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Posted by: Malkavian.4516

Malkavian.4516

I appreciate that they are still working on this, but I got to ask these questions: what’s the challenge involved in just adding in the missing chapters back? What resources are needed just to bring it back? Don’t you have the means of just going to a specific point in the story yourselves? And of course, assuming it does get fixed, is there any possibility of having those players rewind to that point just to play it (upon request, of course)?

I don’t really care about the current arrangement of the PS too much. It’s just that particular issue that always bugs me.

FOR SKYRIM!!!!!

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Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

I’ve spoken out about the changes to the later chapters.

You sure did.

It was a good change because of the situation in Orr.

I love this. First of all you left off the part where I said it was bad because of this and good because of that. So you’re immediately proving yourself to be disingenuous. Here’s a quote from a previous thread Harry Potter and the NPC…from me.

“No question at all, the changes to the end of the Personal story was bad. Not only no argument from me, but I’ve already said it elsewhere. They’re very bad.”

Unless you want to try to take that quote out of context too.

(edited by Vayne.8563)

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Posted by: Tobias Trueflight.8350

Tobias Trueflight.8350

. . . if you were around when it was talked about how unfair Doc Howler was during the mission you have to fight him? You’d know why they decided to make it that way. And that’s just the example I tested out myself and found it’s easier to either build in anticipation or level beyond the recommended level. I am sure there are others.

Maybe I wasn’t around that time and also since I don’t recognize that name… can you tell more about that and how does it have to do with the subject here? Are you talking about why they decided to make story steps in chunks? Just trying to understand your point.

My point is since it’s now locked by level, it now is more likely you are what is now overleveled for what used to be a tough fight.

Doc Howler was a bandit opponent you fight in the Human/Streetrat personal story, chapter one. He could drop some serious damage-over-time on you with poison and if you weren’t aware of it or had snagged something to help you cleanse? It was going to hurt. The general consensus was to overlevel, grab some good skills to handle it, and then come back and whup his butt all over the orphanage.

Or hospital, if you let the orphans burn. (You monster.)

That’s one instance, and I know I personally kept up with a thread saying it was do-able. (It’s the reason I had another human character at the time, a thief, because “thieves can’t do it!” was the point of the thread.) I also know there was similar over other points in the game, but I didn’t memorize them.

My point is, it was far easier to just lock down the story to a certain level requirement above what was known to be needed. Sort of how you could almost completely assume what skills people had access to in GW1 their first time through . . . certain ones just weren’t available until certain times.

Also, a thing is before it would be player’s choice to wait and get upper level before progressing or take the risk and playing with low or equal level. Now, the game forces ppl to be upper lvled before playing it. What’s the purpose of having story levels then… Just for me it feels like game is dictating the way the players must play their story…

Sorry but . . . it always dictated how you did it. Usually it was phone up a bunch of friends and walk through things with remarkable ease.

Seeking assistants for the Asuran Catapult Project. Applicants will be tested for aerodynamics.

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Posted by: Bugabuga.9721

Bugabuga.9721

My point is, it was far easier to just lock down the story to a certain level requirement above what was known to be needed. Sort of how you could almost completely assume what skills people had access to in GW1 their first time through . . . certain ones just weren’t available until certain times.

Well, if “new” way had single-level-worth of story, that probably would be better anyway. Story itself gives you a good portion of XP needed for the next level. It doesn’t have to be 10-level chunks. Heck, if something was OP before why not, I don’t know, lower the difficulty? That should be way easier.

It’s okay to try to do story 5 levels higher than the character and get defeated. But having story go away for several levels is just weird.

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Posted by: Tobias Trueflight.8350

Tobias Trueflight.8350

Well, if “new” way had single-level-worth of story, that probably would be better anyway. Story itself gives you a good portion of XP needed for the next level. It doesn’t have to be 10-level chunks. Heck, if something was OP before why not, I don’t know, lower the difficulty? That should be way easier.

Because the difficulty on Doc Howler was not “real” difficulty. It was difficult because people approached it trying to faceroll it and failed. He was a “wake up call boss”, of which there are a few parts in the story (mine was the Destroyer queen during the Skritt racial mission finale).

It was difficult for people because they got used to one way of fighting and were thrown a curve ball. And since the general consensus of the thread wound up being “level out further and get skills to help” . . .

Seeking assistants for the Asuran Catapult Project. Applicants will be tested for aerodynamics.

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Posted by: Xenon.4537

Xenon.4537

This whole situation stinks of some higher-up trying to squeeze a few extra pennies out of this game for short term benefit. Reminds me of the Ferengi.

Attachments:

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Posted by: shadow.6174

shadow.6174

@Tobias: Got it, thanks for explaining it.

Story itself gives you a good portion of XP needed for the next level. It doesn’t have to be 10-level chunks. Heck, if something was OP before why not, I don’t know, lower the difficulty? That should be way easier.

Nothing more than agreed.

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Posted by: Malkavian.4516

Malkavian.4516

Okay, based on what I have played in the Personal Story post patch, here are some of the major issues that would need serious addressing. I know that others may have mentioned this before but:

1. On the Battle of Fort Trinity and Romke’s Final Journey, on the dialogue cinematic at the end and beginning of their respective instances show no voices at all and for that matter, they don’t even flap their gums.

2. Because Chapter 8 is now Chapter 7, when you defeat the Sovereign Eye of Zhaitan and speak to King Reza, your character immediately guesses that the other Eyes were former monarchs of Orr. This raises the question of how we came across “other Eyes” if that was the very first eye we have ever seen (from the perspective of a first time player)

3. Prior to the Battle of Fort Trinity, the Greatest Fear story segments were deemed missing. I know for a fact that they are not deleted from the game.

As I mentioned on my last post, I won’t claim to know anything about game development 101 or how your policies in Arenanet work plus I know that you currently have your hands full with the new stuff you are releasing. But in my opinion, you need to finish ironing out major issues first before introducing new content stuff. If it takes that much resources to clear out the bugs as opposed to adding upgrades to existing systems, then I’d consider it to be sloppy on your part. The point of the NPE is to give a fresh start to new players, or vets who make new characters. And I won’t speak for the new players, but from my perspective, I’d think of the overall experience from the beginning to the end of the Personal Story would slope down from being awesome to just being really annoyed by the noticeable plotholes your “rearrangement” brings. And as such, all I ask from you guys at Arenanet to NOT ONLY fix the issues, but also work on a way to have players rewind their story chapters back so they can play them again.

If you want to compile the story chapters so that we can access them in 10 levels, know that I am 100 percent okay with that. I don’t know about others, but I got no problem with that at all as I always start my Story chapters every 10 levels anyway.

EDIT: I’ve been thinking about a way to compensate players who care about the story. It’s not a perfect approach but I will welcome better ideas.

Here’s what I think:

If you cannot rewind players story chapters back if you managed to fix it, then provide players who ask for it on your support desk to give them enough tomes of knowledge to go into max level or at least level 60. That way, players can start fresh on a new character, and do the Personal Story again if they want. Your support team can just validate their requests by looking at player’s characters assuming they got the technology to check it for themselves. I don’t know about you, but I wouldn’t mind going that route.

FOR SKYRIM!!!!!

(edited by Malkavian.4516)

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Posted by: Anyandrell.6238

Anyandrell.6238

I will just sum up my opinion about these changes. Old style NPE and new style NPE.

Old style – I couldn’t care less what level I was. It was fun everywhere and many things to do, wonderful details and beautiful stories, not “kill 25 locusts and bring their wings to X NPC”. I felt immersed in the world of Tyria and part of it.

New style – I’m focused on leveling faster so I can finally have fun at level 80. Leveling is a hurdle and not fun. I don’t really care for fun or beautiful landscapes or NPC conversations – all I care is how to zoom faster through hearts and missions (of which many have been dumbed down a lot). I don’t have that feeling of “belonging” until I finally get to level 80. On my new characters I actually avoided doing PS until then, and also I did everything possible on my existing lvl 80s to get as many tomes of knowledge as I could to make leveling faster.

And this is from a veteran player. Now think what a new players feels like compared to what it used to be.

I hope there won’t be made the same mistake of most MMOS out there, true, most of them Korean – to try and “unify” the game for both the Asian and European/US market. Because, in few words, it comes down to this: Asians love grinding. Westerners don’t. They want fun and they want it easy, most of the time.

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Posted by: Goliath.7546

Goliath.7546

The thing that gets me is the first 30 levels before the first dungeon. They are so painfully boring and slow. I hate running around doing heart quests I’ve already done and I find to be awfully tedious. Wish there was a minigame/dungeon sort of way to level at the start that was viable.

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Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

The thing that gets me is the first 30 levels before the first dungeon. They are so painfully boring and slow. I hate running around doing heart quests I’ve already done and I find to be awfully tedious. Wish there was a minigame/dungeon sort of way to level at the start that was viable.

What about EoTM?

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Posted by: Malkavian.4516

Malkavian.4516

My idea for that would be to have the instances readily available but you still need to be the required level or close to that to stand a chance on your own. That way, it could also encourage party instances. I don’t see that too much even among friends.

FOR SKYRIM!!!!!

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Posted by: Malkavian.4516

Malkavian.4516

I will just sum up my opinion about these changes. Old style NPE and new style NPE.

Old style – I couldn’t care less what level I was. It was fun everywhere and many things to do, wonderful details and beautiful stories, not “kill 25 locusts and bring their wings to X NPC”. I felt immersed in the world of Tyria and part of it.

New style – I’m focused on leveling faster so I can finally have fun at level 80. Leveling is a hurdle and not fun. I don’t really care for fun or beautiful landscapes or NPC conversations – all I care is how to zoom faster through hearts and missions (of which many have been dumbed down a lot). I don’t have that feeling of “belonging” until I finally get to level 80. On my new characters I actually avoided doing PS until then, and also I did everything possible on my existing lvl 80s to get as many tomes of knowledge as I could to make leveling faster.

And this is from a veteran player. Now think what a new players feels like compared to what it used to be.

I hope there won’t be made the same mistake of most MMOS out there, true, most of them Korean – to try and “unify” the game for both the Asian and European/US market. Because, in few words, it comes down to this: Asians love grinding. Westerners don’t. They want fun and they want it easy, most of the time.

Hmmm… I suppose I am play it the Asian fashion because it didn’t bother me too much. On the other hand, I do agree that perhaps having the option to access the instances.

FOR SKYRIM!!!!!

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Posted by: triggerhappy.3871

triggerhappy.3871

Give us back removed pet locations in Queensdale and Plains of Ashford.
Why only these 2 areas lost all pet locations?
Any other areas keep their pet locations.
I guess this is not what you intended but your mistake.

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Posted by: Malkavian.4516

Malkavian.4516

If there is anything I should give mention for is some form of compensation for how long it took to fix a glaring issue.

FOR SKYRIM!!!!!

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Posted by: Khisanth.2948

Khisanth.2948

a: Let’s say I have a level 54 Necromancer. It’s a human, but I really want to have an Asura instead. So, let me drain the levels from my Human Necromancer and use them to give a new Asura Necromancer all of that EXP/levels. (Possibly at a loss? I don’t really see any balance issues that would crop up, so a loss isn’t really necessary.)

b: I have a Norn Warrior, but I want a Norn Guardian instead. My Warrior is level 80 already, so I really want to keep him. So, let me have an “EXP bank” to store all of those extra levels in. Let me then spend them on new characters.

Just sell Tomes of Knowledge for skill points.

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Posted by: Palador.2170

Palador.2170

Give us back removed pet locations in Queensdale and Plains of Ashford.
Why only these 2 areas lost all pet locations?
Any other areas keep their pet locations.
I guess this is not what you intended but your mistake.

More than those two areas. I know a lot of juvenile animals near Hoelbrak are gone as well.

Sarcasm, delivered with a
delicate, brick-like subtlety.

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Posted by: Gilosean.3805

Gilosean.3805

Give us back removed pet locations in Queensdale and Plains of Ashford.
Why only these 2 areas lost all pet locations?
Any other areas keep their pet locations.
I guess this is not what you intended but your mistake.

More than those two areas. I know a lot of juvenile animals near Hoelbrak are gone as well.

What? That’s terrible. Pet mechanics are an important part of the Ranger class. So now rangers don’t even find out about a big part of their class until they leave the beginning areas?

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Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

Give us back removed pet locations in Queensdale and Plains of Ashford.
Why only these 2 areas lost all pet locations?
Any other areas keep their pet locations.
I guess this is not what you intended but your mistake.

More than those two areas. I know a lot of juvenile animals near Hoelbrak are gone as well.

What? That’s terrible. Pet mechanics are an important part of the Ranger class. So now rangers don’t even find out about a big part of their class until they leave the beginning areas?

Yes, rangers don’t learn their class until after level 10. You know, before you used to get traits in the old way.

It’s not a big deal, consider you can still get lots of pets in the cities and the early part of the zone isn’t really for teaching you detailed intricacies of your profession. They’re there to teach you the basics of the game.

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Posted by: shadow.6174

shadow.6174

So now rangers don’t even find out about a big part of their class until they leave the beginning areas?

Yeah, that’s the purpose of the dum… err… shinny NPE: “you are not supposed to learn about taming pets that early because we think it’s too overwhelming for you and you aren’t ready for it yet.” :P

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Posted by: Xenon.4537

Xenon.4537

I’ve had 4 friends return to the game since the NPE and all of them hate the changes. They find it far more frustrating to have to wait to unlock skills, and they hate having to wait to do personal story. 3 of those 4 have since quit again. I suppose NPE doesn’t care about returning players, only brand new ones…

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Posted by: BlkPrince.2854

BlkPrince.2854

It doesnt even help new players. They have to grind to unlock the traits! I dont mind the other crap but really they only have 1 trait where is the kitten build diversity!! and freedom for the player to choose how they play that made this game so fun

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Posted by: Malkavian.4516

Malkavian.4516

It can work out different ways, honestly. Some people learn differently than others. While I admit, I miss having to unlock new skills the more I use a weapon, but if the trade off is I don’t need to repeat it with a different weapon, I suppose it works. Besides, the levelling to 10 is significantly faster for me to get the skills I need.

FOR SKYRIM!!!!!

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Posted by: shadow.6174

shadow.6174

Almost 3 months has passed, a few shinny new patches has been released… and nothing, or at least no much, has been done to Personal Story, NPE and stuff so far… I have put my Personal Story in all chars in hold, as well not leveling up new chars until something is done about it…

where is the ??? build diversity!! and freedom for the player to choose how they play that made this game so fun

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Posted by: Tachenon.5270

Tachenon.5270

Teens playing and reacting to the old NES Mega Man game. Potential ‘New Players’? I wonder how they’d react to GW2?

The table is a fable.

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Posted by: Behellagh.1468

Behellagh.1468

Teens playing and reacting to the old NES Mega Man game. Potential ‘New Players’? I wonder how they’d react to GW2?

That was hilarious. And yes, that’s one of the reasons for NPE. How many of them would have given up playing Mega Man if they weren’t being filmed? “Oh you mean I could shoot? I was only using the A button.” “Oh if his shield up I can’t hurt him.”

The controller is a D pad and two buttons and you don’t even try the B button until you burned threw all you lives multiple times?

We are heroes. This is what we do!

RIP City of Heroes

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Posted by: shadow.6174

shadow.6174

Well, seriously… does anyone think that after seeing threads like https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Missing-Map-Completion-Tracker/ or https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Missing-Zone-completion-box (that has been frequent since NPE came out) the NPE really feels more user friendly and easier than the game was before? Once again, c’mon, streamlining stuff doesn’t mean locking or hiding info from people… Also, almost 3 months has passed, where’s the promised changes? I hope they will be really changes and not just amendments in an attempt to make things get “some sense” instead. Stop dumbing down stuff. In fact, I’m really afraid about what’s coming with those changes on dailies and such… Not holding my breath…

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Posted by: Ashendale.2165

Ashendale.2165

This thread was buried, so I ended up creating another, which I believe I will no longer use, as it disperses the information.

This one being older has quite a lot of interesting views. As most of the things I agree with have already been said, I’m left with asking: where is the feedback from Anet? Where is the correction to this… Problem?

We will not have a new patch from today to January. Are you taking these 30 days as vacation? I’m sure you deserve it, but…

Most of the additions granted (regarding gameplay) are disliked and counterproductive for new and old players alike.

As I said on my thread (and others have also suggested), an option at character creation (or during gameplay, if you fancy) asking me if I wanted the dumbed down version of the game or the usual, friendly and insightful version, would be nice.

I’m guessing you didn’t delete the code for it. I hope you didn’t. Just copy paste it in with an “If” condition. Shouldn’t be too hard. Shouldn’t take too much of your time. We’d very much appreciate it. You could consider it our Wintersday present. And for what I’ve seen, some new players (the people who were supposedly the target of this… experience) who would like to play the game as the older players did.

In this case (and I’m not addressing the issues regarding the story restructuring; though if you’d like another piece of feedback: no. I don’t like being served in large batches, and then starved so the next batch seems yummier; let me have the wonderful game you made 2 years ago) everybody can win.

Eat, sleep, play video games

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Posted by: shadow.6174

shadow.6174

This one being older has quite a lot of interesting views. As most of the things I agree with have already been said, I’m left with asking: where is the feedback from Anet? Where is the correction to this... Problem?

That’s what I have been wondering too....

Most of the additions granted (regarding gameplay) are disliked and counterproductive for new and old players alike.

*just nods at this*

In this case ([..] I don’t like being served in large batches, and then starved so the next batch seems yummier; let me have the wonderful game you made 2 years ago) everybody can win.

This made me think of a thing... it’s like someone that’s not used to eat much and in an attempt to make them eat more you prevent them from having breakfast and lunch and then they will feel starve and will eat dinner with more will and appreciation. Not a good move at all.

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Posted by: SHM.7628

SHM.7628

Wanna improve NPE? Get more alt friendly by doing the following:

-The hearts should be quicker to do.

-XP should be ideally tripled for everything across the board.

-Early unlock of skills traits and trait points.

- personal story is not fun especially when you’ve done it multiple times.

-once the personal story arc converges, it gets even more painful. (its like a bad deja vous)

- Kill off Trahearne (ok, I’m kidding on this one……..well kinda)

One more thing loot Give a drop chance of good level 80 loot. I feel cheated while leveling because I am missing out on the good loot. I wanna be able to enjoy the journey not rush to 80. Some of us do like leveling toons, Ya know?

That would be a good start.

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Posted by: Ashendale.2165

Ashendale.2165

-The hearts should be quicker to do.

Not sure on this. I feel that some hearts are faster than others, and it adds the feeling of adventuring throughout the world.

-XP should be ideally tripled for everything across the board.

No, can’t agree on this. If something, the jorney should take me to lower level areas after I’ve cleared the current one. The world should be enjoyed.

-Early unlock of skills traits and trait points.

Not so much as full unlock, but the old system where you bought skill books at the level you could use them for traits (skill points and gold)

- personal story is not fun especially when you’ve done it multiple times.

-once the personal story arc converges, it gets even more painful. (its like a bad deja vous)

Personal story is stll fun over your character build and options available until the converging point where it feels boring (poor Zhaitan)

- Kill off Trahearne (ok, I’m kidding on this one……..well kinda)

Might not… be a bad idea…

Eat, sleep, play video games

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Posted by: shadow.6174

shadow.6174

I wanna be able to enjoy the journey not rush to 80. Some of us do like leveling toons, Ya know?

That’s a good point… leveling doesn’t feel like a teaching moment with some enjoyable exploration anymore, now it feels like a rush to get your character “mature” enough (aka level cap) plus a huge, long and boring tutorial (why still teaching people about basic stuff when reaching lvl 80, that’s usually days or weeks later after their first login?).

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Posted by: Malkavian.4516

Malkavian.4516

Okay….. I know you guys over there are on vacation but I was thinking of following up with the concern related to the Personal Story issue that needs serious fixing. It’s been four months now.

FOR SKYRIM!!!!!

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Posted by: shadow.6174

shadow.6174

Yeah, and then 4 months (almost 5) has passed and no changes has been done (maybe some small and imperceptible ones only). And then, to know how the shinnny NPE has been received here is the results of a poll so far:

[Note: before someone can say anything, it cannot be said that this poll was biased because the link for it has been in my signature and showed up in posts not related to NPE and yes, I have seen the results changing after a few posts of mine in non-NPE related threads]

  • 117 people voted about changes to Personal Story (Results here). From these:
    • 72 (62%) thought it Terrible;
    • 25 (21%) thought it Poor or bad;
    • 9 (8%) were Indiferent;
    • 11 (9%) thought it Good or Excelent.
  • 105 people voted about locking out features based on level (Results here). From these:
    • 83 (79%) thought it Terrible;
    • 11 (10%) thought it Poor or bad;
    • 8 (8%) were Indiferent;
    • 3 (3%) thought it Good or Excelent.

Well, credits must be given when deserved. At least in a thing they seem to have done right…

  • 88 people voted about Content Direction system (Objective Compass) (Results here). From these:
    • 32 (36%) thought it Good;
    • 24 (27%) were Indiferent;
    • 17 (19%) thought it Poor or bad;
    • 11 (13%) thought it Terrible.
    • 4 (5%) thought it Excelent.

So… doesn’t it ring a bell? Doesn’t it give a clue about if the new system succeeded or not?

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Posted by: Andred.1087

Andred.1087

So… doesn’t it ring a bell? Doesn’t it give a clue about if the new system succeeded or not?

Unless these polls are a genuinely representative sample of the entire player base, no, not at all.

“You’ll PAY to know what you really think.” ~ J. R. “Bob” Dobbs

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Posted by: Rangelost.4857

Rangelost.4857

It’s been a few months now since the NPE was introduced, and it still feels like a huge bug.

That’s honestly how I see it. The NPE feels like it was never intended to exist, and was suddenly rushed and tacked on at the last minute to be included in the September 2014 Feature Pack. It’s a mess.

Let’s take a look at weapon skill unlocks, for example. It used to be that you could learn new weapon skills by using those you’d already learned. This would allow players to learn weapon skills one at a time, and use any weapons they’d like to try out.

What we have now is a system that “rewards” players with the ability to use weapon skills. This means that once they reach Level 10, they have access to all 5 weapon skills for all weapons. Equipping a new type of weapon will spam a bunch of unlocks on screen all at once, and the player is left with a bunch of new skills to learn all at once instead of unlocking them progressively. The irony is off the charts.

Why are unlock messages still there, anyway? They are no longer relevant whatsoever. When you unlock a new weapon skill, you’re told so by the giant modal window that pops up when you level up. And you don’t unlock the weapon skills themselves anyway, you unlock the slots they’re in. It doesn’t make any sense, and looks unpolished. It’s like the old, better and more intuitive system tries to continue existing, but can’t.

Speaking of which, what’s up with the starter zones? I understand that most of the first tasks were changed because teaching players about how the game works early on surely must be bad game design, but now was it necessary to leave the map as-is?

Let’s take the Golem Chess in Metrica Province, for example. That was a fun little mini-game you could play at any time, even after completing the task. Now, it’s been disabled because new players are afraid to see diversity in the game, and the reasons why we veterans were attracted to the game as new players in the first place are irrelevant. I get that. Then why leave the disabled Golem Chess boards there? Is to to confuse new players, or to mock veterans?

And of course there’s worse. There’s actual bugs introduced by the NPE that are just laughable. Let’s talk weapon swap. Before the NPE, you could unlock weapon swap at Level 7. Now, you can only unlock weapon swap at Level 15. However, you can still swap weapons once you reach Level 7 if you have weapons equipped in your secondary slots. How did that even happen? Are there literally TWO weapon swap restrictions coded into the game? And why does one override the other? Again, it’s as if the old, stronger system is trying to fight through the NPE.

And, well, I hope the old system wins. I am not a new player. This is a new character. I do not need you to hold my hand. Do not have Alzheimer’s disease. I don’t forget how to play each time I make a new character. All you have to do is check my account for a high level character, and get this anti-self-learning system out of my face.

When I was a new player, I thought the game was so fun, and I had such a good time creating new characters to try out different classes, I don’t even want to think how awful my experience would have been with this NPE. Just making a new character feels like a chore now. Give players the choice. It matters.

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Posted by: shadow.6174

shadow.6174

So… doesn’t it ring a bell? Doesn’t it give a clue about if the new system succeeded or not?

Unless these polls are a genuinely representative sample of the entire player base, no, not at all.

As I said in my post..

[Note: before someone can say anything, it cannot be said that this poll was biased because the link for it has been in my signature and showed up in posts not related to NPE and yes, I have seen the results changing after a few posts of mine in non-NPE related threads]

The links for such polls has been in my signature spread around several threads during last months, several of them not event related to NPE. Yes, I believe it is a genuinely representative sample, maybe not a big sample but a valid one. Also, it just summarizes some general feeling. Just look at the hundreds of posts even in this thread, a lot of them have dislikes about this system, partially or entirely. However, the same way as the poll showed there is some good thing in this system this thread also has some good points and improvements that this system has brought, but the bad thing though is there are a lot more bad than good aspects.

Let’s take a look at weapon skill unlocks, for example. It used to be that you could learn new weapon skills by using those you’d already learned. This would allow players to learn weapon skills one at a time, and use any weapons they’d like to try out.

What we have now is a system that “rewards” players with the ability to use weapon skills.

Yes, I had even mentioned it in a post months ago.

Let’s take the Golem Chess in Metrica Province, for example. That was a fun little mini-game you could play at any time, even after completing the task. Now, it’s been disabled because new players are afraid to see diversity in the game, and the reasons why we veterans were attracted to the game as new players in the first place are irrelevant. I get that. Then why leave the disabled Golem Chess boards there? Is to to confuse new players, or to mock veterans?

What about the nonsense leftover talk from merchants at Plains of Ashford? What about dumb trainer NPCs not being able to figure out that a lvl 80 player is skilled enough to get access to traits? Why are they at very starter area if new players aren’t supposed to use them so early? What about leaving vistas, PoI and other icons on map but taking of their completion progress? Even more, why leaving vistas and stuff at the very beginning areas then? Also the more laughable ever: who in earth would think about making a cow to get rid of their hungry by being entertained by a random wanderer (we players) dancing in front them? C’mon.

This is a new character. I do not need you to hold my hand. Do not have Alzheimer’s disease. I don’t forget how to play each time I make a new character. All you have to do is check my account for a high level character, and get this anti-self-learning system out of my face.

When I was a new player, I thought the game was so fun, and I had such a good time creating new characters to try out different classes, I don’t even want to think how awful my experience would have been with this NPE. Just making a new character feels like a chore now. Give players the choice. It matters.

Well said, I couldn’t agree more.

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Posted by: misterman.1530

misterman.1530

My favorite wth moment is when, playing a new character, I walked up to the first SP you see in Queensland, and could do nothing with it. The idea being that it was too difficult to understand, I suppose. So now I have to remember, once I level up enough, to head back to the SPs I couldn’t commune with when my level was too low.

So bad.

I code for a living – albeit it isn’t game coding – but the design I would have for this is, in pseudocode (and I wouldn’t use an If statement, but easy to understand for demonstration purposes):

intLevelSP = 10
IF charLevel < intLevelSP then
objSkillPoint.accessible = false
else
objSkillPoint.accessible = true
EndIf

Then, in code, all I have to change is the intLevelSP variable. So, CHANGING this shouldn’t be such an onerous task. Just change a variable. So am at a loss for many of these things and why they are taking so long to fix.

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Posted by: ZeftheWicked.3076

ZeftheWicked.3076

I returned after awhile and find the NPE god awful.

“The cow goes moo..oh and you dance infront of it.”

For crying out loud, stop “fixing” stuff that ain’t broken. Making early game easier is about showing a player what he can do with stuff he encounters, not outright locking it in his face, “cause the poor thing may get confused”. If the game treats you like a kitten you have every right to give it the middle finger.

What you do in such cases is provide a nice optional, but easy to access tutorial when you encounter a new thing in the world. What you did is horrid! Examples:

1. Weapon skills unlockable with levels – what? That’s artificially slowing my progress down. And what about having a full set of skills on the weapons i didn’t use till now? The old system was great because it went along with my choice! You wanna learn the sword, no problem, equip a sword go and kill stuff. But that doesn’t mean you’ll be master of hammer from the get go. It respected my choice and in a non annoying way made me learn my weapon before i could go wild with it!

2. The simplified quests at queensdale farm. What. the. hell. I dance for cows instead of feeding them? I get plants back intos b shape by giving them…a massage?! When bandit set fire to hay i magically pop a water bucket by pressing F?
The orignal versions were great because they followed LOGIC and taught you there are objects around you can and should use. Water the plants? Well hey, there’s a bucket of water right next to the well! It’s like magic! Let’s grab it and water them crops or put out the fires!

I can remember when with a friend we were doing an event in queensdale that involved repairing the water pipes while bandits tried to stop us. It was not progressing at all. Moments later i discovered why. The worker fixing the pipe was K.O’d! It was one of the best moments in the game. I laughed my rear off at my kittened thinking, ressed the guy and got it done. When a game makes you realize you’re losing because you’re not applying logic, then that is a GREAT game and an example to follow, and not something to sweep under the rug!

Guild Wars 2 is Guild Wars 2. So stop trying to make it look like something else! When i go to a mexican restaurant i go to eat….mexican spicy food! Not chinese, not toned-down slightly spicy food. Stop gutting the game experience and be proud of your own creation, kitten!

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Posted by: Rangelost.4857

Rangelost.4857

Oh, and did I mention Farmer Eda? I’m sorry, I think I need to mention Farmer Eda. I’m going to mention Farmer Eda.

Alright, so Farmer Eda. We’re all familiar with that one. There used to be this task in Queensdale where you’d collect apples in an orchard, and after you helped her, she’d offer you some apple pie, and you could even purchase her own home recipe.

And somehow, apples being baked into a pie must have been too confusing for new players because they were removed. That’s right, apple pies were removed from the apple pie merchant.

So why am I talking about this? Well, have you even read the dialogue? Here, let me quote every word from the conversation.

  • Farmer Eda:
    Like my orchard? The apples we harvest here make for delicious pies. My husband used to harvest the apples, before he passed away.
  • Player:
    Pie? I like pie. Can I have one?
  • Farmer Eda:
    Of course! You’ve been a great help around here. You’re more than welcome to a slice or two.
  • Player:
    Yum. Pie!

And what does she sell?

A MEASURING SPOON.

THAT is IT.

This is December 2014. The change was introduced in September 2014. For 3 months now, players have been deceitfully promised apple pie, which of course they never got.

Can you imagine the confusion on the poor new players’ faces? Freshly starting adventurers, still dreaming to one day become great heroes, now haunted by a void in the pit their stomach, a void which will never truly be filled by the rewarding taste of a well-deserved apple pie…

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Posted by: shadow.6174

shadow.6174

The orignal versions were great because they followed LOGIC and taught you there are objects around you can and should use.

Once again, LOGIC has been DENIED! :P

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Posted by: Lishtenbird.2814

Lishtenbird.2814

This is December 2014. The change was introduced in September 2014. For 3 months now, players have been deceitfully promised apple pie, which of course they never got.

The pie is a lie.

20 level 80s and counting.

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Posted by: Astral Projections.7320

Astral Projections.7320

This is December 2014. The change was introduced in September 2014. For 3 months now, players have been deceitfully promised apple pie, which of course they never got.

The pie is a lie.

There is no pie. (But there is a spoon).

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Posted by: naiasonod.9265

naiasonod.9265

They’re deeply concerned with these things, I’m sure. If y’all can just spend a few thousand more dollars in the gem store, they’ll surly get back to us in 2d4 months. Promise!

One is only the smartest person in the room if they are alone.

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Posted by: Tachenon.5270

Tachenon.5270

This is December 2014. The change was introduced in September 2014. For 3 months now, players have been deceitfully promised apple pie, which of course they never got.

The pie is a lie.

Not only that, the table is a fable.

The table is a fable.

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Posted by: Ascimator.6735

Ascimator.6735

I really don’t want GW2 to become like this teacher in school who says you solved a problem wrong because “we do not use this method yet”. Even if the teacher is justified because you arguably have to learn this specific method and not the others, the game is not.

Right: “So far you’ve been defeating enemies by spamming 1, but here’s a guy that hits really hard, so if you have not discovered it yet, you can dodge by double-tapping the movement key.”
Wrong: “You cannot use this game mechanic yet because we feel like another button on top of the 5 you already know is going to overwhelm you. We care about your playing experience.”

There’s a fine line between “not flashing a ton of different tooltips in a player’s face” and “you can’t weapon swap before we let you”

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Posted by: Xillllix.3485

Xillllix.3485

Honestly, I was levelling a character in the vacation and the NPE feels terrible:

At level 54 I still have no master trait and since I only play EOTM/WvW/PvP I do not have enough skillpoints to unlock all the skills and traits I want (Skills points should never have become “Trait points”). When my character level up in EOTM I do less damage and lose health. The entire leveling process feel broken and akward: like being told at late level 30s what rare gear is; seriously?

And if the goal was to make things easier then it was a failure, because having to unlock everything, including traits for a class you’ve never played before testing them, is doing the exact opposite.

It’s probably been said a thousand times already but anyway I wished to add my voice to the list of people disappointing by the NPE.

I hope in 2015 you get back on track, specially with new competitive content and PvE content for existing players.

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Posted by: shadow.6174

shadow.6174

The entire leveling process feel broken and akward: like being told at late level 30s what rare gear is; seriously?

It doesn’t feel like a leveling process anymore but more like a huge and boring tutorial now (telling about rare gear at lvl 30? pfft I learned about them when I was still lvl 15).

And if the goal was to make things easier then it was a failure, because having to unlock everything, including traits for a class you’ve never played before testing them, is doing the exact opposite.

Once again, streamlining things doesn’t mean dumbing down, but it seems they haven’t got the message yet. Since the beginning I didn’t see locking out stuff as a good thing, it does anything but teach about stuff.

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Posted by: Ashendale.2165

Ashendale.2165

I’d like to quote somebody who previously brought to attention an issue regarding a tutorial.

For instance, rangers (you know rangers; bow, arrows, pets) only know what a pet is after level 10. It must really be hard for a person to play the profession they chose. If so… Well, time to reroll

I am dumbfounded how a main part of a profession’s mechanic can be left out. If your QA is made out entirely of… limited individuals, by all means get some average players to test it for you. If you don’t want to hire anyone with those qualifications then instead of giving us vague and inaccurate pre-patch notes, give something we can think about and look at the effing feedback, instead of throwing something out and hiding for almost four (4) months.

If you want to drawn in the most people you can get your hands on, a simple option (a simple If and End If), is all there is to get regular players that don’t need their hand to be held, and people who feel they need. Because I doubt anyone that is able to create an account on their own needs this kind of carrying.

I have a previous post regarding story spacing by level and other points, so I won’t go through that again.

Regarding new players, the game was just fine.

Four months… Four months and this horror is still the same. I don’t see many (if any) threads saying this was a good idea, so take hint already. I would really like to fill all my character slots with level 80s, but right now I have no fun whatsoever being insulted like this. It is limiting my options.

If i want to go all kamikaze against a really hard skill challenge, that is my right, my decision. If you think I should suffer a penalty, bring back repair costs. If I want to look at the mini-map and start doing my leveling passing through points of interest and vistas, it is my decision. No need to hinder it, forcing me to memorize the map, or open the full-screen map to see where they are. And what the hell? Why must I be killed immediately, instead of being downed, before level 5?

Also, as a fully fledged level 80 working on his Ascended set, I do not need, while killing Svanir Shaman or the Jungle Wurm, to be reminded that my HP is low and that I have a healing skill. It is annoying, and distracting.

If you’ve ever heard or read anything about a certain gentleman called Charles Darwin, you’ll see that he has some interesting theories about survival of the fittest and death of the stupid; if I go charging in on anything without reading my own skills, I deserve to die.

EDIT: minor corrections to grammar (again).

Eat, sleep, play video games

(edited by Ashendale.2165)

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Posted by: curtegg.5216

curtegg.5216

The new leveling system sucks, so I use my new character for (named appropriately, “Bearer of Rings”) is to simply hold my 250+ ascended rings gotten from the paltry drops in fractal runs. Anet’s stupid RNG really sucks because it should account for prior run drops!

If you really want to improve the game given now you have collections and track what the player has already gotten from drops then use that information to influence future loot drops! Is that so hard now?