Guild Wars 2

Hellkaiser.6025:

step 1: mention that you’re a power trader and move “massive volume” etc etc and make “massive cash”

step 2: mention a market niche that you’re buying into (preferably something that you’ve already bought into as cheap as it gets)

step 3: watch market demand skyrocket as the supply gets hit

step 4: meet the new demand as it spreads and use that to invest into something better

Am I doing this right?

No, usually one reads a thread before they skip to the bottom to make their smart@ss comments, which aren’t unique, and have already been addressed on the same page. But maybe you were also one of those guys who bought chocolate at 1s.

Horheristo.3607:

Logun.5360
I’ve seen a few gold hoarders like you in other MMO’s, players like you got nothing to do with the game and everything that it has to offer.
You feel complete no relation to anything that is going on in it, while talking about kittenes of gear, you follow the very same concept with gold.

As subjective and baseless as it is, you are entitled to your opinion. So we might as well move along.

Horheristo.3607:

I’d like to add on topic that TP farmers exist in every game, personally I believe it is a very selfish and destructive on large scale way of making gold.
But nothing can be done about it, and most of us will just have to suck it up.
Just the other day I was thinking that after playing this game you can come out with a major in economics, which is a very sad state that this game brought us to.

Perhaps you do need some economics, are you aware what would happen to the value of the gold that you managed to farm if there was no TP gold sink? Rapid exponential inflation, that’s what would happen. For ever trade on the TP, 15% of the gold from the transaction is removed from the economy. Now, step out of the virtual and into the real world and consider what would happen to the price of milk if the FED continued to print more money that what is taken out of circulation. Even though you don’t understand it, you still need sinks if you expect the value of your money to remain stable. I personally think it’s sad, you see no value in learning something that has real world value. I don’t have a problem with you running around in pirates clothes eating candy canes, so why would you have a problem with trading?

Horheristo.3607:

I’d like to see players who show no real interest in this game to simply leave it to the casual and traditional hardcore gamers. I talk to deaf ears, but do consider finding yourself a new hobby, perhaps wallstreet stocks exchange.

As I said before, I would leave the game if I had no interest in it. I had extremely high exceptions when I bought this game because it had been hyped by friends that I had played WoW with since vanilla. WoW did a lot of things right, catering to casuals like you wasn’t one of them. I had some of the best times in 40 man raids learning MC and BWL. Those were long hours and hard work but it was EPIC. And the gear you could get from 40man dungeons was EPIC as well. It didn’t just look awesome, it made you awesome. I remember drooling over the 8 set piece set bonus of Tier 1 mage gear, a chance your next spell would be instant cast. That was EPIC. So was the Lighting Capacitor and the fact that you 70 talent points that you could sink into elementalist specs. PvP was fast paced and it took real skill, but they continued to dumb it down for casuals until the game became a gloried Farmville with pandas…when it used to be this…

I wasn’t always an evil capitalist, I used to PvP.

Mobile Fire Shatter
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGk7EodzSEY

Mobile Arcane Shatter
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYYazOg8AcA

There used to be a reason you didn’t let a mage free cast on you.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YrEul297UT8&list=UL

AoE Farming with gay music
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndsmxEBX1M0

My friends and I came to GW2 with a large group of our core WoW guild. We formed MERC for the sole intention of WvWvWing. We have fun but Arena could improve WvWvW. They’ve done an excellent job on some parts, the graphics are beautiful, the siege system is awesome, and the over all strategic setup is fun. However, there’s not much to work towards. Sure their’s a lot of gear but aside for a very very modest stat boost, you only have the graphics to set you are part. But, at least that way its fair for every body, right?…

However, we did have some good times before the nothing to do feeling settled in. My friend shot these in the first couple of months of GW2, the Alamo stand was great, but we’d have never been able to do it without gold.

http://www.youtube.com/koawhkaine

NoOneShotU.3479:

My problem with having that much chocolate (suppose for instance its 100k+ bars)

How do you possibly unload it all and make your money back without finding a sucker willing to buy it? I mean sure you bought a lot of it at 13c, but you know you can’t unload it all at 1s? Are you counting on people who are ignorant of the price fluctuations who think that since fine mats and ectos are going up in price that chocolate is too, or that since leveling guides use a lot of it the power skillers with tons of gold who don’t care about prices are going to buy 100-200 at a time? Even so can you possibly unload all that chocolate or are you going to be constantly sitting on a position?

I have several exit strategies in mind, both short and long term but neither of which is based off of selling to suckers. This would imply that I think chocolate is worthless, which I don’t. I don’t believe chocolate will be used in a recipe during Christmas but Valentines Day is just 2.5 months away and I do believe there is a much higher probability that it would be used then. Additionally, it is possible that more people will either buy the game or the current base will become more active. Both of which will help all basic crafting mats. The only thing that I’m really worried about is ArenaNet reaching down like the hand of God to smite me. I hope they don’t because who wants big brother jump in every time you succeed at something. Who’d what to play the TP if ArenaNet jumped in every time to fix volatility, which brings me to my next point.

Volatility

It’s like blood in the water. People are drawn to big swings. They can be terrifying if you are on the wrong side of one but exhilarating if your not. I have noticed a significant difference in the market since we all started taking about different ways to earn. It could all be due to Winter’s Day but that is still two weeks off. I’d like to think that there has been an increased interest in the Trading Post and this has lead to increased volatility. This is how it should be, because I was really getting tired of the grind. I think the TP is the saving grace of GW2. And it is the only reason I still play this game, because WoW did everything else better. (Really guys? Everyone is a healer, tank, and dps? Gear that has no significant purpose other then graphical eEpeeenES? BOORING) Didn’t you learn anything from The Incredibles?

Oh, I’m real. Real enough to defeat you! And I did it without your precious gifts, your oh-so-special powers. I’ll give them heroics. I’ll give them the most spectacular heroics the world has ever seen! And when I’m old and I’ve had my fun, I’ll sell my inventions so that everyone can have powers. Everyone can be super! And when everyone’s super…[chuckles evilly] no one will be. —-Syndrome

Sorry, tangent…No, I do not plan on unloading my chocolate yet but that doesn’t mean I won’t continue to mess around in it when and if opportunity presents them self. So, you’ve been warned, Do not enter markets when you can’t handle the risk and can’t cover the cost. And please do not blame me if you still choose to play in the chocolate market and you lose. If I haven’t been clear…and it implies to all volatile markets…

BUY AT YOUR OWN RISK

Brian,

I don’t deny a large part of your post but you are wrong in your assessment and overall conclusion. This was not a pump and dump and I believe I’ll be able to show that with only the posts in this thread and spidy graphs.

Brian.9125:

1. Take a low-demand, low supply item

Yes, chocolate is a low-medium demand item with a very low supply rate. Despite being low-medium demand, it is critical to leveling a particular range of cooking. I read the patch notes, so I knew that at some point it would rise in price once the supply had been worked through.

Brian.9125:

2. Buy lots of it. Lots and lots, so the “buy instantly” price point starts to rise

I did buy lots and lots, at 13c. Then I realized I could add more space than I thought I had available, and I bought lots and lots and lots again at 25c. However, I only bought instantly on three occasions, 1am on the 27th (up to 1s per), 12pm on the27th (up to 3s per), and 9pm on the 28th (up to 5s per).

http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/12229

Brian.9125:

3. Place tons of phony custom offers

Absolutely, this happened on the 27th in my lead up to the purchase at 1am. I continued to add fake demand until my purchases on the 28th. My opponents are at least as observant as you in hindsight so I doubt I’m giving anything away at this point.

Brian.9125:

4. Post on the forums “Hey guise did you notice the price of X going up? Its cuz anet nerfed the drop rate and everyone’s buying it because (insert whatever reason)” (Throw in some irreverent economic babble to give yourself more credibility)

Here’s your only real deviation from the obvious time line in this thread. It is disingenuous of you but critical if you are to make a case for “pump and dump”. I say this because you can clearly see in this thread that I suggested a buy price of 13c and a sell price between 21-25c on the 23rd. In a pump and dump this happens after you’ve acquired all of your supply and moved the price as much as you can on your own, then you “pump” the stock and sell into the demand near the top.

Brian.9125:

5. Watch as wild speculation takes over, then once the bubble reaches an acceptable level start selling everything you have.

There was no wild speculation. I drove the price up from 55c to 1s, from 1s-3s, and from 1.5s to 5s. Now, spidy only shows the snapshot price of every 12-15m, so you get to see the massive jumps, but not the extremes to which I took it before it quickly dropped down to the levels you see in the graph. After the buy on the 28th, I left chocolate alone until last night.

Brian.9125:

6. Once you’ve sold off enough, most likely crashing the bubble in the process, assure everyone that they should stop buying now. After all you want them to save their gold for your next scam. Possibly get some sock puppets or friends to post thanking you for being such a cool dude.

I told people multiple times not to buy chocolate bars after the price had hit 50c. Many people PMed me when chocolate reached 25c-30c and I told them buying now would be very risky. Even more people PMed me at 50c and I told them don’t buy. I even posted in this thread and said, don’t buy now for an investment. Some people didn’t listen but still made a killing when I took it to 1s. The people who didn’t make a profit, who in fact took it in the teeth, were the ones who bought at 1-1.5s after the 28th and re-listed between 2 and 5s. Last night, I crushed the buy price of chocolate, it dropped 65c to 6c. Those who bought at 1s lost 90% of their investment if they de-listed from 3s and panic sold to me on the way to the bottom. I did this for reasons of my own, which I’m not going to elaborate on yet. But to steal a quote from a good friend of mine, “This is where the REAL PvP happens”.

I’ve got to head off to work so I won’t have time to edit this for grammar until tonight. However, there is more I’d like to elaborate one. Most of my posts recently have been on the market manipulation side of things but I’ll try and post more of the steady earning principles that I used to build my capital base.

Try using the google+ to register. It is the only option that worked for me.

Puandro.3245:

I hear its random drops and maybe mystic forge. I think they drop from the jormag event.

Thanks, I was worried I missed something obvious

Puandro.3245:

majorkong.9073:

Also, this market is so laughably inefficient. I mean, you can just make a significant profit placing buy orders and reselling on many, many items. That’s the ultimate in inefficiency.

I trip over arbitrage opportunities. Every five minutes I find a brand-spanking new one that I’ve never used before.

Here’s a freebie that I found two minutes ago and I’m too tired tonight to exploit. On the trading post, filter for green items and search for “Bloodlust”. You’ll find items, some selling for less than half of their value. You have to figure out how to unlock the value.

The best was Exotic Bloodlust weapons after the karka event.

Question, can Shaman Etched Avenger of Rage swords be farmed or are they random world drops or random mystic forge items?

LFk.1408:

Cymatoperior.5942:

That seems pretty one time to me. Once the market stablizes as the game matures and bugs are fixed as it is currently looking to do so,there would not be any more quick grabs like the ancient bone example you mentioned.
Also when prices of outputs rise, prices of inputs will without a doubt also rise because every of the hundreds of people camping at the trading posts are doing exactly what you are doing. So how you can actually make a profit larger than the same amount of time you spend farming is beyond me.

If you indeed believe what you said, I can see why this method of profit is beyond you.

There is no such thing as a “one time” occurrence in a fluid world. Something like what happened in my example (Ancient Bones) is actually the most likely type of event to happen again – an item with high relative rarity that had low previous utility (and thus high short-term supply due to that), being given a utility and thus driving value upward.

Combine it with the fact that risk was limited, all signs pointed to a sound investment. This is THE most common type of non-imagined (i.e. not rumor based) value spike that can occur in this game.

Your post implies an efficient, rational, stable, and omniscient market. In such a market, yes, investments do not exist. Everything is exchanged for fair value. None of this is the case.
- Stable is the easiest to disprove: ANet will continue to update the game. That alone makes the market a dynamic entity.
- A vast majority of the market is not rational. Most players buy what they need, when they need it. There is little contemplation of the equilibrium price of a product.
- Few, if any, markets can claim to be efficient. In the NYSE, the brightest minds design millions of automated programs crawl the marketplace for exploitable margins. Even that market is not 100% efficient. There are supposed to be no bots for this in GW2 (though it would be naive to believe that). Even with a few bots, what chance do you think the GW2 TP has to become anywhere close to 100% efficient?

These are all attributes of an ideal market, and none of those attributes even come close to holding true for the GW2 TP. A free market produces opportunities – how diligent you are with looking for them determines if you are able to capitalize or not.

Many here in this thread are much more active/experienced/skilled than me in terms of micro-transactions. Having done it before, I can tell you that it is a very real source of massive profit, but with 2 caveats. One is that the actual profit per hour is ever changing. The market value of the mats you need is always variable, as well as your demand. Even the most consistent market areas experience turbulence from time to time, unlike the Arah-2:30 wraith run, which nets you a set amount of gold with a proper party. The consistency of doing farm runs does have it’s advantages. If done well, though, 25G for an hour’s worth of work with no luck or ‘spike’ crafts is nothing special.

The second is the factor that drove me to lessen my activity in this area: It’s a lot of work, and a lot of careful planning. The 11/15 update ruined a lot for me: I love the fractals and I spend the hour or two I have to just play them. It’s tough to gain market control if you’re not actively monitoring it. I currently don’t have the time to do it well. Others do. I’m just defending the concept, that it’s perfectly feasible and vastly profitable.

You shouldn’t feel pressured to do any of this. The workings of an economy fascinate me. It may not be the same for you. Luckily, this game was designed with very little grind, despite what some seem to think. Most of the gear around the top end (statistically) can be obtained within a month of playing moderately.

I made what equates to possibly the worst investment in the game, sinking ~1000g in current value (I made it when T6 mats/ectos were cheaper) into a legendary weapon, aka something with non-existent value, and no gain in power. We all should do what makes us happy, which is not necessarily what makes us fake money. I’m really quite pleased to see other trading enthusiasts here

Excellent Post!

Cymatoperior.5942:

In an earlier post you said you trade 1000 to 1300 gold daily. With some money as backup id say you got 2000 gold, as I did earlier. You are just market troll, making impossible claims. And your strategies sound childish, as do your attempts at personal insult.

1. You are misquoting me. I said, “Everyday I invest 1000-1300g in bids, which I then resell”. Not all of my bids are filled, sometimes as little as 300g comes through but I usually make 25-30% on the total that does come through. I’ve linked images to show the hedge principle that I was talking about. In the image you see my full bags with 1000g sitting in my inventory. At that time I also had bids up on the TP.

2. You are intentionally and actively trying to misrepresent my position, also known as a straw-man argument (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man). I never claimed to have some astronomical amount of money. I’d estimate my current net worth at or slightly above 3000g but with only about 1500g liquid or in active sell orders. Most of which was acquired in the last month.

3. You are rude. Anyone who takes the time to read this thread will see that you are clearly being an A Whole. At first it appears to be good healthy skepticism but that quickly deteriorates. My only guess is that you didn’t buy chocolate when I first suggested it, in which case you missed out on a chance of a 1000% ROI or at minimum a 100% ROI. If I was the person you attempt to portray me as, then I would have pumped and dumped after I was perfectly positioned in the chocolate market. Perhaps you should go troll the 2g per hour farming forum, at least there you’d have something of value to offer. I will not be responding to you again, unless you have something to add other than insults and skepticism.

P.S. But to your credit, you did alert me to the vast amount of character slots that can be purchased, which fixed my space problem, which enabled me to heavily invest in the chocolate market. I’d tell you how much it’s worth at 1/2 the current market rate but you’d probably crap your pants.

Dude, I haven’t been making 25-40g every hour since I started playing. Surely I never implied that. I’ve spent tons of time building spreadsheets, often investing money at a loss just figure out returns/breakeven points, and then running numbers before my system started paying off. I didn’t start making the gold at this level until about 3 weeks ago. How much gold do you think I have?

Cymatoperior.5942:

Logun.5360:

Cymatoperior.5942:

Thats where you are still wrong. With the space you have wont it be better to use them to invest in something of higher value like powerful vials of blood instead of cheap stuff? Just like how rental works in real life, the space you have can be better utilized to store higher priced items instead of cheap ones to yield a better profit. Space still costs gold to ouechase afterall and is not free.

True in most cases but you’re forgetting a couple of things. 1) It’s easier to take something from 10c to say 1s than it is to take 1s to 10s. 2) Vials can be easily farmed, chocolate can’t. If I were to increase Vials to 10s tons of people would start farming them and I wouldn’t be able to handle the increased supply.

So that proves my point. You dont have that much gold as you claim.

How much gold do you think I claimed to have? Additionally, you seem to miss the point that there is potentially a limitless amount of supply for vials because they are easily farmed by everyone.

Cymatoperior.5942:

Thats where you are still wrong. With the space you have wont it be better to use them to invest in something of higher value like powerful vials of blood instead of cheap stuff? Just like how rental works in real life, the space you have can be better utilized to store higher priced items instead of cheap ones to yield a better profit. Space still costs gold to ouechase afterall and is not free.

True in most cases but you’re forgetting a couple of things. 1) It’s easier to take something from 10c to say 1s than it is to take 1s to 10s. 2) Vials can be easily farmed, chocolate can’t. If I were to increase Vials to 10s tons of people would start farming them and I wouldn’t be able to handle the increased supply.

Puandro.3245:

Logun.5360:

Puandro.3245:

Logun.5360:

Puandro.3245:

I unloaded mine, made 22 gold last night. Pretty good for a 24 hour flip o 50 gold, but then again this was my first investment ever in the TP.

Did you sell 6-7k bars directly to buyers between 78-85c last night?

More than 7K. I knew someone was trying to mess with the bars (again) to get them higher. When i saw someone buy a lot of choco and set up a few buy orders a bit below the new sell price my reasoning was that they were trying to set a new price range for the choco so that the average price would be higher, then in prob a week unload their new stock + their old stock (about 40K bars have “disappeared” in the past 2 weeks). I could have played a long and kept my choco and let the price rise but i decided to play it safe and take my profit. The price will keep rising until someone unload their stock or right before wintersday.

Personally this was my first attempt at playing with the TP to make money and ive never done it in another game but im pretty good with numbers and with access to Spidy i think i did pretty well for a 1 day investment.

Lol, then I was the one who bought your stock and you are correct. The only reason I didn’t post more was because I didn’t know how much you were sitting on and I didn’t want to potentially eat 150k at .85. Most people don’t sell directly into a wall like that. Had you not, we’d probably be looking at 1.5s right now The key to moving a price is keeping the spread traders out of of it.

Like i said im new to this but i guess i was correct to what you were doing, i just wanted to get out and atm im flipping other items as we speak.

It was 10,550 bars btw, sold the last 1K at 77c. The price will rise a bit more for sure until you sell (and other ppl) and it crashes.

http://i.imgur.com/CzRTx.jpg

Yup, I’ve got all your chocolate. Next time you see that, you’re pretty safe selling at supply side because I’ll hold the wall. The only reason I didn’t put up more than a 12-15k wall was because someone was selling into it as fast as they could. I got worried there was someone else out their who had as much chocolate as me

Also, I’m not going to tank the market. I’m waiting to see what winter’s day recipes that bring out, more people will be buying the game and playing during the holidays, and then there is gold inflation. If the gem to gold ratio every drops I’m going to buy into gems again before the 14th.

Cymatoperior.5942:

And logan why would you invest in chocolate if the profits are only about 10 gold per 10000 pieces if you already have like 2000 gold? Shouldnt you be doing something more expensive?

Who said profit is only 10g per 10000? I bought most of my stock at 13c back when I told everyone else in this thread to buy chocolate. Also, wasn’t it you who told me about the buying additional character slots? Before that, I thought I was limited to about 600ish bag spaces, then after your post I realized I could get buy additional character slots up to at least 37. That drastically changed my view on chocolate because space wasn’t a limiting factor anymore.

Puandro.3245:

Logun.5360:

Puandro.3245:

I unloaded mine, made 22 gold last night. Pretty good for a 24 hour flip o 50 gold, but then again this was my first investment ever in the TP.

Did you sell 6-7k bars directly to buyers between 78-85c last night?

More than 7K. I knew someone was trying to mess with the bars (again) to get them higher. When i saw someone buy a lot of choco and set up a few buy orders a bit below the new sell price my reasoning was that they were trying to set a new price range for the choco so that the average price would be higher, then in prob a week unload their new stock + their old stock (about 40K bars have “disappeared” in the past 2 weeks). I could have played a long and kept my choco and let the price rise but i decided to play it safe and take my profit. The price will keep rising until someone unload their stock or right before wintersday.

Personally this was my first attempt at playing with the TP to make money and ive never done it in another game but im pretty good with numbers and with access to Spidy i think i did pretty well for a 1 day investment.

Lol, then I was the one who bought your stock and you are correct. The only reason I didn’t post more was because I didn’t know how much you were sitting on and I didn’t want to potentially eat 150k at .85. Most people don’t sell directly into a wall like that. Had you not, we’d probably be looking at 1.5s right now The key to moving a price is keeping the spread traders out of of it.

Puandro.3245:

I unloaded mine, made 22 gold last night. Pretty good for a 24 hour flip o 50 gold, but then again this was my first investment ever in the TP.

Did you sell 6-7k bars directly to buyers between 78-85c last night?

BUTTERBLUME.3217:

Tip: Do not buy chocolate bars right now ^

You are right. I would not recommend you buy chocolate bars now if your purpose is investing. I think the prices will remain close to what they are now, until I start unloading my supply.

LFk.1408:

Indeed. I did some rune work myself in my earlier days.

Your point about the sigils is valid, even though I haven’t researched much about that level range myself. I think one of the larger problems I have right now is a case of tunnel vision when it comes to end-game items.

One of the largest and most liquid markets is for people below level 60, who are incidentally more inclined to shell out money for things they can just use now, and discard. Level 70s have a more stubborn mindset to push for 80 and just cobble together endgame gear, which occasionally leads to a somewhat exploitable “dead zone” in the mid 70s range of gear. It comes and goes, though, due to how obvious it is.

I have tendencies to chase big-ticket items, which in turn lead to some complications when fads go in and out of style.

To try to counteract that, I’m a lot more buy-and-hold now than I used to be, and also because it’s inherently less work. Interesting that we’re talking about this, because I just dumped 200g worth of a crafting material investment right now. For the life of me I can’t even find out what caused the 350% price spike, so I’m led to believe either someone started another pointless rumor, or the reddit AMA revealed something between the lines. My money is on bubble.

It’s kind of funny. This kind of brash, unreasonable reaction is actually not uncommon in the real Stock exchange, either. It’s particularly fun because Guild Wars is something of a time warp: markets move faster. A day is a great deal of time. Huge, market shaking shifts can be seen in a matter of weeks. This is the game to me, perhaps even more so than the part where you go and kill monsters.

I wonder if you’re in one of the markets that I’m messing with at the moment. Someone just sold about 10,000 units into a new demand wall I setup.

Cymatoperior.5942:

And I have half a girlfriend

Isn’t that illegal in all 50 states?

Cymatoperior.5942:

The casino will always make more money than the gambler. Thats why even anet is selling chests. If you are honest to yourself and did a real calculation, you will find that you arent making as much money as the smart farmers.

It’s only gambling if you haven’t got a large enough sample size and haven’t done the math.

BUTTERBLUME.3217:

That is what I am saying, you hope for the money shot, and it will eventually come. Yet it is not entirely reliable.

If you found an item niche, of course, will work for some time. I found that too for specific items for a short time.

But the supply just is not there to keep it up.

You labeled it as gold per hour, but buying up the items you need to play the mystic forge game should be considered in that estimation.
Doing thus would not let a number like 20g/h pop.

What Majorkong is doing is entirely reliable. You can make millions of dollars playing blackjack if you are able to achieve a 1% edge on the house (which you’ll never get because they’d throw you out for card counting). You only need math and the capital to survive the down swings. It’s not gambling if you are playing the long odds. The same can be said about the mystic forge if you’ve got a large enough sample.

Mr Spooky.5429:

Logun.5360:

It was easy to see what would happen after ArenaNet nerfed chocolate bar drop rates across the board.

Just curious, where did ArenaNet say they were nerfing chocolate bar drop rates? Didn’t see it in any of the recent patch notes, or anywhere obvious.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Update-Notes-October-22-2012/first#post521593

It’s buried in there, I suggest you use the find in your browser. Chocolate was trading at 2c/3c or 3c/4c back then if my memory is correct.

Cymatoperior.5942:

Anyway I did a quick mental calculation before I rebuked your 30-40 gold average an hour, for that to happen there should be high and predictable items to trade and there wasnt any at the moment and anytime in future. Plus you lose 15% of your selling price each time you trade making profit very minimal. Real stocks dont make you pay so much so you cant plat the trading house like you can a stock market.
It is possible to do only long term investment, but no way can you play it short term to make 30 gold per hour.

Your missing my point, or maybe I wasn’t being clear enough. I wasn’t advocating a stock picking approach, I was advocating a hedge fund approach. I make short and long term investments. Right now, chocolate bars, yams, chili peppers, and Glacial lonestones are my long term investments. But I make the majority of my gold buying large sections of the market daily. Every day I invest 1000-1300g in bids, which I then resell. The main issue I run into with this is the sell cap. I have to wait 60 secs for the sell post cool-down (you can only post 6 times in 60 secs), which means it takes an hour or two just to list my items for sale. Theoretically, you could make 9.9g per hour just trading the spread on butter once you were in the butter bid and sell rotation but you can only post 6 stacks per minute.

Cymatoperior.5942:

Err you can buy new character slots and use the new characters to hold stuff?

I’m using my four other characters as 80 slot bag men right now. Additional character slots are the way to go price wise but I’m waiting on the gold to gem conversion rate to come down a little from the last event. I wrongly assumed that you could only purchase a few character slots but it looks like you can buy 32+, so 450g (current conversion rate) will buy an additional 2,560 bag spots if you buy 15 slotters for all of them. This will definitely help with space issues and I appreciate you pointing it out.

Did anyone buy chocolate bars back when I first suggested it? Buy orders were around 13c then.

Did this thread get deleted?

Nvm, I just had to post too see first page.

Nice job Aevin,

I’m currently watching Chocolate Bars, Yams, Chili Peppers, and Glacial Lonestones

Tallis.5607:

Your original statement…
Now… look at the graph you posted. Look the the left. You will see the actual amount of silver. See it? It is 5. Not 15, 5.

You finally managed to add something worthwhile. You are correct, I could have been clearer. My statement about sell and buy volume was specific to the 11th, which you don’t seem to disagree with. My second statement was in reference to the total price swing (between 11th and my post) after I bought up all of the excess between 3s and 5s, I thought this was obvious but clearly it wasn’t. So now that I’ve made myself clearer, do you retract any of your previous skepticism and accusations?

Graph 1
http://s12.postimage.org/717r43wn1/Sil2.png

Graph 2
http://s11.postimage.org/hkgxktj83/Sil3.png

Side note, Ruben, the guy who built and runs Spidy, updates his data every 12-15 minutes. However, he only shows this data on the current day. For previous days, he just shows the hourly data. If you had access to the 12-15 minute samples on the 11th, you’d be able to better see the price and volume movements.

captaincrunch.6731:

Just don’t be a market troll that ruins the game for others like the poster above me. 20-30s for a silver doubloon? Thanks a lot buddy.

Captain,

I’ve been out of silver doubloons since the 18th. All I did was remove the massive amount of supply built up at 3-4s. Silver doubloons, just like platinum, would have risen in price naturally over the next few weeks. I just sped up the process. Additionally, I helped farmers get a better return on their time for farming them. Prices will drop if farmers can supply enough to the market, if not, they will continue to rise.

Since you have difficulty reading graphs, I zoomed in on this one for you. Sell volume dropped from low 2000’s to the low 700s, because I was buying them up. This is the last time I’m going to respond to you until you have something worthwhile to add to the conversation.

http://s11.postimage.org/b9e444egj/Silver.png

I have a link in the gold per hour thread

http://s12.postimage.org/l3tbaphrh/Hedge2.png

Tallis.5607:

Let’s see…

First, you say you make 25g per hour. A statement that I find extremely unlikely.

Then, you claim that ‘you know something others don’t’. Again, very, very unlikely.

You claim to have lost 200g and then won it back on… platinum and silver doubloons which is an extremely tricky market, thir price plummeted then skyrocketed, on very thin sales number. Again, very unlikely.

All talk, talk, talk. When I read the post, I was thinking : ‘why would anyone lie like this’.

But then it became clear… you try to sell something ’’I’ve been buying up chocolate lately because it’s going to 21-25c minimum over the next couple of weeks, which will give me a 50% return. My main problem with the lower value stuff is space, so even though chocolate is a great buy, it’s not that good in terms of the short to mid term space it takes up.’’

So, basically, you are just trying trick people into buying chocolate.

I doubt anyone would fall for it, people aren’t THAT stupid, Mister I-make-25-gold-per-hour.

Just because you can’t fathom it, doesn’t mean I or others can’t and don’t do it. There are hundreds of power traders in the game that make this rate or more. Additionally, you are misquoting me and taking me out of context. I did not say that I know things other people don’t know. I said “. Common principle of hedge funds is buy the whole market and hold unless you know something others don’t about a particular stock.” That means, in the stock market, stay away from individual stocks, unless you are aware of something that a majority of traders are not. Many of the same principles can be applied to this game. You probably don’t have the patience but if you do, there is a lot of real world (and in-game) value in listening to the lectures below. So in summation, I’m arguing a hedge fund approach to the game not a stock picking approach. I only list the doubloon examples because I got burned two of the four.

Concerning gold and copper doubloons, I did lose 200g on them because I bought all gold doubloons up to 50s per level. However, people refused to buy gold doubloons at these levels and there were other traders sitting on small to medium quantities that they started releasing into the market. So prices quickly fell back to 4s level. I did the same thing with platinum and silver but with a much better success rate.

Check out the buy and sell volumns around the 11th. Silver doubloons went from 3s to 15s. Pretty reasonable that this would happen over the long haul (because bots were providing a majority of the supply) but there was a large supply that would need to be removed for it to happen. Enter power trader, buy up all of the supply then slowly release it into the market. Platinum doubloons, high supply do to event, players were paying 25s per less than a month ago, event ends, buy up the cheap ones, wait, then slowly release into the market.

http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/24502

As for chocolate, that was a freebie. Even if I filled all of my available space with chocolate, the return would only be net 45-50g based on my buying in a second time at 12-13c per. Much fewer people read these forums than play the game. Feel free to doubt me, you can always check back in a couple of weeks and see how it went.

Cymatoperior.5942:

Ermmm you should be able to buy space at 600 gems a bank slot right? That is only like 7 gold and should be peanuts to you if you made that much…

I’ve already bought all my bank and bag spaces. But that’s only 386 spaces since I’m using 18 slotters right now. So even if I filled them all with chocolate I’d only be looking at a 45-50g return over a couple of days. I’m sure this sounds great but there are more profitable items out there that require bag space. I regardless to what some may think, I have no need to pump chocolate bars. It was easy to see what would happen after ArenaNet nerfed chocolate bar drop rates across the board. They did the same thing to oranges before chocolate and those are still going up. Supply for chocolate is going down while demand is steady.

http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/12229

I’m at 100k sold so if there is it’s way up there

Most of the things that matter in this game must be bought with gold ie commander, gear. Right now gems buy a very large amount of gold, that will likely to continue over the next day or so. However, I suspect people will start spending real $$ to buy gems to convert to gold soon after. Gem prices will come down but not to the previous level and will then spike up at the next event.

However, right now is the absolutely worst time to convert gold to gems unless you’re buying some that’s at a 70% discount.

Cymatoperior.5942:

You make 25 gold/hour on a bad day? You mean you never lose money trading?
Maybe you made a typo and you meant silver. 25 silver/hour on a bad day.

No, that wasn’t a typo. Common principle of hedge funds is buy the whole market and hold unless you know something others don’t about a particular stock. I occasionally lose money but that’s only when I attempt short term price manipulation. It pays off about 25% of the time, some times big. My recent attempts have been in the four doubloons, I lost about 200g messing with gold and copper doubloons, people wisely refused to buy at the higher prices and I had to get out but I made it back and then some on platinum and silver doubloons. I’ve been buying up chocolate lately because it’s going to 21-25c minimum over the next couple of weeks, which will give me a 50% return. My main problem with the lower value stuff is space, so even though chocolate is a great buy, it’s not that good in terms of the short to mid term space it takes up.

It is harder to do but you still can. Also, if you have enough gold, you can temporarily manipulate certain high volume markets or dominate slow volume high dollar markets like Dusk pre-event

The return is lower (5-10%) but it is possible, it makes more since if you have at least a 1000g to invest. Additionally, it’s a good way to hedge inflation if you don’t plan on playing for awhile.

Gem’s are going to continue to go up in value until after the event. More people will convert Gold to Gems to buy the items which will decrease the $$ value of gold and increase the gem value, just like the first event. Then an interesting happens, there is far less gold in the economy so the buying power of gold starts to increase and the pendulum swings back as people spend $ to buy gems and to then convert to gold. I don’t think it will be as severe this time as last time but it is going to happen.

If you are looking to make gold off of Gems, you should have bought in before the event, it’s too late now. However, if you stocked up pre-event, you’ll probably want to sell midday on Friday if you want to get out at the top.

And you heard it here first, Chocolate is going to 20c per min.

Lol, then spend some of that money I blew on consortium chests and upgrade my man!

DemigoesRAWR.8701:

If you are spending “all your time playing the trading post” You should really think about working at the stock exchange for fun.

John Smith +1

LOL, one of the most common names/alias’s.

I’m a stock analyst irl, outside of PvP, “trading” is what I do for fun

John Smith.4610:

Think of the trading post as a whole. These restrictions aren’t made to inconvenience you.

I understand but there are no limits on the number of buy orders I can do, so why the limit on sale orders? I find it hard to believe that your hardware cannot support it so it must be that you want demand to out pace supply. So, are these restrictions here so you can get a better return on gems sales by driving gold prices higher?

Currently 1 gold piece costs $1.61 to buy through gems. If ArenaNet can create artificial demand by allowing purchases to be made faster than orders can be listed then the price will go up on all items. What may have cost 1 gold piece, now costs 2 gold pieces, which you now have to pay $3.22 for.

John, did I guess right?

Arena Net,

Please lift the 6 item sell cap. You know, the one that lets you sell 6 stacks, then requires you to wait about 10-12secs before you can sell another stack. This requires you to wait 60secs before you can sell another 6 items. This is stupid, I spend all my time playing the trading post and have to wait 60 secs to put up 6 more items if flipping annoying. It’s a kitten waste of my time. Please remove this.

Thanks.

Why are doubloon prices going up so fast?

This happens to me all the time, I am able to list about 6 items different times back to back, then I have to wait on some stupid internal CD, which seems to be about 15-20secs before I can list anther. It is really annoying since I spend almost all of my time in game at the trading post.

I just realized that the moderators deleted 9 of my posts regarding their customers service and the chain of responses that I got from them. I guess showing that their customer service is Kittens does not add to the thread. For anyone who have not realized it yet, they will not be replacing your items or gold.

That’s the first encouraging thing I’ve seen to date.

90 hours later, still out 25g, still no response from ArenaNet

90 hours later, still out 25g, still no response from ArenaNet