Showing Posts For Laggo.8973:
… Is this post based on anything other than 2 or 3 videos you’ve watched, pretty much entirely with incidental comps?
If not, then I can’t take you seriously. Have you ever heard of a thing called sample size?
And recommended means you are going to need it, so yes.
Nope.
Recommended means that it will be easier with it.Due to the small difference between Exotic and Ascended and the fact that we know that it won’t have to do with Agony, it is very unlikely that it would be possible to do with Ascended but at the same time impossible with Exotic.
Didn’t know 15% DPS was a small difference when you are talking about raid tuning. Great players will be able to make up that difference in exotics. The average player doesn’t even know what a rotation is, let alone getting skilled enough to execute their own properly.
So for the average player, it seems pretty safe to say you will need that DPS boost.
I’ll try to clarify. I think the minimum difficulty for a minor encounter in a 10-man raid should be this:
- A skilled player being able to solo (with practice) is fine.
- It should not be easily soloable on an average player’s first attempt.
- A solo player should feel slightly challenged when fighting a boss with 1/10 of the resources of the intended encounter.Again, this is for a minor raid encounter, the major bosses should not be soloable under any circumstances.
Is this something that we can agree on?
If this is your argument then I am geniunely confused considering
1) You can’t solo the first minor encounter. Killing 1/3 mobs is not soloing. Is Swamp fractal too easy becuase you can “solo” 1/3 wisps by yourself? You’re changing the definition of the encounter to partial completion and calling it a day.
2) Again, you didn’t solo anything. Here is where there seems to be a disconnect. You are giving yourself credit again for partially completing an encounter. You can solo one burrow in AC P2 before you get mobbed by gravelings on either section, does that mean the encounter/mechanic is broken? People would think you were being insane and tell you to finish the encounter before you complain. It’s the same thing here.
3) You didn’t fight any bosses. You fought trash. You didn’t even fight all the trash, you picked and chose a tiny portion of the trash to fight.
You didn’t clarify any of your argument at all, it just got even more confusing. You can’t pick and choose what parts of an encounter you want to address. You have to address the encounters as a whole, and the first encounter is the three guardians. Not one. You keep conveniently leaving out anything that goes against the “feedback” or claims you are trying to give to make the point you want to make, despite it not being factual at all when you look at the bigger picture.
Your argument seems to be that no mob in a raid instance should be killable by a single player, which is total garbage. What about an event where you have to defend a point and you get swarmed by waves of mobs? Are you going to say it’s soloable and too easy when you kill the first three mobs by yourself and die?
It’s literally the first trash mob in the first wing of the first raid that you can’t even completely solo, just do part of the fight. You might have a point if you could make it to the boss solo, but you can’t even do that.
This is like saying the Thaumanova Reactor fractal laser puzzle is too easy because you can solo the first switch (ignoring the rest of the puzzle because clearly that’s not relevant)
Look at this seriously for half a second. I’m guessing none of you have ever raided before, because this honestly makes absolutely 0 sense to me.
How can you have difficulty curve and progression if you want the first trash mob of the first wing to require hours of study? It’s already a little more complex than a tank and spank, which is the overwhelming majority of initial trash in raid encounters for other games. That should be a good sign, not a bad one.
Congratulations, you solo’d one trash mob at the very beginning of the first wing of the first raid, skipping any of the mobs with mechanics.
Would you like a cookie? No offense, but what are we supposed to get out of this post? People already solo fractal 50 mossman.
You made the beta character before you put the trinkets in your bank, you messed up
You aren’t even playing endgame, you are just playing around.
Simply, the game is not designed for healing coefficients that high
The point is that dodging and active defense is still necessary. Do you really want to see a Guild Wars where it becomes bad to dodge because it’s a DPS loss and healers are chucking out spammable 2k-3k health heals and healing the party to full anytime the boss does a real attack (not to mention insane regen ticks).
Why don’t you try beating the boss before you say it’s too easy?
I bet you haven’t even seen the triple split phase…
What’s wrong with individual skill being a barrier to not even 1% of the content available in the game?
Is the other 99% being free-for-all and easy to see not good enough?
I’m sure eventually people will sell raid slots as well, or is buying a slot to see the content not good enough either?
People “throw around the word entitled” because that’s what is happening here. Because you play the game, you think all the story content in the game that you want to see should be available to you. Even if the only barrier to seeing the content is literally yourself and your own play (or wallet), you think the content needs to be brought down to your current level because it’s not fair to you.
Doesn’t matter that you will be able to youtube the entire encounter whenever you want. That doesn’t count because your character wasn’t physically there.
Doesn’t mean that you can simply learn to do the content yourself. That doesn’t count because then you have to play the game.
That’s the definition of entitlement.
Making a story mode version is not FREE. This is the part that you are glossing over. It costs development time, it introduces new hurdles with reward structure, and it dilutes the point of raids – which are supposed to be content for endgame players.
You simply aren’t presenting a benefit that is worth the cost that comes with it. The only argument you are presenting right now is “I don’t want to use YouTube” and frankly, I don’t agree with that being worth all the associated headache. Feel free to clarify this benefit if you want. I just don’t see it.
You are the one who seeks to deny a story experience to others…
Nothing is stopping you from going into the raid, getting better at the game, and eventually completing it and seeing the reward for yourself if you so choose.
You aren’t interested in that however, because it might actually take some work, so you just want to go ahead and skip to the end pressing 1 because the game has always been that way.
Why do you feel entitled to this story content? Just because you play the game? What’s stopping you from going into the raid and completing it yourself? Because people say it’s hard?
You are telling other people how they should play the game.
What you are suggesting promotes guild mission exploitation where, say for a PvP capture event where you need to capture 8 points in 15 minutes (3 guild members req.) turns into 1, guilds just send 10 players out into PvP by themselves on individual teams to cap the first point and get the reward without actually ever having to play as a guild or experience any of the associated challenge with a mission requirement like that.
Any suggestion you make to “help” your situation is just trying to open the doors for larger guilds to exploit missions easier and derail any associated difficulty attached to them.
You already aren’t locked out of guild missions, you can ferry as many players as you want into your instance.
You just don’t want to (or can’t) find any help, you don’t want to recruit, but you want to get all the rewards regardless.
At some point someone has to say “tough luck”, you can’t just reduce the requirements ad-infinitum. What if a one-person guild doesn’t want to do guild missions but wants favor? What happened to play your way?!?
Can someone explain the idea that 10-cap would promote more diversity?
This wold only make passive/group buffs like Empower Allies, Banners, Vampiric Presence, Soothing Detonation & Medical Dispersion, Strength In Numbers, Venomous Aura, Bountiful Disillusionment… I could keep going… nearly twice as strong catapulting them into completely necessary status.
Suddenly, it becomes extremely hard to bring more than 1 of any class due to sacrificing a huge amount of group power to duplicate up, with two Warriors remaining to cover all banners, as even Banner of Tactics becomes necessary giving boon duration to 10 people.
No matter how you slice it there will be an optimal way to do things, but at least in the current system it’s mostly a DPS and/or group utility issue rather than “if we don’t bring a guardian we are missing out on 2000 toughness across the raid as well as boonspam” or “if we don’t bring a Necro we can’t gather up all the dead players to a safe rez and revive at once, 700+ HP/S for the raid before wells, 10 player condition removal….”
It’s more strict, not less.
The problem is you seem to equate any semblance of story with “important”.
In other words, if you don’t get to experience it, that means it’s important and thus should be available to all.
That’s the argument you are presenting right now.
Where do you draw the line between what makes things important or not? Is one cutscene too much for you? A series of events that uses a pre-existing lore character? Introducing a character that eventually shows up in open world content?
I’m geniunely curious as to what you consider “important story” versus “normal story”.
The argument from the raiders side is that the Raids should have some kind of story attached to make them worthwhile and not just a boss rush mode. Please explain your side more clearly.
It seems entirely selfish to me to ask developers to do double the work to create an encounter by first having to make a base fight that can be done by players spamming the 1 skill, and then develop new mechanics on top of that to challenge the players who the content was actually designed for – just so you can say your character was physically there instead of watching it on youtube. You can’t just increase the toughness and damage of the boss from one mode to the next and call it a day.
We didn’t ask them to do double the work 1 . We’d prefer they just do right by the player base and not do this to begin with, but since they have here we are.
1 – Assuming that is the case, which I have my doubts as no one has seen where the challenge lies. If the difficulty lies in the stats, damage, or timers; scaling these back would be trivial and succeed in diminishing that challenge.
This ruins the raid for the people trying to do it as ‘intended’ as people naturally do the easy mode first making the actual fight boring and without surprise. There will be backlash from the endgame players the raids were actually meant to be developed for. FFXIV, as I already said, is already suffering from this.
What if at 30% life a boss does a reveal, changes form or sacrifices another NPC, and has new abilities / music? You’ve been working on that boss for two days and never saw that phase. All that magic is gone when you spoil everything about those fights to players in snoozefest encounters. The magic of raiding is in those moments, expecting challenge and seeing those kind of things for the first time and reacting to them.
With no gear treadmill in Guild Wars 2, essentially one of the only real “rewards” to raiding outside of vanity minis and skins is that experience. Take that away and what do you have left?
Half of the people in this thread can’t even do TA Aetherpath in their exotics and are complaining about raids “needing” ascended.
Joe Schmoe Warrior with his exotics still using the same runes/sigils from when he bought them, never uses food or utilities, using sword & shield & rifle cause “thats how he levelled and how he likes to play” is posting in this thread saying stuff like “Ascended gear is a grind and that’s why I don’t want to do it. If I can’t do it in my exotics it’s because the raid is about grinding gold not skill!!!”
None of you are going to admit you are this guy, but I guarantee close to half are this player.
I’m not sure how you pulled that completely unrelated point out of my post…
We are literally talking about one (at first) side story. You have the entire story of HoT, as well as the mini-lore contained in the individual zones to explore to your hearts content.
To this day, people can’t do TA Aetherpath and that has unique cutscenes regarding the big bad of the Living Story. Where is the outcry for the Aetherpath easy mode?
You didn’t address any of the concerns of why creating multiple versions of the same bosses is not free or without problems, you just plugged your ears and invented this story strawman to attack.
Please respond when you have some solutions to the problems I outlined, and then I’ll tell you why your solutions will incur even more backlash from the community.
It seems entirely selfish to me to ask developers to do double the work to create an encounter by first having to make a base fight that can be done by players spamming the 1 skill, and then develop new mechanics on top of that to challenge the players who the content was actually designed for – just so you can say your character was physically there instead of watching it on youtube. You can’t just increase the toughness and damage of the boss from one mode to the next and call it a day.
Making a “story version” is not free. This is additional balancing and design that has to be done that ultimately spoils the achievement for the people who want to do the content. FFXIV is already dealing with the backlash to their savage modes around this point.
This is not even addressing the concept of rewards, which would be a seperate problem entirely. Do you let people get rewards from both instances per week? What rewards are okay to give players for completing a version of content that you’re not meant to fail in comparison to “the real thing”? This is an entirely new balance problem that would need to be addressed, and would bring with it more complaining regardless of what avenue you chose.
None of these downsides seem worth the “benefit” of letting players physically hold their Forward Run key through the instance because they feel left out watching it on youtube.
Until you find out it’s gated on AR
Also the math isn’t cumulative like that. It essentially can’t be the stat difference, it’s not significant.
Agony is most likely the way they’re going to gate it, although I expect OUTRAGE.
The other possibility is that “Ascended Gear Required” is a PR lie to make raids sound more hardkore.
They have already stated that Agony Resistance will not be needed.
Then it’s PR bullcrap. The effective difference in ascended stats is just that insignificant.
I’ve noticed more and more that 90% of this community doesn’t actually understand the difference between exotic and ascended, they just repeat what incorrect information somebody else told them.
The reward structure right now for raids is
1) Raid exclusive minis and skins
2) Ascended chests
3) Legendary-track related matsWhat out of those rewards would you give players for completing the “lower difficulty”? If you give any of those to the people who are doing the easier content, then why would anybody do the harder version?
a chance for ascended chests.
some champ loot bags and a chest of ascended crafting mats.the lower difficulty would be a way of seeing the lore and getting gear for the harder raid with all the shinies, the reward is being able to actually see the story
So you want to get a higher chance at the best gear in the game and free champion bags for doing the “story version”?
lol
lets just make raids another weekly tequatl, sounds like what everybody has been asking for
The reward structure right now for raids is
1) Raid exclusive minis and skins
2) Ascended chests
3) Legendary-track related mats
What out of those rewards would you give players for completing the “lower difficulty”? If you give any of those to the people who are doing the easier content, then why would anybody do the harder version?
You’re really overreacting. There is no artificial gear check. You can attempt the content in exotics. You can probably even succeed if you’re good enough. Ascended isn’t becoming more powerful. They’re simply saying “this stuff is hard, you might want to bring the best possible stuff”
The bolded is my concern. If it is truly balanced around needing ascended gear, then logically speaking, no matter how skilled you actually are you may not be able to finish the content until you re-gear. Which, at that point, the content does become (in a sense) gated content. You cannot do ‘x’ until you have ‘y’ gear, and that’s a problem because they told us they didn’t want to do that. That wasn’t what the game was about.
If they take this stance now, slowly balancing the games progression around having ascended, how long before that touted “optional” tier is no longer optional, hmmm?
Lmao, this is the kind of person that wipes without making it past the bosses 1st phase and goes “Clearly this is impossible without Ascended” and makes a rage-filled post on the forums about how ANET lied to me, despite the reason they failed having nothing to do with gear and everything to do with their own skill.
You cannot do Fractal 50 until you have ascended gear. This is already in the game! What are you talking about when you say ‘thats not what the game is about’?
So many people in this thread don’t want to get ascended because it’s a “grind”, don’t want to find a guild or a pre-made team, don’t want to play meta or use proper food/runes because they like the way they play, and don’t even do the “hard” content in the game already because they can’t be bothered – but they want to raid and they don’t want to be excluded?
Can someone please explain that thought process to me?
No, it’s because his arguments are ludicrously all-inclusive, to the detriment of the people the content is actually designed for.
Should we give everybody that enters the raid an ascended chest for being brave enough to queue up too?
I guess that wouldn’t be fair to the level 40s that couldn’t get to that zone! Scrap that!
If it takes you 6 months to get ascended gear then you aren’t good enough to be doing raids. Maybe focus on improving your ingame efficiency before thinking about raiding.
Ouch, talk about an unapologetic elitist.
Not everyone plays for 40+ hours a week, friend. Perhaps you shouldn’t be so condescending to your hard-working, productive allies in society.
It has nothing to do with playing 40+ hours a week. You can play half an hour a day and get your ascended way faster than 6 months.
If it takes you 6 months you are doing things, terribly, terribly wrong. And he’s completely right in that players like you are pretty much the opposite of who Raids are designed for.
Honestly if you couldn’t be bothered to get ascended gear then you have no buisness being in a raid as you clearly aren’t serious about the game.
You aren’t serious about the game unless you spend 6 months gearing up! :^)
At minimum, if you can’t get an ascended weapon and some rings/amulets that take days to get (in total like a week of work, even less if you get lucky with Teq or PvP track chest) you have no business in being in a serious raid team trying to complete the content.
There is nothing stopping you from having fun with your friends in exotics and random runes, just don’t complain when you can’t complete the content.
For the supposed hardest content in the game, this seems pretty obvious.
If getting an ascended weapon is too much work for you, I don’t think raids were meant for you in the first place?
What is the Guild Wars communities fascination with everything having to be available to everyone?
So many people who can’t even do Fractal 50 complaining about raids… what’s the logic there? Fractals are going up to 100 and Raids are supposed to be harder than that.