Guild Wars 2

If you want good burst damage, pop signet of the wild and use raven F2. It’s a nice surprise in your opponent’s face.

Problem: bad pet AI can cause your pet to miss the target because they moved :-/

Oh, I agree with you on conditions for PvE, you won’t see me run the condition build outside of PvP.

PvE, roaming open world, I don’t care what I use because it’s stupid easy.
Dungeons, I’ll be direct damage, piercing arrows and either take traps or muddy terrain and other utilities depending on the content.

Muddy Terrain, with reduced cooldown, lasts 20 seconds and has a 24 seconds cooldown. It’s excellent.

The problem with focusing on one condition and increasing its duration is when you run into classes with several forms of condition removal (elementalist, guardian, etc.). Particularly several forms of "remove condition every X seconds (guardian).

Yes, I encounter this issue as well.

It would be beneficial if we (myself included) could capture some video of it happening.

Yeah, my current (most common) setups for weapons at the moment are:

Direct damage build

• Shortbow
• Greatsword

Condition build

• Axe + Dagger
• Sword + Torch

If you’re going by how other forms of “invulnerability” work, it’s working the same.

However, since “Protect Me” can result in our pet being killed, I agree with you that it would be nice for it to handle conditions too in order to balance out this trade-off.

From an RP perspective though … your pet can’t really protect you from poison you’re already suffering from.

I agree with you on Sword for dungeons and OH Axe in general. I have played around with OH Axe here and there. With dog KD + quickness + OH Axe #5 you can inflict some good damage. It can also be used to help handle enemies with projectile weapons … but with its cooldown and being our only such skill, I’m not too happy with it.

I have not found any champions that were immune to conditions. Chill, cripple, and immobilize are conditions.

Okay, so this Saturday, April 20th?

At what time(s)?

• I’m with you 100% on the pet being what makes the class. I thoroughly enjoy it for so many reasons … except when it’s not working :-)
• Runes of Dwayne are nice … so are Runes of Melandru and Lemongrass when you’re in WvW since Ranger can be quite mobile and can be lacking in condition removal with some builds … this makes you very hard to hold down, especially if using greatsword and/or sword with reduced cooldowns.
• I agree about opening strikes since Ranger isn’t a burst class
• Skirmishing I half agree. It has its uses in several builds but I think we are only slightly differing in our opinions of how “good” it is.
• Nature’s Magic 15 is a bit lackluster because it doesn’t give your pet the same duration on the boon as you got … it gives 3s instead for most boons … which is garbage when you receive a much longer duration (like 10s).
• I agree 100% to always have a greatsword and longbow. I’m still not a big fan of the longbow, but it does have its uses. I think people should make sure they have at least 1 (exotic) of each weapon their class can use.

KensaiZen’s suggestion is a good one. Search and Rescue is nice if you know you can kite for long enough to buy your pet time to rez an ally. It sounds like you’re more than capable in this fight of doing that.

Chopps is correct about AR. 25 AR pre-30 is all you need. Fractal 30+ you need more.

Other suggestions:

• Don’t use shortbow as the quick attack speed hurts you via retaliation on the boss
• Equip sword or greatsword for more block/evasion/mobility on your alternate weaponset
  • You don’t have to continuously plink away at the boss
• Condition damage ignores protection

My take on it

Human:

• Heal: Ranger has three great heals and I don’t think this would heal your pet too … though I could be wrong (never tested it).
• Condition Removal: Ranger can be lacking in this area so this is very nice
• Random boon/condition: I could see this in a condition build, maybe … I don’t have much experience with it.
• Grenth: this is an awesome elite that is great if you want to be a melee of any type. Ranger can be effective at short, medium, and long ranges so it boils down to how you would play your Ranger
• Avatar: this isn’t as good because you lose your pet when you change to a form.
• Hounds: always a welcome addition.

Asura

• Pain Inverter: There are some videos around (I think they are Xsorus’s) of using Pain Inverter as a Ranger to great success
• Technobabble: That same ranger has been playing around with this as well since the Ranger has access to several interrupts already
• Radiation Field: Ranger has plenty of access to poison and weakness, but another AOE is always welcome in a class that sometimes doesn’t have much for AOEs (Ranger does have some pets, traps, torch, and barrage)
• Bot elites are okay, but Ranger elites are nicer in my opinion. Personal preference here.

Charr

• Landmine, meh, we have traps
• Pistol, meh.
• Battle Roar you may get some mileage out of for more Might/Fury for you and your pet.
• Warband Support: I could see this being nice between the pet and warband on an enemy … somewhat like Human’s hounds.
• Bazooka, meh
• Artillery Barrage if it had range … but it doesn’t.

Norn

• Preface: my Ranger is a Norn for aethetic reasons.
• The utilities aren’t useful to me
• The elites aren’t useful except Snow Leopard
  • About to get swamped by an enemy zerg that has Warriors/Elementalists (they can catch even the most mobile Ranger), pop Snow Leopard and use #4 (LONG dash) and #5 (stealth) and you’re fine … just has a long cooldown.

Sylvari

• Healing Seed is nothing compared to Healing Spring. Done :-)
• Grasping Vines + Entangle Elite could be very mean
• Turret, meh … you’re not an engineer … Ranger is a mobile class
• Fern mastiff … don’t know much about it … never see it
• Spirit … same as mastiff to me
• Turrets … Ranger is a mobile class and I’ve killed every Ranger that’s used this against me 1v1 … on both my Mesmer and my Ranger.

Posting here hopefully for the last time because I’m tired of PMing people …

Please, let’s stop posting in here and let this troll’s thread die

Kensai, you might want to look around the forums. My machine doesn’t allow me to do good video capture while playing (as will be seen from a few fraps I captured from the mists this weekend once I upload them).

Instead, I get the information out there for people.

Now, if you want examples of a good Ranger, take a look at the videos released by Sol. We’ve all seen them. We know what a good Ranger looks like. You are on the opposite end of the spectrum.

There are also videos out there of other Rangers and players playing as other classes in WvW as well. They do better than you. They actually make a difference in the fights. Heck, they actually get kills themselves rather than simply adding 2 to 3 shots to someone that others are already easily killing.

What’s worse is the fact that you continue to make claims, change claims, and despite presenting your own video that refutes your own claims, you continue on.

You are a troll or cognitively challenged.

Posting here hopefully for the last time because I’m tired of PMing people …

Please, let’s stop posting in here and let this troll’s thread die

Well, it’s past “this Saturday”. How about we give people little more warning. Pick another date. Impromptu “right now” doesn’t suit most people’s schedules.

Kensai, the way to do that is to show real facts, good gameplay, and promote discussion … not make wild claims, lack facts, and show horrible gameplay and claim it’s good.

So what Saturday are you all thinking?

I’d say Rabid or Apothecary.

Rabid is going to give you more condition damage and give you more direct damage and options with precision.

Apothecary is going to give you the most healing power out of any set (tied with the other 2 +healing prefixes)

If you think Apoth gives enough condition damage and you have more sources of healing than uses of precision, then I’d go with Apothecary. Otherwise, I’d go with Rabid. You can always mix the two as well to get some balance in between that is right for you.

I can pump out numbers and ideas, but in the end people have to feel it out for what is right for them. It also takes practice.

No worries. Just voicing what I’d like to see :-)

Maybe see you in WvW.

Yes, if you look at the actual graphs (important to understanding the discussion), then you’ll see the numbers I’m talking about include regeneration in them … in fact, regeneration scales the best with your +healing gear.

Thanks guys. I updated the various pet training traits’ information and added a new entry in the last set about entering combat.

Thanks, Tuluum.

Looking at the graph, I’m currently thinking about the following:

• If you take cleric’s gear you have ~1,300 Healing Power
• If you take all the sources of regen (including Dolyak and Pie), you heal ~614 health per second
• If you swap out the Dolyak for Runes of Melandru and the Pie for Lemongrass, you heal ~499 health per second (115 less health per second), but you are less “bothered” with stuns (-25%) and conditions (-65%).
• Melandru and Lemongrass is useless against pure direct damage while healing is good against both direct damage and condition damage.
• Melandru and Lemongrass is good against crowd control conditions while healing doesn’t help there.
• With ~499 hp per sec, a Ranger with 15k hp (roughly base hp) can full heal, in combat, in ~30 seconds without using their #6 heal.
• With ~614 hp per sec, a Ranger with 15k hp (roughly base hp) can full heal, in combat, in ~24.5 seconds without using their #6 heal.

Also, do please note that Cleric’s gear will do less direct damage than Soldier’s (which has more power and vitality) and Knight’s (which has precision and more toughness).

Apothecary will do direct and condition damage than Rabid (which has more precision and condition damage)

If using a melee build, neither pet is likely to take hits for you.

I do believe the bear is superior at surviving your use of “Protect Me!”.

Soldier’s vs Knight’s

• Power: +336 for Soldier’s
• Precision (crit chance): +33% for Knight’s
• Crit Damage: +5% for Knight’s (because of the Cavalier back)
• Toughness (dmg mitigation): +7.48% for Knight’s
• Vitality (hitpoints): +7,280 for Soldier’s

• Effective Power: +41.05 for Soldier’s
• Effective Health: +7,978 for Soldier’s

Since the Ranger really only benefits from crits for Sigils (our on-crit traits blow), I’m curious why so many of us (myself included) are using Knight’s instead of Soldier’s. I have a few thoughts, but still wondering.

What are you guys’ and gals’ thoughts on this?

Some of my thoughts:

In favor of Soldier’s:

• Ranger is not a burst class, at least not with the damage from the Ranger. Instead, we provide solid, continuous damage. This is reliable if you rely on just condition damage or just power. Crit damage is a bit more “spiky” and less reliable than just pure power.
• Condition damage ignores toughness 100%.
• A higher effective health allows one to ensure a fight lasts long initially and is beneficial if able to reset losing fights via mobility … greatsword ranger is quite mobile and able to do this against most classes

In favor of Knight’s:

• Ranger’s are not bursting most people down. As a fight continues, Vitality begins to matter less and less. Once it is gone, it is gone and can only be regained through healing (which neither set has).
• There are some nice on-crit sigils that drain life, chill, bleed, aoe, gain might, etc.
• If you take Runes of Melandru and eat Lemongrass food, you have -65% condition duration

Before I add this to the list, Undean, quick question. Did you make sure you were in combat each time you tested your pets’ boon application skills?

If not, please check the list as I believe we already have that “issue” listed. If I’m incorrect, please let me know.

I appreciate you taking the time to test this.

Note to everyone who is helping or wants to help with this. If you are testing something and it requires a 2nd person (i.e. how much hp spirits actually have), feel free to PM me in-game or PM me here to try to setup a time to test it.

If you removed the ranger pet, I’d quit playing Ranger … it offers nothing else I’m interested in aside from a playstyle focused on steady damage (instead of burst) and a pet.

You’re just all over the other classes’ forums today aren’t you, Mr. Thief (check his post history ladies and gents).

It does not act like piercing arrows.

If my target is at 500 range and I use Greatsword’s beam, it will hit my target and anyone directly between my target and I.

If I use piercing arrows on my shortbow, it will hit anyone between me and my target, hit my target, and then hit anyone up to 1,200 range behind my target.

Big difference there.

Another difference:

If I use my beam without a target, it won’t hit anything.

If I use my piercing arrows without a target, assuming I know how to move the camera, I can shoot piercing arrows in whatever direction I want.

I’m disagreeing mainly on the viability of the bear for taking hits for you … especially in PvP.

If your pet is in melee range, he is having to chase the target, this makes it much harder to make sure he is positioned between you and enemy projectiles.

As it is largely infeasible to use the bear to intercept projectiles, his tankiness is extremely lackluster.

That is how I think about it.

randomfightfan.4091:

I WAS interested until I saw it wasn’t solo. When you solo the dungeon leme know and I’ll watch it.

I would love to see Ranger videos soloing dungeons. Particularly hard ones. Recently even a Mesmer released one in Arah.

Greatsword is far from “crappy”.

Auto-attack: moderate damage and the auto-attack chain has you evading for over 50% of the chain. Yeah, that’s 50% evasion up-time as long as you keep landing your hits.

#2: 6 second (4.8s traited) cooldown on a good power attack that inflicts bleeding

#3: 1,100 range leap with a 12 second (9.6s traited) cooldown … traited you can leap twice for every one time an elementalist or warrior can do the same.

1. Block that allows movement and continues blocking ranged attacks or kicks for damage, knockback, and interrupt against a foe in melee range.

1. A quick daze/stun. Always nice. Also makes your pet hit 50% harder next hit.

KensaiZen.3740:

Signet of stone. 6 seconds they cant hit you or your pet (traited)

Yep … once per 2 minutes … which means a smart thief will simply back off for 6 seconds and then laugh at the Ranger who has one less utility and less toughness.

Attached are images with the information already laid out for you

• Healing Per Second from each source for various amounts of Healing Power
• Equations for each source of Healing Per Second
• Healing Per Second for Ranger with various combinations of Sources and Healing Power
• Healing Per Second for Ranger Pet with various combinations of Sources and Healing Power

NOTE: there are no values for 0, 100, and 200 for some combinations. This is because it is impossible to have Natural Healing without having at least +300 Healing Power since Natural Healing requires 30 points in Beastmastery which gives you +300 Healing Power.

Attached is also a .csv saved as a .txt so I can post it here. Simply change the name to something.csv and any spreadsheet application will know how to open it by default.

To provide a frame of reference, you can get about 1,400 Healing Power with:

• full exotic cleric/apothecary weapons and armor
• full ascended cleric/apothecary trinkets
• 30 points in Beastmastery

I find gw2buildcraft.com to be a great place to test out what stats various sets/combinations of gear will give you.

If you take all the sources, 1,400 Healing Power will net the Ranger 632 health per second and the Ranger’s pet 905 health per second.

I imagine Celestial would probably beat out any gear that gives +healing as its primary stat (Cleric’s / Apothecary) since +healing seems to scale the poorest of all the stats .

I don’t rely solely on my pet for my damage, but he’s a very good source of it.

If you’re using an axe, the weakness isn’t really needed as #3 puts the same amount (though not AOE).

Any pet can really be a condition sponge because you can swap them out when they are low. It just takes faster reflexes with a non-bear pet.

On a Saturday night would work for me. Friday would as well, but most of us are in the clusterfrak that is Friday night WvW :-)

Those groups are simply maximizing their time. A full group of warriors can do it in under 7 minutes. I, personally, like 10 minute runs because it’s still fast and I don’t go below 20 badges per completion. I can accept another 3 minutes for 15 more badges than those people … but hey, they are getting more direct cash per hour than me. To each their own.

Skills do provide fraction of a second duration … however, 4.0 seconds of burning does the same amount of damage as 4.99999 seconds of burning.

Fractions of a second are only useful for chilled, crippled, confusion, immobilized, etc.. Skills that aren’t ticking per second.

Here, I used gw2buildcraft.com

Comparison of Knight’s gear with Knight’s trinkets and with Celestial trinkets

• Power: +125 for Knight’s
• Precision (crit chance): +5.95% for Knight’s
• Crit Dmg: +29% for Celestial
• Condition Dmg: +216 for Celestial
  • bleeding: +10/sec per stack
  • burning: +52/sec
  • poison: +22/sec
• Toughness (Dmg Mitigation): +6.54% for Knight’s
• Vitality (Hitpoints): +2,160 for Celestial
• Healing Power: +216 for Celestial

• Effective Power (Power + Crit Chance + Crit Dmg): +63.39 for Knight’s
• Effective Health (Dmg Mitigation + Hitpoints): +783 for Celestial

Celestial loses out where Knight’s focuses on two traits (offense … power and precision) while winning on the area where Knight’s primary attribute is focused (defense … toughness).

Comparison of Soldier’s gear with Soldier’s trinkets and with Celestial trinkets

• Power: +288 for Soldier’s
• Precision (crit chance): +10.29% for Celestial
• Crit Dmg: +29% for Celestial
• Condition Dmg: +216 for Celestial
  • bleeding: +10/sec per stack
  • burning: +52/sec
  • poison: +22/sec
• Toughness (Dmg Mitigation): +3.28% for Soldier’s
• Vitality (Hitpoints): +1,250 for Soldier’s
• Healing Power: +216 for Celestial

• Effective Power (Power + Crit Chance + Crit Dmg): +147.77 for Soldier’s
• Effective Health (Dmg Mitigation + Hitpoints): +3,281 for Soldier’s

Soldier’s seems to do much better than Celestial. High Power + a mix of vitality and toughness seems too solid for extra stats to win out on.

Oh, definitely, but all the bear is good at is getting hit.

They are harder position to take hits for you because of them being melee, which makes that tankiness not so great.

That would only make too much sense, Aridia :-)

I’d be interested in any and all ranger dungeon videos you could put out there. I like seeing what other people are doing. It helps get the creative juices flowing.

Do please realize that going through a dungeon as a class doesn’t really make much of a statement unless you were obviously carrying the group. There are people who are doing dungeons in groups of 3 nowadays because dungeons are not that difficult (except high level fractals).

It does increase it. However, the icon doesn’t show fractions and you need at least +33% just to see a 1s increase.

Devourers also have more toughness than bears, so they actually do a better job of surviving except against condition damage.

@Durz’s comment:

If you need a pet that is going to intercept hits for you, the Devourer is a better choice as it will remain at range so is much easier for you to position between you and projectiles. Since the bear is a melee pet, this is more difficult and not really feasible.

There are three purposes for your pet in PvP:

• Damage
• Crowd Control
• Support (boons, heals, etc.)

There are four purposes for your pet in PvE:

• Damage
• Crowd Control
• Support (boons, heals, etc.)
• Tanking

As long as you are picking a pet that isn’t focused on tanking, you should be able to use them about the same in both PvP and PvE.

Do please note, however, that using melee pets is more difficult in dungeons than ranged pets.

Issues with pet responsiveness will only make the pets closer to reliable in both PvP and PvE.

Removing bugs will do the same.

@Funky: Excellent! I’m glad I could inspire some more metrosexuality amongst the mesmer community, lol.

Fay.2735:

Sounds biased and yea ranger pets or my bane together with rock dogs they just stick on you like glue so annoying haha

As for the f2 thing I always felt it took forever for pets to respond to it. Kind of as annoying as Illusionary Leap failling half the time for various reasons. These are bugs that really need to be addressed. Responsiveness and reliability of skills are very important.

Yeah, with them wanting this to become an esport, you’ think responsiveness and reliability would be higher priorities.

I’ve been spending more time on the Ranger lately simply because he has better mobility and I need a change of pace for a while.

A guildmate was having trouble with a Mesmer last night, so I told her “just hit the one my pet is following, he’s never fooled”. It worked like a charm :-)

I’ve updated both of the table images to include cast times, cooldowns, and traited cooldowns.

I’ve also updated it with a single instance of how to get 100% up-time.

Chokolata.1870:

Try my 0 15 10 15 30 build with dual sigils of battle and runes of altruism . Add some buffing pets and you are golden

Would you please extract from that build the parts that are:

• Applying boons (including cooldowns, duration, etc.)
• Anything that is increasing boon duration

Thanks.

Meh, I’ve never found swinging at air to be fun.

I’m not looking for entire builds, per se, but rather combinations of things that can fit into a single build that allow for 100% boon duration.

That said, I welcome any builds that cleanly lay out what they include that gives them 100% up-time on boons X, Y, and Z in their build.