Guild Wars 2

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/upcoming-skill-and-trait-changes/

Discuss

On stun breakers…

“We removed some and spread them out across more utility types. For example, the elementalist’s stun breakers have always been loaded up on cantrips, so we spread some out to the other categories like glyphs and signets. This way most builds have at least one viable stun breaker.”

As someone who runs several glyphs in my PvE build, I don’t need stun breakers. So I hope these stun breakers don’t come with a nerf to my glyphs’ primary functions.

“Enemies under Torment will take damage periodically; as they move, they’ll take even more damage”

New class: Bloodseeker

The new torment condition gives an unfair advantage to ranged classes. They should have just kept the way things are right now and stick with buffing confusion instead, since confusion is non-discriminatory among classes and melee/ranged

@Darkace:

As I read it, I thought they are removing stun breakers from some of the cantrips. That’s your nerf, nothing else should be touched on them otherwise (based upon the article).

This is good news as I don’t want to be forced into a cantrip build for WvW (which I currently am).

Vol.5241:

The new torment condition gives an unfair advantage to ranged classes. They should have just kept the way things are right now and stick with buffing confusion instead, since confusion is non-discriminatory among classes and melee/ranged

It will work both ways. A ranged class will take damage trying to kite you, just like you’d take damage trying to catch a kiter. I think we’ll have to see how it plays out.

The disappointing part of Torment is that it’ll be limited to thieves, mesmers, and necros. Two of those classes didn’t really need a buff by getting Torment. I think there were better choices including warrior.

I think whatever they do, there are going to be a lot of pihssed off players out there who’s builds will be nerfed.

juno.1840:

As I read it, I thought they are removing stun breakers from some of the cantrips. That’s your nerf, nothing else should be touched on them otherwise (based upon the article).

This is good news as I don’t want to be forced into a cantrip build for WvW (which I currently am).

I understand that part of it, and I do empathize with those who want something other than Cantrips for stun breakers. My concern is that if [insert skill here] was just right before (hypothetically), then that same skill also being a stun breaker might make it a bit too good, and thus warrant a nerf of some kind.

It’s not anything I’m going to lose sleep over, but selfishly I’d rather the primary function of glyphs (or whatever other skill gets changed) be nerfed for the same of making them also break stuns.

Hoping for nice engineer and ranger changes!

Wow, sounds pretty interesting. Hopefully the whole torment thing is primarily going to be used with Necros, because thieves and mesmers being able to punish you for movement seems a little extreme. But we will have to wait and find out I guess.

I think the expansion of stun breakers can also really help, and it’s something people have wanted for a long time. It’s not as much of a problem on some classes, but engi in particular could see a big boost from this.

Can’t wait to go back to the drawing board with all my professions!

That weakness buff is HUGE, HUGE, HUGE to a thief.

juno.1840:

Vol.5241:

The new torment condition gives an unfair advantage to ranged classes. They should have just kept the way things are right now and stick with buffing confusion instead, since confusion is non-discriminatory among classes and melee/ranged

It will work both ways. A ranged class will take damage trying to kite you, just like you’d take damage trying to catch a kiter. I think we’ll have to see how it plays out.

The disappointing part of Torment is that it’ll be limited to thieves, mesmers, and necros. Two of those classes didn’t really need a buff by getting Torment. I think there were better choices including warrior.

A ranged class has the option of just standing still.
A melee class simply doesn’t (especially against any competent ranged class)

Two of the game’s strongest duelist gets exclusive access to the new condition , punishing those who make a subtle attempt at movement whilst they’re insanely mobile and potent in trickery.

#Keyboardturnersrejoice!

TheOneNOnlyGeneralBama.9586:

Two of the game’s strongest duelist gets exclusive access to the new condition , punishing those who make a subtle attempt at movement whilst they’re insanely mobile and potent in trickery.

#Keyboardturnersrejoice!

Yeah, that was my fear. Let’s wait and see though, they may have to make some serious sacrifices to get viable access to it. For all we know it could be horribly weak too, but I share your concern.

TheOneNOnlyGeneralBama.9586:

Two of the game’s strongest duelist gets exclusive access to the new condition , punishing those who make a subtle attempt at movement whilst they’re insanely mobile and potent in trickery.

#Keyboardturnersrejoice!

Yeah agree. I think warriors should have gotten torment instead of thieves and mesmers. Arguably maybe guardians but they are already in a good place. Thieves have no issue getting to a mobile class and jumping them from behind so I’m not sure why torment was added to their arsenal.

juno.1840:

Vol.5241:

The new torment condition gives an unfair advantage to ranged classes. They should have just kept the way things are right now and stick with buffing confusion instead, since confusion is non-discriminatory among classes and melee/ranged

It will work both ways. A ranged class will take damage trying to kite you, just like you’d take damage trying to catch a kiter. I think we’ll have to see how it plays out.

The disappointing part of Torment is that it’ll be limited to thieves, mesmers, and necros. Two of those classes didn’t really need a buff by getting Torment. I think there were better choices including warrior.

Actually, I can see it being fitting to Necros and Mesmers, but then again I’m biased. Mesmer was THE primary control class in GW1, followed by Necro, and then Ele, Ranger, and Sin. IMO, anyway, although most would probably agree with Mesmer being first in the list.

Still, mesmers and necros need something like this to help differentiate their play a bit.

From the little bit they gave us in the article, I’m underwhelmed at this point. This doesn’t seem that huge, but then again I’m sure they left plenty out. Can’t give it all away, right? I’m not getting overly excited, or concerned, I’m just waiting for the patch to hit and then will weed through the notes and such at that time.

2 Most OP classes in game get another significant buff… They really want us just as standing meaty free kills for mesmers/thieves. There is no other explanation for this new condi.

I don’t understand why thieves would get torment too. They’re already the fastest class and hard to catch as it is, no it seems you would get punished too if you try and chase after them.

Of course we don’t know how exactly the new condition is gonna work yet or how powerful it is but that is just my initial assumption.

Penguin.5197:

I don’t understand why thieves would get torment too. They’re already the fastest class and hard to catch as it is, no it seems you would get punished too if you try and chase after them.

Of course we don’t know how exactly the new condition is gonna work yet or how powerful it is but that is just my initial assumption.

I raced a warrior on my thief while farming coffers, beat me to almost every one, I even used Inf strike and shadowstep to try and win. GS/Sword+warhorn is more mobile than a thief sadly. Maybe I’m just bad but they are almost on par with each other depending on the situation.

Wow. Speaking WvW/PvP wise…this does not make any sense whatsoever. Thieves and Mesmers are already the deadliest 1v1, imo, and now they have access to torment? Are they planning on nerfing some of their other abilities before they add this condition?

biting my tongue on this until I see the patch notes.

I am hoping for staff ele buff…or scepter….focus…maybe even redesigning the arcana tree so we don’t need to go 20 or 30 into it thus opening more options……..but of course Hope in this game does no good.

as I said, I will wait and see

LilMcGinley.3890:

Penguin.5197:

I don’t understand why thieves would get torment too. They’re already the fastest class and hard to catch as it is, no it seems you would get punished too if you try and chase after them.

Of course we don’t know how exactly the new condition is gonna work yet or how powerful it is but that is just my initial assumption.

I raced a warrior on my thief while farming coffers, beat me to almost every one, I even used Inf strike and shadowstep to try and win. GS/Sword+warhorn is more mobile than a thief sadly. Maybe I’m just bad but they are almost on par with each other depending on the situation.

Well one of the biggest advantages with thief is Z-axis teleports, of which warriors have none. So given flat terrain, yes a warrior might beat you in a straight line but that’s about it.

Jericho.4521:

LilMcGinley.3890:

Penguin.5197:

I don’t understand why thieves would get torment too. They’re already the fastest class and hard to catch as it is, no it seems you would get punished too if you try and chase after them.

Of course we don’t know how exactly the new condition is gonna work yet or how powerful it is but that is just my initial assumption.

I raced a warrior on my thief while farming coffers, beat me to almost every one, I even used Inf strike and shadowstep to try and win. GS/Sword+warhorn is more mobile than a thief sadly. Maybe I’m just bad but they are almost on par with each other depending on the situation.

Well one of the biggest advantages with thief is Z-axis teleports, of which warriors have none. So given flat terrain, yes a warrior might beat you in a straight line but that’s about it.

True, but there are very few places (in WvW) where a thief can port up.

I’m waiting to see how the implement this condition. I think a lot of people are overthinking this, not to mention, ANet picked these classes for a reason we can’t clearly see.

not gunna lie, in wvw always getting completely owned by thieves, the added cond and how it sounds like it works doesn’t make any kitten sense. hell their stealth and teleporting tricks alone are op, now we get punished if we even move lol this is dumb

Before everyone QQs too much about mesmers and thieves, there is still a distinct possibility that the OP builds will get nerfed to the ground.

Some the torment condition on mesmers (at least) makes sense because they are 1. one or the two second slowest classes and 2. have no real conditions since confusion was nerfed.

Hmm if there’s a new condition, what does this condition turn into when converted to a boon?

What is this new game these guys are playing? Please let me know so I can try it out.

It surely isn’t the same one I have been playing. If it was they would not be making some of the described changes.

Well, i think this will be the most interesting update since…. probably the Halloween one. It looks promising on paper, but all will depend on implementation and execution, so we’ll see,

It fits the thief because it is a shadow condition. Who else than a necro or thief would this fit? No idea why people complain it doesn’t fit the thief when this is the primary shadow-themed class in the game. I’m surprised the mesmer gets it too, doesn’t really fit with their light reflection theme and light fields etc but I suppose they indeed did need an extra condition.

Just like thieves need more conditions to make condi thief viable. Currently all a condi thief does is stack bleeds and this is simply not viable neither in pve nor pvp. This torment might change some things but I’m not judging till I see patchnotes AND play.

And please don’t complain about backstab thieves or acro sword thieves now becoming OP with torment. Makes you look silly because those are powerbuilds while torment is a condition. Let that sink in for a minute

TheOneNOnlyGeneralBama.9586:

Two of the game’s strongest duelist gets exclusive access to the new condition , punishing those who make a subtle attempt at movement whilst they’re insanely mobile and potent in trickery.

#Keyboardturnersrejoice!

I agree.

Not sure about this update….

How about adding NEW SKILLS??>
Sell them via gemstore via rng chests.

shimmerless.4560:

Vyxion.6358:

It fits the thief because it is a shadow condition. Who else than a necro or thief would this fit? No idea why people complain it doesn’t fit the thief when this is the primary shadow-themed class in the game. I’m surprised the mesmer gets it too, doesn’t really fit with their light reflection theme and light fields etc but I suppose they indeed did need an extra condition.

Just like thieves need more conditions to make condi thief viable. Currently all a condi thief does is stack bleeds and this is simply not viable neither in pve nor pvp. This torment might change some things but I’m not judging till I see patchnotes AND play.

And please don’t complain about backstab thieves or acro sword thieves now becoming OP with torment. Makes you look silly because those are powerbuilds while torment is a condition. Let that sink in for a minute

Mes has one Light Field (and given the other was a bugged tooltip there’s a good question as to whether this was intentional) so I’m not sure where you’re getting the Mes = Light thing from.

Considering pretty much all their spells seem to have light reflection animations to them. Guess you missed that.

Everything a mesmer casts has light emitting prisms or butterflies coming out of it. And some stuf resembles the workings of mirrors.

This is how I got the mesmer = light thing.

Please Arena net do what you did in Guild Wars 1. Make a PvE skill & PvP skill. seperate the two. My suggestion is to make one for PvP, another for WvW, and another for PvE.
Do not merge WvW & PvE. They are entirely different.

Example: As for Elementalist (I do not main one) but I saw this change that brought frustration to many PvE elems. Ride the lightning was nerfed from 1500 to 1200 in all types. This is a great change for PvP & maybe WvW, but keep it for PvE.

tl;dr Make separate skill changes for PvE/WvW/PvE.

scala.1670:

Please Arena net do what you did in Guild Wars 1. Make a PvE skill & PvP skill. seperate the two. My suggestion is to make one for PvP, another for WvW, and another for PvE.
Do not merge WvW & PvE. They are entirely different.

Example: As for Elementalist (I do not main one) but I saw this change that brought frustration to many PvE elems. Ride the lightning was nerfed from 1500 to 1200 in all types. This is a great change for PvP & maybe WvW, but keep it for PvE.

tl;dr Make separate skill changes for PvE/WvW/PvE.

Pretty sure this was intended to be 1200 in the first place

Mighty Assasin.3816:

Hmm if there’s a new condition, what does this condition turn into when converted to a boon?

swiftness?

TooBz.3065:

Before everyone QQs too much about mesmers and thieves, there is still a distinct possibility that the OP builds will get nerfed to the ground.

Some the torment condition on mesmers (at least) makes sense because they are 1. one or the two second slowest classes and 2. have no real conditions since confusion was nerfed.

I don’t think they will nerf anything. The way I read it is that Anet wants to entice thieves/mesmers into trying conditions builds. This game will be broken though if those two classes get access to torment without having to sacrifice anything.

This is walking on thin ice here, I hope Anet really thinks this through.

Amun Ra.6435:

TooBz.3065:

Before everyone QQs too much about mesmers and thieves, there is still a distinct possibility that the OP builds will get nerfed to the ground.

Some the torment condition on mesmers (at least) makes sense because they are 1. one or the two second slowest classes and 2. have no real conditions since confusion was nerfed.

I don’t think they will nerf anything. The way I read it is that Anet wants to entice thieves/mesmers into trying conditions builds. This game will be broken though if those two classes get access to torment without having to sacrifice anything.

This is walking on thin ice here, I hope Anet really thinks this through.

They will totally kitten it up , give Mesmer probably the strongest class in pvp torment , best idea ever.

Vol.5241:

A ranged class has the option of just standing still.
A melee class simply doesn’t (especially against any competent ranged class)

Then treat it the same way you’d treat any other debilitating condition…dodge it if you can and use a condition removal skill if you can’t.

Vyxion.6358:

It fits the thief because it is a shadow condition. Who else than a necro or thief would this fit? No idea why people complain it doesn’t fit the thief when this is the primary shadow-themed class in the game. I’m surprised the mesmer gets it too, doesn’t really fit with their light reflection theme and light fields etc but I suppose they indeed did need an extra condition.

Just like thieves need more conditions to make condi thief viable. Currently all a condi thief does is stack bleeds and this is simply not viable neither in pve nor pvp. This torment might change some things but I’m not judging till I see patchnotes AND play.

And please don’t complain about backstab thieves or acro sword thieves now becoming OP with torment. Makes you look silly because those are powerbuilds while torment is a condition. Let that sink in for a minute

Nothing you just said makes any sense. Sure if the condition was purely cosmetic lol. But the last part is just out of touch with reality…guessing you play a thief. Thief and mesmers are already the best class 1v1…tie even more damage to them just for moving doesn’t make sense.

TooBz.3065:

Mighty Assasin.3816:

Hmm if there’s a new condition, what does this condition turn into when converted to a boon?

swiftness?

Cripple = Swiftness
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Well_of_Power

Im wondering do the arenanet members even play the game ? to do such stupid changes , man i was hyped about this patch , thought its gonna be good, but this is kitten.

LilMcGinley.3890:

That weakness buff is HUGE, HUGE, HUGE to a thief.

Especially for warriors. It could equate to a huge reduction in direct damage.

Its funny how perma invis thiefs have been running around for months and the way we where given to combat them was a trap in WvW that no one uses, now they get a super condition added on, hopefully Anet will have traited it in, in such a way that it cannot be used whilst they are in perma invis,

I play a Mesmer a good bit also, and from what they are saying we also get it, this could be devastating to say the least, again hopefully its traited correctly, if its not, WvW is going to turn into Necro/Mesmer/Thief only.

In saying that, I cannot believe they over looked the Ranger yet again, how many topics have been made by people asking for the Ranger to be looked into, amazing really,

But that all aside, I wonder are they even going to look into the issues that have been raised by the masses on here, espically around there so called end game zones that drop no loot from enemies, id doubt it very much, what about perm content, seems a lot of time and effort goes into making content for 2 weeks at a time.

I guess NCSoft are just going to push as much money out of this game as they can before they pull the plug on the funding, the current trends are continuing this game will be dead by Christmas,

Let’s wait and see folks —-

For example, Torment, I really doubt they are just going to add this new condition to certain Mesmer and Thief skills/utilities without a trade-off of them losing out on other skills they have. (Now if they do indeed add Torment, without a trade-off, then they are totally NUTS – lol).

vizups.3824:

Im wondering do the arenanet members even play the game ? to do such stupid changes , man i was hyped about this patch , thought its gonna be good, but this is kitten.

You’re just thinking in extreme values here. Firstly, we do not know the magnitude of the new condition and its duration. Secondly, there is no guarantee that every mesmer, necro or thief will make much use of Torment. Thirdly, many existing traits and skills will be merged or rebalanced to maybe counter the effects of Torment. It could be that mesmer suddenly isn’t the “OP class” it once was.

Ok I Did It.2854:

I guess NCSoft are just going to push as much money out of this game as they can before they pull the plug on the funding, the current trends are continuing this game will be dead by Christmas,

/shaking my head

You people are amazing. You really are.

Amun Ra.6435:

TooBz.3065:

Before everyone QQs too much about mesmers and thieves, there is still a distinct possibility that the OP builds will get nerfed to the ground.

Some the torment condition on mesmers (at least) makes sense because they are 1. one or the two second slowest classes and 2. have no real conditions since confusion was nerfed.

I don’t think they will nerf anything. The way I read it is that Anet wants to entice thieves/mesmers into trying conditions builds. This game will be broken though if those two classes get access to torment without having to sacrifice anything.

This is walking on thin ice here, I hope Anet really thinks this through.

In a rare moment of optimism, I’m just saying wait and see.

The glamour mesmer was one of the strongest builds in WvW and it was nerfed into oblivion, so I know they can / will do it.

They said they were moving around some traits, i can see how reorganizing some of the Mesmer traits could really weaken the current builds.

Ision.3207:

Let’s wait and see folks —-

For example, Torment, I really doubt they are just going to add this new condition to certain Mesmer and Thief skills/utilities without a trade-off of them losing out on other skills they have. (Now if they do indeed add Torment, without a trade-off, then they are totally NUTS – lol).

Well I think that is what everyone is afraid of giving Anets past moves. None of the supposed “nerfs” to thieves and to an extent mesmers has made them any less deadly.

Different builds.

Let me repeat that.

Different builds.

Different builds.

The thing that everyone complaining always forgets about.

Mesmers and Thieves aren’t inherently better duelist classes. They do have, however, better duelist builds. There’s nothing that’s implying that Mesmers and Thieves will get Torment for their strongest builds – if anything, it’ll just open up new possibilities for condition builds, which Mesmers and Thieves are weak at. Also, both Mesmers and Thieves lack build diversity, and are pretty much stuck on one or two builds, so new food for conditions makes sense.

darkace.8925:

Ok I Did It.2854:

I guess NCSoft are just going to push as much money out of this game as they can before they pull the plug on the funding, the current trends are continuing this game will be dead by Christmas,

/shaking my head

You people are amazing. You really are.

I’ll join you darkace.

/shaking my head.

It is beyond ridiculous when posterss make unsubstantiated claims like this. I think I know how to fix it though. Here is my suggestion. If Anet gives everyone everything they want (even those that have completely opposite views), then Anet will flourish and become more successful than Bill Gates, world hunger will be solved, flowers will bloom worldwide, and Guild Wars 2 will become so insanely successful that all other games will just give up and close shop. The devil (also known as RNG) will be defeated and peace, like a blanket, will cover the earth.