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A Summary of the Scene 1 Year in

in PvP

Posted by: NiftyNags.7946

NiftyNags.7946


We don’t get many responses in this forum because it’s even whinier than the wvw forum, if that’s possible. Constructive posts are all it takes, but it’s all aboard the QQ train here in spvp land.

If people want answers to questions, they need to stop asking loaded questions.


I think the devs care about pvp…

I think they actually believe what they say when they say
“we want people to think of this as the game you go to for PVP”

Why do I think that?
I know they put in the time to play their own game..
I saw John Sharp playing Eu solo que for a week straight, Stalker-status
(Through the leaderboards =D but that account has been moved? now)

These forums have become utterly toxic to dev replies though; one reply by Allie M. = kittennado,

One Reply by Jon S,= Kittenstorm the like of which has never been seen since /b/astards walked the earth.

I’m sure they care just as much as the rest of us playing pvp..
I don’t think you go into game design cause you want to make money
I think you go in there because you care; and cause it’s the coolest job in the world.
And their reward is what? a whole forum seething with hate?

So what happends now? How can the devs even make a post on this forum anymore?

It’s up to us as the pvp community as a whole to grow up, stop making troll posts, focus all our energy into 1 or two issues discuss it thoroughly in one thread constructively and lobby for a fix.

Why? Because;
“Short and long term goals which will go unnamed” sounds like the resources for pvp development are going to pve+ and nothing new is coming.
Unless you like zerg warfare.

I completely agree with you guys about keeping things civil and constructive. And I agree that most if not all of the devs care greatly for this game. I’ve seen some pretty childish and even nasty posts in reply to devs and other players, and I haven’t even really strolled these forums much. The devs do not deserve this, and the players don’t either.

However, from what I’ve heard many players have been posting very constructive posts since launch or even beta and have been ignored. I don’t know how true or accurate this is, because as I said, I don’t watch these forums as much as others, but I think this would partly be what is causing people to get frustrated.

Tribulation Mode - I am ready

in Super Adventure Box: Back to School

Posted by: NiftyNags.7946

NiftyNags.7946


Here’s a fantastic game design lecture by Will Wright. Starting at the 12:50 mark he’s talking about feedback loops in much clearer language than that dense technical link I posted earlier:
http://youtu.be/CdgQyq3hEPo?t=12m54s

One thing he mentions is how the negative side of the feedback loop is usually the most interesting. People usually play games to achieve the success side of the loop, but it’s not very rewarding without having experienced the failure states. Imagine that like a slider, where some people want games with no failure feedback like that amazing mario game posted above, and some people want the slider cranked all the way in the other direction. And that’s what this emerging genre is. It’s an exploration of the furthest reaches of the aesthetic form of negative feedback loop. In that way it’s kind of like the Black Metal of games. Black Metal evolved as musicians were trying to find the most extreme ways to break the established rules of musical aesthetic. (though obviously there are the minimalists and modernists etc. who break them even more.) The point being that most people can’t listen to to more than 10 seconds of Black Metal. It makes them agitated, or so annoyed they get angry. (I know this because I’ve tested several people I know >;) Likewise, this platform hell, or whatever you want to call it kind of game makes some people annoyed and angry. Guild Wars 2 in general is like a beautiful sweeping orchestral movie score. It appeals to a much broader audience.

There is a well established three part structure to popular music, and 90% of the hits follow it to a T. and there’s an ancient 3-act-structure for story that 90% of books, movies, and plays follow to a T. But there are fantastic examples of media that purposefully subvert those structures and the fact that the rules are broken is part of what makes them great. There Will Be Blood has no hero who grows through a struggle, learns a lesson and wins at the end. It’s not so much a story as it is a character portrait on film. And there are entire genres of music that are defined by the ways they break the popular paradigm.

So when I hear folks saying “How are invisible instant death traps fun?” it sounds to me like asking “How can you enjoy Death Metal or 50s Jazz or movies where the hero dies at the end?” It’s simply a matter of taste.

Someone above described what “good design” is in a very textbook sort of way where there are balanced feedback loops with clearly delineated goals and telegraphed challenges. And that is a perfectly valid way to critique games. And most of the time when games break those rules it’s because of sloppy, ill-conceived design, technological hurdles, time constraints, etc. Most movies that break the 3 act structure do it because the writer, director, editor etc. just aren’t good at what they do. Pop music that lacks the Verse-Bridge-ChorusX3 is often because the artist doesn’t know any better.

But when an artist is experienced with their craft, knows the rules backward and forward, and has worked within that framework before, THEN with intent and forethought decides to make something that breaks those rules, pushes one element to its extreme, or some other innovation, THAT’S when “good” happens. Not for everyone, because most people dislike anything that deviates too far from the norm. But there is always a market of people who can recognize the point of the exercise and appreciate it.

Like before, I’ll throw out the caveat that I’m not claiming that the SAB team is that master craftsman pushing the medium forward in dramatic brilliant ways. Only that we are THINKING about the design choices we make, we recognize when we are breaking rules, and we have a reason for doing so. Because SAB exists within the ecosystem of Guild Wars 2 it’s not going to be an exact replica of IWTBTG. We’re a hybrid, and that brings lots of interesting challenges with it. I’m sure we’ll learn a lot from this first TM release, and incorporate those lessons into the next round.

Well, that’s enough prattling at 2:30 am! Good night/morning!

Josh, you and your posts are quickly becoming my favorite dev interaction on the forums! SAB was already one of the most fun pieces of content I experienced with my friends in this game — hours of almost non-stop teasing, jokes, frustration, and laughter. And the details and passion you share with us in your posts is fantastic. Thanks for being so awesome, although I’m sure I’ll be cursing your name in a few days! =P

Theoretical vs Factual

in PvP

Posted by: NiftyNags.7946

NiftyNags.7946

Mammoth, you’ve posted enough in this thread. Unless someone else starts posting something worth your time here, I think you’d be more useful elsewhere. Thanks for the perspective and well made points.

Finally dagger skins!

in Super Adventure Box: Back to School

Posted by: NiftyNags.7946

NiftyNags.7946

I’ve also been looking forward to the dagger skin since last time. It looks like it might be a pretty big dagger based on the hilt that shows in the picture.

or rather “8 lights achievement difficult?”

I wonder how many people actually got this. I managed to do it after a lot of effort, and I like the idea of some content that is this difficult as well as a reward to show off, but I’m worried about having enough time to get it done since it’s not sticking around.

[Merged] Opinions on Birthday Presents

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: NiftyNags.7946

NiftyNags.7946

The ONLY thing I would have been extremely happy to see RNG in, does not have it.

This is exactly how I feel, and I totally agree with everything in the OP’s post. I already made a very similar post in a different thread, but I think this thread is more respectful and professional. Hopefully this becomes a learning experience, and we end up with something more enjoyable and useful next year.

I would like to add, though, that other than this birthday gift and Gnashblade not winning the election, I haven’t had any huge disappointments with the amazing content and all the devs and other people who make it so this game still thoroughly entertains me even after a year of playing.

No appreciation for dedicated players

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: NiftyNags.7946

NiftyNags.7946

I’m glad we got something for our character’s birthday, but as you have mentioned, the gift is not very appealing at all for even slightly dedicated players; I’m stuck with 11 of the same mini that I can’t even forge and 11 experience scrolls when I already have eight level 80’s. But what is even more disappointing is that every character for every player gets the same exact thing.

I’m not sure if this is how many other players feel, but I think what made the GW1 birthday gifts so fun and exciting and had me looking forward to the GW2 ones was the element of surprise and the possibility of getting something cool to show off to friends and other people. They could be special and relatively unique.
EDIT: After reading other threads/posts, it seems there are quite a few who feel exactly the same way.

It seems ironic that this game feels like it has so much RNG in it, but one of the few times that I really wanted variety and random luck, it turns out the exact opposite, and I end up with 11 copies of the exact same thing which everyone else in the game also gets.

I just hope that people’s disappointment reaches ANet and that next year they have something a little more fun for us.

(edited by NiftyNags.7946)

Copper-fed Salvage-o-matic... wait, WHAT?

in Black Lion Trading Co

Posted by: NiftyNags.7946

NiftyNags.7946

Well at least the other tools actually have skins/animations, so, although they are only slight conveniences and will likely never end up saving you money, they look cool and you can enjoy that and show them off.

Does the Salvage-o-matic show something like your character pulling out the machine and fiddling with it when you salvage something?

Vote for Evon!

in Cutthroat Politics

Posted by: NiftyNags.7946

NiftyNags.7946

“You’re a mouse fart who thinks she’s a hurricane.”

This line alone is reason enough!

My character split into two

in Bugs: Game, Forum, Website

Posted by: NiftyNags.7946

NiftyNags.7946

Happened to me as well.
Just after finishing CoF path 2. A couple of us used transformations after opening the chest (the other person said he also had a clone of himself).
The attached graphics settings should be what I was using at the time, although I don’t remember if I was in windowed mode or not.

I did find it pretty entertaining xD

Attachments:

Kegs scored achievement track is stuck.

in Bugs: Game, Forum, Website

Posted by: NiftyNags.7946

NiftyNags.7946

Some friends and I (as well as other random people we’ve asked) are all having the same problem. None of the Keg Brawl achievements are progressing. From what I understand, Crab Toss has the same problem, so hopefully this can get fixed soon for all us crab/keg lovers =D

Tickets for Review (3 days and older) [merged]

in Account & Technical Support

Posted by: NiftyNags.7946

NiftyNags.7946

Incident: 130112-000282

(I’m posting this for a friend; he can’t post because his account was banned).

It’s been three days, and he hasn’t gotten a reply yet.
Another friend with the same issue was promptly replied to and had the problem solved.

Thanks!