@Caliban.3176
So now that a few ppl can kill many ppl means its more zerg friendly? Do you even try to think about what your saying?
I understand why you’d think that, it is a little counterintuitive but try thinking like this.
Now it has become a lot harder to mount a decent siege because defenders are now overpowered with arrowcarts. So 10ppl teams have way less use because it is harder for them to do anything.
It is also a lot harder for the big zerg, but it is easier for a zerg than it’ll be for a small team.
So it just became harder for small teams and harder for zergs but zergs still don’t have it as hard as small teams. Therefore zergs are still better than small teams. It even scales up beyond that. It used to be doable for 50 pugs to take a keep from 25 pugs. Now it is hardly doable for 50 pugs to take it from 25 pugs. It is however doable still for 75+ pugs to take a keep from 25 pugs. Thus it encourages even bigger pug zergs.
I am going to try and not respond to this thread for a while unless anyone actually brings up new arguments in favor of this patch. I have read some arguments that make it sound positive in that niche situation but overall the AC buff is still obviously bad for the game.
The role of a small team is not to take keeps and towers, but supply camps and dolyaks. So the efficiency of small groups was effectively buffed in this patch with the new supervisor.
And not only that, now it takes a lot more supply to take down a enemy structure. Giant zergs are very slow and inefficient at resupplying, making it necessary to split up the zerg.
So, now, if want to take a keep, it’s a battle of managing your supply, and trying to prevent your enemies from getting it. Which is, in my opinion, a much more interesting meta than zerg balling everything.
To ALL people that said defence was underpowered or at a disadvantage before I must say that you were making some mistakes then. It was very much doable to hold of enemies that severely outnumbered you. It required a little bit of skill and coordination. 30 vs 100 while defending a keep was not unheard of nor was it unlikely that the group of 30 would win. Arrowcarts were often used in these defences because they were very effective.
That was back when skill and coordination were rewarded with results. Now the game caters to bad tactics and lazy players. The arrowcart buff rewards zerging and discourages pvp encounters and action.
The game catered to bad tactics and lazy player before. If you had a zerg ball you could shove a bunch of rams or/and golems under a rain of AOE and still take down a door. You could use horrible cata and treb spots and still take down a gate/wall. Now you actually have to make good use of siege. What is apparent in this thread is that very few people know how to do that.
I love this update. I’m finding rather amusing how zerging made people clueless about proper siege use, both in using the right spots and manning them.
Worst WvW Patch ever. Rams are now useless. And every other form of siege as well, because you can’t block shots from mortars or trebuchets any more.
And the only way to win a siege is now if you have the higher position for your trebuchets, otherwise there ist now way to win. Only one Trebuchet for defense you don’t instantly see, because its behind a wall and all your catapults are completly useless.
Great Job Anet
thank you! this post!
EVEN if you enjoy siege wars, without the ability to block treb shots, even the siege game has become one faceted and boring
I think you guys should learn more about siege warfare, now it’s a great opportunity for it.
i guess i’ll have to build 14 superior arrowcarts and defend hills from all the newbs with 15 guys to get them to understand.
My guild could already hold a t1 non upgraded keep without siege with 25 people.
Add 80% buff on arrowcarts, you’ll never get in the lord room.
Maybe if the attackers don’t know what a treb is.
oh really? you do realize that hills has positions that CANNOT BE COUNTER TREBBED from outside? there are so many places in hills to place siege that siege cannot be taken out. If you ever lose hills now, you are a bad server.
I’m have been playing WvW since beta, and I have never seen one spot that couldn’t be countered. What I have seen a lot is people complaining about invulnerable trebs when they competently counterable.
i guess i’ll have to build 14 superior arrowcarts and defend hills from all the newbs with 15 guys to get them to understand.
My guild could already hold a t1 non upgraded keep without siege with 25 people.
Add 80% buff on arrowcarts, you’ll never get in the lord room.
so you want this game to be a game of who builds the first treb? with no swirls now, whoever gets a treb up first wins! or whoever builds the most trebs wins! thats great fun isn’t it?
Let me give you the 2 scenarios
Offensive:
Builds trebs without defenders seeing them. Trebs down all counter siege, trebs down wall, continues firing poison cows and treb shots to poison and knockdown all defenders, takes keep.
Defensive:
Builds trebs or already has trebs up in spots where they cant be counter trebbed. Destroys all offensive trebs, no need to kill anybody, sits in tower or keep doing absolutely nothing.
The bottom line is: When shots can’t be blocked, siege drop faster, and supply will be more scarce. You will actually have to siege a structure making it starve for supply. If they are turtled up, they can’t resupply, the attackers can. The supply game will be much more interesting, specially with the supervisor buff.
Something needs to be done against zergs. I love WvW just as much as the next person, but this whole numbers game really has to go. By default if you have 30 attacking a group of 10 in a capped tower, the 30 will eventually get in, that is all there is to it.
There needs to be far more strategy involved so that:
1) The ones outnumbered actually have a fighting chance
2) The ones with sheer numbers will have to start employing different tactics and strategies.
I would like to see a single person be able to either defend or wipe out an entire zerg (if need be) which forces the zerg to use their numbers more wisely.
I am kinda hoping Anet adds additional things to WvW, which can defend or wipe out zergs either by camps/towers or out in the open field.
The arrow cart idea is a start but it really is pointless when ranged can just pick away at the door from afar
So what happens when in your tier no one is outnumbered and you have pretty even numbers. It is now impossible for anyone to take a tower/keep.
Nothing is right in WvW again. Posts complaining that the “under attack” notice at objectives now displays 30 seconds after it is first attacked just make it easier for zergs to dominate vis-a-vis posts complaining that stronger arrow carts make it impossible for anyone to take a keep or objective and thus destroy zergs….sheeze.
Maybe instead of complaining you should modify tactics. Because of the 30 second rule guards will have to be posted. Because of the powerful arrow carts guards may be able to slow a zerg down. Maybe more siege will be used to take keeps and towers. Field deployable arrow carts, especially at choke points, may throw the balance in some battles. Maybe more small groups trying to destroy siege will come into vogue. Who knows, just quit complaining and work it out.
Personally I hope the days of just blindly following a zerg around are limited.
No, change is bad. I have to actually think and adapt instead of just mindless rushing everything.
How dare they do something to slow down zergers WXP farming.
It hits zergs hard, this is true but it kills anything below 15 as well. So basically they made zerging a lot harder but destroy any other way to do something.
Less than 15 will be taking supply camps, hitting dolyaks, and eventually trying to ninja something as they always did.
It’s not a poor system just some servers have poor communities and do not bring people in or communicate between guilds well it makes the world of difference. The smallest effort can make the biggest differences.
Good communities don’t win the point game, big communities do. And there are a lot of good communities all around, but they aren’t there because of the scoring system, they exist despite it.
Why do people not get that scaling points to active population would make match-up balancing more difficult?
I don’t care whether or not my server is able to get a decent amount of points, I care about whether or not we can hold objectives and have the numbers to actually challenge our opponents in combat.
Points are the objective of WvW, it is intended that people care about it. The problem is that the current implementation of the system is very poor, and that’s why you and many people choose the disregard it.
Knowing the sum of all servers pops in all maps is far from “too much intel”. You can basically already know that just by looking at the ppt. If you could know the the pop of a specific server in a specific map, that would be too much intel. Funny thing is that the outmanned buff already shows that in many occasions.
If you go to the bathroom, and whisper “GvG” three times to the mirror, a VoFT spirit will appear and hunt you down screaming: “This is not GvGgggggyyy”.
I think most of the posters in the thread need to re-read the information on ascended gear and Fractals of the Mist dungeon, including the blog post, over and over until they actually understand it. there is nothing here to be up in arms about. Nada.
Ascended Gear has stats on par with Exotic Gear that has enhancements already applied. Ascended gear removes enhancement slots in order to be able to provide infusion slots. This gear will not be more powerful, outside of Fractals of the Mist, than properly enhanced Exotic gear! Ascended gear will provide another method for players to acquire exotic quality end game gear, but some may miss the opportunity to customize their stats via enhancements.
Where Ascended Gear shines is when equipped with infusions, or when the item comes with resistance to the new FotM exclusive monster condition built in. This system will allow players who play a lot of FotM to get deeper and deeper into the FotM experience on a given extended run.
It’s an end game dungeon progression, but the gear progression provides zero gear inflation outside of FotM!
I look at FotM as another form of adjunct game play in the same vein as WvW and sPvP. They are optional forms of alternative game play meant to appeal to people with particular play styles and content preferences. You can completely ignore FotM dungeon, if you wish, and you will not see the rest of your game play suffer as a result. Others may play FotM almost exclusively. It’s just another way for the game to broaden it’s appeal and offer players more game play options to suit thier changing mood!
^^
This.
I already stated it. Ascended Gear has built-in upgrade slot, yes, but you cannot put your runes in it. Only Infusions. This is what i surmised after having read the blogpost at least six times (i am not english native, so i have to read multiple times).
So, Ascended could be WORSE than exotics, because of the lack of stats from upgrades!
Nope. Stats from ascended are greater than exotics plus upgrades, just look at the image from the blog post.
We already have to grind gold for siege and structure upgrades, don’t make us also grind equips every new content patch.
I assure you, the commanders have an endless supply of siege equipment. Especially in tiers 1-3.
I assure you they don’t. I also assure you this if the have or haven’t, it does not matter. Making people that only play the game for WvW suffer doing PvE is not a good idea.
