HoT Price Feedback + Base game included [merged]
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: MrYay.7063
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: MrYay.7063
I don’t get why the expansion is at the price of a new game. @ArenaNet HoT must be kitten good AND so what’s follows.
However:
- I’ll buy the game just because I like a lot GW2, and it is the only MMO I feel like playing. I like the design and how characters feels. And I bow to the fact it has been released without a subscription.
- I’ll buy it because I have enough money to spend on it rather than on another game.
- I’ll buy it because I believe ArenaNet is doing quite well overall in an industry that is so competitive nowadays. I want this studio to remain successful and I want to contribute so that GW2 gets better, at least as good and brings as mush diversity as GW1 (subliminal message inside).
Therefore, make it a good or, even better, a great game, and please don’t disappoint me.
Peace
Snoop Dog voice pack 4TW.
Peace
Now, GW2 may not have the weapons for reaching simplicity in the scope of eSport because:
- You start in PVE zone to be able to start PvP. I believe they should learn from GW1 with a portal with direct access to PvP zone. The character could still be shared between PvP and PvE/WvW
- Character class mechanics are all different. What is excellent for an MMORPG is not necessarily good for an eSport game. I mean, if you look at Ele where you have 4 attunements, Engineer with kits, Rangers with pets, Weapons swap in general, 2H/dual wield, etc. And I am not even counting on skills inside water. You need quite some training before understanding those concept, I mean for players not used to MMORPG.
- Character roles are not obvious and clearly linked to your build, which consists in Traits, Sigils, Runes, Amulets, Weapon Sets and Utilities. In theory any class can be bunker, burst damage, sustained damage, controller, support/heal, support cleanse, condi damage, etc. Let’s compare it to Moba. Any “hero” in a Moba will have a pre-defined role, and it is during the game that you will give him a specialty. Indeed, for newbies this is also quite difficult to understand if you didn’t play the tutorial. But still, here is the powerfull concept: during character selection, you can agree with your teamates what will be the orientation of overall your team. So if you are new, you can take the time to build slowly your character during the game. Even skills are aquired 1 by 1 for most Mobas. One things that help is the indication on which items works best on the “hero”, which are known as “recommended items”. Anet could provide pre-selected builds that fits to the class most.
- Now this related to skill set, the number of skills is not standardized either. If you had something like 11 skills and nothing more (5 weapons skills, 1 heal, 4 utilities, 1 elite, 2 1 F-skill) it would be more manageable. I mean, just for the sake of PvP, you would take the diversity of each class currently in term of skills, but you would build a standardized deck. Additionally, why not having a game mode where you can buy Runes, Sigils and Amulets in game? GvG v2.0?
- You still need to buy the game in order to taste it. I think the PvP zone should be free, with a limitation in character progression (like limited to level 10 and a restricted loot table period). I believe this will attract much much more players. (You could still expand the same concept to other game mode?).
- With respect to the visibility of GW2, well I don’t know what to say, a lot of special lights/particle effect coupled with Teleport/invisibility/AI spam and fixed camera make it difficult. Maybe a viewer mode could have a default particle/light effect mode with these toned down. I don’t know, Anet are the experts. Still, it is hard to review/learn from a game, so maybe a replay mode could be added too? For instance, At the end of the game, either you could rewind/replay the game, with slow motion and stuff, or you could download the replay, which you could share.
- The in-game announcement system could be enhanced with the stuff I like the most in Moba with the “Double-Kill, Triple-Kill, Quadrrrrra Kill, Pentaaaaaaaaaa Killl (LoL) or Annhilated (InfiniteCrisis)”, but I mean add voices! Since GW2 have its own annoucement with XXX is on the Hunt or XXX is Conquering, it would make it big. And you could have additional game mechanics like: who’s conquering get the in-game title “The Conqueror” and would activate a mission to the opponent team which would have to kill you and give, in return, a significant amount of point if they manage to stop you conquering. Additionally you could have more stuff sell in the Cash-Shop with different announcers voices like "Zaitan, Darth Vader, 50 Cents, Homer Simpson, Grouch, Japanese/French/Spanish/German/Chinese/English, etc).
- Different game mode to experiment. The current Deathmatch is a good start but I would have made the battle field flatter, much wider with stuff to break LoS and maybe some trap to activate as secondary battle field mechanic.
- Concerning the diversity in tactics and strategies, this is obviously inherent to the game mode/map. You could think about this: how come RTS/MOBA players play always the same map per game mode without ever get bored? Maps like Forest of Niflhel and Battle of Kyhlo are really good, but objectives to win a game could be broaden. For instance, why not think about point locking for a period of time? And another mechanic to unlock the point? You could either guard the point unlocker or conquer other point. Etc. Anyway, I think you get the point.
Peace
PS: ArenaNet or anyone else want to discuss about game design/economy in more detail, just PM me.
(edited by MrYay.7063)
GW2 would require to be simpler indeed, because players have barely the time to invest to understand all mechanics of the game, there are too many games out there. So indeed, simplicity needs to be there in following form:
1) The game need to be simple enough so that any newcomer can understand the character he is playing in 2 minutes.
2) The game need to be simple enough so that any newcomer can understand the game mechanic and objectives in 2 minutes.
3) The game need to have a game mode where everyone can fight equally.
4) The game need to have an area where the whole earth can meet and have fun, which means a small part of GW2 should be opened to free 2 play.
5) The game need to have incentive to progress and give the people want to continue even after reaching the level of Veteran player.
6) The game needs to be clear enough so that a viewer can understand what is going on and appreciate the skill level of players. This give the also the opportunity to players to enhance themselves while watching others or themselves to play.
7) The game needs to be play, fun to watch and fun to comment (shoutcasting)!
8) Players must know what is happening in the PvP community like tournaments, featured private servers, who are the best players, what are the most popular builds, etc.
9) The game need to be diverse enough to make an incredible number of viable tactics and strategies to win a game.
There is a sig that you can get by default now, part of the balance change.
Remember: knowledge is power.
Peace
PvP: everything (including sigils, runes, trait, skills, amulets) free except cosmetic. ==> this is balanced for everyone (noobs, veterant, beginners and pro-players).
PvE: Horizontal Progression is ok.
Thanks,
Peace
Simple and dumb question, should I spend all my glory (currency) before the 15?
Peace
SNIP…
Really solid explanation overall, nice to see someone post it.
No, it is absolutely not.
Bringing a new type of game in sPvP is bringing a new type of Meta.
There is no such thing as “one balance to rule them all”.
It’s like comparing WvW and sPvP balance (jewel excluded). It is a different type of format, different objectives, difference scale, different experience. Fortunatlely, having a new sPvP gameplay will still have a balance in the number. BUT, you will see different builds, maybe different team composition as well.
Peace
Rally is just a massive snowballing mechanic.
1 rally/death would be bad enough by any standard, but GW2 has everyone rally off of a single target. It’s just baffling.
Team-fights are decided by stupid finishers rather than combat skills.
Yes indeed. In sPvP, 1 vs 1, when you win over someone by a little, your opponent still have the choice to do damage/interrupt you or save its own life. When someone else come to assist, it quickly turns a 1 vs “dying” into a 0 vs 2, because the first guy has “rallied”. Instead, the second guys should be busy reviving him and deal with the situation where reinforcement come too.
In WvW it is even more ridiculous where you can rally from a raptor or when a whole of people resurrect at the same time.
Peace
Hi guys,
After several hours spent in sPvP and WvW, I came to think that this mechanism was too permissive.
What I propose is:
- you can still rally when you use bandage and manage to recover your health completly
- you can still rally when your allies revive you manually
- you can still rally when an ally revive you with a resurection skill
- BUT you cannot automatically rally on death of an(y) opponent whether it is a player or a NPC in both sPvP and WvW.
/discuss
Peace
Chill is not effective overall against most classes.
I have an “absolute-zero” build on my Elementalist, which I play quite often. You can almost perma chill an opponent, BUT it won’t be enough to be useful overall.
Why:
- because the -60% recharge rate work only on skills having CD
- because even if chill is supposed to lower down initiative recharge rate, overall Thief do not have any issue dealing with Chill.
- It is a condition, which is often cleansed by some traits mechanics. It does not do damage either. It is not as annoying as Burn or Poison.
For that I have (and still doing it) requested to change the Chill mechanism by lower down by 50% the attack rates (basically the opposite of quickness).
Peace
I am quite happy about this Trait. Indeed, it make me feel more Mesmer —> CC domination.
It will be quite powerful indeed, and we still have to see how it is going to work in game. At the same time, passive healing from signet won’t really suffer from this.
Peace
No, more sustain yes, but do not remove their burst damage, which is highly dependent on a zerk build with power/crit spec without/almost no survivability.
And Arcane shield 15s cd, no for obvious reasons.
Peace
I fully support this idea.
/signed
Peace
Nerfing Thieves won’t change a thing. Elementalist needs more immediate damage and less useless/unusable skills, effectively more synergy between their skills.
Strangely, also, condition builds on Ele do not work that well. In a condition based meta, no wonder why they can hardly make it (and no, adding more purge is not an option).
Peace
Five major problems:
- Chill: this condition does not work efficiently where Elementalist is has predisposition for this condition. Chill MUST be reworked. Instead of slowing movement it would work as the inverse of Quickness, by reducing the action speed by 50% (—> this is a conclusion after testing a lot of chill based-build on Ele and Necro).
- Conjured weapon: conjuring weapon is not natural in the action, it is a pre-emptive action. So they are ineffective during combat or not as effective as they should be. Either conjuring should add a secondary AoE effect on landing + Combo Finisher “Blast” at the location the weapon is conjured (e.g Fire: Burn+KB, Lightning: Thunder+Stun, Earth: Bleed+Root, Water: Poison+Chill) OR you allow conjured weapon to be swapped (with the condition to have only one weapon backed up at the time). Beyond that, Frost bow skills must be 1200, not 900; water arrow need to go much much faster (as fast as Ranger’s longbow n#1 skill). Without this change, Ele have 4 unusable skills in sPvP.
- Glyph of Renewal is clearly a design mistake (total useless utility: 5). Why? There is no secondary effect between the 165s of CD. Hence, this skill should be either a Signet or something extraordinary should happen when you revive someone.
- Now Focus Fire does not work at all. While it is a defensive weapon, it should deal significant damage by defending. So Flame wall have to be replaced by something like Warriors’ Combusting shot. Basically, large area of damage that eat you slowly by applying you burning should the opponent want to fight the Ele while is he “defending himself actively”. Fire Shield should be changed by the addition of weakness (5s) whenever a enemy strikes, on a lower cooldown (25 instead of 40s).
- Dragon Tooth, Shatter Stone, Ice Spike and Eruption must be either incremental, i.e you take immediate damage but damage scale the more you stay inside the area of effect, OR these skills would be coupled with an activation skill. What I mean is, I trigger Dragon Tooth, a second icon appears (name it “Bite”), the Dragon tooth is immediatly applied. There could be penalty like for instance the CD of dragon tooth would be increased by 20% if the skill is immediately activated, or the damage would be based on the number of second dragon tooth take to execute.
IMHO based on the aforementioned changes, Ele would be in much much better position.
Peace
(edited by MrYay.7063)
Yes, I have been telling people in my guild for months I wish they would just add arena and capture the flag. The current game type over and over and over again is just boring. I mean, I have 1400 played games, all of the same game type.
Exactly.
And a second game mode wouldn’t harm eSport, but would complete it.
Look at League Of Legends: you’ve got standard game and dominion. And then Riot Games perfected the two adding features to them. I strongly think ArenaNet can achieve the same for the PvP section. And who knows, in the long run, death match can potentially out-perform conquest.
Peace
The most roles in TPvP are allrdy based around teams. 1 dies = you won’t win anyway, completely boring, as if the first person dies it’s decided. I mean who would bring thieves in here?
They are based on current meta.
But I can already tell you your setup would be different for death match.
Controller archetype and rez skills for example would matter even more. Controller in current meta work half way because if the enemy already got a control point you will likely lack damage to put a bunker in danger, since all he have to do is wait for support. However in death match, you can literally shut down a spike damage dealer.
Furthermore, I believe bunkers would be a bit less important, or, by all mean they would have a different role, like bunker/healer or bunker/controller or bunker/pusher, hence hybrid.
I cannot predict if spike/backstab thieves will be viable in this setup, but I can tell you that Thieves have without no doubt their place using trickery/traps and/or mobility based aroud roll/shadow steps. Thinking about it, 1 backstab thieves would may be not enough, but two in focus fire, well that could be a winning all-in.
AoE would probably be another dimension to look at in this mode, you can predict tactic based on regroup-bio ball-spread.
Oh man, I can’t wait to actually play this. Dear ANet, what are you waiting for?
If deathmatch is implemented and the map is not small enough, then it’s going to be just annoying chases most of the time. In a wide map without objectives(which is deathmatch) half of your utilities will become worthless since there won’t ever be any reason for your enemy to stand in AOE unless it’s a stomp or rez situation. This would also be similar to small squad roaming in WWW.
Actually, I think both can fit. A relatively small arena to start with, and then why not make non destructible element to break LOS and stuff.
A wider map can fit for hot join 8v8 later on. And you know, guilds have created their own rogue GvG encounters to clarify “who is the best WvW” (check out 30 vs 30 War Legend (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwJ34UecxNk) or Red Guard videos for example), which as helped a lot to improve their own techniques.
Wait, you’re asking them to create a game mode that hasn’t consistently failed in nearly every competitive format it has been attempted!?
Granted deathmatch doesn’t have a much better track record, it is orders of magnitude better than capture points.
Why any company would make that choice is beyond me.. But whatever, that conversation has been beaten to death anyways -_-
Granted, and this is why I would like to insist on the fact that this game mode is more than needed at this day and age. Spvp in this current form is fine, and probably nearly there for e-Sport. However, when it comes to diversity and fun, well, the whole concept of conquest is getting old. It is cool to have new conquest map on the next patch, and I do appreciate PvP balance/developer/designer section to give us new content, Deathmatch is all about confrontation and fun. And the only thing we request is to tweak this mode over time. It doesn’t have to be perfect from day 1.
How about to create a mini colloseum using the same design as ArenaNet arena that you can find in the south east of lion arch?
- Just call it ArenaNet Collosseum, and put ArenaNet logo in the center of the arena, like you would do it in the center of a basket ball field.
- Put two big gates on each side and open them of each team when the countdown is done
- Get ready for rumble.
- Add 5 camera angle for observer mode. 1 on the very top of the arena, and four on north/east/south/west.
- Enjoy and collect feedback from community for a while.
Peace
PS: you can call the patch implementing it “Force & Honor”
The popularity of deathmatch can be seen over custom servers or low population servers when custom servers did not exist.
I’am 120% sure that it would be beneficial to the game. Two different game modes would be enough to not spread the sPvP population and give us enough diversity.
As you are saying, this would open up new archetype and builds and would certainly lead to new discussions/interests.
Hello ArenaNet & Community,
Can we have a Deathmatch mode to be part of GW2 sPvP, please?
It has been talked about since beta, and I really think you need to take into consideration this mode. A lot of us have been patiently waiting, and now is the time to introduce this mode. I really mean it, please:
- Just release a simple arena map, normal annihilation, a la GW1.
- No gimmick or secondary mechanic for the moment. Even though I love them in the current conquest maps, I think it will just burn your time to think about and/or implements new ones. Just keep it simple and stupid and super sexy (:D).
- Consider it as an experiment, a close up dialog between you and your beloved sPvP/tPvP community.
- I believe this should be a 5v5 encounter (but maybe you’ll will have a different point of view).
- You don’t need to put in the tPvP rotation yet.
- Based on feedback, you can enrich it later.
What is your answer?
Thanks,
Peace
Hi,
I just completed Solitude Vale and I did not receive any chest for having completed the zone.
Can you help me on this one?
Thanks.
Dear Arenanet,
I am quite pleased that you bring a new sPvP type of game, which give us a bit of fresh air regarding conquest.
Meanwhile King of the Hill is good, I have to admit that I was expecting a team Death match instead, and you can believe me saying that I was not the only one. I know other guys that wanted team Death match as much as I want, but they would die for a good GvG a la GW2.
So, I am requesting if you can use in game polls (like you used to do during betas) and forum polls as well in order to officially ask what the community really want. I think I don’t need to tell how useful they are, in term of communication, exchange, participation, and visibility.
One more thing, diversity of gameplay and an engaged community is really what turn the tide in term of MMORPG. You started exotic, it is time to ascend now in order to be Legendary.
Thank you for your time.
Peace
It works, but only if the shield pops. What I mean is, if you trigger Arcane Shield but noone hit you (or hit you enough) to make it pop after three hits, no damage/effect are triggered.
Peace
Charr Ele and Charr Thieves are awesome. If you could get skins like staff-less Elementalists similar to those Charr shamans with fire arms that would be the cherry on the cake!
Peace
I figured out that playing in group and even squads give substantially more badges. For instance, yesterday played with my guild during 2h30 I a got more badges than I would get alone in a day.
I hope it helps.
Peace
With all my respect EvilSardine, you should give more arguments, facts and even numbers or oh, why not builds, because at this stage, it just look like a disguised troll, especially when I see “my heals are absurd”
, and mentioning WWW where you engage up to 8 peoples, ah ah. That was a good one. You know that many other classes that can deal with 1vs3, like Warriors, Engineer or Mesmers, don’t you (it is a rhetorical question here)?
I can get the idea that you are bore with your D/D elementalist. I am playing one since early Beta tests and yes, I can confirm that D/D elementalist stands strong with a setup that brings him close to other Damage Dealers in the game with proper amount of HP and Toughness. D/D is all about avoiding damage and boon and they are very good at it when you know how to play one. And why people play D/D Elementalist, it’s because it is one of the most balanced/versatile/fun because dynamic/build of the elementalist.
Now saying that, you probably not have faced good Necro or Thief. A Necro reverse boon-condition/chill or a thief stealth/bleed-poison. What I find quite funny is that these two class (at least) are awesome when you use a build close to what ArenaNet originally designed them for (like a Mesmer/Interruptions).
So, I give you a hug, congratulation, you’re good at D/D. Now go and play with people that knows the meta-game, play tpvp (because this game is balanced around 5v5 encounters) you can even change region, I figured out that people from EU are playing differently from US.
Anyway, thanks for posting, but stating without argument = disinformation.
Peace
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