Lol Daecollo you want something more for just a 2 k hp ? xD For me It can be good to have a trait like a “200 More vitality” in Honor trait-line instead of “Elusive power”. In this way if you want that Hp bonus You have to spendt 25 point in Honor.
No is exactly what would happen during a inc Lucentfir.When you charge you take some damage and you can be focused easily (A front-line soldier is the one who take the major damage ) You surely can have protection for damage mitigation and stability when you charge but at the same time you risk to be dazed-stunned or immobilized in just 1 second because there are mesmers that play a lot of times Null Field on first line , you will lost stability and you go down for the multiple attack.
I hit 3k-3,5k to heavy armored class and from 4,5k to 6 k on the others.When I charge with my ally we always stack might and buff and I can go easily to 4150 attack with 60% crit rate (thanks to warriors shout , 40% without it) and 57% crit damage with 3 k armor and 20 k Hp.I will do a screen later to demonstrate it (I have sigil of fire too on hammer so I doa little bit more aoe damage ) It’s late now and it’s time to go to sleep for me xD
Bash can you read what I wrote?I haven’t sayd that Ah is better in any type of gameplay but in mass pvp like wvw and maybe for PvE because we can survive a lot too and do more damage respect to your build, You have surely more regeneration respect me but I have somthing too , your dodge roll heals for 1329 mine for 500 but I have more HP for resist to a lot of players focusing me , I heal my self for about 1000 every shout plus I convert aoe 1 condition in boon and I loose 1 condition thanks to rune of the soldier , my virtue of resolve use is similar to yours 1850 vs 2525.I need just to switch from hammer to staff for a 6500 heal extra.I have one passive condition removal every 10 seconds + 6 condition that I can remove thanks to shout every time.If a Necro that know well how to play target you all the buff that you have with this “near perma-self your self” will make you cry and with you other 4 allies.At the end you are surely good with more regen than me , I perfectly know that but I repeat In a large group fight with that hp you will go down easily with no time of dodge-block ecc ecc. 5 person that Hit you at the same time (and in large WvW fight it’s easy) and you go down.I can hit you for 3.5-5 k damage with a mighty blow plus other 4 guardian with the same build of mine and you kiss the ground (without the counting aoe skills of other people). Try to moltiplicate 3.5 X 5 and you know the answer.
Lucentfir on the real WvW not always the bigger zerg win. With my guild (20 people are enough) we can easily kick a zerg of 40 with a good tactic and remember this:
a good guild with nice people with the right builds can pown easily bigger zerg if they aren’t well prepared.Every character , every builds we have are complementary and works surely better (everyone have something to do) respect people that think that WvW is all about zerging.
Lucentfir I play since beta with guardian , everytime people sayd that healway is better but everytime you post a roaming video.I have said that for roaming AH build suck!!You have just to imagine that your battle are just a skirmishes respect the real WvW, with your Hp in a large battle (like 25-30 vs 50) with just 1 error you go down, try to do a little bit real WvW.I’m not sayng that your build is not good or that you are not good with your guardian but simply that is more oriented for skirmishesthat zerg fight.
….. /facepalm Can’t tell of just trolling at this point, or is so obsessed with AH that there is no other build in the game for him.
Man I have never said that AH is the only build for a Guardian , I have only said that the AH build & the Cleric-support build are the only 2 usefull builds in large wvw fight.I think that I haven’t said something strange but just the true and who think different is just a pug in wvw and have really to L2P. Meditation build and the one posted on the video some post ago are surely better vs AH in 1 vs 1 and I know that , I’m the first one that think that AH build sucks in roaming or dueling but I play with my guild and we are always 15 or more and with certain numbers AH build shining especially if you have other guardians with you , always a lot of buff , condition always transformed in boon a lot of regen , protection , retaliation …
No Christos’s build is not more supportive then Ah build , the only thing that He do better is the amount of dodge-heal but he suffer a lot more than me condition damage , In a 20-20 or more he dies surely before of me ‘cause you can be focused a lot more than simply from 3-4 characters.People you just don’t have to be suprised of the videos of the other , they never post all the time that they loose…
Christos you haven’t demostrated nothing , the build you use is the same that I use on Spvp for the point holder , cleric items with a lot of dodge for a 1600-1700 every time with sigil of energy when you swap weapon for the 50% endurance recharge.Nothing new.I prefer to use AH build for wvw and yours for Spvp , MF build and your build are surely better for dueling but peolpe that say that guardian have a lot of viable builds are crazy…I just want to remember how are ours spirit weapons for example…
CptAurellian a little bit of Hp instead can help for that problem for my point of view.
Bash I have seen your builds but really I don’t like them , You have nothing more respect my AH build , maybe can be good for pve (but I think not better than mine) surely not for mass pvp.
Valor trait-line is not so great but if you play Meditations you need it too.It is one of the great limit of the guardians , If you need MF or AH you need 30 point in that and you need that extra 300 toughness If you want good resistance.The point that a lot of guardian talk about maybe is for that too , If you have not a lot of Hp you need MF or AH for more resistance and you lose 30 points here in a lot of build , in this way trait-line like Zeal or Radiance are snobbed.Have you ever thinked that with a little bit more of hp maybe a lot of people will try a lot of different builds?
A real AH guardian don’t use consecrations ‘cause the one that use that is the guardian-cleric (in our parties) , a AH guardian give reta aoe with the shout and simply clicking 1-1-1-2 with the hammer , so we don’t need the extra reta you have ‘cause we always give that.Honor is a selfish traitline?If the possibility to spam shout 20% faster , larger simbols for more protection (and damage) aoe and pure of voice (the trait that give you the possibility to change a condition to 5 person to 5 buff every shout you know that?) plus the extra healing of Selfless daring ( heal aoe simply ’cause you roll) is a selfish traitline you really have to learn something man. You want to do to much thing man , using consecration-using meditation – using a shout so the heal you take for your meditation is not the same of a guardian AH with 3 shout.The error that a lot of guardian do is that you can do ALL with the same build , you have to concentrate on something and doing that the best that you can because you don’t play alone .If you don’t play consecration another one have to respecc for doing that , this is optimization.
Bash you really think that with a meditation build you can support the same that a AH build?Meditation’s build are a lot more 1 vs 1 than mass pvp , you don’t give buff to other (like stability and protection for example that for front line soldiers are usefull).If a guardian in my guild play a meditation build for wvw I simply tell to him to change build.More AH guardian you have on front line and more % the team have to survive thanks to their boon , ask warriors If they like ours prot and regen when we give them .(want to talk about all the conditions that you change to boon aoe??) Meditation guardian win a AH guardian in 1 vs 1 , on mass pvp AH Guardian can make the difference , Meditation ones not.The only things a AH guardian need on virtue line is Inspired Virtue , the best 5 point you can spendt.
I really want just to say 2 things.Who sayd that a guardian have a lot of viable build have to try to play as a guardian.In wvw there are 2 viable build for a guardian , a full shout with AH (the one that I use) and the one that use some cleric item for a better support healing with the dodge.All the rest is really useless…why??’cause the low hp pool the guardian have.People that play full bunker use that build mainly (maybe only) in structured ’cause the only thing we can do well is to play as a point holder.
The people that said that warriors are not good on damage mitigation like guardians have to L2P , try to use a full shout warrior build… 10 k hp more that a guardian (20 k vs 30 k) , 1500 heal aoe for every shout (and 1 condition healed) with a lower recharge rate respect to a guardian and more damage respect us.The regen and protection problems? Warrior have them thanks to the guardians that are playng in front line with them so how can be our damage mitigation better now? A lot of people have really to learn to play , guardians give buff to other 4 characters , stop to see things like a 1 vs 1!!!
The Guardian of the Beta was surely strong-Op , now surely not.We have good utilities and a lot of way to heal but just that , our damage sucks compared to 3-4 class and playing a berserker guardian is just for fun because we have really few Hp , impossible to play seriously.We have not a ranged weapon that works well , just the stuff with a range of 600.In SPVP the only way that people need a guardian is just for point holder , for all the rest they all prefer other classes.In wvw guardian is good in mass pvp , surely not the best for camping because we have not a great mobility and we have no chance to win a good thief that play with sword -perma stealth because every time you are near to win they just escape out of battle , the best you can do is a 0-0 and if someone sayd “I have no problem with thieves” is because you have fought vs noobies , the same that I can kick too.
lol one of the strongest class of the game but strangely you can find in SPVP only a lot of mesmer , thief and ranger and in WVW a lot of thief perma stealth with sword…
I haven’t problem with my shouts , people that use other classes yes because they said that we play good only thanks to SYS (I never use it in WvW).The only things that I sayd is that in future if they want to change SYS so It can be good if all the other shout will be longer because our class is a boon based class.
Sandra try to think a moment , with SYS you take 7 boons with might and fury too but it is a personal shout , It is not with the Guardian style to help the others giving boons.For that I think that a shout like the one I posted can be a perfect one , you will have a little bit of damage too but it will help the other on the same time.In structured too SYS is nerfed with half the boons duration , maybe because they think that it is too strong for a single button skill.I don’t want that people think the same of me but sayng that with this changes guardian will be OP when we will loose some buffs it seems crazy.I agree that fixing the zeal trait would open more interesting build but surely not for wvw and I’m a wvw player.Guardian is a “defender” , is it clear for me and I play berserker only for fun (but a zerker guardian do less damage than a zerk warrior and I think that is fair enough)
I will never play a guardian with a lot of power , they can buff zeal traits a lot too but If I want to do damage I reroll a warrior.Do you understand the word “Guardian” ? A guardian have to help other with buff and resist to damages.Is like a Ranger that wanna play with sword …It is possibile but the ranger way is bow.A berserker guardian with meditation is one of the most uselees build for wvw , 0 support to people , not the best of damage respect other classes … It is good only if you play in solo.Can you understand the fact that in wvw organized guild want class with determinate build that can be usefull?I do 1500+ damage on crit with the staff on #1 with a 41% critical chance , I think that scepter need only to be fixed a little.
And take a look on “for great justice” shout of warrior. 25 seconds to recharge without the 20% faster shout trait , 8 seconds of fury + 3 stack of might for 25 seconds. The "Charge now " shout that I thought is not strong like that with a longer recharge time so I don’t really think that this is OP -.-
In wvw if you wanna play like a front-line soldier you need other traits , surely not Zeal ‘cause having more power is not the key to win ; the key for a good wvw character is be balanced.If someone wanna play something in Zeal you will lost traits that are too much usefull like AH or Pure of Voice.If people wanna play guardian like a berserker you have chosen the wrong characters -.- For the “no ranged viability” I don’t think exactly the same of you Sandra , Staff have only 600 of range but is really good.People say that the guardian is the most balanced class in the game so why in the previous patch they updated things like boonhate or the possibility of unblockable attack or the possibility to steal 2 boon with one skill?Maybe because they think that Guardians are “save your self dependant”?With my teorically changes we can prove not , my stats are good enough to play without it. I just want someone to tell me why with this changes a guardian will be OP if with “save your self” you have more buff and more duration with just one click xD
Guardian don’t need a improvement on the zeal trait-line.No one in wvw use Zeal so will be so useless every improvement on that trait-line!and please tell me how my teorical change can make a guardian Op if neither activating all 3 shout you have the same buffs and duration of “save your self”.“save your self”is noob in structured too (half the duration of normal) cause is strong, I thinked that my ideas was good for all or you are just “save yiur self” dependant?
I wanna start this Topic with the hope that a Dev will see all.
I think that guardian need some changes.I see a lot of people cry for our “save your self” or our buffs so I thinked some thing.Does the guardian really need “save your self”?With some little changes for me not.First of all I think that “save your self” can be replaced by something like “Charge now!” (20% fury and 3 stack of might for 8-10 seconds for us + allies with 35 seconds of recharge). “Stand your ground” shout is ok but need to be improved a little bit the duration , i think somethink like 8-10 seconds is ok."Retreat"is ok but 60 seconds of recharge (48 with the right trait) is a lot , maybe 48 untraited is better.
“Hold the line” is ok but need to be improved a little bit the duration , 8-10 seconds maybe is ok.With this little changes no one use 7-8 buff with just 1 skill but , if used well , we are well balanced.For the last thing I think that with less protection and regeneration (no more “save your self” in this case) maybe a better Hp pool is needed , something like 2000-3000 hp more.
A general fix to stability is needed , is not good that stab. is useless from immobilize!
Whit this changes I think that guardians can be happy without save your self and all the people that cry for our buffs with 1 click too.
Bacon If you take a look on my first post I’m talking about WvW , I’m not interested in fractal , I’m only on lvl 3 on that.I never talked about dungeon.Mobs are not like players -.-
Have I ever speak about boonhate or last patch? People have to stop to play a warrior berserker and say “guardian can resist more”. Want a build for the Warrior that can be very good in WvW?I can give you on pvt if you want , then you can tell me if warrior it’s so easy to be destroyed by a guardian
The only guardians you see in SPVP are the bunker , most of the people play thief-ranger-mesmer or necro -.- And yes , I play a Guardian , I have more than 15 k kills in WvW and I played a lot of different build.The best for WvW for a front-line soldier is the shout build with hammer.We can consider all the build for a Guardian if you prefer.
-spiritual weapon (really useless cause their duration is low and their hp too)
-condition damage (really a s_ _t )
-shout build (the most used in WvW)
-tanky build (the most used in SPVP)
-berserker (is it really a choise with our low hp pool??)
-consecration (can be good for support in WvW , for the rest is useless)
SPvP is another thing , isn’t comparable with the meta-game of WvW. If you play in the same way so is you that don’t know nothing about the current state of the things.“a guardian will wreck a good warrior”…maybe but I’m talking about mass pvp.Try 10 shout -build guardian (the most used in wvw) vs 10 shout -build warrior with hammer with aoe stuns ,every one that heal each-other for 1500 every shout and then you can see if warriors need others to be competitive.for me abolutely not
Warrior’s need help to get on guardian’s level?Warrior’s are better in PvE (a lot better) and WvW (not a lot but with hammer and a full shout build can resist more than a shout guardian) , Guardian is better in structured with a bunker build (the only available for guardian in structured , the rest is a s_ _t)
Warrior want protection too, what do you thing about it?Givin them protection too make them a lot stronger than us for my opinion in large battle like wvw. Our Hp pool is ridicolous for a melee class…
People I have more than 15 k kill on wvw done all with my guardian , I know how it works my class , I heal my self and allies for 500hp (not 1500 +) every time I dodge and look again…my self AND ALLIES. Bacon if you play a build with healing power surely is a tank build …useless in mass pvp like wvw (with 50-60 people vs other 50) because you do too much little damage.In WvW you need to be Balanced , with good damage mitigation but a little bit of damage too and for this warrior is better , I really don’t know if you really have done wvw or only spvp.Try a 10 vs 10 vs ten warriors with shout build and hammer with stun aoe and you will see how much a warrior is a better front-line soldier even without the same buff off guardian.A walking wall guardian in wvw is like a berserker one…USELESS!
Lol people have you ever played a warrior full shout with soldier’s runes? He can heal more than a guardian , like 1500 for shout (instead of about 1000 of the guardian) and loose 1 condition for shout with a less recoil of skills respect a HE -shout guardian.Shout builds are the 2 most used on competitive WvW.Warrior can use Mending for healing skills that heal more than shelter (that is the healing skill that guardians use more) and cure more 2 conditions.So in this way you have a lot of removing condition with this build.The different of Hp pool for this 2 classes (8 k hp of difference) is just for the use of protection that guardian have.So if you want protection too find me a reason why a guardian (that buff the other too with his protection , it is not a self buff!!!) don’t need more hp…
You want protection?ok so you can have the same hp pool of the guardian if you want it , I think that warrior can’t have more power – more hp – all the weapons and protection too… Well you can have it too but if Anet want that I think that they can delete the Guardian-class.
Guardian is still one of the ‘God’ classes, closely following the true god class, the Mesmer. However, the Guardian is ridiculously easy to play with an incredible power in both PvE and PvP, and has an arsenal of amazing utilities for WvW. Compare that with the somewhat stronger Mesmer, which is worse in PvE, and more difficult to play effectively, you have the winning class that is both easy and powerful. The other two ‘God’ classes, Elementalist and Thief, have been constantly on the receiving end of the nerf-bat, and whereas an Elementalist vs Guardian ends in a stalemate, the Thief has to sacrifice a lot to deal with the durability and boons the Guardian has. That again requires more skill and tada, we end up at the Guardian being easy, fun, and powerful in any situation. I imagine that once there are more counter-abilities to the Guardian, people will gradually start to move back to their favored class, after being forced to roll something else for the sake of having a chance in a fight. :-)
Guardian a “God” class? Maybe in the Beta version of Gw2 surely not now…Are you sure that you click on GW2.exe when you play?Maybe is another game …
When you use renewed focus you take damage of all conditions and you can be stunned too , I haven’t test yet if the signet of warrior bypass it , I hope not
I think that every-one that talk about the “healing of a guardian” have never seen a warrior with a shout build. I have a shout build for my guardian with AH and I Heal my self for 1.000-1.100 every shout , a warrior Heal 1.500 a shout for 5 allies with a lower recoil and with 8k more hp.At this point I start to thinking that If I want to play a “guardian” I have to do a warrior in this game (better hp pool , better healing shout for me and allies , no protection but more damage)The Guardian full bunker build is only for structured , a full bunker in wvw (and I’m talking about a competitive wvw) it’s useless.People hate full bunker guardian?Nerf protection for structured so but give a better hp pool to this class , I’v never seen a Melee class with less hp of a caster one -.-
