When all 8 classes are running these builds which classes do the most damage (if you could please rank them 1-8th)? Is the difference in damage meaningful, would you suggest a reroll to move higher on the list? Do any of the classes bring non-DPS support that makes up for being lower on the list (reflects, group healing, etc)?
Thanks!
Anet likely didn’t want to remove the armor stats entirely because…well,
we’ve all seen what happens in games where there’s no disadvantage to taking your pants off.
Anyway it’s hard to rank, because so much of DPS is situational. Mesmers for example are very hard to rank— if you assume three iSwordsmen are out for the entire fight and never get destroyed Mesmer DPS is great. But somehow most speed running guilds aren’t running Mesmers anymore, because bosses usually die before you can get your phantasms up, and Mesmer DPS is bottom tier without their phants.
You’ll also get different answers for single target vs. AoE (thieves and necros move up against single target, for example).
I didn’t know the meta has changed since then. Please rank the classes from 1-8th using current meta builds or the DPS builds you are familiar with.
Anet likely didn’t want to remove the armor stats entirely because…well,
we’ve all seen what happens in games where there’s no disadvantage to taking your pants off.
@ OP: It’s not about which class/build has the highest personal DPS. Personal DPS is meaningless. What matters is highest PARTY DPS. And in answer to that….
Our daily dungeon tours finish quickly because our members build their toons towards maximizing DPS. Exotic zerk trinkets, weapons, and armor with scholars is the minimum gear requirement, although ascended zerk is preferred.
Our group comp is usually:
- 1 LH Ele (10/25/10/25/0, s/x),
- 1 Staff Ele (30/20/10/10/0),
- 1 Thief (30/30/0/0/10, d/d + sw/p),
- 1 War (30/0/0/20/20, a/m + horn), and
- 1 other.
Depending on the dungeon, that “other” is one of the following:
- LH Ele (25/10/10/25/0, s/x),
- Guard (20/25/0/0/25, sw/f + GS),
- Mes (10/30/0/20/10, sw/f + OH sw), or
- Ranger (30/25/0/15/0, sw/horn, feline pet).
Applicants must trial with one of these classes/builds; that means no Necros or Engis.
3 ele, 1 war, 1 thief: all AC, all CoE
2 ele, 1 war, 1 thief, 1 guard: TA up/fwd, CM 1/3, HotW 1, SE 1/3
2 ele, 1 war, 1 thief, 1 mes: Arah 2/3, CoF 1/2
For record runs the group comps are sometimes different, but normal 17 path, 4 hour tours are with the above group comps. There will sometimes be a ranger, but never a necro or engi. Those classes are just unnecessary in high-end PvE.
Absolute highest party DPS is 3x Ele, 1 War, 1 Ranger, but we don’t usually run that because a Thief so useful.
From highest to lowest its probably something along the lines of:
1. Ele
2. thief (single target)
3. everything else
4. mesmer
Poor mesmer
But but… if the phantasms don’t die… and if you let me summon them all before the fight starts… and if the sun is at exactly the right angle, and a quaggan jumps at the start of the fight, then the DPS is good!
(also to be fair, mesmer against Lupicus is still good DPS)
From highest to lowest its probably something along the lines of:
1. Ele
2. thief (single target)
3. everything else
4. mesmer
Poor mesmer
But but… if the phantasms don’t die… and if you let me summon them all before the fight starts… and if the sun is at exactly the right angle, and a quaggan jumps at the start of the fight, then the DPS is good!
(also to be fair, mesmer against Lupicus is still good DPS)
Unfortunately alphard, lupicus, and fractal bosses are the only situations where mesmer is useful. And even on those bosses its for reflects and TW, not personal DPS.
From highest to lowest its probably something along the lines of:
1. Ele
2. thief (single target)
3. everything else
4. mesmer
Poor mesmer
But but… if the phantasms don’t die… and if you let me summon them all before the fight starts… and if the sun is at exactly the right angle, and a quaggan jumps at the start of the fight, then the DPS is good!
(also to be fair, mesmer against Lupicus is still good DPS)
Unfortunately alphard, lupicus, and fractal bosses are the only situations where mesmer is useful. And even on those bosses its for reflects and TW, not personal DPS.
From highest to lowest its probably something along the lines of:
1. Ele
2. thief (single target)
3. everything else
4. mesmer
Poor mesmer
But but… if the phantasms don’t die… and if you let me summon them all before the fight starts… and if the sun is at exactly the right angle, and a quaggan jumps at the start of the fight, then the DPS is good!
(also to be fair, mesmer against Lupicus is still good DPS)
Unfortunately alphard, lupicus, and fractal bosses are the only situations where mesmer is useful. And even on those bosses its for reflects and TW, not personal DPS.
But somehow most speed running guilds aren’t running Mesmers anymore
Ill have you know that two of Europe’s leading speedrunning guilds have mesmers in charge!
But that’s because you guys are portal masters! :P But seriously, in situations where you need reflects, mesmers are still good at dealing damage. I still bring mine in many runs too.
So sad that everyone thinks necros DPS sucks….
They also think necros group utility sucks….
Dredge=well of corruption… Just saying….
Mesmer sword AA chain rips boons off the enemies and they pack reflects.
Necromancer DPS doesn’t suck. In fact, it’s slightly better than a warrior’s, but they don’t possess banners or the ability to cleave 24/7.
The main issue with necros is that they can’t reliably cleave and sorely lack group support skills (and the ones they have are outshone by those of other classes). It’s not about raw damage.
So sad that everyone thinks necros DPS sucks….
They also think necros group utility sucks….
Dredge=well of corruption… Just saying….
Necro DPS does suck compared to elementalists and thieves. Necro utility does suck compared to every other class. . Well of corruption can remove a maximum of 25 boons per 40 seconds. A mesmer can remove a maximum of 73 boons per 40 seconds for the same amount of utilities (sword AA + null field).
So sad that everyone thinks necros DPS sucks….
They also think necros group utility sucks….
Dredge=well of corruption… Just saying….
Necro DPS does suck compared to elementalists and thieves. Necro utility does suck compared to every other class. . Well of corruption can remove a maximum of 25 boons per 40 seconds. A mesmer can remove a maximum of 73 boons per 40 seconds for the same amount of utilities (sword AA + null field).
They can remove boons but they can’t change em to conditions…. Lets just say dredge on my necro is easier than dredge on my mesmer….
So sad that everyone thinks necros DPS sucks….
They also think necros group utility sucks….
Dredge=well of corruption… Just saying….
It’s not really what you can do, it’s what the group needs to get by. If you have utility, that’s cool, but can they get by without it? if so cool, lets go damage. If i can get more damage by not utilizing that utility and I don’t have to utilize that utility, it’s simply not ideal. And Ideal is what we’re talking here.
If you notice the list anierna posted you’ll see they basically take the best damage with the ele’s and war, then pull in the utility as it’s needed. When it’s not needed it’s dropped for the higher damage options. That’s why necros are left behind, their damage isn’t high enough and their utility isn’t needed enough /shrug.
So sad that everyone thinks necros DPS sucks….
They also think necros group utility sucks….
Dredge=well of corruption… Just saying….
Necro DPS does suck compared to elementalists and thieves. Necro utility does suck compared to every other class. . Well of corruption can remove a maximum of 25 boons per 40 seconds. A mesmer can remove a maximum of 73 boons per 40 seconds for the same amount of utilities (sword AA + null field).
They can remove boons but they can’t change em to conditions…. Lets just say dredge on my necro is easier than dredge on my mesmer….
Don’t quote me on this, but I’m pretty sure that the damage dredge take from their reflected attacks is much higher than whatever damage the conditions from WoC could do.
So sad that everyone thinks necros DPS sucks….
They also think necros group utility sucks….
Dredge=well of corruption… Just saying….
Necro DPS does suck compared to elementalists and thieves. Necro utility does suck compared to every other class. . Well of corruption can remove a maximum of 25 boons per 40 seconds. A mesmer can remove a maximum of 73 boons per 40 seconds for the same amount of utilities (sword AA + null field).
They can remove boons but they can’t change em to conditions…. Lets just say dredge on my necro is easier than dredge on my mesmer….
Don’t quote me on this, but I’m pretty sure that the damage dredge take from their reflected attacks is much higher than whatever damage the conditions from WoC could do.
It’s not really the conditions that kill them… I’m not a condi necro…. but it turns might to weakness… Which is pretty awesome… You guys can hate necros all you want but I have seen some very good necros in dungeons.
So sad that everyone thinks necros DPS sucks….
They also think necros group utility sucks….
Dredge=well of corruption… Just saying….
Necro DPS does suck compared to elementalists and thieves. Necro utility does suck compared to every other class. . Well of corruption can remove a maximum of 25 boons per 40 seconds. A mesmer can remove a maximum of 73 boons per 40 seconds for the same amount of utilities (sword AA + null field).
They can remove boons but they can’t change em to conditions…. Lets just say dredge on my necro is easier than dredge on my mesmer….
Don’t quote me on this, but I’m pretty sure that the damage dredge take from their reflected attacks is much higher than whatever damage the conditions from WoC could do.
It’s not really the conditions that kill them… I’m not a condi necro…. but it turns might to weakness… Which is pretty awesome… You guys can hate necros all you want but I have seen some very good necros in dungeons.
Define good. It doesn’t matter if I’m playing with the best necro in the world. Hes still less effective than a better than average elementalist.
So sad that everyone thinks necros DPS sucks….
They also think necros group utility sucks….
Dredge=well of corruption… Just saying….
Necro DPS does suck compared to elementalists and thieves. Necro utility does suck compared to every other class. . Well of corruption can remove a maximum of 25 boons per 40 seconds. A mesmer can remove a maximum of 73 boons per 40 seconds for the same amount of utilities (sword AA + null field).
They can remove boons but they can’t change em to conditions…. Lets just say dredge on my necro is easier than dredge on my mesmer….
Don’t quote me on this, but I’m pretty sure that the damage dredge take from their reflected attacks is much higher than whatever damage the conditions from WoC could do.
It’s not really the conditions that kill them… I’m not a condi necro…. but it turns might to weakness… Which is pretty awesome… You guys can hate necros all you want but I have seen some very good necros in dungeons.
Define good. It doesn’t matter if I’m playing with the best necro in the world. Hes still less effective than a better than average elementalist.
And i see so many eles running healing builds in dungeons… yay for them right?
Warrior:
GS + axe/mace with 30/x/x/x/20 hurts like a truck in PVE. Nevermind the banners + fury upkeep.
Ele:
Might stacks abuse. Overall abuse with conjured weapons.
I like to put Thief as a third since they have the highest against single boss targets. But they don’t really have decent party support aside from smoke fields and blast finishers.
SBI – Thief and the occasional Guardian & Warrior.
Warrior:
GS + axe/mace with 30/x/x/x/20 hurts like a truck in PVE. Nevermind the banners + fury upkeep.
Warriors used to be top notch dps class but that was many months ago.
The only thing making them somewhat useful is that their self buffing is really strong so most of the time they got more might than the others in the party and therefor more dps. In organised groups however warriors are real lacklusters. Lets hope anet does something about that.
Everything is changing this Tuesday so no point talking about it right now. There is going to be a complete redesign of all builds. GW 3 is coming out…
Everything is changing this Tuesday so no point talking about it right now. There is going to be a complete redesign of all builds. GW 3 is coming out…
Everything is changing this Tuesday so no point talking about it right now. There is going to be a complete redesign of all builds. GW 3 is coming out…
From what I know, their DPS is similar to (possibly a little better than) warriors, but the fatal flaw with ranger sword is that you cannot interrupt the sword auto for, say a dodge or even moving normally, and if you’re as unfortunate as me, the 2nd or 3rd skills in the chain could cause you to leap off an edge to your doom.
They’re capable of applying 20 stacks of vuln in under a second, but it doesn’t last long and you can’t sustain it unless you’re scoring kills left right and centre.
A remnant of times past.
“Memories are nice, but that’s all they are.”
It’s like a mini warrior, just 200 times funnier to play. Harder.
Btw, you can dodge inbetween/before autoattacks. Just need proper timing.
They’re op at lupi
E: Oh btw, remorseless is very situational. And it doesn’t matter if your vuln doesn’t last long, things die fast enough anyway. I prefer the straight dps increase of signet of the wild, even if it’s only 8 secs.
Try it with an offhand axe at lupi
Here you can observe one of the two people in the game who know how to play ranger. He, along with the other four members, have auto attack turned on. Turning auto attack off is just asking to lose DPS. This is actually a big reason why sword ranger is overhyped, because next to no one can (consistently) pull off the paper DPS in practice.
