Guild Wars 2

stof.9341:

impoc.1795:

stof.9341:

impoc.1795:

well, we won’t know for sure until they release them but according to what we know, the better stats are there to compensate for the fact that the gear has no upgrade slots for runes or sigils

Why does the example ring get plain better stats in all cases than any other ring you can get in the game currently then?

lack of ability to customize as you see fit would be a good one

There’s no customizability in jewelry. You could get the exact same stats to a couple points mixing and matching different kinds of base jewelry than by putting a different jewel in each. Which would even be the smart thing to do since those upgrades aren’t exactly cheap themselves and the crafted jewelry comes with them for “free”.

please take note that the ring says “unique” most likely meaning you can only equip one of that type at a time, we don’t know what other types of rings there will be, or even how we get them in the dungeon, so being able to independently craft your own jewelry to whatever stats you need looks pretty advantageous

stof.9341:

impoc.1795:

well, we won’t know for sure until they release them but according to what we know, the better stats are there to compensate for the fact that the gear has no upgrade slots for runes or sigils

Why does the example ring get plain better stats in all cases than any other ring you can get in the game currently then?

lack of ability to customize as you see fit would be a good one

Xpiher.5209:

impoc.1795:

JJGlyph.9746:

impoc.1795:

Xpiher.5209:

impoc.1795:

Xpiher.5209:

I have tired it. Every other MMO has crapy gear grind progression. Now so does GW2. I don’t like it.
If I wanted to buy a gear grind tread mill game I wouldn’t of bought GW2. Now, if ANET plans on keeping this POS system that is reason why MMOs are stale (GW2 was actually a breath of fresh air) I won’t bother playing the game, picking it back up when new expansion come out, or spending another dime in the gem store (and I’ve already spent $200+). You will lose us ANET, and we would have been the people to keep your profitable for years just like GW1. Now you have catered to the fickle MMO crowd who will eat up your content and quit when the next shiny kitten is released. Hop you are happy.

you have already tried the new GW2 content?

Its no different than Raid gear progression in every single MMO game in existence.

how do you know if you haven’t tried it?

This is the same argument ppl used for months about events being zergs & too much special FX flash. You don’t need to try it to know. They have provided the details. Wow, some people…

they have not provided all of the details, especially about the armor, what effect the varieties of infusions do, etc.

so we can’t just jump to conclusions here

As someone mentioned, if the armor is only good in that dungeon and “worthless” every where else, then its not taking away from the over all philosophy of the game. Of course, this isn’t likely the case because ANET decided to give the armor better stats on top of a special ability.

well, we won’t know for sure until they release them but according to what we know, the better stats are there to compensate for the fact that the gear has no upgrade slots for runes or sigils

JJGlyph.9746:

impoc.1795:

Xpiher.5209:

impoc.1795:

Xpiher.5209:

I have tired it. Every other MMO has crapy gear grind progression. Now so does GW2. I don’t like it.
If I wanted to buy a gear grind tread mill game I wouldn’t of bought GW2. Now, if ANET plans on keeping this POS system that is reason why MMOs are stale (GW2 was actually a breath of fresh air) I won’t bother playing the game, picking it back up when new expansion come out, or spending another dime in the gem store (and I’ve already spent $200+). You will lose us ANET, and we would have been the people to keep your profitable for years just like GW1. Now you have catered to the fickle MMO crowd who will eat up your content and quit when the next shiny kitten is released. Hop you are happy.

you have already tried the new GW2 content?

Its no different than Raid gear progression in every single MMO game in existence.

how do you know if you haven’t tried it?

This is the same argument ppl used for months about events being zergs & too much special FX flash. You don’t need to try it to know. They have provided the details. Wow, some people…

they have not provided all of the details, especially about the armor, what effect the varieties of infusions do, etc.

so we can’t just jump to conclusions here

Xpiher.5209:

impoc.1795:

Xpiher.5209:

I have tired it. Every other MMO has crapy gear grind progression. Now so does GW2. I don’t like it.
If I wanted to buy a gear grind tread mill game I wouldn’t of bought GW2. Now, if ANET plans on keeping this POS system that is reason why MMOs are stale (GW2 was actually a breath of fresh air) I won’t bother playing the game, picking it back up when new expansion come out, or spending another dime in the gem store (and I’ve already spent $200+). You will lose us ANET, and we would have been the people to keep your profitable for years just like GW1. Now you have catered to the fickle MMO crowd who will eat up your content and quit when the next shiny kitten is released. Hop you are happy.

you have already tried the new GW2 content?

Its no different than Raid gear progression in every single MMO game in existence.

how do you know if you haven’t tried it?

Xpiher.5209:

I have tired it. Every other MMO has crapy gear grind progression. Now so does GW2. I don’t like it.
If I wanted to buy a gear grind tread mill game I wouldn’t of bought GW2. Now, if ANET plans on keeping this POS system that is reason why MMOs are stale (GW2 was actually a breath of fresh air) I won’t bother playing the game, picking it back up when new expansion come out, or spending another dime in the gem store (and I’ve already spent $200+). You will lose us ANET, and we would have been the people to keep your profitable for years just like GW1. Now you have catered to the fickle MMO crowd who will eat up your content and quit when the next shiny kitten is released. Hop you are happy.

you have already tried the new GW2 content?

JJGlyph.9746:

marnick.4305:

impoc.1795:

JJGlyph.9746:

You don’t need to “try it before you knock it”. We’ve all seen gear treadmills in other MMOs & they showed the exact details in the Lindsey Murdock post. No thanks.

based solely on the blog post, please explain how this is exactly like other gear treadmills in other MMO’s

The problem being that they are stepping on the edge of a very slippery slope. Right now it’s just one tier. As soon as they add a second tier, it’ll be exactly like other gear threadmills. That’s why I want a clear statement that this is the ONLY time they’ll be increasing general stats. If A.net can make a solid promise that this is the one and only time another gear level is included (because we all knew “something” was coming for armor), I’m okay with it. The problem however is in the elitist no-life raiders who will be demanding a new tier in a few weeks. And that’s the moment this slippery slope can make or break the game.

It’s not the only time. Read the Lyndsey Murdock post. It is clearly stated that they are introducing item progression into the game.

“Adding item progression is a delicate process normally undertaken in an expansion, but we feel it’s important to strive to satisfy the basic needs of our players sooner rather than later.”

“… that leaves us a lot of room to build upon these levels of Item progression in future content.”

“The new additions in November are just the start of our item progression initiative.”

And for all those ppl saying the change in stats is minor… you forgot to add. There are 12 gear slots. They purposefully showed off a ring bc it has the most minor change in stats. What a joke.

the item progression initiative is the addition of ascended items, the initial items will be the ring and the back pack as well as the level 1 infusions, we don’t know about any other accessories or armors including the variation on stats or about higher level infusions including how they will be obtained

this does not equate to power creep or gear grind

marnick.4305:

impoc.1795:

marnick.4305:

impoc.1795:

JJGlyph.9746:

You don’t need to “try it before you knock it”. We’ve all seen gear treadmills in other MMOs & they showed the exact details in the Lindsey Murdock post. No thanks.

based solely on the blog post, please explain how this is exactly like other gear treadmills in other MMO’s

The problem being that they are stepping on the edge of a very slippery slope. Right now it’s just one tier. As soon as they add a second tier, it’ll be exactly like other gear threadmills. That’s why I want a clear statement that this is the ONLY time they’ll be increasing general stats. If A.net can make a solid promise that this is the one and only time another gear level is included (because we all knew “something” was coming for armor), I’m okay with it. The problem however is in the elitist no-life raiders who will be demanding a new tier in a few weeks. And that’s the moment this slippery slope can make or break the game.

I agree with this, they were very good about gear in GW1 and many people were expecting a legendary tier of armor, so I don’t believe that from everything we definitely know right now, that any of it is cause for concern

That’s ignorance from your part. The parts we don’t know yet are very much cause for concern. Ignoring the potential bad effects until after they happened isn’t golden rule, it’s stupidity.

These posts are a form of “until here and not further”.

well, since I can’t speak for the developers, I would assume since its their job, they have considered the potential bad effects and decided to try it out and add something new, and they will listen to feedback so that if it doesn’t turn out like they thought, they can make changes and grow the game, its a living thing, nothing new has to be set in stone

from what I do know from the variety of previews, and the blog post, this update is worth trying and not something people that should cause people to quit especially without trying it out first

stof.9341:

gwawer.9805:

Gear grind is a bad idea because of the grinding part implying the content needed to get the gear is boring and repetitive. But if Anet introduces content that is innovative and has replayability, then I don’t see the problem of adding gear progression along with that content.

People who want fun content gets it. People who want gear progression get it. Everybodys happy.

What about people who spent dozens of gold to get the best gear that got told suddenly that they should have waited and used that gold instead to buy lodestones or some cultural armor set instead because that new dungeon will loot BETTER gear?

so far we only know that the rings come from the dungeon, there is no mention on how we will get armor or when it is coming

nofo.8469:

No thanks, I know where this is going.

Pretty obvious what direction they want to go when they release a new tier of gear this close to release.

actually its not obvious, it would be more obvious to add a new tier sooner than later because gear does not have a legendary tier and that creates a somewhat odd dichotomy with items

Khemizt.5104:

impoc.1795:

it doesn’t matter what other games you have played, this is not those games

give the new content a try and see how it works

its ok to express your concerns or fears, but to outright say you have been betrayed, or scammed, or that you are quitting because of this, is simply idiotic

PLAY the content, THEN give feedback

right now everyone is taking speculation as fact, without even giving the ideas and content a chance

FROM THE GOLDEN RULES OF GUILD WARS 2:

Take risks
“Let’s try it.” You hope to hear that phrase at the end of a meeting, especially if that meeting was contentious, or if the idea discussed is new and radical.
Imagine a playground full of kids playing. At its best, playing is making mistakes in a safe environment and learning from those mistakes in a way that encourages growth. Trying out new ideas or making drastic changes is the way we as designers get to play with the game. It’s where we slip and fall, scrape our knees, and otherwise monkey around on the jungle gym. While we don’t try out every idea, we use our collective experience to get a sense for what has promise—what we should follow down the rabbit hole. We look at where our ideas break, how they break, and why they break. "

The game was terrible on release and still is now, “it doesn’t matter what other games you have played, this is not those games”. Clearly, the MMO’s I play are fun unlike this mess of a game, $60 for a week of boredom! I’ll never buy an MMO on release thanks to this company!

you add nothing to this conversation

marnick.4305:

impoc.1795:

JJGlyph.9746:

You don’t need to “try it before you knock it”. We’ve all seen gear treadmills in other MMOs & they showed the exact details in the Lindsey Murdock post. No thanks.

based solely on the blog post, please explain how this is exactly like other gear treadmills in other MMO’s

The problem being that they are stepping on the edge of a very slippery slope. Right now it’s just one tier. As soon as they add a second tier, it’ll be exactly like other gear threadmills. That’s why I want a clear statement that this is the ONLY time they’ll be increasing general stats. If A.net can make a solid promise that this is the one and only time another gear level is included (because we all knew “something” was coming for armor), I’m okay with it. The problem however is in the elitist no-life raiders who will be demanding a new tier in a few weeks. And that’s the moment this slippery slope can make or break the game.

I agree with this, they were very good about gear in GW1 and many people were expecting a legendary tier of armor, so I don’t believe that from everything we definitely know right now, that any of it is cause for concern

Talloc.6835:

impoc.1795:

elsbeth.3567:

impoc.1795:

it doesn’t matter what other games you have played, this is not those games

give the new content a try and see how it works

its ok to express your concerns or fears, but to outright say you have been betrayed, or scammed, or that you are quitting because of this, is simply idiotic

PLAY the content, THEN give feedback

right now everyone is taking speculation as fact, without even giving the ideas and content a chance

FROM THE GOLDEN RULES OF GUILD WARS 2:

Take risks
“Let’s try it.” You hope to hear that phrase at the end of a meeting, especially if that meeting was contentious, or if the idea discussed is new and radical.
Imagine a playground full of kids playing. At its best, playing is making mistakes in a safe environment and learning from those mistakes in a way that encourages growth. Trying out new ideas or making drastic changes is the way we as designers get to play with the game. It’s where we slip and fall, scrape our knees, and otherwise monkey around on the jungle gym. While we don’t try out every idea, we use our collective experience to get a sense for what has promise—what we should follow down the rabbit hole. We look at where our ideas break, how they break, and why they break. "

Industry history doesn’t matter? Why? Because you just declare that by fiat?

ArenaNet’s own descriptions and promises don’t matter? You yourself are quoting some of them. Should we ignore those, too? How is responding to the company’s own words “speculation”?

Your argument is like saying that just because I once got bitten by a growling yellow dog, I should not be worried about being bitten by a growling brown dog. Experience matters. Your line of argument is naive, illogical and beside the point, since many people of course will be trying it.

I wasn’t saying you shouldn’t have reservations or concern, I stated quite the opposite, I’m saying look at what we know, look at how Anet has developed THEIR game, TRY IT and THEN give feedback

most people are outright rejecting the ideas because of fear and ignorance

My lack of ignorance is what makes me scared when Anet starts introducing items with better stats.

thats a valid concern and I would group that under a fear, but don’t allow that fear to prevent you from trying new things, whether or not you like the content, you can express all of you feedback firsthand after trying it and maybe help Anet improve the game and grow it into a better one, just like their golden rule!

LordByron.8369:

try what?
a concept that we perfectly know and makes mmorpg hated by mature players?

We already did with any other OLD SCHOOL mmorpg….

I would assume a mature player would be reasonable and not reject something based on games made by other companies

elsbeth.3567:

impoc.1795:

it doesn’t matter what other games you have played, this is not those games

give the new content a try and see how it works

its ok to express your concerns or fears, but to outright say you have been betrayed, or scammed, or that you are quitting because of this, is simply idiotic

PLAY the content, THEN give feedback

right now everyone is taking speculation as fact, without even giving the ideas and content a chance

FROM THE GOLDEN RULES OF GUILD WARS 2:

Take risks
“Let’s try it.” You hope to hear that phrase at the end of a meeting, especially if that meeting was contentious, or if the idea discussed is new and radical.
Imagine a playground full of kids playing. At its best, playing is making mistakes in a safe environment and learning from those mistakes in a way that encourages growth. Trying out new ideas or making drastic changes is the way we as designers get to play with the game. It’s where we slip and fall, scrape our knees, and otherwise monkey around on the jungle gym. While we don’t try out every idea, we use our collective experience to get a sense for what has promise—what we should follow down the rabbit hole. We look at where our ideas break, how they break, and why they break. "

Industry history doesn’t matter? Why? Because you just declare that by fiat?

ArenaNet’s own descriptions and promises don’t matter? You yourself are quoting some of them. Should we ignore those, too? How is responding to the company’s own words “speculation”?

Your argument is like saying that just because I once got bitten by a growling yellow dog, I should not be worried about being bitten by a growling brown dog. Experience matters. Your line of argument is naive, illogical and beside the point, since many people of course will be trying it.

I wasn’t saying you shouldn’t have reservations or concern, I stated quite the opposite, I’m saying look at what we know, look at how Anet has developed THEIR game, TRY IT and THEN give feedback

most people are outright rejecting the ideas because of fear and ignorance

Omnio.3652:

You know what I hate when I go to dungeon? If someone says “do you have equipment you need for this dungeon?”, and you know what I don’t mind to be asked? “do you have skill for this dungeon and have you been here before?”

I’m thinkin about Mursaats when I hear infused armor so I’m still looking forward to new content, but I’m a bit afraid that it might destroy what Guild Wars used to be. If someone says to me, you are noob you can’t go with us, it makes me try harder, train and get better so I can, if I want to go that certain thing, usualy dung. But if its only about equipment it makes me think “ok now I have to grind something I might even hate because I have to get some stuff to get stuff I need to get somewhere I want to go”. – If I’d want that, I go play WoW. I noticed that most (maybe only) people who are complaining about “not enough progression in items” are WoW players. Why? Figure it out.

is there a way for you to show or for people to check what kind of gear you have? as far as I know there isn’t, so the question is pointless to ask

JJGlyph.9746:

You don’t need to “try it before you knock it”. We’ve all seen gear treadmills in other MMOs & they showed the exact details in the Lindsey Murdock post. No thanks.

based solely on the blog post, please explain how this is exactly like other gear treadmills in other MMO’s

marnick.4305:

I tried it in other MMOs. I’M NOT INTERESTED in gear progression. That’s the primary reason I play GW2. I’m not interested in trying broken mechanics AGAIN.

how do you know that the addition of a SINGLE tier of gear that has a primary use in ONE dungeon is the broken mechanics you have seen before?

Deimos.9285:

aliquis.9180:

Sparda.9356:

On the left corner, we have elitist complain no endgame, on right corner we have casual complain about gear treadmill. Sigh, I guess it IMPOSSIBLE to make everyone happy

Certainly not when you market a game to casuals, because you know that’s where the big money is, and 3 months later go “psych” and turn the game over to the elitists.

This is an honest question, as a casual player why would they be worried about getting +15 more stats and an Infusion that only negates Agony at the absolute hardest end of a dungeon that can be happily played without requiring any ascended gear at all?

Casual players already have an absolute boat full of things to do in this game, this is something for the “hardcore” players to strive for.

from what I understand casuals are afraid they will be gated from content by ascended gear checks in the dungeon when they don’t even have or have barely gotten exotic gear

if they would read the previews all the way through, they would see that gated content won’t be an issue

but what they should really do is just TRY IT OUT

aliquis.9180:

Sparda.9356:

On the left corner, we have elitist complain no endgame, on right corner we have casual complain about gear treadmill. Sigh, I guess it IMPOSSIBLE to make everyone happy

Certainly not when you market a game to casuals, because you know that’s where the big money is, and 3 months later go “psych” and turn the game over to the elitists.

I don’t think adding one dungeon and a small amount of gear should be considered turning it over to elitists, by a long shot

Djavlas.8249:

how have they disrespected you? by adding ONE new type of dungeon, to TRY something new?

like the title says, TRY IT,
if you like it or don’t like it, then give feedback

in no way, shape, or form have you been disrespected
ESPECIALLY before the content has been added

going back on your word

how is that not disrepectful?

can you specifically show me, right now, how ANET has disrespected you by going back on their word?

aliquis.9180:

Some people have enough experience with other games to know what they like and what they don’t like. “Try it before you knock it” is only for people who don’t know any better.

but as I said, other games are not this game, if they still insist on being stubborn in that regards, they can avoid the content completely and continue playing the copious amount of content that already exists and look forward to the next free expansion that may have more of the content they enjoy

Talloc.6835:

Vasham.2408:

Talloc.6835:

Vasham.2408:

That would require the GW2 community to be a couple of things: calm, rational, and open to new ideas.

Sadly they are none of these things.

You mean that idea that’s plague the MMO community for years, giving rise to things like GearScore?

Naw, I’ll pass.

Thanks for providing a perfect example of what I was talking about. Immediately comparing what’s happening to other MMOs rather than waiting and seeing how it turns out. The usual kind of kneejerk reactions I’ve grown accustomed to on these forums.

Yeah, no. I’ve played about five MMOs at launch and each time the developers screamed at me “No really, we promise you’ll love it!”

Now they’re all collecting dust on my shelf because I thought they would teach me a lesson.

I can understand your hesitation, but anecdotal evidence doesn’t translate to factual predictions of the future

dangerhunt.2607:

impoc.1795:

dangerhunt.2607:

I am still going to wear ascended armors everywhere I go. It’s going to become a symbol that says “I spend hell of time in the new dungeon.”

did I miss the post where they told us how we would be getting ascended armor?

We are only going to get back slot and rings for now, but in future update, they plan to add full sets.

I know that but they never said that the armor would be dungeon exclusive, unless I missed it somewhere

dangerhunt.2607:

I am still going to wear ascended armors everywhere I go. It’s going to become a symbol that says “I spend hell of time in the new dungeon.”

did I miss the post where they told us how we would be getting ascended armor?

Djavlas.8249:

No gear treadmills or artificial gear gating was one of the MAJOR selling points of GW2. Excitement leading up to the release of GW2 was generated through the all the aspects of gw2 that appealed to players. This was one aspect. Anet would not have had the success they saw if they had advertised “same old tried and failed gear systems!”

here, from the golden rules:

Respect the player

We respect you—as a player, as a human being. This game we’re making may end up competing with your real life. It might fight for your free time alongside your friends, your family, your work, and whatever else you might be doing. Because of that, we want to give you a meaningful experience, not one that is a vapid waste of your time. Whatever your reasons for spending time in Tyria, we don’t want to waste it by doing stuff that isn’t fun.

That’s why we make our content epic. That’s why we have giant nightmare demons to fight, global allegiances to form, immense keeps to siege, and giant catapults to fire. Tyria is a place that will foster relationships with new friends, and provide you a rich experience to share with old ones. It’s our version of a playground on the grandest of scales.

Finally, we are building an online world, but we are always careful to leave space for its most important element, the one we designers would like to step out of the spotlight for: its heroes—you.

Purpose: To keep us honest.

honest…. right….

how have they disrespected you? by adding ONE new type of dungeon, to TRY something new?

like the title says, TRY IT,
if you like it or don’t like it, then give feedback

in no way, shape, or form have you been disrespected
ESPECIALLY before the content has been added

because we don’t know where ascended armor will come from?

it doesn’t matter what other games you have played, this is not those games

give the new content a try and see how it works

its ok to express your concerns or fears, but to outright say you have been betrayed, or scammed, or that you are quitting because of this, is simply idiotic

PLAY the content, THEN give feedback

right now everyone is taking speculation as fact, without even giving the ideas and content a chance

FROM THE GOLDEN RULES OF GUILD WARS 2:

Take risks
“Let’s try it.” You hope to hear that phrase at the end of a meeting, especially if that meeting was contentious, or if the idea discussed is new and radical.
Imagine a playground full of kids playing. At its best, playing is making mistakes in a safe environment and learning from those mistakes in a way that encourages growth. Trying out new ideas or making drastic changes is the way we as designers get to play with the game. It’s where we slip and fall, scrape our knees, and otherwise monkey around on the jungle gym. While we don’t try out every idea, we use our collective experience to get a sense for what has promise—what we should follow down the rabbit hole. We look at where our ideas break, how they break, and why they break. "