Guild Wars 2

Hopefully it is not like it came as a surprise for them. Generally when you treat people like small kids, they are going to act like small kids.

’Merica!

lol 61% world completion?

PvE whore! Might wanna try out pvp if you want a challenge.

I’m laughing myself to sleep every reset where deso meets vizu <3

So nearing primetime and 585 ppt.

And with a bit of luck, same matchup next week!

Looks like it is the bad week to make that offer. Try something more along the lines of:

Wanted a break from GW2? This is prolly the week for it. 440 ppt after what… 15 minutes? :P

Yeeeeaahh new gear rewards, this will make wvw funny again!

Oh god Arenanet oh god….

Lol anti stealth, it is useless for anything but cleaning out a keep for mesmers. The price + 4 second channel, who is ever going to use it? With the current price, nobody is going to let simply put them around at random either.

Well better than nothing, I assume. I still believe the incredible damage + poison is going overboard and incentivizing people to make the somewhat stale turtle situations even staler. Furthermore after only two weeks, people saying everybody having adapted to the arrowcart changes is just silly. After 8 months of wvwvw the builds keeps evolving, and I’m under the belief that when people actually start to adapt to the use of arrowcarts in world versus world, it will significantly slow down world versus world, more so than it has done so already.

People are just adjusting to new “meta-game”. Aka abusing arrowcarts in every way possible. Gogo FoV abusers and zoom hackers.

As for the people enjoying the AC patch, saying they kitten everything with arrowcarts. Ever stopped to think that maybe, when the enemy is more organized and have a larger number, you are actually suppose to lose? I mean, when they go through the trouble of organizing and gathering the numbers, which is a feat in itself these days, they should have the bonuses they work towards. It doesn’t make sense that 5 people are keeping 50 people away, if they where to do, it should be a challenge, not putting up bloody 5 ACs to start the neverending tedious and boring siege warfare.

Entropy.4732:

Riiight. 48 pages, 2300+ responses, over 30,000 views and it’s just a bunch of L2P noobs who can’t take the heat for you, huh? I don’t care what business you’re running but when that percentage of the consumer base is that riled up about what Anet thought would be a minor patch I’d say something is very, very wrong. Those are serious numbers.

Don’t forget the damage control trying to be done by Arenanet in the start, merging the topic daily getting rid og tens of thousands of views.

But yes, people who still haven’t seen reason when it comes to the arrowcarts. You guys be slow yo.

In all honesty wvwvw is not going to be complete until they make oxygen a scares commodity. Wouldn’t it be much funnier if your character could only breath in specific areas of the maps? Require a lot of tactic that most zergs are not able to master. So your character can only breathe while in keeps or supply camps and can only sustain himself 30 seconds outside. I believe that this would be a pro addition and the zerg killer that apparently all the unguilded people have been waiting for!

Jackie.1829:

^

I did supplyinfo as a commander to do a numbers count of 19 players. The group we killed was between 40-50 players by simply counting the number of exp ticks I get. We used absolutely 0 arrowcarts because we captured that keep originally and we dont use siege to defend. The end text was not for anybody in t7 but for the people who called VoTF bad for being opposed to the AC patch claiming that defending keeps vs zergs is not possible without siege, except it very much is. The defender always has the advantage, never the attacker.

But defending keeps without arrowcarts requires skill and teamwork.

Aint nobody got time for that.

Pryda.8257:

Even openfields battle are now “run to a keep behind AC” or “drop arrow carts” and build it faster than others, awesome.

In all honesty not everybody drop arrowcarts in keeps, several people seem content just dropping the arrowcarts in open field

Well… In all honesty the game was rather buggy before, I mean keeps flipped several times a week. At least they have fixed this issue with the traps.

I mean… The arrowcarts are obviously not enough. I mean totally like, rams got 10 seconds lifespan? Waaaaaay too much. It is much easier with this patch, just throw a couple of supply traps on the gate and all rams will have a -0 second lifespan.

So finally the problem with keeps flipping that has been bothered Arenanet for so long has finally been fixed.

Every new feature we see…. “It will help us kill zergs”. Changes are that you are zerging yourself, second of all, zergs are a part of the game, you either man up and become able to beat them, or you will die from them. Nice and simple. Learn to take on twice your numbers or organize people yourselves. the zerg problem is not going to be gone anytime soon, with a lot of the server now only having one commander across 4 maps, there will be zergs + all the additions they are making are benefitting the zergs as well. I’m dumbfounded.

At least zergs gets the job done, unlike those five man groups that apparently want the ability to kill the world, but instead stand inside a keep and become happy because they got 10 lootbags, well gz.

Uhm….. I feel something.

trappers trapping trebs takes treb-trapping to totally terrific topical tiers. Trapping the trading-post transfers traffic to trappers trying to trade traps to trebbers thirsting to trap trappers. The trebbers trapping the trappers will transpire tomorrow. trapping traps transfers transfer tax to trampy tranquilizing tedious team of wvwvw developers.

trap the trebs trebbing the traps.

I like this patch.

Okay, remember to put up traps so they can’t put up trebs trebbing your ac, ac’ing your rams, ramming the door. Unless ofcourse people put up traps, before the traps are being put up. Then the trappers will be trapped and when the trappers are trapped they’ll be susceptible to acs which is hopefully not getting trebbed or catapulted because the ac should have ac’ed those first.

hahahahahaha

Traps… it is a trap!

DevonCarver.5370:

Kaleden.9386:

Outfitter? You mean the NPCs selling PVP weapons/armor? If so, did you check just south of the home-point spawn location on Red BL – they were the last time I saw them (this was on Sanctum of Rall’s borderlands a few weeks ago).

I do wish banks were more accessible in WvW, but those are one of the few useful perks from upgrading personnel at a Keep. That said, IIRC, the banks were removed because people were queuing up for WvW just to access their bank, causing longer queue times.

That’s also what was the impetus for removing the crafting stations. The more time people spend in the maps not playing WvW, the longer the queues are.

You do realize there are players just standing afk autocasting heal right?

Heijincks.9267:

That said, we haven’t seen what they want to make WvW, so all this talk about permanent stalemates and slow WvW is inconclusive.

Problem is, that Arenanet haven’t said what they are going to do, and they do very little to convey what the entire point is of world vs world – From my and my guilds point of view, it definitely seems like they are not conveying any point regarding world versus world, because they have no point or no clue when it comes to world versus world. The Rambo balancing and random buffing of the arrowcarts which nobody has complained about for 8 months really tells us, that they have no clue and most likely the worst is yet to come.

Well, I guess they could be conveying a point towards having long drawn out siege battles. This however is not the direction to go for in my eyes. The game is too casual, the maps are to small and the mechanics to simplistic to make any kind of convincing siege warfare. I have to join the group that says: “Trebbing aint fun yo”.

Just FYI to the people who is starting to notice the change arrowcarts are bringing to wvwvw. This is only the beginning, imagine when people have actually adapted to the use of arrowcarts + knowing all the placements + all the traits – more damage, poison etc. If you feel the matchup is getting stale now and the keeps are hard to cap, just imagine what they are going to be in a couple of weeks or even a month. Stalemate Central.

Don’t worry, Devon has stated they have plans in motion fixing this issue.

Just like they fixed siege and zerging.

HEYOOO!

LordByron.8369:

Kebab.4013:

Omg finally unbanned, wuhuu! Just wanted to add a little quote from Jonathan Sharp a game designer from arenanet:

We want to avoid “whack-a-mole” style balance. HUGH increases and HUGE decreases lead to meta instability, and thusly, we try to make multiple small tweaks rather than putting in massive changes that we have to later correct.

!

As an ele/mesmer player i will put that declaration near

“Here’s what we believe: If someone wants to play for a thousand hours to get an item that is so rare that other players can’t realistically acquire it, that rare item should be differentiated by its visual appearance and rarity alone, not by being more powerful than everything else in the game. Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games — we leave the grind to other MMOs.!”

Well the quote was actually from their view on structured pvp and class balances. So yes you as elementalist/mesmer sure got your mole whacked quite badly last patch. But hey, at least you didn’t take such a hard blow as wvwvw did with the arrowcarts

Omg finally unbanned, wuhuu! Just wanted to add a little quote from Jonathan Sharp a game designer from arenanet:

We want to avoid “whack-a-mole” style balance. HUGH increases and HUGE decreases lead to meta instability, and thusly, we try to make multiple small tweaks rather than putting in massive changes that we have to later correct.

So when are they going to live up to that, and not randomly buff arrowcarts by over 100%? I think the whine is rather week compared, imagine any other mmo or mechanics being more than doubled in effectiveness after 8 months of remaining the same.

Whack-a-mole indeed!

Apparently saying goodbye was a “I quit” thread, so yeah, so far the arrowcarts has not done much good.

Lance.5892:

Johje Holan.4607:

It doesn’t actually seem that powerful to me. The most I was hitting for on a regular AC with no mastery was 1245. But mostly in the mid triple digits.

And to tell you the truth, I saw a lot of offensive AC’s too.

And the zergs in my match actually split up last night! It was fun.

http://imgur.com/w0LVRTA

1) try a superior
2) factor in wxp rank ac upgrades

I do have the upgrades and superiors!
roughly 2,5-2,6k hits. And for some reason 1 out of 10 hits for 3,1-3,2. Must be lowbies :P

So…..

From patch the 26th of March
to patch the 30th of April.

something happened that required arrowcarts to be buffed with 100%+

Anybody got some ideas?

Lance.5892:

Guys guys guys, i finally understand! ANet wanted to stop server side skill lag, thus by implementing superpowered ACs and unstoppable trebs, people are useless, won’t bother using skills and all skill lag is forever gone!

Close, but wrong. They are making sure there is no skill lag by making people not joining world vs world.

I used to be an adventurer like you, until I took an arrow to me knee, capillaries, veins, eyelash, buttocks, cornea, musculocutaneous nerve, meniscus, metacarpus, metacarpal, backbone, middle-finger, marrow, eyebrow, carpus, ligament, collar-bone, cerebellum, thigh, lips, belly, medulla oblongata, bronchial-tube, tendon, molar, leg, middle frontal gyrus, toes, tissue, labia, lungs, cerebrum, ears, mandible, liver, opisthenar, vocal cord, vessels, quadriceps, brain, ovary, body, bones, thumb, cartilage, tibia, back, bellybutton, epidermis, vomer, cavities, eyes, medial plantar nerve, organ, tear duct, cells, limbic system, little-finger, occipital lobe, calf, vulva, triceps, metatarsal, talus bone, mammary, lymph nodes, limb, mind, throat, mouth, muscles, earlobe, blood, biceps, teeth, vitreous humor, eyeballs, leukocyte, cranium, elbow, torso, Chromosome, tubes, tongue, breast, chest, cheek and lumbar.

Anatolian Turk.4057:

But….it all depends who has the bigger blob. The server with greater number will eventually take down the tower or keep but it will take a bit longer than pre patch days. But re taking the lost tower/keep for smaller servers is going to be impossible now.

PS this isnyt going to stop the karma train but slow it down.

+1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1

Though karma trains? Who are these karma trainers that keep being mentioned?
Our members are stockpiling millions of karma each currently and there is nothing to use it on except accessories if making alts. People are not playing world vs world to get karma, they are playing world vs world for the fights.

With the AC buff, there won’t be any. There will be either trebbing or running away from arrowcarts.

evildan.8260:

If there’s oil up and manned you take it out before getting a ram going.

If there are manned ACs that you can’t pull the users off and gank, or AOE to death, then you back off and get some cats or trebs up.

This is basic siegecraft stuff.

So you go in, kill oil and arrowcarts… to build trebs? very basic siegestuff lol.

I guess it might be a divine intervention tbh.
One day after the AC patch, it is 20 degrees outside and not a cloud in the sky.

ty god for showing me the way to redemption!

In all honesty. The people that enjoyed long out siegefights, shouldn’t they have left now after 8 months?

My mind has exploded. -.-

evildan.8260:

Anything that cuts down on blobs derping down gates is a good move.

It’s like some people here have never heard of cats and trebs to get into places…

There are some people here not knowing what is fun about playing wvwvw…

Lol did Arenanet not intend fast caps? I’m sorry, why haven’t they implemented this fix let us say… 8 months ago? Ofcourse they are counting on keeps flipping. The maps are too small and the game to casual for any “real” siege warfare.

They only did it to fix the zergwhining issues, nothing more. Unfortunately they did so without thinking of the consequences.

Let’s think shall we?

What is funniest:
Fighting a wall and siege, or fighting actual players with abilities? – I think we all know the answer.

Which of the options are the changes leading the game towards? – I think we all know the answer.

The worst part is that this is, for once, an actual slippery slope. The more arrowcarts, the less people will be needed and do not want to come, the less people that wants to come to wvwvw decreases, etc. etc. Keeping a somewhat healthy population in world vs world is key to its survival. This injection of arrowcart buffing has the ability to possible make things irreversable within a couple of weeks.

I mean.. Mention me one other game, where after 8 months of no change what so ever, suddenly a major part of the game is increased by way more than 100% effectiveness. After 8 months of meta gaming and working out strategies etc, how the heck do you honestly think that this could be a healthy journey to depart upon?

My my… I knew the intelligence and foresight level is low on forums, but I had kinda hoped for developers to at least consider it twice before implementing.

I’m pretty sure me and my guild, VoTF, have played GW2 more than the developers and above the normal average, + having over a decades experience with this kinda pvp in a myriad of other games to realize that this is something that breaks a game.

Bllade.1029:

Honestly, I can imagine the pug zergs and people who run in these zergs having a huge issue with this. In most tiers, trying to coordinate a pug zerg is like trying to teach a blind man to read.

For those of us who run with our guilds, coordinate, and are much more tactical. This is a very much welcomed addition. Long time coming honestly. Now, it FORCES people to think and listen.

Commanders will have to become more than just “follow this blue thing, kill anything red.” They’ll have to actually command. Of course this is different depending on what tier you’re in.

I like it personally. Good call Arena Net, and thank you.

Yeah screw pugs, why are they allowed to play this game? They are way beneath us.

Also if your commander har trouble getting anything done before, he was a pretty bad commander. Now it’ll be even worse. Only two commands in the vocabulary:

- Avoid red circles!
- Build arrowcarts to make red circles!

Dawdler.8521:

morrolan.9608:

I take it you don’t play on a T1 server then.

Has it ever occured to anyone… That if T1 servers cant adapt to the new arrowcarts, they dont deserve to be in T1 and will inevitably drop?

Yes let tier 1 drop and let the people who desire stagnant and borring fighting step forward.

That will keep the game alive.

ps. it doesn’t.

fix the arrowcarts.

Granted you noobs that are defending arrowcart buff, I can understand you. You are noobs you will never able to use the arrowcarts for anything useful anyway.

It is when there is actual fight between respectable opponents it will simply get decided between the usage of arrowcarts.

guildwars, game title in itself is missleading. Should be called nolife-spvp-and-acwars2.

Wvwvw was the closest thing we came to GvG in guildwars, and now it is going to be player versus who cares.

Sometimes I’m wondering whether or not the unguilded people supporting Arenanet in this thread is actually Arenanet themselves making troll accounts.

The patch would suggest that this would be the kind of humor they would use.

Trashbob.2743:

hf…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEml669YJHY

Lol… They were so close at getting up.

Atleast that issue will be fixed when people get their world xp for more damage, larger area, poison etc to prevent all hope

Yes, good job moderators, I salute you!

“lortnoc egamad”

Changes of developer admitting they have no clue?

Chances low!

zepp.4109:

Where is Devon? We need a feedback from the staff.

I think we do know their rationale behind their actions tbh.

And with them looking through these threads, I think we know why that are not coming with a statement why they did it – they know we are not gonna like it

In all honesty.. I don’t think it would be unreasonable for Arenanet to explain the rationale behind this patch that “came” out of nowhere.

They could easily answer silly questions regarding wvwvw gear and pointsless stuff. But commenting on possible gamebreaking mechanics… no dice.

They can obviously do real time editing of the post though.

JaredKincade.9761:

You cannot starve supply. They port to their keep in EBG and get it there. Or start siege razer on another map and get supply there. You CANNOT STARVE SUPPLY. The trebs your building cost 100 supply each, their mortars that you cant see to hit are FREE.

What both of these changes together means is there are now no options of taking a fully upgraded keep UNLESS IT IS EMPTY.

Everyone who is saying “L2P and try different strats” go try them yourself. Flip that tag on, give it a shot.

This change encourages large zergs (to hold the supply for the 4 trebs you need in hopes of killing their treb/mortars first), and encourages PVD (taking the points at night when no one is in the tower and you can build 4 AC to keep anyone from getting in the door (Except of course keeps with a waypoint, aka, free access to supply from another map).

The most thought provoking aspects of this game (fighting thinking people) have been diminished in this patch. Now we just wait out the other team to see who leaves their towers first.

I agree with you fully except on one topic. You say the people defending this change needs to go in and fight to find out. Well they are not going to get a fight, because nobody will be playing :P

lettucemode.3789:

Several? Why are there so many trebs defending a tower of all things? And your statement “they will always take out your treb or catapult” is misleading, it assumes a lot:no human error, perfect scouting by the enemy given the long range of trebs, etc.

Under normal circumstances, it’s not hard to figure out. They have a limited amount of supply and you don’t. Build trebs simultaneously in multiple locations around the tower, close to max treb range. Once those go down, build more. Keep doing this and defending the spots until the defending trebs are down. Then move in closer and set up the next round of siege. Prevent more siege from being carried to the tower with small groups.

EDIT: I’m gonna be gone for a while, got a meeting here at work for the next 1.5 hours. Will try to respond to any other comments when I get back.

Bad scouting? You do realize there is this thing called viewdistance right? You can see when a treb goes up. Ofcourse you will be able to take down their one treb, if you spend 3-4 hours building your own from the 20 supplies you get from the supply camp every minute or so. So after 10-11 tries to get their treb down, it goes down….. But hey wait… what exactly prevents them in getting supplies in? Forcefield? Vodoo? Do you got 30 arrowcarts in 13000 range from the tower a circle around the tower preventing stealthed people running past? Even more likely, you couldn’t prevent normal people from running in the first place.

So you sit here, taking hours taking their siege down, but they will continue to build more and repair, nothing can possibly prevent them. Don’t say small groups because then I know you haven’t been in wvwvw. So you sit here for 12 hours taking our treb.

No you cannot put in close quarters, because guess bloody what, AC enmasse. You CANNOT get close to a well sieged tower.

Your way of thinking amazes me….

and another thing…

HOW COME THAT EVERYBODY IS ON AN OUTMANNED SERVER AND WANTS TO BREAK THE BLOB? SURELY NOT EVERYBODY CAN BE ON AN OUTMANNED SERVER.

Daemonne.5018:

I see more trebs being used and mroe catas.

Anti Treb you say? oh, well thats good cause we took your camps and can build multiple trebs to take yours and your walls down.
Oh your ACs were on those walls? Sorry I’ll aim better next time.
A calssic siege is about having the resources to outlast the other group. Running a target out of supplies until they can no longer reinforce is what it will take.
Range down all the ACs on the walls and they will run our of resources to replace them.
I don’t believe the ACs will stop zergs from happening. Large groups will be able to carry the supplies needed to siege a tower/keep so they will still be more desirable. The small groups will be relegated to camps and yak slapping.
I do see a rise in treb purchased…I’m taking out stock when I get home :-)

If you think this is what is keeping the game alive….

R.I.P
Guildwars 2
Summer 2013

“Denied their own faulths until the end.”

lettucemode.3789:

Think about every single time you have seen a group of people take a tower or keep. What do they do? They stand directly in front of the door and beat on it, or they group around the catapults that are attacking the door. They just stand there, attacking the door. Cast things on the walls if there are defenders up there. Stand around, hit the door.

Everyone has been stuck in the same mindset about how towers and keeps are taken for months and months, which is run up to the door, drop rams, and plow on through. Now that you can’t do this anymore, the complaints roll in.

How to take a tower now? You need siege to take out the arrow carts. “But they will just build counter-siege!” They do not have infinite siege! You do, because you are the attacker and they are trapped inside. You need to starve them out. How you do this is:

-small group to man the siege that is destroying the arrow carts and other siege
-small group to defend the siege man-ers
-small group to secure nearby supply camps so you can keep building more siege
-small group to defend the supply camps so the enemy can’t build siege
-small group to cut off reinforcements to the tower so they can’t bring in supply from elsewhere

Hey guys, look at that, Anet solved the zerging problem! Which you’ve all been asking for, for months!

As defenders I would prolly do this:
-medium group to kill the siege and their guards
-redirect medium group to kill the small groups running from and in the camp and grab supplies.
-redirect the medium group to kill the last small group running around being idiots.

Hey guys, look at that, Anet has made the problem even worse! Which you’ve all been asking for, for months!