I have never had any trouble with the camera.
Do people that complain about the camera move it with a key instead of the mouse or something?
For me, the first thing that happens is it sticks. Every instance, I have to take my finger off M2 and press it down again to make it move.
Then, because I have to manually adjust it all the time I’m moving round the tower (instead of the camera staying behind you in the way it would in a normal platforming game), I end up frequently having to pick my mouse up and move it back across the pad. When I put it down and press M2 again, the camera likes to jerk in an odd direction, because I’ll have adjusted the way my character is facing in that time.
That’s my experience.
Cheesus, where do people get the idea that if you’re feeling a bit accomplished with something in a video game that your view of reality is warped?
The winking emoticon was supposed to indicate I was being waggish.
In all honesty, though, I guess we just have a different idea of fun. I like platforming and I do find it fun … but only on the basis that two hours of investment gets me much, much further than a few steps higher.
I’ve done the thousands of hours on platforming games the OP speaks of.
This is still not fun. It’s not fun because the progress-to-effort ratio is insanely low. I remember when it was generally accepted that Tomb Raider was a seriously flawed game because of how perfectly you had to do everything to progress. But you could still manage a jump on the fourth or fifth try … usually.
This is the platforming equivalent of asking someone to memorise a sequence of 100 different numbers. It’s challenging, it’s possible, but why put in so much effort to achieve something so singularly inapplicable to any future situation?
Ayperi"I spent 2 hours at it today and I noticed considerable progress in how far I get.
Good God, man, this is my approach to learning ninjitsu or an instrument – something that has applicability to daily life – not getting up some dodgy stairs in a computer game. ;-)
I got into GW2 not overly hyped, I was indifferent, but I wanted to see the innovations and interesting concepts (dynamic events, quake-ish non-gear based PvP) etc. And while GW2’s delivery is more serious by looks, it failed to trigger the immersion in me. Both of them, as a matter of fact. Now, it’s not that I am not enjoying the game. But, “it” just isn’t happening.
Sadly, this is pretty much a perfect summation of how I feel too. I come to this forum overflowing with suggestions for both the story part and the game mechanics part, because I look at it and thing, “They’ve done so much right”, but at the end of the day, it’s just doesn’t feel right.
That’s the reason I’m dismissive towards this subject, because it’s irrelevant to the point of the game: to kill as many different things as you can find, for as long as you’re enjoying it.
People don’t enjoy it without successfully established context. That’s why games have plots, artwork etc.
Try bringing out a game where the player is a stickman who kills other randomly coloured stickmen on a black background for no reason. See if you can sell millions.
They’re ingeniously constructed platforming structures …
… stuck within the confines of an engine wholly unsuited for the purpose.
It’s well designed as a concept and as a piece of 3D architecture. It really is. And I like platforming.
I just can’t stand doing it with the GW2 engine. Maybe I’ve just been over-indulged by how well this genre of challenge has been done elsewhere.
(On the other hand, Dierdre’s Steps was great.)
… and by thunder, I’ll take on the Clocktower until it’s done. See, I actually do like platforming.
Good Lord, you can even give me 1995 Tomb Raider and I’ll do it. That was a game lambasted for its combination of sluggish response and pixel perfect jumps, but honestly, give me that engine again, and I’ll do it.
But not with GW2’s delayed-reaction controls, diabolical camera and bizarre, whimsical collision detection. The way I’ve approached every other jumping puzzle is to scan the terrain as carefully as I can to make the right decisions about which surfaces my character will actually cling to and what jumps she can make. Since the rising tide of ectoplasm makes that impossible, what we have is a jumping puzzle that can only be completed by making mistake after mistake after mistake after mistake and trying again and again and again and again, and even then, you’re liable to be betrayed by the camera swinging about weirdly.
Yes, it’s challenging. So is breaking your own fingers. Well done, if that’s what the aim was.
I don’t know why you expect reality, when its not the point.
I don’t expect reality; I expect – or rather, I hope for – some vaguely, half way believable alternative reality, so that I can get lost in an escapist fantasy world and roleplay a skilled warrior.
Some time in the future, when games have developed creative solutions to many of their endemic problems, people will look back on GW2 and games like it as the equivalent of early CGI or zip drives – a move away from rolling dice or moving chess pieces but still miles away from a convincing world to inhabit.
I honestly believe A Bard’s Tale will hold up to scrutiny better, because people will look at it and say, “Well, they were working within the limitations of a system.” Whereas people will look at GW2 and say, “They had beautiful graphics, powerful computers, real-time hit detection, special effects and smooth animation – why didn’t they put any effort into making it look as if people were actually fighting?”
Secondly, Runes provide these extra benefits already and this is a system that allows a vast array of customisation as an addition to crafting items.
Am I missing something then? I’ve got up to level 80 in the game and the Rune business doesn’t seem to affect anything yet. Surely, I could have a tiny bit of extra power versus a tiny bit of extra healing, but it changes the way I successfully complete a battle not one iota.
What I’d ask for from a combination of the combat and the crafting is very simple: I see an enemy. What kind of enemy it is determines how I approach the fight. If it’s a new enemy, I first have to figure out what strategy works best. If I go in with the wrong one, I either lose or am severely damaged. If I go in with the right one and time my attacks successfully, and dodge when I need to, I can win almost flawlessly.
Instead, the way it works is this: I see an enemy. The only thing that matters is if it’s a veteran or champion. Other than that, it could be a black, unlabelled blot on the screen because how I go about defeating it will be exactly the same every time.
And yes, I do try different weapon combinations and abilities. I regularly swap them. I try discovering combos. I try different styles of opening shot. I swap runes and reroll my trait tree. It makes no difference. Nothing is any more effective than anything else in 99% of the encounters.
This! If ordinary fights lasted an entire minute I wouldn’t even bother playing.
Arrgrhhhh. How can this be the third time I have to point out that I’m not asking for fights to last longer? I want them to last the same amount of time but be more believably represented in terms of visuals. The reason I posted stipulation #2 is because that’s what the devs obviously considered a design stipulation in making this game, that ‘Fights need to last more than a second, ideally anything up to a minute for ordinary encounters, longer for bosses’. This is the game you already have. This is how MMORPGs currently work!
I just do not understand how any of you managed to get the idea from my original post that I’m proposing fights last longer! If anything, my system would give them the potential to be shorter – just not too much shorter:
A fight lasts just as long …
How is that ambiguous??
There are good games with realisitc injury consequences, but I´d say mmorpg aren´t the place for that. Also, do you really think you could rebuild the combat system here as easy as that?
No, I don’t – I think this could just be a direction for the devs to explore in future, when developing extensions on this game or a new game. It’s too much to overhaul the whole thing from the ground up right now.
But how on earth can you say mmorpgs aren’t the place for what I suggest? The principle thing I’ve suggested changing in the future is the visual representation of the fight. Everything else stays pretty much the same, just with the introduction of a finishing blow system.
I dont want there to be only one way to kill a boss, I always thought that was stupid.
It would be. But that’s not what I’m suggesting. I’m suggesting a system where certain strategies work better than others. What we have now is a world where almost everything against any creature works just as well as anything else. There are very few occasions when you need to alter your tactics in any way whatsoever. The bad guys might as well all have the same model – they differ visually, but not in many other ways.
its always the same though..put x and y and special z into a pot and stir..there is nothing fantastic about it.
Maybe I just have a feverish imagination, but I can imagine a system which allows a huge variety of outcome without being more complex to build/approach. For one thing, you could have a system where certain combinations of materials improve certain stats of a weapon while weakening it in other areas – specialist bows that consistently weaken/cripple but deal little damage, or armour that has added protection but breaks more easily, or armour that deals damage to all melee attackers (via an electric shock) at the cost of protection.
Now what would be interesting, is a mechanic where certain combinations of traits opened up new skills or changed old ones. Like..maxing your crit and power line gives you a new powerful skill, maxing crit and traps gives your traps new conditions etc..
Yes. Well, there you go. That’s exactly what I mean – it’s very easy to look at GW2 and imagine far more interesting systems than the one we have. It’s a shame, but there it is.
Sir, I am the one that plays the a video game—designed to entertain—to be entertained. If anyone is missing the “point”, it’s you. You’re looking in the wrong place for culturally significant artistic expression, or whatever it is you’re looking for.
Attempting to parse art from entertainment is facile and ignorant. Entertainment is any rewarding preoccupation. One of the aims of art is to make preoccupation with the artwork rewarding. The crossover is huge; they’re barely distinct subjects at all.
OP is complaining that ill-thought through aspects of the game are spoiling coherence, which in turn ruins his sense of immersion in the world. This is an ‘entertainment’ problem, not just an ‘art’ one. The game is failing to entertain him because it keeps reminding him, through its imperfect structure, that he’s a guy sitting in front of a computer screen tapping keys. The point of a game is to forget that and become involved in the ‘reality’ of the game.
This as true of chess as it is of snakes and ladders as it is of GW2. If you’re not involved in the game because aspects of it are baffling and inconsistent, you’re not being entertained.
Now, people like you might come along and say, “Well, I’m entertained – I have no problem”, but there will always be people who can say that, no matter how poorly designed a game is. Whereas if a game is improved then it usually entertains more people more thoroughly without sacrificing those who are already being entertained.
In other words, if the devs listen to OP’s feedback and try to improve the context around the encounters so that players are more informed about why certain tasks are morally upright and consistent with a heroic character, more people like the OP will enjoy the game, and people like you won’t even notice the difference. Good for the audience, good for the developer, good for everyone.
This discussion is not worthless.
The only reason why I am so hard on GW2 is because I enjoy the game so much, so I talk about what I don’t like so the game can become that much better. Problems won’t be solved by praise.
That’s exactly where I’m coming from. I’m keeping a GW2 ‘diary’ on my blog where I faithfully report about many of the things in the game that are excellent and appreciable, what is worthy of awe and respect.
But there are plenty of criticisms that, when levelled appropriately, could hopefully help the devs both dramatically improve aspects of this game and take big strides with any future games they make, and they’ve got more chance of being chewed over if we post them here than on our own blogs.
If you want longer fights, play a Greatsword Mesmer and fight at melee range.
Seriously though, I do agree that fights in MMOs these days are generally over too quickly and I’d like to see a bit more depth, though not necessarily realism.
Afraid that wasn’t my point – I was trying to keep the fight length the same while making the visual representation of it more believable, ie. when you do actually swing a massive blade through a soft body, it kills them. The way I envisage it, the fights would last just as long and there’d be the same spread of abilities, but low-damage abilities would look like low-damage abilities.
But I think people today are focused more on the destination than the journey. People dont want to risk their time having been wasted. It seems that it does not matter how much fun they had on their journey. All that matters is that it’s the destination and their impatience.
I agree, but that doesn’t make a more believable battle system impossible, imo.
Just imagine in GW2 had been presented exactly as it is now, except that most of your weapon abilities are replaced with minor hits and knocks. They do the same ‘damage’ and apply the same conditions, but visually, instead of you swinging a sword, you’re butting the enemy with your hilt.
Everything plays out exactly the same – it just looks different. Until, that is, the enemy has run out of health, when you use an execution style move that looks like the current blade swing. The difference is that this blade swing would actually kill them, like you’d expect it to.
I really think the simple test is as I said above: would you believe what you saw if it was happening in a fantasy film? Would we watch someone repeatedly firing arrows into the body of a wolf and go: “Oh, it’s just fantasy, so I’m not bothered.” Or hurling fireballs into an enemy, only for them to proceed unharmed? I doubt it. Would we believe it if the wizard started by using a searing touch a few times, then melted the ground to encumber his enemy’s movement, blinded him with a flash of fire and only then finished him off with a fireball? Maybe.
Thanks for the link, Sad Swordfish. Gives me more to chew on.
I don’t get the point of this thread. Do you seriously expect Anet to revamp the core of this game months after release?
Nope, but it might influence their approach to future mechanics if they ever think about changes or alternative game modes. Ultimately, it’s just a discussion point.
And, “realistically” why would you not throw fireballs from your hands from the get-go?
It’s a compromise. Realistically, a battle would end very quickly, as someone says above. I’m trying to come up with a way for it to feel fairly, if not completely, realistic, in how it’s visually represented, while maintaining a system that lets it last a while. There are always creative solutions to questions like ‘why can’t you just pelt them with fireballs’. You just have to think.
You can’t possibly be telling me the current system feels remotely like you’re attacking someone with real weapons.
The responses here make me sad. Why do companies like ANet even both with graphics and storylines if none of you have any expectations of finding the experience suitably convincing as a possibly reality?
I hope you’re trolling.
This is a game
So why don’t we all just play chess? Why do we have the remotest interest in 3D worlds and polygonal sculpts of deadly-looking weapons?
It’s not really realistic anyways. And besides, we have no idea how real fighting in a world with magical powers would work. It’s like someone from the middle ages trying to describe “realistic” combat with jet fighters.
You make some good points about potential problems with the system but this is a bad point. We know what lightning and fire do to people. Here’s an easy test: would you accept what you see in GW2 if you saw it in a film? I think not.
Now, going to what to propose (implying you are just new and not trolling): making a normal fight last around a minute would make it tedious and terribly repetitive. Not even to mention if its a boss.
sigh The point is to keep the fights lasting whatever they last now. I thought it was around a minute. My point is that the only change is the way the fight is visually represented, not the mechanics or how long it lasts.
hey, welcome to mmorpgs!
Welcome to a thread where I try to envisage mmorpgs being better than they are, and people looking back on this era and not being able to understand why so many of us put up with so much that was ridiculous when the alternatives were obvious and reachable.
OK, the truth is I sometimes feel good, sometimes not so good about GW2. I’ve been reading the opinions on both sides and sympathise with a lot from both the ‘haters’ and the ‘fanboys’. But let me be clear about where I think the real negativity comes from:
It’s not that nothing about GW2 is enjoyable or worthwhile. It’s that it’s so easy to imagine massive potential improvements.
By that, I mean this kind of thing:
1) The crafting system. Just look at all the work that’s gone into it, all the potential for something deep and arresting. Look at what they were aiming at with the recipes. It’s easy to see how this could have worked out.
How it could have been
You pick a crafting profession. You spend ages testing different combinations, making odd, junky weapons, learning what things work well together, gradually getting better. Eventually, you know how to produce a variety of weapons with high stats and special effects. Players come to you to buy these weapons because they need them for specific instances, eg. a dungeon has fast critters in it, and you’ve created a bow that sacrifices power for a mean slow-down ability. You make lots of money selling this bow, which only you and other people who’ve picked that profession can create, and which took creativity and hard work to make.
How it is
You work out the ‘system’ with recipes after about a minute: two parts of a weapon plus one inscription. The rest is a grind. Everything you produce along the way is worthless, to be immediately sold to a vendor. No one wants it. The different effects are negligible. It’s all just to get to the stage of crafting your legendary.
2) Combat.
How it could have been
You have an array of weapons, spells and abilities. Different enemies require different tactics. Some you figure out quickly; others take a while. Bosses require you to specifically combine your abilities with someone else’s for particular special effects. By observing an enemy camp before attacking, you can plan a strategy to take them all out, but charging in recklessly will get you killed. Powerful weapons mean you can take out some enemies in a single, satisfying hit but only if you put the work in to position yourself, wear them down and create an opening.
How it is
You have an array of weapons, spells and abilities, but the effects they produce are short-lived, with little impact and make no discernible difference to the outcome of a battle. If enemies are difficult, it’s purely because (1) they have obscene amounts of health and wear your down, (2) they have moves that kill you in one hit, or (3) ten of their friends spawn out of nowhere right next to you, destroying all of the gameplay potential of planning a strategy or approach. Yes, you can have an elementalist lay down a firewall and a ranger fire arrows through it, but to what end? Fire, lightning, metal – all it ever does is chip away at a floating health bar or cause a five-second ‘condition’ whose effects you barely notice.
I could go on … but instead, I’ll just make this point: I don’t believe much of what we might have asked for would have required more work, just different work. I would have happily accepted a slightly smaller world, a smaller number of effects, abilities, cut scenes, heart quests – even less professions and crafts – in exchange for added depth and potential in the systems we do have.
Okay, Op you got awfully wound up about this eh? I can’t tell if you’re a troll or some kind of bleeding heart activist that wants to protest Tyrian behaviors. There’s GOT to be a better cause for you to fight the good fight for than what pixels did what to another pixel in a made up history…right?
Oh, please just grow up or gtf out of here. He’s clarified several times that his complaint is that the game doesn’t make enough effort to give context to the killing. All he’s asking for is a better set-up. Even if he wasn’t, what’s wrong with asking questions about how to improve the play environment so that it’s more of a convincing, immersive world, less of a shallow, colourful excuse for simpletons to keep pressing numbers on their keyboard in exchange for imaginary victories? Have some freaking soul.
Now, this is all, of course, my 2c, but generally, those things mentioned in the OP are consciously neglected errors, or maybe even enforced, for the sake of “greater good and appeal”. Which, of course, doesn’t take away from validity of your observations, but that’s another point.
Doolio – thank you for you’re posts and the insight they provide. At the end of the day, I guess I feel that developers do have their priorities wrong, or rather, that there’s a lack of creativity when it matters. There are, surely, potential solutions to many of the problems caused by the tension between practicality and believability, and I wish developers would invest more time in them.
One of the triumphs of Portal, for instance, was making the tutorial part of the game a fundamental part of the plot, rather than forcing the player to sit through an insanely unrealistic ‘training’ mission.
Among the many successes of Planescape was making your character immortal, so that the whole ‘dying and reloading’ cycle that breaks immersion is cleverly resolved. You die, and your character wakes up in the mortuary – genius.
Another great idea – basing the plot of Team Fortress 2 around the idea of pointless, endless battles between nutjobs over a silly dispute. Because that’s all a competitive FPS can ever amount to, so why not admit it? Why attempt (and inevitably fail) to convince the player that they’re an honourable, skilful freedom fighter partaking in a meaningful battle, when we can all have just as much fun playing a black comedy of constant undignifying death?
There’s a lot that the player will allow as being somewhat representative or metaphorical. This is why RPGs originated in stats and turn-based combat. The big mistake, as far as I can see, is taking many of the facets of the stats and turn-based approach and carrying it over into a ‘live action’ context. It’s like the uncanny valley – the closer a fake human gets to being like a real human (but not quite) the more freakish it is. So it is with the combat and other elements of this game. In my opinion, a lot more thought should have gone into rethinking things that are jarring in terms of reminding you you’re just some person tapping a keyboard, not an adventurer in a fantasy world. I think it’s entirely possible to do it better without sacrificing the necessary gaming elements.
GW2 team has still not unlocked reserved names and now were missing out even more...
Posted by: Focksbot.6798
How you think this is a remotely reasonable complaint is beyond me …
What are you so eager to call your character? Blaze? Laser? Blazer?
Man, just let it go and come up with a different name! This is the umpteenth thread complaining about this because of people’s apparent lack of originality when it comes to naming characters …
Stipulation #1: Players must have access to serious, mean weaponry and heroes who can perform powerful-looking, fluid killing strokes and devastating spells.
Stipulation #2: Fights need to last more than a second, ideally anything up to a minute for ordinary encounters, longer for bosses. Otherwise it just isn’t satisfying.
Result: Arrows that do the damage of paper cuts, ‘chain lightning’ that’s less effective than shining a bright light into someone’s eyes, huge swords that take 20 gigantic slashes to make an enemy sigh and keel over.
Proposed Alternative: Divide moves into two categories: (1) quick, blunt trauma moves or deliberately weak attacks, or ones that cause confusion and conditions; (2) deadly, spectacular finishes or severe wounds. The second category of moves will nearly always be evaded while the enemy is at full ‘health’. The first category wear the ‘health’ bar down, since it actually represents the enemy’s initiative/awareness/reaction time. The lower the ‘health’ bar the better chance a (2) attack has of landing, either killing an enemy outright or dealing a severe blow.
Envisaged Result: A fight lasts just as long because the player is forced to rely mostly on moves that look and appear weak, eg. a knock with a rifle butt, flinging dirt in eyes. Realistically, this wears an enemy down. When the amazing weapon/wizarding powers are finally brought to bear, it results in a strong finish that leaves the player feeling their character and armaments are truly something to be reckoned with.
The limitations of the medium need to be accepted in order to understand the story.
I accept that, but I don’t think the limitations are anywhere near as stringent as you make out. There are some pretty simple steps forward that can be taken.
Again, look at Planescape: Torment, a 10+ year old game. It frequently gave you the chance to talk your way out through dialogue trees, which rewarded you with as much (sometimes more) experience as offending someone and then killing them. It basically gave you the option at all times of being friendly, conniving or thuggish.
I completely agree about the grawl and the dredge as well. I particularly dislike the undertones of these encounters – destroying minor religions and communists respectively.
People whose reponse is to cry ‘carebear’ – the thing is, you’re treating the game like a themepark in which you kill stuff to earn rewards. That’s your prerogative – fine. But I’m thinking of what ANet were trying to accomplish here. Unless I’m mistaken, they put a lot of time and effort into constructing a believable world in which they want players to believe their actions matter, and feel a part of the various events. So this goes out to ANet – please consider massively widening the scope for non-violent conflict resolution and allegiance options if you remotely give a kitten about players role-playing a hero or consistent character, rather than a savage mercenary who’ll do anything for a bit of copper!
ok, enjoy being level 1, because you can not kill ANYTHING. PERIOD.
Of course you can, because otherwise you’re letting people deprive other people of their ‘right to grow’. You intervene to preserve the greatest peace for all, ideally.
The whole concept behind GW2 is that you are this heroic figure saving the land of Tyria.
My biggest problem is actually this. The personal story is overblown in terms of making you out to a hero. There’s a jarring disconnect between all the messages and cutscenes about what a legendary figure you are, and the whole server being full of equally skilled adventurers.
imo, the personal story should always have cast you as a skilled adventurer whose moral outlook isn’t commented on. People ask you for help, are grateful if you help them, that’s it. This is an RPG. Leave it to the player to think about whether they’re a hero or a bully.
Secondly, given the complex web of alliances and factions in Tyria, it would have been much, much more exciting – and given the game added depth – if you had a choice of which people to aid in order to complete heart quests, or at least a choice to complete them using diplomacy and tact. Frankly, I’m never comfortable harming the Skritt, who are loveable and fun, but I would jump at every chance to attack the centaur, who blight the landscape and seem like a bunch of thugs.
I feel like I’m stuck on repeat here, but it almost brings a tear to my eye how much better this already beautiful game could be if they’d imported more of the design philosophy of Planescape: Torment, which let you level by being clever, diplomatic, sneaky and helpful, as well as by killing stuff. ArenaNet do actually promise on this very site that GW2 will be different depending on how you play it, be ‘the kind of game you want to play’.
Well, I’d have loved to resolve a bunch of situations without violence. It’s not that I don’t love the fighting – there’s just so bloody much of it. You have to fight every inch of the way round almost every zone in the world. How is it carebear to want to take a break to accomplish something more constructively?
Even when the renown hearts give you the option of doing something peaceable to complete them, you’re constantly being attacked by enemies while you try to do so. I really wanted to complete, say, the one at the top of Blood Tide Coast just by blowing the cover of the cloaked poachers, but I spent the whole time fighting drakes, because they never left me alone!
Can I just say, before I respond in full, that this is an excellent discussion – great first post and first rate response by AW Lore – and I’m sad that it will inevitably plummet from the first page under the weight of a hundred banal threads about endgame, botting and the Halloween update.
I might be the only one in the forums who actually finds this game mode fun.
I think the majority have found it fun. I do, for one. Most of the rage has been directed toward the clock tower jump puzzle but I haven’t found anyone who has disliked the Reapers Brawl.
Sticking up my hand.
Hated it. Really just underlined for me, far more than PvE, how awkward the battle system is. I couldn’t find a single reliable ability apart from a pistol shot with a super-long cool down. Would kill for them to implement some kind of proper aiming and collision detection, so that it doesn’t seem completely random whether I hit someone or they hit me.
Hi,
I just bought the game and downloading now. I was hoping leveling would take time and deliver lots of fun.
Is the game made to level fast (Like umm….WoW?) I hope not. :-)
It’s actually wonderfully flexible. If you’re very keen to level up fast, there are shortcuts – such as focusing entirely on crafting, as this fellow has done.
If you play the game normally, and respond to whether or not you want to help someone/join in an activity, do your story at an appropriate pace, take time to explore and take in the world, it will take you a good while, all the time progressing smoothly and constantly.
Personally, I took a long time getting to level 50 and then rushed the last 30 levels because I wanted to get access to some of the top drawer weaponry and have an easier time exploring.
Tried Reaper Rumble for the first time. Haven’t tried any form of PvP before.
Target player, press 2 for my leaping slash type ability. Character leaps in another direction, into a tombstone.
Press 5 for my targeted shot. Lead the target so that my shot will land correctly. Shot doesn’t land anywhere – just disappears. (If you miss, it’s supposed to at least show the explosion hitting the ground).
See allies. Go to help them. Six or seven skeletons suddenly materialise next to me (they were there all the time – just not drawn on my screen).
Look for the way out. Cannot find it.
Exit game.
PvP servers are the most fun i ever have in these games.
Mordred on DAOC was a blast, the PvE was fun too because you could go to all 3 worlds. The excitement and watching your back while pving made it alot of fun.
Killing AI fake mobs is UTTERLY boring to me.
But…most people are carebears in MMO.s nowdays, god forbid someone die.
What kind of idiot are you to hold these opinions and still buy and play GW2? What were you expecting? Did you read any of the publicity material?
I can’t think of any good reason why they couldn’t give you an open world pvp server.
There are tonne of good reasons in this very thread. The whole world is designed around dynamic events. On your pvp server, dynamic events would become farcical and pointless because (a) you’d constantly be accidentially hitting each other, and (b) they’d be a magnet for griefers. People have pointed this out like a billion times.
For a pvp world that would work, ArenaNet would have to design a whole other world – or at least a few zones – which have no dynamic events. But no one would go to them to level up or start with a new character, or with the expectation of being attacked by someone of a higher level than them, so I doubt you’d get what you want, which is the freedom to randomly attack someone who’s not expecting it.
(edited by Focksbot.6798)
I like them in theory, and I get a thrill from them, but by gum, they need to improve the physics and camera so that you can control your character reliably. Some puzzles require you to actually stand on thin air to get to the next bit.
…LOL? of course its a question, which you obviously misread completely.
Can someone else answer me?
“If you’re not a role player then you should stay away from this game?”
And don’t give me “oh there’s pvp for non role players”. I’m speaking for ones who just want pve.So let me get this straight: you’re asking: “Should non-role players stay away from this game?”
My answer is no, because there’s plenty to do for at least the first 50 hours or so, probably more if you don’t rush it. After that, there’s a more limited range of things to do.
Ok, I’m not posting as a smart kitten or anything, but besides pvp and costume collection (craft) and I guess completing the maps.. What else is there to look forward to?
I’m obviously missing something, no?
Well, for starters you’ve missed the whole pre-level 80 experience, which involves taking part in a story and doing events for the first time. That’s reason enough to play the game for the first 50-60 hours.
As to whether players should stick around after level 80, well, here’s what I plan to do:
- Level up a completely different character. (I’ve deliberately left large sections of world unexplored so that I’ll see them for the first time with this character).
- Join a friend in completing their story mission.
- Hold myself out as a gun-for-hire for anyone who wants help.
- Take a well-earned break until a content update.
“In GW2, you can still outclass people by being the better player. In a communist society, people can’t get ahead of anyone by being better. The incentive in GW2 is to be the better player, so don’t tell me that there is no incentive to improve or work hard.That’s why the sports analogy is more spot on than the communist analogy.”
In that sense of being better, you can do the exact same thing in communism with the exact same types of rewards (if we go by your analogy).
Not true, because in GW2, the better player wins more rounds, kills mobs quicker and therefore gets more karma/gold, completes their dailies and monthlies faster, earns their world points in WvW etc. In a communist state, you would not get these rewards.
My ultimatum to everyone: if your problem is lack of things to do at level 80, let’s talk about some constructive ideas and alternatives to grinding that might be easily and successfully implemented.
If your problem is that you think any MMO which doesn’t let you continuously grind your way to better stats is hopelessly flawed and a diabolical waste of time, we’ll have to disagree, because I’m probably never going to stop thinking you’re an insecure individual who needs superior gear to compensate for feelings of inadequacy.
@ Kerri Knight, I agree with you it would indeed not be a healthy thing to do.
However, I was not aware that I was doing so. Thank you for taking the time to use your superior mind reading skills and instant personal character evaluation techniques to inform me of whom I am and of what I think and what my personal failings are. All this after reading one forum post and then taking some of the comments made totally out of context, most impressive!
It is interesting to see how defensive you appear to be, do some of the comments you have taken out of context apply to you, or are you just really that idiotic?
Kerri’s post was eminently sensible. Your response here is juvenile at best.
One problem with rangers is the lack of build diversity created by a number of sub par utility skills. Many signets, a shout or two, and spirits are all a bit lackluster. That is the first place to expect improvements. Second is trying to improve the feel/ pacing on some weapons.
This is the important bit. Whatever they change or don’t change, the fact that Jon gets this is great.
Actually I was thinking more along the lines of Erika Elfwenkrona, but if your mind immediately goes for Scandinavian pornstars more power to ya.
So an underwear model. About as relevant as a pornstar, no?
I’m not taking your post out of context. You tried to argue, albeit in a tongue and cheek manner, that Norn women shouldn’t be bulky because they’re modelled after Viking society. That doesn’t make any sense, for the reasons I’ve explained.
…LOL? of course its a question, which you obviously misread completely.
Can someone else answer me?
“If you’re not a role player then you should stay away from this game?”
And don’t give me “oh there’s pvp for non role players”. I’m speaking for ones who just want pve.
So let me get this straight: you’re asking: “Should non-role players stay away from this game?”
My answer is no, because there’s plenty to do for at least the first 50 hours or so, probably more if you don’t rush it. After that, there’s a more limited range of things to do.
Witnezz – ‘hot women’ in Viking times were rather different to what they are today. Like many cultures (including modern Brazilian culture), they liked their women curvy. It’s got nothing to do with the Scandinavian pornstars you’ve been ogling.
Honestly, I find the attitude of you and others here someone narrow-minded and crude. There are numerous female athletes with much thicker, more muscular builds than the two thickest available Norn bodies. See my link above. You picked a pole-vaulter for crying out loud – what’s that got to do with the GW2 professions? Try looking at athletes who are built for throwing or lifting heavy objects – the closest equivalent we have to the types of people who would wield heavy metal swords and armour. Show me a world class weightlifter or hammer-thrower who looks like a Barbie doll.
Also, check out the calf muscles on any woman who is a serious walker or long distance runner, or even a cyclist. They’re effing massive. Now compare that to your ‘thickest available build’ pictures above.
Fine, it’s an unrealistic game. But there should be a much wider range of available body types. What’s the point in eight different frames that barely differ in any meaningful way? Give us the option of bulkier, older, top or bottom heavy women.
(edited by Focksbot.6798)
Gotta hand it to the man: this is exactly what we’ve been wanting to here. I haven’t even been complaining that much and this news gladdens my heart.
“GW2: not a game, but an arena in which games take place.”
Does this line of thinking help us approach GW2 in a new light? You aren’t playing a game; you’re entering a world. Once in the world, you need to work out what game/s you’re going to partake in.
Your analogies and describing skills only applies to the human players in mmo.
My analogies and describing the progressions only applies to the avatars in mmorpg.Both analogies are different and can never be compared, but both of us are right.
Okay, Naoko, let me put it this way: it’s reasonable to want progression from a game. ‘Fun’ is synonymous with feeling there’s something at stake, something that will report back to us on our performance. Rewards are one way to do this.
But what you’re asking for is an impossibility. At some point, progression has to stop, because content is finite. You have to reach the end of the road. Gear treadmills are a poor attempt to stretch out the concept of progression so that the last few drops of content can be milked for longer. They’re a stopgap system that can be much improved on.
Let’s talk about new and better ways to reward time and application beyond level 80. I’ve put up a thread suggesting the idea of special skins, gold and karma rewards for particular difficult feats in combat. The link is in my post above this one. Ideally, I’d envisage hundreds of possible achievements and rewards that can be worked towards, none of which affect balance.
If you feel that’s not enough, let’s talk about something else that might work. But the gear treadmill is one thing ANet and many of us here are decidedly against.
“On the other hand I like working towards something, I like the carrot because I cant resist it.”
There are compromises we could talk about. I created a thread specifically to discuss possible ‘carrots’ that aren’t gear grind, or at least one suggestion:
It would gladden my heart immensely if all the people currently complaining that they need ‘progression’ could turn their minds towards creatively thinking about new kinds of progression and fulfilment, away from the cul de sac of the gear grind.
As a fellow ranger player, I feel we’ve got it worse than other professions. Spirits are a missed opportunity – imagine how much you’d put into buying them up if unleashing a full suite of spirits significantly changed the feel of the combat.
Most shouts are also unappealing. One that tells your pet to tank, when that’s what they do anyway??
I’ve had a look at the thief skills and they seem to hint at a much wider variety of playstyles.
I agree that it’s probably best to introduce it only at level 70 or so. That’s exactly the point where I started to wonder what my aims in the game would be once I’d cleared the last 10 levels.
Hmm. Bit disappointed this thread – and compromises along these lines – are being ignored by players who seem to feel the only acceptable endgame is gear grind.
If Level scaling was gone would you feel motivated to visit lower level areas again?
Posted by: Focksbot.6798
Put me in the ‘downscaling is one of the best features’ column. I can’t wait to be able to help out friends when they buy this game without my having to make a brand new character.