Non-berserker builds should be more rewarding
You can create your own LFG party if you wish to run other builds, or even just join a party that says “All welcome”. There’s also a few guilds out there that don’t care which build you run.
If you do tequatle or triple trouble other builds do come in handy for the specialised party in triple trouble as for teq power vit and toughness. In the new dry top its faster to kill certain bosses like the husks at the red keep with condi damage so if ur map is organised there ur condi builds would come in handy. And again you can play how you want no1 said you should join the zerker only teams make ur own team if u want to play other builds
If you do tequatle or triple trouble other builds do come in handy for the specialised party in triple trouble as for teq power vit and toughness. In the new dry top its faster to kill certain bosses like the husks at the red keep with condi damage so if ur map is organised there ur condi builds would come in handy. And again you can play how you want no1 said you should join the zerker only teams make ur own team if u want to play other builds
Silverwastes.
Also, you can make your own yes, but still, it’s a pain to find people who don’t care about zerker gear. I’ve only met a few (aside from some of my guild mates) who don’t care.
Condis should be more effective, yes. Otherwise, the simple presence of new content in the xpac will discourage zerker for a while (for that content, at least), until people get used to it.
“and basically it is the laziest way do deal a huge amount of damage.”
top kek
Other gear is not rewarding enough because it’s even easier to play. It’s simple, you can’t have something more rewarding while being easier to play.
Hi everyone.
I feel like non-berserker builds should be more rewarding, in PVE especially.
You will speek differently after you done those dungs 100x times trust me
Tekkit Mojo – Engineer
Tekkit’s Workshop
Tekkit’s Workshop
I agree with everything you said save one. Nerfing zerker is the only way to fix it really.
If they are going to work on the philosophy they’ve had this whole time where they want to eliminate what they would consider an unfair advantage (which is what basically happened to first heal scaling, then crowd control, then conditions, and finally reflects) then they need to follow through on what they started and nerf the effectiveness of zerker vs bosses and champs. Bosses and champs if everything were truly equal in this game in PVE would have a debuff that prevented crits from occurring when crits have hit just like the CC debuff works. It would diminish the effectiveness of Zerker above all else and it would force the community to become a more diverse group.
On top of this change, they need to fix condition damage stacking because that’s the key problem with conditions beyond the nerfs it’s suffered as a mechanic, conditions also have the added problem of being designed poorly.
Anyone who disagrees doesn’t believe in fairness.
Balance Team: Please Fix Mine Toolbelt Positioning!
Other gear is not rewarding enough because it’s even easier to play. It’s simple, you can’t have something more rewarding while being easier to play.
Well, ‘easier’ is complicated. Berserker gear certainly should put you at the lowest possible risk of raiders’ fatigue, but if that’s really killing people in a fight that lasts less than a minute, then that’s rather disturbing, frankly.
Anyone who disagrees doesn’t believe in fairness.
No, anyone who disagrees with you… disagrees with you. Nothing more, nothing less. That’s it.
Reflects can one-shot certain enemies; potentially keeping a boss permanently stunlocked is the very definition of lame and every MMO ‘nerfs’ CC one way or another; and several professions can still heal fast enough to be invincible.
Now compare and contrast what happens with berserker gear. It became the norm because people were mastering the content and no longer needed much defence to survive, because we’re talking about content that has been around for two years. It is, for the most part, an example of skilled play defeating things quickly, not an example of people using unintended strategies to deal with things quickly (unintended strategies are generally used to deal with things easily, not quickly, reflects aside).
Oh, and CC is perfectly viable, even in open-world champ events. The only issue with it is that you don’t see many attacks worth interrupting. Add more of those, and you’ll see more CC happening.
What really needs to happen is that all profession hp bonuses need to be halved, possibly even removed. Mesmers are already far too durable in a lot of content.
(edited by evilunderling.9265)
It’s also unfair that I cannot do the same damage with my guardian using clerics armor and staff. Please fix this! /sarcasm
It comes down to a matter of personal choice. This game uses active defense rather than passive defense that you see in other games. As such, using berserker gear rewards players with higher DPS but at a greater risk. Condition damage is damage over time whereas physical damage is straight damage. Considering most things die rather quickly, physical damage will be better as the full damage for DoT conditions will not have had enough time to be fully realized.
I agree with everything you said save one. Nerfing zerker is the only way to fix it really.
No it isn’t, people will still continue to use it because it does the most damage. There is no holy trinity, so the best stat set to use in PvE is berserker, because you don’t need other stat sets to give supporting boons or to debuff enemies.
Well My 15 characters (3w,2g,1t,3r,1m,2e,3n) have:
Zerk: 2w, 2n,1e,1r,2g,1t
zealot, 1e,1g,1n
clerics/nomads, 1g
sinister: 1w,1n,2r,1t
soldiers 1w
celestial 1e
rabid 1m,1n,1r
yes thats 23 armors… And I’m probably forgetting some… I run all but the rabid armors through CoF. With AC I tend to run zerk, not always though… In CoE zerk, well most of the time, In Fractals I run zerk, zealot, celestial or sinister. In TA mostly well all of them except the rabids…
If people have a bad time I take my zealot/zerk necro or zealot ele
If the party doesn’t do DPS, I bring my zerk pug carrier
I do not agree you do not need other stats are not usefull, I do agree, viatlity and toughness are well, mostly a waste of investment. I for one beleive in the use of healing, condition duration, boon duration to buff regen and healing and survival, but only if you can combine it with a decent build capable of sustained dps.
Which defies my clerics/nomads guardina, as it has no dps whatsoever. When fully buffed and ready It holds an amazing 1920 power, no crit, no precision. but it does have 1 thing no-one expects: 3750+ armor… Why? Just because I can.
And I will never ever take it into dungeons because it would be a kick in the whatever for my party. would be interesting though to see how much aggro I would pull… Imagine 24% crit chance -with- fury….
23 lvl 80’s, 9 times map, 4ele, 4ncr, 3war, 3grd, 3rgr, 2thf, 2msm, 1eng, 1 rev.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
(edited by PaxTheGreatOne.9472)
This is a side effect of the lack of trinity. Nothing less than that. If every player has the power to survive on their own without the need for another player’s help, then they should logically be as powerful damage wise as possible to save everyone else their valuable time.
This is just common sense in action.
I feel like berserker gear is too rewarding in PvE but nowhere near as rewarding in WvW.
We need a change that won’t damage players running full berserker in WvW because risk/reward gameplay does hold high value to many players such as I.
The problem is that PvE is handled in a very traditional way when the game’s various systems are built around PvP, which is a very different beast.
The solution has always been to do what they can to make PvE more like PvP – smart AI, less mob health, better mob mobility, faster and weaker attacks, etc.
“and basically it is the laziest way do deal a huge amount of damage.”
top kek
So.. while I think it would be cool if there was a way to fix the ‘zerk problem’ (and I’m full ascended zerk).. this guy pretty much beat me to it. Kind of getting the impression OP is just bitter about the situation. If I want to be lazy in PvE, I’ll run my soldier stuff.
Lindelle Ulfsvitr – Norn Ranger
“Walk with the pack. In the eyes of Wolf, we are all brothers and sisters.”
“Walk with the pack. In the eyes of Wolf, we are all brothers and sisters.”
Other gear is not rewarding enough because it’s even easier to play. It’s simple, you can’t have something more rewarding while being easier to play.
It’s also unfair that I cannot do the same damage with my guardian using clerics armor and staff. Please fix this! /sarcasm
You can create your own LFG party if you wish to run other builds, or even just join a party that says “All welcome”. There’s also a few guilds out there that don’t care which build you run.
I think you all interpret (or project, however you’re response is toned) the wrong intent on the OP. I don’t believe the OP is suggesting the damage of a glass build be available to non-glass build and thus quick dungeon clears be available to any build. Going by his quote:
+"Im not saying “nerf zerks”.
I think condition damage should play a greater role in PVE.
Healing power and vitality are not that important to survive.
Non-zerk builds not rewarding enough."
Would mean that the effects obtainable from the other type gears isn’t “impressive” (or rewarding, as he words it) enough to be made useful in the game.
It comes down to a matter of personal choice. This game uses active defense rather than passive defense that you see in other games. As such, using berserker gear rewards players with higher DPS but at a greater risk. Condition damage is damage over time whereas physical damage is straight damage. Considering most things die rather quickly, physical damage will be better as the full damage for DoT conditions will not have had enough time to be fully realized.
I agree and disagree with both you and the OP. Theoretically, other builds are impressive enough that they work making you capable of doing more unique things than a glass build but those things just aren’t supported by the encounters or the system.
You mention passive and active defense, and while toughness is certainly passive, healing often is not. Healing is not certainly not as valuable as damage in PvE. Most passive defense is rather lackluster compared to active defense, and that’s how it should be…but active defense is wholly too common which further devalues passive defense. It’s a broad balancing act where things like toughness and vitality simply get the short-end of the stick (in PvE).
The effective solution, however, would likely require roles to be fulfilled for a cumulative desired goal vs leaning on the extremes (all-glass to blow the boss up before it can burn through your handful of defensive measures; all-bunker and wittle down the target while it does little to your group). Would also require the player to step out of the “it’s a trinity” mindset as well since the goal would be variety not “what the meta will be” because the meta really isn’t important.
Have you ever heard someone say something so not intelligent that you don’t really want to respond to it…due to feeling like it brings you down to their level to even acknowledge it?
Logic fails:
1. Wanting the option that requires less effort and less skill to be the most rewarding.
2. Wanting to diminish the enjoyment of everyone else so you can be lazy.
3. Asserting that other people, who want nothing to do with you, are stopping you from obtaining rewards…instead of forming your own group.
4. Thinking a valid solution is to force others to play your way/with you.
5. Failing to read the game description before purchase to notice there is no trinity.
You do realize there is no inspect feature or damage meter in this game? This means either you are trying to join zerk groups or your dps/game play is so terrible that it is drawing attention to you in a negative way.
The result of buffing passive defense and/or healing power to any different extent would be to create roles in PvE, which means creating the trinity, which is not what this game is about. Once the trinity exists, then the party composition then gains a mandatory structure, which is again…not what this game is about. The only gear equalizing solution would be to have there only be one gear set allowed in pve (everyone with the same stats)…they have pretty much shown they are not going to do that. I’m pretty sure you wouldn’t want that anyway as it would take away the security blanket so many players enjoy (high vit, high toughness).
Those other gear sets do have value though. Just not so much in PvE.
(edited by ODB.6891)
Gear was designed so that players have two choices to make:
- How much condition damage or how much direct damage do I stat for?
- How much offense or how much defense do I stat for?
Given #1, it was a curious choice to have conditions work as they do while featuring large scale PvE content. I’ve come to the conclusion that the effectiveness of multiple condition stackers in large scale PvE was sacrificed at the altar of the great gawd “Making PvP Condition Play More Interesting.” While a fully offensive condition build will do less damage than a fully offensive direct damage build, there seems little reason to address that imbalance as long as the featured PvE content type results in conditions being overwritten.
As to #2, there is no way that full defensive stats or hybrid defense/offense stat mixes should kill as quickly as full offensive stats. The idea that they should ignores the principles of MMO balance by removing the opportunity costs for using defensive stats.
And guess what? If ANet were to flatten the offense/defense curve, they’d have to flatten it completely to create an environment wherein defensive stat stackers would be welcome in parties for whom speed is the primary consideration. Players excluding other players is a “people” issue. It could only be “solved” by a game-play solution if that solution were to eliminate differences completely.
And guess what else? If ANet were to flatten both the condition/direct and offense/defense curves (give everyone celestial stats, say) to allow everyone to be equal numerically, there would still be players excluding others. The criteria at that point would be skill.
I’m afraid, OP, that this is a situation that you’ll need a workaround for. Like forming your own groups, or finding a guild with like-minded players.
I love how people are now trying to say that berserker builds are LAZY.
Does the ignorant misinformation have no bounds? Nope!
So here it is – berserker is hardmode. Yes, it rips out top damage, but its glass.
Stop crying on the forum and go try it for yourself. You think we that like our zerker builds are lazy?
Oh boy are you in for a rude awakening. Go. Try it. Come back when you’ve wrung all those tears out when you realize that to go full zerker, you have no wiggle room left and if you don’t know how to move, where to go and when to use what defensive CD’s you might have, you’re done, gg.
One is only the smartest person in the room if they are alone.
Have you ever heard someone say something so not intelligent that you don’t really want to respond to it…due to feeling like it brings you down to their level to even acknowledge it?
That’s how I feel about every single one of the threads whining about berserker in PvE.
I can’t dignify it with a detailed response. All I can really do is… smirk and shake my head.
How is Zerker the laziest way to do things?
I can run full clerics on my guard and just facetank and fully heal up in all of the dungeons just spamming 1. With zerker I actually have to dodge and position and use my defensive abilities.
The main problem is how combat works. Not gear. If combat wasnt active, and more of a turn based/passive style, then other gear would be more useful. Even if you did nerf beserker gear, it will still be the best and most optimal. And even if it wasn’t, anything with power and precision would become the new beserker. And you would be back where you started.
The only way to fix such a problem would be to fundementally change how combat, stats, and gear work.
“You know what the chain of command is?
It’s the chain I beat you with until you
recognize my command!”
It’s the chain I beat you with until you
recognize my command!”
Conditions are okay, they’re just easily disregarded. Confusion, for example, is ineffective because enemies don’t really use skills. Strong conditions stack too quickly and are constantly recycled on heavy-concentrated champions.
Supportive/Tanky stats like toughness and healing power are disregarded because of their additive property, rather than multiplicative.
If I’ve said it once, I’ve said it a thousand times, the concept of GW2 was kitten and botched from the start. It’s like they started with something good, rushed to complete it and the end result was pretty bad. HoT with specs sounds like we’ll definitely be seeing a fix to this problem.
how is toughness a supportive stat? how is increasing your own survivability while not increasing that of your party supportive? isn’t dealing more damage to kill a mob quicker before you and your party run out of active defensive more supportive?
Serah Mahariel – Death and Taxes
You dont thibk being a zerk is lazy? lets demonstrate it with thief ,shall we?
put all your signets, sword and pistol and just spam the 3rd skill and kill all foes.
Or an alternative, use d/d and just backstab everything by constantly pressing 5-1.
And with the right traits, you dont die that quickly.
I dont think the zerker meta is lazy. You need group buffs and proper combo blasting. If you dont have that, you end up dead.
Condi builds on the other hand dont favor teamwork, as no group buff increases condi damage or duration.
Any build that is not zerker non sinister or rampager shouldnt output as much damage, as you are trading damage for survaivability.
So it comes down to direct damage vs conditions and yes, condis suck. Condis dont scale with team work, and dont deal as much damage vs single target.
And the only way to fix that would be to nerf zerker, of course, nerf ferocity, as condi buiulds also rely on crit but not for the damage, and nerf power, which they will do in the next patch.
Still, you will not see 2 condis in the same dungeon run, unless it’s random.
You dont thibk being a zerk is lazy? lets demonstrate it with thief ,shall we?
put all your signets, sword and pistol and just spam the 3rd skill and kill all foes.
Or an alternative, use d/d and just backstab everything by constantly pressing 5-1.
And with the right traits, you dont die that quickly.
You know you can run out of initiative, right? Zerker thief pops like a pimple without stuff like that.
You dont thibk being a zerk is lazy? lets demonstrate it with thief ,shall we?
put all your signets, sword and pistol and just spam the 3rd skill and kill all foes.
Or an alternative, use d/d and just backstab everything by constantly pressing 5-1.
And with the right traits, you dont die that quickly.
Make a video about it – I’d love to see that.
Edit: And yeah, I really mean that you should go out and spam 3 on S/P or spam (really?) 5-1 on D/D. You’ll soon realize that it takes a lot of skill, even if it’s against npcs.
(edited by Jana.6831)
I agree with everything you said save one. Nerfing zerker is the only way to fix it really.
If they are going to work on the philosophy they’ve had this whole time where they want to eliminate what they would consider an unfair advantage (which is what basically happened to first heal scaling, then crowd control, then conditions, and finally reflects) then they need to follow through on what they started and nerf the effectiveness of zerker vs bosses and champs. Bosses and champs if everything were truly equal in this game in PVE would have a debuff that prevented crits from occurring when crits have hit just like the CC debuff works. It would diminish the effectiveness of Zerker above all else and it would force the community to become a more diverse group.
On top of this change, they need to fix condition damage stacking because that’s the key problem with conditions beyond the nerfs it’s suffered as a mechanic, conditions also have the added problem of being designed poorly.
Anyone who disagrees doesn’t believe in fairness.
This is almost feels like a troll it’s so ridiculous, but sure I’ll respond. What has led you to the impression that everything is supposed to “truly equal” in this game? In what way should soldier’s gear EVER compare to zerker gear? It’s more defensive. It shouldn’t put out the damage zerker gear does. It makes 0 sense, in any capacity, to offer a full damage stat like zerker, and then nerf it’s effects to be on the same level as defensive gear. If arenanet wanted every armor set to be “truly equal”, they would have made one armor stat. Nothing is broken with zerker gear. It should inherently do more damage than a defensive stat. That is literally its purpose.
For whatever reason, there’s this opinion in part of the community that somehow their tanky gear should be just as effective as damaging gear, and for the life of me I cannot understand why. You chose a safer gear set. You get to do less damage. I know some would like to see the encounters force people out of zerker gear, which I don’t understand either. The people who advocate zerker gear do so because it’s what’s optimal. Whatever the optimal gear changes to, we’ll switch to that combination and people will still whine that their clerics gear isn’t optimal. The zerker community still won’t struggle with content as they adapt, and the people sitting in defensive sets will be playing harder content without the option to fallback on even tankier gear.
As for the condition part, sure. I’m fine with sinister’s gear being competitive with zerker.
You dont thibk being a zerk is lazy? lets demonstrate it with thief ,shall we?
put all your signets, sword and pistol and just spam the 3rd skill and kill all foes.
Or an alternative, use d/d and just backstab everything by constantly pressing 5-1.
And with the right traits, you dont die that quickly.
Ok 1, pressing 5-1 isn’t “zerk”. It’s just using your skills. Regardless of what gear you are in, this will be what does the most damage. It sounds like your problem is that to get the most out of a thief’s damage, you don’t really do anything interesting. Nerfing zerker gear won’t change this. There’s literally 0 connection between the 2. I am all for revamping classes to make them have meaningful rotations (like the engineer’s), but again, nerfing zerker gear won’t change this at all.
(edited by Sorin.4310)
So basically the people saying berserker is lazy are the ones who have likely never played it?
World bosses, for example, cannot take critical hit damage, and in that situation, PVT gear > Zerk gear.
Anet has also started introducing enemies which are more susceptible to condition damage and have defense against physical attacks. (Such as Husks.)
Anet is aware of this situation and is addressing it as they see fit.
Also…. its not that playing zerker is rewarded differently….
Killing things faster just earns rewards faster.
Stacking DPS over survivability creates higher risk of getting vaporized if you miss an evade or reflect….
We need more foes that punish squishy players, and less foes that can be facerolled.
Foes that attack more often, but do less damage would be perfect.
But in the meantime…. why would anyone want to play anything slower if you can get by with evades reflects blinds?
(edited by TheBlackLeech.9360)
So basically the people saying berserker is lazy are the ones who have likely never played it?
Its easy to spot those that’ve never actually done anything in zerker, honestly – they suffer the bizarre delusion that we that favor berserker gear have just as many HP (or somehow more) and just as much damage mitigation (or somehow more) than them while also dishing out Da Big Damage.
For reasons bizarre and unguessable, they seem to imagine that berserker means one can just stand there, push one button and win everything.
Nobody that’s ever played it could possible arrive at that conclusion. Not unless they did something like stand in Queensdale and test this theory strictly against moa.
One is only the smartest person in the room if they are alone.
Well, ‘easier’ is complicated. Berserker gear certainly should put you at the lowest possible risk of raiders’ fatigue, but if that’s really killing people in a fight that lasts less than a minute, then that’s rather disturbing, frankly.
It’s more about proper traits, might and vuln stacking than the specific gear. A person in full soldier’s gear deals about 60% of fully equipped zerker and since most fights can take about 10-30 seconds in full zerker parties (depending on the dungeon, earlier dungeons are much faster because of the new downscaling), fights in full soldier’s gear will also last less than one minute.
I think you guys miss my point. I was a zerk untill now and found it too easy and boring.
But other playstyles are not as good as zerks, and i think condies should be more effective in pve.
There is a reason why most of LFG descriptions ask for “lvl 80 war ele zerk only”.
zerk groups can beat anything in seconds. there is no reason whatsoever to try another build. there is no role for a condi or a healer in those groups.
So i think the non zerk builds should be more “needed” in pve.
I think you guys miss my point. I was a zerk untill now and found it too easy and boring.
But other playstyles are not as good as zerks, and i think condies should be more effective in pve.
There is a reason why most of LFG descriptions ask for “lvl 80 war ele zerk only”.
zerk groups can beat anything in seconds. there is no reason whatsoever to try another build. there is no role for a condi or a healer in those groups.
So i think the non zerk builds should be more “needed” in pve.
There will never be a role for healers in Gw2 PvE. That would involve bringing the holy trinity back, and that’s something that will just not happen. People heal themselves.
I think you guys miss my point. I was a zerk untill now and found it too easy and boring.
But other playstyles are not as good as zerks, and i think condies should be more effective in pve.
There is a reason why most of LFG descriptions ask for “lvl 80 war ele zerk only”.
zerk groups can beat anything in seconds. there is no reason whatsoever to try another build. there is no role for a condi or a healer in those groups.
So i think the non zerk builds should be more “needed” in pve.
The only thing zerker is ‘needed’ for is speed running. That’s it.
Nobody needs it for anything else in pve. If you want to try for a world record clear time of Arah P2, you’re gonna need to get good and do it in zerker though, yes.
To clear Arah P2? You need a few people with gear that isn’t broken that can dodge occasionally and are awake at least most of the time. That is what you need in PvE.
Not much else.
One is only the smartest person in the room if they are alone.
I think you guys miss my point. I was a zerk untill now and found it too easy and boring.
But other playstyles are not as good as zerks, and i think condies should be more effective in pve.
There is a reason why most of LFG descriptions ask for “lvl 80 war ele zerk only”.
zerk groups can beat anything in seconds. there is no reason whatsoever to try another build. there is no role for a condi or a healer in those groups.
So i think the non zerk builds should be more “needed” in pve.
Anet got rid of the trinity with Guild Wars 2.
When you have the option to bring things to the table that provide more support/healing or more damage….. you go with more damage.
Not because healing or support is boring…. instead because its boring to be anywhere in this game longer than you have to be there…. and you should always strive to be the fastest and most efficient.
I can’t remember the last time I did a dungeon or a fractal for “the immersive experience” and I just wanted to get my loot as fast as possible. There is nothing fun about doing a dungeon for the 551st time. Just go through it as fast as possible…. get your reward… and get out.
Players who don’t like running full zerker gear are still in their “lets stop and smell the flowers” phase with this game.
Play it every day for two years and you will be wearing full zerker gear and bored to death of everything and just want your kitten ed loot.
Well, ‘easier’ is complicated. Berserker gear certainly should put you at the lowest possible risk of raiders’ fatigue, but if that’s really killing people in a fight that lasts less than a minute, then that’s rather disturbing, frankly.
It’s more about proper traits, might and vuln stacking than the specific gear. A person in full soldier’s gear deals about 60% of fully equipped zerker and since most fights can take about 10-30 seconds in full zerker parties (depending on the dungeon, earlier dungeons are much faster because of the new downscaling), fights in full soldier’s gear will also last less than one minute.
Assuming, of course, they might stack, generate fury and all that. That takes effort, and is hard to do while strafing at range as far as possible from whoever has aggro. Since at least some of the anti-meta posters also dislike group proximity play.
I think you guys miss my point. I was a zerk untill now and found it too easy and boring.
But other playstyles are not as good as zerks, and i think condies should be more effective in pve.
There is a reason why most of LFG descriptions ask for “lvl 80 war ele zerk only”.
zerk groups can beat anything in seconds. there is no reason whatsoever to try another build. there is no role for a condi or a healer in those groups.
So i think the non zerk builds should be more “needed” in pve.
There are no other playstyles except condition specs. How else do you want to kill your enemies? With retaliation? No, you swing a sword and then you swing it again.
Healers don’t work here unless you have 5 people in cleric’s gear which surprisingly works and allows you to unbind dodge key because it’s no longer necessary. No clue how thrilling that would be. Please, a place where you can cheese is in the mists.
I think you guys miss my point. I was a zerk untill now and found it too easy and boring.
But other playstyles are not as good as zerks, and i think condies should be more effective in pve.
There is a reason why most of LFG descriptions ask for “lvl 80 war ele zerk only”.
zerk groups can beat anything in seconds. there is no reason whatsoever to try another build. there is no role for a condi or a healer in those groups.
So i think the non zerk builds should be more “needed” in pve.The only thing zerker is ‘needed’ for is speed running. That’s it.
Nobody needs it for anything else in pve. If you want to try for a world record clear time of Arah P2, you’re gonna need to get good and do it in zerker though, yes.
To clear Arah P2? You need a few people with gear that isn’t broken that can dodge occasionally and are awake at least most of the time. That is what you need in PvE.
Not much else.
That is exactly my point. They need to make other builds more effective in pve.
Condi builds on the other hand dont favor teamwork, as no group buff increases condi damage or duration.
Actually, Might increases condition damage as well as power. So a condi build with somone stacking might can increase condition damage by 875, making condi damage almost OP. However in group settings with the condi cap being reached quickly by incidental conditions being applied by multiple people. Thus making it useless.
“You know what the chain of command is?
It’s the chain I beat you with until you
recognize my command!”
It’s the chain I beat you with until you
recognize my command!”
I think you guys miss my point. I was a zerk untill now and found it too easy and boring.
But other playstyles are not as good as zerks, and i think condies should be more effective in pve.
There is a reason why most of LFG descriptions ask for “lvl 80 war ele zerk only”.
zerk groups can beat anything in seconds. there is no reason whatsoever to try another build. there is no role for a condi or a healer in those groups.
So i think the non zerk builds should be more “needed” in pve.The only thing zerker is ‘needed’ for is speed running. That’s it.
Nobody needs it for anything else in pve. If you want to try for a world record clear time of Arah P2, you’re gonna need to get good and do it in zerker though, yes.
To clear Arah P2? You need a few people with gear that isn’t broken that can dodge occasionally and are awake at least most of the time. That is what you need in PvE.
Not much else.
That is exactly my point. They need to make other builds more effective in pve.
If by ‘more effective’ you mean ‘can kill as quickly as berserker’, then no, they absolutely should not.
If by ‘more effective’, you mean somehow making tanking and healing and conditions a larger factor toward survival, they specifically did away with the trinity and created an all new set of problems that they seem to be very fond of. I don’t see them dramatically increasing the value of tanky or healing stats probably ever.
Should they? Should is irrelevant – they almost certainly won’t.
If you mean ‘more effective’ in some other context, please enlighten me, as its too late in my evening to guess what it might otherwise be.
One is only the smartest person in the room if they are alone.
And if you dont wanna talk about healers, then what about a mere supportive spec? there is no need for that either. Why arenanet chose to give armor stats like healing power and vitality if no one uses them?
And if you dont wanna talk about healers, then what about a mere supportive spec? there is no need for that either. Why arenanet chose to give armor stats like healing power and vitality if no one uses them?
We do use them in wvw and pvp.
What if pve was never meant to be that important? What if every one of us was expected to play pvp/wvw?
And if you dont wanna talk about healers, then what about a mere supportive spec? there is no need for that either. Why arenanet chose to give armor stats like healing power and vitality if no one uses them?
Vitality is still used in instances where you can’t crit or critting isn’t as important, such as world bosses and also WvW zergs. Healing power is sometiiimes used in WvW zergs, but it’s not as common as it used to be. GW2s definition of support is more along the lines of boons and debuffs, which you can build for while still using the most offensive stat set. Not every stat set needs a use everywhere.
Do you see what they did there? this is a role playing game and you have one role for pve.
Do you see what they did there? this is a role playing game and you have one role for pve.
Then defend your world from other worlds and go wvw – this is your role as well, as a good citizen..
And if you dont wanna talk about healers, then what about a mere supportive spec? there is no need for that either. Why arenanet chose to give armor stats like healing power and vitality if no one uses them?
Vitality is still used in instances where you can’t crit or critting isn’t as important, such as world bosses and also WvW zergs. Healing power is sometiiimes used in WvW zergs, but it’s not as common as it used to be. GW2s definition of support is more along the lines of boons and debuffs, which you can build for while still using the most offensive stat set. Not every stat set needs a use everywhere.
^ This.
I get great use out of my Shaman gear on my guardian every so often, plowing around in a medium/large roam team of 3-5. No, it doesn’t hit like a truck, but seeing the little solo thieves be SO CONFROOZED when they burst on me and I’m all like ‘Yeah, your mom, lol’ and am incinerating their faces while my friends are having a hard time dying.
I use a mace/focus and staff for that. Is it ‘ideal’? Is it ‘meta’? Hell naw. Is it even brilliant? Prolly not. But I have a blast with it, and with a few people, its sometimes hilarious what enemy roamers just are not prepared to handle and clearly never expected to ever run into.
One is only the smartest person in the room if they are alone.