Guild Wars 2

KinkyGiraffe.4123:

Lol you guys,
We’re not WINNING because of our Oceanics, we simply have a 45k lead on you because of them.
It takes both NA and Oceanic to keep the PPT up and stay in the lead.

Like i said above, yes in that graph it seems like DR would barely win during NA only, now if you guys had oceanic presence aswell, and it was the same/we were winning oceanic, our tactics will be completely different and it will be a totally different matchup.

Saying we’re winning because of our oceanics is wrong, do not take it away from our NA’s, theyre the ones that are doing the hard yards trying to fight off the prime.
Ive constantly seen people say ‘Naw i always miss out on the fun" meaning our stomping during Oceanic.
Dont just find excuses to put down part of our server when we’re all here fighting the same cause

Kinky,

Can’t you see that we are saying if the coverage was like primetime for 24 hours then this would be a relatively close three way matchup?

yawn passive aggressive attacks… night capping.. yada yada yada.

Good fights Ferg, as always you guys bring it with everything you can, and with class.

Had some fun last night on EBG, which is unusual for me or my guild to say as we do not frequent that map very often.

IoJ were camped in our keep and proving extremely difficult to clear out as they seemed to be able to counter our zerg wherever they were going.

Had to resort to some sneaky tactics to distract IoJ enough to give us a chance to get our stuff back. So off we went, our band of 8 merry men, and a couple of friends, on a little adventure around the map, hitting everything that was blue, including the IoJ keep watergate. Not with the intent of taking it, just to try and pull some of the force they had on the map, back to where they belong.

Then it was back over to our keep to sneak in through our watergate but there were still a ton of IoJ in there.

Picked off a couple of towers then, sorry to the FC zerg that was taking Wild Creek, feel kinda guilty for stealing that from you at the last minute. Props for venturing down into the chaos that was our corner of the map though.

Had to go back to the IoJ keep and this time re-enforcements arrived in the form of 2 DDLG golems, which finally created enough of a distraction for us to take back our keep.

Bloody hard fight all round. Well done to IoJ for making it so difficult for us to take stuff back in NA prime and also to FC who managed to grab SM from IoJ, was a good move.

Will be back to the other borderlands for us for a while, probably IoJ as they love us really

Oh… I don’t really get the whole animosity between IoJ and DR as we only transferred not so long ago but we used to fight against IoJ in T2 and you guys were not so…. let’s say.. vocal on the forums then, so I am sure I am missing something rather big in your eyes.

Thanks for the fights IoJ and FC and thanks for the 3v3 our guys had with some FC dudes yesterday on our BL. Your mesmer is a pain in the kitten to kill

/salute

Lol this thread

I thought FC and ET had issues, boy was I wrong :P
Every match up has a winner: the one with the most points…. Largest guild, best players, numbers, oceanic presence – it all amounts to points and we have a winner, a whiner and a when-ner

Let’s put away the handbags and beat each other up on the battlefield.

Just qurious:
DR, why do you insist on taking FC garrison above anything else on the map? Last night you had enough people to take 4 towers at the same time and then probably bay and hills at the same time, but oh no: Gaaaarrriiiiiisooooon!!!!!
*sings*"We’re off to take the garri, the wonderful garri of Fergs"
I don’t get it. Lo and behold we get a WP there? Surely the garr alone is not worth as many points as 4 camps and 4 towers? errrr…. wait…. no go ahead, focus on the garrison… note to self: don’t supply enemy with tactics

You IoJ types better hope your Oceanics don’t rent a beach house with no internet, or you would be sitting 3rd, and leaving your present tier. It is nice as usual to see the IoJ commanders sucking up to another server in hopes of an alliance to compensate for their poor primetime. The question here is will it take flowers and chocolates? What will DH think if they see you around going all snuggletums with FC?

To FC- as you can probably tell, our first pick is IoJ as far as wrecking homelands goes, as that is straight where we went on reset. Mon night DDLG was in IoJ BL, and last night we were mainly in DR BL. It has been good fighting you guys, and you have done much better than IoJ in countering us open field. Perhaps if we went Away From Keyboard for 5hrs and transformed into doors, IoJ would do better against us in the open field.

Lepew.7890:

You IoJ types better hope your Oceanics don’t rent a beach house with no internet, or you would be sitting 3rd, and leaving your present tier. It is nice as usual to see the IoJ commanders sucking up to another server in hopes of an alliance to compensate for their poor primetime. The question here is will it take flowers and chocolates? What will DH think if they see you around going all snuggletums with FC?

To FC- as you can probably tell, our first pick is IoJ as far as wrecking homelands goes, as that is straight where we went on reset. Mon night DDLG was in IoJ BL, and last night we were mainly in DR BL. It has been good fighting you guys, and you have done much better than IoJ in countering us open field. Perhaps if we went Akitten for 5hrs and transformed into doors, IoJ would do better against us in the open field.

Well from my point of view, we do as much damage (as we can) to IoJ as we do to DR in EB. We just retaliate against DR more often in their BL since they pay our BL frequent visits (especially paving the yellow brick road to our garrison). I know each person has their own “prime time” and that’s why you think that DR is paying IoJ homelands more visits than FC, but if you look at the graphs in the above posts there is a certain trend going on that whenever there is a spike in the green line, there is an accompanying dip in the red line….

EDIT: Again, from my point of view – IoJ not that we don’t appreciate any interference when it comes to suppressing DR, but just so we’re clear – we don’t need you pity either. Now please don’t take this as meaning you should bring your entire zerg to FC all day, every day until Friday… but just don’t take any offence if those blue towers look a lot more lucrative than the green ones at times. Green is of course the colour of sick and should be eliminated at all times, but blue is normally the colour just before getting sick and our treatment is a little red anti-nausea medicine drops :P

Scleameth.6809:

Lepew.7890:

You IoJ types better hope your Oceanics don’t rent a beach house with no internet, or you would be sitting 3rd, and leaving your present tier. It is nice as usual to see the IoJ commanders sucking up to another server in hopes of an alliance to compensate for their poor primetime. The question here is will it take flowers and chocolates? What will DH think if they see you around going all snuggletums with FC?

To FC- as you can probably tell, our first pick is IoJ as far as wrecking homelands goes, as that is straight where we went on reset. Mon night DDLG was in IoJ BL, and last night we were mainly in DR BL. It has been good fighting you guys, and you have done much better than IoJ in countering us open field. Perhaps if we went Akitten for 5hrs and transformed into doors, IoJ would do better against us in the open field.

Well from my point of view, we do as much damage (as we can) to IoJ as we do to DR in EB. We just retaliate against DR more often in their BL since they pay our BL frequent visits (especially paving the yellow brick road to our garrison). I know each person has their own “prime time” and that’s why you think that DR is paying IoJ homelands more visits than FC, but if you look at the graphs in the above posts there is a certain trend going on that whenever there is a spike in the green line, there is an accompanying dip in the red line….

From a purely tactical point of view, it makes sense for us to hit your garrison before it has a waypoint up as it makes your whole borderland much harder for you to defend, as I am sure you are aware.

This goes for IoJ’s garrison as well. My guys will be trying to take out any Tier 3 towers and keeps on both enemy borderlands first as it weakens the defending team significantly. Much harder to defend your borderland when everything has paper gates, and FC were in DR’s borderland for a large part of last night and managed to flip pretty much everything. I fully expect this to happen to us as it is a very good tactic.

/salute

Snow Ghost.6817:

From a purely tactical point of view, it makes sense for us to hit your garrison before it has a waypoint up as it makes your whole borderland much harder for you to defend, as I am sure you are aware.

This goes for IoJ’s garrison as well. My guys will be trying to take out any Tier 3 towers and keeps on both enemy borderlands first as it weakens the defending team significantly. Much harder to defend your borderland when everything has paper gates, and FC were in DR’s borderland for a large part of last night and managed to flip pretty much everything. I fully expect this to happen to us as it is a very good tactic.

/salute

Accepted. Makes perfect sense… But it’s more of a hindrance than a crippling blow… and it costs our small population a ton of dough to queue upgrades again…
So if you feel generous and want to be the most polite opponent ever – get in, take Greenbriar, flip a few camps and reatreat :P
Any takers? Anyone? No? Oh well, I suppose we’ll have to up the ante in gar from 6 AC to 20…

CrazyCanuck.4265:

Ya, thats definitely 21 people. 10 seconds before the tail end of them made orange swords killing one DR.

Actually, yes. It looks like about 20 people. It takes 25 to pop orange swords, and 21 + pugs is consistent with your evidence. I think you should work on your estimation skills.

KinkyGiraffe.4123:

Lol you guys,
We’re not WINNING because of our Oceanics, we simply have a 45k lead on you because of them.
It takes both NA and Oceanic to keep the PPT up and stay in the lead.

QFT.

If people wanna QQ about night capping, go complain to ANet. They’re the ones who decided to allow it.

Meh, some of you people take this game too seriously. DR is winning because every time I get on, I’m having a blast. Credit goes to the IoJ and FC that take/provide loot bags.

I know of one commander who was an equal opportunity offender, keeping as many keeps paper as possible with his never ending karma train. He would flip from BL to BL to EB doing that over and over. It is human nature to only notice your own BL flipping.

In my opinion the upgraded keeps only serve to buy time for defenders to arrive. The real deterrent is massed arrow carts, which are useless without defenders. Clearly oil and cannons serve to handle those times when nobody refreshes siege and it despawns, and it directly slows a golem assault. But from what I see most of these keeps fall because nobody is there defending. The oil is built, the cannon is built, but nobody is home.

Now last night in EB, IoJ had DR’s keep, with loads of AC’s and trebs, and had a full crew there defending. PUGs were coming off WP and going right into the WxP farm IoJ had set up. I tried to drag the PUGs off to attack something deep in the IoJ section, but they were too interested in dying over and over again to massed siege. I think Prizzmo had similar poor results with the PUGs earlier. The few I had with me on the flank encountered very light IoJ resistance as all were in that keep. Anyway because the PUGs were ignoring command, and they were disorganized, that keep with all that siege stood there in IoJ hands for quite a long time, and the only real progress occurred when a significant mass of guildies (VP) took charge and started to coordinate a proper offensive without the PUGs. A well sieged up keep or tower can stand up to a lot of PUGs for hours and hours. But if it is unmanned, it will fall to even disorganized PUGs. This is my central objection to the claims of the IoJ Oceanics. If all we have defending is a few disorganized PUGs, then really any uncoordianted zerg could night cap what we hold. Just build rams, bash door, repeat.

During prime time, we do not face undefended keeps. Usually there are some IoJ there, or can get there unless you are very fast and stealthy. I think turning the IoJ BL green on Mon as we did during prime is a much larger accomplishment than the nightly Oceanic flipping of our BL against our skeleton force.

The annoying thing about IoJ in the past was we would lay off them and attack #1, and IoJ would never attack the #1 team, and back cap everything we took from #1. This is why we said they were playing for #2. They were content never show aggression to #1, and fight for the scraps #1 left them, and let their Oceanic force do all the heavy lifting from a points standpoint. On top of this in Prime, if #1 attacked IoJ, IoJ would just roll over and go all submissive, and let their homeland get capped. This meant that if #1 wanted something more than boring pvdoor, they would go for #2, us, because IoJ would never put up a fight on defense against them. The end result of this submissive posture of IoJ was to engender a (#1 + #3) v. #2 alliance which was really very boring from our WvW standpoint. #1 was happy because they placed high week after week bringing in more players. IoJ was happy because they could get #2.

In this particular matchup, the only way to prevail against the IoJ Oceanics would be for DR + FC to hammer IoJ nonstop during prime and throttle their points. But that will never happen. IoJ has run of the map with the Oceanics, and FC + DR fight frequently during prime giving the Oceanics the win.

All this talk about “no choice but to play for 2nd” but you know what? Check the previous threads with IoJ, DH, and SF, and you can see how we actually teamed up against DH most of the time and made it a helluva week. The power is in your hands, all it takes is the willpower to put your egos away and focus on the bigger target. Find the teamspeak addy for DR and FC and hop on, get together and set something up! It can happen, it has happen, and you can make it happen.

Now quit kittening about “playing for 2nd.”

Oozo.7856:

KinkyGiraffe.4123:

Lol you guys,
We’re not WINNING because of our Oceanics, we simply have a 45k lead on you because of them.
It takes both NA and Oceanic to keep the PPT up and stay in the lead.

Like i said above, yes in that graph it seems like DR would barely win during NA only, now if you guys had oceanic presence aswell, and it was the same/we were winning oceanic, our tactics will be completely different and it will be a totally different matchup.

Saying we’re winning because of our oceanics is wrong, do not take it away from our NA’s, theyre the ones that are doing the hard yards trying to fight off the prime.
Ive constantly seen people say ‘Naw i always miss out on the fun" meaning our stomping during Oceanic.
Dont just find excuses to put down part of our server when we’re all here fighting the same cause

Kinky,

Can’t you see that we are saying if the coverage was like primetime for 24 hours then this would be a relatively close three way matchup?

No, you guys are say we’re only winning because of our oceanics.
But yes, its clear in the same post you made 3 times the the scoring is generally equal during NA time.

KinkyGiraffe.4123:

Oozo.7856:

KinkyGiraffe.4123:

Lol you guys,
We’re not WINNING because of our Oceanics, we simply have a 45k lead on you because of them.
It takes both NA and Oceanic to keep the PPT up and stay in the lead.

Like i said above, yes in that graph it seems like DR would barely win during NA only, now if you guys had oceanic presence aswell, and it was the same/we were winning oceanic, our tactics will be completely different and it will be a totally different matchup.

Saying we’re winning because of our oceanics is wrong, do not take it away from our NA’s, theyre the ones that are doing the hard yards trying to fight off the prime.
Ive constantly seen people say ‘Naw i always miss out on the fun" meaning our stomping during Oceanic.
Dont just find excuses to put down part of our server when we’re all here fighting the same cause

Kinky,

Can’t you see that we are saying if the coverage was like primetime for 24 hours then this would be a relatively close three way matchup?

No, you guys are say we’re only winning because of our oceanics.
But yes, its clear in the same post you made 3 times the the scoring is generally equal during NA time.

Not to mention that EVERY match up in this game would be equal in this match up with is logic of it being a Primetime 24/7. Go up to T1/2 if you want constant Prtimetime please. Down here coverage means the world, if you complain about oceanics, go and recruit some oceanic guilds, there are PLENTY looking to move around. Trust me i’ve seen the posts, take some initiative for your server if you’re all so kittened about coverage.

What those charts fail to show is that when Oceanics flip everything every night, we have to rebuild all of that the next day. The normal pattern then is to mop up the previous nights mess, start upgrading camps and getting supply back in, re siege everything…that takes time and sets us back further. So simple points verses time graphs do not take into account recovering from paper. As FC points out, people tire of putting the time and money into upgrading a borderland only to have it all vanish every night when the Oceanics log in. So would be defenders get demoralized and cease participating with the nightly wipe. Those points verses time plots would be a lot different without nightly resets. If it was skeleton crew v. skeleton crew, many of those upgraded keeps would survive the night, and people might defend and siege more because it would matter.

The earlier point I made about poor Anet design regarding lumping in Oceanics with NA remains. People in similar time zones should be in similar matchups. I have had much better experience in MMOs where Euros, Oceanics, and NA were in different battle groups. Were NAs v. NAs, then guilds would be focusing upon tactics rather than recruiting for coverage. What do you as a game designer want your WvW force working on? Recruiting? Or tactics? Hopefully Anet will learn from the problems they have here with coverage dominating points as much as it does. It would be really easy to divide the WvW day up into 3 time slots: Oceanic, Euro, and NA, and grant points and rankings per time slot. Perhaps this is by design to churn more transfer fees and gem purchases to overcome a design flaw.

Compensating for this design flaw by teaming up in team speak really does not prove much. A true 3-way match settles more than a gang up. If you win in a gang up, you can claim no expertise as the loser will invariably and rightfully attribute your victory to teamwork across server.

Recruiting Oceanics is not as easy as you may think. Certainly we as a server have had this coverage hole for a while, and we have been actively trying to resolve this issue, but there just are not that many Oceanics unhappy with their present servers to make a difference with the IoJ Oceanic zerg. To some extent, people will gravitate towards the clear victor in their time slot. I bet the strong Oceanic presence on IoJ attracts and draws more of the available Oceanics.

This matchup is what it is, and as it stands it is pretty meaningless. The strengths are not facing the strengths, and it is coverage dominated. It is what it is. It is sad that the game design is such that coverage trumps tactics and strategy.

Agricola.2817:

The Coma Kid.5184:

Fergs thanks for all the loot bags while trying to take your garrison back. Should stop bunching up in that corner when our DDLG zerg keeps coming back.

http://i.imgur.com/ozly49O.jpg?1

My personal favorite part was when DR was defending the north inner gate of bay and let us take down the south gate and kill the lord without anyone noticing. Should stop bunching up in that corner with your DDLG zerg without realizing the other doors are under attack.

No, what was really funny was most of the people attacking the north gate had no idea that this happened, and just how long we kept ramming the gate after the flip, not realizing the keep had already changed hands. I personally felt a little silly having to run through the red door to go kill the DR zerg.

Lepew.7890:

What those charts fail to show is that when Oceanics flip everything every night, we have to rebuild all of that the next day. The normal pattern then is to mop up the previous nights mess, start upgrading camps and getting supply back in, re siege everything…that takes time and sets us back further. So simple points verses time graphs do not take into account recovering from paper. As FC points out, people tire of putting the time and money into upgrading a borderland only to have it all vanish every night when the Oceanics log in. So would be defenders get demoralized and cease participating with the nightly wipe. Those points verses time plots would be a lot different without nightly resets. If it was skeleton crew v. skeleton crew, many of those upgraded keeps would survive the night, and people might defend and siege more because it would matter.

The earlier point I made about poor Anet design regarding lumping in Oceanics with NA remains. People in similar time zones should be in similar matchups. I have had much better experience in MMOs where Euros, Oceanics, and NA were in different battle groups. Were NAs v. NAs, then guilds would be focusing upon tactics rather than recruiting for coverage. What do you as a game designer want your WvW force working on? Recruiting? Or tactics? Hopefully Anet will learn from the problems they have here with coverage dominating points as much as it does. It would be really easy to divide the WvW day up into 3 time slots: Oceanic, Euro, and NA, and grant points and rankings per time slot. Perhaps this is by design to churn more transfer fees and gem purchases to overcome a design flaw.

Compensating for this design flaw by teaming up in team speak really does not prove much. A true 3-way match settles more than a gang up. If you win in a gang up, you can claim no expertise as the loser will invariably and rightfully attribute your victory to teamwork across server.

Recruiting Oceanics is not as easy as you may think. Certainly we as a server have had this coverage hole for a while, and we have been actively trying to resolve this issue, but there just are not that many Oceanics unhappy with their present servers to make a difference with the IoJ Oceanic zerg. To some extent, people will gravitate towards the clear victor in their time slot. I bet the strong Oceanic presence on IoJ attracts and draws more of the available Oceanics.

This matchup is what it is, and as it stands it is pretty meaningless. The strengths are not facing the strengths, and it is coverage dominated. It is what it is. It is sad that the game design is such that coverage trumps tactics and strategy.

I will agree with you on the fact that WvW is more like Coverage Wars 2, but we did have to face you and DH before we had a stronger NA presence around, and we would continually have to recap from both DR and DH and we still kept going at it, dont give up simply cause you are on the flip side. IoJ was at the bottom of a constant free fall for months, when we stabilized at T6 it was simply holding our own—barely. Without Oceanics we WERE a T7/8 server, thats indisputable in my mind. However im not saying your guild, or you, or anyone still even posting on the forums said this. Yet for a long, long time DR told us they’d stomp us to the ground if we didnt have DH to hide behind. DH isnt here anymore, we’re simply proving ourselves now that, that isnt the truth. Now with the new system in sure we’ll get stomped on by some other server soon enough, just like you guys will end up stomping some other servers you get matched with eventually.

Lets just agree to disagree here that we win this round around, but maybe you will win next round around. I just want to have a fun and awesome match up without having to come on the forums seeing DR complaining all the time, FC deals with us, they have fun with what they have, hell they even flip SM or our keeps from time to time (Once a day somewhere XD) and all without constant complaining. Now it may just be a few random people complaining, if thats the direct opposite of the general server feeling i do apologize, but what we see most of the time from other servers and what they think is from the forums since we dont have a real direct communication linge. I dont understand though why people need to continue this massive dispute, even if DR was winning this time around, i wouldnt be complaining at the loss, simply you guys would have been proving your statement right. (Sorry this is random and jumbled, just woke up for the most part)

It’s not like DR or FC don’t have any people to defend at night, but they would rather scatter all over and flip camps rather than work together and put some effort into defending. The longer we get held off the less we take/upgrade and thus the better it works for you, but the course of action you choose is not to be blamed on IoJ or oceanics.

If someone chooses to cap Bay in IoJ, then upgrades it and tries to hold it at the expense of their own BL and eventually loses 3/4 of it, that’s their mistake they will have to live with

You maybe at ‘dissadvantage’ for few hrs a day but it doesn’t look like you’re taking full advantage of your prime time and the numbers you can come up with against IoJ.

And since we capture stuff over night and then end up defending it, we are effectively fighting both FC and DR and obviously we have to make sacrifices when we get overwhelmed.

All in all, just find your way to work around it.
And + 1 Banzie

I hope this makes any sense

LifeForce all you told us is that you dont understand what’s happening

My complaints are with the game design, as you said “Coverage Wars 2”. I really wish our primetime could fight your Oceanic. That would be fun. Until we get coverage in the Oceanic slot, I do not see much changing. We have identified a guild, but they will only come with a free transfer, and looks like Anet is in no hurry to offer that, and we have no oil baron willing to buy them transfers. Perhaps we underestimated how strong that Oceanic advantage was when we were playing w/ IoJ + DH. The IoJ + DH alliance was certainly frustrating. This matchup settles in my mind that it is coverage. Did DH give your Oceanic crew any difficulty? Perhaps it is not only the advantage v. DR, but no pressure from DH in the Oceanic slot. I do remember seeing some maps posted in your thread showing IoJ night capping in the new matchup.

I am not sure if you have noticed, but our open field has improved a huge amount since we last faced you guys. Going down from t6 to t7 really made us step up that game (NSP in particular). I think the small roaming groups who went down even further to t8 came back up as the competition there was fierce. As you go up tier it seems to be more about paper gates and endless zerging with few keeps coming to completion. I personally like keep fortification mattering in WvW, as supply matters and where you spend it matters, and defending yaks and camps matter. As much as it was annoying to try to take down, I liked how IoJ was dug in at our keep in EB yesterday. Not sure that happens up tier.

stay classy IOJ stay classy…

Oh hay guise! Good to see our hardened other half faring well.

I see so much emphasis on coverage in this thread, and yet DR doesn’t really play for PPT. DR in our BL? No sweat, they’re here to farm… Apples and oranges. And they’re both claiming the other is more sour.

Also, just leaving this link here for nostalgia’s sake. Miss you Gab!

Dark Isle of Janthaven, coming soon to a tier near you.

Well I will try to bring some logic into this whole argument. Feel free to respond with any concerns or questions you have and I will try to respond to them as best as I can. However, please don’t quote or respond to minor parts of my post without reading and comprehending the entirety of it first.

Crimson Magdelana.9024:

Five days. Six hours at most (being generous) per night means 30 hours since reset. 45,000+ point lead. DR rarely being outmanned as shown more than once (from an oceanic player: more by FC than IoJ)…that’s where the lead came from? After all this time coming in third…suddenly IoJ is winning because of this?

This would be true if NA players logged on directly after Oceanics logged off. This is not true. After the Oceanic players log off there is long period of time where WvW is pretty much dead, and where very little is flipped.

If you would have actually looked at the charts, you would see that DR takes the lead again at about 6pm (coincidentally, when NA prime time starts), which is 13-14 hours after you guys take the lead at about 3-4am in the morning.

So no, it really doesn’t matter how good your NA crew does against ours because as long as your Oceanic players can get better ppt during Oceanic hours than what our NA players can get during NA prime time, which to be honest isn’t that hard given how the game and the servers are set up, you will always end up with more points.

If DR had 100 players online during NA prime, and 0 during Oceanic prime, and if IoJ had 0 players online during NA prime, and 100 during Oceanic prime, it would result in a curbstomp from IoJ. Let me show you why in a really simple scenario, using the numbers above.

(Server time)
Period 1: 18:00: DR takes lead of 695ppt. DR holds throughout all of NA prime time.
Period 2: 03:00: IoJ takes lead of 695ppt. IoJ holds throughout all of Oceanic prime time.
Period 3: 11:00 Now this is where it gets tricky. Let’s have two cases:

• Case 1: FC has 100 European players.
  Here FC would take a lead of 695ppt, and hold it until NA prime kicks in again.
• Case2: FC has 0 European players.
  Here however, FC would take nothing. PPT from Oceanic prime time stays until NA prime time.

During period 1, DR would gain 25020 points, IoJ 0, and FC 0.
During period 2, DR would gain 0 points, IoJ 19460, and FC 0.
Case 1:
During period 3, DR would gain 0 points, IoJ 0, and FC 19460.
Case 2:
During period 3, DR would gain 0 points, IoJ 19460, and FC 0.

Total case 1: DR 25020, IoJ 19460, FC 19460.
Total case 2: DR 25020, IoJ 38920, FC 0.

As I am sure you can also see, the problem is accentuated by the fact that DR has to compete with a server that also has strong NA prime time, namely FC. If the situation was reversed here, you could easily see that if DR still has 100 players during NA prime time, but both FC and IoJ has 100 players during Oceanic, the ppt during that period would be split into 350 / 345, giving us the same 25020, 19460, 19460 score that we saw in Case 1.

On top of this people who start playing this game from NA will naturally pick a NA server and assume they can find people to play with. This is not true for Oceanic players because of your smaller player base. This had lead to stacking on servers such as Sea of Sorrows and Isle of Janthir. Every server has an “ok” NA prime time, whereas not every server has an “ok” Oceanic prime time. This further skews the total points.

I am in no way saying here that these numbers are completely accurate, but it should give you an idea of why NA players are actually worth less than Oceanic players, because in lower tiers such as this where European coverage is very rare, Case 2 is a lot more common than Case 1, because of the simple fact that Europeans have their own servers. (I am neither NA nor Oceanic myself so I am not saying this in a biased way although I am sure most of you will interpret it that way).

Similarly, if there was a server of only European and NA players, NA players would be worth a lot more than the European players, because of how their prime time interacts with the European prime time.

Like others have mentioned before, since you can hold most of your stuff during NA prime time, you will have upgraded maps to work from, whereas the other servers can’t. This means that we have to spend a comparatively larger amount of time and dedication to defending our Borderlands, which in turn would account for a weaker NA prime time than what would be appropriate given our numbers.

melodey.4652:

Dark Isle of Janthaven, coming soon to a tier near you.

Ahem… GoM and DH have only been back together for less than a week, and you’re already thinking about cheating on us?

I think we should split up. And that entitles us to half of your possessions, so kindly hand over Stonemist and NSP’s borderlands and we’ll call it even.

melodey.4652:

Also, just leaving this link here for nostalgia’s sake. Miss you Gab!

It’s great that you would post this because it is in fact what my second post was going to be about.

I firmly believe that in the middle of April we were the stronger server. If the week after we would have faced this exact same match up I am sure we would have won. However, I firmly believe that server potency changes. We used to see outmanned on IoJ during reset, now they queue multiple maps from what I understand.

I still firmly believe that the average skill level of a DR player is higher than that of an IoJ or DH or SBI player. I am also sure that the average skill level of an EB, NSP or a Maguuma player is higher than that of a DR player. This is just all my opinion, not me lashing out at other servers. I also believe that players who play on European servers would consistently smash the kitten out of players who play on NA servers, myself included.

I am also a bit surprised that you think because Oozo posts videos of ADQQSty killing IoJ players it’s some kind of personal insult towards you. Oozo posts the videos because many people enjoy watching them.

I hope my posts can clear some stuff up. Enjoy the rest of the week

I thought this kind of posts died down after my posts in page 6. (._.)

Some of your true forum fighters toned down and changed a bit, some FC people stood out and also had some interesting replies as usual.

Until…

KinkyGiraffe.4123:

World Versus Isle of Janthir

WE WERE SO kittenING CLOSE TO 695PPT, WE HAD 680 AT ONE POINT. WHY DID YOU LOT HAVE TO RUIN THAT, WHY!!!!

Also thanks to Derron, it is now Isle of Janthir Lowlands, we expect you to be packed by tomorrow Devona, we mean it!!!

Well, probably just excitement…

[ Old Quote ]

KinkyGiraffe.4123:

There was no bragging then, my post with the youtube link was just excitement, we’ve never capped all of EB on reset weekend! Im Blue da be de da ba di

[/Old Quote]

Then, again,

KinkyGiraffe.4123:

Naw which DR fella said IoJ’s borderland defense was poor?

You guys are in FCs borderlands being a menace meanwhile your hills gets 5 manned?

Hey, good one! Mr. Starkk from [GEN]… [GEN] implies Oceanic, right?

However, the time you posted which I see on my screen here is 00:29 (please see attachment), and the time on your mini-map is 12:xx AM something… I think it’s server time, which is NA Pacific Time. (Ref: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/updated-changing-wvw-match-reset-time/ Anet announces news and updates using NA Pacific Time, too. PDT here stands for NA Pacific Daylight Time, just FYI. And, if I didn’t get it wrong, I think Anet is based in Seattle, WA.) again, for your information, it’s 3AM NA Eastern Time.

If the time in the screenshot is not NA Pacific Time, then 00:xx UTC +0800 would be 09:xx NA Pacific Time. Well, I think I get it right up there, anyway.

Eh, the people here or there really don’t know much about each other’s schedule… I know time difference is mindkittening, but I expected Oceanic/Asia-Pacific people coming to NA servers is more aware of it, comparing with those errogant NA people. (also you actually set you in-game clock to server time) And here, some further information about the most NA people — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:USA-2000-population-density.gif , and I feel bad if I don’t include/introduce Canada a bit — http://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/91-214-x/2010000/m003-eng.htm .

I see the WvW map in your 3rd screenshot. Although there is a possibility that Fergs have no manpower to retake their land swiftly and/or their force online focus in EB during that time, it is indeed very sad for our homeland security krewe, daytime or nighttime. — No one likes to defend the boredom land when it’s peaceful, and few like to defend the borderland when it’s messy, people like to conquer, like to play.

According to my experiences in past few weeks (matches with GoM and NSP), we might have a handful or less than 10 people on the map then, most of whom not from major or well-known guilds (check my “bear with me” screenshot… alas, I masked all the guild tags for our in-game privacy. We certainly don’t want to become some bad people’s target in-game), and it would be lucky if I run into 3+ experienced WvW’ers in our borderland. (eg. in-game warrior Theo, and self-proclaimed gay thief Alk q: )

Back to the topic(?), the way to counter your party’s attack at Hills west wall ninja spot is using sieges, setting up 1 AC or using the south mortar on the west wall. With AC mastery lv1 and recently lv2, I solo’ed defensing Hills from GoM ninjas and Hills treb killers a lot in previous matches. 3-5+ GoM [RH] [ASH] [Worm] group love the lakeview (especially when we trebbed down NW wall), the convenient location, and the farming potential of our SE tower! uh, off the topic…

I don’t know if we got a WP up at Hills, most likely not. It seems that your party did a great job to set up not only 2 but 3 cats in advance, it may be too late for our HLS krewe after they noticed contested Hills WP or the 30s-delayed notification at Hills then coming from Garrison or Citadel (if Garrison is contested) to build the AC or use mortar to save Hills. (Surely you can have 1-2 people in your party to neutralize 1-2 our lonely homeland defender[s]) Plus, your commander is working on Bay, and our map looks quite blue then (or seconds after you took Hills and the screenshot)

TL; DR

NOICE JOB. (= w=)b

I saw and read our people and your people’s posts in between and later, I’m sorry that I have to skip those (5,000 chars limits, ah, exceeded again) and I actually have nothing to comment on those. Somehow I think our armed forces really like to turn on hard mode for our self-defense forces — that is, hitting both side day and/or night, and get us hit by both side at the same time. Camp running or XP train is fine, but what I’ve seen is beyond that.

I learned that some DR have friends in FC, they’re just playing with each other for fun, but I don’t know how other FC people interpret that. Some simple logic is… you have a lot of fun in our BL, I’ll go have some fun in your BL, too.

Yesterday afternoon before the new build, with the help from few friends and their guildies, we take NE tower back and secure the north for yaks bringing supply to Garrison. I can’t remember what I had ordered for Garrison during my time yesterday (just SSDD since facing GoM), but I did order the WP and walked several yaks. I want to bring Garrison WP up first, for Hills and Bay and others. WP was 45% before the new build kicked in. I logged out for the rest of the afternoon. When I came home around 19:00 (NA Pacific Time), Garrison was not claimed by the guild previously having it and I saw no WP. I sent a mail, returned some gold to my friend, and logged out for the night.

I poked my head into DR BL early this morning between 04:00 and maybe 05:50 NA Pacific Time (19:00~20:50 UTC +0800). 2 sieger friends online, and we had had a lot of sieges in Garrison, ACs, ballistas, trebs. I just chatted with people in map chat, and kept refreshing sieges we got. Had some fun bombarding IoJ people attacking watergate and inner south with my newly unlocked cannons mastery lv2, and later trebbing inner south gate in lord’s room.

I didn’t build some more ACs at watergate. My accumulated skill points drops from 120 or 130 something to 82 now. I’m fully aware that it’s a game. I also understand people playing for fun, in different ways, in their ways. So, I think I’ll just go camping or fooling around somewhere else for a while from now. World completion 92%~

—
@Lepew: Anet/NCsoft partnered with Chinese company, and a special localized GW2 is now closed beta in mainland China. I don’t know if they’ll open the servers to others running the standard version, or if they’ll have servers for Aussie, Kiwi, Japanese, Korean people just like the EU servers do for different ethnic groups.

—
PS. Recently, after p.1 and p.2, no one directly qoute me, reply me, troll me, or argue with me, I’m so sad. QQ

FC catapulting and ramming a wall that cannot be destroyed.

….well played you guys.

Look at all these dead IOJ and FC

Just thought I would post this vid I found, that I thought was pretty entertaining.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeFvw5BlGTU

Look, I like FC and SR and i’m sure you guys are all nice people but SF and IoJ already proved it in previous weeks, and i’m sure other servers have done it already in weeks before that:

If you team up on the bigger server, or at least the one with more advantages (like more oceanic coverage), you will have a much closer match. A more entertaining match for all 3 servers.

If you go after the other server, the one not dominating, you’ll have all kinds of reasons to hate each other and point fingers, etc etc.

Next reset, go for the dominating server after the first few days, and see where it puts you. IoJ and SF were much better off because of it. We didn’t manage to do it 100% of the time, hell we barely did it over 50% of the time, but we tried to make it a goal, and everyone was better off because of it.

The first week we did it, 1st 2nd and 3rd was within 2k points or something crazy, and it was Tuesday or Wednesday!

You can either do it, and have fun, or you can keep finding reasons not do, and write 4-5 paragraph stories about it on the forums, and be no better off than you were to start.

imsodonovan.5183:

FC catapulting and ramming a wall that cannot be destroyed.

….well played you guys.

I dunno what idiot built the ram but the catapult was in fact damaging the wall to the left of the wall which could not be damaged. I should know, that’s my cute tree face you have targeted.

Crimson Magdelana.9024:

The underlining point here is simply this; DR has trolled/farmed/belittled IoJ long enough with excuses, videos (Remember when Noqq/AD/Bsty posted all the silly video intro posts to a video of you farming half empty servers that have now ceased?), and berated IoJ for long enough that the bros have been blessed with the matchup of our dreams.

AND DR IS LOSING! Where’s the videos?

Didn’t realize you were such a big fan.

Helping DR defend IoJ’s Hill Keep on 6/2
ADQQSty vs IoJ/FC Montage

The first half of the second movie is our old matchup, the second half is the new matchup.

GavinGoodrich.1382:

Look, I like FC and SR and i’m sure you guys are all nice people but SF and IoJ already proved it in previous weeks, and i’m sure other servers have done it already in weeks before that:

If you team up on the bigger server, or at least the one with more advantages (like more oceanic coverage), you will have a much closer match. A more entertaining match for all 3 servers.

If you go after the other server, the one not dominating, you’ll have all kinds of reasons to hate each other and point fingers, etc etc.

Next reset, go for the dominating server after the first few days, and see where it puts you. IoJ and SF were much better off because of it. We didn’t manage to do it 100% of the time, hell we barely did it over 50% of the time, but we tried to make it a goal, and everyone was better off because of it.

The first week we did it, 1st 2nd and 3rd was within 2k points or something crazy, and it was Tuesday or Wednesday!

You can either do it, and have fun, or you can keep finding reasons not do, and write 4-5 paragraph stories about it on the forums, and be no better off than you were to start.

Pretty much what I do. Looks like some people spend more time on the forums than actually playing lol. Enjoy the game for what it is and what makes you happy, if its fighting doors or killing enemies.

The logic in this thread is basically like any other match up thread..
Our Players>Your players
Our server> Your server
The forum warrioring is fun and all but some people are taking it too much to heart

Crimson Magdelana.9024:

IoJ/DR/SF.

Lets have some fun. Make it so Anet. SF hates IoJ for “playing for second” and I’m sure DR has a bit of disdain for SF taking their spot in T6. DR/IoJ is pretty much like a divorce gone terribly wrong. Those three together would melt a server. But it would be equal enough to be fun for all.

Didn’t that matchup already happen?

Edit: Sorry, it was DH, not DR we were in with IoJ.

rawrcommentaboutoceaniccoveragezergingrabblerabblerabble

What I see happening is IoJ/Ferg hitting DR during our off-hours. But DR being DR, some nights we have a lot, the other nights we have four. Not much you can do. I’ve been hopping to FC during that time, it’s pretty easy to cap over their whole map because they have three defenders. Only then though does IoJ make a push on that BL. It’s not a bad tactic, but someones got to get the short end of the stick. Again, not much you can do.

Anyways, it’s been fun. Love the fact that there’s always players to fight, and decent sized groups. IoJ has been proving tough to string out, they stay together well and when one comes they all seem to come. They’re dedication to staying together is extremely high, in fact earlier today while cutting off reinforcements, an IoJ ran completely by another IoJ and I during a fight. Just left that poor guardian. You guys must have solid communication so props. I hope DR adopts this tactic to some extent, we don’t seem to do the greatest on not overextending.

It’s been fun, thanks.

Tots.3056:

IoJ has been proving tough to string out, they stay together well and when one comes they all seem to come. They’re dedication to staying together is extremely high

Yep, it’s been generally pretty hard to extend and string out IoJ’s numbers to thin them out. That’s good leadership and discipline.

Gab Superstar.4059:

I am also a bit surprised that you think because Oozo posts videos of ADQQSty killing IoJ players it’s some kind of personal insult towards you. Oozo posts the videos because many people enjoy watching them.

Although i enjoyed watching it…i cant help but think this is personal to my guild

playard.6035:

TL; DR

NOICE JOB. (= w=)b

Ur uzn awl kindz a big wurdz (ill probably understand this better when i wake up)

What my post was pointing out is that, we had maybe 25? people in your map, your hills had paper gates (WHICH we realised after we got the outer wall down) It took 3 catas longer than i expected to get outer down, and we ended up getting the gate down faster (i now know paper gate over reinforced walls erryday) no you guys didnt have mortars, not even cannons, there was no upgrades going. But 1 ac behind that inner gate should be able to hit our catapults…that would have just ruined our day.
Thats why i hate trying that spot with so few people (2 rangers and an ele, 3 skills that can barely hit a well placed ac) Hills should not be that easy to take >< Though im not calling out your whole server, as ive seen when DR defends…they do not make it easy and we generally win with just pure numbers (I.E My failed rush on Jerries, we didnt wipe because we had so many, and when we lost 6+ catas, 2 acs and a treb to Klovan, which should NEVER be that hard to take)

DR need to see their borderlands as their homeland, why be attacking someone elses when your own one is getting messed up? I myself and many other IoJ commanders, if we see our borderlands flipping colour, we call all the troops back, IoJ borderlands has always been, and will always be the number 1 priority…(SM being at the bottom of that list >:O)

And i actually laughed at you guys complaining about upgrades…you do not start an upgrade on a camp/tower/keep expecting to see it last 24 hours, OF COURSE it is going to flip some time, yes it hurts, yes its sad to see keeps flip back to paper but hey, thats WvW!!! We’ve all sunk 1000s of gold into WvW, if youre complaining about upgrades you might as well just leave…Everyones paid for upgrades, everyones gotten frustrated when they see their keep flip

Derron, the commander that spent all not getting a waypoint up and fortifying IoJ lowlands He KNEW he wouldnt be on to defend it, but he still sunk his money into that corner hoping our NA guys will get a chance to defend it, but we all knew itd fall eventually.

shrugs most of the time when we have something resembling even numbers we do defend and upgrade… if your already outnumbered meh… find a good fight instead… having a fun fight keeps people fighting fighting 5 against 20+ people usually log.

I got off from work early today logged in around 12 pm cst to see this massive fighting force we had… 5 people in DR bl and about 10 in Eternal.. it is what it is.

I enjoyed the fights we had… laughed my butt off when we rampaged into IOJ flipped all the camps a few towers and then just had fun… we tossed 2 trebs down against garrison keep doors (right against them*) then just fought IOJ as they ran out… it was fun and more people came out to play on our side.

Some of you are still playing to win… I think most of DR (note: I am not a spokesperson for the server this is my opinion) plays for fun fights… if we accomplish some objectives great… if not but we killed a bunch of enemies… great.
Either way we had fun, BP said it best I think… our strategy is incomprehensible because nobody knows what we are about to do… think Vikings with ADHD.

This thread is priceless. After MONTHS of DR talking smack to IoJ back when we were stuck in the DH-DR-IOJ matchup, Dr shows their true colors the instant they start losing. Yes DR, your losses are all because of our Oceanic presence, and nothing to do with you AT ALL!

Stay free.

Darek.1836:

LifeForce all you told us is that you dont understand what’s happening

I was only referring to the QQing about IoJ dominating (by 50k and still growing) cuz we got 3-4 hrs of night coverage and others don’t. If I have skipped any more important QQing then; my deepest apologies !

Pssh all you kids need to stop talking and start playing. After all the whole time we, IoJ, were getting beat, we were getting better. … then again maybe if DR would stop spending so much time on this thread trash talking, they might get “better” or worse depending on how you wanna look at it :P

spconder.2489:

This thread is priceless. After MONTHS of DR talking smack to IoJ back when we were stuck in the DH-DR-IOJ matchup, Dr shows their true colors the instant they start losing. Yes DR, your losses are all because of our Oceanic presence, and nothing to do with you AT ALL!

Stay free.

That’t probably because for months and months we continuously stomped you. Congrats on your improved NA presence since last we fought, it’s is nice to not see the outmanned buff on IoJ during every single primetime. Also congrats on remaining to be the only server below t4 with a massive oceanic presence, maybe now you guys can stop dropping after 5 tiers and actually go back to being a solid higher tier server. Unless DR gets massive oceanic and EU transfers of at least 50 or so people, we will never survive again above t6/t7. Every one is entitled to their own opinions but there is only so much a 6 hour NA primetime can accomplish, no matter how good it is, there are still 18 hours in the day.

spconder.2489:

This thread is priceless. After MONTHS of DR talking smack to IoJ back when we were stuck in the DH-DR-IOJ matchup, Dr shows their true colors the instant they start losing. Yes DR, your losses are all because of our Oceanic presence, and nothing to do with you AT ALL!

Stay free.

This is priceless… apparently we scarred you so badly that you nursed a grudge about a video game… here is a free tip turn it off and go outside you need perspective on life.

Edit: oh and IOJ seriously im a solo ranger… are you that afraid you run off to bring back friends…

CrazyCanuck.4265:

spconder.2489:

This thread is priceless. After MONTHS of DR talking smack to IoJ back when we were stuck in the DH-DR-IOJ matchup, Dr shows their true colors the instant they start losing. Yes DR, your losses are all because of our Oceanic presence, and nothing to do with you AT ALL!

Stay free.

That’t probably because for months and months we continuously stomped you. Congrats on your improved NA presence since last we fought, it’s is nice to not see the outmanned buff on IoJ during every single primetime. Also congrats on remaining to be the only server below t4 with a massive oceanic presence, maybe now you guys can stop dropping after 5 tiers and actually go back to being a solid higher tier server. Unless DR gets massive oceanic and EU transfers of at least 50 or so people, we will never survive again above t6/t7. Every one is entitled to their own opinions but there is only so much a 6 hour NA primetime can accomplish, no matter how good it is, there are still 18 hours in the day.

Oh, I see. You’re just mad that we’re not always outmanned and you can’t zerg farm us for easy badges anymore. You can wave charts in my face all you want, but i hope you realize that those charts also show that you aren’t able to beat us even when our friends down under aren’t there to help us.

You can trash talk all you want, but don’t get mad when it’s shown that you can’t back it up.

OMG look at our zerg gaiz!..gaiz?

Reality.1025:

OMG look at our zerg gaiz!..gaiz?

Made the mistake of trying to fight your longbow warrior 1 on 1. Saw the rest of you guys coming from the champs bridge a bit too late; and then I got crippled.

All I hear is:

Huhuhuhuhuhu! I’m the best, but I cannot beat them. Huhhuhuhu! I don’t cry. SNIFF. They don’t have tactics but I still lose. OK I’ll just play for second. Huhhuhuhuhu! I hope we will be in lower tier so we can stomp them and I would be the greatest! SNIFF

Tukmolytes.3467:

All I hear is:

Huhuhuhuhuhu! I’m the greatest, but I cannot beat them. Huhhuhuhu! I don’t cry. SNIFF. They suck but I lose. OK I’ll just play for second. Huhhuhuhuhu!

Maybe you should change your name to Tribo Troglodyte, because you’re showing all the mental capacity of one with these blanket statements and generalizations.