Guild Wars 2

Item rarity is taken from the skin rather than from the stats, so yes, it’d still be legendary. However, I don’t know if legendaries can be used with transmutation stones in the first place and it’d be kitten expensive just for a skin.

how can their be conflicting reports? pull out a mortar, get on it, then put on the trait and notice it makes ur skill change to 1500 range, also note the trait only changes your skills in the mortar not the range of the actual mortar elite skill(still says 1400). and if a player that doesnt have that trait gets on the mortar then they only have 1400 range

Asking the other player to shoot would have been a good idea, tooltips are known for not being reliable right now since they often don’t update properly with traits. So, yeah, I’m just going to assume I’m right.

Khezekiah Bellamy.5016:

tested it and only the person with the trait on benefits from the increased range

Conflicting reports, heh. Someone else to test and confirm a result?

Khezekiah Bellamy.5016:

well the tooltip isnt updating any dmg change, also u dont see the 1500 range increase until you are on the mortar. what if u have the range increase and someone else gets on your mortar u place, do they get the range increase or do they have to have the trait? i want the range increase to apply

Just managed to test it and the increased ranged does work when someone else uses it.

I’m afraid I don’t know about the range applying to other people, I suppose it should; feel free to test it yourself and tell us the results, I probably won’t find anyone to test it myself before a few hours.

PotatoOverdose.6583:

There are several reasons for this, most of them pertaining to WvW. First, you begin to conflict with arrowcart, at no supply cost. Second, a mortar that can hit at 1600 (the lowest possible increment for elite suplies) would, if properly positioned, allow it to damage siege in certain currently un-touchable by non-siege locations. This wouldn’t be useful in general combat, but could be used by smaller teams to neutralize siege before and after combat.

Both of the above become increasingly problematic as you increase mortars range to 1700 as well.

TL;DR: Adjusting mortar’s range past 1500 might make mortar useful, at least in wvw. I don’t think Arenanet wants that.

Every ranged siege weapons have more range than Mortar (lowest being the arrow cart at 2500) people drop them closer because nothing threatens it other than other siege/wall weapons and suicide rushes, so even if they increased Mortar’s range to 2000, it wouldn’t upset the balance of siege weapons much. People would just need to use the range of their siege weapon instead of sticking right behind their group.

The auto attack was added to grenades when underwater, and the bonus damage to Mortar does work (tested both in PvE and Heart of the Mists).

RapBreon.9836:

*Your continued misrepresentation of what I’ve done; “supply some information” like I’ve dropped it down as the word of God is tiresome. *

I supplied info, we discussed it, we’ve probably helped him more. Good times. It’s a better start than “sorry dunno, new game”.

People are idiots that’s why they’ll just accept anything that way. Course you’re not responsible for that but as I said it’s not helping either.

RapBreon.9836:

Minilys.4765:

Spoonfeeding people isn’t helping anyone, not you, not people like OP, it’s not helping me either since I spent the last few hours monitoring this thread. And that’s definitely what I’m fighting against.

I put a disclaimer on it and explained it, I can’t do much more. I mean I could have not helped I guess, but seeing as we’re combating ‘misinformation’ in the off chance somebody might get it ‘wrong’ or ‘misapply’ it, we better just close the forums!

Moral crusades are fun, especially when they’re so ambivalent.

I actually just expected to spark an educated discussion on the question, mission failed. You could have said something like: “Hey OP, sorry but the game is new so we won’t have a definite answer for you anytime soon”, and that’s exactly what I was planning to say to OP at first but well in retrospect I really do feel like I spent the last few hours on nothing.

RapBreon.9836:

He got what he wanted, a base to work off, a starting point. If he takes it as a conclusive answer, that’s his own failure.

Spoonfeeding people isn’t helping anyone, not you, not people like OP, it’s not helping me either since I spent the last few hours monitoring this thread. And that’s definitely what I’m fighting against.

RapBreon.9836:

Minilys.4765:

“But I tested it, I must be right for every possible situation ever!”

Lmfao, I put a disclaimer both within the original post, explained it multiple times to you and on top of all that, I said in this scenario it ‘illustrates’ (as in there is a link) better scaling from direct damage. I did another test in a different circumstance and added another confirmatory piece of evidence, strengthen the link.

Regardless my information helps, because during that scenario, a certain set-up is better, lending itself to applying to other scenarios using that set-up. Your information helped him with his options, which wasn’t his question.

Regardless, I think OP left a long, long time ago, satisfied by the first answer he came across.

RapBreon.9836:

CptCosmic.3156:

condition removal is annoying but luckily the engineer conditions have mostly short duration and are reapplied very fast

also I wish you good luck against anyone with retaliation. getting hit back 3 times everytime you hit with a grenade ability is not fun, especially in WvW and area retaliation combos.

Hahah yeah our condition application is fairly fast and short duration and gives us a leg up, still some builds are very hard to kill, I find mesmers are a condition build to be difficult as illusionary swordsman is pounding me into dust while I try to aim up a single blowtorch.

Hahah yeah I’ve blown myself up on retaliation before, Guardians make me fairly wary.

@Minilys; basically you’ve given him nothing. I at least gave him some information that was tested – I mentioned it isn’t conclusive – to use your analogy I gave him a 4 and a 2, what he wants to do with that 4 and a 2 is up to him. You basically just gave him the numbers 0 – 9 and said, make your own decision. I’m sure he could’ve done that without your help.

It seems you’re looking down on the mathematical complexity of OP’s question.
I can only give broad information because that’s the only thing I have right now, you gave him an answer that only apply to you. “But I tested it, I must be right for every possible situation ever!” doesn’t sound very convincing and if OP asked here he obviously couldn’t decide for himself either by lack of basic information (in which case I helped) or lack of definitive decision (in which case I didn’t help) but your answer doesn’t help much either and would require a discussion involving a lot a other players in which case both you and I could have given an opinion to help OP make a decision, but having a discussion with just 3 people saying opposite things simply wouldn’t help regardless.

@CptCosmic.3156,RapBreon.9836
I wouldn’t want to interrupt but OP specifically asked for PvE, dungeons and solo.

RapBreon.9836:

Minilys.4765:

Didn’t I say your tests were meaningless? It’s so narrow-minded, you keep locking yourself in specific conditions, it’s barely progress, the only progress is that you tried something different. Does it answer OP’s question? Nope. Only theory crafting can give OP an answer unless you have the dedication to test forever with every possible factors available. I already said it, I don’t doubt that you’re trying to help, but it just doesn’t.

Dismissing everything even small portions of evidence is narrow-minded. I’ve tested many factors relevant to a grenadier who can’t decide. You’re theory crafting has provided nothing, where as I have at least provided something. And I’ve admitted it’s not conclusive but it does help to paint a picture, the only picture painting you’ve done iskitten in my paint.

Well I didn’t have the chance up until now. But sure, I’ll do my painting, I might not draw OP a 42 but I’ll at least give him a (3+3)*(2+5) while you gave him a 2 and a 4. If you don’t get it, don’t bother.

So, OP, as you probably already know, at lvl 80 gear has 3 stats 1 major and 2 minors; if you forsake survivability entirely, your choice of gear is either Berzerker (power, crit and crit damage) or Rampager (precision, power and condition damage); Berserker is obviously a direct damage stuff, relying on raw damage and crit damage, while Rampager give more of an hybrid build with more crits and condition damage but less crit damage and direct damage.

Scaling for direct damage/conditon damage per condition provided in https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/engineer/80-engineer-grenade-build-Power-or-Condition/first#post97028

Direct damage is less effective high armored target since armor reduce direct damage but not condition damage. At the same time some targets , like World boss dragons can’t be critted but are still affected by condition damage, unfortunately due to the number of people doing them, only the person with the most condition damage will see the benefits from it, while some targets are immune to both crits and condition damage (world object like walls, turrets) which can be important in specific situations in dungeons.

For traits, since you’ll at least have 30 points in Explosives and will obviously have Grenadier as your Grand Master trait, you may want to consider Sharpnel, Incendiary Powder, Empowering Adrenaline(if you dodge a lot), Explosive Powder, Enhance Performance or even Forceful Explosives (if you have problems hitting your target).

For secondary traits, a mix between Firearms and Tools is what we generally see though an elixir build with 30 points in alchemy for HGH might be worth it if you’re using elixirs a lot.

In Firearms, the only traits you consider for damage are Precise Sights and napalm Specialist (only with Incendiary Powder from Explosives) tought the GrandMaster passive pretty much assure you a 5% dps increase against bleeding targets (which is always with sharpnel grenade anyway)

In Tools, only Scope (at 20 point) directly help your dps, otherwise Speedy gadget can help with Utility Googles, Kit refinement if you need instant burst around you but isn’t all that great dps wise since it has a cooldown or Static Discharge (doesn’t do much damage but can hit multiple targets at range). You might want to go for the Grand Master passive if you don’t dodge much.

For other specs, their passive stats gain don’t help dps directly.
In Invention only Energized Armor helps but that’s 10 points for only ~50 power at lvl 80, might be better if you choose gear with thoughness on it but will still less than going straight for Rampager or Berzerker gear.
Going for the Grand Master Passive really isn’t worth it.

In Alchemy, Blood Injection is the same as Energized Armor but Fast Acting Elixir help if you’re using Elixir B and/or U or even C if you’re expecting a lot of conditions on you. At 20 points only Potent Elixir helps for damage but doesn’t affect Elixir U. The Grand Master passive is only worthwhile with HGH and is futher reinforced with Enhance Performance (in explosives), but you will spend a lot of time drinking/throwing elixirs.

In conclusion, for OP (and everyone else) don’t accept easy answers, think for yourself, that’s the only way you’ll get better.

RapBreon.9836:

I have decided to do another test for the sake progress! Same rotation as last time.

Traits were;

30 into explosives, incendiary powder, explosive powder and grenadier.

30 into firearms, precise sights, napalm specialist, nothing.

10 into tools, taking nothing, done only for crit damage.

These are pretty much the best traits for improving grenade damage. Blood injection could of been an option for the condition build, but due to only having 1.2k vitality and such a high crit rate with Rampagers, I felt 10% more crit damage was better.

Power build: 300 condition damage, 130% condition duration, 3,273 attack, 49% chance to crit, 180% crit damage. Ogre runes, Zerker Amulet.

Time to kill

1. 5.9
2. 6
3. 5.7
4. 5.9
5. 6.1

Average. 5.92

Condition build: 1,127 Condition damage, 130% condition duration, 2,750 attack, 62% crit chance, 160% crit damage.

1. 6.9
2. 6.9
3. 6.7
4. 7.1
5. 7.2

Average. 6.96

This only further illustrates to me grenades are not a condition centric kit, they are a direct damage kit with some condition damage tacked on. The purpose of the kit is not condition damage like say the pistol is. They function better with traits and stats with power-crit and crit damage and anything that supports this set-up.

This was done on a heavy dummy and maybe in very long fights could condition damage ramp up enough to possibly catch up on heavily armoured targets. But seriously Rampagers Amulet for a condition build? You’d be stomped on so quick without some way to survive and let those conditions wear your opponent down, I still maintain even under the absolute best circumstances conditions for the grenade can’t compete with the direct damage component.

Didn’t I say your tests were meaningless? It’s so narrow-minded, you keep locking yourself in specific conditions, it’s barely progress, the only progress is that you tried something different. Does it answer OP’s question? Nope. Only theory crafting can give OP an answer unless you have the dedication to test forever with every possible factors available. I already said it, I don’t doubt that you’re trying to help, but it just doesn’t.

RapBreon.9836:

Minilys.4765:

You answered no meaningful question, the only question you managed to answer was: “Do I kill a target dummy faster with Berserker gear or Carrion gear with my specs and traits?” I could have answered that question with no tests, it’s a no-brainer for anyone who know what stats are carrion and berzerker. Well, congratulation on answering that question I guess but this certainly wasn’t what OP asked.

I certainly already mentioned that it was done in response to another topic, and was merely linking it to inform the OP.

Lets try a different approach, if I had of said; “using Dual pistols what kills faster” Zerker or Carrion, have a guess at what kills faster? Carrion because pistols are focused on condition damage, even if the Zerker has more dps stats. The whole point of the test was to work out where the focus was on the grenades and damage distribution was on the grenades, with relevant traits.

Problem is, what’s relevant to you might not be to someone else, and vice-versa, I mentioned Incendiary Powder and you kept ignoring it for example. I mentioned Rampager stuff while for you stacking condition damage is the way to get the best dps out of a condition damage build. As I said, the answer is only meaningful to yourself and isn’t what the OP asked.

RapBreon.9836:

Minilys.4765:

Didn’t have enough crit because you decided to use a stuff with only 2 damage stats on it.

Rampagers amulet is too eclectic but most importantly, the most important reason I did not use it, is because it does not have enough condition damage 568 as opposed to 798 no condition damage Engineer would run with Rampagers without running a hybrid build, I was not testing hybrid build, I was stacking. This has been mentioned and reiterated.

I understand your logic about using the Rampagers amulet, it’s not beyond me, no matter how much you think it is, but it is not practical to use on a straight condition damage Engineer. I don’t want that much crit at the sacrifice of condition damage which was the subject being tested.

Minilys.4765:

All stats on gear at lvl 80 are like that: 1 major + 2 minor stats, minor stats are roughly 70%,
with dps stats being power, precision, condition damage and crit damage; why you insist on using 3 dps stats for your crit test but only 2 for your condition damage one is really beyond me, even with the lost power from using rampager over carrion, you’d still get more dps.

I already mentioned that the Zerker amulet has equal total stats to a Carrion/Rabid amulet. Zerker sacrifices 300ish vit for 15% crit damage. The zerker amulet has 4 stats in total on it.

I mentioned in hind-sight if I wanted to favour condition damage even more I could’ve used the Knight’s amulet for the crit-power test, even if they turned out even in TTK, the test is still so rigged in favour of condition damage that if it can’t beat direct damage by a decent margin it obviously is an inferior damage dealing method for grenades.

Additionally, in an actual PvP setting and condition Engi would take either Rabid or Carrion while a crit-power Engi would take Zerker, this is an itemisation problem with the lack of choices regarding amulets, there is no condition equivalent of the Zerker amulet . The testing was supposed to emulate a real situation as much as possible whilst using even specs and only changing gear, picking traits that favour condi damage. This has been mentioned I am not wondering why it does less damage, it is evident.

Minilys.4765:

If that was the case you’d have you test with no specs or traits and only modifying gear. Which would give you the exact same results I gave you.

Which isn’t practical, because as I said it was a test of scaling and I assumed that part of understanding how things scale, also include the traits they scale off.

Is there a point in stacking? Why not stack only crit and crit damage then? Oh, wait you can’t.

You answered no meaningful question, the only question you managed to answer was: “Do I kill a target dummy faster with Berserker gear or Carrion gear with my specs and traits?” I could have answered that question with no tests, it’s a no-brainer for anyone who know what stats are carrion and berzerker. Well, congratulation on answering that question I guess but this certainly wasn’t what OP asked.

CptCosmic.3156:

Minilys.4765:

CptCosmic.3156:

Minilys.4765:

CptCosmic.3156:

i didnt included shrapnel trait into the calculation. with just 51% crit chance every second grenade toss applies a 5s bleed with that setup (6 nades with grenadier * 0.51 * 0.33 => 1,0098)

You throw 3 grenades per second, not 6. Unless you’re talking underwater.

I have never said anything about throwing speed (second adjective != second substantive)

Re read your first post

just aim for atleast 50% crit chance and you apply one 5s bleed every second ability

The “ability” is what escaped me. I instead focused on the every second.
But it doesn’t really matter, since it’s pretty meaningless to know that you get roughly 1 bleed every two cast.

it isnt meaningless cause the bleed lasts long.

Edited my previous post to be more clear in what I meant, if you don’t mind reading it again.

CptCosmic.3156:

Minilys.4765:

CptCosmic.3156:

i didnt included shrapnel trait into the calculation. with just 51% crit chance every second grenade toss applies a 5s bleed with that setup (6 nades with grenadier * 0.51 * 0.33 => 1,0098)

You throw 3 grenades per second, not 6. Unless you’re talking underwater.

I have never said anything about throwing speed (second adjective != second substantive)

Re read your first post

just aim for atleast 50% crit chance and you apply one 5s bleed every second ability

The “ability” is what escaped me. I instead focused on the every second.
But it doesn’t really matter, since it’s pretty meaningless to know that you get roughly 1 bleed every two cast. Saying you have a 45% chance per throw to bleed your target with Sharpshooter at 50% crit is definitely more helpful.

RapBreon.9836:

Ironically that’s what I’m thinking about you. Why would I build for burning without reliable application? The grenade kit itself does not apply burning, it only procs from one talent to which I did not have sufficient crit.

Didn’t have enough crit because you decided to use a stuff with only 2 damage stats on it.

RapBreon.9836:

if I did have sufficient crit, I would have had far, far, far less direct grenade damage which is less dps anyway and less pistol damage (which is important as well for a condition build).

All stats on gear at lvl 80 are like that: 1 major + 2 minor stats, minor stats are roughly 70%, with dps stats being power, precision, condition damage and crit damage. W
hy you insist on using 3 dps stats for your crit test but only 2 for your condition damage one is really beyond me, even with the lost power from using rampager over carrion, you’d still get more dps.

RapBreon.9836:

I can tell you this though; 50% of condition damage does not apply to burning, I have never seen burning tick for 1k+ (base is roughly 300ish somewhere). And your scaling numbers don’t detract from what I’m saying.

That one was my mistake, I redid my test and the scaling is in fact of 25% not 50.

RapBreon.9836:

This is about the kit and it’s ability to apply conditions in a meaningful damage applicative way. Not condition damage versus direct damage in general.

If that was the case you’d have to test with no specs or traits and only modifying gear. Which would give you the exact same results I gave you.

RapBreon.9836:

I don’t even understand what your scaling values were based on, it just seemed like arbitrary numbers to me. Unless you mean 50% of power is converted into direct grenade damage, etc. it wasn’t explained sufficiently.

That’s exactly what I meant.
50% of your power is added to direct grenade damage.
50% of your condition damage is added to burning damage per second.
5% of your condition damage is added to bleeding damage per second per stack.
7.5% of your condition damage is added to poison damage per second.

And again you didn’t factor in Burning with your runes, which, as I already said, is the best dps condition. You’re just stuck in your own parameters without seeing beyond. You’re applying a single setting to try to answer a broad question. It’s like saying a car is safe because you couldn’t shatter its windshield by throwing nerf balls at it during a test.

CptCosmic.3156:

i didnt included shrapnel trait into the calculation. with just 51% crit chance every second grenade toss applies a 5s bleed with that setup (6 nades with grenadier * 0.51 * 0.33 => 1,0098)

You throw 3 grenades per second, not 6. Unless you’re talking underwater.

CptCosmic.3156:

and my calculations are right:
30% from explosives tree
+15% 2x krait runes
+15% 2x afflicted runes
+10% 2x lyssa runes
=> +70%
sharpshooter 3s +70% =>5s
shrapnel 12s +70% => 20s

grenadier throws 3 nades thus statistically you get 3 crits every 2nd grenade toss with 50% crit chance. that means statistically you have 0.99 grenades proc a bleed every 2nd grenade toss. if you have slightly more then 50% crit then you get atleast 1 bleed proc every second grenade toss statistically.

I didn’t mean the duration but the proc chance:
(Let’s pretend proc chances add for the sake of simplicity)
You throw 3 grenades per second (spamming only #1 let’s not add poison grenade or grenade barrage, again for the sake of simplicity)
With Sharpnel (trait) you get a flat 6% per grenade so 18% chance per cast to bleed.
With Sharpshooter you have a 30% chance on a crit to bleed; at 50% crit that’s 15% chance per grenade, totalling 45% per cast.
So at 1 cast per second (or 3 grenades) at 50% crit, your chance to inflict a bleed, either from Sharpshooter or Sharpnel is 63%.

RapBreon.9836:

It shows that the grenades scale better with power and crit, rather than power and condition damage.

No they don’t, I gave the scaling values in my first post, I really can’t get more into the basics than this, and even then you can only get a real answer when you factor in a lot a things including but not limited to, gear (specifically the stats on them as well as runes used), specs, traits, target’s armor (people forget that thoughness reduce direct damage but not condition damage) and probably other thing I’m not thinking about right now.

CptCosmic.3156:

proper runes give you a 8 second bleed from shrapnel grenade.

Shrapnel Grenade’s bleed base duration is 12 seconds, don’t know where you’re getting those 8 seconds from but it seems you’re mistaken.

And it looks like you’re wrong with sharpnel+sharpshooter calculations as well.

RapBreon.9836:

Carrion gives power, from previous testing power gives more raw damage than rabid. Rampager I never use, because if I’m making a condition damage build, I’d take the amulet that give the most condition damage.

The idea was to test both ends of the scale, not a hybrid. Which Rampager lends itself to being. Rabid and Carrion have a very obvious condition damage focus.

As I said it’s completely useless in a direct test because you can’t separate the direct damage from the condition damage ever, period.

While I don’t doubt that you’re trying to be helpful, your results are ultimately meaningless and misleading.

Lawbringer.1956:

and not being able to strafe or do anything because of having to extend my hand all over the place just to do a simple kit swap

Yeah, totally impossible to change the keybinds for utility skills in this game, or something. This has nothing to do with engineers anyway, go advertise somewhere else.

@RapBreon.9836
Direct testing has a lot of flaws.
In fact, I’d say your whole test is complete flawed:
First you choose Carrion stuff for your C. damage test, you basically delete a dps stat from your stuff and wondered why you killed things slower.
Your choice of traits is stupid, short fuse not working with grenadier at the moment and choosing sharpnel over incendiary powder, the burning condition having the highest dps of all.
Not taking Precise Sight and 10 points in tools is also stupid, OP asked a straight question, “what’s better between power and C. dam”; to find a true answer, saying that “you’re favoring one spec or the other” is totally backward logic (and you’re wrong, you’re skewing both specs as I said earlier).
Your rotation, adding Freeze Grenade is totally useless to a dps test since they do the exact same damage as the #1 grenades, the chill condition not doing any damge on its own.
All that added to the fact that you used a “time to kill” test over a grand total of 10 tests and your results don’t mean anything.

If anything grenades scale with stats like this:
Direct damage from power: 50% for all 3 grenades (78% for all 6 grenades from the toolbelt)
Bleeding from C.dam: 5% per stack per second
Poison from C.dam: 7.5% per second
Burning from C.dam: 25% per second
Precision increases the value of power by 2.5% per 100 (+5% crit) at 150% crit damage (base value)
Crit damage value is harder to calculate so I’ll leave it to other people.

Y u mad its vydia.6324:

Do you even play engineer?

The Mine fields gives 15 stacks MINIMUM, the luck is getting extra mines inside the fire wall. Because of how the mines are thrown, you will always have at least a few inside the wall, plus the extra ones outside the wall. With the explosion radius trait that will be a lot of mines finishing the combo. If you would have read my post you would have noticed you can also use Shield 4 for an extra blast combo. I don’t even know how you can complain about this, other classes can barely go up to 16 stacks with a lot of time spent and weapon switch, the engineer can get all this in 3 seconds. There’s no problem with stacking finishers on top of the fire wall, even under fire.

18 seconds is nothing. You can use mine 3-4 times even in 1v1.

Accord to my post, the player isn’t bad and can throw a mine and detonate it in mid-air at the right time. Sorry for the confusion. I don’t want to have to post my PvP rank, so if you want to discuss how bad this build is, bring arguments. I mostly posted this so devs can have a look at it, because the only thing that’s worth switching to from this is DPS grenade build in PvE.

I don’t want to rain on your parade but mine field always only spawn 5 mines, I don’t know where those “extra mines” are supposed to be coming from. And in case you’re confused, the mines are supposed to be inside the fire wall to trigger the combo field, if they’re outside, even if the explosion can hit targets inside the combo field, it won’t trigger the might stacks. While I’ll admit that I overlooked the shield 4 for an extra stack, it seems really complex for not much and you do spend quite some time getting them as well. Throw mine, mine field and healing turret aren’t instant.

And spending 1 minute killing someone in 1v1, isn’t anywhere near fast. In fact it’s pretty extreme turtling, you might not be dying and killing your enemy but if you think it’s fast, you’re totally mistaken.

And exploding the mine in mid air is fine and all, but the knock back is only of 300 so pushing someone inside the firewall would need your target to be at 300 or less range of your firewall (and you, assuming you set up your combo field). A 300 range hardly qualify as ranged combat.

Graywolf.6513:

since they gave incendiary powder a 4 second CD

That’s wrong though, the cooldown is 3 seconds which pretty much allow permanent burning with flamejets as long as you have enough crit.

Y u mad its vydia.6324:

Lol no, I’ve been playing this a lot and it’s very effective.

So, for your might stacks, you’re mostly relying on being lucky with mine field. I guess you really need to be lucky to get those mine both in an almost perfect line as well as being in range of their explosion. Also, you can only get 24 stacks of might at most with the combo you posted 3 from Enhance Performance, 3 from turret explosion, 3 from throw mine and 15 from mine field, again if you’re lucky enough to get them all inside the rather narrow combo field from Napalm.

At the same time you’re supposed to “Use your mine to avoid melee attackers / bring ranged attackers closer to you or inside the fire wall (by throwing the mine behind them”, I assume you’re talking only about throw mine since mines from minefield don’t have a knockback, but the cooldown on throw mine is 18 seconds which means you already lost Might from the combo field by the time the cooldown is up again so you can’t do both. Also, you’re expecting ranged to just sit there while you knock them inside the fire, that’s some pretty high expectations.

Well, and other things but I wonder if it’s really worth trying to convince you …

This is only theory, right? Because from my point of view, it’s really, really bad.

For damage, grenades with grenadier is the only way to go right now, just check the rest of the forum. And activate fast-cast ground targetting in the options unless you want a destroyed index finger.

Let’s leave the bugs alone for a bit since the engineer forum is finally open.

DPS

Right now, every dps spec other than grenades is (rightfully) considered useless and is mostly only good thanks to the grenadier trait.

• Flamethrower: Even with the new Juggernaut, the best spec I could come up with only did 75% of the dps I did with grenades
• Bombs: Does just a bit less damage than grenades but is over shadowed thanks to traits like Sharpshooter, Incendiary Powder or Steel-Packed Powder that can trigger multiple times in a single attack with grenades but only once with bombs. You’d expect a spec that basically forces you to sit on your target to deal good damage but no luck here. Also the healing from Elixir-Infused Bomb is terrible.
• Turrets: Not even considering that they are destroyed in 5 seconds on any fight with AOEs and for some unknow reason are often a priority target for basically any mob , the fact that they don’t scale with stats makes them obsolete. Their long cooldowns really don’t help either, they already don’t do much damage but when they’re destroyed and on cooldown, you really feel like you’ve been gutted.
• Rifle/pistol: At range, it’s the lowest damage i’ve seen in every spec I tried, in melee, it just alright at best. You just need to check the numbers to notice it.
• Elixirs(with HGH): Seemed interesting, too bad you have to spend so much time drinking potions for damage pretty much equivalent to what you get without spending 30 points in Alchemy.
• Harpoon Gun (because underwater combat matters too): If anything it’s in a better shape than rifle damage. But yeah, grenades are also better underwater.
• Grenades: Because even the best spec isn’t without faults, namely the trajectory of the grenades. At short or medium range the grenades are launched pretty much horizontally, but at long range, they are lobbed very high instead, increasing the time they take to hit their target zone by a lot but are also very likely to hit ceilings, decors or trees in the way.

Generally, specs based around long durations conditions damage are useless in group play or world events unless you’re the one with the most condition damage on your gear. (which is unlikely to be an engineer since we lose the stats from our weapon when using a kit)

Support

As a buffer, we’re basically limited to throwing elixirs which is absolutely terrible because:

• Random boon
• Short durations
• Small area of effect along with the fact that it’s zone targetted goes against the dynamic and movement heavy fights we see in GW2.

As a healer, we shine the most, too bad it’s boring, unrewarding, unreliable and everyone else will consider you mostly useless. See, being a healer in GW2 is a very hazy definition, I already expected that a long time ago when Anet announced they wanted to get rid of the holy trinity (tank, healer, dps).

• Boring because you have so few skills to begin with. (and I’m quite certain we’re one of the class with the most healing skills)
• Unreliable because all those skills are ground targetted or dropped.
• Unrewarding because it really doesn’t depend on you but on the rest of your group to go in the healing zone here, get in range of the turret there or walk on the bandages on the ground.
• And people will consider you useless, because Anet really insisted that there was no healer in this game, nobody plays them. And this whole: healers aren’t absolutely needed so healers are useless mentality, but for some reason people still ask for tanks (guardian or warrior) when doing dungeons.

Looks like Anet isn’t fond of lists.

3. Do not post more than one bug per thread: lists of bugs are not very helpful to us because we’re frequently sending thread links to specific people who may not be able to address the other bugs you’re reporting. Please make a separate thread for each bug you’re seeing.

Feel free to disregard this post in the future and post your bugs in new threads instead. And if you really want this class fixed follow the other guidelines as well.

XelNigma.6315:

Triple Post! And each a min apart.

Also Iv notice some times skills/traits that dont work in PvE/WvW will work in sPvP not sure why but they do. Maybe so they can balance sPvP with out screwing up PvE/WvW.

One thing I found while testing traits in sPvP was that the refined rifle barrel trait for more turret damage and range worked on giving the rifle turret more range, but it didnt display the new range on the tooltip. And when I over charged it for bleeding effects and faster cooldowns, the range was reset back to normal for the duration of the over charge.
I didnt test if the same problem affected the other turrets.

Tested a bit, the problem seeems to come only from the tooltip.

StarFreeze.3812:

I’d say this is on the borderline of a bug/functionality of what was intended. If you place a mortar you can’t take back control of it if someone else takes control like siege weapons. Too often in WvWvW, I’ll place it just for it to immediately be taken by someone else…whoohooo best use of my elite skill.

Not a bug no matter how you look at it.

StarFreeze.3812:

Also when using mortar while standing on a wall/ledge the rounds will explode immediately as I launch them. There doesn’t look like anything is in the way but apparently there is. No other spell effects are going on around me.

I guess the mortar could use a higher trajectory at short range and when shooting lower but it’s not really a bug.

StarFreeze.3812:

Noticed when I sometimes use Jump Shot the landing can take a few extra seconds if the person/monster I’m using it on seems to move directly under where I am to land. It’s like my character is stuck for a brief moment in the landing phase trying to figure out where to go.

Seems to be a server synchronisation problem.

StarFreeze.3812:

Overcharged Shot doesn’t all the time cure being immobilized. Trying to figure out if it’s a certain spell that’s causing this. I get knocked down but I’m still stuck in place and the immobilization is still going. Also noticed that if a selected enemy player moves out of range/to the side of me just as I hit overcharged shot nothing happens but I get a cool down.

Couldn’t reproduce it but I’ll add it.

gravekeeper.8352:

The Elixir Kit sometimes looses the target when the camera is rotated.

I don’t think it’s specific to the Elixir gun. I’ll add it in the general category.

Reveaux.5720:

couple more i dont think i saw

1) Explosion effects do not work at ClockTower location in PvP (grenades, mines) they land on control point and do not detonate

2) Mines can be placed and then a different skill can be selected in its place while the mines remain on the ground

3) Mines often remain on the map after detonation

1. Already added.

2. Added.

3. Couldn’t reproduce it, it could be a graphic bug from you.

BradersVal.1708:

not sure if anyone before has mentioned this.
1. grenade kits underwater, if fired without having a target they head straight “down” in relation to where the character is facing.
2. “Fumigate” cannot be cancelled mid cast by using other abilities (with the exception of dodge). Other channeled abilities like “flame jet” and “poison dart volley” can be cancelled

1.Added.

2. Added. It can be cancelled by utility skills but not by other skills from the elixir gun.

Elesmod.6790:

There’s a bug which increases every skill’s cooldown by a certain percentage. The skill’s look as if they were off cooldown, but I can’t use them for a few more seconds.

I’ve done some testing, here are the results:
Skill —-—————— Cooldown — Bugged Cooldown — Difference
Poison Dart Volley --——— 10 —-————— 13 —-———— +3
Static Shot——————— 15 —-————— 19 —-———— +4
Magnetic Inversion —-—— 30 —-————— 35 —-———— +5
Static Shield —-————— 40 —-————— 47 —-———— +7
Elixir H —-——————— 25 —-————— 31 —-———— +6
Elixir S —-———————- 60 —-————— 71 —-———— +11
Elixir B —-———————- 40 —-————— 47 —-———— +7
Toss Elixir U —-————— 60 —-————— 70 —-———— +10
Acid Bomb —-—————- 15 —-————— 19 —-———— +4
Napalm —-——————— 30 —-————— 38 —-———— +8
Warband Support (charr)— 240 —-————- 297 —-———— +57 (!!!)

It seems that the longer the cooldown the longer the bugged cooldown is.

I’ve created a new lvl1 engineer and the cooldown on Elixir H was correct.

I took all of my gear off and it didn’t help. So my conclusion is that it must be a trait bug. I’ve changed all the major traits — no difference. I think it’s one of the minor traits, but I don’t want to waste gold experimenting. Here is my spec:
Explosives: 25
Firearms: 15
Inventions: 7
Alchemy: 10
Tools: 0

Are you sure it’s not just lag? I tested it why your spec but couldn’t reproduce it.

Erllun.3278:

Grandmaster trait Automated Response from alchemy line doesn’t work and it’s a big issue when comes to spvp.
Also I like to see a anet post about all this bugs on eng profession becouse this game isn’t on beta anymore.

Added.

Elesmod.6790:

Big Ol’ Bomb combo finisher blast does not work.

It was working just a few days ago but not anymore, added.

Pannonica.5378:

I don’t like crossposting, but in case you don’t check the other thread regularly, I’m posting this here as well:

- Med Kit on 6 while out of water and Elixir H on 6 underwater.
If you use Elixir H underwater, triggering its cooldown, and get out of water, you now have the cooldown of Elixir H on your Med Kit and can’t equip it.

Added, thanks.

Spart.6578:

Juggernaut got changed.

200 Toughness still, lost the stability, lost the movement reduction, and every 3 seconds a might stack is added that lasts for 15s. Suppose you can cross that off the list.

I guess that’s a way to fix bugs. Removed.

Helevorn.2953:

Not sure if was mentioned before, did a quick scan but didn’t find it.

Backpack Regenerator is not working. I don’t get a regeneration boon when I equip a kit.

It doesn’t show but you still get the regen effect.

Yamsandjams.3267:

A few more bugs:

General: Multi-purpose toolkit back slot item often appears while transformed into another form, and often appears to be floating around the area (i.e. try transmuting into snow leopard form with that back slot item equipped and visible).

General: Movement impairing effects (i.e. chill) can cause skills with movements involved to have a reduced effect. For instance, using Acid Bomb (Elixir Gun Skill #4) will generally cause you to leap back a fair distance, but using it while chilled also reduces the amount of distance you jump back. I have not personally tested this with other movement skills, such as Overcharged Shot (Rifle Skill #4), Jump Shot (Rifle Skill #5), and Rocket Boots.

Tool Belt: Some tool belt skills (possibly all) have a land and underwater version, both of which operate on separate cooldowns (I have personally observed this with elixir skills) For instance, it is entirely possible to use Toss Elixir B (Elixir B Toolbelt Skill) on the land, jump into a nearby lake, and use the Toss Elixir B skill again after being submerged. I have not tested this rigorously, but it appears that they are considered two completely separate skills, and thus have two completely separate cooldowns. I assume this is the case with all “Toss Elixir” type skills underwater, but it may affect other toolbelt skills whose functionality changes underwater. This behaviour has not yet been observed with utility slot skills or kit skills.

Healing Turret (Skill Slot #6): It seems to be possible to sit in the AoE of the turret and continually build up duration on the regeneration boon, making it easy to build up several minutes (or potentially hours) of regeneration before heading off elsewhere (i.e. one can place one down and sit in the field while afk, coming back to find they have a 10 min regen boon on). Haven’t tested this fully to observe any limitations on this.

Healing Turret (Skill Slot #6): Regeneration boon seems to be applied two times in quick succession when the healing turret normally applies the regeneration during its cycle. If this is unintended, it may be the cause of the previous issue.

Healing Turret (Healing Skill Slot #6): The tooltip indicates “Combo Field: Water”, but attempts to make use of said combo field have failed. Have only tested this with Magnetic Shield (Shield Skill #4), which has “Combo Finisher: Blast” and is known to work with other combo fields consistently.

Super Elixir (Elixir Gun Skill #5): Ability seems to clear conditions (seems to be all conditions) on self (likely on others in AoE) but this is not mentioned at all in the tooltip. Either the skill is not supposed to do this or it is simply not mentioned in the tooltip.

Elixir X (Elite Skill Slot #10): If the “casting” animation gets interrupted (the moment when the timed “start-up” bar is filling up), the skill is put on a short cooldown and can be used again when that is over. After this “start-up” bar has finished, there’s an additional animation that lasts about 1 second before the character transforms into one of the forms. If the animation is interrupted at this stage, Elixir X is put on cooldown for its full amount instead of a shorter amount. As such, dodging or being dazed/stunned/knocked down while the “start-up” bar is filling will not punish you harshly, but doing so in the small bit of animation in between the two will effectively waste the skill completely.

-Can also happen with every kit but it’s a relatively minor graphic bug.

-Added.

-Added.

-The regen effect is capped at 1 minute.

-Nothing to say on that.

-That on is a bit tricky, the combo field only last 0.5 to 1 second everytime the regen boon is applied.

-Added.

-Added.

Bloody.8769:

Tested all the list as above and can confirm all bugs present and repeatable.

also, i did not see this on the list

Auto Attack is enabled ( for skill 1 ) when Engineer equips Grenade Kit underwater but not on land.

On purpose since you have to target a zone normally but go straight for your target underwater and I don’t think they can add auto attack to a zone targeted spell.

Battlewill.5614:

Minilys.4765:

Arcano.3214:

You might want to add these three, the Jugggernaut perk bug really annoy me since we already pay a 50% selfcripple to have stability, yet I’m still getting crippled debuff is added and cripple animation triggers.

1. normal weapons and its sigils are not giving any stat when a kit is equiped.
2. Flame Blast will get “obstructed” almost every time if used in a target you just blew away with Air Blast, the idea of our combo is to blow them away then hit flame blast while they are at range for the explosion. I have tested it in different places it fails no matter my position. I know that there is absolutely nothing in the way since its an empty field. (note that it will get “obstructed” only if used right away after using Air blast, seems to bug when the npc is performing the animation of standing up after been knocked away)

3. Stability from the juggernaut perk seems to be broken, even though it says I cannot be cripple, chilled, knocked bacl, pushed, or launched. I’m still getting crippled, I see my character moving slower than usual and the animation for your crippled character.

1. I already noticed it and I’m not sure this is a bug but I’ll add it.
2. Added.
3. I’m not sure this is a bug either, from the Guild Wars 2 wiki Stability: Ignore control effects (stun, knockback, launch, knockdown, sink, float, fear, daze) and doesn’t list crippled in the effects ignored but I’ll add it as well.

I’ll talk about the 3rd point : Simply because Stability does not Ignore Conditions but Crowd Control abilities. Cripple is a condition ability … then it’s totally normal to be crippled while under Juggernaut.

My2c.

Well, snares and roots are generally considered crowd control, soft crowd control but crowd control nonetheless.

Ashes.6418:

Not sure if this is a bug, intended (but unmentioned) feature, or just plain bad dice rolls, but when using Elixir X I have observed a clear favouritism toward the Giant form. Since release, I have only gained the Tornado form once, and the Giant form every other time. I have probably used Elixir X upward of thirty times. I also noticed this favouritism toward both Giant form and the Plague form during Beta. Plague and Giant forms were both about equal, and Tornado was very rare.

The tooltip does not mention anything about Giant form being more common than Tornado form— unless I am missing something.
I will do a test sample in the morning drinking Elixir X one hundred times and record the data.

Noticed as well, I’ll add it just in case.

Weresentme.2089

You can equip and use weapon kits in town clothes.

Well that’s a funny one, I’ll add it.