Guild Wars 2

orresho.3197:

Seems like people just want ascended items handed out to them. I enjoy the way they put it out. It makes me want to revisit some dungeons, mini-dungeons, bosses and other types of content to get the mats needed. I like it.

I see some people talking about making the ascended items drop from bosses. Lol, just lol.. with the supereasy zerg-bosses this game has to offer it would be so boring and unchallanging. If u want the boss-drop system to be fun, enjoyabe and rewarding we need 100x harder bosses(instanced raids for example) so when you actually kill the boss you get a chans of drop. But then people would just rage again.

Seems like however arenanet makes things there are ALLWAYS someone complaining and crying like a little child.

Ehh.. They do drop from bosses.

Galen Grey.4709:

orresho.3197:

Seems like people just want ascended items handed out to them. I enjoy the way they put it out. It makes me want to revisit some dungeons, mini-dungeons, bosses and other types of content to get the mats needed. I like it.

I see some people talking about making the ascended items drop from bosses. Lol, just lol.. with the supereasy zerg-bosses this game has to offer it would be so boring and unchallanging. If u want the boss-drop system to be fun, enjoyabe and rewarding we need 100x harder bosses(instanced raids for example) so when you actually kill the boss you get a chans of drop. But then people would just rage again.

Seems like however arenanet makes things there are ALLWAYS someone complaining and crying like a little child.

Ehh.. They do drop from bosses.

lol.

I like it and everyone who disagrees is a crying little child. You sir are no better than the rest of us who argue for the sake of arguing. Now if only I can figure out why I keep coming back to argue to no avail..

MikaHR.1978:

Vayne.8563:

MikaHR.1978:

Vayne.8563:

MikaHR.1978:

Vayne.8563:

MikaHR.1978:

Galen Grey.4709:

MikaHR.1978:

Galen Grey.4709:

MikaHR.1978:

Galen Grey.4709:

MikaHR.1978:

And your son will be gone again when he crafts his ascended weapon as clearly GW2 is not the game for him. At the same time i (and some others that have already played 1000+ hours) stopped playing the game because of something that will give your son 2 week gear grind fix, so…yes, i quite see you dont understand it.

Actually yes it does make sense.

If you’ve got a person who quits the moment something they dont like happens and you have another person who plays the moment you give him something he enjoys which customer would you want to keep?

Theres a lots of things i dont like about GW2. Your logic…..fails. To be mild.

Even more reason why taking care of you as a customer at the expense of other customers would be a bad idea dont you think ?

But thats funny cause I would have swore that yesterday you said “I was quite happy for past year. Put 1000+ hours in the game.” Which in itself is also funny cause ascended gear wasnt introduced now but actually last year and you were perfectly happy then according to you.

I was quite happy for the past year. But i really think you dont know what youre talking about.

Im quite happy with my GF too, doesnt mean i like all about her rofl

Sorry if i have to draw everything out for you.

sorry I must have been mistaken didnt realise there was no ascended gear in the game before 2 days go. my mistake.

Thats because i still hoped (small hope though) that there was part of old ANet in them that wants to create and innovate and they will scrap down whole nonsense. But, nope.

It blows my mind that you can’t see the innovation, but what can you do?

Gear gear treadmill is not innovation im afraid.

Loot pinatas are not innovation.

…
…
…

I agree with you 100%. Neither of those things are innovative. And since that’s all that’s been in the game, you must be right. /sarcasm.

There’s other things in the game, and you chose to focus on the stuff you don’t like. That’s on you.

Really? like what is so innovative since launch? Entertain us pls rofl

I’ll let others entertain you,. since no matter what I’d say it would be a dismissive one line from you, like so many other of your posts to me.

There’s nothing I can say that can convince someone who’s determined to make fun of me….so I won’t bother. Sorry to put a damper on your day.

Awwwwwww. Such a shame you couldnt find even 1 thing since we know you would cling to it like….

Ill tell you whats not innovative and with what they will shove you with generously very soon:

gear grind (treadmill)

If you weren’t so intent on trying to make me look bad, we could have a conversation, but since most people here see what you’re about, it makes no difference at all.

My theory is that the itemization in GW2 is terrible, awful and that the problems with the game come in part because some players cannot live without VP, and in part because ANet didn’t understand how terrible their itemization is.

Look at the game at release, you quickly got your exotic set and people complained that there was nothing else to do. But there was supposed to be a lot of stuff to do beyond farming one set of armor! We were supposed to experiment with different stat sets, different runes, try other builds, make alts and for the longer term, farm some of the awesome skins in the game.

Unfortunately, those activities are at an odd with each other. Mostly, the longest term goal which is to farm the looks is at odds with experimenting with many stats. The problem is that switched stats and runes is far too expensive! So once you got one set of stats that works for you, you get the look you want, the runes you want. Those stages are very expensive. And then, what about another look? You cannot. You cannot because you either erase the first expensive look you got, or you duplicated the work you did to get the stats and rune again and keep two identical sets except for their look in your inventory.

And when ANet added ascended weapons, I had the slightest hope that they’d use that occasion to solve this big problem. Heck, they even got part of the requirements in their Legendary stat switching feature!

Getting the look you want on the stats and rune/sigil you want should have been three completely independent tasks of varying effort with no destructive interaction between them. Any such interaction is a deterrent in pursuing more activities for grinding more looks or more builds, which caused a perception that there was less stuff to do at level 80 than it should.

orresho.3197:

Seems like people just want ascended items handed out to them. I enjoy the way they put it out. It makes me want to revisit some dungeons, mini-dungeons, bosses and other types of content to get the mats needed. I like it.

I see some people talking about making the ascended items drop from bosses. Lol, just lol.. with the supereasy zerg-bosses this game has to offer it would be so boring and unchallanging. If u want the boss-drop system to be fun, enjoyabe and rewarding we need 100x harder bosses(instanced raids for example) so when you actually kill the boss you get a chans of drop. But then people would just rage again.

Seems like however arenanet makes things there are ALLWAYS someone complaining and crying like a little child.

That is why i say gw2 players are players who are not used to MMo’s or hate that genra yet play gw2.

Better the gear, harder to get as drop.
If people want to have it, then craft it.

The only flaw i can point, is the ascended were not avaliable at release, IMO being able to craft all gear shout be allowed since then, fractals was a ugly way to introduce that gear lvl.

TheDaiBish.9735:

darkace.8925:

Red Falcon.8257:

Seriously guys they’ve been saying there would be a gear treadmill since October 2012.
If you wanted to quit over gear treamills policy you shouldn’t be here to begin with.

They said, explicitly, the only grinding in this game would be for cosmetic items.

“Here’s what we believe: If someone wants to play for a thousand hours to get an item that is so rare that other players can’t realistically acquire it, that rare item should be differentiated by its visual appearance and rarity alone, not by being more powerful than everything else in the game. Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games — we leave the grind to other MMOs.”

- Mike O’Brien, President of Arenanet

Does the addition of ascended weapons fall in line with what was said by Mike O’Brien?

You can quote that all you like, but they said that Ascended gear would be introduced more recently than that quote:

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

Since we knew these were going to be coming out, why stick around if you didn’t agree with it?

I am fine with the current content. I just wanted to point out: What’s difference with them lying earlier, rather than more recent?

(This is objective, I really don’t give a toss as I love the game from launch and still have fun :P)

Vayne.8563:

MikaHR.1978:

Galen Grey.4709:

Hrithmus.2583:

353 replies and 7373 Views on this post and not one Dev Reply yet. Man they must be scared?

Because they know its pointless. Whatever they would say themselves has been said many times over by regular players. Did any of that chance a single opinion of either side?

A post by the devs would be counter productive. All it would do is cause more rage in the end.

Yes, everyone knows that they dont have anything to say that would calm it down, and they certainly cant say the truth so they just ignore it and hope it goes away

They have said the truth. The truth is that exotics didn’t take long enough to get. Do you know how many people hit level cap in this game and left because there was nothing for them to do? The forums were full of such posts.

It’s not like 3 guys in a room made all of them.

They say one thing and do the opposite. The truth is ascended gear, living story, and RNG boxes are moth holes in the fabric of fun. Do you know how many people have been disgusted to find these things in this game of all games and have left because of them? The forums have at times been full to overflowing with posts profoundly against those things.

And yet those things persist. There’s your ‘truth’. Imagine that.

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

Galen Grey.4709:

Hrithmus.2583:

353 replies and 7373 Views on this post and not one Dev Reply yet. Man they must be scared?

Because they know its pointless. Whatever they would say themselves has been said many times over by regular players. Did any of that chance a single opinion of either side?

A post by the devs would be counter productive. All it would do is cause more rage in the end.

This is true. Everyone paid for the game, I don’t see how devs taking sides would help at all.

They already did that, in regard to Ascended Gear. They took the side of the ‘most dedicated players’. Whoever the kitten that is.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear

This exactly what I am talking about. They didnt take the side of the most dedicated players, they created goals for said players. If they took the side of those dedicated players (who actually are meant to be those who go for VP) they wouldnt have come out and said this “We will not be adding a new tier of gear every 3 months that we expect everyone to chase after and then get the next set and so on.”

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/A-message-from-our-Studio-Design-Director-Chris-Whiteside/first#post721451

What they did is a compromise.

why do we have to take it as a crusade again non vp players?

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

MikaHR.1978:

Galen Grey.4709:

Hrithmus.2583:

353 replies and 7373 Views on this post and not one Dev Reply yet. Man they must be scared?

Because they know its pointless. Whatever they would say themselves has been said many times over by regular players. Did any of that chance a single opinion of either side?

A post by the devs would be counter productive. All it would do is cause more rage in the end.

Yes, everyone knows that they dont have anything to say that would calm it down, and they certainly cant say the truth so they just ignore it and hope it goes away

They have said the truth. The truth is that exotics didn’t take long enough to get. Do you know how many people hit level cap in this game and left because there was nothing for them to do? The forums were full of such posts.

It’s not like 3 guys in a room made all of them.

They say one thing and do the opposite. The truth is ascended gear, living story, and RNG boxes are moth holes in the fabric of fun. Do you know how many people have been disgusted to find these things in this game of all games and have left because of them? The forums have at times been full to overflowing with posts profoundly against those things.

And yet those things persist. There’s your ‘truth’. Imagine that.

So no one likes them? Is this your argument? No one is having fun? Then why are people still playing? How come they’re still producing the content? If it wasn’t working for them, logic dictates they’d stop.

byjiang.1260:

Galen Grey.4709:

orresho.3197:

Seems like people just want ascended items handed out to them. I enjoy the way they put it out. It makes me want to revisit some dungeons, mini-dungeons, bosses and other types of content to get the mats needed. I like it.

I see some people talking about making the ascended items drop from bosses. Lol, just lol.. with the supereasy zerg-bosses this game has to offer it would be so boring and unchallanging. If u want the boss-drop system to be fun, enjoyabe and rewarding we need 100x harder bosses(instanced raids for example) so when you actually kill the boss you get a chans of drop. But then people would just rage again.

Seems like however arenanet makes things there are ALLWAYS someone complaining and crying like a little child.

Ehh.. They do drop from bosses.

lol.

I like it and everyone who disagrees is a crying little child. You sir are no better than the rest of us who argue for the sake of arguing. Now if only I can figure out why I keep coming back to argue to no avail..

I corrected a mistake someone who is defending my side of the argument did. yet even there you have to see it as a conspiracy. So if you try to be impartial that means you argue for the sake of arguing. geess

Galen Grey.4709:

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

Galen Grey.4709:

Hrithmus.2583:

353 replies and 7373 Views on this post and not one Dev Reply yet. Man they must be scared?

Because they know its pointless. Whatever they would say themselves has been said many times over by regular players. Did any of that chance a single opinion of either side?

A post by the devs would be counter productive. All it would do is cause more rage in the end.

This is true. Everyone paid for the game, I don’t see how devs taking sides would help at all.

They already did that, in regard to Ascended Gear. They took the side of the ‘most dedicated players’. Whoever the kitten that is.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear

This exactly what I am talking about. They didnt take the side of the most dedicated players, they created goals for said players. If they took the side of those dedicated players (who actually are meant to be those who go for VP) they wouldnt have come out and said this “We will not be adding a new tier of gear every 3 months that we expect everyone to chase after and then get the next set and so on.”

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/A-message-from-our-Studio-Design-Director-Chris-Whiteside/first#post721451

What they did is a compromise.

why do we have to take it as a crusade again non vp players?

A compromise means little to people who are set in their ways. What ANet should have done is add Ascended, then nerf their VP component somehow after. This would have been met with far less outcry after the nerf part.

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

MikaHR.1978:

Galen Grey.4709:

Hrithmus.2583:

353 replies and 7373 Views on this post and not one Dev Reply yet. Man they must be scared?

Because they know its pointless. Whatever they would say themselves has been said many times over by regular players. Did any of that chance a single opinion of either side?

A post by the devs would be counter productive. All it would do is cause more rage in the end.

Yes, everyone knows that they dont have anything to say that would calm it down, and they certainly cant say the truth so they just ignore it and hope it goes away

They have said the truth. The truth is that exotics didn’t take long enough to get. Do you know how many people hit level cap in this game and left because there was nothing for them to do? The forums were full of such posts.

It’s not like 3 guys in a room made all of them.

They say one thing and do the opposite. The truth is ascended gear, living story, and RNG boxes are moth holes in the fabric of fun. Do you know how many people have been disgusted to find these things in this game of all games and have left because of them? The forums have at times been full to overflowing with posts profoundly against those things.

And yet those things persist. There’s your ‘truth’. Imagine that.

We dont know the exact numbers but considering population is on the increase I would say less then ones who like the status quo

Galen Grey.4709:

byjiang.1260:

Galen Grey.4709:

orresho.3197:

Seems like people just want ascended items handed out to them. I enjoy the way they put it out. It makes me want to revisit some dungeons, mini-dungeons, bosses and other types of content to get the mats needed. I like it.

I see some people talking about making the ascended items drop from bosses. Lol, just lol.. with the supereasy zerg-bosses this game has to offer it would be so boring and unchallanging. If u want the boss-drop system to be fun, enjoyabe and rewarding we need 100x harder bosses(instanced raids for example) so when you actually kill the boss you get a chans of drop. But then people would just rage again.

Seems like however arenanet makes things there are ALLWAYS someone complaining and crying like a little child.

Ehh.. They do drop from bosses.

lol.

I like it and everyone who disagrees is a crying little child. You sir are no better than the rest of us who argue for the sake of arguing. Now if only I can figure out why I keep coming back to argue to no avail..

I corrected a mistake someone who is defending my side of the argument did. yet even there you have to see it as a conspiracy. So if you try to be impartial that means you argue for the sake of arguing. geess

Not talking about you, lol.

So grind is based on perspective. Why and what are we arguing here again?

byjiang.1260:

Galen Grey.4709:

orresho.3197:

Seems like people just want ascended items handed out to them. I enjoy the way they put it out. It makes me want to revisit some dungeons, mini-dungeons, bosses and other types of content to get the mats needed. I like it.

I see some people talking about making the ascended items drop from bosses. Lol, just lol.. with the supereasy zerg-bosses this game has to offer it would be so boring and unchallanging. If u want the boss-drop system to be fun, enjoyabe and rewarding we need 100x harder bosses(instanced raids for example) so when you actually kill the boss you get a chans of drop. But then people would just rage again.

Seems like however arenanet makes things there are ALLWAYS someone complaining and crying like a little child.

Ehh.. They do drop from bosses.

lol.

I like it and everyone who disagrees is a crying little child. You sir are no better than the rest of us who argue for the sake of arguing. Now if only I can figure out why I keep coming back to argue to no avail..

Thats not what I said thou. I have my dislikes about the game, but i don’t go to the forum making a thread/post and saying “I don’t like crafting and thats why the system sucks and I want this and that instead” that is crying like a litte child to me. I like to read the threads and other peoples opinion with legit arguments. But this is a 10 page thread so far and not many legit arguments and ideas has been seen. We would still be at page 1 if not for all the crying ppl post.

stof.9341:

Galen Grey.4709:

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

Galen Grey.4709:

Hrithmus.2583:

353 replies and 7373 Views on this post and not one Dev Reply yet. Man they must be scared?

Because they know its pointless. Whatever they would say themselves has been said many times over by regular players. Did any of that chance a single opinion of either side?

A post by the devs would be counter productive. All it would do is cause more rage in the end.

This is true. Everyone paid for the game, I don’t see how devs taking sides would help at all.

They already did that, in regard to Ascended Gear. They took the side of the ‘most dedicated players’. Whoever the kitten that is.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear

This exactly what I am talking about. They didnt take the side of the most dedicated players, they created goals for said players. If they took the side of those dedicated players (who actually are meant to be those who go for VP) they wouldnt have come out and said this “We will not be adding a new tier of gear every 3 months that we expect everyone to chase after and then get the next set and so on.”

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/A-message-from-our-Studio-Design-Director-Chris-Whiteside/first#post721451

What they did is a compromise.

why do we have to take it as a crusade again non vp players?

A compromise means little to people who are set in their ways. What ANet should have done is add Ascended, then nerf their VP component somehow after. This would have been met with far less outcry after the nerf part.

Assuming the players who dont like VP outnumber the ones that do.

Do you know that for sure?

Scoundrel.2139:

I am fine with the current content. I just wanted to point out: What’s difference with them lying earlier, rather than more recent?

(This is objective, I really don’t give a toss as I love the game from launch and still have fun :P)

There is none.

I personally don’t see it as lying; a manifesto isn’t an unequivocal promise, it’s a statement of intention.

However, the best intentions aren’t always the best implementation of something when it’s actually implemented, thus changes need to be made. At the end of the day, Anet is the one with the numbers; if they see a decline in players playing per day, and they see that the decline started when the majority of players have Exotics, they’d see a correlation there.

Thus, Ascended. Again, that’s speculation, but I can imagine that’s what happened. I can also see why some people would feel ‘betrayed’, as it were.

What I was trying to point out though was that we knew that this Ascended gear would be coming out close to a year ago, so I don’t know why we’ve got this massive uproar over it again.

Vayne.8563:

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

MikaHR.1978:

Galen Grey.4709:

Hrithmus.2583:

353 replies and 7373 Views on this post and not one Dev Reply yet. Man they must be scared?

Because they know its pointless. Whatever they would say themselves has been said many times over by regular players. Did any of that chance a single opinion of either side?

A post by the devs would be counter productive. All it would do is cause more rage in the end.

Yes, everyone knows that they dont have anything to say that would calm it down, and they certainly cant say the truth so they just ignore it and hope it goes away

They have said the truth. The truth is that exotics didn’t take long enough to get. Do you know how many people hit level cap in this game and left because there was nothing for them to do? The forums were full of such posts.

It’s not like 3 guys in a room made all of them.

They say one thing and do the opposite. The truth is ascended gear, living story, and RNG boxes are moth holes in the fabric of fun. Do you know how many people have been disgusted to find these things in this game of all games and have left because of them? The forums have at times been full to overflowing with posts profoundly against those things.

And yet those things persist. There’s your ‘truth’. Imagine that.

So no one likes them? Is this your argument? No one is having fun? Then why are people still playing? How come they’re still producing the content? If it wasn’t working for them, logic dictates they’d stop.

/e Strunk and White

Ahem. Moving on.

So everyone likes them? Is this your argument? Everyone is having fun? Then why are people still leaving? Is it because they are still producing the content? If it wasn’t working for them, hubris dictates they’d keep on regardless of the consequences.

To expect logic from game developers, gamers, and games is… illogical.

Galen Grey.4709:

Assuming the players who dont like VP outnumber the ones that do.

Do you know that for sure?

Pretty sure the players that like social games (Farmville) outnumber those that like GW2, doesn’t mean you have to make every single game for that audience.

This situation is very well explained in that Extra Credits episode : http://www.penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/metrics

Metrics. Metrics that ANet uses to make their game appeal to a wider audience. It works, I’m sure of it. There is a catch though and for me it’s exactly the problem and the reason I like GW2 less and less. Sure, ANet gets more clients and more money, doesn’t mean I have to like the direction they take.

Short summary of the episode :

Metrics are great, they allow us to find what people like and what they don’t, what works and what doesn’t. But Metrics can ONLY conclude stuff about the past, about the already existent. If a game studio decides to use metrics and data for any new development, it’ll inevitably lead them to do more of the same than everyone else does, except maybe more polished, more shiny, but still more of the same.

GW2 for me was kind of a promise that it would NOT be more of the same. No Vertical Progression! If I wanted it, I’d just play WoW or Aion. Then metrics entered the game and GW2 is morphing slowly into more of the same.

stof.9341:

Galen Grey.4709:

Assuming the players who dont like VP outnumber the ones that do.

Do you know that for sure?

Pretty sure the players that like social games (Farmville) outnumber those that like GW2, doesn’t mean you have to make every single game for that audience.

This situation is very well explained in that Extra Credits episode : http://www.penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/metrics

Metrics. Metrics that ANet uses to make their game appeal to a wider audience. It works, I’m sure of it. There is a catch though and for me it’s exactly the problem and the reason I like GW2 less and less. Sure, ANet gets more clients and more money, doesn’t mean I have to like the direction they take.

If they bought gw2 then yes you have to.

They’re equally committed to all of their customers. Not just a particular subset.

No of course, you dont have to like the direction they take no doubt. Its up to you.

Thats the risk you take with compromise. You create stuff for 2 types of players. Some players will go great, there is stuff I like to play so this game is for me. Other players will point at the stuff they dont like and go look this game does stuff that I dont like so this game is not for me.

Its a glass half empty / half full thing in a way.

I am mad by the fact that they destroyed GW1, not giving anything capable of comparing to it in return. That’s it. GW2 is a successor only in name and a tiny, tiny bit of setting.
I would not have a single complaint if I could still play original Guild Wars.

Ichishi.9613:

I am mad by the fact that they destroyed GW1, not giving anything capable of comparing to it in return. That’s it. GW2 is a successor only in name and a tiny, tiny bit of setting.
I would not have a single complaint if I could still play original Guild Wars.

Why can’t you still play GW1?

Ichishi.9613:

I am mad by the fact that they destroyed GW1, not giving anything capable of comparing to it in return. That’s it. GW2 is a successor only in name and a tiny, tiny bit of setting.
I would not have a single complaint if I could still play original Guild Wars.

funny I was just playing it last weekend. How did they destroy it again?

I think he means that GW1 is officially now on life support and they will not make any more content for it.

Oh god, you guys sees farm in everything.
500 dragonite ore = no need to farm, just do event and WvW
500 things from champion bag = no need to farm, just do event, WvW, dungeons
500 things from dungeon = same as above.

Of course, if you want an ascended weapon in 5 days you need to farm like a crazy, but seriously you can make it by spending some gold and doing your normal activity.

The point is that the Gw2 community wants everything instant. Farm is boring, give us 1 legendary per player via mail!
PS: An ascended weapon is just 7% (I think) better than an exotic, no need to do it if you don’t want.
PSS: And stop compairing Gw2 to Gw1. They are different games, they only share the same lore.

youkai.2394:

The point is that the Gw2 community wants everything instant. Farm is boring, give us 1 legendary per player via mail!

B… b… but what about my alts! And I need different weapon sets!

Galen Grey.4709:

Ichishi.9613:

I am mad by the fact that they destroyed GW1, not giving anything capable of comparing to it in return. That’s it. GW2 is a successor only in name and a tiny, tiny bit of setting.
I would not have a single complaint if I could still play original Guild Wars.

funny I was just playing it last weekend. How did they destroy it again?

Anything that involves players from not the same place playing together result in a rather unpleasant experience, especially in pvp since there are only two pvp servers and both of them in america.
Constant lag spikes and freezes all over the place even in gvg all the way since the server load optimization.

For the people out there, it’s “play however you want”, not “get whatever you want.”

Gw2 is not L T W ( Log in TO win ).

MikaHR.1978:

Peets.8529:

Let’s assume that Ascended weapons are grind and we want to get rid of it.
We should be fair and remove all grind then.
You need to grind to get rewards in dungeons. So remove the tokens.
You need to grind to get exotic weapons, remove them.
That leaves only rares which are easy to get. So why not remove all the types and just stick with common which we can all get. Since we do not want to grind.
Same with weapons, trinkets, etc..
Then why not just let everyone choice everything they want at the start of the game like PvP. Grinding is gone.
Loot is then only gold, otherwise you can get grinding since we do not want to play a lot of time to get something. Actually, you no longer need gold since you get everything at the start. We can remove that too. Same with karma, laurels and everything else.
We just play content. I haven’t played this kind of boring games but is it Minecraft? (never played it so I can be wrong that there is grind)
I feel like this is an adventure platform game then and not a MMO or is that just me?
And if so are they playing the wrong genre?

Too bad Minecraft is 10x more popular than GW2. You were sayin?

My last question fills it?

I have been playing with rare gear and weapons for 10 months. For 10 months I didn’t see any exotic weapon. Now since I had enough karma (500k) I decided to get the Karma gear in orr and then created a exotic weapon with crafting. I didn’t suspected it to be so cheap and easy. But now that I have raised from rare to exotic I didn’t noticed any difference… Perhaps I still suck With the last content (Invasion) I received one exotic weapon from a champion It was only 1.5k gold worth :/ kitten that is cheap when you have 112 gold.

None the less, I am still having fun.
OH and I just started to save materials for my Legendary. But I won’t grind for it.
I will just have fun and one day I will have enough to get it. But it won’t change the having fun part.

Well, that’s because you got the crappy karma gear in Orr with all over the place stats and lots of wastage :p

I can make the argument pretty simple. The economy has become the 800 pound Gorilla in the game. Because it appears the economy is affecting the developers judgement.

Obviously the “No grind” sales pitch was misleading. To say Ascended Gear was created because we obtained Exotics too quickly, means they always intended for us to be chasing a level of gear. Not spending the majority of our time experiencing content and story.

Tom Gore.4035:

youkai.2394:

The point is that the Gw2 community wants everything instant. Farm is boring, give us 1 legendary per player via mail!

B… b… but what about my alts! And I need different weapon sets!

With alts the problem is solved.

I am starting to think the only time gated item that is not sellable on the trading post (Vision Crystal) is actually time gated by 1 per day per character.

Different weapon sets well………….. Can’t help you there.

And yes I know you are being sarcastic.

Gehenna.3625:

There will always be differences of opinion on what is a lot….but it does look very boring to do regardless.

Exactly. Is it fun?

The people that did what they did to get their Legendary. Was it fun? Yes, you have a Legendary. Yes, you have the Ascended weapon. But did you have fun obtaining it?

If you did, good. If you did not, then that is sad. Games should be fun.

I believed Arenanet when they said repeatedly that they were making design choices for GW2 based on “is it fun?” So when someone came up with all of these requirements and various modes for getting Ascended gear, did they consider them to be fun?

I have seen so many great ideas on ways to tie Legendary and now Ascended to core mechanics in the game. To make it an epic journey. None of this is epic or fun.

youkai.2394:

The point is that the Gw2 community wants everything instant. Farm is boring, give us 1 legendary per player via mail!

Why is it that whenever anyone talks about how ridiculous the requirements are for obtaining max stat gear, someone says “we” want it instantly? That is an extreme statement without ever considering a middle ground.

I personally do not want anything instantly. I like many others enjoy goals. If gear is in a game, I assume it is useful. Yes, useful. Everyone always says that you don’t “need” Ascended. True. But this is not about needing it. It’s about using it.

If Ascended was not useful, then why even have it at all. Because it is “useful” in playing the game. period.

So yes, I want the most useful gear in the game. However, I do not want to have to spend months obtaining it. That is the issue. Many of us know how much we play and how often mats/weapons have dropped for us in the past. So we already know that it could be several months before we can craft our weapons for our mains.

Worse for those of us with alts. It could be 1/2 a year before we have completed crafting for all characters.

Is 3-6 months reasonable for obtaining max stat weapons? At launch, the answer would have been no. And that answer would have come from Arenanet because they had various ways to obtain Exotics and 2 weeks was the average time.

If you guys spent half as much time grinding as you did complaining in this thread you’d all have an ascended weapon already.

The only “grind” is that you need to do world events, kill champs, and run dungeons… the horror… playing the game… how could they…

To the people saying ‘exotics were too quick to get so they introduced ascended’, an awful lot of people sang this games praises and came to it because they were told that it was going to be about playing the game not grinding for gear. They even created a cosmetic grind to keep the gear grinders happy in the form of skins and legendaries. The PVE guys who ( I assume) are the ones that wanted another gear level are the ones that dont actually need the bloody gear as there is no content requiring it. The WvW guys who (I assume) did not want the gear are now facing the choice of give up WvW for a few months to do PVE (WvW players are generally rather poor and cannot just buy all the mats of the trade post) in order to get the not insignificant amount of mats and gold required to level up their crafting so they can make the weapons or just ignore the gear level (for your guide, PVP centric players go to great lengths to not be at a gear disadvantage to their opponents).

I have chosen to ignore the gear level and probably quit playing when the armour comes out as the difference in stats will be too high then.. But after a few days since patch WvW has already become farmville with barely any pretence of being anything else any more = not fun for me so probably will be off. For those that are embracing the changes and loving it have fun and I doubt I will see you in another game as we have different tastes.

Theftwind.8976:

The sheer amount of materials required to fashion an ascended weapon is ludicrous. I have read fantasy novels ever since I was knee high to a grasshopper and considering “Stormbringer”, “Excalibur”, “Sting and Glamdring”, “Werewindle”, and “Callandor” nowhere could I find a sword that requires over 800 ingots of metal to create. (not counting all the other materials). One can overlook the 1,500 ingots used to create a Legendary such as Twilight as those are used to create a “Gift of Metal” which then becomes part of the sword’s creation. With Ascended however they do not even bother to hide the grind behind the story of a “Gift”, just throw all this stuff into a forge and you will get a sword light enough for you to wield with special powers.

They could have done it differently and still dragged out the process as long as they wanted to. Clues in the world to special recipes, certain beasts to kill for special reagents, skills that need to be required by practice, and so on.

Sadly game developers have lost the ability to tell stories in their games and to make those stories believable. That lack of believable storytelling is what turns great games into a grind. They take the easy/lazy way out by increasing or inflating the costs for items in materials or gold rather then adding real content and sadly this process exists in all games. A game starts out with great promise; there are new stories to be told; new discoveries to be made that fit the story being told but eventually they reach the point where that story no longer makes any sense. It gets lost in the inflation of gold/materials/time or more commonly known as the grind to fill in the gaps.

Single player games have a finite timeline. They have a beginning and an ending to tell a story and thus can be made to be more believable. MMO’s are meant to be ongoing so the timeline they can encompass does not end. The lack of a good story is filled in by the grind and this is a good example of that. One day, hopefully, a developer will begin to understand that the greater and more believable the story you tell the greater your game will be.

This game does not need more developers, it needs more story tellers.

This. If Guild Wars 2 with it’s massive lore/story background with Guild Wars 1 can’t even bother to rationalize how 500 pieces of shiny material makes a one-handed sword, then it has failed the “r” portion of “RPG”.

Lurch.9517:

To the people saying ‘exotics were too quick to get so they introduced ascended’, an awful lot of people sang this games praises and came to it because they were told that it was going to be about playing the game not grinding for gear. They even created a cosmetic grind to keep the gear grinders happy in the form of skins and legendaries. The PVE guys who ( I assume) are the ones that wanted another gear level are the ones that dont actually need the bloody gear as there is no content requiring it. The WvW guys who (I assume) did not want the gear are now facing the choice of give up WvW for a few months to do PVE (WvW players are generally rather poor and cannot just buy all the mats of the trade post) in order to get the not insignificant amount of mats and gold required to level up their crafting so they can make the weapons or just ignore the gear level (for your guide, PVP centric players go to great lengths to not be at a gear disadvantage to their opponents).

I have chosen to ignore the gear level and probably quit playing when the armour comes out as the difference in stats will be too high then.. But after a few days since patch WvW has already become farmville with barely any pretence of being anything else any more = not fun for me so probably will be off. For those that are embracing the changes and loving it have fun and I doubt I will see you in another game as we have different tastes.

Thought of putting my opinions on the matter but this largely sums it up. I am one of those that praise the ease in which exotics were obtained, because for me it’s silly to want content (or what passes for it for some) in the form of trying to get to a fun point rather than the fun itself. I prefer a quick means to get the top gear u want, and then spend much more time after doing stuff with said gear (dungeons, fractals, WvW…FUN stuff) rather then spend countless hours trying to obtain said gear. Some would say " you want stuff handed to you" i would say “the point is to do the fun stuff, not preparing for it”. (it should take some effort to get stuff, mind you, but not THAT much).

It’s a basic concept that doesn’t require a complex understanding to determine if the implementation was done well or in line with Arena Net’s core values:

Is getting Ascended gear fun?

Just ask yourself that question before you start grinding away at content to obtain it.

If the answer is yes for you then go ahead, this game is for you.
If the answer is no for you then don’t do it, this game is not for you.

I don’t like having been mislead in regard to Arena Net’s design and development of Guild Wars 2, and I will not support this or any game that makes development decisions that directly conflict with a founding doctrine which established the premise many, myself included, used to justify purchasing an MMO.

They’ve systematically neglected or killed everything about Guild Wars 2 that was redeeming, leaving the fruit of their years of obsessive development to rot in the basket full of all the other bad apples in the genre.

DeWolfe.2174:

I can make the argument pretty simple. The economy has become the 800 pound Gorilla in the game. Because it appears the economy is affecting the developers judgement.

Obviously the “No grind” sales pitch was misleading. To say Ascended Gear was created because we obtained Exotics too quickly, means they always intended for us to be chasing a level of gear. Not spending the majority of our time experiencing content and story.

I don’t see how you can draw this conclusion. Making one thing too easy doesn’t mean that anything requires the majority of our time. In fact, Ascended gear, in and of itself, doesn’t require all that much time…it’s an encouragement to play different parts of the game.

Now that has negative and positive drawbacks, but it has very little to do with time. For example, after I get my crafting to 450, which doesn’t take much time itself, I can only craft for a few minutes a day.

Obviously to get some of the stuff I need, I do have to play the game. Dungeons, mini dungeons, jumping puzzles, world events…yes, these are things we’re encouraged to do. But I tend to do them casually. I’d basically do all of them at one point or another. The more you want that gear NOW, the faster you have to do that stuff, but make no mistake. Most people will end up eventually getting the mats just by playing.

You’re not spending more time getting this gear. You’re spending more time playing the game.

Some people, no doubt, don’t enjoy being forced to play the game to get the gear…but that’s a far cry from saying they want us to spend more time getting the gear than playing the game. Because the only way to get the gear is to play the game.

I blame Obama, ya’ll idiots should’ve voted Ron Paul. Now you got yourselves a massive ascended grind, good going morons.

Vayne.8563:

DeWolfe.2174:

I can make the argument pretty simple. The economy has become the 800 pound Gorilla in the game. Because it appears the economy is affecting the developers judgement.

Obviously the “No grind” sales pitch was misleading. To say Ascended Gear was created because we obtained Exotics too quickly, means they always intended for us to be chasing a level of gear. Not spending the majority of our time experiencing content and story.

I don’t see how you can draw this conclusion. Making one thing too easy doesn’t mean that anything requires the majority of our time. In fact, Ascended gear, in and of itself, doesn’t require all that much time…it’s an encouragement to play different parts of the game.

Now that has negative and positive drawbacks, but it has very little to do with time. For example, after I get my crafting to 450, which doesn’t take much time itself, I can only craft for a few minutes a day.

Obviously to get some of the stuff I need, I do have to play the game. Dungeons, mini dungeons, jumping puzzles, world events…yes, these are things we’re encouraged to do. But I tend to do them casually. I’d basically do all of them at one point or another. The more you want that gear NOW, the faster you have to do that stuff, but make no mistake. Most people will end up eventually getting the mats just by playing.

You’re not spending more time getting this gear. You’re spending more time playing the game.

Some people, no doubt, don’t enjoy being forced to play the game to get the gear…but that’s a far cry from saying they want us to spend more time getting the gear than playing the game. Because the only way to get the gear is to play the game.

Not if you want to do your dailies, pvp or even wvw because they mostly dont overlap with getting mats for ascended weapons. For example WvW how many times will you be able to capture a tower in an hour in order to get the dragonite?

PvP HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Well at least my least favorite part of the game get royally screwed as well. No G, no karma, no ascended mats, nada. All the PvPers can live in the self contained Mists and not venture out into Tyria at all.

Khal Drogo.9631:

Vayne.8563:

MikaHR.1978:

Galen Grey.4709:

Hrithmus.2583:

353 replies and 7373 Views on this post and not one Dev Reply yet. Man they must be scared?

Because they know its pointless. Whatever they would say themselves has been said many times over by regular players. Did any of that chance a single opinion of either side?

A post by the devs would be counter productive. All it would do is cause more rage in the end.

Yes, everyone knows that they dont have anything to say that would calm it down, and they certainly cant say the truth so they just ignore it and hope it goes away

They have said the truth. The truth is that exotics didn’t take long enough to get. Do you know how many people hit level cap in this game and left because there was nothing for them to do? The forums were full of such posts.

It’s not like 3 guys in a room made all of them.

You think farming and grind will convince people to stay or entice these people back? They may not have wanted vertical progression but more content instead.

Exactly.

I was here like Vayne since launch. I saw many of the complaint posts in this Forum. There were more people complaining about “no trinity,” “no raids,” “no mounts,” “no new dynamic events,” than about not having another gear tier to get. But this was no different than complaints on non-GW2 forums. For months, people talked about “no raids.” Some said they would buy the game anyway. Some said they would not.

In fact, there were people who admitted that they came from WOW and did not like the end game or lack of an endgame. More people even responded after they read Arenanet’s Endgame Reimagined article in September (some negative, some positive).

Many of those people did not like most of the content in the game. They admitted to hating jps, wvw, spvp, dynamic events, etc. They wanted raids, the trinity, and questgivers. Basically, many of us pointed out that it was not that GW2 had nothing to do after reaching 80. It was that they did not like what GW2 offered – the same thing they hated doing at lvl 1 they hated doing at lvl cap.

They did not like most of the game’s content. So tell me how adding a new gear tier was going to fix that?

Here is my question. Once you get this new gear tier, what are you going to do with it?

JPs? WvW, Dynamic Events? Hearts? It like being all dressed up with no place to go. Since you know, you don’t like the fun stuff in the game.

Vayne.8563:

Guild Wars 1 did it perfectly, except that it was never a household name, was never going to be a household name. They did it great for an extreme minority of people, because most people who played Guild Wars 1 didn’t stay for any length of time. They tried it and went to WoW (like both my kids).

Now, with a bigger, more ambitious game and a bigger staff, they can’t do what they did eight years ago when GW 1 came out. The gaming industry was different, the cost of producing the game was different, the amount of competition was different.

If Guild Wars 1 came out today with better graphics, it probably wouldn’t have lasted long enough for a sequel to be produced.

For someone who calls others out for stating opinion as fact you do the same rather frequently.

What percentage of people who tried GW1 didn’t stay for any length of time ? You claim that it was at least 51%. I would love to see your data showing that most people who tried GW1 left it for WoW.

Of course GW1 was aimed at a small minority of people. So is WoW. The sum total of all MMO populations combined would be a small minority of people.

Khal Drogo.9631:

Vayne.8563:

DeWolfe.2174:

I can make the argument pretty simple. The economy has become the 800 pound Gorilla in the game. Because it appears the economy is affecting the developers judgement.

Obviously the “No grind” sales pitch was misleading. To say Ascended Gear was created because we obtained Exotics too quickly, means they always intended for us to be chasing a level of gear. Not spending the majority of our time experiencing content and story.

I don’t see how you can draw this conclusion. Making one thing too easy doesn’t mean that anything requires the majority of our time. In fact, Ascended gear, in and of itself, doesn’t require all that much time…it’s an encouragement to play different parts of the game.

Now that has negative and positive drawbacks, but it has very little to do with time. For example, after I get my crafting to 450, which doesn’t take much time itself, I can only craft for a few minutes a day.

Obviously to get some of the stuff I need, I do have to play the game. Dungeons, mini dungeons, jumping puzzles, world events…yes, these are things we’re encouraged to do. But I tend to do them casually. I’d basically do all of them at one point or another. The more you want that gear NOW, the faster you have to do that stuff, but make no mistake. Most people will end up eventually getting the mats just by playing.

You’re not spending more time getting this gear. You’re spending more time playing the game.

Some people, no doubt, don’t enjoy being forced to play the game to get the gear…but that’s a far cry from saying they want us to spend more time getting the gear than playing the game. Because the only way to get the gear is to play the game.

Not if you want to do your dailies, pvp or even wvw because they mostly dont overlap with getting mats for ascended weapons. For example WvW how many times will you be able to capture a tower in an hour in order to get the dragonite?

PvP HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Well at least my least favorite part of the game get royally screwed as well. No G, no karma, no ascended mats, nada. All the PvPers can live in the self contained Mists and not venture out into Tyria at all.

Stealth capping an unupgraded tower, maybe one or two in an hour, add to that some havoc capping of camps in between avoiding huge zergs.

And you need ascended in spvp for what again?

dalendria.3762:

Khal Drogo.9631:

Vayne.8563:

MikaHR.1978:

Galen Grey.4709:

Hrithmus.2583:

353 replies and 7373 Views on this post and not one Dev Reply yet. Man they must be scared?

Because they know its pointless. Whatever they would say themselves has been said many times over by regular players. Did any of that chance a single opinion of either side?

A post by the devs would be counter productive. All it would do is cause more rage in the end.

Yes, everyone knows that they dont have anything to say that would calm it down, and they certainly cant say the truth so they just ignore it and hope it goes away

They have said the truth. The truth is that exotics didn’t take long enough to get. Do you know how many people hit level cap in this game and left because there was nothing for them to do? The forums were full of such posts.

It’s not like 3 guys in a room made all of them.

You think farming and grind will convince people to stay or entice these people back? They may not have wanted vertical progression but more content instead.

Exactly.

I was here like Vayne since launch. I saw many of the complaint posts in this Forum. There were more people complaining about “no trinity,” “no raids,” “no mounts,” “no new dynamic events,” than about not having another gear tier to get. But this was no different than complaints on non-GW2 forums. For months, people talked about “no raids.” Some said they would buy the game anyway. Some said they would not.

In fact, there were people who admitted that they came from WOW and did not like the end game or lack of an endgame. More people even responded after they read Arenanet’s Endgame Reimagined article in September (some negative, some positive).

Many of those people did not like most of the content in the game. They admitted to hating jps, wvw, spvp, dynamic events, etc. They wanted raids, the trinity, and questgivers. Basically, many of us pointed out that it was not that GW2 had nothing to do after reaching 80. It was that they did not like what GW2 offered – the same thing they hated doing at lvl 1 they hated doing at lvl cap.

They did not like most of the game’s content. So tell me how adding a new gear tier was going to fix that?

Here is my question. Once you get this new gear tier, what are you going to do with it?

JPs? WvW, Dynamic Events? Hearts? It like being all dressed up with no place to go. Since you know, you don’t like the fun stuff in the game.

And thats the funny part, ANet trying to cater to people that dont like the game in the first place.

Vayne.8563:

DeWolfe.2174:

I can make the argument pretty simple. The economy has become the 800 pound Gorilla in the game. Because it appears the economy is affecting the developers judgement.

Obviously the “No grind” sales pitch was misleading. To say Ascended Gear was created because we obtained Exotics too quickly, means they always intended for us to be chasing a level of gear. Not spending the majority of our time experiencing content and story.

I don’t see how you can draw this conclusion. Making one thing too easy doesn’t mean that anything requires the majority of our time. In fact, Ascended gear, in and of itself, doesn’t require all that much time…it’s an encouragement to play different parts of the game.

No, Dailies are an “encouragement” to play different parts of the game. Adding in fun new rewards would be another way to encourage playing different parts. Making the game itself more fun would be the best way to encourage playing it.

What ANet has done is set up a system that extorts us into playing very specific parts of the game in very specific, grindy ways if we want to maintain a competitive stat total. Sure, you don’t HAVE to grind champions all day and then go into crafting, but then you’ll fall behind other players who are willing to put in the time.

A core tenant, perhaps THE core tenant, of GW1 (and supposedly GW2) was that playing more shouldn’t give you a statistical advantage over your fellow players. There would be a stat baseline everyone could reach fairly easily, and then all the rewards after that would be purely cosmetic. Want to dump a bajillion hours into the game? Here, shoot for a Legendary weapon or two, but you’re still going to have to fight on the same playing field as Joe Casual.

Ascended gear will cause people to fall behind, in some cases rather significantly. This wouldn’t be such a big deal except it’s explicitly not supposed to happen in GW2. It’s a betrayal of core principles, and I think it’s clear that many of us find that disturbing and unacceptable.

Blaine Tog.8304:

Vayne.8563:

DeWolfe.2174:

I can make the argument pretty simple. The economy has become the 800 pound Gorilla in the game. Because it appears the economy is affecting the developers judgement.

Obviously the “No grind” sales pitch was misleading. To say Ascended Gear was created because we obtained Exotics too quickly, means they always intended for us to be chasing a level of gear. Not spending the majority of our time experiencing content and story.

I don’t see how you can draw this conclusion. Making one thing too easy doesn’t mean that anything requires the majority of our time. In fact, Ascended gear, in and of itself, doesn’t require all that much time…it’s an encouragement to play different parts of the game.

No, Dailies are an “encouragement” to play different parts of the game. Adding in fun new rewards would be another way to encourage playing different parts. Making the game itself more fun would be the best way to encourage playing it.

What ANet has done is set up a system that extorts us into playing very specific parts of the game in very specific, grindy ways if we want to maintain a competitive stat total. Sure, you don’t HAVE to grind champions all day and then go into crafting, but then you’ll fall behind other players who are willing to put in the time.

A core tenant, perhaps THE core tenant, of GW1 (and supposedly GW2) was that playing more shouldn’t give you a statistical advantage over your fellow players. There would be a stat baseline everyone could reach fairly easily, and then all the rewards after that would be purely cosmetic. Want to dump a bajillion hours into the game? Here, shoot for a Legendary weapon or two, but you’re still going to have to fight on the same playing field as Joe Casual.

Ascended gear will cause people to fall behind, in some cases rather significantly. This wouldn’t be such a big deal except it’s explicitly not supposed to happen in GW2. It’s a betrayal of core principles, and I think it’s clear that many of us find that disturbing and unacceptable.

This.. I really feel betrayed by Anet through the introduction of ‘basic’ (non-cosmetic) BiS equipment that requires a significant amount of devoted time..

I can’t even begin to imagine how much time we have to devote for ascended armors. If we are to follow the means of acquiring ascended weapons, it will take us 3 months just to fully equip 1 character

All of the recent changes from the two week living story updates, the achievement rewards, the magic find changes, the crafting reset, and the time-gated ascended gear (along with some I’m sure I forgot to mention) have one very basic, undeniable goal… they are all geared to get you playing this game on a daily basis or forever fall behind those that can/do.

I know that there is a group of MMO players out there that love this kind of grind/progression, and I’m not going to knock someone for liking that. However, there are many MMOs already on the market that cater to that playstyle and Guild Wars 2 was not supposed to be one of them!

I bought this game because I loved the original Guild Wars and loved that they were going to keep the same basic design philosophy and just push the envelope further. ArenaNet saw people complaining and leaving because the grind/progression wasn’t there for them at end-game and they scrambled to get them back. Unfortunately they never stopped to ask themselves how players like me would feel about these changes.

I still love this game, and I’m not leaving. I’ve basically resigned myself to the knowledge that grinders are going to surpass me even though they start playing a year after I did. I know there will be items that I will NEVER have because of the way I choose to play, but I refuse to jump on the grind treadmill at the expense of my fun. I can still have fun in this game if I choose to ignore content that is not intended to appeal to me. It doesn’t mean I have to like this change in direction, or be silent and not provide feedback, and I know there are many of you who will not agree with my viewpoint and that is fine.

I just wish ArenaNet would have stuck with their core philosophy of being the anti-grind MMO because I honestly believe the players who enjoy this grind/progression style will abandon this game as soon as a WoW type successor is launched.

I’d just like to make one final point, a lot of these changes are not about making challenging content to keep epic rewards rare, they are to slow progression towards things that were much easier to acquire in the original game. The changes to Tequatl illustrates ArenaNet improving an encounter to make epic loot feel deserved after a difficult encounter. The change to magic find is just a tedious multi-year grind intended to provide a carrot to log in daily all so you can earn a few more green drops.

dalendria.3762:

youkai.2394:

The point is that the Gw2 community wants everything instant. Farm is boring, give us 1 legendary per player via mail!

Why is it that whenever anyone talks about how ridiculous the requirements are for obtaining max stat gear, someone says “we” want it instantly? That is an extreme statement without ever considering a middle ground.

Its called a strawman argument and yes it is annoying. The vast majority who object to the ascended implementation do not want it handed to us on a platter.