Guild Wars 2

top five priorities well that’s a long story:
wrote a thread about the stuff i think would fix problems
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/const-How-to-fix-the-WvW-and-Guild-PvP/first#post6033179

long story short:
1. listen to the community – don’t ignore the GvG community
2. focus on the pvp part of wvw – pve is fine but to much is not good for the game mode
3. skill balance – yeah some stuff needs balance there
4. get some cookies – with cookies is everything better
5. read the thread

best regards, just a dedicated palyer

Archslayerxd.3597:

Can this guy become an Anet dev? I think these are more ideas then the past 2 years have brought…

thx mate for that compliment
I am an Engineer (in rl) and not a game developer, i just love the games (GW1 and GW2) and wanted to share my thought, prolly ANet will read and like it as well

Yuffi.2430:

So let me try to summarise this.

For WvW you’re suggesting a 3 way mega-server match on old style maps over an EotM time scale?

For GvG you’re suggesting that PvP is extended to cater for larger guild groups to play a larger version of Legacy of Foefire?

WvW should feel moer impactful with a nice concept behind it and background story.

no larger LoF, no capture and Hold a real revamp of GW1 GvG and heroes Ascend there’s a difference in it.

but in basic words you are kinda right

Hello everyone,
Some of you might know me as the guy who organised the ESL GvG Ladder.

I’m a dedicated WvW player since the betas and I’m a veteran GW1 player who focused on PvP (be it AB, HA or GvG)

To understand the core of WvW, we need to understand it’s roots:
It is most compareable to the GW1 alliance battles.
You had objectives to capture by killing a few NPC’s on the point.
ANet understood to split the “big” group of 12 players into 3 small groups to have small scirmishes, but to pull them on certain points together to have epic big fights with a 12v12.
In WvW you have the same roots, with some upgrades to the capture points. you have big fights but the splitting of the big group is not given somehow, so there should be a promotion in the game for splitting the big zerg into small groups to cap different objectives.
WvW is a PvP/PvE mode, but the PvE part of it should concentrate on the necessary things, like objective defenders. the rest of the PvE environment is there to make the map more lively, but this is not needed and can cause performance issues since this is server resources spend. so remove all the neutral creatures (they don’t have a big use to the WvW experience anyways) the neutral events could be used in a better way as well, instead of letting them stand around somewhere in the world, why not letting a neutral group attack an objective to get the player split as well.
WvW shouldn’t be about avoiding fights, it should promote PvP battles. So give the maps a more open look, the Desert Borderlands are nice to look at but it’s really easy to miss a fight. If the maps have clear ways to get from point A to point B people can flank them on the way or what ever. The maps still can look fancy but there is no need for 5 different levels. With more fights people will have more fun with the Game Mode overall and will enjoy the sieges as well.
Next the popluation issue:
This can be solved in a way GW1 showed with alliance battles as well:
The game already has 3 factions, so why not use them?
The guild can decide which faction they want to join and fight for. With that a balance of population will occure in any way.
Short excourse to PvE:
You might ask: why should the 3 factions fight each other, aren’t the a big alliance?
This can have a nice story Line for a Living Story in it. We just killed another dragon in PvE and now we want to go for the next Dragon, but which one? well every faction wants to go for another. since the AMA we know you are working on expac2. why not one of them wants to go to another continent (Cantha) to conquer it and the other two have a problem with it? Here you have a PvE influence threw WvW, like the AB’s had an influence on PvE as well (gets important later). I’m not a Story Writer nor do i know what you have planned for that, but it’s a suggestion.
Back to WvW:
we fixed the population. What now? yeah rewards would be cool.
we have a faction system, so why not spending a new/old currency onto them and some merchants. we have WvW ranks so why not doing a currency out of this, one rank up gives a certain amount of faction reward points. so now you can spend them on a vendor for ascended gear (trinkets, armor and weapons) no need for players to go to PvE and craft really expensive armors, you once told us we can play the game however we want and have the chance to get everything we need, asc gear is not one of those things you can get with wvw in an “easy” way like in PvE. so you might now say: well there will be people getting everything when we would do that. yeah there are but they already played WvW for 3.5 years so why not give them what tehy deserve for their dedication. in my opinion a player with WvW rank 500 should be able to get a whole asc set. this takes a certain amount of time to get, so this should be fair.
What if I have everything and don’t need anything of that vendor? Spend the points on supplys for the PvE war going on. Earn with your guild the control over a city in PvE (like GW1 )
Legendary Back Pack threw new WvW achievements, like fractals and PvP.
Exclusive Looking WvW Legendary Armor?

So let’s talk about the Maps:
in GW1 AB we had a rotation of maps depending on the state of the border in PvE.
GW2 WvW could have this too so people would have a rotation in maps and wouldn’t get bored of some maps. and you could give a weaker faction an advantage. go for overflow maps with an indicator how the population of the map is, like: you have an advantage on overflow 3 so it is marked with a symbol to show. you have a disadavantage on overflow 5 you have another mark to sign it, so people can decide where to go to help their faction and know which overflow they are on to tell their friends.
we talked about the map design earlier, so again short, clear paths to obejectives promote open field fights.
Match Duration:
problem with the 7 day match is that it’s a long time so if you loose a certain objective it doesn’t feal like this is a big issue you can take it back and be fine with it later as well.
so I would recommend a one day Match. Why? a loss of the objective would mean a bigger impact to the matchup. and there is more happening in PvE border movement as well.

Lot input for WvW but this should basically fix the major issues to it.
Let’s talk about Guild PvP:
GW1 had two big Guild PvP Modes: Guild versus Guild and Heroes Ascend
What the GW2 GvG community reffers to GvG is basically a Heroes Ascend kind of Game Mode. (to clarify it)
GW2 has the potential for both:
a pure Guild Deathmatch mode: kill the enemy team and advance one round
a GW1 like GvG mode: fight to kill the enemy Lord

Let’s talk about Game Mechanic:
The Game promotes a kinda bigger combat than 5v5 since in a pure 5v5 fight you have certain things to look at, condition pressure can get ridicolous so noone will ever be able to clean it and power burst dmg can get negated easily.
to get a balance between the extremes, a bigger group is needed with supportive players as well as dmg players, in a 15v15 power and condition is working quite balanced, both have their counter play in this scale. so in the future we will talk about 15v15 as a standard match size.
15 player rosters open up a lot of varity to the meta team comp (more back line focus <-> more frontline focus)
there are enough condition cleanses in the roster to clean a certain amount of conditions but still be able to get damage done themselfes and it is still not to much so conditions are still a viable option.

How to do a Deathmatch:
no respawns like in Coutyard more like a round based system you kill all next round starts with again 15v15, so a complete snowball isn’t possible. there are a lot possible match ups in a queue form bo1 bo3 bo5, (bo3 would be my way to go)
have different maps with enough space to fight but still have some obstacles to have a postion game in it as well. go threw maps like in GW1 HA until the Hall of Heroes where the ultimate fight happens of the best teams of the queue.

How to implement GvG:
Stronghold is not a revamp of GvG it’s a try to get GW2 into a MOBA game. sorry devs but if you wanted to do a MOBA you should have prolly go somewhere else or shouldn’t have developed a MMO Game, THIS IS NOT A MOBA GAME!!!
What’s wrong with Stronghold? people are running back and forth and not fighting for the aim. It’s completely different to what GW1 GvG was. in GW1 one player ran the flag the rest was trying to kill the enemy team or the enemy flag carrier, so it was a fight around the mid of the map and who won that could push further into the base to kill the lord.
It was a PvP fight with nearly no PvE elements which interacted with it.
give the game a clear aim: Kill the enemy Lord!
how to reach that objective: get threw the enemy team, they want to hinder you, after that get threw a gate and push for the lord.
Have a revive mechanic (not setted like in sPvP) with a monk who is reviving them at a certain time, so he can be killed so no respawns would happen after that and would give the enemy team basically the win.

Long post if you read it all thank you:
for everyone else:
tl;dr: ANet get back to your roots, you made some really good things in your past with GW1 use this experience you got there and with the new Game Mechanic you can create something really great.

That’s it from me, for questions regarding the topic or the GvG ESL Ladder, just feal free and ask me

To ANet: Thanks for a great game, let me help you to make it really GREAT

just a little bump.

sign up and let’s have some awesome time in the GvG scene.

first time participating? these FAQ could help you:
http://play.eslgaming.com/ladder-faq

You want to help us make this big? write me ingame a message and we can talk about it

well you (as the active part of the community ) have now the chance to play in there and be part of sth big, instead of flaming or complaining that it’s to late

Olli.9028:

1. problem 2 years to late
2. at least in eu 20vs20 always was the normal gvg size and 15vs15 only a option if not enough ppl
3. g arena to small even for 15vs15 and still a pve zone for the balacne of reta and other skills.

1. 2 years ago we hadn’t the possibility to face whoever whenever we want
2. it was the normal gvg size
3. g arena isn’t perfect but it’s the best we can get so we use it until we get sth better

the arena has it’s weaknesses, but it is our best option to finally get a real competition in it without beeing forced to server change every two weeks to get the GvG

Hello everyone,
this could be interesting for a lot WvW guilds who are interested into GvG as well.

short Trailer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Y2KZvIzHLs

Link to the ladder:
http://play.eslgaming.com/guildwars2/global/gw2/open/ladder-gvg-europe/

If you have any questions about it, feel free to ask me ingame

Greetings and cya in the Arena.

1.) The Juggernaut effects are srsly poor on the class, even worse than warrior. it would be really great if the skills would get some animation changes with the juggenaut.

2.) Rocket Charge. i think it feels a bit clunky and in pvp it’s pretty hard to hit, since it can be simply sidestepped. so to make it more comfortable to use it would be great if you could use the skill 3 times and have always one leap, instead of pressing it once and go to nirvana with it and not sticking to the target it should hit.

3.) Electro whirl doesn’t feel like it’s working well, since i get dmg against projectiles while casting it.

4.) the gyros don’t feel like to have a real use when using them, instead of other skills. so you will find better options for the different gyros

Warrior nerfs are fine for stunlock wars yeah. but do you think about the support wars as well?

I’m mainly playing WvW in a Guild group of 20-30 people and playing there Banner supportive build, my only dmg is coming from unsuspecting foes.

this trait is not worth a master trait, it only triggers on STUNED foes, not on disabled foes, on a warrior you have only 3 skills which are stunning the enemy.

you think you nerf the stunlock wars but actually you nerfed the support wars even more

i have the problem that the bloodlust buff refreshs every 10 secs 100 times, this causing a kittenload of laggs.

this is an issue which you could test BEFORE the patch going live!!!!

The thing is about GvG and WvW is that most guilds which play GvG are setting up the PuG commanders and organise the WvW, if those guilds wouldn’t be there, there where no casual part in WvW, no real Commanders which know what they do, the hardcore WvW guilds are carrying the WvW in the whole game mode.

I dunno if its good or bad that they do it, perhaps the game mode would be better if there were no organisation.

hello everyone,

I want to tell you sth about why sPvP is not so good for big ESL tournaments:

Let’s compare with other Games which established in the ESL scene:
The “BIG DEAL”: League of Legends is a game which is based on three lanes (compareable to GW2) you have slow fights and on the map there are not more than 2 “big fights” so it’s easy to shoutcast, be cause you have only one fight at a time and the rest of map happens nothing more.

The “VETERAN”: Counter Strike is a fps Game which has different objectives, very fast shoot outs, so there is no big deal in shoutcasting it, be cause you can switch to the action.

The “CONQUEST”: Battlefield is a Conquest based Game (like GW2) with the small difference that you have one direct Line between base -> point A -> point B -> point C -> enemy base. so the action will be around Point B normally.

The “NEWCOMER”: Guild Wars 2, GW2 takes a bit of every Game, you have 3 Lanes, 3 Capture points and a lot of action. You have normally fights on every point they are not standing in front of each other and waiting for mistakes. the players are going in and start killing. now there is the Problem for Shoutcasting: you don’t know where to stay and watch the fight, be cause everyone wants to see some other place, one guy wants to see how the engi is killing the bunker guard, some other want see the 3 vs 3 fight in the mid, and so on.

If you want to have a good ESL with a lot fans and stuff, you need clear PvP fights, one fight on the map a clear objective what you want to kill.
I give you an example for that: (care mister obvious is showing up) Guild Wars 1 PvP modes, some example for the shoutcasters try to shoutcast this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFWvdyCk1Uo
it’s 5 years old but got 212k views over the time.
For the guys who didn’t play GW1:
Game Mode explanation:
Main aim: kill enemy lord (NPC standing in the enemy base)
Side Objective: bring a flag to the shrine, every 2 min holding you get a morale boost which increases your life for 10% and Cd’s on rezz signets are restored.

No other Objective which need to explain, really simple you don’t think so?

I apologise for the wall of text. have fun reading and discussing.
question for discussion:
What do you think could increase the presence of GW2 in ESL?

Greetings Pimpi

Seuche.4809:

KoA want a sparring 20vs20 ?

why no official? afraid that you could loose some rating points?

It’s kind of obvious that when you tell us that you haven’t your core members online that we not ask for official than? and rest of week is kind of full i think, but you can usk if you want

Seuche.4809:

@CoN

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScXDLCEnfSo

l2p

really posting a vid 3 months old, seems legit. and why we not sparring you, same reason as Bayern München not playing a friendly game against Barcelona

It’s kind of obvious when the whole map is Green and only active Realm is Elona that the guilds search their fights, but you know base has more than one exit? and i’m not complaining about numbers, had good fights against GD.

yiishing.9057:

Hebril Amolebin.9817:

It ws fun figthing you but the poor thing is when you lose few you rage and quit:D
I suppose stomping Opt in practice unofficial gvg lifted your mood?

You told us you were playing for points, so why should we bother fighting you with your arrow carts and cannons and portal gates in the back, when you had nearly twice our numbers (20vs35)? Go play for points and stuff, i’m sure Vizunah will approve of this.

You Sir need a reality check, enemy forces look everytime more than you have. start counting and not blaming.
oh and some other info for you, we hadn’t even 35 people in TS and i thought you were only 16?

I have a link to the stream video, and the new buffs gives 1 War Point for every stomp you do, per stack of bloodlust buff. in a GvG there are mainly 20 vs 20 and when in one fight 5 guys get stomped you can get up to 15 points for that, which are equal to holding 5 camps for one tick.

http://youtu.be/8ciFk-dvUOI

He told that Point traiding is not possible and will be punished with Bans?

so my question is now:
We have some situations where you can think about point traiding:
1. GvG
2. farming spawn
3. don’t capping tower and farm the PuG’s going in
are those now banning reasons for Anet?
be cause wvw will get really empty after that.

What do you guys think about all this and Point traiding?

Tom Gore.4035:

What good would that do? You can already “mix stats” by choosing the trinket/jewel.

Of course I’m all for it for including these new stat combos into sPvP trinkets and jewels, but beyond that I really don’t see any reason to put stats into each and every piece of gear.

The thing is i play in WvW with:

PVT armor
zerker weapon
PVT back
Zerker amulett + rings
Knight with main precision earring
cleric earring

this gives me the perfect stats for playing my build. and without those stat combination in spvp i can’t play the build because there is not the right stat combination for this

give them stats and make it change able like the legendaries, give all twinkets and make them stat change able, all on a exotic/ascended level.

not only one trinket where all stats on

some suggestion for a better variety:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Suggestion-for-sPvP-EQ

Fenrir.3609:

Wryog.5073:

Why is it that it’s always the “WvW GvG” guys that get challenged to do sPvP? Why don’t the sPvP guys try to do GvG?

It’s due to time/logistical reasons.

For a gvg player to jump into spvp and have a character ready takes about five minutes. It takes rather more time for someone who spends all their time in pvp, to ramp a character to 80 and gear up.

didn’t anet say that every player should play the whole content =)

sorry for the trolling

Hello everyone, hello ANet Team.

with the patch today Anet will introduce a new way to change stats on your Legendary.

and now this way to Change the stats would be incredible for sPvP EQ so you have a bigger variety of stat combinations, and your stats would be better comparable to PvE stats.

I think it would be some work for the programmers to do this, because its a big change to ALL sPvP armors, but actually the people would really like this, so the work would be worth it

The problem with the ancient GvG mode is that it won’t work with the new game mechanics, for the old gvg style you need the monks with the massive heal, in GW2 there is no class which can outheal those massive Damage, so you need for a proper GvG with good fights, at least 15 to 20 people (not more than 20 be cause of solo skill of every person should be needed for this) I’m GW1 vet too so I know the old GvG and I would really like that they implement sth like this but it should be improved that the new game mechanic will work for this.

I think if it’s a combination of WvW and sPvP, everyone has same chance for having the same EQ, and in a 20 vs 20 (15 vs 15) you have to siege a “keep” (Guild hall) and kill the enemy Lord, Lord should have the strength between the SM Lord and a Keep Lord. Walls and Gate shouldn’t be to strong but not to weak.

DevonCarver.5370:

Your reward will be based on the server you log into the first time once the season starts. You can transfer as much as you like, but you will still get the reward from that first server.

so did you thought about that people of leading server will swap after 4 weeks to the second place server and block his wvw activity by blocking borderlands, and not deffing stuff?
the guys who will cheat the system will get the first place reward, even if they would loose to the second place? you said sth about personal rewards and server rewards, deny server transfer players the server rewards and give them the opportunity for the personal reward.

edit:
i think the whole system will get to a big blobbing system, the bloodlust points can give a bit relief for unblobbing

i wrote playtime my dear friend, so you will take more time for achieve it, but you need at least 3 years playtime ^^

Wrote this on another thread, and to now realising that one of those exists yet.

we got some thoughts about the WvW achievements in guild and searched the most ridiculous achievement in the game. we found it
the Stonemist defender achievement.
in it you have to deff Stonemist 500,000 times!
so the event lasts for 3 mins which will lead us to a play time of 25,000 hours whats around 1041~ days playtime. nearly 3 years. this achievement is a life time achievement. this are 56 achievement points. oh at not to forget after you finish this you have at least 2 chars on max rank in wvw, so no need to do the wvw ranks account bound
for comparison the drinking achievement (where the most people on pve forums are discussing about)
you need 100,000 drinks and when you use a karma drink in some outpost which gives you 4 points in it and a doubleclick needs at least 1 sec you need “only” 7 hours to complete it. you get for this 36 achievement points
Lets get to spvp:
to achieve the Legendary Champion you need 14,973,500 rank points.
i think a really good player can do 400 points in a tournament round which will take 15 mins all in all (queue, getting ready, fight) so you would take 37434 rounds and 9358.5 hours. which are 390 days. wiki says for all spvp achievements you get over 1000 achievement points.
so have fun farming

Anet says they don’t want hard core wvw players. I think right now you would need around 7-10 years playtime for achieving this, kinda hard core
but they will fix it and i hope we get some good rewards for it, one suggestion: if you finish all wvw achievements you’ll get a legendary, so noone can say you wouldn’t get legendarys with only playing wvw, and you would have a reward which is worth the work here
oh and i think the realm avanger is a good number for a kill count, only the AP aren’t right. but everyone sees that you can reach it in some normal time ~2000 hours playtime if you do it right.

we got some thoughts about the WvW achievements in guild and searched the most ridiculous achievement in the game. we found it

the Stonemist defender achievement.
in it you have to deff Stonemist 500,000 times!
so the event lasts for 3 mins which will lead us to a play time of 25,000 hours whats around 1041~ days playtime. nearly 3 years. this achievement is a life time achievement. this are 56 achievement points. oh at not to forget after you finish this you have at least 2 chars on max rank in wvw, so no need to do the wvw ranks account bound

for comparison the drinking achievement (where the most people on pve forums are discussing about)
you need 100000 drinks and when you use a karma drink in some outpost which gives you 4 points in it and a doubleclick needs at least 1 sec you need “only” 7 hours to complete it. you get for this 36 achievement points

Lets get to spvp:
to achieve the Legendary Champion you need 14,973,500 rank points.
i think a really good player can do 400 points in a tournament round which will take 15 mins all in all (queue, getting ready, fight) so you would take 37434 rounds and 9358.5 hours. which are 390 days. wiki says for all spvp achievements you get over 1000 achievement points.

so have fun farming

DevonCarver.5370:

I’ll post this here as well:

WvW is a game type that we believe very strongly in. We’ve seen that people have been organizing their own combat in WvW and that’s really cool, but WvW requires changes that are not always in step with the gameplay that has been emerging. Our focus is on making WvW as strong as it can be and we will continue to make changes with that in mind. We have been and will continue to discuss these open field battles, but in the meantime the changes we make to WvW will always have that game type first and foremost in mind.

just one weird idea from a community member:
you say you are discussing about it? why don’t discuss with the community, I think all of the active Guilds like CoN, VotF, Scnd and more would invite you on the TS and talk with you about the ideas and what we think about it. just give the community a feeling of being a part of your thoughts.
don’t missunderstand me i really like that you postet this, its kinda of relieve for all of us that you guys are not ignoring this.

hey all,

some moderator decided to move my question to suggestions area …

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/ANET-please-give-us-relieve-about-GvG/first#post2690094

so fill it up with you thoughts, that we get heared

thread was moved to suggestions.
dear moderator this is a question no suggestion :/

why is a GvG in direct opposition of wvw? it’s just an open field fight. or am i wrong?
you say the GvGers are trolling. we are not trolling we just added in an awesome game, an additional “game mode”

it will make it kinda unbalanced in some points. but there are the wvw buffs as well so if you can do it right you can balance the wvw buffs out with the bloodlust thing.

do you not think that bloodlust is kinda weird to take as name for this because there are a sigil with same name too.

Hello all,

Let’s start with the question:

Is there any work on GvG?

Explanation of the question:

Everyone who watched the Stream knows that there got a spam war for GvG. Most of the Main World vs. World players are playing in organized guilds which are also do GvG matches in WvW.
those guilds are mostly the WvW organising guilds. They are doing their best to let the WvW flow. Setting commanders and stuff and try to Organize the PuG’s. everyone of us knows that this is often really hard to manage.
You saw it on Stream chat what the most people who care about the game and the dev work are not interested in things they can read ingame. mostly they want to know about your work, what you are doing for them to improve their gameplay.
I’m sad about people who are spaming a chat full.
I don’t want to know, when it’s coming or how it looks like in the complexity of your work. I just want to know, if you are working on it. #Believe
I don’t care if its 15vs15 or 25vs25 but the mechanic of the game with the new battle system, its obvious that the classic GvG from GW1 is not working here.
It’s kinda hard to develop sth everyone will like in the end. The GW1 vets (which I am part of) and the DAoC RvR vets. Every player has another Image of a GvG mode and I believe in your skills that it gets so awesome like the rest of the Game and if you are working on it we would be really happy if we could help you in any way. If its testing the Mode or just giving some ideas for helping.

it got quite a long post so sorry for the WoT.

greetings

P.S. if you are bored in WvW and have a friend on another server, try Asura Ball http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Bc2GE8ETik

and some PR for me and my guild: our latest GvG http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GIL0ziO4eeU
just contact us if you want to play one in the unofficial GvG scene perhaps we can reach that Ogre is featuring us in the GvG Showdown

when wvw is boring and you have nothing to do, play a round asura ball

have fun watching