Showing Posts For LovefulfillsAll.4870:
(mandatory post that talks about how it was meant to target Veil bombs and misses the point entirely)
These post are the real ignorance. The REAL point was stated quite well, it still disables the thief and an entire trait line.
Ignorant player will be ignorant, nothing you can do. This applies to game designers as well.
I really don’t understand why a thief is coming in here and asking for nerfs after the kitten slew that it was already hit with.
Further more, this class does not need any more nerfs, it needs buffs. Tired of PvP QQ, because there happens to be this other part of the game called PvE, where thief does not excel at , whatsoever.
I really wish people would stop mindlessly asking for nerfs because of tunnel vision in whatever they “think” is best.
lay out as many pvp scenarios as you want, but with anti stealth mechanics being introduced soon (which cripples backstab builds almost entirely around it) , we dont need any stealth nerfs.
For the sake of PvE, get BUFFED and not nerfed..
Some nice opinions, thanks for sharing.
I’ve already stopped actively playing until thieves get a buff.
Perhaps the biggest problem is that thieves aren’t rewarded enough (if at all…) for being skilled. The most effective way to kill someone (at least before the patch) requires literally 3 button presses. CnD, Steal, Backstab. The next most effective way requires spamming 2 until you run out of initiative or your enemy dies. Boring as hell, and the main reason I don’t run D/D.
Would like to see more risk-reward gameplay added. A few examples of what I mean:
1. Reduce the hitbox on being “behind” someone, but cause backstab’s damage to scale cleanly depending on how to close to the “back” you are.
2. Replace the “gain might on dodge” trait with “gain might for each successfully evaded attack”. Perhaps move it up the tree a bit.
3. Headshot deals additional damage (like 2-3k on crit) upon successfully interrupting an attack.
I’m really not sure what you mean by this post. You said you stopped playing thief until they got a buff. Nothing you said in there is an actual buff though.
And that back stab idea is not good at all imo. If you take into account of the variables not in your control like latency, you would really destroy thief back stab viability as this is the internet and is not stable 100% the time.
Right now, I also disagree on no risk/reward for thief. In this game you can actually face-stab something for little or no damage and mess up your setup, put reveal up and cripple your fight. ~Just to name pretty risk/reward thing for running back stab.
Also heartseeker spam does not win fights, I think the large misconception is people getting hit with 2-3 after hitting 50% health and exaggerating the “you hit 22222 and win”.
Its a finisher, and it’s doing its intended job of finishing the target after certain health percentage.
Okay as title suggest, I think it is about time for people who main thieves and not just on a whim or a recent buff, to stand up.
Please do not come in here and make us look bad, talk with sense. =D
Honestly I want to stand up and just say, leave thief alone! If your not fixing our numerous problems or one trick pony builds, then leave us alone.
I am tired of watching numerous and mindless QQ threads about thieves and stealth specially.
I am actually afraid they are going to widdle down this profession to nothing over time because of other’s complaining.
There is a difference between being over-powered and needing tuned, and then bad players just losing to good thieves and whining about it.
At this point after constant nerfs, if you are still losing to a thief, its time to look at your play style instead of opening your tear ducts all over the forums.
Now for some constructive suggestions
~I read somewhere that they want to increase base damage on thieves. Now I actually think this is a great idea! Take out some of our current damage traits to balance out damage output , but replace them with more defensive talents.
~Next, the SA tree has some amazing condition removal ability if you spec accordingly. I think you should do the same thing for acrobatic tree, add something deep into the tree where you can remove one condition per evade that uses endurance. (This would actually open up more NON-BS builds, as acrobatics and back-stab builds do not have the best synergy— as Critical Strikes + SA tree are almost mandatory.
~P/P Really, I am at a loss for this weapon set. But there are some really good suggestions out there I’ve read. Maybe somebody would post something again here.
~ Venoms Hmm this one is really tough, cause I don’t want to just come out and say they are terrible. But they are so situational at best and rarely worth the utility slot. (lol at venomshare)
Actually I am going to rename a suggestion I seen a little while back that I thought was excellent. Putting in the venoms into f2-fx buttons would add some serious flavor to the class. And add some counter play to the thief so they don’t run when burst cd’s are down. I think they should share a 10 second global CD, but each individual one should be around 30 seconds.
This would probably need some tuning, but when I sit here and think about the extra depth and utility it adds to the profession I get excited.
That’s all for now I can think of at the moment.
Feel free fellow thieves to share things you think would make this class better, or comment on my opinions.
P.S Sorry if I seemed hostile at first, I tried to make my point as direct as possible. Cheers!
You know what is also funny and something to be considered about the stereo-type of stealth hating people?
Scenario 1 in a duel – Thief does not stealth, does not obey what he’s balanced around and tries to face smack the other player like a warrior and then loses horribly. The player then says “GG” ( LOL)
Scenario 2 in a duel – Thief uses stealth, obeys class mechanics, actually plays like a thief and wins the bout. Then the guy says “QQ your OP”
Followed by these huge stealth QQ fest.
This breaks down to l2play. Stealth itself does not win games. And of all games to see so much QQ about it when you can still slap the thief around in stealth if he’s actually as bad as you claim.
I find this very frustrating, Other plays won’t be happy until we are nerfed so hard that they can win with little to no effort
You know at this point after so many nerfs and actually in need of some buffs. It’s truly a l2play problem. I hope Anet realizes this and stops listening to the constant whine. Because it will stay until we don’t do anything anymore.
Okay this is just my opinion, and some changes and nerf’s are warranted. While I think the majority are poor decisions. The hypocrisy is indeed obvious.
In actual reality, right now, you have to play way better than your opponent in most cases to achieve an equal result.
^ This is a result of constant unwarranted nerf batter with no compensation. (Thus them admitting base damage is low)
Thanks everyone who is gracious enough to complain about this class at every tick and turn cause it wasn’t a free kill!
I read somewhere that anet wants thief to be the top burst class, as it stands right now. It is not, thief is easily rivaled in this by a proper phantasm build, maybe even a GS Warrior with haste buff and Axe off set for eviscerate.
This class’s main role was damage, it has very little defense outside of being king of escape. Taking its damage away slowly but surely, just makes this class feel like an empty shell.
“Thieves are adept at the art of stealth. They utilize surprise shadow and shadow to get closer to their enemies, and they’re deadly in one-on-one combat.”
Thieves are hardly the only class adept in stealth, but okay statement is still true. They just forgot to mention its by far not the only one. (say hay Mesmer!)
Deadly in one-on-one combat. What a big freaking joke. In PvE my warrior can do everything my thief can 2-3x better. And slowly but surely QQ is turning thief into a watered down mud-stomped class in PvP (which also carries out to PvE).
Somebody please explain to me, how you deal and decent amount of pressure in a S/D Build.
Like at all.
I can get over burst being gone, but seriously. You just flank spam and auto attack to death?
Removing boon is an awesome utility but, that also does not win the game anymore than running all.
Really though, somebody explain to me how you deal damage in sPvP.
I run knight amulet btw, because I do not like dieing in 2 hits. (although it still happens)
Phantasm burst?
Protection?
Reflective/Condi reflect?
Stun?
= Phantasm build and Arcane Thievery?
K listen dude. that build is pretty much God tier 1v1 and takes little to no skill to use. Is that bull kitten? … Actually no =D
Ok well maybe a little, best option is to just not fight this 1v1. It’s a bad build in team fights and thats how it’s balanced. I know it seems a little silly but in competitive play it’s not a big deal and unless they are solo queue side point a good majority of mesmers don’t actually run this crap.
The rest of the mesmer builds are pretty strong yes but can be countered pretty well if you know how to out play them. (just don’t be a warrior when you try to do it)
See this guy right here? ^^
He actually acknowledges the facts that are posted and are there.
The guy calling me new to pvp?
That was nothing but a big rambling post with no actual feedback on the build I am referring about.
People who like being OP or just don’t know how to play, will usually defend the class ignorantly.
Anyhow I came here with facts, and not to argue, but to state a point. So I am basically done posting now on this thread.
But please do stay on topic and
Discuss
(edited by LovefulfillsAll.4870)
woah woah woah let me get this straight you are telling someone who plays mesmer that he has no idea of the potential his class possesses……okay.
Edit: Also what class do you play (from there we can work a strategy)
Hey I appreciate the attempt to “work a strategy” , seems like an attempt to help but it doesn’t matter what classes I play. The thread is about Mesmer’s and their potential to build all-in-one into something overpowered.
Every build needs a downside outside of just being zerged down by 2+ players.
And no I did not claim somebody who plays Mesmer doesn’t know the potential of his class.
But if your the guy saying, but hey I can’t do X when in reality you really can, then the truth is, you don’t know your class.
Example being the guy above here talking about bad condition removal and completely unaware of the ability to put conditions from yourself onto the enemy.
Another thing, just because you play the class, does not mean you know everything about it.
Play a mesmer for 3 months. Then come back to this thread and post about mesmers being OP.
I didn’t claim Mesmer was easy to play, but that doesn’t mean its not OP. Cause it truly surely, definitely IS-Overpowered.
Can remove condition while reflecting conditions? What the hell are you smoking? Mesmer condi removal is worst in game by far… And any “reflects” we have are projectile only… We can not Randomly gain protection unless we have signet of inspiration which is a rarity in pvp or chaos armor which is a bright purple bubble. The only time we actually gain protection is if we have chaos armor up or we are traited for it… In which case we won’t be doing all that much damage….. Mesmer is not a do everything class… I’m sorry but they really are not.
Your doing it wrong, and obviously there is a build you don’t know about if anyone tries to deny the things this class can do all in one. Because those ones that I run into that face roll (Yes they are very good) Do everything I said.. Every single thing , including removing conditions and putting them on the original caster.
You don’t know your own class well if you don’t know it can do this with the proper building.
(edited by LovefulfillsAll.4870)
Dude, it is very hard to win mesmer in 1on1 battle.
Its way to strong.
(When a class can be good enough that one player can’t defeat it, its a indicator it’s to strong)
At least in GW1, they had cool tools like they do now, but they didn’t burst 15k health with 2 phantasm almost instantly. All in One – OP
So, without naming any particular class that I play (I play a few).
I gotta say, Mesmer is the one that irritates me the most. I cannot fight a Mesmer with a proper build and plays right.
Why can this profession with the right build seem to do everything?
~Can remove condition while reflecting the conditions back on the original caster.
~25 Sec CD ranged Stun which leads up to the issue of the build where they summon two damage phantasms and do ridiculous burst damage. So even if I broke the stun with a utility I still pretty much get hit because one shoots and never misses unless you LOS it.
~A large immobile strikes me usually after or during the stun, while they use an invulnerable move during phantasm burst.
~Invulnerable moves?? (What)
~ Random Boon generation, meaning they can just randomly take 33% less damage, block an entire attack. You name it.. Its passive its there, and its annoying.
~Surviving as one is funny, cause they just summon multiple clones up in between stun/burst combo if you managed to survive.
~Built in vigor on some things, making it dodge constantly
~ Stealthing – causing target drop while putting out exact replica clones and only way to tell the difference for me is when they use a specific skill the clone don’t do or back pedals
Right now I ran into a few Mesmers with a similar build and they have the whole kite and kaboodle. They survive, they burst heavily and they heal great. There is truly no disadvantage to it.
Its way to strong.
You might say I’m not good, or you could recognize that this class well played has no counter outside of being zerged by 2 or more players. (When a class can be good enough that one player can’t defeat it, its a indicator it’s to strong)
At least in GW1, they had cool tools like they do now, but they didn’t burst 15k health with 2 phantasm almost instantly. All in One – OP
P.S Dieing in ranged stun from 60%+ health is not fun