Guild Wars 2

I don’t know why there isn’t a reveal stealth ability somewhere. But yeah, I don’t have much trouble with thieves on my Ranger. But that’s because she is a bunker beast master, so if I was on something that didn’t have much defense I can see how thieves would be OP.

I was on my up leveled staff ele the other day and was downed/stomped in under 5 seconds. So that wasn’t fun.

On another note. Not everybody can be Pro at the game/has the time to learn/level every class. Just some food for thought.

I truly hope they don’t Nerf thieves. I’m a Toughness Guardian and I kill thieves 7/10 times if they stay and fight. But as soon as they go stealth with low health I take that opportunity to run until a few cool downs are gone or close to gone and repeat until I’m where I need to be. That’s if I don’t kill them before I get where I need to be.

I think thieves being able to stealth finish is the most aggravating mechanic in the game, makes me rage every time it happens.

Tammuz.7361:

I used to like turtles, then ANet nerfed them

Being as my guild name is Screaming Herd of Turtles…..thats a weee bit scary. Oh, and I still like turtles. hehe.

I like how the obvious Thief people say that Thieves can be hit out of stealth, when in reality they are able to move fast enough in stealth to get away from where the AoEs are going off at, which when combined with moves that remove conditions, makes them nearly impossible to knock out of stealth unless you have people covering a very wide range of terrain.

Just increase the timer debuff where a Thief can’t restealth, and force him to actually commit to a fight instead of getting cheap shots and running away all the time. It makes it impossible to do 1v1 encounters with them, and it’s especially hard for even decent sized groups to take down one of them. If they get a backstab off, fine, reward them for that, but having an option to chain stealth backstabs repeatedly and then stealth again to run away is just dumb.

PolishSausage.1279:

Just increase the timer debuff where a Thief can’t restealth, and force him to actually commit to a fight instead of getting cheap shots and running away all the time.

How many hit can a GC Thief take before being downed in an open fight?

loneknight.8425:

PolishSausage.1279:

Just increase the timer debuff where a Thief can’t restealth, and force him to actually commit to a fight instead of getting cheap shots and running away all the time.

How many hit can a GC Thief take before being downed in an open fight?

About 3x as many as they should.

Of course they are imbalanced , because they don’t have the same purpose!
Thieves are awesome for skirmish, fast killing dolyaks, etc…
When im away from my group and i see thieves approaching me, well i just fly away because i know i have no chance. Being smart is not always being a hero. Knowing your class means also knowing your weaknesses, knowing what you can or cannot do.

My first thought on this thread: boah, not again…

I fought yesterday a thief, and he was quite good, but he could not bother me for more than a minute… he ran… 3 ppl should easily be able to deal with a thief.

Stealth is a part of the game. The culling makes it more difficult, granted, but thieves aren’t that powerful. I think it is only a minority here in the forum, that with repeatedly posting threads like this one, only create a false image of the game balance.

A mesmer could yesterday hold a 3 man group of us longer in place that any thief did yesterday…

Do damage?

Most of the classes you mention can outlast a thief and even burst him.

Lets see..

Warrior/Guardian/Ele CC > thief CC
Warrior/Guardian/Ele HP > Thief Hp
Warrior/Guardian/Ele Though> Thief Though

All you need to do is chain cc a thief or burn their antibreak stun (Shadowstep) and you can kill easily.

I play a thief and if i play against a Good Warrior/Guardian/Ele.. I have a hard time getting them down.

But if we talking about Berzerk gear warrior/guardian/ele or horrible players. Thief just eats them all the time.

Trust me. Thiefs are far beyond Unbalance as having 30 Heals (guardian), amazing mobility/sustain/burst (Elementalist), 100blades/snipe shot(warrior).

P.S. i have ele, warrior, ranger and thief.

So we don’t get the whole “you defend your class”.

Stealth finishing is something i hope get removed.
I don’t find the stealth to be a problem on it own, the problem is stealth combined with one of the best mobility in the game and the initiate system.
It would be more balanced if when the thief enter stealth he/she would get a movement debuff and would have to use stealth in a more sneaky way to get out of the fight. As it is now they usually just stealth and suddenly they popup far away and are ready to attack again. I also would love if the thiefs got buffed on other areas so it’s possible for they to do more but when in stealth should always give some disadvantages.

Stealth finisher is fine.. cause as a thief you have a Lack of AOE.
All you can do is single target on a fight. You go for your kill and you plan on killing. If the group your atacking is bad or lack communication/tactics.. the “stealth” finish goes on like nothing. You get away with it.

If you actually go against a good group/guild. Oh trust me.. there will be a warrior hammering while 2 guys ress the down person. And thats how it should be. If your group/party/guild cant assist to help you while your down. It doesn’t really make a difference the stealth finish.
I think it’s a viable option for a thief. And anyone can stealth finish.. I use shadow refugee on down players n my party often finish them off without me (The thief) having to do it.

Its just a simple combo field. Just like any other in game.. Now.. If we wanna complain of culling and stealth.

Hello Mesmer Veil. How you doing back there.

xKedge.5493:

Stealth finisher is fine.. cause as a thief you have a Lack of AOE.
All you can do is single target on a fight. You go for your kill and you plan on killing. If the group your atacking is bad or lack communication/tactics.. the “stealth” finish goes on like nothing. You get away with it.

If you actually go against a good group/guild. Oh trust me.. there will be a warrior hammering while 2 guys ress the down person. And thats how it should be. If your group/party/guild cant assist to help you while your down. It doesn’t really make a difference the stealth finish.
I think it’s a viable option for a thief. And anyone can stealth finish.. I use shadow refugee on down players n my party often finish them off without me (The thief) having to do it.

Its just a simple combo field. Just like any other in game.. Now.. If we wanna complain of culling and stealth.

Hello Mesmer Veil. How you doing back there.

You don’t see the problem that when fighting against thiefs and he down someone it will take 2 people to ress the 1 person with 1 just swinging in the air , while if there was no stealth finishing you would see if the person is getting finished or not and would usually just require 1 person to ress?
All actions except running should break stealth imo.

Kormona.7156:

xKedge.5493:

Stealth finisher is fine.. cause as a thief you have a Lack of AOE.
All you can do is single target on a fight. You go for your kill and you plan on killing. If the group your atacking is bad or lack communication/tactics.. the “stealth” finish goes on like nothing. You get away with it.

If you actually go against a good group/guild. Oh trust me.. there will be a warrior hammering while 2 guys ress the down person. And thats how it should be. If your group/party/guild cant assist to help you while your down. It doesn’t really make a difference the stealth finish.
I think it’s a viable option for a thief. And anyone can stealth finish.. I use shadow refugee on down players n my party often finish them off without me (The thief) having to do it.

Its just a simple combo field. Just like any other in game.. Now.. If we wanna complain of culling and stealth.

Hello Mesmer Veil. How you doing back there.

You don’t see the problem that when fighting against thiefs and he down someone it will take 2 people to ress the 1 person with 1 just swinging in the air , while if there was no stealth finishing you would see if the person is getting finished or not?
All actions except running should break stealth imo.

Nope, cause almost any class on this game have a skill during downtime to get away from a finisher. If you can’t time yours at the right time. Then its really up to you.

Only one that have a hard time are guardian/warrior and ranger. Even though they all can hit you while stealth on their down skill.

And most actions do break stealth. Any skills that you use breaks stealth. You do realize that thief is about stealth. We have a lack of aoe/stability/CC. Our only weapon is using stealth on our advantage.

Trust me.. theres worst stuff like Ele being available to 4v1

P.s. Getting back to the topic. I can hardly see a thief pulling this off if the other classes know what they doing.

xKedge.5493:

Nope, cause almost any class on this game have a skill during downtime to get away from a finisher. If you can’t time yours at the right time. Then its really up to you.

Only one that have a hard time are guardian/warrior and ranger. Even though they all can hit you while stealth on their down skill.

And most actions do break stealth. Any skills that you use breaks stealth. You do realize that thief is about stealth. We have a lack of aoe/stability/CC. Our only weapon is using stealth on our advantage.

Trust me.. theres worst stuff like Ele being available to 4v1

Ofc i understand that you play a thief and are afraid of the nerhammer, trust me we all are. But as a ranger i don’t got a skill to get away from a finisher. Also i don’t think they should nerf the thiefs but they should nerf the stealth a bit by decreasing some of the movement while in stealth, remove stealth finishing and instead buff the thief in other areas like giving the thief some skills with stability and cc. Thief got almost the same amount of aoe as rangers.

Azure Prower.8701:

What can a thief do? Fire a cluster bomb every 5 seconds that does squat all? Man a cannon where they melt to AOE?

Truly Elementalists are balanced…

You mean, stand in a spot where they cannot be hit and take out enemy rams and catapults build upto the wall.
Aswell as use Smoke Screen to block Trebs firing at your tower/keep, just like Swirling Winds.
And Thieves are still better roamers then d/d Eles are, and nothing is better at sniping dollies, scouting or contesting keeps then a Thief. And lets also not forget the spammable blastfinisher, Clusterbomb.

Terrahero.9358:

Azure Prower.8701:

What can a thief do? Fire a cluster bomb every 5 seconds that does squat all? Man a cannon where they melt to AOE?

Truly Elementalists are balanced…

You mean, stand in a spot where they cannot be hit and take out enemy rams and catapults build upto the wall.
Aswell as use Smoke Screen to block Trebs firing at your tower/keep, just like Swirling Winds.
And Thieves are still better roamers then d/d Eles are, and nothing is better at sniping dollies, scouting or contesting keeps then a Thief. And lets also not forget the spammable blastfinisher, Clusterbomb.

i lol @ Ele not being better at roam than a thief. Ele can easily get away from a full zerg while thief has to sit on a shadow refugee hoping they don’t see it or they have a little brain on popping a CC.

Chain cc on the thief and thief gone. Trust me.
now smokescreen op and clusterbomb _
To bad clusterbomb got nerf hard a while back.. I rarely use that at all. Waste of energy.

If a thief goes down to a door n gets a ram while a zerg watches without dying to aoe. I had give that thief all my money. Brave man.

Catapult.. put a guardian on it? or pop.. i duno maybe sanctuary/necro fear/CC bot(hammer)/ele cc..

Catapult.. put a guardian on it? or pop.. i duno maybe sanctuary/necro fear/CC bot(hammer)/ele cc..You guys realize that thiefs really have no stability right?

Don’t complain about stealth and thieves, because most cases its stupidty ,not stealth killing you,

i find thief pretty easy to counter on alts

The problem with thieves is that stealth is completely broken on the side of the player being attacked.
Not only do they stay in stealth for ages and there is NO counter for that,at all,but when they come OUT of stealth they’re STILL untargetable and invisible for a whole second or more and then they stealth AGAIN before the game loads their model and their existence so I can target them so I literally can’t touch them.

I can’t AOE them because I only have two real AOEs that are any good and I don’t like using the longbow either,there is literally no counter for thieves as a warrior and the game lag isn’t helping either.

And people say warriors are OP.

xKedge.5493:

Do damage?

Most of the classes you mention can outlast a thief and even burst him.

Lets see..

Warrior/Guardian/Ele CC > thief CC
Warrior/Guardian/Ele HP > Thief Hp
Warrior/Guardian/Ele Though> Thief Though

Wrong. Ele has lowest HP + Toughness of all professions. The difference is most thieves run mostly glass canon whereas eles mostly run full PVT + clerics sacrificing ALOT of damage stats.

Thief is the only profession who can go mostly full glass canon without sacrificing to much defense due to stealth.

Oh wait, we shall use AoE, my fault… lol

If they would just fix culling and remove midcast steal, most of the complaints about thief would be gone. We would pretty much be left with complaints from the people who still think 100 blades is OMGWTFBBQRAINBOWS.

I was talking of Ele daggers.. and I can get around 14+stacks of might on ele with 3 times the survivability of a thief and faceroll 3-4 people while i cant do that on a thief unless they bad.

Culling only affects only affects on big fights unless your computer runs like a turtle. And i still don’t know.. why no one talks about mesmer veil.. lol

What kind of warrior do you play _
You can easily burst down a thief.. specially the horrible thiefs that go full zerk. I laugh at them on most of my characters.

Only thief build i find quite annoying and not because of the damage but the catch me if you can.. its pistol/condition.

I just spam laugh/sleep while they try kill me then i get bored and leave.

Azure Prower.8701:

Zerg at your door? Rain down fire and light them up! Get downed on the walls of the structure you’re defending? No problem! Vapour form hover away to safety!

Zerg at your door? Rain down deadly poison and blow them up with cluster bomb. Get downed on the walls of the structure you’re defending? No problem! Teleport out of the red circles to safety!

Azure Prower.8701:

Zerg planting down catapults from a short distance? Get your thief engines ready!

Step 1: Block with Smoke Bomb.
Step 2: Shadow Refuge run to their siege. Dagger Storm twirls of death!
Step 3: Survive.
Step 4: Stealth and run back into the keep!

Truly thieves are balanced too…

MarzAttakz.9608:

Azure Prower.8701:

Zerg at your door? Rain down fire and light them up! Get downed on the walls of the structure you’re defending? No problem! Vapour form hover away to safety!

Zerg at your door? Rain down deadly poison and blow them up with cluster bomb. Get downed on the walls of the structure you’re defending? No problem! Teleport out of the red circles to safety!

Deadly poison? Cluster bomb? …Teleport? lol

MarzAttakz.9608:

Step 2: Shadow Refuge run to their siege. Dagger Storm twirls of death!

I’d like you to meet two friends of mine. Mr. Melee and Mrs. Feedback.

Also if you go down before you reach the gate portal. You can’t “teleport” in unlike how Eles can hover in unopposed.

Who in their right mind places siege that requires a suicide run in range of the entrance portal anyway? And everything you say countering dagger storm has an equivalent counter to an Elementalist. Stop being so pig-headed and rather use the energy you spend complaining finding out creative ways to use your class.

My favourite profession to do siege bombing with me are thieves. What I’m saying is the two compliment each other well but you don’t see me asking your class to be nerfed.

Here’s the biggest problem with the majority of thieves: they only think in terms of “ME” and not in terms of “US”.

Thieves are beyond OP, the fact they have high damage plus high mobility plus high stealth and high escapability all rolled into one far out weights the fact they are “squishy”.
If they didn’t have the high damage the other stuff would be bearable!
When it comes to Risk VS Reward, Thieves are all reward!
Had 1 theif yesterday making 10 of us run round like idiots trying to stop him, he knew he was trolling us too as he was just stealth’ing when we attacked him and then appearing and literally bouncing round like a kangaroo in circles for the fun of it!
I’m a hammer warrior, didn’t matter what skills I used to lock him down nothing worked, he’d go invisible right in front of me, I’d immediately hit hammer skill 3 which is a stun and the next thing I know he was bouncing around miles away!
If being able to run circles round 10 people with no risk at all isn’t overpowered then nothing is!

They need to rethink about the Thief package as a whole, either swing the nerf bat at their damage to compensate for the rest of the stuff or take away some of the stealth’ing capabilities so they can’t ditch and run quite so easily!

Don’t get me wrong, I think they are a great class and have the potential for amazing scouting abilities and such, but they don’t play as a team due to the fact they can just go gank teams of people for the lulz!

AkiraZero.8514:

Thieves are beyond OP, the fact they have high damage plus high mobility plus high stealth and high escapability all rolled into one far out weights the fact they are “squishy”.
If they didn’t have the high damage the other stuff would be bearable!
When it comes to Risk VS Reward, Thieves are all reward!
Had 1 theif yesterday making 10 of us run round like idiots trying to stop him, he knew he was trolling us too as he was just stealth’ing when we attacked him and then appearing and literally bouncing round like a kangaroo in circles for the fun of it!
I’m a hammer warrior, didn’t matter what skills I used to lock him down nothing worked, he’d go invisible right in front of me, I’d immediately hit hammer skill 3 which is a stun and the next thing I know he was bouncing around miles away!
If being able to run circles round 10 people with no risk at all isn’t overpowered then nothing is!

They need to rethink about the Thief package as a whole, either swing the nerf bat at their damage to compensate for the rest of the stuff or take away some of the stealth’ing capabilities so they can’t ditch and run quite so easily!

Don’t get me wrong, I think they are a great class and have the potential for amazing scouting abilities and such, but they don’t play as a team due to the fact they can just go gank teams of people for the lulz!

Now tho asked you to chase him around with 10 ppl grp ? dont you have places to be with such force instead of chasing solo thief ? Just turttle up and move your way lol.

Karolis.4261:

AkiraZero.8514:

Thieves are beyond OP, the fact they have high damage plus high mobility plus high stealth and high escapability all rolled into one far out weights the fact they are “squishy”.
If they didn’t have the high damage the other stuff would be bearable!
When it comes to Risk VS Reward, Thieves are all reward!
Had 1 theif yesterday making 10 of us run round like idiots trying to stop him, he knew he was trolling us too as he was just stealth’ing when we attacked him and then appearing and literally bouncing round like a kangaroo in circles for the fun of it!
I’m a hammer warrior, didn’t matter what skills I used to lock him down nothing worked, he’d go invisible right in front of me, I’d immediately hit hammer skill 3 which is a stun and the next thing I know he was bouncing around miles away!
If being able to run circles round 10 people with no risk at all isn’t overpowered then nothing is!

They need to rethink about the Thief package as a whole, either swing the nerf bat at their damage to compensate for the rest of the stuff or take away some of the stealth’ing capabilities so they can’t ditch and run quite so easily!

Don’t get me wrong, I think they are a great class and have the potential for amazing scouting abilities and such, but they don’t play as a team due to the fact they can just go gank teams of people for the lulz!

Now tho asked you to chase him around with 10 ppl grp ? dont you have places to be with such force instead of chasing solo thief ? Just turttle up and move your way lol.

Would have been a great plan except the thief was following us while we tried to take back supply camps, like I said, he was trolling us knowing full well we weren’t going to stop him. (Although we did eventually when more people turned up and he panicked and back himself up against a wall and everyone laid into him).
The point still stands that no class should have that much yummy goodness rolled into 1!

AkiraZero.8514:

I’m a hammer warrior, didn’t matter what skills I used to lock him down nothing worked, he’d go invisible right in front of me, I’d immediately hit hammer skill 3 which is a stun and the next thing I know he was bouncing around miles away!

You must be part of the warrior minority who can’t stun a thief who stealth, as claimed by you, in close range. Or the other warriors I have met must be sPVP elites o.O

loneknight.8425:

AkiraZero.8514:

I’m a hammer warrior, didn’t matter what skills I used to lock him down nothing worked, he’d go invisible right in front of me, I’d immediately hit hammer skill 3 which is a stun and the next thing I know he was bouncing around miles away!

You must be part of the warrior minority who can’t stun a thief who stealth, as claimed by you, in close range. Or the other warriors I have met must be sPVP elites o.O

Touchy touchy, maybe he was just a better Thief than you
I’d like to say I knew what he was doing but someone said he was probably switching to shortbow and using (heartseeker?), whatever the skill is to get distance on us as soon as he stealthed.
As many others have said, AOE’s/Stuns and Knockback’s don’t help when a thief can so easily move out of range.

Not sure that I agree or disagree that stealth deserves a nerf. I certainly know that they annoy me, but a lot of things annoy me, and I also know that I will never be skilled enough to be consistently successful in 1v1 with any class. Anyway, that doesn’t mean that I can’t theory craft a few terrible ideas on how to “rebalance” stealth. Mind you, don’t flame me, because think these are probably all terrible ideas, unless they happen to be in the game already. Nor are these ideas intended to be combined. Just food for thought/conversation. You are encouraged to point out why these are all really dumb ideas.

1. Attacking always takes you out of stealth.
2. Taking damage always takes you out of stealth.
3. Reduce the amount of damage dealt while in stealth.
4. Increase the amount of damage taken while in stealth.
5. Reduce movement speed while in stealth.
6. Cause health drain while in stealth.
7. Limit the number of seconds a character can be in stealth over a given amount of time… Like Endurance, only for stealth.
8. After a certain amount of time in stealth, automatically go out of combat. (And allow other parties to go out of combat as well.)
9. Disallow boon gain/condition removal while in stealth
10. Combine #7 with some of the others to provide degraded performance after a significant amount of time in stealth, for example: if you have been in stealth for 5 out of the last 6 seconds, you take more damage.

Honestly, I think the only real chance of “balancing” if “balancing” is even needed is going to come out of the more complex and nuanced solutions like #10. Everything else is just a big, nasty nerf bat that would make the class a whole lot less fun for those playing it.

The only problem I see with thief is that they are a 1 person team-breaker. They can break and survive fairly easily if you keep moving. However, if you try to ignore them and not deal with them, they can pick your team apart 1v1. This is particularly true if your team is built to maximize interaction as a team, and not as a bunch of 1v1 fighters….. Actually…. That sounds like fun…. I might need to go roll a thief, now.

AkiraZero.8514:

I’d like to say I knew what he was doing but someone said he was probably switching to shortbow and using (heartseeker?), whatever the skill is to get distance on us as soon as he stealthed.

Infiltrator arrow & heatseeker break stealth. Based on my experience, the group of you miscalculated where he is heading

loneknight.8425:

AkiraZero.8514:

I’d like to say I knew what he was doing but someone said he was probably switching to shortbow and using (heartseeker?), whatever the skill is to get distance on us as soon as he stealthed.

Infiltrator arrow & heatseeker break stealth. Based on my experience, the group of you miscalculated where he is heading

Infiltrator arrow yes. Heartseeker only on damage.

JaironKalach.4938:

Not sure that I agree or disagree that stealth deserves a nerf. I certainly know that they annoy me, but a lot of things annoy me, and I also know that I will never be skilled enough to be consistently successful in 1v1 with any class. Anyway, that doesn’t mean that I can’t theory craft a few terrible ideas on how to “rebalance” stealth. Mind you, don’t flame me, because think these are probably all terrible ideas, unless they happen to be in the game already. Nor are these ideas intended to be combined. Just food for thought/conversation. You are encouraged to point out why these are all really dumb ideas.

1. Attacking always takes you out of stealth.
2. Taking damage always takes you out of stealth.
3. Reduce the amount of damage dealt while in stealth.
4. Increase the amount of damage taken while in stealth.
5. Reduce movement speed while in stealth.
6. Cause health drain while in stealth.
7. Limit the number of seconds a character can be in stealth over a given amount of time… Like Endurance, only for stealth.
8. After a certain amount of time in stealth, automatically go out of combat. (And allow other parties to go out of combat as well.)
9. Disallow boon gain/condition removal while in stealth
10. Combine #7 with some of the others to provide degraded performance after a significant amount of time in stealth, for example: if you have been in stealth for 5 out of the last 6 seconds, you take more damage.

Honestly, I think the only real chance of “balancing” if “balancing” is even needed is going to come out of the more complex and nuanced solutions like #10. Everything else is just a big, nasty nerf bat that would make the class a whole lot less fun for those playing it.

The only problem I see with thief is that they are a 1 person team-breaker. They can break and survive fairly easily if you keep moving. However, if you try to ignore them and not deal with them, they can pick your team apart 1v1. This is particularly true if your team is built to maximize interaction as a team, and not as a bunch of 1v1 fighters….. Actually…. That sounds like fun…. I might need to go roll a thief, now.

Actually thats completally false, if your team is build to work as team, not 1×1 heros, thief will never ever kill you. Full gc thief might down 1 of u, but he will Never stomp u. As I said, move close to each other and dont break formation to hunt poor thief down, couse thats what hes expecting lol.

Karolis.4261:

Actually thats completally false, if your team is build to work as team, not 1×1 heros, thief will never ever kill you. Full gc thief might down 1 of u, but he will Never stomp u. As I said, move close to each other and dont break formation to hunt poor thief down, couse thats what hes expecting lol.

Ah… Good point. Of course, there are plenty of weak teams that will want to prove their prowess by trying to kill the thief, instead of rezing their downed team member. But…. They get what they paid for, then.

Edit: snipped unnecessary duplication of my earlyer post.

People tend to make excuses and beat their chest claiming how they can deal with stealth classes bla bla bla. The reality is that stealth in and of itself is the most over powering mechanic in any PvP game, just like it is in war. Whether or not you can deal with stealth is irrelevant. The ability to fight unseen and pick and choose your battles at will has toppled world powers all threw out human history. Stealth in a PvP game is no different than in real life… You can not effectively fight what you can not see.

Stealth in any " game " that claims to have or want " balance " is an oxymoron. Stealth in any PvP game is just a bad idea because it can never be " balanced ". It’s either to powerful or totally useless and maybe one day the game developers will realize this and come up with a new concept to help those who suck compete and buy their games.

Killkill.7983:

I can’t AOE them because I only have two real AOEs that are any good and I don’t like using the longbow either,there is literally no counter for thieves as a warrior and the game lag isn’t helping either.

And people say warriors are OP.

I main a ranger and have several other 80 chars. the ranger and warrior are the only two i WvW. around 13k kills about 35% or so are probably from the warrior.

I find that the warrior has good counters to thieves as long as you aren’t a GC zerker build.

once i got rid of the GC build things got much better. i went with more of a balance build that leans towards the tank side. running mostly knights gear with zerk trinkets. i am now running axe/shield and rifle. that gives me 1 stun on each weapon swap, and i have another stun loaded in the skill slots bull rush or stomp. it did suck losing the mobility of the Great sword. makes it hard to get away from a zerg, but O well.

i don’t think i could play a warrior without a shield now. the trait that gives might when you block is pretty nice. the rifle is good against thieves cause we have a knock back and two abilities on it that will track the thief as long as you start the cast before he stealths (volley and kill shot) both do good damage. even with this more balance build i get 10k kill shots on low armor guys.

now when i run with my ranger there are 2 things i wish they would change about stealth.

1. coming out of stealth should give revealed debuff no matter what, not just if you damage from stealth.

2. remove being able to stealth from C&D on my pet. my pet is suppose to be there to help me not the enemy and the pet can’t try to dodge it.

just not sure how much these would hurt the thief.

Being a thief the only things I think my need to be “nerfed”, backstabs top end damage (along with kill shot and other stupid high damage attacks) and CnD becuase as of right now dagger is almost always the go to off hand. At the same time things like pistol whip and flanking strike need to be fixed, pistol whip is crap damage and the stun is so short you almost never get the whole attack off and flanking strike is supposed to be unblock able but you would never know this since the pathing on it sucks and you have a very good chane of just missing.

Loving the “it’s broken, reroll one”.

Main problem come from kittening culling, they hit you, but you don’t see them until the 2nd or 3rd attack. So basically they got 2 free hit instead of 1, given that those hit go from 3 to 6k, it’s just insane.

Thx Anet for that too.

bullkitten, our godlike elementalist was fighting 3 hacking thief’s ALONE.. hes beyond good tho.. anyhow, thiefs are made for 1v1 fighting so ofcourse its strong…

MarzAttakz.9608:

Who in their right mind places siege that requires a suicide run in range of the entrance portal anyway? And everything you say countering dagger storm has an equivalent counter to an Elementalist. Stop being so pig-headed and rather use the energy you spend complaining finding out creative ways to use your class.

My favourite profession to do siege bombing with me are thieves. What I’m saying is the two compliment each other well but you don’t see me asking your class to be nerfed.

Here’s the biggest problem with the majority of thieves: they only think in terms of “ME” and not in terms of “US”.

You do realize that ele often abuse the use of vapor mist while holding any tower. I get it when your on a wall dropping aoe. But whenever you can go in drop your aoes 10 feet from the gate and get away from it with vapor mist tru the door.. It’s kinda annoying.

I really don’t care on who kills the siege or not cause at the end of the day.. If you get away with a Zerg not punish you. It’s like meh but vapor mist thru the door is bs.

I wonder how much of this thread could be countered by people not rolling with no vitality and toughness. I’ll agree thieves are strong but so are most of the other professions in the right hands. I’d class ele’s as currently the most capable of the classes.

I don’t play dagger dagger its a lame spec and very easily countered but you can’t go into wvw with a glass cannon, no CC, no sun break(panic button) skill, and no aoe on one of your two weapons and utilities and expect to come out on top.

My counter to thieves at the moment is to just stand still and kill them in 2-3 hits whilst thye try and spike past my toughness and vitality, if their health disintegrates you know they’re a GC and you can out dps them with toughness vit gear on. If they aren’t GC then they are a good thief and its time to start dodging, cc, and using your tricks. if you lose to them as multiple level 80’s in a group you have to look hard at your current builds and playstyle and think about what its lacking.

Majik.8521:

Killkill.7983:

I can’t AOE them because I only have two real AOEs that are any good and I don’t like using the longbow either,there is literally no counter for thieves as a warrior and the game lag isn’t helping either.

And people say warriors are OP.

I main a ranger and have several other 80 chars. the ranger and warrior are the only two i WvW. around 13k kills about 35% or so are probably from the warrior.

I find that the warrior has good counters to thieves as long as you aren’t a GC zerker build.

once i got rid of the GC build things got much better. i went with more of a balance build that leans towards the tank side. running mostly knights gear with zerk trinkets. i am now running axe/shield and rifle. that gives me 1 stun on each weapon swap, and i have another stun loaded in the skill slots bull rush or stomp. it did suck losing the mobility of the Great sword. makes it hard to get away from a zerg, but O well.

i don’t think i could play a warrior without a shield now. the trait that gives might when you block is pretty nice. the rifle is good against thieves cause we have a knock back and two abilities on it that will track the thief as long as you start the cast before he stealths (volley and kill shot) both do good damage. even with this more balance build i get 10k kill shots on low armor guys.

now when i run with my ranger there are 2 things i wish they would change about stealth.

1. coming out of stealth should give revealed debuff no matter what, not just if you damage from stealth.

2. remove being able to stealth from C&D on my pet. my pet is suppose to be there to help me not the enemy and the pet can’t try to dodge it.

just not sure how much these would hurt the thief.

Problem with your request is that why punish for not backstabbing. When I wanna deal damage on big fight but I been focus I don’t wanna backstabbing get notice for the debuff n get kitten instantly.. It’s hard stalking on big groups specially when I’m hunting commanders which usually get 10 people babysitting them.

Also pets often run way to fast and sometimes appear out of nowhere, they often block my backstabbing with their big body.. So if thief could hit a ranger without the pet tanking.. Then sure.

Kormona.7156:

Stealth finishing is something i hope get removed.

While stealth the thief can take damage, knockback ecc… we don’t have access to stability while finishing… and what do u think for example for the Invulnerable Engi stomp with Elixir S?

Majik.8521:

1. coming out of stealth should give revealed debuff no matter what, not just if you damage from stealth.

2. remove being able to stealth from C&D on my pet. my pet is suppose to be there to help me not the enemy and the pet can’t try to dodge it.

I agree whole heartedly with 1 there should be a revealed debuff on all reveals from stealth and this goes for mesmers too.

number 2 I beleive should be countered by your number 1 suggestion, a lengthy 2-3 second reveal debuff should help with those pesky stealth thieves.

Jiiub.7135:

bullkitten, our godlike elementalist was fighting 3 hacking thief’s ALONE.. hes beyond good tho.. anyhow, thiefs are made for 1v1 fighting so ofcourse its strong…

What about the all classes can do everything? It’s ok that one class can do something a little bit better but they got way to much for 1v1. I would like them to be able to spec into other areas instead of just 1v1 builds, and the stealth should have some disadvantage imo. One solution to stealth could be that thieves would be visible if they come within 900 range, they could even have a circle around them to indicate the range like eve in lol. It’s the mobility combined with stealth that is the problem, oh and stealth finishing ofc:) Buff thief in other areas ofc so they can do more is what i think is needed.

xKedge.5493:

I was talking of Ele daggers.. and I can get around 14+stacks of might on ele with 3 times the survivability of a thief and faceroll 3-4 people while i cant do that on a thief unless they bad.

No matter which ele you meant, your statements are plain wrong. Ele is the profession with the lowest HP + Toughness. But ele is forced to compensate by running full PVT + clerics.

So pls stop pretending thief has so few HP + toughness. The reason most thieves have lower HP + toughness is because they run full glass canon. The reaons is thieves – as the ONLY profession – dont have to rely on defensive stats because stealth is such a powerful defensive tool without any counter (aoe is no counter to stealth because it does not break stealth).

Spacchiuso.5230:

Kormona.7156:

Stealth finishing is something i hope get removed.

While stealth the thief can take damage, knockback ecc… we don’t have access to stability while finishing… and what do u think for example for the Invulnerable Engi stomp with Elixir S?

I can’t see the problem with res stomps if you can stability stomp or quickness stomp.

if you are worried about being stomped in one of these various ways I’d suggest you address the issue of you being downed in the first place.

aimed at kormona backing up Spacchiuso

teg.1340:

(aoe is no counter to stealth because it does not break stealth).

thief pops on me hits me and restealths, cluster bom cluster bomb wait. oh there he is downed. its incredibly effective, as are channels, clones, pets and melee weapons which cleave.

saying that as I said a few posts up thieves need reveal debuff on every stealth reveal for 3 seconds.

A good thief is very hard to kill with a couple people trying.

Yes they are OP, Yes the game would be more fun without them.