Guild Wars 2

Just as a note, my only updates to the build post-patch are taking energy/intelligence sigils on both sets, and full cleric’s amulet. Healing Breeze is a fun option, but take focus instead of shield if you want to do that so you can protect your heal. Not really recommended unless your team always rotates you out of 1v1 situations and you have a heavy melee team, Shelter is way better for surviving 1vX and handling point pressure.

It’s a great amulet, Five Gauge is running a Celestial build right now on our team and having a lot of success. Still solid damage for teamfight and very hard to beat 1v1.

They were ok the team we were playing against wasn’t condi heavy though. Haven’t played against a good patch necro yet, condi engi seems strong with balthazar esp 1v1 but I haven’t played against it enough to have a firm opinion

The game is feeling more balanced now than it ever was, but that’s only a few hours of play worth of experience. Hopefully that remains my opinion a few months from now, but at the moment the game is a blast. Thief burst is pretty bursty now with air fire sigils, we had some pretty nutty stuff going down in last night’s games. Good times.

Yes, damage is certainly higher than before due to the rune and sigil changes. Not a ton higher but enough to feel the difference. The game will be faster paced, which is great imo.

I played this in team q last night a bit with leeching and energy sigils on both sets, worked real good with an ele partner for fury on aura share. You get 53% crit chance when fury is up and are still pretty tanky. Gonna keep experimenting with it.

Agree with chaith, the suggested combos would be too strong. Cavalier could theoretically see some play in builds that use sigil of intelligence or have high base vit and good fury uptime. Knights is probably unusable but super zerker is too good, not sure what the middle ground would be there.

Honestly I don’t have as much time to keep up with this stuff as I used to. I thought no new glory would be earned after patch, not that it was disappearing completely. If I had more time to read the development posts I probably would have known, but as it stands I lost like 700k glory that I could use to get skill books for my alts to try the new traits and theory craft for my team.

Wait, so if we had extra glory leftover, we can’t spend it on getting things I didn’t know I would need, like skill books to get the new GM traits??? So I’ve spent thousands of hours pvping, and I don’t have the ability to automatically unlock the new traits………. wow, I’m actually pretty mad.

Narcarsis.5739:

cymerdown.4103:

Narcarsis.5739:

I know the build differences, I stand by what I said. It’s not necessarily a shot towards anyone but more of a compliment to Tage.

It’s shots fired when you say that Guards are pretty easy to kill 1v1 as a Thief except Tage, when that’s not really the case. I can’t imagine even a decent AH guard being killable for you in any sort of reasonable time frame, and I’ll back that up with duels anytime.

It’s more that Tage doesn’t die, at all. Everyone else does.

I don’t remember ever playing a game or a duel against you on ah guard, so how would you even know that?

Condi guard will be terrible don’t worry. The class is too far off from having a good condition build, a little more burn damage won’t make a smidgen of difference. I was assuming that condition damage would just replace power in the real formula if you have that trait, in which case it’s bad.

One that people haven’t been mentioning is Rabid Survival Ranger, might be the new back point build. Should have a lot of good match ups,

Narcarsis.5739:

I know the build differences, I stand by what I said. It’s not necessarily a shot towards anyone but more of a compliment to Tage.

It’s shots fired when you say that Guards are pretty easy to kill 1v1 as a Thief except Tage, when that’s not really the case. I can’t imagine even a decent AH guard being killable for you in any sort of reasonable time frame, and I’ll back that up with duels anytime.

Just wanted to say that I agree with the OP. Whirling Axe and Healing Seed steal abilities are without a doubt ridiculous and need a toning down. Not sure about the others, but I’d assume Caed’s suggestions are pretty close to the mark.

Regarding the shots fired towards Guardians, let’s keep in mind that Tage plays AH build with about 200 more Toughness, more Mace Healing Power (or +150 Toughness as Tage runs it), Focus, AH, and maybe even Writ of the Merciful for dueling, all of which improve the Thief 1v1 matchup (Boon Duration vs Trickery thief… yay). Even so, it’s pretty rare that a Virtues Guard with all CDs will die 1v1 to a Thief in less than 30 seconds, unless they mess up and get dazed out of using Sanct or something. Another thing is that Thief 1v1ing a Guard shouldn’t come up super often in matches if the Guard is doing proper rotations.

That being said, the daze is pretty long tho. Bringing it down to 3s would make sense.

Yeah, pack runes are an idea I had as well, and they give you some base precision much like Lyssa. Lack of stab is kinda painful at times, though. 30 in virtues isn’t bad and opens up shield as an option, definitely something worth investigating once Lyssa is nerfed.

I don’t think you can go cleric, since the way this game works, you either want to kill fast or be a condition build or you want to have a lot of condition removal. Also, let’s face it, spirit weapons are pretty squishy, no amount of support is really going to keep them alive for a significant amount of time. All you can really do is make the most out of them while they are alive by trying to get a kill before or as they expire. You also don’t want to go full glass, though, so you can survive a bit while they are on cooldown. Try soldier amulet out and go from there. There is no top level competitive sw build but there is something reasonably playable that you can make out of it, enjoy

The investigations were partly related to the upcoming patch, and partly an extension of earlier theorycrafting work. The other stats will go up come April 15th, but I believe the Crit Damage will go down (which is a good compromise for this type of build). The build will lose a little bit from the slight nerf to Lyssa, but not much.

I agree that Celestial is generally bad in its current version, but I think this is one of the only builds where that may be not the case. But again, small sample size, so I don’t have conclusive results to speak of just yet. Fun build worth trying though, IMO, especially for advanced players that know how to use it the right way. Also, keep in mind that it’s not meant to be a DPS build, it’s just a support build that happens to do some damage.

A main theme in this build is the use of as many different stats as possible, in order to gain the most out of the Celestial Amulet choice. Purging Flames, for instance, is mainly there as a source of condition removal, but we are also managing to make the best use out of the long-duration burning application from it with the Condition Damage from the Celestial Amulet. Instead of Energy Sigils, I opt for Geomancy Sigils since they work well on a crowded point and utilize both Power and Condition Damage upon weapon swap.

Lyssa runes not only up your crit chance to match your high crit damage, but also make your elite go super-sayain. Full condition removal + all boons is good? Who knew?

Bunker Guardian doesn’t really use set skill rotations, since skill use is a bit more dependant on the situation. For general recommendations, check out my bunker guide here.

For Solo Arena, this build will carry a point less than a full bunker if your team has slow rotations, but your 1v1 matchups are much better. Compared to bunker, which stalemates or loses to everything, this build can actually kill people, so that’s a pretty nice thing to have in solo queue when you can’t count on your teammates.

For Team Arena, in terms of your team composition, try to build in a class with good Fury uptime. Thief works, but it might be good to also add an aura-share Ele if it ends up being good enough after the April 15th patch. Ranger with offhand horn, or maybe even a Warrior with “For Great Justice!” are other options (lolwarshouts). Fury more powerful than normal on you because you have a slightly low crit rate but high crit damage. It’s also good when you can add in a few extra ways for your team to get stomps or resses since you only have one source of team Stability. To compensate, your team will have more damage pressure in teamfights due to your half-DPS nature, so your team should be advantaged to get the first down.

The playstyle is a little different from a traditional bunker. You are a little bit more squishy than the traditional Virtues-style bunker that I normally play (not really by much stats-wise, but more because you don’t have protection from “Hold the Line!” and fewer instant cleanses). To make up for that loss, you need to play a little bit more aggressively. You want as many enemies near you as possible when you Geomancy, and you want to land as many hits with Staff and Mace as possible. You’re still a support, but one that needs to apply good damage to deliver as much effectiveness as a full bunker. On the other hand, you’ll have to keep in mind that you’re a hybrid and be more careful not to overextend. If you play it right, though, you have a higher-risk but higher-reward hybrid bunker variant that may or may not be as good as a full bunker, but fun to try out regardless. Enjoy!

Here’s the build (sPvP):

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-7Z-Bd;0NFV10B3RG-90;9;6TJJ;446A49-58;7KJG4KJG40JX

I know what you’re thinking. Celestial Amulet??? No, I’m not insane. Ok, maybe a little. Here’s the deal though: the build actually kiiiiind of works. It’s still experimental, but I’ve played it in high ELO Team Arena to some decent success so far. If you like trying out new builds but also like to bunk, give it a shot. Let’s break it down and see what’s going on in this crazy theorycrafted experiment.

Staff and Mace/Focus are the weapons of choice for this build. You can’t really afford to run Shield here, as much as I am a fan of it. Being more squishy than a cleric’s amulet and with only one source of stability (two counting Lyssa, for now), you need the extra self-defense and stomp/res protection that Shield of Wrath affords. Also, Ray of Judgement shores up the slight weakness to conditions that you would otherwise have compared to a shout-based build. Staff and Mace are for bunkering and support, and both synergize well with Altruistic Healing and Writ of the Merciful.

As for your other skills, Shelter is the obvious choice for any sort of bunker build. We are purposely avoiding going full shouts here, so we’ll take the only mandatory shout in “Stand Your Ground!”. The other two slots go to consecrations. Purging Flames is necessary here to cover your condition removal requirements — Absolute Resolution and Lyssa won’t be enough to support yourself and your team against the vast majority of comps. Sanctuary is the only flexible slot, with the main alternatives being Hallowed Ground against CC-heavy comps, and Wall of Reflection against very heavy projectile-based comps. Renewed Focus is the most viable Guardian elite for PvP, and also happens to work well with Lyssa runes. Your elite is a little different here than in classic bunker since it will proc 5 seconds of badly-needed Stability for you, so you’ll sometimes use that proc in order to stomp or res.

The trait point allocation is the main reason for the existence of the build, and is the reasoning behind the use of Celestial Amulet. My idea is to harness the 30% Crit Damage you acquire through Valor (normally a wasted stat for bunkers) and put it to good use as a bunker through the addition of some Precision from the Celestial Amulet. While 28% Crit Chance isn’t the highest, it grows to around 38% with 25 stacks of Accuracy, and if you have a way for a teammate to give you Fury, you’ve arrived at quite a decent chance to hit for 3x normal damage. Not bad for a bunker, eh?

The goal of the rest of the build is covering up our defensive and support weaknesses gained from using a Celestial Amulet. Purity, Altruistic Healing, and Writ of the Merciful are all required to sustain yourself on point (against teams with very low condition output, Defender’s Flame may be able to replace Purity). Mace of Justice helps you “catch up” a bit with your Healing Power while also upping your base damage a bit for those big crits. It’s important to note that Vigorous Precision will proc pretty often in this build compared to a full bunker, so use those dodges! Resolute Healer is a lock in Team Arena since it can knockback while protecting you and your team during resses. Master of Consecrations improves two of your utility cooldowns, but Consecrated Ground is another option if you want that effect. Absolute Resolution is the main way you will group cleanse, so use it wisely.

Backpack 4 prez of his kindergarten class

jk

preschool

Can’t watch from my phone but I hope it’s not a video of me getting punkt on skyham but I bet it is

From a bunker guardian perspective, this will affect the build to a very minor amount. Normally bunker guardian would take a barb jewel so that they can reach a 8% crit rate instead of 4% for the purpose of proccing vigor on crit. With the vigor being nerfed, I think bunker would probably want to shift back to cleric/cleric anyway, though cleric/magi might have been a fun combo to try out. In general, I think people overestimate the effect of mixed amulet/jewel combos; in comparison to the amulet and the trait point allocation, the jewel stats are very small, bordering on insignificant. This is a fine change that will streamline the build process for newer players IMO.

Also, keep in mind that for combinations where the jewel was significant (like in valk/zerk and soldier/zerk), those sorts of anomalies will be going away in the next patch with the ferocity changes. So keep that aspect in mind.

When will then be now?

Just duel Wakkey 10x and tell me the results, if you can go points neutral or better against him (as in, start a match and fight at his point, then mark what the score is for both teams after your 10th death), then I will be convinced.

Stab trait does auto stunbreak. Taking an extra stab and losing hammer damage is a small build concession. Devoting an entire build to knockbacks is a bigger one.

If you won’t run the build against a team that has a thief, then what are we even discussing here anyways? Btw, when I said “decap” thief (note the quotation marks), I didn’t mean that the whole point of the thief is to decap, I meant that the thief is just plain superior to the engi for that team slot because he can accomplish so much more than the engi can, including getting uncontested decaps, which are far better than contested ones (much less points donated to enemy team by fighting on their point), while also getting ganks, rotating home for quick 2v1s against silly decap engis, and winning team fights. When I see a team with a decap engi, I see a team that misunderstands conquest game mode, whereas the team with a thief gets it.

I’m with you on the immunity traits, though.

It’s bad in team arena, can be effective in solo, though. For team, just run a “decap” thief instead. 4 stab war counters the build, just test it. Jin just go duel Wakkey, you won’t full cap before death and you need to full cap for it to be worth running the build otherwise you are a negative point investment.

Keep in mind, nothing is really new about this build. It’s been around and known for over a year, and no top team has ever run it. There are good reasons for that.

Absolutely agree with you on this one. I’ve always thought that kills should be worth 10, I was actually surprised when I got the game and found out that kills were only worth 5, which is a relatively insignificant amount towards winning the game. I think doubling the point value for kills would give a lot more viability to bursty team comps and hopefully push gameplay to a faster paced nature than what currently exists. More value for kills would also have the added benefit of putting more spectator focus on the fighting itself, rather than the map control which is the less exciting aspect of the game for most observers.

If you know they have a decap engi, just bring 4 stab war, gg.

Congrats to [ELE] Fifty Five Hp Monks, the winners of the 1st Good Fights Invitational!

Good Fights 1st Invitational Tournament is about to start, featuring 8 great teams from EU and NA! Tune in: http://twitch.tv/blu42

Best of luck to all teams.

Yeah, maybe not exactly how I’ve got it, though (staff to buff them, might duration, tanky amulet).

It’s true, it is a lot of traits. It would be nice if the 50% longer duration was baseline, so you basically just needed 3 traits in Zeal to get full effectiveness, and you could combine it with Altruistic Healing, maybe. On the other hand, buffed weapons do hit like a truck. They can get kited a bit, just like any other AI build… the issues that AI has with ramps and other z axis obstacles can be frustrating. I’ve gotten to first page solo q while playing that build on and off, so take that for whatever it’s worth, I guess.

Wait, s/d thief existed in curse tournament, though (Jumper). Focus pull was insane, I admit, but a great Thief could shut down Mesmer pretty hard. Looking back more closely, I see this was the period right after the mug nerf, in which case my placement of non s/d Thief was wrong. Before that, though, d/p had good chances of shutting down a Mesmer IMO.

In any case, Mesmer placement aside, I really do think that Necro and Warrior were farther off from playable in that time period than how you presented them. Some buffing was warranted, I just think they went overboard with it.

The tiers for 8 months ago (Curse tournament) were like this:

S Tier
Thief
Ranger
Elementalist

A Tier
Engineer
Guardian
Mesmer

B Tier
Necro

C Tier
Warrior

I do remember people overestimating Mesmer and undervaluing Thief back then, though (probably due to lack of good thieves). Necro couldn’t 1v1 well and had to be built around to be useful (condi spams with Engi), and Warriors went from bad to useless post quickness nerf till god patch.

A lot of these responses are to the title of the thread, which is admittedly inaccurate. If you actually read the post, he’s not saying that power necro, or lich form as a whole is overpowered. He’s saying that lich form #1 skill hits too hard, which is accurate. Power necro as a whole is not quite top tier viable (thief says hello), but that doesn’t mean that lich form in its current iteration is how it should be. Lich form should just be reworked a little to make some of the other skills in the kit a bit better but reduce the auto’s damage by a small margin (10%ish should be enough).

I think they’re actually ok in PvP if you build it and play it right. Not like top tier viable maybe, but they’re better than most people think. Since they offer you so much extra damage, you can afford to go a little tanky and still do solid dps. Best in smaller encounters like 2v2 and 3v3.

Try this in sPvP sometime if you enjoy spirit weaps: http://tinyurl.com/kenguardsw01

They already said they are totally revamping the rating system into a tiered ladder like in Starcraft. Coming out sometime early this year. Patience, bros.

We are in the age of the Warrior meta… condi meta was like 6 months ago, chief.

Should be interesting to see how the next patch shakes things up. Wish it were coming sooner, but oh well. Hoping it’s worth the wait!

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

cymerdown.4103:

Honestly, it does do too much damage.

No, it does exactly enough damage to make it useful. If it did any less damage, no one would ever use it.

That’s not true, if the other attacks in Lich Form are good, the autoattack (#1 attack) can be decreased and the kit would still be useful. The damage is very high (as if someone is spamming you with Arcing Arrow every second and it pierces).

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

cymerdown.4103:

There are ways to counterplay it,

Exactly. Period. There are MANY ways to counter play it. In fact, you’d have to be blind to not be able to counter play it. All you need to do to avoid Lich Form, is run away, and then come back a few seconds later. A necro is slowed down considerably while in Lich Form, it lasts very short, and has an insanely long cool down.

Not just a few seconds, 20 seconds. This is conquest game mode… if all the skill did was make an entire team run away for 20 seconds once every 3 minutes and let me capture a point for free, then I would take that skill on my team. Can’t always “just run away” when the entire mode is built around controlling territory.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

cymerdown.4103:

but it has extreme potential to snowball a team fight as soon as one person goes down.

Only if they are a rare breed of stupid.

You’re not necessarily dumb if you happen to die sometimes to 5k crit attacks. I’ve played with some of the best in the game, and you just get focused down sometimes, it happens. Anyway, what I meant was once that person is down, they are going to be very hard to res with 5k piercing attacks hitting the body. If you can’t res them, then you usually have lost the fight cuz you’re down a person.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

cymerdown.4103:

The autoattack should be toned down and other lich moves should be slightly buffed to compensate, I think.

What auto attack?

The #1 attack, deathly claws.

Josh Davis.6015:

While Lich does a metric ton of damage, it’s also extremely telegraphed and on a rather long cooldown. If anything, Lich does an excellent job of area-denial – I’ll gladly vacate a point for 20 seconds or so to avoid it.

This is unrelated, but I remember a certain PvP team that ran 2 Lich necros and Time Warp mesmer (before the haste changes). It was brutal.

Anyways, as you were…

Honestly, it does do too much damage. There are ways to counterplay it, but it has extreme potential to snowball a team fight as soon as one person goes down. Luckily for team arena, power necro as a whole isn’t the best spec, but especially for solo arena or lower elo teams, lich form is very, very destructive tool, especially combined with wells + transform shenanigans. The autoattack should be toned down and other lich moves should be slightly buffed to compensate, I think.

The meta right now in higher end teams is: Bunker Guardian, Spirit Ranger, Warrior, Thief, X. It’s meta because it’s just an assortment of the most powerful specs in the game, and has a good combination of map control and bunkeryness to both decap and hold points.

Right now, the meta is sort of built around the Warrior — people either play a Warrior, or something that has a good chance at 1v1ing a Warrior (like Thief) or gives support for fighting Warriors (like Guardian) because of how powerful the meta spec is.

Two biggest reasons that I won’t hear the treb:

1. I was just outside the warning range when the treb is originally fired.
2. One of the teams captures a point, so the announcer is too busy saying that already when it should be playing the warning sound.

And now, everyone else has waited patiently for months for the godmode sustain that requires zero button presses to be toned down. 30 hps is a very small reduction, and it’s vital to the balancing of every game mode that warrior sustain be reduced.

MTC.9536:

Dhuumfire has always been 3 seconds with only 1.8k dmg, there are a lot of other traits that do far more DPS than this trait but it gets nerfed again, and only with bleedings necro doesn’t do enough dmg, and they even implement more condi remove..

No, it’s not. It’s 4 seconds of burning in PvE and WvW, and it later got nerfed down to 2 seconds in PvP. This is before condition duration (most dhuumfire necros have +50% condition duration, making it a total of 3 seconds). After their proposed change, it would become 3 seconds base, or 4.5 seconds with the same +50% condition duration.

This trait will still be viable. Keep in mind, they did mention increasing the burn to 3s as part of this change. You can combo them with fear or immob to help landing the green fireball of doom. I think they should go this direction with traits, rather than the random procs with zero counter play that we currently have. I agree with returning some of those silly “I remove 1 bleed stack from this skill in PvP” changes that have been happening lately to compensate, though.

There’s been a good amount of disappointment on the forum today regarding a misunderstanding of when the changes proposed on Ready Up would end up going live. See as how the next big update is still probably over a month away, I was thinking that maybe a small “hotfix” size patch in the next week or two could help address the biggest concerns for PvP balance in the short term, without adding undue amounts of extra work for the developers as they prepare the next big patch. I think 3 simple, small changes would do just that:

1. Implement the proposed change to Healing Signet (reduction of about 30 hps, small increase to active).
2. Implement the proposed bugfix to Spirit of Nature (reduction of 160 hps).
3. Remove Skyhammer from the Solo Arena rotation.

Just my thoughts, but I am fine with waiting it out as well. What do the rest of you think?

Yo, they made it pretty clear that the changes they were discussing we’re in the planning stages only. They used language repeatedly throughout the stream to indicate that. I really hope that this is all some bad attempt at trolling, but by the sheer number of posts it seems like people are being genuine, which is downright baffling to be honest.

Personally, I’m pretty happy that we got an early peek at future balance ideas. It’s giving them plenty of time to their feedback and ideas from the community before they move forward, which is huge. Please take this time to review their proposals and tell the devs what you think so they can use that information in a positive way, and let’s cut down on these types of threads that don’t really help anyone, thanks.

No, I think their goal is to nerf dodges across the board, for all aspects of the game (they are trying to reduce active defense in PvE as well, to reduce the zerker meta).

Personally, I think the dodging ability on perma-Vigor classes is currently too high. When you get a 0.75s dodge every 5 seconds, you will use them when under light to moderate pressure in order to not waste the invuln frames, not just in order to avoid big attacks. That is especially true on classes where the dodge gives you some additional benefit (like an AoE heal on Guardian, or a clone on Mesmer). I abuse the high number of dodges I get all the time, and I see Mesmers do it, too. Using a dodge shouldn’t just be an automatic part of a shatter combo, it should be a deliberate decision (do I burn a dodge to make a clone now, but decrease my future survivability?), and right now it isn’t really a choice. Also, perma-Vigor for a 5 point trait is just insane, since it’s probably the 3rd strongest boon in the game. I’d rather see a change like this and then have the rest of the class balanced around this change, rather than hold back on it because of the current meta. Let’s also keep in mind that Mesmer will probably see a 5% damage increase on Greatsword to compensate for the slightly fewer dodges (Energy/Force Energy/Force), so even though their ability to fight in melee will go down a bit, their already considerable ranged DPS will go up a bit.

I disagree with the Deceptive Evasion change, especially being done with the Vigor nerf at the same time. I hope they will revert this and wait to see how the Vigor change plays out before even considering a change like this one.

Just wanted to say as a viewer that I look forward to watching the ESL every week. Glad we had some new teams last week, including one with a decap engi that did very well. It’s hard as a new team to face these more experienced ones, but there is no better way to learn what works and what doesn’t. Looking forward to next week!

sPvP is still about team play, it’s just that tactics and builds are set up around small scale fighting (5 or less players), rather than large scale (10 or more players). It’s just a completely different setting. Anyone that tried to use WvW tactics in a 6v6 are just going to get destroyed by a team of sPvP players using small scale strategies and builds. For example, things like Veil and Time Warp, which are used heavily in WvW, are pretty bad here and almost never used. “Regrouping” is just another term for “dying to nades”, etc. Tuning in to a 6v6 and expecting it to play like a 15v15 is just setting yourself up for disappointment.

That being said, there is still tons of skill required for small scale fighting. It’s just that the skill is much more about individual player ability and how to apply that in a team fight rather than army-level coordination between a large number of people. It’s like comparing a navy seal squadron to an army company. Totally different skill sets, but both require skill to execute properly.

Respectfully, I disagree with all but one of your points, Aldizi.

1. They do care about the success of PvP. As a smallish company, their resources are limited, but it seems that they have been growing their staff over time. The launch of their biweekly stream shows their growing efforts to make pvp a priority. I think 2014 will be a good year for us.
2. Balance has progressed, and is getting close to being in a good spot. Anyone who says that balance was better on release is looking through rose-tinted glasses, and that’s just a simple fact. D/D thief instant gibs, time warp lich forms, lack of viable condi comps, immortal bunker eles, block bug guardians, and one spec warriors are all a thing of the past.
3. The communication is getting a lot better, from what I see. The last Ready Up is a good example of that. I may not agree with every last thing they implement, but I do see more and more feedback being listened to with their changes, and with Grouch in place, I expect that is only going to increase over time.
4. Kinda agree here, but I think they are already working at this. More unlocks are going to be added, which is part of their future business model plans, I believe.
5. Ok, I can’t argue with this point. A PTR would be amazing for testing and feedback purposes.