The real question is, does this change also affect keg brawl?
Showing Posts For Kermit.3601:
If you go to the gw2 homepage, the rotating spotlight displays the dates for Wintersday as 12/14 – 1/3. But if you look on the right bottom, the little Wintersday panel shows the dates as 12/14 – 1/13. I assume right panel is wrong.
So some people might consider this evil, but I was playing the Ascalon fractal which had a WvW feel to it. After getting downed it almost felt natural that they should try and finish me. I’ve liked how anet has in cases blurred the line between PvP and PvE mechanics. I think it would be a neat mechanic if a boss actually did try and finish you. both neat and evil, but mostly neat.
OMG! I was just thinking the same thing. I just read an interesting blog/article about this idea of content locusts. The problem with forums is it becomes a venue for a loud vocal minority. The difficulty with not appeasing the vocal minority is that there opinions greatly influence others, how they play the game, and prospective new players.
http://morgaren.hubpages.com/hub/Content-Locust-How-They-Change-The-MMO-Landscape
Surveys are great for both getting feedback, and publishing results to the community. That way the next time someone says in a forum, “most players feel we need X…” it’s either valid, or you can point them to surveys that refute their claim. Now a days, people throw around number and facts based on anecdotal evidence.
I think this is very subjective, and I think they will continue to add features across all aspects of the game to cater to the different audiences. Ascended gear is just one part of a very large set of updates.
They are still staying true to the world storytelling aspect of GW2 with both the Mad King and Lost Shore patches. There are full blown stories coming out with these patches. I do see your concerns, but am not quite a part of the sky is falling group. I guess time will tell.
To preface, I break down PvE into 2 categories. World PvE and Dungeon PvE. Dungeon PvE being self explanatory and world PvE mainly being the dynamic events, meta chains and general exploration.
I love the idea of the dynamic world environment. It’s what drew me to GW2. Having done dungeon progression in a bunch of other games, that aspect of the game interests me less. Anyhow, dungeon PvE isn’t the topic of discussion, that aspect is getting a lot of love.
Second disclaimer: I’m very happy with the game, and completely happy playing the way I do. I like exploring. I did the Bria event in Iron Marshes 3 times in a row cause I liked the story. But since everyone else is asking for more stuff with regards to other aspects of the game, I thought I would throw my 2 cents in and lobby for the part of the game I enjoy most.
I think it would be cool to have more world PvE specific rewards. Some thoughts on what those rewards can be:
Area sets: For example a Kryta set where completing DEs in kryta give you a token that can be used towards a specific skin.
Activity theme sets: Jump master set. You’ve ton a ton of jumping puzzles. Why not be able to sport a specific skin showing that off?
Meta event sets: For example a Temple assault/defense set. You’ve completed these meta chain events countless time and again.
Those are just some thoughts. I think the content updates are great. I love just “playing” the game, but since I spend the majority of my time leveling alts, and just exploring the world at hand, I thought I’d throw my hat in the ring and lobby for a little world PvE reward love… why not?
Oh and as a bonus, much love forever if keg brawl gives you specific town cloths rewards.
It was working today on Isles of Janthir. One of my favorite dynamic events when it’s not bugged.
What I really want to see is our guild be able to spend an afternoon playing keg brawl as a social activity. Similar to a pickup match at the park, we’d pick our teams, and have fun playing with folks that we know. Would also be nice to have the flexibility to choose different team sizes, i.e. 5v5, 4v4, etc.
Really just a way to accommodate groups of people looking to hang out and do some activity together.
So then the content isn’t geared for people that think the repair cost is a barrier to playing the game?
I realize this is a fine line, perhaps a slippery slope. Are you really that invested in this subject, or more interested in winning a forum debate? I’m curious, is a suggestion with the hope of encouraging people experience more challenging content, and even with the hopes encouraging Anet to develop more difficult content that misplaced?
The problem is if you take out repairs graveyard zerging will get even worse. Atleast right now they will hit a point where they must stop the dungeon because there naked with no coin left.
I think Nurvus.2891 had some good suggestions in curbing graveyard zerging. And truth is, in the case of graveyard zerging, I would like to see a solution that completely prevents it rather than one that just deters it.
While i agree it would be nice if it was gone the one fundamental design about GW2 is its made so EVERYONE can complete everything. In cases graveyard zerging is what it will take for your very bottom of the player base to get threw it. But in truth graveyard zerging doesent affect you unless your running in a pug thats just plain horrible. From personal experience i’ve yet to have one of these groups. What sets people apart is there skill. Sure they may be able to do it but they wont finish it any where near as fast as you and you will come out ahead at the end of the dungeon.
Yeah, and I really wasn’t trying to start any sort of heated debate. The truth is, in my mind, armor damage is a minor annoyance and for me personally, it isn’t a deterrent. But my mind got to turning and the thought popped in my head: “What REAL benefit do we get from having Armor Damage in the game and could removing it possibly improve the game?”
Which led me to the statement where Anet has said that explorables are geared to be challenging for pugs, and moderately difficult for organized groups. I would like to see them intoduce MUCH harder content. Stuff that you can’t PUG. (side note: not necessarily more personal rewards, but perhaps significant influence/guild rewards to encourage guilds to work at the content)
I was a big fan of Demon Souls. I think any real challenge will be preceded with lots and lots of failure. So I got to thinking, and formed the opinion that it would be more awesome to have super challenging content where dying was an expected part of the learning process both in learning nuances of your profession, and learning the challenge mechanics (I’m being generic as I believe the philosophy applies to more than dungeons) and remove or modify the armor repair mechanic, than set an expectation that all challenges are doable with moderate loss to gold via the repair mechanic.
I actually like that there have been so many comments on this. I personally think it’s an interesting thought to ponder.
TL;DR: Harder content with less failure penalty is better than easier content with acceptable failure penalty that can be mitigated.
So then the content isn’t geared for people that think the repair cost is a barrier to playing the game?
I realize this is a fine line, perhaps a slippery slope. Are you really that invested in this subject, or more interested in winning a forum debate? I’m curious, is a suggestion with the hope of encouraging people experience more challenging content, and even with the hopes encouraging Anet to develop more difficult content that misplaced?
The problem is if you take out repairs graveyard zerging will get even worse. Atleast right now they will hit a point where they must stop the dungeon because there naked with no coin left.
I think Nurvus.2891 had some good suggestions in curbing graveyard zerging. And truth is, in the case of graveyard zerging, I would like to see a solution that completely prevents it rather than one that just deters it.
So then the content isn’t geared for people that think the repair cost is a barrier to playing the game?
I realize this is a fine line, perhaps a slippery slope. Are you really that invested in this subject, or more interested in winning a forum debate? I’m curious, is a suggestion with the hope of encouraging people experience more challenging content, and even with the hopes encouraging Anet to develop more difficult content that misplaced?
oh yeah, armor repairs are also a way to punish graveyard rushing. if you just graveyard rush through the entire dungeon, you’ll not only take like 20 times longer to beat the dungeon, but you’ll lose money instead of winning.
if you play effectively, you don’t die, don’t pay repair costs, finish the dungeon faster and profit.
Fair point, but I think there are other ways to avoid graveyard rushing. Things like boss lockouts, etc. I’m all for completing challenges “as intended” And I think there are a lot more you could do to curb this. When making this suggestion what I really had in mind was being able to get a group in there for some insanely crazy hard content, where frequent death is actually part of the learning experience. I don’t think that content exists today, but I want it to. I just see repair costs as a barrier to being able to add that content.
Oh dear, not another one of these.
Firstly, let’s get one thing out of the way. Just because it’s a game and a pastime, does not mean that everything in it has to be fun. Also, just because you think it isn’t fun does not mean it’s a universal truth. If you start eliminating things based on what individual people think isn’t fun, what you get is basically an empty space. For some, roaming mobs attacking you isn’t fun, so remove it. For some, doing quests isn’t fun, so remove it. For some, crafting isn’t fun, so remove it. For some, the storyline isn’t fun, so remove it. For some, leveling isn’t fun, so remove it. For some, getting exotic gear isn’t fun, so remove those as well. For some, being forced to choose a single class and race isn’t fun, so let’s remove classes and allow you to change your race from a drop-down selection in your Hero menu. See where this is going?
Secondly, you are not meant to play the game in a way that aims to avoid all costs. Hell, by definition that can’t be fun. So basically you’re playing in an inherently unfunny way and are complaining because it is what it is. That’s kinda hilarious. The costs are there for a good reason, so appreciate them. If you’re going to avoid certain content because you’re afraid of the repair fees, you should probably stick to other games.
If anything, obvious penalties for death, such as long traveling time due to contested waypoints, costs due to using waypoints and repair fees encourage you to get a group. And it’s an MMORPG, that’s a pretty big part of it. Granted, GW2 does get a buttload of points for allowing people to solo almost everything. Heck, most of the time I see DE’s failing because of lack of participants or because there’s a time limit to succeeding.
Interesting. So many things to respond to.
To your first point, I’m open to arguments stating how amor repair costs make the game better. I think you are also assuming that I don’t realize that my opinion is an opinion. This is a game suggestion forum. This is where things like this go. But I don’t think it’s valid to state that just because “I” think something, not everyone does, as an argument against a suggestion. Make points on why we should keep it. Let’s have a real debate about the specific issue, not a debate on “what if we listened to every suggestion”
Second, neither of my suggestions talk about avoiding incurring any cost. It’s either replacing cost or making it fixed.
In response to the third paragraph, this is the biggest argument I see for having penalties for armor costs. It either acts as a deterrent for bad behavior or motivates good behavior. My personal opinion is those costs are actually more of a detriment to attempting challenging content than it is a motivator for succeeding that content, and actually motivates “bad behavior” more so than it does “good behavior” And, yeah, it’s just my opinion.
Stuff.
I’m just gonna say that a rule of play that players are given to understand they will operate under in any game is not the same as extrinsic motivation. It’s an equalizer, a measure in place to make sure that repetitive failure is not met with pure reward. The penalty by nature ensures that players will try to avoid it. The obvious way is to develop the skill to avoid it, which is an intrinsic desire catalyzed by something outside the player’s control. The wasteful way is to not participate in activities that risk incurring it (i.e. people acting as though repair cost is a barrier when really the barrier is their own skill). The deciding factor is not whether the penalty is extrinsic or intrinsic, but whether the player’s own intrinsic desire to become better is greater than their intrinsic value of small amounts of imaginary money.
Intrinsic desire to become better will take a back seat to the lazy train if there’s no reason to become better, basically.
Does armor repair costs in any way affect whether you want to be a more skilled player? Truth is people don’t like to fail. That’s all the reason you need to be better. And for the people who need not incurring amor repair costs as motivator… then the content is probably not geared for them anyway.
Take away armor damage from combat-related death and you take away the incentive to develop skill.
I would argue that armor damage has little or no impact to a players incentive to develop skill. I think most people that are trying to become more skilled do it as a result of their intrinsic set of values.
If you look at Daniel Pink’s “Drive” he actually sites studies that extrinsic motivators for tasks that require some level of cognitive skill actually deter from their ability to perform.
I think the big problem with armor damage is how you can be forced to go back and forth.
You essentially get a maximum of 6 defeats before pieces of your equipment start getting broken.Instead, I think each piece of equipment should have at least 10/10 Durability, including Weapons.
- Whenever you get downed, you should lose 1 durability on 1 random piece of equipment.
Undamaged equipment (51% to 100% durability) is damaged first.
Damaged equipment (1 to 50% durability) is damaged last.
- Whenever you get defeated, you should lose 1 durability on all pieces of equipment.The total cost after a defeat should be roughly the same.
Essentially, Durability should be an immersive gold sink, not a fun sink.
I think this would be a step in the right direction.
I guess the real question for armor damage is what does it add in terms of making the game more fun?
The penalty for failing a challenge is time and failure. Truth is a lot of folks learn at different rates, all I’m suggesting is removing an additional barrier for some to be able to learn and tackle this content. And it’s true others might not see this as a barrier.
Also, in some ways I feel like it adds a ceiling to how insanely challenging you can design your content.
Nurvus.2891, I don’t think your points are mutually exclusive. I’d like to see the reigns of difficulty and creativity let loose on the top end content. I just believe that armor damage is a barrier for a lot of folks and what you end up is a smaller percentage of players you can group with who are willing to incur the cost to learn and tackle that content.
Just to point out you nolonger take armor damage for death from falling. Only time you take it is when you are actually killed which in all honesty is how it should be. If your ignorant enough to “graveyard zerg” instead of learn the content and actually do it with minimal death then you should have to pay for it.
That’s assuming that all players should be able to complete content (i.e. dungeons) without dying. What I’m really talking about is content, where death is part of the learning experience. Any content you can complete without some death and learning is not really challenging content. I’m more interested in scaling challenges and removing the excessive penalty for mastering that content.
So there are 3 reasons why you would implement armor damage in the game.
1. As a gold sink. I realize gold sinks are important to the overall economy as they help mitigate the flooding of the market with too much coin.
2. Role playing.
3. Adding real consequences to mitigate certain mentalities. i.e zerging in WvW
The big problem with armor damage is that it also is acts as a deterrent for really challenging content.
Ultimately, in my opinion, the armor damage mechanic not only adds zero fun to the game, but is actually a net negative to folks being able to truly enjoy challenging content. It also limits your ability to introduce harder content without significant lashback.
I recently did the clock tower jumping puzzle, and I had a blast. When I failed I went to the start and tried again. No armor damage, no frustration from losing gold. If there was a price tag on the number of attempts (via armor dmg), I feel it would have turned a lot more people away. I personally would like to see more challenging content in the game in terms of bosses and dungeons, but when you add armor damage to equation, deaths and failures become more costly and even act as a deterrent.
Couple ways to handle this:
1. Remove armor damage altogether and find a different gold sink.
2. Allow for a buff that you can purchase at the beginning of difficult content to protect you from excessive repair bills and make armor damage a fixed cost.
I would have liked to have seen the simon says mechanic persist through the fight with the number of adds spawning dependent on how many people correctly chose the right option. For the hardcore folks make it a true simon says where the number of emotes you have to repeat increases every time until he dies. There are definitely some ways to play with this mechanic to up the difficulty. But I really liked the swapping out of the skill bar mid combat with the adds. All and all it was an enjoyable fight.
Getting the same error as Donari when trying to connect. 3022:1002:3:2863
If people want to farm plinx to max/min karma gains, I think that’s fine. But I don’t think we should be rewarding the max/min karma mentality. If you’re playing the game for the purpose of max/mining karma, then to a degree you are already trivializing content.
It’s like having your cake and eating it too. At some point you have to ask yourself the question, why do I play this game:
1. To have all the coolest stuff the game has to offer faster than anyone else.
2. To explore all the content the game has to offer
There are 2 things that make gw2 different than most MMOs
1. lvl 80 exotics are the best you can do statwise. So for the majority of your time at 80 you will not be at a statistical disadvantage.
2. You still get rewards that can be used towards max level gear in ANY zone. Just not at the Plinx rate. (For me it’s the right amount of incentive.)
Keeping things the way they are forces 1 of 3 things to happen:
1. People getting frustrated with the lack of “end-game content” and “min/max” options and find some other game to min/max
2. People realizing that getting that “skin” a month or two or six early isn’t worth mindlessly grinding the same event over and over again, and people will naturally begin to branch out and seek out fun and entertaining content. But not because it has the best rewards.
3. People realizing that if they want to farm the most lucrative content then their options for content are limited and are ok with that so long as they get to flash their legendary around town and make the rest of us jealous.
Personally for me, I would rather have Anet focus on ways to make the content more dynamic, engaging, fun rather than find ways to incentivize people to do existing content via rewards. I see this game as more of a marathon than a sprint.
But for those looking to max/min karma, you can have plinx. I’m fine with taking everything else. But I’m really not a fan of turning the entire world into a plinx-like extravaganza.
When moving my camera, if I do a quick swipe with right click it auto-attacks a mob. I don’t recall having this issue prior to the patch.
Would be nice to be able to have some in game features for finding the right guild. Right now it seems the forums. Having a forum seems sub-optimal in searching for or finding members.
1. Guild Summary/Description. Having to scan forums and external websites is extraneous. Would be nice to have a in game canonical source that allows folks to describe their guild.
2. Guild application mechanism.
3. Ability to tag yourself as looking for guild with a description of what you are looking for
4. Ability to search for guilds.
5. Ability to flag your guild as recruiting.
6. Ability to view players searching for a guild.
7. Ability to designate main server(s) for guild.
8. Ability to designate main time zone(s) for guild.
If it takes 3 days to fix something like a loading screen, this game is dead in the water. This is pretty pathetic. Im alt tabed out now waiting to kick back to what ever as im at a perma loading screen.
While I don’t want to speak for the Anet dev team, I’m pretty sure the bug isn’t with the “loading screen” as much as it is with one of the hundreds of things that are being loaded while the loading screen is being displayed. Although I might find it secretly amusing if it was just a problem with a line of code that got removed that read: loadingScreen.hide();
In the Blazeridge Steppes the quest where you have to defeat an angry Kendrick Redstaff, it’s possible to interrupt his conversation before he is done. Doing so makes him invulnerable while attacking. The only way to defeat him is to have everyone run away so he resets and finishes his conversation at which time he becomes normal again.