healing Power improves healing signets heal by about 10-15%.

If you wanna make Healing Signet special, change every heal in the entire game.

Healing Power should be a Bonus not a Requirement.

Healing Signet is fine, DEAL with it. I have.

Because TU has a cast time, down time, requires timing, is easier to time poison with, and is worse than healing spring…

honovi.7893:

Daecollo.9578:

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

kiwituatara.6053:

Lower the base heal, and make it scale higher with healing power

Agree.

Disagree. If thats the logic, apply it to every healing skill ingame.

Agreed, why should http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Troll_Unguent heal for a lot, AND have a secondary component that also heals the pet be more Hp/S then healing signet, which just heals the warrior and gives you a big giant target that says Hey I have no burst healing, I am Suspectable to all forms of burst damage!

Healing Power improves its heal by about 10-15%.
Healing Power improves healing signets heal by about 10-15%.

If you wanna make Healing Signet special, change every heal in the entire game.

Healing Power should be a Bonus not a Requirement.

Healing Signet is fine, DEAL with it. I have.

Because TU has a cast time, down time, requires timing, is easier to time poison with, and is worse than healing spring…

Actually its better, because I can cure poison then use it to heal myself. Rangers also have more stability then Warriors do. As well as…

Stealth
Protection (They take less damage then warriors do…)
More Regeneration

Did you even see the tournament yesterday? Or are you just arguing to argue?

Did you also know that rangers get poison? Warriors don’t get poison.

Also, you never awnsered my question above, does that mean your agreeing with me?

Daecollo.9578:

honovi.7893:

Daecollo.9578:

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

kiwituatara.6053:

Lower the base heal, and make it scale higher with healing power

Agree.

Disagree. If thats the logic, apply it to every healing skill ingame.

Agreed, why should http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Troll_Unguent heal for a lot, AND have a secondary component that also heals the pet be more Hp/S then healing signet, which just heals the warrior and gives you a big giant target that says Hey I have no burst healing, I am Suspectable to all forms of burst damage!

Healing Power improves its heal by about 10-15%.
Healing Power improves healing signets heal by about 10-15%.

If you wanna make Healing Signet special, change every heal in the entire game.

Healing Power should be a Bonus not a Requirement.

Healing Signet is fine, DEAL with it. I have.

Because TU has a cast time, down time, requires timing, is easier to time poison with, and is worse than healing spring…

Actually its better, because I can cure poison then use it to heal myself. Rangers also have more stability then Warriors do. As well as…

Stealth
Protection (They take less damage then warriors do…)
More Regeneration

Did you even see the tournament yesterday? Or are you just arguing to argue?

Did you also know that rangers get poison? Warriors don’t get poison.

Also, you never awnsered my question above, does that mean your agreeing with me?

Yeah nice. Longbows rangers get stealth or you can get it from traits.
Yeah more regeneration. Run runes of dwayna as a warrior and your almost set.
And yes, thank you. Rangers get poison and warriors dont. I never would have guessed.
Rangers get stability because they have to use their elite skill…
Did you know (insert rhetorical question here)?

honovi.7893:

Daecollo.9578:

honovi.7893:

Daecollo.9578:

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

kiwituatara.6053:

Lower the base heal, and make it scale higher with healing power

Agree.

Disagree. If thats the logic, apply it to every healing skill ingame.

Agreed, why should http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Troll_Unguent heal for a lot, AND have a secondary component that also heals the pet be more Hp/S then healing signet, which just heals the warrior and gives you a big giant target that says Hey I have no burst healing, I am Suspectable to all forms of burst damage!

Healing Power improves its heal by about 10-15%.
Healing Power improves healing signets heal by about 10-15%.

If you wanna make Healing Signet special, change every heal in the entire game.

Healing Power should be a Bonus not a Requirement.

Healing Signet is fine, DEAL with it. I have.

Because TU has a cast time, down time, requires timing, is easier to time poison with, and is worse than healing spring…

Actually its better, because I can cure poison then use it to heal myself. Rangers also have more stability then Warriors do. As well as…

Stealth
Protection (They take less damage then warriors do…)
More Regeneration

Did you even see the tournament yesterday? Or are you just arguing to argue?

Did you also know that rangers get poison? Warriors don’t get poison.

Also, you never awnsered my question above, does that mean your agreeing with me?

Yeah nice. Longbows rangers get stealth or you can get it from traits.
Yeah more regeneration. Run runes of dwayna as a warrior and your almost set.
And yes, thank you. Rangers get poison and warriors dont. I never would have guessed.
Rangers get stability because they have to use their elite skill…
Did you know (insert rhetorical question here)?

No Warrior would run Dwayna runes over Melandru/Lyssa.

honovi.7893:

Because TU has a cast time, down time, requires timing, is easier to time poison with, and is worse than healing spring…

Sword+dagger..Anyone from rangers? 3 evades in one set and all of them on low cd..Easy access to Vigor inst a problem either.

Stop looking on small image like x hp/s and take the whole picture. If hp/s were all that matter warrior would be a best bunker by now, but for some reason he inst, or im simply wrong? Unlike other classes we taking everything on chest, and all we have for defense is:

Gs – whirlwind evade (gs is a crappy weapon for pvp anyway) 10cd
Shield stance – 3sec block. 30cd
Sword offhand riposte – block distance atatcks for 2sec, 1 attack for melee. 15cd
Mace mh counterblow – block single attack, 10cd
Endure pain – take 0 dmg from attacks for 4sec, 60cd.
Berserker stance – conditions cannot be applies for 8sec, 60cd.

Thats all we got from evades/blocks. Other type of defense we use is stuns. Thats what makes healing signet looking op and what the majority of ppl qq about. The Stuns. . U cant deal damage when ure stunned. Ask urself if u had troubles dealing with warrior that doesnt use stuns.

Also healing spiring healing allies and provides 15sec water field..do u really trying compare it to signet? No words man.

honovi.7893:

sinzer.4018:

honovi.7893:

So, here it is. Your chance to defend healing signet. I find this skill to be the most ridiculous skill in the game, yet warriors claim its necessary and not unbalanced.

Lets look at the base stats for warrior’s healing signet, keeping in mind that the warrior has the highest base toughness and health pool in the game.

Healing signet (pve): Base 392 health per second with a .05 healing power modifier.
Healing signet (pvp): same thing.

Now lets look at the elementalist, the class with the lowest base toughness and hp pool in the game:

I stopped here. This is a flawed analysis. You cannot compare warrior’s healing signet to an elementalist’s heal. Elementalists, unlike warriors, always have access to other healing abilities purely by switching to water attunement, regardless of equipment and traits. Anet atleast tries to balance elementalist’s 6 heal with those from their weapon skills.

I have said this before. The elementalist’s skill need either 30 in arcane or 15 in water to get that “ridiculous healing” and our dagger healing skill has a cast time. All the warrior needs to do his put his healing signet on.

No traits necessary for eles “Glyph” just spam ability’s I just point out that all the other crap added into the mix makes it crazy

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

Because TU has a cast time, down time, requires timing, is easier to time poison with, and is worse than healing spring…

Sword+dagger..Anyone from rangers? 3 evades in one set and all of them on low cd..Easy access to Vigor inst a problem either.

Stop looking on small image like x hp/s and take the whole picture. If hp/s were all that matter warrior would be a best bunker by now, but for some reason he inst, or im simply wrong? Unlike other classes we taking everything on chest, and all we have for defense is:

Gs – whirlwind evade (gs is a crappy weapon for pvp anyway) 10cd
Shield stance – 3sec block. 30cd
Sword offhand riposte – block distance atatcks for 2sec, 1 attack for melee. 15cd
Mace mh counterblow – block single attack, 10cd
Endure pain – take 0 dmg from attacks for 4sec, 60cd.
Berserker stance – conditions cannot be applies for 8sec, 60cd.

Thats all we got from evades/blocks. Other type of defense we use is stuns. Thats what makes healing signet looking op and what the majority of ppl qq about. The Stuns. . U cant deal damage when ure stunned. Ask urself if u had troubles dealing with warrior that doesnt use stuns.

Also healing spiring healing allies and provides 15sec water field..do u really trying compare it to signet? No words man.

I’m not comparing it to healing spring at all. He brought up troll unguent. I brought up healing spring.

Yes, i do have trouble with warriors that don’t use stuns because all they do is run away and heal for 400hp/s the moment they see trouble.

Daecollo.9578:

honovi.7893:

Daecollo.9578:

honovi.7893:

Daecollo.9578:

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

kiwituatara.6053:

Lower the base heal, and make it scale higher with healing power

Agree.

Disagree. If thats the logic, apply it to every healing skill ingame.

Agreed, why should http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Troll_Unguent heal for a lot, AND have a secondary component that also heals the pet be more Hp/S then healing signet, which just heals the warrior and gives you a big giant target that says Hey I have no burst healing, I am Suspectable to all forms of burst damage!

Healing Power improves its heal by about 10-15%.
Healing Power improves healing signets heal by about 10-15%.

If you wanna make Healing Signet special, change every heal in the entire game.

Healing Power should be a Bonus not a Requirement.

Healing Signet is fine, DEAL with it. I have.

Because TU has a cast time, down time, requires timing, is easier to time poison with, and is worse than healing spring…

Actually its better, because I can cure poison then use it to heal myself. Rangers also have more stability then Warriors do. As well as…

Stealth
Protection (They take less damage then warriors do…)
More Regeneration

Did you even see the tournament yesterday? Or are you just arguing to argue?

Did you also know that rangers get poison? Warriors don’t get poison.

Also, you never awnsered my question above, does that mean your agreeing with me?

Yeah nice. Longbows rangers get stealth or you can get it from traits.
Yeah more regeneration. Run runes of dwayna as a warrior and your almost set.
And yes, thank you. Rangers get poison and warriors dont. I never would have guessed.
Rangers get stability because they have to use their elite skill…
Did you know (insert rhetorical question here)?

No Warrior would run Dwayna runes over Melandru/Lyssa.

Couldn’t i say the same for other classes with lacking condition removal? No engi, no mesmer, etc…

honovi.7893:

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

Because TU has a cast time, down time, requires timing, is easier to time poison with, and is worse than healing spring…

Sword+dagger..Anyone from rangers? 3 evades in one set and all of them on low cd..Easy access to Vigor inst a problem either.

Stop looking on small image like x hp/s and take the whole picture. If hp/s were all that matter warrior would be a best bunker by now, but for some reason he inst, or im simply wrong? Unlike other classes we taking everything on chest, and all we have for defense is:

Gs – whirlwind evade (gs is a crappy weapon for pvp anyway) 10cd
Shield stance – 3sec block. 30cd
Sword offhand riposte – block distance atatcks for 2sec, 1 attack for melee. 15cd
Mace mh counterblow – block single attack, 10cd
Endure pain – take 0 dmg from attacks for 4sec, 60cd.
Berserker stance – conditions cannot be applies for 8sec, 60cd.

Thats all we got from evades/blocks. Other type of defense we use is stuns. Thats what makes healing signet looking op and what the majority of ppl qq about. The Stuns. . U cant deal damage when ure stunned. Ask urself if u had troubles dealing with warrior that doesnt use stuns.

Also healing spiring healing allies and provides 15sec water field..do u really trying compare it to signet? No words man.

I’m not comparing it to healing spring at all. He brought up troll unguent. I brought up healing spring.

Yes, i do have trouble with warriors that don’t use stuns because all they do is run away and heal for 400hp/s the moment they see trouble.

If they run away that actually means u won. Congratz u beated non stun warrior and actually proved me right that signet inst op..So i fail to see any issue with healing signet. Its not like they can run away, reset and come back without using signet. I did that many times with surge. So time to nerf surge i guess.

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

Because TU has a cast time, down time, requires timing, is easier to time poison with, and is worse than healing spring…

Sword+dagger..Anyone from rangers? 3 evades in one set and all of them on low cd..Easy access to Vigor inst a problem either.

Stop looking on small image like x hp/s and take the whole picture. If hp/s were all that matter warrior would be a best bunker by now, but for some reason he inst, or im simply wrong? Unlike other classes we taking everything on chest, and all we have for defense is:

Gs – whirlwind evade (gs is a crappy weapon for pvp anyway) 10cd
Shield stance – 3sec block. 30cd
Sword offhand riposte – block distance atatcks for 2sec, 1 attack for melee. 15cd
Mace mh counterblow – block single attack, 10cd
Endure pain – take 0 dmg from attacks for 4sec, 60cd.
Berserker stance – conditions cannot be applies for 8sec, 60cd.

Thats all we got from evades/blocks. Other type of defense we use is stuns. Thats what makes healing signet looking op and what the majority of ppl qq about. The Stuns. . U cant deal damage when ure stunned. Ask urself if u had troubles dealing with warrior that doesnt use stuns.

Also healing spiring healing allies and provides 15sec water field..do u really trying compare it to signet? No words man.

I’m not comparing it to healing spring at all. He brought up troll unguent. I brought up healing spring.

Yes, i do have trouble with warriors that don’t use stuns because all they do is run away and heal for 400hp/s the moment they see trouble.

If they run away that actually means u won. Congratz u beated non stun warrior..So i fail to see any issue with healing signet. Its not like they can run away, reset and come back without using signet. I did that many times with surge. So time to nerf surge i guess.

More like time to nerf mobility but that is a different story.

honovi.7893:

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

Because TU has a cast time, down time, requires timing, is easier to time poison with, and is worse than healing spring…

Sword+dagger..Anyone from rangers? 3 evades in one set and all of them on low cd..Easy access to Vigor inst a problem either.

Stop looking on small image like x hp/s and take the whole picture. If hp/s were all that matter warrior would be a best bunker by now, but for some reason he inst, or im simply wrong? Unlike other classes we taking everything on chest, and all we have for defense is:

Gs – whirlwind evade (gs is a crappy weapon for pvp anyway) 10cd
Shield stance – 3sec block. 30cd
Sword offhand riposte – block distance atatcks for 2sec, 1 attack for melee. 15cd
Mace mh counterblow – block single attack, 10cd
Endure pain – take 0 dmg from attacks for 4sec, 60cd.
Berserker stance – conditions cannot be applies for 8sec, 60cd.

Thats all we got from evades/blocks. Other type of defense we use is stuns. Thats what makes healing signet looking op and what the majority of ppl qq about. The Stuns. . U cant deal damage when ure stunned. Ask urself if u had troubles dealing with warrior that doesnt use stuns.

Also healing spiring healing allies and provides 15sec water field..do u really trying compare it to signet? No words man.

I’m not comparing it to healing spring at all. He brought up troll unguent. I brought up healing spring.

Yes, i do have trouble with warriors that don’t use stuns because all they do is run away and heal for 400hp/s the moment they see trouble.

If they run away that actually means u won. Congratz u beated non stun warrior..So i fail to see any issue with healing signet. Its not like they can run away, reset and come back without using signet. I did that many times with surge. So time to nerf surge i guess.

More like time to nerf mobility but that is a different story.

Anyways u just proved that healing signet is far from being OP and the thread was about it. Maybe its time to make a thread about mobility then? Moving on.

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

Scoobaniec.9561:

honovi.7893:

Because TU has a cast time, down time, requires timing, is easier to time poison with, and is worse than healing spring…

Sword+dagger..Anyone from rangers? 3 evades in one set and all of them on low cd..Easy access to Vigor inst a problem either.

Stop looking on small image like x hp/s and take the whole picture. If hp/s were all that matter warrior would be a best bunker by now, but for some reason he inst, or im simply wrong? Unlike other classes we taking everything on chest, and all we have for defense is:

Gs – whirlwind evade (gs is a crappy weapon for pvp anyway) 10cd
Shield stance – 3sec block. 30cd
Sword offhand riposte – block distance atatcks for 2sec, 1 attack for melee. 15cd
Mace mh counterblow – block single attack, 10cd
Endure pain – take 0 dmg from attacks for 4sec, 60cd.
Berserker stance – conditions cannot be applies for 8sec, 60cd.

Thats all we got from evades/blocks. Other type of defense we use is stuns. Thats what makes healing signet looking op and what the majority of ppl qq about. The Stuns. . U cant deal damage when ure stunned. Ask urself if u had troubles dealing with warrior that doesnt use stuns.

Also healing spiring healing allies and provides 15sec water field..do u really trying compare it to signet? No words man.

I’m not comparing it to healing spring at all. He brought up troll unguent. I brought up healing spring.

Yes, i do have trouble with warriors that don’t use stuns because all they do is run away and heal for 400hp/s the moment they see trouble.

If they run away that actually means u won. Congratz u beated non stun warrior..So i fail to see any issue with healing signet. Its not like they can run away, reset and come back without using signet. I did that many times with surge. So time to nerf surge i guess.

More like time to nerf mobility but that is a different story.

Anyways u just proved that healing signet is far from being OP and the thread was about it. Maybe its time to make a thread about mobility then? Moving on.

I think you are missing the point. Warriors have all this healing and they also have max base toughness + vitality. Read the first post. I simply used elementalist as a comparison because they have the least max toughness/health.

Daecollo.9578:

No Warrior would run Dwayna runes over Melandru/Lyssa.

wrong.