Guild Wars 2

Archaos.4953:

Jedah

You should seriously consider simply moving Merc to a European server. SOS has been struggling since launch to produce decent 24 hour coverage and I doubt at this point that there is anything you can do to “fix” SOS.

SoS is quite fixed at this point after it added over 1000 NA players this week. I think Jedah (who has been doing an outstanding job organizing SoS recruitment!) is just looking for some EU coverage to place between Oceanic log off and NA log on.

There is a fantastic amount of drama in this thread. What a great read.

A couple of quick points/corrections:

1. There’s no queue on SoS in any of the BL’s since Saturday.

2. There’s been some good fights to be had even with the sitatuation the way it is.

3. Commentary on the “skill” level of any of the three servers in a match up like this is hilarious. Let’s keep focusing on that because its a riot.

Sharpclaw.7510:

Match is close still, considered. TC’s not terribly far behind and even though they’re in last, Dragonbrand isn’t either if they manage a big offensive. Not to sound pejorative (and really I’m just talking playful talk here) but I do want to stress the word if.

;)

If?

Saranis

Its interesting, certain Dragonbrand guilds have approached Crystal Desert guilds with bets in the effect of “If we win, we’ll move to your server, if you win you move to ours…”
I don’t know of any guilds who have actually accepted these approaches, but its funny to see how desperate Dragonbrand is for WvW guilds.

DB really only needs a few more non-NA guilds to cover some of our weaker coverage times.

Not like latency matters much atm with all of the culling/rendering problems. Piling everyone onto the same servers would be hilarious IMO.

Ah well… was hoping they would address it publicly so that DB would stop getting blamed for X-Realming and sabotage.

Keripo.6842:

My block list has been empty since launch and I’m pretty sure I clearly stated that there are no ranks in our alliance system…

At this point, I’m pretty sure the posters in this thread are either just having fun trolling or have already jumped ships and are trying to dirty-propaganda up these forums. Back to work for me, no point feeding the trolls.

~Valkyrja Flame [RQ]

Did you see the thread about one of your members taking supply from keeps? Not sure if that thread was here or on GW2Guru.

Hux,

DB doesn’t need any more primetime guilds. Sounds like a plot by your server to clog up our queues.

However, DB IS seeking organized oceanic guilds to flesh out our already outstanding off-hours teams.

Ragnar Dragonfyre.1806:

I’ll gladly trade you my ability to play late at night for a permanent 9-5 Mon-Fri shift. If primetime players feel discriminated against they need to look up the term “First World Problems”.

Everything on this forum is a first world problem.

Sky.9347:

Heh… I guess it’s your last vestige of hope. I understand, but I would say don’t give up yet.

We, as a community, can still fix this. I can’t fix it and neither can you – but if we are respectful, reasonable, articulate, and persuasive we can perhaps change the trend of thought.

Don’t go all chicken little on me here.

The complaining on the forums is going to continue until they make adjustments (and they work) or the game dies. I’m not “holding out hope” as I’m just expecting that adjustments will be made. It makes the most sense and would retain the most players if they changed things vs leaving them as they are now.

Cyclonite.5786:

Kazim.2043:

If you have more people you win. There is no tactics involved. Check the queues and compare it to rankings:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Queue-size-data-from-9-14-to-9-18-NA/first#post200124

RamonDomke.9638:

Higher server population and maximum player cap in world vs. world do not go hand in hand. Yes, there is a statistical advantage of this happening – since you can fall back to a higher number of players. But stochastics and ‘large numbers’ do not per se grant an advantage – since we are talking mere ‘probabilities’. It still could happen that you have a caped out world population – of which no one wants to (or can) play at night.

The queue size maps directly to ranking and the graph also shows how servers with lower rankings don’t have their WvW zones maxed out 24/7.

Sky.9347:

Forgive my ignorance here, but what is it you keep saying about the “German CM”? I don’t visit the German forums, and so I haven’t read anything there. Can you link this post of his?

Page 2 of this thread. Look at the developers title.

Seems a little strange to me so I’m not taking it as the gospel on any future WvW adjustments until a known team member confirms it.

Sky.9347:

Finally, ANet has officially voiced their stance: HoD is the solution.

So now, my goal is to help convince the community to create 6 to 9 HoD-esque servers, so we can all just resume KICKING EACH OTHERS kitten

I’m still trying to figure out when ANet brought in the German CM to advise them on WvW adjustments. All other Dev statements were made a long while back before the problem became so obvious.

Here’s to hoping that their official stance is adjusted to meet the current situation.

Cloud.7613:

Okay, so you only care about your day of playing? have you played during the morning yet? Because as I’ve said before, I’m very certain your server has players, just so happens your server lost.

No, I care about the entire 24 hour cycle, not just the time when I play. Each timezone’s peak impacts everyone elses peak and the overall scoring of the match. Steps need to be taken to make sure that the matches stay competitive even if the timezone for many of the servers is vacant.

And no, my server doesn’t have a strong NA off-peak presence. If I hop online early in the morning before work its a ghost town.

Furthermore, the top servers need to stop pretending that their tactics, individual skill, or organization level is better than anyone elses. One thing that I see consistently throughout the 24 hour and nw the 1 week matches is that everyones playing at basically the same level and that its population at off hours that turns the matches.

Cloud.7613:

So you’re telling me, Americans don’t stay up all morning? ok, interesting, I must be vsing nothing but oceanic players, moving on.

Screw off? Everyone I know joined GW2 to play WvWvW because it’s 24/7 fighting. Not whenever Americans feel like PvPing. There are 3 big oceanic presences, Sea of Sorrows(which isn’t doing that well compared to most American servers, I wonder why?), Isle of Janthir(again, not doing THAT well but doing better then Sea of Sorrows) and Henge. And I can bet you Henge isn’t winning because of the oceanic players, Americans are up playing all night too, screw off? When we WvWvW, we have competition. Must be the oceanic population again right?

Nationality and time zone don’t matter to me. What matters to me is that the WvW zones are equally populated as much as possible throughout the day.

Sky.9347:

And?

I do what I want, and I am not an Oceanic player. They SHOULD say “screw off, I’ll do what I want” because they aren’t obligated to you, or ANet, or anyone else here. (generally speaking)

That’s fine and that’s what I’d expect that you’d say. That is why people are asking ANet to fix you regardless of your thoughts on the issue.

Cloud.7613

I’ve not seen anyone prove how a good method will help even out peak times, just people with issues. If anything it’s abuse-able. My server, would only WvWvW at our prime time, so it would be WvW. When it’s our prime time, we log in and dominant, then leave. ??? Beats the purpose really.

If you throttle the matchup so that no one can field more players than the lowest server in the group at any given time (give or take) then you would force the Oceanic guilds to spread out and improve competition.

Yes, its a kitteny thing to do but at this point the oceanic guilds have basically told everyont to screw off and they’ll do what they want. This forces them to spread out and make the environment competitive.

To be fair, you could also do the same thing to prime time NA guilds but you’ll find that it doesn’t have any impact since they are maxing out the zones anyway during this time.

Cyclonite.5786:

RamonDomke.9638:

Night capping is one of those valid tactics to score some points in a lasting battle – to get your world the upper hand, or cancel out daytime supremacy by another well coordinated opponent..

What are we debating here? Anet recognizes night capping as a valid tactic.

The German Community Manager recognizes it, does that matter? Is the CM part of the WvW dev team? Mike Ferguson recognizes it dating back a few weeks ago.

The hope is that Mike (who is the one that really matters here) will change his mind and fix the kitten game. Hope that sums it upf or you.

Sky.9347:

That isn’t what I meant. And I mean no offense, or passive aggression. I am being 100% serious.

I thought this population imbalance was a problem ANet could help with. They have said they are looking for ways to let guilds keep their influence, and they also said they will make no changes to the game for these population imbalances.

Well, okay then. Question answered. Let’s move forward.

The only solution is for most serious WvW players to play with each other. Since we are only 20-30% of the population, 30-40% of the top servers should be where we all go.

The top 30-40% (7-9) servers should be filled to the brim with everyone kittenally wants to play WvW to win. The other 60-70% of servers will dabble in WvW and hopefully will be relatively matched.

Queues might be a small issue, but that comes to each individuals preference.

If it is important to YOU, then YOU make a choice for YOU and move YOURSELF to a server that has a chance to be competitive. I’m not saying flock to HoD, I’m saying the top 2 or 3 tiers of matches.

It is a reasonable solution, given the current situation… is it not?

I like your approach to discussing the subject… for starters.

My concern here is that we could all move our guilds to the top four servers… and it’ll bring them crashing to the ground. We’re going to ramp up the queue times during prime to the point of being ridiculous and none of us will be able to WvW at all. If everyone is serious about playing there like you say the queue times may never get to a reasonable points.

I couldn’t care less about guild upgrades at this point. The queue is the bad part. I also consider myself to be serious about PVP and I’m in a guild that does only WvW.

Judas.5432:

That’s where you’re wrong. I would argue that the reason SBI is staying on top is because we don’t get discouraged just because we aren’t winning.

Kittens, man, WvWvW is fun to play regardless of whether or not your work is undone by morning. We will continue to take kittens back and fight like hell to win. Nobody is unbeatable despite their powerhouse numbers at night.

Complaining won’t get your morale up. Head to Lion’s Arch and let people know you are pushing back. Find a guild that will focus on WvWvW and make your game fun despite what happens when you are offline.

I’m not referring to SBI, ET, or JQ with my posts. I’m talking about the rest of the servers without significant off-peak presence. The guilds that are all piling onto the top 4 servers have a skewed view on what is good and what is bad. They are submitting themselves to queue issues in order to win.

To clarify: complaining will hopefully get ANet to realize the problem. That is why people are complaining here.

Sky.9347:

Large NA Prime Time guilds can move to #5 and #6 and turn them into competitors almost overnight.

We all want good tense matches. There is only one solution… everyone has to clump up near the top, and suffer slight queues.

If WvW is important to you, join one of the top servers. Queue times will generally improve the farther away from #1 you get, but that depends on your prime time.

This is seriously flawed.

DB and CD have large NA alliances which are organized. We held and and traded the lead in points multiple times throughout Friday and Saturday. It was a fun and competitive matchup for those two days.

However, once Sunday evening rolls around and people start to head to bed before work/school on Monday then we get trounced and no one has fun for the rest of the week.

These top servers need to stop thinking that they are winning because of superior players or organization during prime time. They just aren’t and the real reason is population issues during off-peak hours. These blow outs are NOT happening during NA prime time.

Sky.9347:

All serious WvW players should immediately and permanently move to one of the top 6 servers.

There are not enough of us to fully fill out every NA server. If you want consistently competitive games, you are going to need to group up with the top two tiers and help further populate their maps.

Maybe even top 9, but I doubt it. This is the future, gentlemen. If you want to WIN – you need to be in one of the top 6-9 servers. The rest will only ever dabble, and will NEVER break through the population barrier to the top tier where the real fights happen.

It needs to be the top four servers… not the top 6-9. The difference between the 4th and 5th server is massive. The oceanic guilds have made it this way permanently because they aren’t going to move to make things competitive… they are content winning during off-peak hours.

To summarize, anyone who enjoys competitive WvW should move immediately and subject themselves to ridiculous queue times.

Blaeys.3102:

A few days ago, Henge of Denravi took a substantial lead, one that quickittenurned into a statistical inevitable victory. Even people on the server realized this was due primarily to “night capping.”

Then a lot of people (mostly on these forums) said it would kill WvW, hurt the experience, cause people to quit trying, etc.

But then, something very different happened. The battlefields all stayed full – very full. Queue times didn’t go down substantially. Stormbluff and Eredon Terrace continued to push hard and, at many times, maintained the highest number of capture points (often by a huge margin).

That just isn’t something that is sustainable. It isn’t going to keep happening.

I’m on a T2 server and we drew JQ this week. JQ, due to its overwhelming population advantage blew DB and CD out of the water. Next time one of our servers draws JQ… many people just aren’t going to bother. The same will go for ET and SBI as they get rotated down into the lower tiers. Similarly, as T3 and T4 gets T2 flunkies they will get crushed.

They have to fix the system to make it competitive and somewhat skill based. Individual/group player skill and organizational skills of alliances. Timezones shouldn’t factor into this as heavily as they do because off-peak guilds are rare birds… birds that have decided to flock to a couple of servers and stay there no matter what.

They are anti-competitive and they are content to just sit there and win unearned landslide victories. The player base has decided that it isn’t going to fix itself.

Ramone

Hi Everyone,

All is fair in love and war – and as love, WvW is a battlefield.
There are exploits, I’ll give you that – but then there is coordinated effort to ensure your world or your team uses each and every resource they have to their advantage.

War is not fair, war is not pretty, war gets out the worst in us – and the best – and even if we have excluded open world pvp from the rest of the game, this is exactly what happens on the WvW maps: It is the ‘playground’ for strategists and great tacticians, it is the place for coordinated efforts and mean ideas in the middle of the night.

Night capping is one of those valid tactics to score some points in a lasting battle – to get your world the upper hand, or cancel out daytime supremacy by another well coordinated opponent.

As Guild Wars 2 will progress in time, so will world vs. world and core gameplay mechanics. But for now, night capping is one valid possibility to ruin your enemie’s days – pun intended.

So is this ANet’s official stance on this? Something tells me that it isn’t. I’d love to hear from the WvW team devs on their take.

In direct response to you however, I would point out that WvW is not War, it is a game. Games are typically considered fun because they are somewhat structured in that they have rules. Many games start out missing key regulation and as the game is played the rules are amended or added to.

The complaints you are getting from people that don’t play on one of the Top 4 servers is that one of the major game modes in your game is going to start emptying out soon. Keeping players interested at the guild level is getting more and more difficult. Eventually, after servers experience repeated blow outs to night-capping losses people will start to get fed up and stop trying at all.

This will lead to people going into WvW just to farm… farming either players, objective swapping, or piling up in the jump puzzles. Is that how you envision your game in a month or two?

The math is really simple here. You need to do something to keep the people that aren’t happy. Implementing the fixes necessary to make those people happy isn’t going to alienate anyone who is enjoying the system now. They will continue to play and stroke their kittens regardless.

It makes the most sense for you stop posting stuff like you just did… and fix the issue (and quickly).

lollie.5816:

Forcefully move groups off HoD? You mean force Oceanic players off HoD? Hey let’s go further and force NA players to the Oceanic servers SoS and IoJ.

Who knows, that could be a possibility. If I were ANet, I would certainly be thinking up SOMETHING at this point before the crown jewel of my game stagnated completely.

lollie.5816:

Grim West.3194:

In the end it is only going to be solved by ANet, if at all. I can assure you that whatever happens, many players on HoD will not like it.

What are you expecting Anet to do? Ban the Oceanic players from playing in their own hours? You’d rather we couldn’t play during our peak hours, than go to the trouble of recruiting Oceanics yourself?

Then there’s the fact ET beat the two main Oceanic servers during their matchup vs IoJ and SoS. Explain how that happened, seeing as ET has no Oceanic crew.

They could put crank down the scoring according to lowest pop server, cap other servers pop to the current level of the lowest server, they could forcefully move groups of HoD to balance things out.

Who knows? (not us) But, those are some of the potentially disastrous things that could happen for HoD.

lollie.5816:

Can the leaders of the respective guilds come clean up their less intelligent members from the official forums. I now have a really bad impression of certain servers because of them, pretty sure I’m not the only one coming away with this impression (endless QQ shame for server).

We were just thinking the same thing about HoD posters here. Who’s your GL… maybe we can get him in here to clean this thread up.

Binafus.8153:

So HOD has lead the points per tick all night during your prime time tonight?

Who you gonna blame that on?

Before long it will be 24 hours straight HOD has lead in point per tick every tick.

Pick the hour that is your perfect time for your server, all the stars align, the sun is not in your eyes, YOU LOST THAT HOUR TOO.

LOL

How is a normally evenly matched prime time group supposed to recap fully upgraded stuff gained overnight? Why would they even bother, knowing that it’ll flip again when they go to sleep?

Your logic is deeply flawed.

azizul.8469:

yeah.. transfer to Devona…. no Q at all….

I promise you that the thought has not entered their minds a single time.

It must suck to have those super long queue times and still not have the respect of the other servers.

You guys should transfer to Devona’s or something.

Keldrath.4735:

Hmm… let’s see, as I type this…

+370 HoD
+220 SBI
+105 ET

It’s 8:30pm CST. this is NA Primetime.

So where did your primetimers go? by the logic people have been spewing out we should be getting dominated right now.

That’s a very illogical conclusion that you’ve stumbled upon. If your night shift capped everything with little resistance and then upgraded everything how would you expect a prime time force that is equally matched under normal circumstances to take it all back?

Poor show, sir. Poor show.

Keldrath.4735:

Ald.9418:

Astonishes me how some people cannot see how having all the Oceanic players crammed on 1 or 2 NA servers is absolutely terrible big picture wise.

If people can’t see this is hurting WvW and GW2’s longevity, then i don’t know what to tell you.

Yes because there are only like 500 oceanics playing the game on NA servers.

Ya know?

Where did you make up that number from?

Bad news… all of the servers are at basically the same overall skill level. It all just boils down to coverage. Bummer, I know.

Hope that helps.

lollie.5816:

Wait I’ve got more. Oceanics play with a 200ms-300ms latency handicap. Maybe we should give this latency handicap to NA players as well, you know, to make it fair.

NA players? Don’t you mean the keep doors?

shedim.8504:

I’m getting tired of all the self proclaimed pros telling me to l2p, Guardian is fine in WvW and I should reroll. The lack of ranged weapons occasionally shows up in pve, but it’s negligible. You don’t haveany issues in spvp as a Guardian, but WvW is a whole different story. This profession has severe flaws in WvW because of the lack of viable ranged weapons and the ultimates simply not fitting the class. You can sugercoat it as much as you want but it won’t change anything.

Dear TE, feel free to try WvW with your Guardian. If you encounter issues or situations where you don’t feel viable or you’re not having fun just don’t fool yourself lvling that things are going to change once you hit 80. Just have a look at how many players are complaining about the Guardian’s lack of ranged weapons. I doubt every single one of them is a noob who should l2p or needs other clowns to tell him how the game should be played and how to enjoy the game. The whole GW2 mindset was repeatedly described as everybody can play his profession the way he wants to, as far as I recall correctly. If so many people can’t play the Guardian the way they want to, what does this tell you?

@OP,

The guy quoted above is doing it wrong. While guardian has no meaningful range specs there are many different thing that you can do at any point during WvW.

Its a great WvW class that many guilds are critically short on. The amount of utility that it brings to the table is ridiculous and that’s why a lot of guilds are having their players roll them as alts.

Keldrath.4735:

One thing I just need to add, in case someone else gets it and changes their mindset for the better is…

This whole attitude I am seeing is the attitude of a failure. People are always too full of themselves and their own ego’s to the point they will defend it to their own detriment. Stop blaming everything else. Stop blaming your teammates, stop blaming your server, stop blaming THE GAME ITSELF. That is a recipe for failure right there.

You need to change your mindset if you want to improve.

Since you’re an HoD player your point of view makes a lot of sense to me. You desperately need to promote this idealogy on these forums in a way that influences ANet so that your server isn’t impacted by forced transfers, mergers, or scoring changes that would hurt you.

HoD has inadvertently (I think) made itself the biggest target for future fixes to WvW.

Cyclonite.5786:

Fact is WvW is 24×7. If your server is weak during certain periods of time then do something about it instead of complaining.

Actually, I think the intent is to complain on the forums in sufficient volume to get the developers to make significant changes to the way WvW scoring is handled.

I don’t see how ANet wouldn’t change things because as it sits now it isn’t an interesting, competitive, or sustainable game mode right now.

Sky.9347:

The middle tier matches are all the same, too.

The reason is because no matter where you fit into the grand scheme of things, one of the three servers WILL have an opportunity to full cap while facing little resistance, and then it’s a downhill ride from there.

Yeah, Dragonbrand beat the crap out of TC and Maguuma because we had a better night presence. Now Dragonbrand is getting crap kicked out of it by JQ because their night presense is better.

One thing that I notice between the two weeks? TC, Maguuma, JQ, and Dragonbrand all play at the same approximate skill level during prime time (my play time) and the level of coordination/organization is pretty much the same. The landslides occur late in the weekend and throughout the week when people start to sleep.

Keldrath.4735:

HoD is ahead of the rest still, but the other servers in the top 3 are closing the gap pretty quickly. I know one thing that helps a lot on my server is the chat, there is a lot of communication going on and things not related t the battle are practically non existant. people call things out, respond quickly, and often the titan players will relay messages to the rest of us, telling the “militia” where they are needed etc. There is a lot of coordination and teamwork going on. That is something I think anyone who wants to compete for #1 is going to need to have.

What you describe here isn’t unique to HoD. What makes the top 4 servers unique is their 24/7 coverage.

Nick.3926:

What will happen is #2 and #3 will always lose to HoD and #4 will always win vs #5 and #6 which willr esult in #4 moving up every week to lose to HoD only to have a new server fall back down to #4 to dominate #5 and #6. Week after week after week.

To make things worse, I’ve already seen rumblings from the #5/#6 servers about taking intentional losses to be matched up with servers that aren’t going to night cap them and wreck all of their primetime holdings/upgrades.

I’m not sure how this is a sustainable game mode in the long term.

Guardian here…

You’ve gotta use a tanky build to be effective… there are several different builds that work well. If you’re expecting to be anything less than tanky then ou’re not going to have a lot of success in WvW.

I do we wish we had a viable ranged option though.

Keldrath.4735:

I don’t get all of this “henge has no skill because they just attack doors all night” argument. I play at Primetime and I also play during the night a lot of the time as well. At night it is never just “player vs door” You just act like these servers have no presence at night. Well sorry, they very much do. Maybe not to the same extent as during primetime, where they can defend and attack simultaneously pretty easily, but it’s never a case of “player vs door”

Its unfair to say that you PvD all night for sure. However, if you’re competing against opponents where you have a 3:1 or 2:1 population advantage then you really aren’t competing much at all. Anyone should be able to overcome defenses with those odds stacked in your favor.

It isn’t your fault and I’m not judging your personal skill level. I’m just trying to make sure that people understand that this isn’t a competitive environment and in my own experience… there isn’t a large skill gap between any of the servers when the odds are even.

Chromatos

Unfortunately, there is a rather large gap between the first 4 servers and then all of the others, and it means that the other two worlds in the second tier match will always get completely and unfairly dominated by whichever of these 4 servers is currently in 4th place (at least until one of them starts to sink, or two more rise to match them).
It really quite markedly shows the difference between a server with a dedicated alliance and organisation, and all the other servers with a more casual approach.

I’d have to disagree with this assessment. DB has organized guilds and alliances but JQ simply has better 24/7 coverage. Dragonbrand has been able to hold its own consistently during prime time, taking and holding the lead in points gain equally between the three servers.

There is simply is no marked skill gap between the servers when players are online for all sides. Props to JQ for having oceanic and/or EU guilds to support them (seriously). But asserting that JQ is more organized and that it has better alliances is just plain inaccurate.

Igolbug.7295:

Phoenix.7069:

Get over it, it’s called tactics. No point complaining on the forums.

I think it’s actually the opposite of tactics…

Technically its strategy and not tactics.

There are still a ton of people running dungeons post patch… but the ones they are doing are the couple of workaround/speed runs that still exist for getting tokens and what-not.

I haven’t touched them since the patch. I would consider doing Arah speed runs for tokens but I know that once I get a couple of runs under my belt it’ll be “fixed.”

Sounds like they are finding creative solutions to fixing the grind. Something Anet seems unwilling to do themselves.

Daboris.6730:

That’s a better design. So you’re saying you’ll laugh at people who worked hard and put in hours for their pieces and endured all the deaths everyone claims come no matter what, right? So less people will have them, and people who do have them will feel like they earned it and are actually part of a minority?

Seems like the perfect solution. Make people who can’t take it stop doing them because the dungeons are actually too hard for them – not just the difficulty, but because the “reward” is stagnant at “oh,kitten I don’t get enough silver”…whereas the ACTUAL reward for doing dungeons is the armor pieces at the end.

Cool/unique things should cost money and require time and effort, not make you a profit all the time along with make you look cool.
^Learn this, then realize why dungeons are a money sink and worth it, from the right perspective.

Let me get a few things straight:

1. The dungeons aren’t hard at all. The dungeons are tedious, unimaginative, time consuming, and repetitive.

2. If i saw CoF gear (which I have pieces of BTW) on someone… I just shrugged it off. Wow, someone took the time to do 60 runs of that dungeon… what a time sink. If I see CoF gear now I’ll assume it was acquired pre-buff or that person carebeared their way through 60 runs of an incredibly dumb dungeon. I certainly won’t admire them for their “skill” in running the same scripted PVE event 60 times.

3. People are going to stop running the dungeons because they are tedious (even more so now), unimaginative, time consuming (even more so now), repetitive, AND give kitteny rewards. They aren’t going to stop doing them because they’re too “hard.”

4. Dungeons just went from being barely worth the effort… to not worth the effort by a long shot. I would be just thrilled if they posted pre-buff metrics and compared them with post-nerf metrics. I bet they’ll see all the effort they wasted creating those dungeons contrasted by the few people that bother to run them anymore.

5. I’ll spend my time from now on farming badges and influence in WvW. I’ll spice it up by doing SPvP in between. I’ll my chuckles by seeing the sets of tedious dungeon gear sets running around.

Cheers.

The changes are absurd. I’m done posting reasons for why it was absurd.

I think that a massive chunk of the user base will just stop running the dungeons (myself included) and the armor sets that we see running around will just be something for us to chuckle at.

Kain Francois.4328:

I am sure ANET is reading all the explosive feedback.

I sympathize with the people who hate this patch, and I am sure this upsetting change is only temporary.

Yeah, my money is a full reversal or an overhaul of the rewards system. Too much hatred flowing as a result of this nonsensical patch.

I haven’t seen “fixes” this bad since Diablo 3. Wait, that wasn’t that long ago… this industry is really going down the chute.

Richard.8207:

drwookie, have you played a pure dps recently and compared badge/hour rates or such? How big is the current discrepancy?

There is just a lot of noise mixed in with potentially useful comments on this issue. Some of it is support players foolishly believing dps players that are just lying about how fast they get badges right now. Or people are comparing their current support badge generation to their badge generation on pure dps builds weeks ago. Or people are seeing diminishing returns on loot and thinking it is because they aren’t doing enough damage. I’m hoping people can provide more specific details about their experiences so any specific problems that exist can get the attention deserved.

Seems like about 30-40% more badges during a normal play session on my DPS Necro than my Support Guardian. I’ll start trying to keep better track.

My necro just deals way more damage to way more things. I try to tag by spamming staff but I try to stay more focused on support work than diving in to deal damage.

I think that an easy fix is to give the entire group credit for a kill.