Guild Wars 2

Chasind.3128:

Yes, just kill the mesmer & thief class because “they’re just so hard! they kill me to fast! OMG I need skillz to face them?! NERF THEM”

jalmari.3906:

I think anet simply went insane if they’re going to just give thief and mesmer new condition, especially condition like that. With current mechanics you need to MOVE to avoid their attacks (which somewhat instakill you if you don’t) and now you’d just get damage for doing it. Way to go. Clever. Good work etc.

I just hope this also means thief and mesmer get a meganerf at same time. i.e. Mesmer GS loses 20% dmg and vuln from autoattack and thief loses stealth from dagger 5.

the nice thing is in pvp one guy/girl said me:
“having fun mesmer? why don’t you try something that need skills”

the sad thing? i didn’t even need skill to kill him/her i didn’t even have to kite actually…

What we all need are buffs, not nerfs because usually when that happens there is some outcry that people’s builds don’t work as good as they used to & discovering an entirely new build is out of the question because they’d rather complain – But maybe the skills/traits that noone uses (because they were rendered useless in the past due to nerfs) are just getting buffed & it’s all going to be equally matched which it all should be – no more nerfs because of players laziness & lack of skill, Nerfing just makes players NOT want to play that class any longer regardless

But we won’t know anything truly until the changes are made

Overpowered…Guess we know who isn’t a Ranger.

Pixelpumpkin.4608:

Isaac.6041:

But this patch seems to be going to the opposite extreme of making everything overpowered.

How can “everything” be overpowered? Overpowered means that something or someone is powered over something or someone else…

Don’t worry. Ranger’s remain to make the others look better.

I’m sorry to say.

If the source is this “supposedly leaked” source : http://pastebin.com/2rrFg9pS ,then i honestly fail to understand how the Ranger was nerfed… I actually think it was boosted…

Aside from a reworked shadowtrap, nothing in those leaked notes looks good for thief. And before everyone who loves to complain about the OP thieves that oneshot them starts celebrating, the nerfs are all directed at things that aren’t d/p and d/d, so have fun running into even more backstab thieves.

Syrpharon.7491:

So basically with torment on your only option is:
Melee: immobilize the enemy and teleport / rushing / leaping via skills to it
Ranged: Hit from the distance of course.

In both ways we should consider a few things before allarming:
- Would evading count as movement or is just WASD?
- Will this Torment last only a few seconds?

If above are true, maybe is acceptable, because it should be meant to limit your options, not to make you a standing target :/

It is meant to force people to stand and fight, which is intended to help Necros. Thieves and Mesmers will hopefully only have very limited access to this condition while Necros get decent uptime with it.

I love how many people are crying that the sky is falling and they haven’t even seen the trait changes yet. The trait changes will affect all of this in significant ways. Let’s please put our “End of the World” signs down please til the update is live and the adults get a few hours to play around with it in sPvP.

The thief love.. guys.. can you dig it ? <3
/15char

Ranger longbow buff, hooray! Maybe it’ll finally outdamage the shortbow when it’s at (avoiding censor, lol bewbs) its max range? Spotter +80 precision, too bad you probably won’t be using it if you have a longbow. Bear damage (what damage?) not touched!

Madness: Guardians breaking stuns on OTHER CHARACTERS?! Who’s gonna spec deep into virtues for that trait now?

http://pastebin.com/2rrFg9pS

Because thieves werent OP already. Why dont we just call this Rift II thieves and necro builds. Nerfing ranger pets is just silly.

I don’t see a lot of thieves changing build for this new condition. Some will try it of course. It could be quite good for dungeons and stuff. Tank up and torment mobs. Why not?

As for mesmer, I wouldn’t worry about that either. Torment will be on weapon skill that almost nobody ever uses, the off-hand sword. On the other hand my main is a mesmer and I’m wondering how the hell I’m supposed dodge-roll my clones out while under Torment, never mind get away from a thief/necro team.

Which brings me to… Necro is clearly the winner here. The new DS skill and traits are going to have a lot of people crying if a necro is traited to auto-build DS. I dare say that necro/guardian will be tower door defense team while necro/thief will be the new roamers.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

what if …

PvE monsters are able to dodge?

Some enemy NPC’s can.

Amun Ra.6435:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

what if …

PvE monsters are able to dodge?

Some enemy NPC’s can.

Guess that guy never went to Southsun.

Amadan.9451:

does anybody realize that usually high condition damage means low burst damage? yeah you can’t move, but nobody is going to oneshot you!

You are assuming thief/mesmers will have to go full condition build to get torment. Yes, all is assumption right now. It is concerning, but I guess we will have to see.

Colly.4073:

And so it begins!….The mesmer changes haven’t even been introduced yet and the crybabies are at it. You kitten Whiner’s already had our only viable condition nerfed to the ground so give it a kitten rest.

I am sorry, you are a VERY bad mesmer if you were in any way dependent on confusion.

I LOVE the reducation on aftercast delay on skills that badly needed them – in particular Ele Staff and Ranger Longbow – but some appear missing (Thief Pistol/Shortbow and Warrior Longbow)

Overall, this will likely be the best balance patch that’s happened so far.

Torment. This condition is designed to play around with movement, one of our fundamental combat mechanics. Enemies under Torment will take damage periodically; as they move, they’ll take even more damage.

Really…What the crap As if Mesmers and Thieves aren’t overpowered enough. Now you can’t move while combating either of them?! You MUST move while fighting thieves or just lay down and die. Stop adding new conditions and buffs to overplayed/powered classes and add it to the underplayed/powered classes. Just because the condition “torment” sounds like a Mesmer and Necromancer condition doesn’t mean you have to apply it to that profession. You would have been better applying the condition to one of the ranger’s traps, for example. If you’re going to make the conscious effort to balance the game, look at the overplayed professions currently and why. If you find out the reason warriors are overplayed is because of zerking all dungeons, either nerf “zerking” or adjust other professions, but for pete’s sake don’t add an additional condition to those classes.

Xhyros.1340:

Amun Ra.6435:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

what if …

PvE monsters are able to dodge?

Some enemy NPC’s can.

Guess that guy never went to Southsun.

Or never fought a bat, griffon, harpy, ooze, Frog guy, or Inquest.

What exactly is tethering? The potential #5 DS skill states this:

Death shroud: New ability #5 – Dark Binding: You tether all enemies within a 600 range, constantly dealing Torment to them over time. At the end of the cast, Dark Binding immobilizes all affected enemies still within the radius.

Are they tethered to a spot or to the necro? If the necro jumps off a cliff…

How did you fail to not include engineers in this patch? You have now made them even less desirable. No one considered putting Torment on the flamethrower?
I really don’t understand why necro is one of the most overplayed classes need a buff?
Or thieves for that matter?

Camaro Charr.2805:

I really don’t understand why necro is one of the most overplayed classes need a buff?

Lol.

Hey,

So I see a lot of people complaining about the “leaked” patch notes. Saying this class will be useless, this class will be op, and everything else. We need to remember that these notes have yet to be confirmed. One thing to note is the #5 Deathshroud for necros. In the official preview it is called Tainted Shackles while in the “leaked” patch notes it is called Dark Binding.

So these patch notes could very well be fake or old enough to where a lot has changed. It could not be all the notes. Whatever it is though, dont give up on your classes so easily during meta changes. I see this a lot in MMOs, if these patch notes are true it may take a few weeks for the meta to adjust. However, from what I read their main focus was saying “What abilities aren’t used and how can we solve this?”.

Having looked at the new balance changes, they are overall pretty good and may well inspire me to try a few new builds, which I like…

The only sad face for me is the Ranger SB, having its range changed from 1200 to 900. Why couldn’t they just increased LB to 1500 and kept SB the same? You may not think its such a big deal 1200—→900 but I am mainly a WvW player and that will mean my Ranger dies a lot more than now. Which, is annoying, as I had just finally got my Ranger to the point where, he only dies if 80-90% of the zerg I am with goes down or I get jumped by a very skilful thief or outnumbered 2-3 to 1.

I play a condition damage/healer/toughness Ranger, the range change on SB and other changes means I am going to after move from SB/axe & horn to LB/GS and to a power/precision/crit damge set up. So I am going to after replace all my exotic equipment and don’t even mention my ascended items…

Probably just put my Ranger into semi-retirement and play my Ele instead…sad face…

In defense of the qq’ing. There is a possibility that these changes aren’t locked in stone. If we are vocal about the parts that we dislike, maybe we can get them changed before the patch launches.

edit: assuming, of course, that the leak is legitimate.

We have no idea what’s in this patch yet. All that people have seen so far are unconfirmed “leaks” that may not even be real – and, even if they are, are probably very incomplete.

I understand the uncontrollable desire (especially on gaming forums) to complain and overreact, but at least wait until we know what is coming first for once.

It doesn’t bother me that Torment was only given to a few professions. What bothers me is how OP Necro’s seems compared to Thief & Mesmer. I don’t play thief, but if Torment is only available for a mesmer on 1 block skill on 1 weapon then it’s severely weak. Especially compared to what seems to be a Necro’s ability to do some channelled aoe Tormenting with an immob. Which means either take the damage moving or get rooted. Sounds strong.

From what I have seen is that they are buffing trait lines and skills that are not commonly used. This is to increase build diversity. I, for one, welcome this change. Keep in mind that if you change one of your traits to one of these buff traits, that you are losing your old one. It’s not going to single handedly make everyone stronger, just different.

There were nerfs in there as well. They are just buffing the things that players don’t use because they want players to have diversity rather than pidgeon holed into specific sandboxed and proven builds. For me personally, my main thiefs build was nerfed because the one change that effects me is Shadow step no longer breaks stun, which is just about enough to make me completely rethink my build.

Sometimes I wonder how much of this ‘leaked’ stuff is actually on purpose just to see the reaction….

Real or otherwise, I’ll wait until I can actually play with some of it before I make any judgement calls.

Camaro Charr.2805:

How did you fail to not include engineers in this patch? You have now made them even less desirable. No one considered putting Torment on the flamethrower?
I really don’t understand why necro is one of the most overplayed classes need a buff?
Or thieves for that matter?

Patch notes are unconfirmed leaks. Wait for official on Tues.
Engineers were included. Did you see the list of changes? Torment was not the only thing patched.
Necro is not an overplayed class. In fact, it’s probably one of the bottom 3.

First off re read these leaked " notes" there is plenty for engies. 2nd play a necro then tell everyone how you feel. Necros get just as little if not less attention than engies to. All we get are tool tip fixes and fixes for the fixes.(lol)

You don’t increase build diversity by making those options worse to use, you make others more appealing. If you don’t want power creep, make PvE a more challenging experience in return.

Power creep in PvP is simple: separate the skills.

Being ignored if often a very good thing. Be thankful of that. (aka LOLRANGERNERF)

VOLKON.1290:

What exactly is tethering? The potential #5 DS skill states this:

Death shroud: New ability #5 – Dark Binding: You tether all enemies within a 600 range, constantly dealing Torment to them over time. At the end of the cast, Dark Binding immobilizes all affected enemies still within the radius.

Are they tethered to a spot or to the necro? If the necro jumps off a cliff…

Tether links you to one or multiple enemies, and at a certain range it breaks and the skill ends. I usually hate referencing other games, but look up Morgana from League of Legends. Her ultimate is pretty similar to this skill.

Don’t worry about mesmers getting torment if those patch notes are correct. The application is trash on a melee counter ability. Underwhelming changes for many classes and quite a bit of nerfs hidden in there even to classes that are weak… lol @ warrior leg specialist.

Captain Splosion.8645:

VOLKON.1290:

What exactly is tethering? The potential #5 DS skill states this:

Death shroud: New ability #5 – Dark Binding: You tether all enemies within a 600 range, constantly dealing Torment to them over time. At the end of the cast, Dark Binding immobilizes all affected enemies still within the radius.

Are they tethered to a spot or to the necro? If the necro jumps off a cliff…

Tether links you to one or multiple enemies, and at a certain range it breaks and the skill ends. I usually hate referencing other games, but look up Morgana from League of Legends. Her ultimate is pretty similar to this skill.

Ah, so it’s more like an energy string that can break as opposed to a physical attachment that would allow you to, say, jump off a cliff and take them with you.

That’s too bad.

Odaman.8359:

Don’t worry about mesmers getting torment if those patch notes are correct. The application is trash on a melee counter ability. Underwhelming changes for many classes and quite a bit of nerfs hidden in there even to classes that are weak… lol @ warrior leg specialist.

Yeah, if they’re correct you’ll rarely if ever see torment from a mesmer.

You know where it would make sense? Great sword 3. A giant sword coming out of the ground to stab you up between the legs… if that’s not tormenting then I don’t know what is.

Just how useless can ANET make the Ranger.

Aegis.9724:

Being ignored if often a very good thing. Be thankful of that. (aka LOLRANGERNERF)

As a Ranger this made me lol.

I have a guildie who’s playing an engi and his build is quite OP, so I don’t know what “undesirable” means in case of engies.

Odaman.8359:

Don’t worry about mesmers getting torment if those patch notes are correct. The application is trash on a melee counter ability. Underwhelming changes for many classes and quite a bit of nerfs hidden in there even to classes that are weak… lol @ warrior leg specialist.

It sounds bad but with Sword able to apply cripple on auto attack and now the leap as well and the fury skill allowing 100% uptime alone it is quite a nice combo.

sostronk.8167:

For me personally, my main thiefs build was nerfed because the one change that effects me is Shadow step no longer breaks stun, which is just about enough to make me completely rethink my build.

I feel your pain, and am already shaking my fist at ANet’s change to Cleansing Fire.

Im Mudbone.1437:

Just how useless can ANET make the Ranger.

Please delete this post I don’t want a Dev to think something along the lines of;

“Challenge Accepted!”

VOLKON.1290:

Odaman.8359:

Don’t worry about mesmers getting torment if those patch notes are correct. The application is trash on a melee counter ability. Underwhelming changes for many classes and quite a bit of nerfs hidden in there even to classes that are weak… lol @ warrior leg specialist.

Yeah, if they’re correct you’ll rarely if ever see torment from a mesmer.

You know where it would make sense? Great sword 3. A giant sword coming out of the ground to stab you up between the legs… if that’s not tormenting then I don’t know what is.

Yeah but GS is a power weapon, not condition damage so you wouldn’t get much benefit from it.

Deified.7520:

However, from what I read their main focus was saying “What abilities aren’t used and how can we solve this?”.

And how do they do that ? by nerfing builds that are played atm . thats stupid , its like we want new builds running and to achieve this goal we destroy the previous builds to push people into 1 ’’new’’ build.

Im Ele , so i’m wondering why they nerf bountiful power, it’s a good trait but dont even close to OP or somethin so why do they nerf this.(if the leaked notes are true ) this nerf will make 0/10/0/30/30 D/D a bit useless/ underpowered.

Castaliea.3156:

VOLKON.1290:

Odaman.8359:

Don’t worry about mesmers getting torment if those patch notes are correct. The application is trash on a melee counter ability. Underwhelming changes for many classes and quite a bit of nerfs hidden in there even to classes that are weak… lol @ warrior leg specialist.

Yeah, if they’re correct you’ll rarely if ever see torment from a mesmer.

You know where it would make sense? Great sword 3. A giant sword coming out of the ground to stab you up between the legs… if that’s not tormenting then I don’t know what is.

Yeah but GS is a power weapon, not condition damage so you wouldn’t get much benefit from it.

Ah, right, good point. I was just thinking of the aesthetics of it all.

But wait… (edit), the GS is also a distance weapon, intending to keep you from the enemy, ideally near max range. In that line of thought torment would go quite well with it.

AngryCat.4825:

I feel your pain, and am already shaking my fist at ANet’s change to Cleansing Fire.

Its actually overall a really good change because they have reduced the cooldown…really, stun break vs cooldown reduction, I far prefer the cooldown reduction. Do more damage faster/remove conditions faster excellent!

Also, your other cantrips have stun breaks, so who cares about losing one?

juno.1840:

Vol.5241:

The new torment condition gives an unfair advantage to ranged classes. They should have just kept the way things are right now and stick with buffing confusion instead, since confusion is non-discriminatory among classes and melee/ranged

It will work both ways. A ranged class will take damage trying to kite you, just like you’d take damage trying to catch a kiter. I think we’ll have to see how it plays out.

The disappointing part of Torment is that it’ll be limited to thieves, mesmers, and necros. Two of those classes didn’t really need a buff by getting Torment. I think there were better choices including warrior.

As a necromancer I like the idea of torment. We really needed a buff as more than half of our traits are weak, broken, or useless. Hopefully other problem classes got a buff too like PvE build mesmers, engineers, and PvE Thief.

juno.1840:

TheOneNOnlyGeneralBama.9586:

Two of the game’s strongest duelist gets exclusive access to the new condition , punishing those who make a subtle attempt at movement whilst they’re insanely mobile and potent in trickery.

#Keyboardturnersrejoice!

Yeah agree. I think warriors should have gotten torment instead of thieves and mesmers. Arguably maybe guardians but they are already in a good place. Thieves have no issue getting to a mobile class and jumping them from behind so I’m not sure why torment was added to their arsenal.

Yes I do think thieves having access to torment with their movement speed is a bit much as they can switch to pistols and sprint circles around a melee. PvP Mesmers are now going to be a bigger pain in the kitten when you try to use a skill to remove torment but also have 12 stacks of confusion or more on you.