Guild Wars 2

Apathy.6430:

Wintyre Fraust.6534:

Apathy.6430:

Torcan.2314:

Wintyre Fraust.6534:

Torcan.2314:

Just wait till you get level 80.

What’s going to change when I hit 80?

Well, personally, I found out that my personal story was bugged, so I’m stuck on my last personal quest, with no way to finish it because the NPC wont interact. Not that it matters anyway, but I’m dying to see the rewards, story is irrelevant.
But not much will change, expect that you’re not gonna have stuff to do.

Spoiler alert: The rewards aren’t going to excite you

Guild Wars (2) isn’t a loot game.

Unless one finds variant cosmetic looks exciting – which I do. Heck, I’ve got a level 11 thief that looks so cool in his current gear, I might just have to transmogrify future gear back into this look. That’s another thing about this game – even the low level gear is detailed and appealing.

That’s a dress up game.

Which isn’t bad, I like playing dress up games.

Graphics are a huge part of the MMOG genre. If it didn’t matter to players what their character looked like, then we wouldn’t have had the evolution of the detailed avatar creation system. Avatar graphics are a big driving force in cash shop sales, as well.

Obviously, a huge part of MMOGs in general is what you apparently disdainfully dismiss as the “dress up game”. So if players are willing to pay cash to “dress up” their avatar, and it is obviously one of the driving mechanisms of MMOG development and revenue, your comment:

Spoiler alert: The rewards aren’t going to excite you

Guild Wars (2) isn’t a loot game.

… is only indicative of an apparent personal disdain you hve for something many MMOG players do actually find exciting: what you call “the dress up game”, which others call avatar customization and personalizaton.

I’m sorry it doesn’t excite you, but to classify GW2 as “not a loot game” because it doesn’t offer exclusively more powerful rewards for putting in endless hours of ATK repetition is just erroneous. It might not be the kind of loot game you prefer, but that doesn’t make loot “not exciting” for the rest of us.

At some point you may realize that not everyone is driven to play in MMOGs for the same reasons that motivate you, and many players actually have entirely different motivations. Your assumption that someone else will not be excited by cosmetic rewards demonstrates this basic lack of understanding.

You see, I understand that you and I enjoy different things in MMOGs, and that we are motivated by different expectations and desires. Perhaps the difference between you and I is that I did my homework on MMOGs and realized that while RIFT, TERA, TSW and SWTOR were not my cup of tea when it came to what I enjoyed and what motivated me, GW2 is. That is why I didn’t buy those games, and bought GW2, and why I am enjoying GW2 so much.

There are many recent games that either provide, or are scheduled to provide, the kind of end game rewards you prefer. Why did you buy GW2 when they explicitly pointed out that high end gear would only have cosmetic differences, when such a system clearly doesn’t excite you?

Great post, Proeliator.8740. I agree whole-heartedly. I’m so glad ANET has broken the mold and has liberated players from having to create cookie-cutter builds.

Apathy.6430:

Torcan.2314:

Wintyre Fraust.6534:

Torcan.2314:

Just wait till you get level 80.

What’s going to change when I hit 80?

Well, personally, I found out that my personal story was bugged, so I’m stuck on my last personal quest, with no way to finish it because the NPC wont interact. Not that it matters anyway, but I’m dying to see the rewards, story is irrelevant.
But not much will change, expect that you’re not gonna have stuff to do.

Spoiler alert: The rewards aren’t going to excite you

Guild Wars (2) isn’t a loot game.

Unless one finds variant cosmetic looks exciting – which I do. Heck, I’ve got a level 11 thief that looks so cool in his current gear, I might just have to transmogrify future gear back into this look. That’s another thing about this game – even the low level gear is detailed and appealing.

DusK.3849:

I want to agree with you that there’s zero frustration, but I can’t. I’d place as little frustration, but definitely there. I can’t really say it’s due to intentional game design, though; it’s just the bugs.

The bugs in many high-level areas have been frustrating me as late. I’ve hit snags on a lot of dynamic events that are frozen in time, hearts with bugged, missing components that make them impossible to do (Kennelmaster Warsnout?), and skill point challenges that, like many dynamic events, are simply locked in place and unable to be completed.

I do realize, however, that bugs are never an intentional game mechanic, are pretty much inevitable for any MMO launch, and that ArenaNet has been working around the clock to get them fixed (I’ve heard we’re supposed to see a big update on Monday). And these bugs by no means have stopped me from thoroughly enjoying every single aspect of the game that’s working as intended, and logging more hours in a single week than any other game I’ve ever played. I’ve had more fun with this buggy mess in my first two weeks than I did in years of WoW.

Well, as far as I know I haven’t run into a bug yet. Even the lack of the trading post early on wasn’t frustrating for me because there was just too much else to do

Edge.4180:

Yes, I don’t really understand the “wait until you reach 80” warning.

Especially since I probably won’t hit level 80 with any of my characters for about a year. But then, leveling has never been something I specifically pursue.

Swagman.9013:

Games great plenty of awesome details. Have you found any of the pipe organs yet? Really cool thing they added in the game.

Holy moley! MORE stuff to look for! Thanks for the tip.

But not much will change, expect that you’re not gonna have stuff to do.

I’ve got plenty to do. I love doing the same stuff over and over, even in zones I’m familiar with. How is it that I’m not going to have stuff to do when I get to level 80?

Pandemoniac.4739:

Did you know that the forum has a feature that allows you to ignore posts from particular people? I find it really ups the signal to noise. Just click on their name and you’ll see the option.

Thanks for the tip, Sir!

Untouch.2541:

Wintyre Fraust.6534:

Torcan.2314:

Just wait till you get level 80.

What’s going to change when I hit 80?

Nothing.
It’s still the same game, more bugs though.

That’s great, because I’M LOVING IT!

Torcan.2314:

Just wait till you get level 80.

What’s going to change when I hit 80?

knightblaster.8027:

Evil.7529:

What happened to playing the game just to have fun and not playing it simply to get the next best piece of gear? If you don’t have fun PvP’ing then why would you have fun PvP’ing for gear? If you don’t have fun in raids then why would you have fun if it gave you better gear? If you don’t like doing the DE then why did you level up through them at all? Basically, if you don’t like anything the game offers, then why did you play it all the way to 80? If the game was fun before 80 doing all these things then how did it suddenly become not fun once you reached an arbitrary number? .

This is the reality, I think. People are utterly and thoroughly brainwashed by the Skinner box mentality. It’s simply the case that almost all content is viewed instrumentally by these players: what do I get out of it. That determines the “fun” of the content. It’s a very sad thing, but it goes to show you just how influential the Skinner design has been in online gaming.

And how difficult it is to dispose of that mentality where it is not appropriate.

First. hats off to ANET for taking the risk in making such a different kind of game. Big kudos and appreciation to all the hard work and talent involved. Please rest assured that many of us are seeing the love and attention you so obviously put in every nook and cranny. I was wandering around some 20ish area yesterday, and came upon a couple who were lounging around in the grass watching their child laugh and play. A couple of other players stopped and watched a while too … that kind of stuff is all over the place. Cute stuff, moody stuff, gruff stuff, funny-as-heck stuff. It’s everywhere, and it’s truly appreciated.

This is the first computer game I’ve ever played, MMOG or otherwise, that is, for me, all enjoyment and zero frustration. I just realized this as I read a couple of entries here, that all of my play time has been fun and enjoyable, and not of it frustrating or boring. There’s an apparently endless amount of stuff to find (love those hidden treasure chests!), do, explore, try out and just gawk at. I’m going to have to buy another hard drive just to store all the videos and pictures I’m taking.

I went into GW2 with some preconceptions about what I would like doing, and what I would not like doing, based on relative levels of frustration trained into me by years of standard MMOG fare. There’s no sense of “wasted time” or “hurry up and wait” or “OMG I’m getting no experience for any of this”. There’s no need to min-max or be super-efficient; there’s no need to conform your character to standardized expectations and rote systems and numbers. There’s no sense that I need to maximize my sub fee dollar into character advancement (because there is no sub fee!).

The freedom is amazing. I figured out that the reason I had gotten to where I could only spend maybe 30 minutes in prior MMOGs before I had to log out is because they were SO FRUSTRATING and UNENJOYABLE in so many ways, whereas GW is, for me, pure enjoyment and fun.

Thank you so much!

Perhaps if someone put a gun to my head, I could go back to playing a standard MMOG. I stopped playing MMOGs several years ago. GW2 got me interested with Anet’s manifesto, and then videos and early reviews got me interested enough to buy they game, since there was no sub fee.

I must say, I’m utterly blown away by this game. It’s so, so much more than any other game – MMOG or not – that I’ve ever played. I’m always finding new ways to enjoy this game, I’m continuously surprised find myself so amused and entertained that hours can go by without me getting bored or antsy or frustrated.

I reached level 80, and was extremely excited to see what the endgame held.

That’s like saying “after I got to San Diego from my home in New York, I was extremely excited to see what the journey to San Diego would be like.”

Anet couldn’t have been more explicit about what the “end game” was NOT going to be in GW2, and that the whole game was the end game.

He’s reiterating the same thing that ANET has been saying all this time. They explicitly said what the “end game” was, and would not be, in GW2. Now you have people coming to the forums and complaining that they got exactly what Anet said they would be getting in GW2 as far as any “end game” is concerned.

I think that more than anything, this was a message to reiterate that this is what GW2 is about, and will be about in the future. If it’s not your cup of tea, go find something that is more to your liking.

Phoonie.9704:

Having a flat line on gear progression at 80 means there’s no further progression for your character.

There’s no sense of “getting more powerful”, which leads to a meh game, hence rapid lost in interest.

For many players, feeling superior to other players isn’t why they log into an MMOG, which is what the title of your thread suggests – that people play MMOGs to be better than average (which requires a majority of players to be “less than you” for you to be “better than average”).

I think that a whole lot of people play MMOGs for a whole lot of reasons that have nothing to do with being able to consider themselves “better”, in some way, than the next guy. That may be the reason you play, and that may be the reason a lot of people play games, but that’s certainly not the reason everyone (or probably even most people) play MMOGs

DirtyHoudini.2917:

Lol, this joke of skill, you should know how to play your class once you reach 80 and all the inner tweaks, combos and such by the time you reach 80. You don’t hit 80 and then have no idea how to play your class then tell yourself “well, I gotta work on my skillz now”.

You mean, besides the first guy to hit 80, who did it all crafting? There’s more ways to 80 in GW2 than the linear path other games force you down.

DirtyHoudini.2917:

There doesn’t have to be a grind for gear but there certainly is a wall of no progression once you hit 80 and it’s really turning people off from even logging on anymore. People like to invest their time into one character to see it get better and better and also to compete with others as well. The gear grind is just a form of competition with other players.

So you’re saying that those players bought a game that was fully explained to as not being that kind of game, and now it’s really turning them off because they got exactly what they were told they were getting?

I don’t understand it. It’s like reading a menu, ordering a dinner, getting exactly what you ordered, and then complaining because you got exactly what was on the menu.

If you don’t understand the trailer, it’s because it’s not marketed to you.

“Our time is now.” Who is that referring to? Who is rising up against what oppressor? Who is feeling fear and doubt when it comes to MMOGs?

All of us who never got to enjoy the kind of epic content shown at the end of the trailer, because in all prior MMOGs only those with a specific playstyle could enjoy that kind of content. We’ve been disappointed and frustrated by game after game that focused on that same system, and a lot of us have been out of MMOGs because of it, treated as nothing more than an underclass of scrub cash cows.

GW2 has rebelled against the end-game gear-grind uber-raid character spec pigeonholing player caste system, and made a world we can enter without fear or the paralysis of not measuring up to professional standards or being policed out of content by others who don’t like our playstyle. We don’t need your uberguild, your permission to group, your approval of our playstyle or how we play our characters.

So yeah, some of us “get” it – those of us who have been on the short end of the reward stick because of our playstyle in every MMOG from EQ to TERA.

It seems to me that many people are throwing the term “zerg” out as if what is going on is some kind of mindless bum-rush by players that have no idea what they are doing.

While I am sure that some people rush in blindly, what I see are individuals working together synergistically. Just because you can’t easily define exactly who is doing what, and who is contributing what in a pie-chart or spreadsheet-style battle formula, doesn’t mean that players are just flinging themselves into the battle without thought or consideration for strategy and tactics.

If “zerg” means “there are no specific roles and methods being used in rote fashion over and over to overcome specific challenges”, then I’m loving me some zerg. I love the challenge of getting into an event and figuring out – on the fly – how I can best contribute, and how I can make it as easy as possible to get others involved in attack combinations.

Suggestions for CASH SHOP:

I’d like to propose a whole new perspective on what can be monetized in GW2 and other games: how about emotes? What if you could buy RPing and casual sets of emotes and accessories, like a chaplain/priest set, a dancing set, a screenshot-friendly pose set (dramatic poses, sexy poses (nothing lewd), fun poses, couples poses such as holding hands, kissing, hugging, loving glances, etc.), attitude sets, etc.

When there is player housing, how about furnishing sets? You could have different styles that reflect different races and proffessions, or just fun sets.

How about cash-shop hairstyles? Tattoos? Emblem sets? Gear decoration sets?

How about cash shop variant battle animations (not applicable in PvP)? Variant spellcasting animations? Variant walking, running, and jumping animations? Variant finishing animations?

How about custom player “booth” applications for guilds, where your guild can set up “booths” at events they organize to provide mini-games for prizes the guild puts up, or just to have fun, like a dunking booth, a fortune-teller’s booth, an arcade, fishing from a barrel, coin toss, etc.

Or, there could be guild-hall “event” packages, such as a masquerade ball, or a harvest or summer faire, etc.

MUSIC! Musical instruments, musical scores, ampitheater events (theater dress & emote packages), etc.

Voice sets, including different voices and different sets of voice emotes.

Character name changes.

Yes, OMG, thank you so, so much!! LOVE IT!!