Guild Wars 2

tigirius.9014:

Galtrix.7369:

Most of the updates were definitely pointless. Blizzard had countless updates and tweaks to the game every day. But, WoW also had about 4 times the content that Guild Wars 2 has at the moment, so I found myself happy with the amount of content I could complete until an expansion came out. In other words, I didn’t need the constant updates that GW2 has to do constantly when I was playing WoW. So GW2 has a lot more updates than WoW, but WoW’s updates were better, with less bugs.

There’s a big big reason for this that most players have ignored or outright lied about trying to make it not happen.

PTR.

WoW used the PTR big time and it saved the players alot of headaches in the long run. This game uses some kind of weird testing I’ve never seen before in any mmo out even the F2P ones that are old as dirt as well as the ones just released, they all have PTR’s. It’s just essential to make sure that mistakes don’t happen, mistakes like the three weakest classes in this game.

I find it weird that this game doesn’t have a test server.

ColinJohanson.2394:

Zoia.3678:

I’m quite happy with the amount of updates in GW2, but I wish more of it was permanent.

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like.

news for you, your living story content does nto work, its not exciting, its not epic, its trivial and no one really cares about it.
You have a game with so much potential but its being wasted, you could be driving an epic narrative with truely awesome events that change the world over time to build a fantasy storyline that comes alive in a game in a tangible way….instead we get the equivalent of a throwaway holiday book thats feels like the author just churned it out to keep the numbers up….

Please start thinking BIG and not in such a small way.

ColinJohanson.2394:

Zoia.3678:

I’m quite happy with the amount of updates in GW2, but I wish more of it was permanent.

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like. Based on all of your feedback, you’ll be seeing a greater degree of permanent content built into future living world releases in 2013. And of course, some things you’ve seen before may return again, in its current form but updated like SAB or holiday festivals, or in a new form entirely….

We’ve got a few more updates coming more along the lines of what we’ve done so far in the vein of holiday festivals, but as the year progresses we’re going to layer more permanent changes and content as well with each living world release. I’ll toss a blog post up in a couple of weeks that outlines high level, where we’re taking our living world style updates specifically in the future for more clear transparency once we’ve got it all ironed out.

As always all of your feedback and comments are greatly appreciated, we’ll continue to adapt and grow this strategy and concept as we go. As we’ve said before, we’re trying something very new and different here, and in some ways we’re learning along with all of you how we make a living world style game work.

Thank you very…very…very…very much.

Galtrix.7369:

Most of the updates were definitely pointless. Blizzard had countless updates and tweaks to the game every day. But, WoW also had about 4 times the content that Guild Wars 2 has at the moment, so I found myself happy with the amount of content I could complete until an expansion came out. In other words, I didn’t need the constant updates that GW2 has to do constantly when I was playing WoW. So GW2 has a lot more updates than WoW, but WoW’s updates were better, with less bugs.

The Bugs I;ll grant you, Anet sertiously need to invest in quality control.
But the quality? no. WoW updates were few and far between with massively subpar quality and they were usualy pretty buggy to.
If you want a standard of updates to aspire to, look at Rift in the first 18months (not so much lately unfortunatly), quality and quantity both.

I think that the best way for ArenaNet to understand what it is people want is for everyone to talk about what exactly they are expecting from them rather than comparing this game to a really old one made by a company with way more resources and took way more time to develop huge chunks of permanent content.

The problem with that method is the game would feel static and boring as heck if everything they added was always there. That’s the biggest flaw of any MMO to date, I appreciate that ArenaNet is trying to create a world that feels alive and isn’t static, and I trust that they have a good handle on how to go about doing that as it really hasn’t been done before, at least not to this degree. Yeah, we need more permanent content for sure…But I would prefer the seamless & progressive attempt at both in a reasonable amount of time, than to be waiting 3 months or 6 months for a big update where the world doesn’t really change much between it all.

I played WoW from launch. When it launched, it was still smaller than this game in scope but they’ve always been REALLY SLOW at content development and it made that game get boring ALL the time. Everyone would rush on to play the new update then slowly trickle off back to a capital city to chat & troll each other between dungeon runs. Blizzard is phenomenally slow, and honestly most of the updates weren’t all that big, and that’s not going to work in a modern MMO.

ColinJohanson.2394:

As always all of your feedback and comments are greatly appreciated, we’ll continue to adapt and grow this strategy and concept as we go. As we’ve said before, we’re trying something very new and different here, and in some ways we’re learning along with all of you how we make a living world style game work.

I just wanted to say: respect to all the devs who are constantly criticized (sometimes rightfully, sometimes not) and nontheless work hard to please us.

I know it’s not feasible for the devs to reply in the suggestion forums what they like and what they dislike about certain ideas/suggestions, it would help us to know what you’re looking for though. Therefore I’d suggest: give us some ideas in which areas of the game you need new ideas urgently.

It’s just frustrating to write walls of text and no one replies on those suggestions.

The fact that this forum is so dead is just further evidence of how little people care about the game anymore. People quit more and more often by the day. Normally a dev post with any other game would receive a mass of more posts, but when the official forums of a game have so few posts and so much time in between replies.

Well, bottom line is, permanent, meaningful content needs to be added. Bugs need fixing, dungeons need to be more fun and rewarding (The ascalon revamp is neither) and there needs to be more game types then just domination. Wub has been shown enough love, pay attention to the people that somehow still manage to play a single gametype daily.

Galtrix.7369:

Most of the updates were definitely pointless. Blizzard had countless updates and tweaks to the game every day. But, WoW also had about 4 times the content that Guild Wars 2 has at the moment, so I found myself happy with the amount of content I could complete until an expansion came out. In other words, I didn’t need the constant updates that GW2 has to do constantly when I was playing WoW. So GW2 has a lot more updates than WoW, but WoW’s updates were better, with less bugs.

Agree’d.

Since I quit several months ago there have been updates, but nothing has really changed. I see no reason to come back and play more. So I pay a subscription and play a game that when they do update, contains actual content for me to participate in on a regular basis.

Celestina.2894:

Zoia.3678:

I’m quite happy with the amount of updates in GW2, but I wish more of it was permanent.
Rift is/was P2P and I was impressed by all the content they released on a regular basis. But, last I heard, they are going F2P as well, or have already done so.

They’re going f2p, right now no game except WoW can survive as P2P. It’s simply no longer viable, and it has nothing to do with game quality. The only reason WoW still works as P2P is because it came out at a time when MMO competition was weak at best and honestly still a “niche” of sorts. Plus it was Blizzard and Warcraft.

(sorry I know off topic, but wanted to put that out there before anyone came to the conclusion that Rift was horrid. People seem to have this idea where f2p = horrid)

final fantasy xi is also still pay to play

Yaki.9563:

Since I quit several months ago there have been updates, but nothing has really changed. I see no reason to come back and play more. So I pay a subscription and play a game that when they do update, contains actual content for me to participate in on a regular basis.

well you missed quite a lot of fun stuff, Molten Factory was the best dungeon in the game and SAB was tons of JP-fun.

I agree that all of that should have been permanent, but saying that nothing has changed is just not true. A lot has changed during those living story sections (and has been removed too )

Yaki.9563:

So I pay a subscription and play a game that when they do update, contains actual content for me to participate in on a regular basis.

Yeah, you get new content which destroyes the old content. As great as the Lich King or Illidan were, no one plays those today anymore because you’ve outleveled that content. In GW2 even the starter-areas are still relevant, we’ve seen this with Flame and Frost.

I’m sure these events and temporary content appeals to a lot, but to me its kinda gotten old, i try hard to enjoy them knowing they are gonna be gone in a few weeks (sure some parts stay)..

The whole RNG shadow over every event hurts me the most and i wonder why i bother doing these things.. I guess i’m more of a GW1 expansion type person not a flash in the pan content lover..

but it kinda seems like the only major new permanent content we have gotten was the fractal dungeons, everything else was either more minor or temporary.

sonicwhip.9052:

but it kinda seems like the only major new permanent content we have gotten was the fractal dungeons, everything else was either more minor or temporary.

Guild missions are neither minor nor temporary. There are a lot of them. Some of them are kitten ed good content. Guild rushes in particularly are fun as hell.

Id like to see the beta events that happened to come back as permanent random WORLD EVENTS much like the Favored “branded” event when everyone was converted to branded that died in the map(not everywhere, just in the area) that got to KILL other players(if they could) and convert them to branded. the Legends Eir Stigalkin were in the areas too! i would LOVE to see this.
Link to the event

I’ve seen 5 bugged events still after playing for 3 days coming back from a 4 month break. This is unacceptable, I do not care how often you are adding content, the fact that old content still bugs out, almost 1 year later, and new content you release is constantly bugged and does not work properly is not right.

Also the quality of the past 2 content updates(null/canach + karka queen) were that of something someone made in RPG maker. I’ve seen better bosses and mechanics in a RPG maker game than Null, Canach, and the Karka queen. Karka queen is the worst open world boss in the game, basically being a veteran/champion karka with a boring mechanic that makes no sense and is a total pushover with no real strategy or skill involved. The temple bosses were much harder, and tons of other boses were too.

If the quality of stuff you are adding is going to diminish because you are trying to update the game too quickly, then please either hire more people, or update slower and spend more time creating content. I would prefer quick, bug-free, well designed content every 2 weeks(PSO2 does this, PSO2’s content also is permanent and they add much more and much better content, also a 100% free to play game and not buy to play), but if that is not possible please make better quality content at a slower pace.

Karizee.8076:

Absolutely. Don’t know why anyone would pay a sub these days.

Because most sub games are games we want to play? It’s hard to grasp I know :P

I like GW2 but if a game wants to make me pay 15 bucks a month to play. I’m okay with that as long as it’s enjoyable. A lot of subs are being thrown away though with the new MMO model of cash shops. That’s why a lot of newer mmos are going to be F2P.

But back to the topic, the content is regular for sure but like another poster said it isn’t to my tastes. They are fun for a bit and then go stale after I finish them in a day. (That’s not even me playing hardcorely. As I don’t with GW2. It’s my casual MMO.)

Guild Missions are nice but I can’t seem to get a guild that does them so I haven’t done one yet. FNF was cool but it got boring and then went away leaving nothing to enjoy.

They need beefier updates imo.

Cameirus.8407:

If you want a standard of updates to aspire to, look at Rift in the first 18months (not so much lately unfortunatly), quality and quantity both.

Yeah, that game to date had the most content thrown at players I’ve ever seen. I couldn’t believe it. Then they started developing two other games and now they are publishing ArcheAge. Supposed to show ArcheAge off at E3.

GW2 does have more updates than any other MMOs, but all of these updates feels like unimportant to franchise. Quality over quantity, and all of these updates are not up to the bar right now.

Thank you Colin and rest of Anet for listening! I really enjoyed the Flame & Frost dungeon and was sad to see it go away never to return. Content like that is something that is fun to visit, even if it’s just for nostalgia. (I used to go back to Sorrow’s Furnace in GW1 all the time just cause it was fun. Forgeman had to die every bounty.) Please keep focusing on balancing rewards (either by making some farms better or making CofP1 more similar to other rewards) and adding permanent content to the game. You’re doing a great job with pretty much everything else!

Karizee.8076:

Absolutely. Don’t know why anyone would pay a sub these days.

Heh… I would’ve gladly paid 15/mo for this game…

Silentsins.3726:

Karizee.8076:

Absolutely. Don’t know why anyone would pay a sub these days.

Heh… I would’ve gladly paid 15/mo for this game…

Truthfully, I would have quit a bit ago if there was a sub here. Luckily there isn’t :P

Yup, people forget the Guild Missions who are also a big amount of permanent content.

That said, it is not accessible to everybody, so in my opinion it is time to prepare a new fractal update : permanent end-game content that can be replayed for a while and always offer challenge and reward. I’m still running them !

On the other side, I loved the festival-like temporary content (Halloween/Wintersday/SAB) so I hope they won’t stop this either.

Runescape is the only MMO I have paid and would ever pay a subscription fee for. But only because Runescape since I started playing in 2004, has had updates 2-4 times a month. To me, it’s a good example of how a subscription mmo should work. I have no issue with paying for an MMO, if it’s actually putting out new content all the time.

Tamaki Revolution.3548:

tigirius.9014:

Galtrix.7369:

Most of the updates were definitely pointless. Blizzard had countless updates and tweaks to the game every day. But, WoW also had about 4 times the content that Guild Wars 2 has at the moment, so I found myself happy with the amount of content I could complete until an expansion came out. In other words, I didn’t need the constant updates that GW2 has to do constantly when I was playing WoW. So GW2 has a lot more updates than WoW, but WoW’s updates were better, with less bugs.

There’s a big big reason for this that most players have ignored or outright lied about trying to make it not happen.

PTR.

WoW used the PTR big time and it saved the players alot of headaches in the long run. This game uses some kind of weird testing I’ve never seen before in any mmo out even the F2P ones that are old as dirt as well as the ones just released, they all have PTR’s. It’s just essential to make sure that mistakes don’t happen, mistakes like the three weakest classes in this game.

I find it weird that this game doesn’t have a test server.

Not sure what PTR is (Google tells me it’s either a Personal Tennis Registry or a type of DNS recorder) but I’d be very surprised if they didn’t have a test server. If anyone’s ever done alpha testing of any kind you’ll know what we’re getting in the game has far too few weird bugs to be untested content.

But the test server is probably closed off from the normal ones and only accessible to Anet staff, and maybe their friends. They seem to like surprising us with new updates (or trying to anyway) and that would be ruined if everyone could see new content on an open test server before it came out.

I like the way they’ve kept the updates going, even though I’m a little disappointed by the Gemstore focus and childishness of a lot of the items (if you’re going to give us backpacks, make them cool ones, at least! I was thrilled with the FNF gear, cause that had a different look that was lore-friendly and looked like something people could actually wear. Riding clothes and Quaggan backpacks, on the other hand…)

I also agree that the temporary-ness of the updates should be removed: IIRC, the FNF periscopes are still there (at least they were a couple weeks ago when I last played my low-level Norn char), so why aren’t the FNF mobs? That would have actually made a GREAT update to the Personal Story, with an opportunity to go in-depth and discover why exactly the two groups were really cooperating? Also, the lava-dripping hands make me think of a certain type of enemy, and those Molten Gate things remind me of similar circular portal technology… My belief is that we’ll see a LOT more Molten Alliance peeps when we go after Primordius in the Central Transfer Chamber.

But I digress: I want the Living Story content to be more permanent. Think of all the people who might have joined after the Lost Shores and Secret of Southsun event, and have no clue why the Karka Queen is enraged, or who joined after FNF and wonder why some people have this bizarre “Volunteer” title…

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like. Based on all of your feedback, you’ll be seeing a greater degree of permanent content built into future living world releases in 2013. And of course, some things you’ve seen before may return again, in its current form but updated like SAB or holiday festivals, or in a new form entirely….

So to put this in another way, basically you were playing around with our gaming experience and now you’re saying that you’re planning to put in more permanent content now that you’ve pretty much arrived at what you think the game should be.

In other words, the whole of past year has been one big open beta, except there is no server-reset at the end of it all. In other words, no matter how beautiful the game was when it came out, it wasn’t finished to begin with because you haven’y made up your mind yet about what to put in permanently.

In other words, we are all guinea pigs to you.

we want cantha!!

projectcedric.6951:

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like. Based on all of your feedback, you’ll be seeing a greater degree of permanent content built into future living world releases in 2013. And of course, some things you’ve seen before may return again, in its current form but updated like SAB or holiday festivals, or in a new form entirely….

So to put this in another way, basically you were playing around with our gaming experience and now you’re saying that you’re planning to put in more permanent content now that you’ve pretty much arrived at what you think the game should be.

In other words, the whole of past year has been one big open beta, except there is no server-reset at the end of it all. In other words, no matter how beautiful the game was when it came out, it wasn’t finished to begin with because you haven’y made up your mind yet about what to put in permanently.

In other words, we are all guinea pigs to you.

How does this differ from every other MMO on planet? Do you not see this happen all the time (cause I do). This is how MMOs evolve and all the good ones do.

MMOs are an experiment, because they’re constantly changing. MMO developers test changes all the time to see the reaction.

So I’m not sure why you think this is different from any other MMO.

Vayne.8563:

projectcedric.6951:

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like. Based on all of your feedback, you’ll be seeing a greater degree of permanent content built into future living world releases in 2013. And of course, some things you’ve seen before may return again, in its current form but updated like SAB or holiday festivals, or in a new form entirely….

So to put this in another way, basically you were playing around with our gaming experience and now you’re saying that you’re planning to put in more permanent content now that you’ve pretty much arrived at what you think the game should be.

In other words, the whole of past year has been one big open beta, except there is no server-reset at the end of it all. In other words, no matter how beautiful the game was when it came out, it wasn’t finished to begin with because you haven’y made up your mind yet about what to put in permanently.

In other words, we are all guinea pigs to you.

How does this differ from every other MMO on planet? Do you not see this happen all the time (cause I do). This is how MMOs evolve and all the good ones do.

MMOs are an experiment, because they’re constantly changing. MMO developers test changes all the time to see the reaction.

So I’m not sure why you think this is different from any other MMO.

Listen to yourself, man. Do you actually really believe that kitten you wrote? Im referring to the phrase here:

“MMOs are an experiment”

What do you think is this? A science project?

You think players’ time are worth nothing to be experimented on?

And to answer your question: No, these hyper-rapid, whack-a-mole changes do not happen in MMO’s, only in Guild Wars 2. Usually, developers do tests in TEST SERVERS. Usually, there is a comprehensive and definitive closed and open beta to decide things. Usually, if something is faulty, its consistent with the game design right from the very start. Usually, updates mean new content or a bug fix – not a crazy-dramatic nerf of every farming area in the game. And most importantly, usually these things dont noticeably happen every kittening week in a poorly attempted stealth patch.

At the very least, if they don’t know what to do, the first step is usually to admit it and be open to things. Absolutely nothing -none of any of the good or bad suggestions, pro and against the game- that I have ever read in these forums have ever been implemented.

Absolutely none of the complaints -even if the complaints are contradictory to each other- has been resolved towards one way, despite how much we have been reassured that they are listening to their players. This game is a modern Third Reich. And to claim to us thakittens not so is downright insulting to my person and my intelligence.

Now, don’t even bother replying to this post, because I’m not arguing with you any further. Ive known you. Everybody here knows you. Talking to you is like talking to a wall. I’d have a better chance of a meaningful conversation talking to an ANet dev.

Cheers!

projectcedric.6951:

Vayne.8563:

projectcedric.6951:

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like. Based on all of your feedback, you’ll be seeing a greater degree of permanent content built into future living world releases in 2013. And of course, some things you’ve seen before may return again, in its current form but updated like SAB or holiday festivals, or in a new form entirely….

So to put this in another way, basically you were playing around with our gaming experience and now you’re saying that you’re planning to put in more permanent content now that you’ve pretty much arrived at what you think the game should be.

In other words, the whole of past year has been one big open beta, except there is no server-reset at the end of it all. In other words, no matter how beautiful the game was when it came out, it wasn’t finished to begin with because you haven’y made up your mind yet about what to put in permanently.

In other words, we are all guinea pigs to you.

How does this differ from every other MMO on planet? Do you not see this happen all the time (cause I do). This is how MMOs evolve and all the good ones do.

MMOs are an experiment, because they’re constantly changing. MMO developers test changes all the time to see the reaction.

So I’m not sure why you think this is different from any other MMO.

Listen to yourself, man. Do you actually really believe that kitten you wrote? Im referring to the phrase here:

“MMOs are an experiment”

What do you think is this? A science project?

You think players’ time are worth nothing to be experimented on?

And to answer your question: No, these hyper-rapid, whack-a-mole changes do not happen in MMO’s, only in Guild Wars 2. Usually, developers do tests in TEST SERVERS. Usually, there is a comprehensive and definitive closed and open beta to decide things. Usually, if something is faulty, its consistent with the game design right from the very start. Usually, updates mean new content or a bug fix – not a crazy-dramatic nerf of every farming area in the game. And most importantly, usually these things dont noticeably happen every kittening week in a poorly attempted stealth patch.

At the very least, if they don’t know what to do, the first step is usually to admit it and be open to things. Absolutely nothing -none of any of the good or bad suggestions, pro and against the game- that I have ever read in these forums have ever been implemented.

Absolutely none of the complaints -even if the complaints are contradictory to each other- has been resolved towards one way, despite how much we have been reassured that they are listening to their players. This game is a modern Third Reich. And to claim to us thakittens not so is downright insulting to my person and my intelligence.

Now, don’t even bother replying to this post, because I’m not arguing with you any further. Ive known you. Everybody here knows you. Talking to you is like talking to a wall. I’d have a better chance of a meaningful conversation talking to an ANet dev.

Cheers!

I’ll reply to any post I choose to, thanks. Particularly one that’s so blatantly incorrect. I certainly don’t think you should argue with me further, because nothing you’ve said has helped your argument in the first place.

Every MMO experiments. We see WoW do it all the time. Test server or no test server, they experiment. I’ve seen Rift make a drastic change to PvP and then reverse it four days later, because everyone hated it. Because this content is temporary, there’s no reason to reverse it, so it’s SMARTER than other MMOs.

Test servers aren’t often highly populated. I was an alpha tester for Rift before the game launched, and I was on the test server after. The number of people on that test server was miniscule. It was so small that nothing really could be tested properly anyway.

Anyone who says developers of MMOs don’t experiment on the people playing the game isn’t watching very carefully.

Vayne.8563:

projectcedric.6951:

Vayne.8563:

projectcedric.6951:

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like. Based on all of your feedback, you’ll be seeing a greater degree of permanent content built into future living world releases in 2013. And of course, some things you’ve seen before may return again, in its current form but updated like SAB or holiday festivals, or in a new form entirely….

So to put this in another way, basically you were playing around with our gaming experience and now you’re saying that you’re planning to put in more permanent content now that you’ve pretty much arrived at what you think the game should be.

In other words, the whole of past year has been one big open beta, except there is no server-reset at the end of it all. In other words, no matter how beautiful the game was when it came out, it wasn’t finished to begin with because you haven’y made up your mind yet about what to put in permanently.

In other words, we are all guinea pigs to you.

How does this differ from every other MMO on planet? Do you not see this happen all the time (cause I do). This is how MMOs evolve and all the good ones do.

MMOs are an experiment, because they’re constantly changing. MMO developers test changes all the time to see the reaction.

So I’m not sure why you think this is different from any other MMO.

Listen to yourself, man. Do you actually really believe that kitten you wrote? Im referring to the phrase here:

“MMOs are an experiment”

What do you think is this? A science project?

You think players’ time are worth nothing to be experimented on?

And to answer your question: No, these hyper-rapid, whack-a-mole changes do not happen in MMO’s, only in Guild Wars 2. Usually, developers do tests in TEST SERVERS. Usually, there is a comprehensive and definitive closed and open beta to decide things. Usually, if something is faulty, its consistent with the game design right from the very start. Usually, updates mean new content or a bug fix – not a crazy-dramatic nerf of every farming area in the game. And most importantly, usually these things dont noticeably happen every kittening week in a poorly attempted stealth patch.

At the very least, if they don’t know what to do, the first step is usually to admit it and be open to things. Absolutely nothing -none of any of the good or bad suggestions, pro and against the game- that I have ever read in these forums have ever been implemented.

Absolutely none of the complaints -even if the complaints are contradictory to each other- has been resolved towards one way, despite how much we have been reassured that they are listening to their players. This game is a modern Third Reich. And to claim to us thakittens not so is downright insulting to my person and my intelligence.

Now, don’t even bother replying to this post, because I’m not arguing with you any further. Ive known you. Everybody here knows you. Talking to you is like talking to a wall. I’d have a better chance of a meaningful conversation talking to an ANet dev.

Cheers!

I’ll reply to any post I choose to, thanks. Particularly one that’s so blatantly incorrect. I certainly don’t think you should argue with me further, because nothing you’ve said has helped your argument in the first place.

Every MMO experiments. We see WoW do it all the time. Test server or no test server, they experiment. I’ve seen Rift make a drastic change to PvP and then reverse it four days later, because everyone hated it. Because this content is temporary, there’s no reason to reverse it, so it’s SMARTER than other MMOs.

Test servers aren’t often highly populated. I was an alpha tester for Rift before the game launched, and I was on the test server after. The number of people on that test server was miniscule. It was so small that nothing really could be tested properly anyway.

Anyone who says developers of MMOs don’t experiment on the people playing the game isn’t watching very carefully.

Another anecdotal proof to prove your point.

Doesn’t matter, man. Seriously. I was right. Talking to you is like talking to a wall. Good luck to every player in this game and in this forum.

What a waste of time of my few months time. I’m out. Ciao.

projectcedric.6951:

Vayne.8563:

projectcedric.6951:

Vayne.8563:

projectcedric.6951:

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like. Based on all of your feedback, you’ll be seeing a greater degree of permanent content built into future living world releases in 2013. And of course, some things you’ve seen before may return again, in its current form but updated like SAB or holiday festivals, or in a new form entirely….

So to put this in another way, basically you were playing around with our gaming experience and now you’re saying that you’re planning to put in more permanent content now that you’ve pretty much arrived at what you think the game should be.

In other words, the whole of past year has been one big open beta, except there is no server-reset at the end of it all. In other words, no matter how beautiful the game was when it came out, it wasn’t finished to begin with because you haven’y made up your mind yet about what to put in permanently.

In other words, we are all guinea pigs to you.

How does this differ from every other MMO on planet? Do you not see this happen all the time (cause I do). This is how MMOs evolve and all the good ones do.

MMOs are an experiment, because they’re constantly changing. MMO developers test changes all the time to see the reaction.

So I’m not sure why you think this is different from any other MMO.

Listen to yourself, man. Do you actually really believe that kitten you wrote? Im referring to the phrase here:

“MMOs are an experiment”

What do you think is this? A science project?

You think players’ time are worth nothing to be experimented on?

And to answer your question: No, these hyper-rapid, whack-a-mole changes do not happen in MMO’s, only in Guild Wars 2. Usually, developers do tests in TEST SERVERS. Usually, there is a comprehensive and definitive closed and open beta to decide things. Usually, if something is faulty, its consistent with the game design right from the very start. Usually, updates mean new content or a bug fix – not a crazy-dramatic nerf of every farming area in the game. And most importantly, usually these things dont noticeably happen every kittening week in a poorly attempted stealth patch.

At the very least, if they don’t know what to do, the first step is usually to admit it and be open to things. Absolutely nothing -none of any of the good or bad suggestions, pro and against the game- that I have ever read in these forums have ever been implemented.

Absolutely none of the complaints -even if the complaints are contradictory to each other- has been resolved towards one way, despite how much we have been reassured that they are listening to their players. This game is a modern Third Reich. And to claim to us thakittens not so is downright insulting to my person and my intelligence.

Now, don’t even bother replying to this post, because I’m not arguing with you any further. Ive known you. Everybody here knows you. Talking to you is like talking to a wall. I’d have a better chance of a meaningful conversation talking to an ANet dev.

Cheers!

I’ll reply to any post I choose to, thanks. Particularly one that’s so blatantly incorrect. I certainly don’t think you should argue with me further, because nothing you’ve said has helped your argument in the first place.

Every MMO experiments. We see WoW do it all the time. Test server or no test server, they experiment. I’ve seen Rift make a drastic change to PvP and then reverse it four days later, because everyone hated it. Because this content is temporary, there’s no reason to reverse it, so it’s SMARTER than other MMOs.

Test servers aren’t often highly populated. I was an alpha tester for Rift before the game launched, and I was on the test server after. The number of people on that test server was miniscule. It was so small that nothing really could be tested properly anyway.

Anyone who says developers of MMOs don’t experiment on the people playing the game isn’t watching very carefully.

Another anecdotal proof to prove your point.

Doesn’t matter, man. Seriously. I was right. Talking to you is like talking to a wall. Good luck to every player in this game and in this forum.

What a waste of time of my few months time. I’m out. Ciao.

You also can’t be counted on to keep your word, since you said you wouldn’t reply. And you know, talking to walls can be theraputic. You know buddah sat in front of a wall for two weeks and when he rose he was enlightened.

Anyway have fun wherever you end up.

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game

The most successful aspect of the game – WVW – succeeds because it’s unpredictable & emergent, unlike the majority of the rest of the game.

I really wish you’d experiment with more emergent gameplay elements, and re-introduce GW1-style skill capturing. I’m really sick of playing the same spec on my Ele because all the other weapons & traits are clunky, pidgeonholed, and/or outright ineffectual.

The only updates GW2 needs at the moment are bug fixes and Hrouda getting a proper team to polish up your seemingly half finished/broken Dungeon content.

Guild Missions clearly show that you guys have the talent to build cool, aggravating and thus interesting game mechanics.
But your management (guess that includes you too Colin?) has decided it´s wiser to butter up the userbase with flighty new “TV-episodes” that are devoured in a weekend.
This just won´t work.

The game could do so much better than the current meager increase in players, that actually is just a hair width away from going downhill fast.

Polish > Hype.

Edit: and agreed with the above poster, WvW is your key to actual longevity and a fiercely loyal userbase, not constantly rushed “GW2-soap” content.
See EVE Online or DAoC.

There goes another player, would you say the test is working or failing, i’d say the latter..

Dante.1508:

There goes another player, would you say the test is working or failing, i’d say the latter..

Unless you look at how busy it is in PVe after patch day. Oh yeah, forgot about that, did we?

Vayne.8563:

Dante.1508:

There goes another player, would you say the test is working or failing, i’d say the latter..

Unless you look at how busy it is in PVe after patch day. Oh yeah, forgot about that, did we?

How much did those glasses cost you? I always wanted to see the world rosy.

Gasoline.2570:

Vayne.8563:

Dante.1508:

There goes another player, would you say the test is working or failing, i’d say the latter..

Unless you look at how busy it is in PVe after patch day. Oh yeah, forgot about that, did we?

How much did those glasses cost you? I always wanted to see the world rosy.

Right, because Southsun didn’t have a WHOLE bunch of overflow servers. /logic

I didn’t find any glasses from southsun??? The vendors didn’t have them. Where should I look?

While I’m really grateful for all the ANet’s efforts to provide us with something fresh, new to the genre (take the lack of Holy Trinity, for example – while the way it was implemented doesn’t appeal to many people, it was a brave move and I hope they will not give up on that), the current idea of the Living Story is an exception.

I was forced to take a break from games a few months ago (an old PC exploded, and I can’t afford a new one yet), but I’ve been following GW2 all that time. And seeing the new content come and go, is terribly discouraging for me. ‘Geez, when I’m back online in September, I will have skipped tons of content already… why should I bother? Even if it’s reintroduced somehow in two years?’

While I see the point (to keep people interested in the game, to make them log in regularly etc.), I would rather see a more typical approach to the way new content is implemented – give us regular, permanent updates, focused around advancing the plot, so that even a completely new player can naturally progress and enjoy whole content: core game -> Flame and Frost -> Southsun -> whatever’s next. Temporary content should be limited, IMHO, to the holiday events AND vanity items that commemorate an introduction of a particular part of the storyline (weapon skins etc.). This way everyone will be happy – both new and veteran players will get to experience tons of content (that doesn’t get out-of-date, as in most MMOs featuring the gear treadmill), AND people playing regularly get rewarded for going through the new content as soon as it’s in the game (some of these weapon skins are truly epic, but I agree, they should remain exclusive to people playing regularly).

Good luck, ArenaNet – there are many things to be done, but I trust you will deliver.

Gasoline.2570:

I didn’t find any glasses from southsun??? The vendors didn’t have them. Where should I look?

There were goggles on southsun…maybe that’s what he’s talking about?

ColinJohanson.2394:

Zoia.3678:

I’m quite happy with the amount of updates in GW2, but I wish more of it was permanent.

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like. Based on all of your feedback, you’ll be seeing a greater degree of permanent content built into future living world releases in 2013. And of course, some things you’ve seen before may return again, in its current form but updated like SAB or holiday festivals, or in a new form entirely….

We’ve got a few more updates coming more along the lines of what we’ve done so far in the vein of holiday festivals, but as the year progresses we’re going to layer more permanent changes and content as well with each living world release. I’ll toss a blog post up in a couple of weeks that outlines high level, where we’re taking our living world style updates specifically in the future for more clear transparency once we’ve got it all ironed out.

As always all of your feedback and comments are greatly appreciated, we’ll continue to adapt and grow this strategy and concept as we go. As we’ve said before, we’re trying something very new and different here, and in some ways we’re learning along with all of you how we make a living world style game work.

does that mean that the living story will end? and >only< permanent content releases will come in the future? :-(

projectcedric.6951:

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like. Based on all of your feedback, you’ll be seeing a greater degree of permanent content built into future living world releases in 2013. And of course, some things you’ve seen before may return again, in its current form but updated like SAB or holiday festivals, or in a new form entirely….

So to put this in another way, basically you were playing around with our gaming experience and now you’re saying that you’re planning to put in more permanent content now that you’ve pretty much arrived at what you think the game should be.

In other words, the whole of past year has been one big open beta, except there is no server-reset at the end of it all. In other words, no matter how beautiful the game was when it came out, it wasn’t finished to begin with because you haven’y made up your mind yet about what to put in permanently.

In other words, we are all guinea pigs to you.

Hi there! This must be your first MMO. Welcome to the genre, where the first year of a major MMO is usually one filled with bugs, broken classes, and changing features.

WoW was like this, LoTRO was like this, AoC was like this, Warhammer was like this.

Par for the course.

ColinJohanson.2394:

Zoia.3678:

I’m quite happy with the amount of updates in GW2, but I wish more of it was permanent.

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like. Based on all of your feedback, you’ll be seeing a greater degree of permanent content built into future living world releases in 2013. And of course, some things you’ve seen before may return again, in its current form but updated like SAB or holiday festivals, or in a new form entirely….

We’ve got a few more updates coming more along the lines of what we’ve done so far in the vein of holiday festivals, but as the year progresses we’re going to layer more permanent changes and content as well with each living world release. I’ll toss a blog post up in a couple of weeks that outlines high level, where we’re taking our living world style updates specifically in the future for more clear transparency once we’ve got it all ironed out.

As always all of your feedback and comments are greatly appreciated, we’ll continue to adapt and grow this strategy and concept as we go. As we’ve said before, we’re trying something very new and different here, and in some ways we’re learning along with all of you how we make a living world style game work.

Good stuff, keep up the good work!

As a gamer, so far, GW2 is the only game that I have played (or remembered, lol) that has official communication with players this often.

Once again, keep up the good work!

It’s not just MMOs that experiment with adding/changing content. All games do it, but until recently most had to release a whole new version to try out their changes.

Look at the Zelda series for example, every game has brought something new and different and some of those changes stayed, some were removed and new ones were added in their place. Sometimes it’s relatively quick – you had to do the same dungeon about 15 times in Phantom Hourglass and everyone hated it so they dropped the idea, sometimes it’s more gradual – Twilight Princess finally hit a point where there were too many items (many of them relatively useless) so for future games they scaled it back and made sure all of them would be used multiple times in different ways.

It’s the same with pretty much any industry and regardless of how you feel about being “experimented on” it’s an essential process. If people didn’t try new ideas we wouldn’t have MMOs to begin with (or video games at all), and no amount of testing will ever equal releasing those ideas and getting real feedback from your consumers.

projectcedric.6951:

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ve been playing around so far this year with a lot of different concepts to see what works for a living world game, and see what players liked and didn’t like. Based on all of your feedback, you’ll be seeing a greater degree of permanent content built into future living world releases in 2013. And of course, some things you’ve seen before may return again, in its current form but updated like SAB or holiday festivals, or in a new form entirely….

So to put this in another way, basically you were playing around with our gaming experience and now you’re saying that you’re planning to put in more permanent content now that you’ve pretty much arrived at what you think the game should be.

In other words, the whole of past year has been one big open beta, except there is no server-reset at the end of it all. In other words, no matter how beautiful the game was when it came out, it wasn’t finished to begin with because you haven’y made up your mind yet about what to put in permanently.

In other words, we are all guinea pigs to you.

I think you’re missing the point.

They’re not experimenting on us. They’re experimenting with us.

The sub vs F2P argument is not an easy one to handle. Reason being is no two sub games or F2P games are exactly alike. They each have slightly different currency models or content mechanics which make the argument sway in different directions.

For instance SWTOR , when it went F2P basic users lost all kinds of kitten like additional character slots, full crafting capabilities, etc. I left right before that update, but I went back and played it afterwards and was severely put off by the aspects of the game that were missing for me. Sure I could unlock them over time, but for a casual player like myself I would just rather pony up $12 a month to have full access to the features. Still cheaper than a night out at a bar.

DDO another example. Content updates came in modules which needed to be purchased with TP. Everything else available in the store was just fluff (aside from perhaps reincarnations and some classes), but you had to buy or unlock those content areas or you wouldnt be able to quest with friends and such. For me it was just easier to be a premium player and have full access plus some TP to spend each month – even if I took days or weeks off at a time.

Now GW2 is full blown F2P (aside from the client purchase), complete with premium boxes only unlockable through store purchased keys (this is apparently the favored marketing approach these days). I think Anet did this well, as I don’t feel like I’m missing out on much by not spending a ton of cash each month. I’ve bought some gems for things like transmutation crystals or to convert into some gold for mats, but otherwise I don’t feel like there are entire sections of the game that are closed off to me because I don’t pay up consistently somehow. That would certainly turn me off.

The fact that GW2 has frequent small updates seems to be good enough for my casual playstyle. More aggressive players might feel it is not enough, but that is an issue with GW2 not the F2P model in general.

Vayne.8563:

Gasoline.2570:

I didn’t find any glasses from southsun??? The vendors didn’t have them. Where should I look?

There were goggles on southsun…maybe that’s what he’s talking about?

Ha, he’s referring to looking at the world through rose colored glasses