Nice to have, the question then is whether sacrificing burst capacity for constant recharges would be worthwhile in PvP. That’s something for the PvP theorycrafters or playtesters to figure out though, especially since it has to be balanced around playing against such a spec.
sounds reasonable to me.
maybe adding in-combat recharge only to it, just to maintain the players responsiblity to manage the handling from time to time inbetween combat situations
That’s utter BS though, “managing the handling” only means wasting time on tedious clicking, something we already have enough of in this game.
Your error lies in the assumption that the effect/time ratio will remain unchanged with the new mechanic. Even if this is implemented initially (unlikely as is), it would leave Anet without any further options if that turns out to be overpowered. They would be forced to nerf cooldowns or active effects to maintain PvP balance, wrecking PvE in the process.
Simply reducing the chant time is different, because that timer, that window of vulnerability, still exists. You can set it to 0.25s and increase cooldowns accordingly, but if that’s deemed OP you can at least increase it back to, say 1.5s. Put it in a trait if only certain builds are OP (you don’t want shatter+4Mantra to be a top pick…)
Go for a middle ground, not an extreme that is bound to fail eventually.
And again, state not only why a change is needed, but also how your proposition is better than other suggestions, for example the ones I have listed in this thread. I have clearly stated the problems with yours, so please give constructive feedback on how those problems can be avoided or why taking those risks would be worth it even in the long run.
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And you didn’t address any of the concerns I already voiced multiple times prior to your post, hence the unfriendly reply.
The more options they have to tweak individual aspects of a skill/build, the less likely a single knee-jerk nerf will wreck the affected content for everyone. Your suggestion removes potential balancing options.
And nerfing the dps or heal/s on purely spamming MoP is just as ridiculous for PvE as what I mentioned would be for PvP, it’s barely helpful as is. Unless you meant only reducing the actual number, so heal/s would stay the same with the new charge gain system.
Changes to damage and healing can be adjusted to compensate for balance if ANet deems them necessary (as I’m sure they will in the case of Restorative Mantras).
…and that is why I have full trust in Anet to completely butcher Mantras for PvE if such a change goes live. Right now Mantras are in a workable spot because you can effectively split them between PvE and PvP, without actually splitting.
What you suggest would again force PvE players to suck up PvP-centric nerfs to the actual effectiveness. Or how would you like MoP to deal 2k damage pre-crit, or Restorative Mantras heals 5k in a 900+ AoE so you can actually heal your PUG team? That’s the kind of scale you’re looking at from a reversed perspective, making “support” the best-in-slot option for PvE.
Even if the current recharge timers would be balanced in PvP with the chant removed, I would be very skeptical for the future because this would still eliminate a potential balancing handle that doesn’t wreck PvE instantly. Would sPvP players enjoy Maim the Disillusioned buffed to 10 stacks per illusion so it’s a competitive pick for PvE? I think not.
Ah okies, I do not use stealth much, but I was under the impression it broke combat. Of course I am probably wrong in the assumption, but it is worth considering how the mechanics might interact behind the scenes. The last thing we need is something like the power block over reaction occurring against a mantra QoL change.
Nah, Thieves have special traits to heal while stealthed so they don’t need OOC regen. As far as I know even they only use it as a hard disengage, essentially to restart the fight from fresh in hopes of landing a better opening burst.
Might make a burst mesmer more “meat-grindy”, but if people run into a burst spec 1 by 1, waiting for their ally to die before fighting themselves, they probably deserve the loss.
That might potentially be a fair balance, so long as it could not trigger while you are in stealth. As 3s + PU could enable you to recover a charge on each mantra simply by using decoy or torch.
How exactly would you manage that? With “out of combat” I meant “no yellow markings around the skill bar and OOC health regen active”.
It’s not meant to be a PvP combat buff, only a QoL change for PvE/WvW roaming.
Given that all of those full heals are on base 20s cooldowns (some can be even shorter) and some even include cleanses … some even more than that … that is why I think 15s is more suitable for half a heal … even if you spend trait points to improve it to be a cleanse as well. Others aren’t having to make that investment for a full heal on the same or better to do the same.
I know the numbers are pretty low from an objective standpoint, the problem is that most of those heals can be interrupted, while autoregen Mantra can’t, and we have so many damage avoidance skills which effectively magnify the heal. At least the recharge rate can be used to balance it, so no conceptual problem here. The Warrior whine would be glorious though.
I think lowering the cast time for Mantra of Pain could get ridiculous, especially if lowered by 1.5s so that it is only 1.25. Combine that with Restorative Mantras and you are spamming high damage, no-telegraph AOE damage and healing yourself.
- 1s cooldown between two charges being cast
- 1s cooldown on ability
- 1.5s cast
You’re healing every 3.5s and nuking quite a bit in that period as well.Maybe that’d be fine, but I’m not sure.
A shorter cast time for all the other Mantra’s would definitely improve Mantra QoL.
You’d also lose a utility slot, at least 1 valuable Dueling Trait, and you’d spend half your time with a giant, glowing “smack me now!” sign above your head. 2 more trait points down the drain for Restorative Mantras unless you’re in a tank/sustain build in the first place.
I would definitely suggest making the buffed Mantra trait a Master, or even swap it with Harmonious Mantras if that alone doesn’t take enough trait points out of sustain spammers. 0/6/0/4/0+X would already be a hefty hit for PvE, in particular you’d lose Empowering Mantras, meaning you’d have to make a choice between pure dps and support/sustain. Which is good.
Independent of the traits, how easily can you get “out of combat” in high-level PvP? Would something like this be abusable:
While out of combat, all readied Mantras regenerate charges at a rate of 1 every 1-5s. A flat 3s rate would be nice and easy to read, otherwise 1s MoP, 2-3s both MoR, 3-5s MoD. MoC might have to go as high as “four to five seconds” (seriously? took me half a minute to even figure out why it’s censored) base because some idiot would try to pre-stack Stability with it, but the others would be inherently limited as they have no actual use outside of combat (you already heal rapidly, and damage/conditions/interrupt should put you in combat right away)
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For example, I don’t think making MoP have an animation and hit 0.5s after you cast it would cause an issue in PvE. Same with MoD. Perhaps making the AOE slightly larger could compensate for any potential issue with that such as it sometimes hitting less mobs since they can technically move some in that 0.5s.
I can see the concern with having larger cooldowns on your mantras’ charges in PvE as I do more often have a chance to recharge my Mantras in 40+ fractals than I do in PvP. Going from 2 charges every <30s (cooldown + cast time) to one charge every Xs could definitely be a nerf as you get less charges per second if able to cast soon after the cooldown.
Does my idea above work better for you?
MoP is vital for tagging since we don’t have any decent pulsing AoE fields. Any delay hinders it greatly, even latency since you need to select a target and auto-target is terrible for lining up circular AoE. Other than that the main use is cycling with Restorative Mantras, so anything that doesn’t affect the spam-cycle time is okay. MoD has other viable uses, but few/none that strictly require the instant-cast.
Anything that leaves the spam-on-cooldown effectiveness the same should be fine for PvE, and adding additional effects/timer buffs on top of the current charge/cooldown mechanic is fine. But if the charge is removed the passive generation timer will be balanced around sPvP fringe cases, and we know how that ends.
And for your suggestion, consider Mantra of Recovery in a PU stall build, 170 hp/s regen with no condition or counter besides losing out on an inferior “active” heal, that’s half a Healing Signet on top of all our damage mitigation, which can also be traited to cleanse 2 conditions every 15s…
I wouldn’t exactly mind such buffs, especially if the PvP pros conclude they would be good for the meta, but I’d rather see changes targeted at both specific skills and specific game modes. Since it’s mostly PvP where Mantras fall short I would suggest buffing defensive traits which won’t be abused in PvE, or tampering with the charge time. Example:
Protected Mantras gives a base 2s Stability upon starting the channel, 1 stack, 10s ICD (numbers are horribly off I’d guess, toughness boost should stay)
or: Mantra Mastery reduces the charge time by 0.75-1.5s, possibly keeping the CDR
Both should help with the core weaknesses of Mantras in PvP and give additional balancing handles to tweak. Neither would see much abuse in PvE because you can have MoC up for every big attack anyway and no mob will bother to interrupt your chant. MoP could get interesting, but all the cheap 1shots would still hit just as hard.
Second, Elementalists have some astoundingly good traits for their cantrips that turn all of them into condition cleanses, regen, vigor, etc.. This makes these utilities much higher up on the power curve … and it takes only a single trait line.
Forgive me if I missed one, but I only see Might and Regen+Vigor, both in traitlines that offer other, less selfish ways of granting these boons. It’s not a single trait line, and I don’t see the “all of them cleanse” trait either.
Third, Armor of Earth also provides protection and Cleansing Fire also provides AOE burning. Neither is “just a stunbreak + stability” nor “just a condition cleanse”. They have their secondary effects.
True, we call it “Null Field”. And that’s my point, those Cantrips, just like our Glamours, are overloaded with “helpful on paper” secondary effects that drag down their effectiveness, while Mantras have one purpose and one purpose only. If we can somehow get secondary effects without compensating nerfs, again, go ahead.
Fourth, yes, two Mesmer Mantras provide their effects in a small (240) radius around them. Elementalist can provide the cleanse with just weapon skills in a much larger area and with some healing to boot … not to mention their other benefits such as all their other combos for Might stacking, providing Fury to the group, etc.. Does Mesmer have to always have someone else better than them at something? Are they not allowed to be that class people first think of when they think “our group needs some more condi removal support” or “our group needs some more stability”.
That’s overall class balance which you can’t compare easily. Plus I don’t see anyone asking for ele/thief when they need reflects (yet! XD )
Fifth, I never said anything about what that recharge time would be per charge. If you feel that it would need to be longer than the current cooldowns for Mantras, then let’s discuss that. I don’t believe I’ve seen anyone take issue with that idea.
I wouldn’t mind actual buffs (who does?), but I don’t want to take another stupid PvE nerf for the sake of sPvP balance, which I fear auto-regen would incur in the form of weaker actives or increased cooldown.
Sixth, you’d obviously have to add some 0.5+ second between the cast and when it hits. I don’t think this is asking for too much. Sure, it’s a nerf to Mesmer, but it’d be a nerf to all the other classes that currently benefit from abilities that instantly hit their opponent for several thousand damage immediately at the press of a button with no telegraph. This is the most minor of points brought up though … the main points are on Mantra charges.
MoP needs to be instant in order to be viable, MoD not as much but casting it while cc’d is the only real reason to use it in PvE. If lockdown builds become overpowered enough nerfing that and only that would be okay.
Lastly, you’re coming off a bit aggressive. Please calm it.
Sorry, just a little fed up that most discussions only consider “how great something would be for tournament play” or “not enough deeeeps!” for speedclearing dungeons 1.5s quicker. I don’t mind having PvP-only specs, but I DO mind having perfectly valid PvE options ruined because of them. Nothing personal.
While I am a big advocate for counterplay, I do have to point out that Elementalist Cantrips do the same (some could argue “more”) than similar mantras … and don’t have any counterplay to them either … at least not in the form of being interrupted.
Condition cleanses and stunbreaks have counterplay in that your opponent is trying to get you to get them on cooldown so they can then get you with more conditions/stuns while they are on cooldown.
Our only Mantras that don’t have much counterplay aside from the charge are Distraction and Pain … give an animation and there’s your counterplay as people can react to what they see … though that better only happen if they do the same for other instant, non-telegraphed abilities in the game that can do thousands of damage … like our “hard-counter” also has access to.
And how many people use cantrips in PvE? Cleansing Fire is 3 conditions every 40s, Mantra is 4 conditions every ~25s. Earth Armor is 6s stab and 1 stunbreak (+ protection) every 75s, Mantra is 4s stab and 2 stunbreaks every ~30s, Lightning Flash is Blink trading stunbreak and 10s cd for damage. Mist Form can’t really be compared especially since eles are squishier overall.
Mantra cleanse is over 2x as effective even without the AoE, that’s what makes it worth considering for PvE.
And how, exactly, do you add animations/“reactive” counterplay to an instant-cast ability, if I may ask? No delays, that would again break it for PvE (cleanse out of Fear, MoP tagging, stunbreaks are instant-cast anyway…)
The only pvp counterplay right now is to interrupt the charge of a mantra. There wouldn’t be any buff to them once they’re charged. So I don’t really see any “op” tag here. There are plenty of skills you can only dodge by pure prediction, you’ll never dodge some skills 0.25 windup time just by the animation. Also we already have tons of easy dodgable and predictable skills like shatter and summoned phants. I’d really enjoy this buff without screaming “op”, even when I was another class facing a mes. After all would a mantra mesmer lack of either blink or invis (or both).
In PvP interrupting the chant is the counterplay, because you get limited charges on a limited utility effect, and after that you’re open to interrupts or have to disengage and recharge, also giving your opponent ample breathing time.
Unlike other crazy burst stuff like Shatters however, Mantras are actually good in PvE because you can either recharge after encounters, or when things go south still recharge midfight without any loss other than personal dps, which is only half our total dps anyway. Cycling MoP actually gives very good sustain, though healing more than 1 ally is unrealistic with such a bad PUG.
The loss of the “risk” factor offsets the lack of power/utility in the active effect for PvE, and this dynamic would be lost if the “risk” (charging) is taken out entirely. If Mantras are found to be balanced without the chant then sure, change them. But I’m not willing to sacrifice another set of good PvE options for the sake of sPvP “balance”. And let’s face it, without the charge time as a PvP-centric balancing wheel the actives would be the part to eat the nerf hammer.
I don’t see the problem there? I already like the current mantras and these mantra changes I just mentioned are the same but just with an autorecharge. It’s even better.
For the huge condi cleanse I’d suggest to buff the nullfield to tick twice as fast and add an immune to boons / conditions while standing inside it.
The problem with your setup is that Anet’s stance on PvP/PvE splits will ruin it, since there’s no counterplay. Instant-cast heal or AoE stability/cleanse with no setup or drawback? It’d get nerfed into the ground. Karma worked (somewhat) because her “Mantra” only buffed her other spells, which could still be dodged/interrupted/leashed.
The big appeal I see in PvE Mantras is that they just work. They’re quick, they’re efficient, and most of the time you have to actually try in order to get interrupted during the chant.
Signets and Manipulations are too niche in their effects, and Glamours are bloated with secondary “potential uses” which drag down the viability of their main effect. Null Field, I’m sure, is balanced around stripping boons and conditions on every tick in the midst of a full zerg, while several other people blast and pewpew through it in a mythical world where Confusion and Chaos Armor don’t suck.
My bottom line is “don’t change a working system”, Mantras are fine already (for PvE) and Anet should first focus on skills that are truly underpowered, unhelpful or broken, like PvE in-combat stealth, Signets, Manipulations other than Blink, supportive phantasms, PvE Shatters, THAT STUPID CURTAIN “fix”, 1v1 vs ZvZ balance, iMage, half our traits, Elites worth using when alone…
Once all that is done then yeah, why not make Mantras more “unique” and interesting. Should only take a decade or so :P
You can swap 1-2 times charged mantras with any skill and swap them back, so you have no CD. Well there is a CD, but it starts when you first charge the mantra.
For example a mantra with a 30 sec CD will go on full CD once you have cast the last mantra. If you charge it, a hidden 30 sec CD starts to count. If this one is gone, you can swap, otherwise you’ll have like 10 sec CD left or something.
Yeah, now you go do that in an area full of Hyenas/Canyon Spiders when you just want a quick condi cleanse. Mesmer and Engineer need some serious “quality of life” changes regarding the amount of button presses. Swapping out reflect utilities and respeccing on the fly without templates is bad enough.
MAIN mesmer? Most of the whiners probably didn’t even look up the tooltip for Feedback, while continuing to stand in it and spam projectile attacks…
The only thing mantras need right now is regenerating charges, either very slowly or when leaving combat (timed so that 0→full hp takes just as long as reaching 3 charges?)
The effects themselves are good as-is, but having to waste 1-2 charges after finishing a fight just so you can be ready for the next is annoying.
Doesn’t IR already proc around the illusions shattered by Distortion, only they don’t bother walking to their targets?
And by that stretch of logic you could demand to make Diversion-procced Halting Strike apply confusion, and Illusionary Persona would be completely broken because anything you do while shattering ought to be affected. No, shatters should proc AoE confusion around the destroyed illusions, and nothing more.
Also note that with the (semi-)recent “leveling experience” changes Mesmer is utter garbage until you get most of your traits unlocked. For PvE it doesn’t matter that much, but Sword and Illusion cooldown reductions really help out a lot. WvW/PvP you’re probably boned until you get at least Deceptive Evasion and/or Prismatic Understanding, depending on playstyle.
At lvl80 Mesmer has a lot of team utility though, so it’s worth the effort if you’re willing to learn the class fully. Unlock and learn key utilities early: Feedback, Focus trait, Mantras (Pain: good for tagging in zergs!), Blink+Decoy (universal panic buttons)
Almost anything in open world PvE can be beaten by running in circles outside their melee range and spamming Phantasms (Staff clones if condi). That and liberal use of reflects against anything with projectiles. Also use GS1 (or even Scepter auto) to pull single mobs from loose groups, finishing them off one by one. If you get overwhelmed your best bet is Phase Retreat→Blink→Stealth→run like hell.
3. All illusions only attack a single target. They vanish after your target is dead. You cannot cast any illusions without an enemy target. This is pretty frustrating especially in fast paced PVE where you kill lots of enemies and targets change constantly. Half the classes abilities are almost unusable in these scenarios.
For solo gameplay you shouldn’t be able to kill targets that quickly on a pre-80 mesmer :P
For group play/zerg events “viability” doesn’t really matter, and like all classes you just spam the skills that secure the largest number of tags. Which for Mesmer means Greatsword with a Sigil of Fire, and Mantra of Pain (for many Centaur/Orr events you can charge it inbetween enemy waves); use auto-target or drop a Chaos Storm if mobs die before you can manually target them for GS1/MoP
5. No passive speed boosts. Most classes have passive speed boosts. Mesmer is a light armored class and has to stay away from melee combat so it adds even more incentive to have a passive speed boost but there is none. Why is that?
Speed Runes or Centaur+Mantra/Transformation Tonic for speed. Centaur 6-piece speedboost works with any skill linked to the #6 hotkey.
You are wrong about staying away from melee combat though, mesmer can troll PvE really well in melee: Blurred Frenzy is a 2.5s evade (much longer than dodge roll, and longer than quite a few enemy channels, on a traited 9.5s cooldown!), and iLeap+Swap usually roots enemies long enough for you to reposition yourself without blowing a teleport cooldown or dodge roll.
6. Some skills feel pretty weak. I understand the Blink skill was pretty neat before but now its just a small step forward with a massive cooldown. Mirror Images?
Most of those are balanced around PvP, like any condition damage ever. Don’t use anything Confusion-related in PvE.
The skills you should look into are Glamours and Mantras. Glamours provide heavy-duty, sometimes even unique team support, as does Signet of Inspiration (only really works with coordinated allies though).
Mantras aren’t something to build around, they’re more like “apps”: Getting tossed around? there’s a Mantra for that. Getting overloaded with conditions? There’s a Mantra for that. Need something to stop pummeling you RIGHT NOW!? There’s a Mantra for that. Mantra of Pain can essentially be renamed to “Mantra of Tagging”. Also, Restorative Mantras.
How am I exactly supposed to play this class? I haven’t enjoyed it much thus far. Any help appreciated.
One thing you should accept in general (and which in my eyes makes Mesmer the best “pet” class for GW2’s spammy combat action) is that illusions are expendable! Their cooldown starts upon summon, not upon death. Their AI is simplistic to nonexistant. Shatters destroy them to grant you, their creator, a tactical advantage: Mind Wrack ends open world mobs that precious second earlier, Diversion is another instant-cast interrupt if you have a clone in melee range, Distortion lets you cheese out some nasty dungeon mechanics (Cry of Frustration is useless in PvE though)
While you will want to maintain Phantasms for sustained dps, you shouldn’t feel bad when they’re destroyed. To quote the Necro: “Kill my minions? I’ll simply make more.” Except we do it much faster than them.
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Pistol+Shield is a viable alternative to Rifle the instant you gain access to a fire field. And before that time “viable” doesn’t really mean anything and you should be fine pressing 1+6 on any loadout.
For both weapon sets you don’t want to stay in for long unless the specific encounter demands it (tagging at range, need to push away mobs, afk’ing Golem MKII)
Rifle you mainly use #3+#5 on cooldown for extra (AoE!) damage, immobilise/knockback as needed.
Pistol+Shield you use #4 whenever your fire field is up (or save it to reflect projectile bursts), #3 the instant mobs start attacking you or to block heavy spike attacks, and #5 to interrupt. Maybe #2 if you’re running bombs and only need to get a set number of hits in (Grawl Fractal etc.)
No one should insult/kick you unless you join explicit speedrun groups, and even then P+S should be okay unless you use #4 to kick mobs away from the heavy damage pile. Keep a rifle on hand for cheesing jumping puzzles though (#5 can cross chasms, unlike teleports)
Power, and spam Flame Blast (#2). Actually you want to run Power on pretty much everything in PvE, even Elixir Gun does more damage between Elixir F and Acid Bomb.
You could try and force condi FT, but it’ll only work on lvl80 with buff food. You don’t have easy burn uptime outside of Napalm, and no other conditions besides Sharpshooter bleeds, which don’t work well with the abysmal pre-80 crit chance.
Pistol+Shield works reasonably well with FT/Bombs, but you want to blast fire fields, blind enemies and get back to your kit, not camp that weapon set.
Technically the change isn’t that massive as far as I can see. In testing with Staff clones I sometimes got two full ticks out of a 1.25s duration burn.
The simplest explanation I could come up with is that each target has a “pulse timer” and any condition active during the pulse deals damage. Since application is essentially random this would average out over longer timescales, yielding overall damage equivalent to the fractional duration added.
It is a boost to short-term reliability though, especially for anything with a longer application cooldown than staff auto.
Sadly the prayers are pretty bad even with the toolbelts. Dwayna technically gives the largest burst heal when immobilised but not taking lethal damage, and Kormir can be stacked with EG/Elixir C, but Lyssa is just garbage considering the condition diversity already available to engineers.
“most worthless racial based build” has to go to Norn though, max 2 non-Elite skills and both are outclassed by chugging Elixir B and lobbing a grenade or two. And you’re a giant bullseye in PvP…
Aftercasts are a general “feature” not limited to annoying mesmers. We’re more spoiled with instant-casts than most other classes though, so it’s easier to notice the difference.
Greatsword is better for procs regardless of the exact attack rate, simply because it’s easier to judge where the proc will land and pretty much nothing can stop you from hitting your intended target short of active defenses on them (and even then GS is 100% reflect-proof, so still better)
In an ideal afk-autoattack situation you can pretty much maintain perma-Fury on yourself though, which already is a massive boost to most sigil procs, and you also get some might stacks to boost those bleeds+burns. Plus the spammy application of those conditions makes them more robust against cleanses (in the rare case that a PvE mob has cleanse at all…)
Currently only relevant for soloing cleaving champions though, many other champs will never kill your 3 iSwordsmen/Zerkers and players aren’t dumb enough to sit there eating autoattacks while you dance within 400 range of them. Well, if they are you probably still would’ve won using Torch phantasms.
If conditions from different players didn’t interfere at all I’d be mashing Phase Retreat 24-7, because it’s simply more fun than Phantasms or the “Noobstick”. The raw condition pressure from 3 Staff clones actually produces competitive damage numbers against single targets until you’re with a proper organised group and all those +%dmg modifiers start stacking up.
Do you want the aftercast timing or just the general attack rate? The actual aftercast you can probably only get by recording and then going through the animation frame-by-frame.
For the attack rate there’s a much simpler option not involving any 3rd-party software: grab any watch that shows seconds (stopwatch is even better) and simply measure the total time it takes to complete, say, 100 attacks. Then just divide by 100 to get the duration of a single attack cycle. The start/stop inaccuracy gets downweighted by the number of consecutive attacks you total up, so as long as you don’t miscount you can reduce the error indefinitely.
Staff can’t cleave (though having 3 targets lined up and actually aiming at the one furthest away is rare), the projectiles are painfully slow and to get the double-tap you’re almost close enough to use MH sword anyway.
Additionally iZerker is AoE and much harder to miss against PvE mobs compared to iWarlock, Chaos Armor is complete trash and most of what Chaos Storm does doesn’t help all that much in PvE either.
Traiting Staff also requires investment in the Condition Damage/Shatter line (and defensive condi for the CDR), GS doesn’t take 4 trait points in a non-Power line to gain half its damage.
For PvP Staff’s defensive utility actually matters, so it’s a viable pick regardless of damage potential. And Phase Retreat spams clones for shatter builds either way.
Generally, focus on aesthetics the most, since that’s the focus of the GW2 endgame. You can drag a new character through the tutorial and use the wardrobe to preview future clothing options without actually leveling that toon. Then, especially for sPvP, there’s the “Asura meta” (smallest possible Asuran character to obscure your skill animations). Though the “standard model” option prevents this in principle, not everyone uses it so you can gain an edge against some opponents.
Racial skills can be relevant for WvW, but only for specific niche picks:
The Sylvari invul is great to have as a defensive option, especially if you can’t use Crate to reliably interrupt crucial damage skills.
Norn Snow Leopard is good for stealth and extra mobility, at the cost of being trash in a straight-up fight.
Grasping Vines/Vine Shield might help if you absolutely need another immob/block.
All the Asuran utilities are a goldmine for trolling/torturing enemies in WvW. 1200 range interrupt (Perplexity Runes ftw!), AoE confusion, more confusion, and that radiation field is nasty if you can actually get someone to stand in it (now, which class has tons of CC flying around? oh, right.)
Realistically though, you’ll rarely use any of those unless you absolutely love Perplexity-trolling. Chances are, looking swag in T3 cultural armor or PvP-only reward skins will be more important.
Swordsman hast the highest dps. Duelist is second and can survive a few encounters better if placed well, but uses projectiles (bodyblock, reflect, miss etc.). Also don’t use Duelists if you’re running zerker and have a condi teammate, as they put out a huge amount of low damage bleeds.
Zerker is good for aoe, just don’t keep the GS out if in a speedrun group. Warden doesn’t benefit from Phantasmal Haste if you’re running it, still an obvious winner if facing reflectable projectiles.
For pure single target damage the best setup probably is Sw/Sw+P, Duelist→Swordsman→Signet of Aether→Swordsman, or swap the 2 phantasms if you know it’s a “Duelist-only” encounter. Replace Duelists with Swordsmen if the enemy proves itself incapable of killing the latter.
It depends on what you want to do.
For max-everything dungeon speedruns Scholar will still deliver the highest total damage output, especially since you can hit the crit chance cap (depending on your traits, food, perception stacking etc.) without any bonus from runes.
The point of Ranger runes is to maximise reflect damage since your power doesn’t affect it at all. The damage bonus can also be maintained permanently in a PUG, so these will probably be better if you don’t have a coordinated speedrun group.
Pack runes are certainly best if you still have some exploration to do, or run around a lot for other reasons. With no ferocity or +%dmg these won’t be that good for speedruns though. One other thing to consider is structures: if you still have a lot of renown hearts to do, fight tequatl/wurm with that armor set or run other content with many crit-immune enemies the crit stats go to waste.
Overall Pack is an all-rounder/“lazy” choice: of some use in most situations, but rarely, if ever, the best. (for raw damage against crit-immune targets Strength is better)
With the new mobs, has anyone else noticed how Vile Thrashers seem to use one move only? Plus it’s rather harmful in narrow spaces, and channeled, thus easy to interrupt…
So, obviously, Power Block should keep the slime frisbee at bay for quite a while, right? well guess what? Apparenty the spin counts as an autoattack, and is immune to the increased interrupt cooldown!
So, why are we getting special effects if anything worth using them on is immune?
Hey, I never said there were more good options…
If there are multiple boonspammers the only viable options are mesmers and necros, and the only one that works against retal with no personal risk is mesmer with sword clones+nullfield+disenchanter. Maybe MM necro against low numbers.
Of course you don’t need to keep enemies free of boons, retal can be countered with healing (for example a dps engineer can just unload his blast finishers on the turret water field instead of stacking might); such plans are prone to getting you killed from other stuff though.
Boon Stripping … available to Mesmer and Necromancer as well in a more limited fashion to Engineer and Thief.
Correct?
Technically also Guardians (Radiance V), and the Sigil of Nullification which anyone can <there is a space here, what is this filter doing???> use and has already been mentioned.
Still, similar to previous boonspamming mobs anything short of standing in a well/nullfield or spamming sword clones isn’t really worth slotting.
Oh, and retal isn’t “anti-zerker” either, as the zerker takes less hits to kill the mobs. It’s anti-aoe/multi-hit (read: ele, engi), regardless of stats but weaker against healing sustain.
Actually, this is one problem which these mobs don’t adress at all, despite sitting at the heart of the dungeon zerk meta: killing mobs before cooldowns or mechanics come into play. If you can wipe the entire group within the duration of a single well/nullfield these mobs are just as weak as the previous ones.
I like the new Mordrem mobs, they’re more fun to fight than most other types. I think the Husks could be buffed to be more dangerous…
How about this:
Basic Punch, Ground Slam (knockback/knockdown/immobilise) attacks
If you stay at range, starts throwing goop: Heavy AoE attack that inflicts several stacks of torment, maybe cripple/weakness. Projectile can be reflected, but doesn’t cause the full impact effect (only basic damage)
Normally has an unstrippable 75-90% direct damage reduction. Uses a charge attack similar to Risen Abominations (should 1-2shot a zerk ele), during which the damage reduction is disabled. The Husk must recast the damage reduction manually after charging (but that should have a very low cast time and very subtle animation, i.e. not easy to interrupt)
Vulnerable to all CC, but every time it’s successfully CC’d, gain 5s stability on a 5-10s ICD (maybe +5s if successfully interrupted)
Do you see any glaring problems with such a setup, besides being more complex than most existing enemy designs?
Mordrem Vile Trashers: Same as has been told, would be wise to have CC available too. Would suggest to have condition removal and support player to ensure you don’t die on the enormous amount of DoT…
Just stay at range and out of the goop. CC doesn’t help much because they just start spinning again within seconds (unless you can chain CC)
Mordrem Leeching Trashers: Stun them when they root into the ground, to stop their AoE attack. In general, CC is very useful against these, since it can also prevent them from healing nearby mobs.
The large AoE field isn’t stopped once they cast it, you have to interrupt them before the annoying red cloud spawns. I think the same goes for the vine spikes. CC isn’t more useful than against any other mob that actually does something.
No, these mobs are all anti-zerker. The variety ANet was afraid of adding into the game.
Not exactly. Running pure dps stats still is the best general approach, but each mob gimps a specific option that increases dps:
Hounds mess up multi-hit attacks and AoE, which is very imbalanced regarding different classes (ele has almost no non-AoE attacks, engi too but most attacks multi-hit on top of that!…) And AI builds can avoid the retal with spammable minions while others have to eat it themselves. (note warriors don’t even have non-viable minion builds)
Husks are anti-direct-damage, which is terrible for solo content, because it’s straight-up forcing you into a different stat set without really changing your tactic/playstyle. Make sure you have bleed-on-crit traits and they don’t really bother you, even in zerk gear. Good design for group content though, e.g. Triple Trouble.
Vines are supposed to be anti-burst I guess, but as I said they are animated horribly and become a random annoyance. Once there’s something to be aware of these will be good to reward situational awareness.
Vile Thrashers are anti-melee, but again I think some of their mechanics just aren’t working (I can stand there and GS1 lazer them down, doesn’t matter which way either of us are facing…)
The leeching thrashers are a major annoyance, and so far I haven’t found a better solution than staying away from them until everything else is dead. They’re pretty much carbon copies of Veteran Risen Subjugators though, with an added “don’t melee while the ground glows red”. Engineers will probably have a field day with the thrashers with their combination of long-range AoE and CC.
Overall these mobs should be fun to face with a group, but I really hate their design for solo play because each forces a specific counter on you, there’s no alternative tactic to most of their gimmicks and I doubt all classes can play around them equally well. For example guardian blinds and single-hit blocks are next to worthless because the things that actually kill you aren’t single big hits (unless you get flanked by hounds), while mesmers have AI, boonstrip, instant-cast CC, time-based damage negation, decent bleed-on-crit, a ranged weapon, decent condi clear and a clutch teleport all in a single build. And that’s without runes or sigils. (that build is GS+Sw-Focus/Pistol, 0/3/0/2/0+X with the healing mantra, daze mantra, null field and blink in case you don’t believe me)
Of course all of them (except those dumb vines) are way better than existing mobs which either do nothing or rely on even cheaper gimmicks (hello there, dredge!), now just bring their loot up to par with these brainless punching bags!
(edited by Photoloss.4817)
My main gripe is how these enemies drop no loot at all. At least keep the vendor trash and occasional T5 mats!
As for the actual combat, they’re a nice improvement but overall they feel a bit too lopsided: Most of the new mobs have one gimmick they spam over and over, and nothing else. I’d rather have mobs that use several abilities in moderation, thus allowing more strategic options (but each with reduced effectiveness)
And some of them are annoying/seem unfair for specific classes (Mesmer here):
-small vine roots have terrible animations. Maybe it’s a bug, but they often play their idle animation, while having evade frames, and end it with a massive burst attack out of the blue. Basically the wurm burrow-move, but with no animation whatsoever. Very bad if you’re (supposed to be) using active defenses.
-Inquest Assassins spam stealth. Not much of a threat, but I haven’t seen many people call this a positive aspect of PvP, so why add it here? (A tactical stealth->teleport would be okay, but these guys just stealth->attack->repeat)
-The Veteran Golem Type I gains retal with every hit from its spin attack. At least as a Mesmer there’s enough boon strip going around, but it’s still annoying when it goes after illusions. It’s very easy to beat with Greatsword 2-4-F1-111111111, but boring.
-Mordrem Threshers are very simple-mided. I still don’t know what “vulnerable from behind” is supposed to mean as they take damage just fine while facing me, and spend like 75% of their time spinning anyway (also bad for newbs, because you don’t want to be behind them while they’re spinning!)
The other Thresher type, Husks and Dust Mites all feel too simple. The Thresher forces ranged attacks as opposed to encouraging them. The Husks are big “condi here!” signs but with no depth, if you aren’t running a condi build you can only sit there and twiddle your thumbs while they slowly die. The Dust Mites would make a nice encounter mechanic, with 1-3 chasing you while you fight other enemies, but instead you face them alone or get swarmed by them, leading to chain-blinds and no real threat once you run out of melee range and attack/cleanse once.
(edited by Photoloss.4817)
Yeah, I love glitching Lupi by staying out of range so he can’t kick me. Totally haxorz to recognize that some attacks are only done at certain range.
We love ganging up in numbers of 100+ against bosses with a 50 target hardcap, the devs messed that one up too. Quite a few reactions to the Assault Knight fiasco were “wait, you didn’t see this coming???”
Some “mechanics changes” are clearly intended, but all of them? Actually, include the mechanics themselves too, CoF p1 portal, Arah p1 endboss, Fyonna (which you still haven’t addressed), CoE abom skip, CM everything with reflects, dozens of shortcuts through the dredge fractal (of which most have been patched, thus unwanted)… Let’s face it, the speedrunners know the dungeons far better than the devs themselves.
This is fine. But when people ask for the “best” builds, GS isn’t going to come up because people actually are trying to do better. I don’t think anyone disagrees that GS is fine for casuals (as is pretty much everything except Torch).
And please, Spider Queen? You can trivially get the same effect by standing inside of her, the wall stack is just a simpler way of making sure your pug stays near her.
The OP certainly didn’t ask, he simply stated “optimal dps”. For any optimum you make a number of assumptions, in the case of these dungeon builds you’re expected to remain in melee range (and often above 90% hp) most of the time. The best players obviously can do all that, but the OP didn’t restrict the question to perfectly coordinated dungeon speedruns.
And how you glitch the spider isn’t important, fact is you can completely negate a massive area denial attack the fight is built around without much learning, personal skill or preparation. At the current state of the game it’s pretty much impossible to tell apart intended design from oversights or even outright bugs, but at least the Fyonna example was rectified in the Aetherpath, which locks the arena once you enter.
You are not bypassing mechanics by stacking.
Not sure which ones are intended mechanics and which ones are oversights, but the AC queen spider comes to mind. Or pulling Fyonna from her cocoon-filled arena into the tunnel wall. Reflects are an intended mechanic, but poorly balanced, trivialising many fights.
Then there’s the general point of boss lifetime. While within the game’s mechanics, killing a boss extremely quickly negates intended drawbacks like skill cooldowns. For the record ignoring your economy and spamming only basic army units is perfectly within the rules of Starcraft, yet the 6pool became pretty much the definition of “cheese”.
Greatsword-swap is a better aoe burst opening than not using it at all, and having a ranged option is invaluable if you don’t, or truly can’t play “with the best” (aka able to melee-solo any boss after your noob PUG wipes). Lag issues, bad reaction times etc all prevent you from staying alive in melee, and in those cases it’s better to stand at range with a mathematically inferior weapon than getting 2 allies killed trying to res you.
Basically, within the speedrun/solo-clear community there is little to no use for the GS, but most players aren’t part of said community and many don’t even want to be.
The easy answer is that the charr tech is based on real life natural laws and asura tech is based on something we would experience as magic.
(and others):
The problem with that is, some Charr tech defies real life laws just as much. Mortars that launch 6x their total volume in explosive shells every few seconds, vehicles that should collapse under their own weight, muzzle-loaded flintlocks reaching a higher fire rate than WWI machine gun prototypes…
Meanwhile, Asuran tech could mostly be exlained with real-life electromagnetism, though I agree their terminology probably was inserted as thematically consistent technobabble. Still, a high-efficiency generator/battery, room temperature superconductors and a few ambient fields and you’re set. It’s supposed to be of alien origin, but it kinda falls short.
Especially compared to the “traditional” magic in the game: elementalists, necromancers and mesmers don’t lend themselves to easy analogies in real life. Asura gates and Waypoint tech also counts, especially since electromagnetic “teleporters” would be of the rather unpleasant “kill and revive at the other end” variety. I don’t know of any “hard studies” on human gods, and Oola specifically states that necromancy and golemancy are different concepts, by trying to combine them.
Why are you setting up “magic” and “technology” as polar opposites?
“Science” is observing nature and deducing laws and models that describe it. We have Newton’s laws, but a single glance at Morgan’s Spiral would make anyone rethink them, or postulate a force that counteracts gravity (e.g. a “levitation field” or whatever). Real-life scientists would actually do that, if they found a stable formation of floating rocks out in the open.
“Technology”, for our purposes, is using these laws to run the universe for personal gain. If a world has natural “magic” (loosely defined as anything that doesn’t match up with real-life science); then that magic is a valid component of “technology”.
If levitation enchantments worked in real life we’d long have replaced most if not all wheeled constructs. In fact levitation is entirely possible IRL, but the energy costs are prohibitive hence we’re stuck with bicycles instead of flying broomsticks/hovercars.
Asuran technology isn’t “way above and beyond” Charr tech, they simply focus on entirely different aspects of nature. With all the references to “aether”, “flux”, “oscillation/frequency” as well as circuits, lasers and electric arcs most of it actually seems to be based on electromagnetism, only with a much higher production and storage capacity.
Imagine if we had access to a naturally occurring crystal, where 1kg would yield enough electric energy to power a microwave oven for hours. Suddenly inventing computers before combustion engines doesn’t sound that far-fetched, right?
On the original topic, I would like some more tech options too. Actually “golemancer” seems to be a valid, combat-capable profession in-universe (based on certain Inquest and the CoE runes). I’d also like to see more Sylvari “tech”. While most people think it’s only good for primitive imitations, remember that seed turrets and (improved magic-imbued) bramble walls are in use throughout Orr, so some of it actually is “viable”.
Don’t form zergs over 50 people. I’ve never seen any hard confirmation, but during the Assault Knight debacle that theory seemed to hold pretty well. Basically it seems the internal loot register for individual mobs caps out at around 50-100 people at any given time, but somehow reallocates credit to new arrivals even if they dealt much less damage.
This doesn’t apply to events, Tequatl does give loot for most participants. However there are a few problems here too: You must get credit on an individual mob of some sort to get credit for the event, and if a mob’s death finishes the event that mob doesn’t contribute properly (test this with the guards during the Frozen Maw event, only tagging the Veteran will rarely, if ever, get you credit)
Not sure about mobs being despawned by the event (especially those alive at completion, like Tequatl battery defense), so the best approach probably is to find a medium-sized blob that is guaranteed to kill its enemies, but doesn’t go over the 50+ tag limit. If there’s any kind of large, hp-loaded structure go for that instantly, I have yet to fail tagging the “Destroy the Dragon Totem” event (gold credit on a zerk mesmer only spamming sword autoattack) but struggle to even get bronze on the guards. (Frozen Maw chain in case you don’t know)
As I said, all you have to do is swap to a power weapon. No need to change spec or gear.
Switching to a completely unsupported weapon is “changing spec”. To a bad one, but still. And this thread is not about how to l2p and beat the knights, it’s about the fact that the steps we do know already are restrictive, discriminating, uninspired, boring and go against anet’s stated goal of reducing the zerker meta.
So I just tried that “Kill 3 Legendary Clockworks” quest. It is nothing but a DPS test. Can we please stop having quests like these?
These quests are saying:
If you are not using berserker gear, go home.
The point still stands in that zerker is vastly superior with no compensation for other playstyles. It mostly fails because people have no clue and refuse to listen, but then a “difficulty measure” would be “how many people can afk/be dead while the others play properly and still win”. Spoiler: zerker wins out by a huge margin.
@Photoloss
I think the point was that even 150 condi-players would easily kill the knights + the holograms. No problem at all.Hence the whole “omg DPS tests!” is a bit misplaced. The fights are so easy you can get by spamming AA on a condition spec by just swapping to a power weapon. And you’re fine. Your damage is even fine, compared to what the fight requires.
How would 150 condi players survive the first 25% hp? Let alone get through both reflect phases in time? Only use autoattacks that don’t apply conditions or finishers?
This condition reflect is too simple and discriminating to be called a proper combat mechanic in the current state of the game. If the fight is so easy it can still be completed with only condi specs autoattacking with power weapons that means it’s a failed attempt at a dps test.
The only true mechanic is the pull attack, which admittedly many are too dumb/lazy to dodge even once. Outside of organised 6min attempts I’m one of them because the fight is so boring I tab out every few seconds once it’s clear we’ll win. I have yet to fully die doing so, on a zerker mesmer.
Funny enough, I played those knight event with my condi-heavy nade engi and killed the bosses just fine. Perhaps, you guys haven’t read its tool tips? [Mode-change]? Hello? [Condition Crash] when power level lowers the more conditions applied to it? Dynamic Holographic Knight? Hmm…? It’s surprisingly a very balanced fight that requires both DPS and condi damage.
So why the hatred to berserkers?
Well, for all we know condi-crash doesn’t actually benefit condition specs, and 50 zerkers can easily max the debuff through crit-procs and skills that happen to apply conditions by default. The blue holo is better, but generally can be zerged down.
And of course zerkers aren’t 200% useless in their “opposed” phase.
But we don’t know X and Y. And the players that truly are that uninformed won’t rethink their ways when getting smacked with a hammer in the middle of 50+ fire effects, they’ll cry for a rez.
And that’s what I’m getting at. A gear locker and trait sets will not really change much if a large enough chunk of the population doesn’t care.
It will. Not for them, but I couldn’t care less. It’ll be a major convenience for everyone who doesn’t live under a rock. And hey, I at least would tell “new” players “change your trait setup to include the damage increases – you’ll get more loot for it”, then “and if you die a few times, just save another page where you pick the defense buffs, you can switch when needed you know”.
“make a PVT page” is a much nicer message than “OMIGAWD GO AWAY BEARBOW NOOB ZERK!11!!1”, and “you can keep the other setup, just use this one here and now” is a much better addition than “well, his tone is awful but he’s kinda right, you should have gone back to the city, retraited, and picked up any spare gear in the bank while you’re at it”
So basic m.o. is to replace Feedback with Mantra of Concentration or whichever condi clear you aren’t running already.
You make a good point up until this point. Josh makes it sound like those players won’t even go this far. He mentions this group immediately after those that don’t know about trait points.
We know that X% of players don’t know about traits. We know Y% never swap out their 7-0 skills to accommodate specific challenges.
But we don’t know X and Y. And the players that truly are that uninformed won’t rethink their ways when getting smacked with a hammer in the middle of 50+ fire effects, they’ll cry for a rez.
The argument was much stronger for the marionette fight. The knights don’t have any meaningful mechanics or counterplay you could learn, just a list of things that will have you kissing the floor for 14 minutes. Condition removal and stability (outside of TTS runs) are only minor boosts or convenience, the truly meaningful choices are the passive damage increases. It’s sad when you can sum up the preparation advice as “read all tooltips, use nothing that lists conditions, pick everything that increases damage in any way” (and the players who actually care to learn the event can take care of the “burn phase”)
I’m also pretty sure most of those uninformed/“bad” players have the chat turned off or are deliberately trolling. Like when you have 5+ people attacking a near-dead colored holo while 5 more spam the chat with “DMG STOP”, then run away and kill another while you’re busy with the spawns. These players clearly can’t or won’t communicate or improve and open world mass events should either a) allow the others to succeed without massive overcompensation or b) find a way to eliminate these players entirely. Stopping fully dead players from upscaling an event would be a good start, then we can just leave them in the dust where they at least can’t actively harm overall progress.
However, there is a problem. How many people bother to swap around utility slots? I don’t know. Anet has an idea. And it seems to bother them as Josh Foreman mentioned it in a thread about the marionette, but he didn’t list numbers. If the % is high, then it’s doubtful that gear lockers and multiple trait sets will see much use. I know I personally don’t actually swap utilities that much. At best, I only switch around 1 slot or the elite unless it’s something big. And even then, it’s more of a canned choice. I already know what to switch to where.
That’s partly because half the utilities are worthless in PvE overall. Of those that are left the vast majority is invalidated by the mechanics in any given fight: look at mesmer:
Glamour:
Feedback: no enemy projectiles
Veil: no aggro play
Portal: you just stand there and whack the knight
Null Field: conditions are reapplied too rapidly, might be worth taking anyway (but it’s also something many mesmers bring by default)
Manipulation:
Blink: good if you’re really bad at dodging or try to melee, also a common default
Arcane Thievery: no enemy boons and the knight has this as an aura pretty much
Illusion of Life: will probably kill more than it saves
Mimic: lol
Illusions:
Decoy: see veil, at least gives shatter fodder
Mirror Images: more shatter fodder
iDisenchanter: good shatter fodder, no real use, gets pulled
iDefender: too unreliable, dies instantly once people melee
Signets:
Inspiration: boon share, oh great, never do that as mes…
Domination: condi or stun, which is more worthless in this fight?
Midnight: minor boon duration and a blind, one!
Illusions: the knight melts PVT warriors who melee, let alone afk illusions
Mantras:
Pain: still not enough for people to survive melee
Distraction: living under a rock or something?
Resolve: actually decent and I take it over Nullfield
Concentration: good against pull if you’re lazy with positioning or trying to squeeze out every last bit of dps
Elites:
Timewarp: PvE standard
Mass Invis: worse than Decoy
Moa: wish that one worked…
So basic m.o. is to replace Feedback with Mantra of Concentration or whichever condi clear you aren’t running already.
Whenever the content is about tagging and getting loot, survival is way more important than damage. The PVT player might die to the second Battle Standard, but the Berserker still dies to the first one and might get downed easily by many other damage soruces like Lighting Strikes or Grenades.
Except outside of mass aetherblades you can’t actually die, and in those LS events the zerker still has a better chance of tagging a random non-elite mob. The first Battle Standard will down, not kill.
Some classes can fill their bar with damage improving utilities and other don’t. If you’ve no other meaningful utility, a power boosting signet is among the best things you can slot.
As a Guardian, with Aegis, Reflects and any other defensive utility being a complete waste, Bane Signet is actually my second utility choice for this content right after Stand Your Ground..
Valid. Meh, I don’t care much, I main mesmer. Can’t even veilbot here, at least GS auto doesn’t earn me random burns.
And when I talk about adapting, I talk about a full retrait before porting to L.A.
Retraiting “on the fly” is still useful but nowhere close to what a fully respec can achieve.
I meant this stuff shouldn’t exist until we can have a full retrait “on the fly”, or at least swap between 2-3 premade templates while out of combat.
And don’t get me wrong. I wholeheartly dislike the Knight fight.
I just think that encouraging player to adapt and experiment with their builds instead of sticking to their “chosen one” is something positive.
Then start by prodding the builds that actually work and make sense to bring in the first place? The first thing I’d throw on a boss as a sadistic/adventurous game designer would be Thorns Aura, i.e. reflecting a % of all direct damage dealt (the distinction between the 2 would be the exact percentage value…)
I wasn’t calling the Knight battle a minor nuisance :P
That was about porting to the Mist for a full retrait.
Oh, so was I. Fix retraiting first, then add encounters that warrant it. Or put the stuff in raid instances with a big sign “TTS only, bring ascended food or you’ll fail”.
About your hypotetical encounter … you would need a good amount of power damage for the Knights and a good amount of survivability for the Holo. I’m not sure if it could be matematically possible to achieve both.
Condition vulnerability still wouldn’t be a problem since you could easily reach the cap with a couple of dedicated conditon players. Those should attack while every other player dance and cheer at them (there’s a chance on inflicting weak conditions and lowering the overall damage if they attack) :P
I wasn’t talking about buffing the holos, just doomsaying for the next patch (“Scarlet’s Return – she actually found a way to become undead, woohoo!”). The last example was to imply forcing Settler/Apothecary stats which no one will have at hand.
I’m all for more challenging gameplay and shaking things up a bit, but there should be choice and diversity and not railroaded do-or-die junk like the last knight patch. Their engine supports free retraits (sPvP), dividing enemies (without the timer the UV holo would actually be the best part to encourage condition use, just up the toughness on the micros), reactive boons to replace Defiant (see Karka, they gain stability when CC’d but have Defiant and CC immunity anyway… ), Eye of Zhaitan with the buff-shield has been in since release and is a great way to kill 1-spammers, lazers down glass cannons and could easily be rehashed into a Veteran-level version to not doom anyone caught in its attacks. Some random enemies lay boon-corrupting wells or mass confusion. I love the holo fight because it encourages mobility and tactical foresight while dps is rarely an issue.
But every time we’re fed more junk bosses of the form “kill it before it kills you or the timer runs out, oh and this, this and this won’t work, but just beating it down with all direct damage buffs you’re left with will work just fine”.
The holo fight is excellent within current standards. It’s a huge, epic final boss we get to fight together that doesn’t end in “stand at its foot and whack it”, rewards awareness and coordination but doesn’t outright fail you for a small mishap, at least tried to encourage different playstyles (red is high dps, green has conditions and reflects+punishes stacking, blue is a failed pro-condi experiment), the loot is decent on top the “chance” at rare stuff, oh and the music is so catchy I can’t get it out of my head at all. Just 3-4 minor bugs/oversights and the framework of GW2 PvE to worry about, really great job overall.
To be honest, max DPS berserker is the meta for dungeons, and outside the few well known paths that a lot people run for farming, I’m not sure on if we should call it meta at all.
Many organized groups run it and there are a few speedrun PUGs here and there, but for the most part those dungeons/paths are pretty much ignored.
The meta for zergy content has been really more about PVT than anything else.
Zerker is also best for open world content (higher clear rate, higher tagging rate with random weak AoEs) and any zerg boss you can actually crit. The “can’t-crit-zerk-ban” just invalidates all dps gear so you’re left with PVT/clerics (because conditions are still worthless). And while a PVT player might survive better against Scarlet’s souped-up minions, the second Elite Aetherblade Thug Battle Standard will kill them too, as the first already gave him 25might.
I already said that I don’t expect anyone to get a set that doesn’t want for some temporary content.
I strongly believe that there’s enough potential in overlooked traits, utilities, weapons and consumables to increase the damage output by A LOT.I still think, however, that an average veteran PVT user should have enough laurels (and maybe even guild commendations) to acquire some ascended berserker trinkets that might be useful on a quite recurrent basis (I would not buy the now, so close to the ferocity changes).
Few utilities increase direct damage (you don’t really want more people running Signets purely for the passives, do you?) and few traits can be switched without actually retraiting entirely, which as I said can’t be done on the fly.
And while there is room for “improvement”, we’re back to “accepting the design versus questioning it”. Yes, necros can use an axe and switch dumbfire for Close to Death, but they’ll still be running an inferior mockup in suboptimal gear through no mistake of their own beyond playing PvE necro in the first place. Anet needs to either allow people to adapt without being penalised for personal playstyle choices, or diversify/“dumb down” the content enough so everyone can make a meaningful contribution.
I agree on the build/template system being too rigid.
I also think that the overflow issues don’t exactly help people to retrait and those staying in L.A. for different activities might feel slightly uncomfortable with a different trait setup (I do).
For people porting to L.A. just for the Knight event, however, I can’t really see a good reason to not visit the Mists and retrait before. It’s just a minor nuissance.
A minor nuisance that must be squashed, burned, torn to shreds and forgotten before it can take root. It would already be bad if the Holo fight actually required dedicated condi players, what if the next boss reflects all crits? Or has a constant 2000dps armor-piercing aura? Or is only vulnerable to conditions and has the aura?
You are correct in all matters. But the problem is it jsut seem to many people WANT to play berserkers. The only way they could solve that is remove it. OR make the game to punishing to DPS race players by adding OHK or harder mechanics than press 1.
OHKO is the norm, and the reason zerker is meta in the first place. Problem is the “tanks” also die in 1 hit, or maybe 2-3 with no ability to heal up between attacks. Better to kill everything before your dodges/blocks/blinds/invuls run out, and as a bonus the trash that couldn’t ever kill a tank dies faster too!