Guild Wars 2

Fluffball.8307:

mistsim.2748:

sword really doesn’t belong on zerker builds. ive tested a variety of power melee builds and spamming sword autoattack is suicide due to the animations. it’s not bad when finishing off a target, and it might be interesting on a tanky cleric build with Remorseless.

Then don’t spam the autoattack. I’ve been using sword on berserker builds for 3 years. Especially in WvW where you’re often outnumbered, it’s objectively better than GS because of the movement. For 1v1 where you have more control and have to worry about less, obviously it’s going to be better than GS.

GS is still a solid choice for berserker LB builds of course, and in PvP I could see an argument for it. But this has been done to death.

I was wondering… Isn’t 80% of this topic made around PvP? While the rest is offtopic statements or possible speculations?

Anyways, just one more question:
If you are not supposed to autoattack with the sword (which is the highest DPS we can currently get), while Zerk’s job is mostly to deal damage… What are you supposed to do with that thing? Roam? GS is better for that one. Mitigate damage? GS is better for that one. Disrupt? GS wins again… So tell me, What the snap are you supposed to do with that double edged sword?

Serraphin Storm.2369:

Sebrent.3625:

The Sword is a liability because the tools you have don’t matter during the animation for the 2nd and 3rd attack in the AA chain as you can’t interrupt them. A smart opponent knows this and will try to take advantage of it by timing their burst attack to hit during that animation. Thieves are especially good at this due to how quickly some of their burst can hit thereby making the proper timing easier for them to achieve.

The sword is a great weapon, but this one flaw makes it a liability against any good opponent.

Attack animation is 1 1/2 seconds with quickness you cut it down more. How is one going to use the animation against you when they themselves are locked into the fear or kd animation. You cover your vulnerabilities by making them vulnerable.

Them thinking that you’re vulnerable is exactly why you will come out on top.

There is no such thing as the perfect attack or defense. One needs to cover their strengths and weaknesses.

Sword animation killed me in PvP countless times.

With Quickness, it’s basically a death sentence for you. Unless your target is not an Engie and is CCed at the same time.

Ghotistyx.6942:

Why not halve the prot duration and apply it it both ranger and pet? You’re already in nature magic, so the pet will get the prot twice while you get at least a smidgen

I was thinking exactly the same thing myself.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

For a glassbow, barkskin will only halve the first 3036 damage to 1518, which will be gone in the 1st hit from a thief. It won’t stop a thief 1-shotting you from initial burst.

It is a decent trait, but 90% is too high imo.

It all adds up though, -5% from OHS is nice too as we can keep Regen up more now, plus (hopefully) the protection from PW. PW is just like Nature’s Protection, with the weakness added and NP seems to be missing, perhaps that is a change.

Leaving glassbow in a pretty nice place with MM, WS and NM as its traitlines, a lot tankier than before.

I’d say the trait is now more powerful then before … Especially for the Glassbow.
What the trait does is reducing the initial burst by 50%. In theory, it doesn’t reduce 1518 …
It reduces the DAMAGE RECEIVED by 50%, when above 90%… So if you get hit by 10K damage attack – it will be reduced to 5K. Which is much more than you currently see it =)

This trait will give the Zerk build the much needed time to react to ambushes. It’s much better than you think.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Yup, weakness is essentially a 25% reduction in damage, plus it has the added bonus of reducing your foes endurance regen by 50% too.

So, a 50% uptime of 25% damage reduction is a 12.5% reduction in damage.But it works even better in reality against burst skills. Plus your pet gets 80% up time of Protection and mostly likely the reduction from the weakness too.

It’s a powerful trait, that’s for sure. It would be cool if the Ranger got something other than the weakness, but its good as is.

In reality it works just as statistically. Because as you say “it works better on burst skills” – it “doesn’t work on burst skills at all” at the same time since it’s a 50% chance.

And reducing mere autoattacks while being blown by burst skills is as unrewarding as rewarding is reducing exactly the burst ones. There’s no “works better in reality”.

Protection would do exactly that. Reduce the statistical damage (burst included) by 25%. If that part goes away, most of potential from HotS expansion concerning ranger disappears.

I disagree…

Because the cooldown has absolutely no association with Arctodus, and if you kept your idea going, you’d ended at a statement of
“For the sake of Hawks, reduce it to 6 seconds.”

So it’s like saying… Reduce the swap of ranger weapons to 6 seconds because Skirmishing traits have 6 seconds duration <and I want to have 100% uptime>
So… Why would you reduce the cooldown, again?
Isn’t it because you want ? This game should be made mostly around “balance and gameplay”, just so you know.

Few points to remember:

#Ranger is not an Archer.
#Guild Wars 2 system will always favor melee specs
#You can always play the style you want efficiently, there’s always a way and a particular build for that. Even GlassBow rangers are effective in WvW roaming groups.

Rangers currently have a meta spot in dungeons with the Sword+Axe (or Warhorn) and traits including Frost Spirit + Spotter.
What defines our role is … Hate.

You’ll be hated for playing it wrong by the people in your group, and you’ll be hated by people who’ll die pathetically in a fight against you.
Neither playing the role correct or wrong will bring you appreciation =D But you’ll get used to it. There’s already a nice family of us, the senior rangers, who do not give a kitten =)

Toxsa.2701:

When Shared Anguish is activated, your pet is not doing damage either lol… Also pet’s damage is like 15%~20% rather than 30% after so many nerfs. (Unless you choose a cat type and the target is not moving at all)

Not to mention Hard to Catch will still be vastly superior than Shared Anguish even when SA CD is 30, because it has ZERO additional effect, and it harms your class mechanic. Hard to catch does not has any drawback, and also refill endurance. The additional feature justify that SA rly need to be on much shorter CD

Not to mention this “melee feature” actually does thief more good than harm. They’re very agile and distance means almost nothing to them. It’ll make range class life that much harder, and it’ll benefit them more in conquest mode. You talk as if that if thief becomes a better range class, it’d be more useful in conquest lol…

Just counts the number of thieves in top 10 teams and the number of rangers in top 10 teams and you may see the logic.

You are missing the whole point. If you stun a Thief – his damage output drops to zero. When you as a ranger get stunned – 70% of your damage was negated. With Shared Anguish, it’s basically a swap from 70% to 30%.
Isn’t that unfair?! We want every class to have the same mechanic, so let’s make it that if you get stunned, your pet cannot be commanded by you and thus is stunned as well every time you are.

And then we can make Shared Anguish 30sec CD that will negate you and you pet on a separate CD. <clap... clap... clap...>

I’m aware that rangers are not taken much into competitive. But that might or might not say anything objective. What if I tell you that there’s a miracle build that no one has thought of, and is suitable for both teamfights and point holding, hmm?
An overpowered one that no one uses because they didn’t think of one.

Could we buff it further so the people can realize it and then nerf it even more than it was before the people knew about it?
That logic is wrong if you ask me. The Rangers taken into competitive had builds that are much weaker than the builds currently available. Because Power Ranger is weaker in all terms available.

Fluffball.8307:

Couple things to consider:

• Ascended only matter for high level fractal or WvW roaming. For most dungeons, the downscaling means there is literally no advantage at all over exotic.
• As far as we know, no new dungeons are being added in HoT.
• Ascended armor is expensive, so it’s probably worth waiting till the expansion so you have all the facts.

Assuming you do mostly solo or small group open world content in HoT and play a good amount of WvW, I’d lean towards using exotic gear with several stat combos, and make your ascended for whatever makes sense in WvW with a druid.

If you do a lot of high level fractals, you have probably won’t have much choice but to make ascended berserker.

This and this only.

Mathematically, Predator’s Onslaught is currently weak for the Grandmaster Trait.

But I do think that the damage should stay as it is. Someone mentioned increased duration on cripple and chill effects by 30% (33%). That would be a perfect solution to boost this trait to match the Grandmaster.

10% is not really that much, and is Condition restricted. It still has a potential to be up 100% time when using sword, but that’s not really the point.

Eggyokeo.9705:

the dulfy guide as a good start for any class
http://dulfy.net/2014/07/05/gw2-ranger-pve-class-guide-by-lorek-and-cell/

but i believe that leveling is the time for experimentation, what i do when i make a new class is change weapon sets about every 5 levels so i get a feel for all the different combinations and don’t get to caught up in builds until am about 70ish, just through all your points in to the first 2 trait lines.

i would actually go 3 in to natures magic before any thing else.

What for… ?
… The only boon you can get by yourself is Might from axe at early levels… And I found leveling with Axe … Slow and boring. There’s just no point in taking it early on.

The boons shared come mostly from the party that you stick with while doing PvE.

Toxsa.2701:

Terkov.4138:

But do other traits also save you from stun? You know, like necro fear enemy, but isn’t he stunned during it anyway?

Thief’s “Hard to Catch”:

30 ICD. Auto breakstun, refill endurance, ADAPT TRAIT. NO DRAWBACK (like pet getting CCed instead?)
Not to mention thief has more stun breaker than ranger. Ranger does have stability but none of them are instant and need to precast it. It greatly hinders it’s effectiveness because you have to predict a CC and waste duration by pre-casting it.

Balance?

Then why is Thief so reliant on melee damage? Not to mention he is thousand times squishier. And deals ZERO damage while stunned (ranger still deals 30%, remember?), and has to choose between evading and dealing damage (cannot do both at the same time, ranger can).

Like the guy above me stated, treating abilities throughout different classes is pointless. Every class has different value on the same mechanics. While one sees it as a life-saver, the other can find it utterly useless.

Cristoff.2481:

I can see what you are saying and on one level I agree, but the way GW2 introduced ranger and animations they use, they imply at least for some types of rangers that we channel nature. Not all times .

Other type rangers are skirmishers like you said and those are bow users, trap users, using tricks, but when you look at animation of melee weapons ans some the names, and powers like spirits, spring of renewal, even signets those imply channeling power of the nature. those at least how GW2 presents are not just things someone picked up and learned by living in nature and surviving there.

Don’t forsake yourself.
… Think of 50 shades of grey. Even such a garbage can tell that not everything is black and white and there still might be something in between. I know you can do better than this =)
Blaming the designer of your personal preferences is not something I consider cool. They did they game just fine. Some might like it, some might less.

There’s always X+1 correct possibilities.

Syfin.6875:

Thanks for the great information! I will definitely get to level8ng and testing out what you guys said. Probably go with gs/lb and if i find it bland ill try the sword dagger/ axe axe. And tragic that is exactly what i hoped someone would suggest a selfish solo build. Ill follow that build and see how i goes

Just don’t use Axe+Axe… That’s a set of condition weapon with pure Power weapon. That’s a no-no.

Sword+Dagger is perfectly fine, applies lots of poison, gives a chunk of evades.
Sword+Axe is amazing too. Deals high burst and pulls enemies to you.

You don’t want Shortbow. Boring and flank restricted.

Serraphin Storm.2369:

Zerk is fine for 1v1 the trick with zerker is not killing its staying alive strong offense and cc …

…

This and this exactly.

If one wants to play Zerker, he has to learn to rely on mechanics, not stats.
Stealth/CC/mobility…

Never the stats, since all of them are going to be blown into offense (that is going to be evaded or mitigated anyways).

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I assumed OP was talking sPvP as he mentioned servers…

@ Tragic – It is Knights ammy, not soldiers. At least knights has precision.

My bad, point taken … But the damage still cannot compare to the role you try to achieve as a Zerk. It’s still quite off the track.

I’d say that it does or doesn’t make sense.

What you say are statements based on personal preferences and personal “pictures”.
From which all are subjective (so they may or may not be objective).

While you may or may not be right, there’s several thousand people who’ll see it the opposite way / won’t bother / prefer gameplay / have a cosmetic suggestion of totally unrelated kind.

I personally think of Rangers as skirmishers that learned to survive in the wilderness and use their tricks for battle, such as taming beastly attributes and beasts themselves, just as mastering all kinds of weapons to survive in the wilderness.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Tragic Positive.9356:

…Any lesson is meaningless without pain. If you really want to get better, play the standard Zerk, and pay for your mistakes. Just like you should capitalize on mistakes of your enemy. That’s how Zerks do. Playing a soldiers version will only distance yourself of your initial goal.

I disagree, if you cannot stay alive long enough to see the mechanics, you won’t learn anything, you’ll just get frustrated. And you will be contributing a lot less to your team if you are always in the respawn Q because you keep getting one-shot by thieves. Much better off doing 30% less crit damage having 300 less power so you can stay alive and contribute something, and learn at the same time.

I suggested the KNIGHTS/Melandru version so he can see those mechanics before being nuked. Once you learn what to do and get better, you can swap to Zerk amulet, once better again, swap the runes to Pack.

Do you really think it’s educative to tell a player that has trained for several days with a tanky no-DPS build without any burst whatsoever to put on a Zerk suit?

No, I don’t believe so. It’s better to ask some PvP players to duel and train with him for a while. You need to know WHEN TO STRIKE. That’s the whole point of the GlassBow ranger and Glass classes in particular. With a tanky constant DPS build you get your mind into a “comfortable state” where you think you’ll survive the burst anyways and you don’t need to search for opening… They’ll show up after a while, right?.

It’s much better to play non-ranked games for a couple of days, knowing you’ll lose beforehand. Than reflect back what happened and what could you do better. If you can record the games, even better.

But with all due respect, taking a Power Ranger that already has the lowest DPS output into a Soldiers armor to lower it further – that’s wrong.
If the player is new to the PvP environment as such, I already proposed condition builds. GlassBow ranger is one of the hardest classes to master.

“Training wheels will let you learn the basics faster at a cost of learning to ride a bike twice.”

Syfin.6875:

Hello

I just made a ranger and ive read around about optimal builds for pve, but the only solid information I could find was centered on dungeon running. Im looking for an open world pve build setup that would satisfy leveling and then later on silverwastes. Not really concerned with group based builds as there is plenty of information out there about that. Any advice is appreciated.

I’d suggest something like this .
In the open, spirits are a bother to reactivate all the time, and you don’t feel like being useful anyways. It just doesn’t feel that way.

This is the most mobile, most reactive (you can tag more mobs on melee since GS, you also apply vulnerability and so on).
Remorseless was the best trait for leveling up for me, and I found it more useful for open world events than Predator’s Onslaught, taking into account that you’ll be using GS (without cripple).

It’s also a nice addition to make up for lack of Frost Spirit in open world (that is a must-have for dungeons).

Hmmmh… The abilities are simple.
Panic button “Signet of the stone”
Burst Button “Signet of the Wild” (also passive regen that you’ll often want)
Standard mobility “SotH”.

Heal is optional. So are the 2 points in Wilderness Survival. You can put them into Nature Magic for Vita>Power convert (like 2,5% more damage that I can’t even notice). But for example, I never got feared at Tequatl ONCE thanks to shared anguish.
The comfort it provides is well worth the non-observable damage boost.

tl;dr > this build is pretty much the most comfortable solo build to play for enjoyment. You won’t stick to LB only (it made me wanna kill myself), and you’ll feel satisfied (It’s much more satisfying to see the Boss CC negated then to deal 4050 damage instead of 4000).

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

If you like LB/GS, stick to it, you will get better. Try using this for a bit, so you survive the initial bursts, then as you get better, you can change to zerk amulet and different runes for more damage. Once you learn what you need to do to survive them, then you can worry about killing them.

Why would I make a Power Build that is made for soaking up the damage?
… I can’t seem to find the reason.

If I wanted a build that will sustain – I’d definitely go Condi. Not only I’ll live longer, I’d even deal more damage. Period.
If I wanted to burst people – I’d go full zerk and learn my mechanics, positioning and do my job which is bring people from 100 to 0 in the least time possible. You already are a bother for your team since your damage and utility is lover than the one of a Mesmer and you can’t stand on a point… Now you’d even cut the only thing you bring in half – which is Damage.

Any lesson is meaningless without pain. If you really want to get better, play the standard Zerk, and pay for your mistakes. Just like you should capitalize on mistakes of your enemy. That’s how Zerks do. Playing a soldiers version will only distance yourself of your initial goal.

Guyz…
… If you play GlassCannon, don’t be surprised if you break.

It’s like saying that you don’t understand why you lost as a samurai when your enemy is an armed soldier.

Specifically against Warriors and Thieves… Condition survival might be what you are looking for. Probably even full regen Ranger. Those are pretty powerful dueling builds.

Substance E.4852:

Tragic Positive.9356:

But there already are several totally viable builds I’ve thought of after the changes are made. One of them uses 50% projectile denial. Passively.
Front line Ranger will be useful, and I’m definitely looking forward to it.

You die in the front line from hammer, marks/wells, and meteor shower aoe. Wall of reflection is already a vastly superior projectile deterrent.

Reflecting projectiles while meleeing isn’t really going to do much at all.

Everyone dies front line from hammer, marks/wells and meteor shower aoe… That’s a strange excuse. Moreover, Wall of Reflection is superior, but not more valuable.

Strider’s defense is permanent and walks with you. And did I mention it’s permanent? So what if it’s only 50% chance, it’s permanent, Jesus…

Don’t be too skeptic about stuff. You don’t need Precision anymore. Who can boast of such a privilege except for … eles … that have everything better already?

You can sacrifice 1 whole stat for defensive ones to deal damage almost identical to Zerks. I mean, come on! With 30% passive evade, even a situational stun and huge mobility since GS.
Also the best and longest stability in the game, so far.

Ranger is a weak variation of other classes <at the moment>.

But there already are several totally viable builds I’ve thought of after the changes are made. One of them uses 50% projectile denial. Passively.
Front line Ranger will be useful, and I’m definitely looking forward to it.
Aren’t you guyz looking forward to perma protection with AoE Weakness paired with double maul 250% crits (opening strikes) or what not?

I can’t wait.

I actually think that taken the whole class into account …
… We are currently the only one that is basically immune to CC for 30 seconds whole via Elite Skill available to anyone that doesn’t need traits to be functional.

If you don’t want that elite, you should be vulnerable to CC (which is your least concern WITH the elite). That trait is much valuable than on other classes, since once your position is broken on Power Builds – you are dead on sight.

If they can’t pull you down (which is usually a CD over 25 seconds), than you achieved what you wanted.

It’s weaker than other classes’ mechanics, but I take it as a fact since we don’t really need it at all, and if we do, it can change a lot.
Especially with the new Longbow builds upcoming.

cafard.8953:

Tragic Positive.9356:

cafard.8953:

Tragic Positive.9356:

McWolfy.5924:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Ripping 16 boons off one target is pretty OP on a 25s CD mate.

There are already remove all boons skill and that convert them into condis or remove on area etc.
Btw warriors warhorne removes 40 condis, turn 10 in boons, give swiftnes on 12 sec cd and remove 5 more condi convert to boons, aoe vigor, blast finisher + aoe weakness on 16 sec
Am i missed something?

You have a point, but there’s a difference between <strip the boons and allow them to reapply> and <make the target practically immune to boons for 5 seconds>

Revenants come with a temporary “immune to conditions” mechanic. Why not have a temporary “immune to boons” one as the flip side? :p

They do not really “come with” … Warriors have had it for years.
… But defensive and offensive “immunity” is something absolutely different.

Being immune to boons means BOTH offense and defense. They will deal less damage (defense for you) as well as be vulnerable without Aegis, Protection, Regen and such (offensive for you).

That’s why the idea is wrong.

That was more for the sake of finding an excuse, i don’t particularly think it’s good, justified or balanced. :p

And i’d argue that your point applies equally to conditions. An enemy can be affected by Chill/Blind/Weakness (defense for you) as well as be made vulnerable through Cripple/Immob/Vulnerability/Poison/etc (offensive for you).

There is no way to lower condition damage you receive…
… Why there should be a way to lower the support you get?

There are ways to “reset” the status by stripping or cleanse.
But being immune to “support” is like justifying heals to be able to be dodged.
Makes sense, but not from gameplay point of view.

cafard.8953:

Tragic Positive.9356:

McWolfy.5924:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Ripping 16 boons off one target is pretty OP on a 25s CD mate.

There are already remove all boons skill and that convert them into condis or remove on area etc.
Btw warriors warhorne removes 40 condis, turn 10 in boons, give swiftnes on 12 sec cd and remove 5 more condi convert to boons, aoe vigor, blast finisher + aoe weakness on 16 sec
Am i missed something?

You have a point, but there’s a difference between <strip the boons and allow them to reapply> and <make the target practically immune to boons for 5 seconds>

Revenants come with a temporary “immune to conditions” mechanic. Why not have a temporary “immune to boons” one as the flip side? :p

They do not really “come with” … Warriors have had it for years.
… But defensive and offensive “immunity” is something absolutely different.

Being immune to boons means BOTH offense and defense. They will deal less damage (defense for you) as well as be vulnerable without Aegis, Protection, Regen and such (offensive for you).

That’s why the idea is wrong.

McWolfy.5924:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Ripping 16 boons off one target is pretty OP on a 25s CD mate.

There are already remove all boons skill and that convert them into condis or remove on area etc.
Btw warriors warhorne removes 40 condis, turn 10 in boons, give swiftnes on 12 sec cd and remove 5 more condi convert to boons, aoe vigor, blast finisher + aoe weakness on 16 sec
Am i missed something?

You have a point, but there’s a difference between <strip the boons and allow them to reapply> and <make the target practically immune to boons for 5 seconds>

Bran.7425:

Tragic Positive.9356:

The trait is plain weak for a grandmaster.
… Not bad for the early trait placement like it is currently proposed, but absurdly weak for the grandmaster. Just saying.

I would agree with you, but so long as the developers (read Peters) think that it is too strong to remain as a adept choice they will change it. It still think that Peters had not been keeping up with was being worked on where ranger was concerned and was blind-sided by the trait and had a knee-jerk reaction.

The thing is that 6 might increases your raw damage by roughly 7,5% …
… Condition damage is hard to say since it’s addition system, not a multiplication.

Grandmaster of these values is ill to think about.

Bran.7425:

I have a feeling it will not be buffed (at least at first) when it is moved to the Grandmaster tier. Peters didn’t seem to like the trait even as a grandmaster, I just hope it isn’t reduced to useless as a grand master when it launches just so they can play it safe.

The trait is plain weak for a grandmaster.
… Not bad for the early trait placement like it is currently proposed, but absurdly weak for the grandmaster. Just saying.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

The damage can stay where it is imo, even if you add quite a bit of other utility to it. It is mid range, so if it had a damage condition, it would do good damage with both power/condi builds.

Fear/Torment would be gold to see and I would use WH all the time

The thing is that almost no one who uses Warhorn does use it for damage.
Necros, Warriors…
I don’t want every single weapon we have to be damage oriented, and we already have more than enough CC. Most of the game so far with the upcoming changes.

I want a satisfiable utility. And blind is exactly what I’d like to see happen.

Wondrouswall.7169:

Problem with that is Anet plans to shift Most Dangerous Game into the GM tier with Quickdraw, so you can’t have both.

You mean … Buffing it hugely and moving to Grandmaster? I guess people like me miss a lot when they don’t watch the show regularly, don’t we?

Ehecatl.9172:

Having the birds apply blindness effect each tick would be pretty nice. Just enough so that the opponent is suffering periodic blindness ticks while the birds are on them rather than stacking it. That way the warhorn has a strong defensive skill that can be used to stop stomps or mess up an opponent’s damage rotation every 25 seconds.

Warhorn currently has close to no uses.
… I’d definitely want to see the damage be cut in half, probably even the duration (damage ticks unchanged), and see it re-applying blindness to secure stomps or deny bursts from Zerk classes. We already are a snack for them, both in terms of damage and utility.

Make a utility weapon a utility one at the very long last. It would still be fine for applying on-hit effects such as Sharpened Edges, but would have other effects finally justified (because nobody cares about damage when taking warhorn).

What do you guyz say?

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Tragic Positive.9356:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Not for my playstyle.

Well, no one is blaming you for that =)
I’m just glad that we’ll finally have some viable BM options. Definitely not the “best for everything” … But finally viable for plenty of occasions.

You beat me to it, I was actually replying to the post above yours and was too lazy to hit quote So, I agree with you.

Ah, had no idea;
Sorry, it looked like that for me

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Not for my playstyle.

Well, no one is blaming you for that =)
I’m just glad that we’ll finally have some viable BM options. Definitely not the “best for everything” … But finally viable for plenty of occasions.

Serraphin Storm.2369:

66060, 66600 would be a superior builds

I was thinking of 6-0-0-6-6.
… Heavy disruptive and tanky build. Don’t forget you can get a new AoE CC on a 15 second cooldown from BM. Don’t underestimate this one.

Also… 3-4 blast finishers … Mmmm … I doubt those builds will be superior in every single scenario.

I’m actually looking forward to new Beast Master.

There are already 2 great paths I can think of. Highly offensive build and one disruptive/supportive (bunker-like, again). I’ll probably let my today’s build die away.

The wrong thing about this issue is that people constantly think of it for the current Zerk “Meta” (that isn’t even the most powerful Ranger version, so far).
…
I remember when I was playing Regen Survival ranger. I rarely got above 60% HP. But I never got below 20%. Even in 1v2 situations. I can imagine this being very suitable for several condition / cele builds.

You can’t desire every trait to be perfect for every build selection. You won’t ever get one. The trait alone doesn’t sound very appealing, but it has several uses and synergy with other traits. It’s far too early to bury the idea. But doesn’t anyone think of cele builds with this trait going for Protective Ward? Like a point holder fighter? Dunno… Sounds fine by me. Opens high options for melee builds that MIGHT JUST HAPPEN to become meta.
(but that we don’t know yet, even though I already see the potential)

The goal of the trait is wrong. It doesn’t give you the needed advantage to ress, and it provides offensive values at a place where you need defensive ones.

Now if they added the Downed no.2 ability to the table in addition to this trap, it would be much more like worth. You’d interrupt stomps and help yourself avoid some of the CC through Rune of the Trapper.

Currently it’s just not worth.

infantrydiv.1620:

Annoyingly passive aggressive and vague, and you make almost no real points about the class.

Yep, this is how people who I don’t agree with see my realistic nature. The question is: Is there a rule that says it’s you who made real points about the class? If so, wasn’t it you who made it? You haven’t proven me wrong, either.

You fail to point out how anything I’m suggesting makes the class actually ‘easier’. And you remain in favor of silly RNG passives like Strider’s Defense.

Silly RNG passives that are unique, powerful and useful, as well as rewarding are fine by me. But you seem to be just the guy who wants every class in the game to have the same spells with different names. “There’s a guy who has this and that on 10 second cooldown, I want my stuff on 10 second cooldown, too!” is how it sounds.
And I’m against it. A class should be looked at as a whole, not from a single spell’s point of view.

About enlargement… I’ve been using it for quite a long time. And I won lots and lots of fights thanks to that, just as I was able to survive and escape lots of them at the same time. Think out of the box of PvP=Zerk and find other combinations that it can be useful at. It gives you 5 stability, almost super speed, and 25% damage increase.
Which means it’s easier for you to run away, or easier for you to turn the table in case you and your enemy are on similar health level.

And I failed to explain how it makes the class easier? You want to make it an almost free stuff. Just like lots of other things.
You haven’t seen a single teeny bit of it in practice. You didn’t even THINK of possibilities or combinations where it could end up overpowered. The only thing you did was to look at different classes, their mechanics, and wanted the same system.

You might have thought that A-net did some research on their own. If their results die in practice, it’s never too late to update the numbers afterwards.

If you ask me, I thought of a combination of the Most Dangerous game, Enlargement, Remorseless, Knight’s Armor, and Greatsword used under Rampage as one.
Edit: I’d probably pair it with Runes of the Forge. I can see it working.
I would dare you to bring me under 25%. Not only you’d still have trouble getting me down through those 6K (daze, block, 30% evade), but every maul I hit will hurt you for mountains lot.
Here, it fits just fine. Starting at 50% would be overpowered. But did you think about it? If I’m correct, you stopped at comparing Rangers to Eles who can stack might, as well as current meta.

infantrydiv.1620:

I feel like your post is from the perspective of a person who literally only zergs in WvW and nothing else.

Than it’s just justified that that’s my least played environment… Not even close.

First of all, do you realize how fast you will die in actual PvP or even PvE never dodging any attacks? You will very rarely be at 100% of Endurance unless the enemy is just ignoring you entirely. That 10% uber-powerful buff would probably be up around 10-20% of the time in real fights.

I am. How about taking some of the PvP talents for PvP, then? Did you think about it? How about some for burst, or higher stun duration instead of on-paper statistical damage increase? Clarity sounds familiar?
Also… I’ll be a kitten and state your favorite statistics and say that by evading (3/4 sec.) you are only able to lower the statistical damage taken by 7,5% (once per 10 seconds). Don’t sweat it
Did you know that in PvE, you can evade with sword/greatsword (GS provides close to 30% statistical damage mitigation)? Or probably that Longbow has close to Sword damage output if used into full potential – meaning you can use this trait for Ranged combat to stay on par permanently?
Well, I can’t blame you if you didn’t.

As for the numbers on Enlargement, 25% damage increase every 60 seconds for 8 seconds maximum. Meaning essentially 3.3% extra damage if it’s constantly proccing exactly on time. So no, what I suggested was not unreasonable at all.

Bringing PvE statistics into PvP that is again, decided by burst. I still can’t blame you for not realizing the best use for a talent and using statistics.

Strider’s Defense is an RNG defensive trait with horrible design. “Oh, I randomly destroyed the enemy’s killshot!” Yeah, sound’s skillful. “Oh, I randomly destroyed half that thief’s unload!” Again, really skillful. And no, this trait won’t make Rangers good in zergs. And you are the one telling me I want the class to be too forgiving? >.>

Now is my time to throw dirt and blame. You kept clinging to your statistical (and not practice) use for so long, and when you can passively negate 50% of enemy ranged damage AS SUCH, NOT TO YOU, you start to overlook it? … I feel strange.

infantrydiv.1620:

As for Most Dangerous Game, for a year now we’ve had two classes running around stacking 20+ might stacks on themselves for almost the entire duration of PvP games. And you will complain about 9-12 might stacks when you drop below 50% health?

Assuming we were viable even now, got lots and lots of love we needed in every direction I can think of, the bonus damage of this amount seems about right. You can realize that we are going to have 2 pets for blasts, 2 blasts on 30 second cooldown that even grants Swiftness and Fury (can be traited for Regen) – which means that we are totally able to get 20 might by ourselves anytime if you decide to play it that way. You might want to remember Axe, too.

infantrydiv.1620:

I’ve never used Runes of the Trapper. Unfortunately, the balance team doesn’t really consider WvW, since the mode is pretty broken with food buffs and whatnot. Spike Trap on revive is a horrible trait in PvP, and useless for PvE as well.

This only proves most of my thoughts. Not only you want the ranger to be as easy to be played as he is, but as easy to master as well… But you even play false accusations based on nothing but personal feelings. You just said that you didn’t even bother trying the rune. How do you know if you never tried?
I’m aware that the trait is still underpowered. But your self-centered point of view is what I have in mind, because you go by it in most of your ideas.

P.S.

Swinging at air would make this trait a bit more interesting, if not sillier. But I doubt it works this way… likely you have to be hitting something.

It does. You don’t have to hit a thing. If I remember correctly, you only have to be in combat.

Toxsa.2701:

Quick Hand + Remorseless + Great Sword Training.
100% crit chance+ 30% damage + instant 20 stacks vulnerable with double Maul.
Add that with a signet of wild and signet of hunt…

Hmmm, guess melee ranger finally can shine!

There’s a possibility to make it deny ranged projectiles on you and everyone behind you at the same slap. What’s there not to love?
(don’t forget… Lich Form Necros will hate us with every single of their cursed body cells)

I have to say that I don’t sympathize with most of the proposed changes.

Only a few of them are well thought over and justified.
I won’t go over all of them, but some to point out.

Steady Focus… You’d like such as 10% flat damage boost (that is a lot, actually on par with Predator’s Onslaught) to be penalized less.

Enlargement is a 25% damage boost. You are reading that right, 25%. That’s a table turner. Stating objections like “we want to have full reward from it all the time” is ridiculous.

About Strider’s defense… This is the very trait that is going to put us into WvW zergs. Front Line ranger will negate roughly 50% of the enemy projectiles. And you want it swapped. I’m saluting to you, Sir.

Most Dangerous game… You do realize… That you are asking for 12 might when below 50%HP? Nope, that doesn’t feel right.

About spike trap … It’s a day and night difference to ress your teammates with this one. I believe you didn’t forget about the synergy with Rune of the Trapper.

And so forth.
Some of the points you made are really good, though…
… But some like these I pinpointed out … It’s clear that you want to justify rangers too much. Not only we will have unique mechanics that will put us at a rightful place, we’ll get more team support that we needed, we got everything we asked for concerning longbow …
… And you still want it without any single risk or trade-off whatsoever?

Nope, I’m not fine with that.

Not yet… But it will be after the proposed changes.
…
At this point, it’s not really viable. It’s plain outshined by anyone else. It doesn’t have proposed burst, nor the needed utility or mechanics… The only thing it does have is dueling potential.
And for that reason, it’s not worth, not even one bit.

Turamarth.3248:

Tragic Positive.9356:

I wasn’t able to step into action the other day…
… Is there a source where can I read/watch back through all of the changes?

http://dulfy.net/2015/04/24/gw2-specializations-ama-livestream-notes/
http://www.twitch.tv/guildwars2/c/6594135

Thank you a lot, dear Sir.

I wasn’t able to step into action the other day…
… Is there a source where can I read/watch back through all of the changes?

OGDeadHead.8326:

Sube Dai.8496:

Also invigorating bond is one of the worst GM traits in the game. A 2k heal every 20 seconds is pathetic. Natures Voice by comparison offers a 3k heal every 13 seconds, and swiftness, for your entire group…

Depends!

For a healing support build, if anyone feels they want to play one, it’s decent.

Look at the healing potential of this build, if that’s your kind of playstyle (pve):

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fNAQRBHhx+1JPi0Lo9rgvKQ0iBOEKWBw7sYZva39QQUzV82D-ThxGABA8EAy9gAso6PMp8To9HoTJIA-e

I’d say that’s a whole freaking lot of HPS you can dish out! The fern hound alone will heal for at least ~4.5k every 20 seconds (counting the regen), the moa for even more but not at once since harmonic cry isn’t on demand.

If anyone wanna do the theoretical maths on that build when it comes to healing, be my guest.

Also, your pets will hit hard.

Your pets will hit hard regardless… But not really since you intend to take Wolf as a DPS pet. About the maths, I’ll jump straight to practice part.

In PvE: You either didn’t dodge and died – or the 2K heal will prolong your life by 2 seconds. Full stop. For PvE, there’s only one encounter that is done on healing basis and that’s Mai Trin at Fractals.
Also, your pets are dead 50% of the time in PvE. If we are talking about casual PvE, than by not going Zerk – you put your group in danger (your target lives longer = more damage it deals). 2K heal once per 20 seconds is a joke for that trade.

Healing is effective in PvP only, where staying alive on points = objectives. You don’t really need to kill stuff to win.

@Ehecatl

You might be correct. I didn’t really push myself into testing this further. It worked for my build, so I didn’t really bother.
I’m sorry that I forgot about devourers, but as it was already said, they are situational at best.

It’s “the best” to make your own builds. And truth be told, those builds will always be better than builds from metabattle. The reason is simple – you made the build because it entertains you – which leads you to your goal of doing your best. Also, if it’s out of the meta – people will have no idea how to play against you unless you fight them 5-6 times in a row.

But then again… Suicidal builds will be no fun for you. Because it’s no fun to lose every single match up. That’s why we are here to help you out with it =)

OGDeadHead.8326:

Ehecatl.9172:

Your pet will also be stacking conditions that will override your own much stronger conditions, so instead of doing 1,000 damage a tick with a bleed stack your enemy would go through stretches of time where they take maybe a couple hundred damage a tick instead. You’re actually lowering your damage output by setting your pet up for condition damage.

Is this really how it works?

Unfortunately…
… Even though they might have changed it. I think that I was able to keep my own Poison damage (Poison Master increased) even after my pet used his own poison attack.

So if you apply the poison before your pet does – you should be fine (pet’s poison will start ticking only after yours; concerns Marsh Drakes and Spiders only).
If we are talking about Bleeds – that doesn’t matter. They stack. And there’s only 1 Burning pet that is hardly ever picked since he misses most of the time for short range.

Ravinsild.4637:

Are both versions of my build really so bad? I was just trying to find a way to keep gap closing warriors and such off me which is why I went so heavy on the immobilizes.

I’ll be honest, they quite were.
You simply can’t go into PvP with zero condition clears and 2500 armor. Ever. Period.

As a Beast Master – your job is to sustain out while your pet does the job. If you wanted to do damage only, Beast Master’s whole point is at a wrong place (since pet is only 30% of your damage).

Your damage was more suited for … Fighting AFK players (players that do not fight back). Because it was flank restricted and focused on nothing but keeping the enemy rooted.
The build I stated offered almost permanent cripple / chill, which is good enough.

If you call a suicidal missions “weakness” … Then I’m not really sure if I should encourage you in playing whatever it is that makes you enjoy the game, or question your sense of viability.

Not only this build is suicidal against anything with conditions… It’s also going to lose to most of the Power Builds as well.

But as I said earlier – if you don’t intend to play it competitively, as long as it helps you enjoy the game, why not, right?

If you want something that is really fun, though, you might want to try this one. If you happen to set the burst sequence, you’ll tear anyone apart in a few seconds. Bunkers included. You’ll also be alive more often than with your mentioned build. Condition builds will still be your weakness (since you don’t have that much HP, and Signet of Renewal will bomb your pet if you can’t swap him right after), but will no longer be a death sentence.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fNAQRAsf3YnEqQrgWxC+rAXLI4QoadCsCg3Nxye1Of3W4ileqC-TJxHwAOLDI4JAA4kA8Z/BA