Guild Wars 2

Colin Johanson wrote:
“The rarest items in the game are not more powerful than
other items, so you don’t need them to be the best. The rarest items
have unique looks to help your character feel that sense of
accomplishment, but it’s not required to play the game. We don’t need to
make mandatory gear treadmills, we make all of it optional, so those
who find it fun to chase this prestigious gear can do so, but those who
don’t are just as powerful and get to have fun too.”

Less than 3 months after launch :“In November we’ll unveil the first Ascended items. This new rarity type
falls between Exotic and Legendary on the spectrum of rarity and has
slightly higher stats than Exotics.”

I guess anet just proved they’re just like every other company out there, tend to the whiners follow the money ^^

Oh and Ascended items are not just “slightly better” than exotics. From the picture of the rings they posted you can see an extra +10 stat and a +3% magic find wich is 67 stat points on exotics right now if you put some other stat there.
Pretty sure they posted the item with the magic find % on purpose so the difference doesn’t show that much wich is probably +77 stat points from just a ring.
Imagine a full set when or if they implement it…

I’ve always defended Arenanet in everything, i love their game and would have kept playing for years even without any content update, but now i feel like this:

Jetser.2486:

So first everyone complains there is nothing to do at 80 (except Legendaries)

Then we get something to do at 80, which by the looks of it, is not giving a noticeable advantage (like you can tell if someone is wearing rares or exotics), but is something more to work towards for those who want to.

And people still get mad.. I don’t get it.

What you don’t get is who was complaining before. The people complaining that there was no content were the people that weren’t supposed to buy this game. They were the people who preferred a play style that ArenaNet specifically said it wasn’t going to cater to. They are the people who would have been perfectly happy over in WoW or SWTOR or any other gear grind MMO.

But now Anet has caved to their demands and instead of a 20 page forum thread that accumulated over a couple of weeks from those people described above, you have a 113+ page thread that has blown up in less than 24 hours.

The people who supported and followed this game’s development from the start are outraged. This game was marketed to us and now its being taken away because they’re changing the biggest principle that we loved about it: no treadmill. I never felt that I was chasing a carrot in this game. I never felt forced to do anything or pressured to keep up because there was an end point. Others felt the same way and it felt so much nicer to have that end point in place (and vehemently promised to us that it wouldn’t move) than any gear grind could have ever felt. But now we see we’ve been lied to.

The core audience has every right to be upset and if you don’t see why then you don’t understand what the appeal of this game was at the start.

Hunterdan.4921:

ChairGraveyard.2967:

Lomax.2463:

1. There is no stat increase !!!!!! they took away the upgrade slot and put the points that you would have gotten from the upgrade slot into the main stats of the item!
that is right Ascended armor is worse then exotic as it is not as customizable as normal armor!

Stop spreading misinformation.

The new gear IS better even when considering the upgrade slot. It’s as good as an exotic with an upgrade + 8% extra.

So sorry but you are actually just wrong, despite all the many exclamation points.

You’re assuming that higher slot upgrades will never be included.

“A new resource to harvest with 200 new crafting recipes.”

If any of those 200 new recipes happen to be for crafted upgrade slot that raise stats above Ascended gear, suddenly this fervor is unnecessary. Ascended gear would not be the end all be all outside of it’s specific dungeon, and the many crafting professions that create slot upgrades would not be obsolete.

What? He’s just wrong, period. I’m not assuming anything, and what you posted is completely irrelevant to my reply.

saurus.8290:

Wagnard.4027:

saurus.8290:

10 more dmg make you more PRO?
0.00001% more crit chance make you more PRO?
getting 4% MF in WvW make you more PRO?
not able to add runes, orbs or sigils to these items make you more PRO?

The stats is just ONE problem.
Another one is “Restricted Content” = bad idea (If you have multiple alts, you can see the problem in the long run)

BTW : Your argument is a fallacy Ad Hominem

the same “restricted content” was in GW1
to progress more into the story you HAD to infuse your armor

Infusing your armor was part of the story. That’s like saying in order to progress the story, you had to progress the story.

jboynton.7894:

RobinotX.1604:

Darknass.1903:

Sousuke.7268:

Loosifah.4739:

The thing you’re failing to realize is for every person who hates this, there’s a person who loves it.

I do believe this thread is a clear indication that the numbers tip towards the “we hate this” demographic.

I’m just going to repost this because.. it still holds true 5000+ posts in.

“If you look there are A LOT of repeat posters arguing with eachother, and I’d like to just point out that the complaining usually drowns out the compliments only because the complainers feel compelled to come on to the forums and whine, while the majority of the happy players are more then likely playing the game.”

My thoughts on this topic: there is already a “treadmill” in place you start off with white quality gear and end up (at 80) still getting white level gear aswell as blue yellow and finally orange and purple (or blue… w/e legendary is). If they intended for zero gear progression they would have either;

A.) Made white quality gear “max” and then you would only have to look for gear you like the looks of. (rather boring in my opinion)
B.) Have each “tier” of gear level specific i.e. white is 1-19 blue is 20-39 yellow is 40-59 and then exotic’s/legendary and w/e else would be 60-80 or what have you. Also make each “tier” only drop from those level zones or creatures or whatever…

The system that is in place now is, I repeat IS a gear treadmill of sorts, smoothly pulled off so it doesn’t really feel like one but it is. You don’t start off with max armor and thus have to gear yourself up. Sure it doesn’t take long and sure once you’ve maxed your gears you only need to upgrade looks (well until this patch hits…).

I honestly don’t mind a bit of “gear progression” and as they stated IT WILL GIVE THE PEOPLE WHO WERE COMPLAINING THEY HAD NOTHING TO DO, SOMETHING TO DO!

This is pretty much truth indeed. If you agree this just quote it a few times so people can actually read it.

And about the fact the most people claim they win their fights.

I don’t. I was giving an example with my Mesmer..

I have enough fights which I lose 1 vs 1. Cause of 1: Bad skills usage at some time. 2: Just being bad.

But still I have fun, and having new gear to look forward though, me likes.

Not because I have to grindfest my brainout. No, because I actually like to play GW2, and love to see my characters in different gear ^^.

The whole cosmetic aspect is something I also missed in other MMO’s which gave us some sets, and where in the end everyone was the same.

WoW is a boring experience. The endgame content start at 90. The leveles 1 through 89 are a dragg.

Where GW2 delivers an adventure. You can do whatever you want in GW2.

You want to craft? Go craft.
You want to PVP? Go PVP
You want to PVE? Go PVE.
You want to Explore? Go Explore.

There is enough to do, but if you don’t like the things GW2 give you, then you didn’t like it before this news and will probably never like the game at all.

People wanted something do to, we know get something to do. I am happy with it.
Even when I am a donkey with a carrot.

What does a new tier of gear have to do with having something to do? Do you mean to say that you can’t craft, PvP, PvE, or Explore without the reward of progressively better gear at max level?

No, but people need to get some sort of a goal.

For example I have many goals I have put myself, making Mystic Forge weapons instead of Legendary. Or making a legendary en get my characters all on the armor I want for them.

Some people have to hold a hand to know where they have to go.
WoW for example has goals. Goals where all people go for.

Guild Wars 2, puts you, a measly human, charr, norn, asura or sylvari in a wide world. And says, go and play. They say nothing about.

Before you can do this dungeon, you have to do this one. And after that, you have to dungeon X, But before you can dungeon X you have to level again in Area V…

Here it is, you can do whatever you want..

Now they have put one dungeon in it where you have to do something (sort of a must if you wanna do that specific dungeon), and go for it. You get a goal.

I see and I do respect what people think about the future, but I am not afraid yet. I wait till this patch comes out and see what it will do with the whole game. Maybe we are laying eggs for nothing.

Jetser.2486:

So first everyone complains there is nothing to do at 80 (except Legendaries)

Then we get something to do at 80, which by the looks of it, is not giving a noticeable advantage (like you can tell if someone is wearing rares or exotics), but is something more to work towards for those who want to.

And people still get mad.. I don’t get it.

1) It was the end gamers who were in Mad Group #1. They wanted a grinding / raiding system of gear progression, which was clearly not part of ArenaNet’s manifesto. Thus massive complaining ensued while the rest of the players rolled their eyes.

2) Now people who got into GW2 to escape the eternal gear progression treadmill are angry and have formed Mad Group #2. These were people who understood that Exotic gear pieces would be the cap for the near future (or longer) and only gear graphics would be ground for.

The issue is that Mad Group #1 is mostly comprised of the usual crowd that floats from MMO to MMO looking for the next big thing. They are often ex-WoW players and they throw their weight around to get MMO developers to change parts of their MMO’s core design to make the game closer to WoW. Inevitably these people in Mad Group #1 are still not satisfied with the MMO that they helped to warp, so they abandon it for the next big thing.

At the same time, Mad Group #2 is filled with people who were interested in that specific MMO due to the specific features that it was going to offer. In front of their very eyes, these players watch the devs disregard many of their MMO’s specific ideas and innovations as they attempt to appease Mad Group #1. This angers the loyal customers and helps to turn them into Mad Group #2.

MMO developers have been constantly repeating these mistakes over the past decade. Each MMO bends over backwards to try to cater to the fickle Mad Group #1 of floating players. To date, each MMO has failed to substancially woo them into staying. Then the developers have only their original “fanboy” players left, who no longer want anything to do with the MMO since it’s not what they initially paid for and also because they no longer trust the developers. This causes much of the Mad Group #2 to leave the MMO, which helps to finish the job of making that MMO implode. Wash, rinse, and repeat for infinity.

Imakkiman.2875:

the gear is meant to be used in order to progress further into the stages of the new dungeon… OH MY LURDSSSS GEAR PROGRUSOON IM SO BETRYEDDDDD

screw yall.

…aaand it has better stats than exotics no matter what you´re doing in game…yes, limited to said duneon only…right?

Most of us would be happy if it was just the infusions they added.

So I haven’t posted on the forums before but I dislike the Ascended gear enough to make my fist post. I do not want this in a game I play. I’m not saying I’ll “quit” because of this but it had definitely made me reconsider things.

If the Ascended gear had the same stats as Exotics (base stats + gem) and an infusion slot (which only helped in Dungeons) then I’d be fine with it but the extra tier of gear…. No thanks.

Jetser.2486:

So first everyone complains there is nothing to do at 80 (except Legendaries)

Then we get something to do at 80, which by the looks of it, is not giving a noticeable advantage (like you can tell if someone is wearing rares or exotics), but is something more to work towards for those who want to.

And people still get mad.. I don’t get it.

Everyone?
Look at this thread, 5.5k posts in about a day, plus a lot that have been deleted. I think there’s more posts in this thread alone than in all threads created about “lack of stuff to do”.

No, not everyone was complaining and among them, not everyone was complaining about lack of gear grind, either. Plus, some of the complainers were the ones who got Legendaries in a month, which I will not comment on.

There are a lot of ways to give people something to do. ANet was seemingly going in the right directions, planning content updates often. But gear grind is not the right direction, a sentiment quite a major part of the player base seems to share, for one reason or another.

I have an idea… instead on having totally new gear why not each time you get infusions you can just add them to your current gear…. this means that their would be no increase in stats but people would benefit from the infusions ? This would also not effect the balance issues or the WvW concerns….

Lomax.2463:

2. Infusion slot is for negating a new condition call Agony that will only be in this dungeon! that is right it is worthless in WvW or any place outside this dungeon.

The above is incorrect, the infusion slot is more than just to combat the Agony condition…quote from the blog post:
“Infusions are a special new type of Upgrade Component that can only be slotted into special Infusion slots on gear.

There are multiple types of Infusions and Infusion slots. In November, we’ll introduce Offensive, Defensive, and Omni Infusions of Fine rarity from new Mystic Forge recipes. Infusion upgrade types must be paired with their like slot, with the exception of the rare and versatile Omni Infusions which can be slotted into any type of Infusion slot.

For now, Infusions slots can only be found in gear of a new rarity type: Ascended.”

The fact that the infusion slot can offer a variety of buffs to add to the upgraded/Ascended gear is (in principle) a good thing.

However, to sacrifice such a buff for a specific infusion that has to counter the Agony condition is a setback, even more so because the same blogpost already states that “some defense against this condition is a must. The only way to mitigate Agony damage is by building up resistance through Infusions” which makes it mandatory to slot that specific infusion into the gear.

Again, in short: the Agony condition is a gating mechanism creating mandatory gear/infusions to be used in order to see the new or explore all content. Currently for this new Fractals dungeon, but possibly to be used in future dungeon to come.

The Agony condition itself is the problem, not the infusion slot.

Lomax.2463:

good god you people cant read !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i am amazed there so so many that cant comprehend what Anet is doing

OK FOR THOSE THAT HAVE NO CLUE.

1. There is no stat increase !!!!!! they took away the upgrade slot and put the points that you would have gotten from the upgrade slot into the main stats of the item!
that is right Ascended armor is worse then exotic as it is not as customizable as normal armor!

2. Infusion slot is for negating a new condition call Agony that will only be in this dungeon! that is right it is worthless in WvW or any place outside this dungeon.

3. getting exotic gear is easy and is full customizable with upgrade slots, Ascended armor is hard to get is less useful as real exotic gear outside of this dungeon.

4. this is a cool great new dungeon , it is scalable for the progression players but none of it is any use outside of this one dungeon. it will allow player to brag about i hit 27th level of infusion !!! woot for me but as infusion does nothing outside of the dungeon why would a WvW player even care ?

this is like a PVE dungeon version of the PVP ranking , i think its great .

Lol you need glasses…..Look at the post they just made on the homepage about ascended gear and look at the 2 rings they took as an example….Both the basic stats and the merged upgrade jewel stats are higher on the ascended ring…..Only2-3 stats but still.

jboynton.7894:

Shunsui Jiraiya.9103:

Anyone heard of an MMO that you can put down, play some single player games for a few months and come back to still be at top stats?

I would love a game where time invested is fun with some visuals being the byproduct reward.

Maybe a day one game where the designers dont need to add bodge treadmills to keep sub’s coming in.

Also it would be awesome to have lots of epic skins to buy for either £/$ or in game currency.

Man, that would be toast-balloons.

Will keep an eye out for some type of manifesto that sets the scene for a game like this to be created over a 5 year period. They may even start a blog to reinforce their ideals…. What could go wrong…..

GW1. It’s still available for purchase here .

And GW1 is, sadly, not blessed with getting new content. Some of us played this game 7 years and saw about everything in this game. Yes I will go back but I’m realistic and say: Not for a very long time again. If there comes a new addon, I would definately buy it (ok, implies that it is a GW1 Addon, not another random mmo addon).
The problem with viable games of that type is, that they need some new content at some point and in this case there aren’t real options.

I’ve watched this “manifesto” video:

WHERE in it do they say that item progression is bad and should be/will be avoided? In fact, most of that Manifesto is about Dynamic Events and the game’s world and art style. Very little of it is (if any @ all) is about dungeons or progression on that weight.

People who are saying “you’re going back on your Manifesto” are lying…. they are either fooling themselves or are trying to deceive the community into turning against Arena.Net.

In fact, the ONLY thing I can think about that might be incorrect in that Manifesto is the part about Grind; but that’s only in relation to Legendary weapons. Then again, it’s not really grind if you rotate it casually with normal play, WvW, guild and friend events. It just scuttles into the background of fun.

Betrayal!

I liked the premise of a open world Guild Wars where I could take a break and not feel behind the gear and instance treadmill. Instances would be all equal in gear quality and crafting was worthwhile.

An 8% increase in stats is significant, especially if factoring the exponential relationship between critical damage and power. When they are balancing damage around this, they’d have to take this larger-than-eight-percent increase in stats into account. Conversely, people towards the back of the gear treadmill (rares) then hit substantially lower.

It’s fine to have

ChairGraveyard.2967:

Hunterdan.4921:

You’re assuming that higher slot upgrades will never be included.

“A new resource to harvest with 200 new crafting recipes.”

If any of those 200 new recipes happen to be for crafted upgrade slot that raise stats above Ascended gear, suddenly this fervor is unnecessary. Ascended gear would not be the end all be all outside of it’s specific dungeon, and the many crafting professions that create slot upgrades would not be obsolete.

What? He’s just wrong, period. I’m not assuming anything, and what you posted is completely irrelevant to my reply.

Pardon? How is the suggestion that the many crafted recipes coming along in the update could possibly include upgrade slot items that would push Exotic + Upgrade items beyond the stats of Ascended gear irrelevant to your post?

Lomax.2463:

good god you people cant read !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i am amazed there so so many that cant comprehend what Anet is doing

OK FOR THOSE THAT HAVE NO CLUE.

1. There is no stat increase !!!!!! they took away the upgrade slot and put the points that you would have gotten from the upgrade slot into the main stats of the item!
that is right Ascended armor is worse then exotic as it is not as customizable as normal armor!

2. Infusion slot is for negating a new condition call Agony that will only be in this dungeon! that is right it is worthless in WvW or any place outside this dungeon.

3. getting exotic gear is easy and is full customizable with upgrade slots, Ascended armor is hard to get is less useful as real exotic gear outside of this dungeon.

4. this is a cool great new dungeon , it is scalable for the progression players but none of it is any use outside of this one dungeon. it will allow player to brag about i hit 27th level of infusion !!! woot for me but as infusion does nothing outside of the dungeon why would a WvW player even care ?

this is like a PVE dungeon version of the PVP ranking , i think its great .

False. Let’s re-read the blog shall we? I shall disprove your points with facts straight out of the horse’s mouth.

“Eventually, you’ll be able to kit yourself out with a full set of Ascended gear and high end Infusions to help give you the edge in end game content.”

Not an increase? Why then would they say it’s to give me an edge on end game content?

“You’ll also see more Legendary items in the future and an update to our existing Legendary weapons. Legendary items were always intended to be on par with other “best-in-slot” items. So fear not, all existing Legendary weapons, which are currently on par with Exotics, will be upgraded to be on par with Ascended weapons at the same time that we add Ascended weapons to the game. Thus Legendaries will remain “best-in-slot” items.”

Ok let’s do some math with words! It’s called the pathogram theory and this is how it works! If A = B and B = C then A = C. So if Legendaries are the best-in-slot items and they are going to mimic/reflect Ascended weapons wouldn’t that mean that Ascended weapons are also the best-in-slot items? Hmm… sounds to me like a stat increase!

Shunsui Jiraiya.9103:

Anyone heard of an MMO that you can put down, play some single player games for a few months and come back to still be at top stats?

GW1. =)
Havent played since August 25, but as far as I know, there was no new stat tier since I started playing.

Omega.1473:

Jetser.2486:

So first everyone complains there is nothing to do at 80 (except Legendaries)

Then we get something to do at 80, which by the looks of it, is not giving a noticeable advantage (like you can tell if someone is wearing rares or exotics), but is something more to work towards for those who want to.

And people still get mad.. I don’t get it.

What you don’t get is who was complaining before. The people complaining that there was no content were the people that weren’t supposed to buy this game. They were the people who preferred a play style that ArenaNet specifically said it wasn’t going to cater to. They are the people who would have been perfectly happy over in WoW or SWTOR or any other gear grind MMO.

But now Anet has caved to their demands and instead of a 20 page forum thread that accumulated over a couple of weeks from those people described above, you have a 113+ page thread that has blown up in less than 24 hours.

The people who supported and followed this game’s development from the start are outraged. This game was marketed to us and now its being taken away because they’re changing the biggest principle that we loved about it: no treadmill. I never felt that I was chasing a carrot in this game. I never felt forced to do anything or pressured to keep up because there was an end point. Others felt the same way and it felt so much nicer to have that end point in place (and vehemently promised to us that it wouldn’t move) than any gear grind could have ever felt. But now we see we’ve been lied to.

The core audience has every right to be upset and if you don’t see why then you don’t understand what the appeal of this game was at the start.

So so so much this. They have abandoned their principles to appease a tiny minority that were complaining, meanwhile alienating the very people they marketed the game to for years. Meanwhile those people complaining probably already left the game and went back to WoW or SWTOR or any of the other dozens of games that already have gear treadmills.

They sold the game so well precisely because they marketed to the segment of players that do not want gear treadmills which is a completely unrepresented segment of gamers in the MMO market.

Adding this junk alienates every one of the people that bought the game because of the lack of gear treadmill nonsense.

The incessant whining is hilarious.

The people that think they are entitled to anything and everything are the biggest whiners.

The fact that they are adding more carrots is just a great thing. The increase is small on the item they showed… They haven’t even showed any armor yet.

If the armor they show eventually is 8% better on the base stats but lacks a rune slot…what would the whiners say then?

Siphaed.9235:

I’ve watched this “manifesto” video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35BPhT-KI1E

WHERE in it do they say that item progression is bad and should be/will be avoided? In fact, most of that Manifesto is about Dynamic Events and the game’s world and art style. Very little of it is (if any @ all) is about dungeons or progression on that weight.

People who are saying “you’re going back on your Manifesto” are lying…. they are either fooling themselves or are trying to deceive the community into turning against Arena.Net.

In fact, the ONLY thing I can think about that might be incorrect in that Manifesto is the part about Grind; but that’s only in relation to Legendary weapons. Then again, it’s not really grind if you rotate it casually with normal play, WvW, guild and friend events. It just scuttles into the background of fun.

U wot m8? Not ever read their advertising, their >9000 videosblogs and crepe?

RobinotX.1604:

jboynton.7894:

What does a new tier of gear have to do with having something to do? Do you mean to say that you can’t craft, PvP, PvE, or Explore without the reward of progressively better gear at max level?

No, but people need to get some sort of a goal.

For example I have many goals I have put myself, making Mystic Forge weapons instead of Legendary. Or making a legendary en get my characters all on the armor I want for them.

Some people have to hold a hand to know where they have to go.
WoW for example has goals. Goals where all people go for.

Guild Wars 2, puts you, a measly human, charr, norn, asura or sylvari in a wide world. And says, go and play. They say nothing about.

Before you can do this dungeon, you have to do this one. And after that, you have to dungeon X, But before you can dungeon X you have to level again in Area V…

Here it is, you can do whatever you want..

Now they have put one dungeon in it where you have to do something (sort of a must if you wanna do that specific dungeon), and go for it. You get a goal.

I see and I do respect what people think about the future, but I am not afraid yet. I wait till this patch comes out and see what it will do with the whole game. Maybe we are laying eggs for nothing.

Isn’t the goal to complete the content though? The reward for completing is then a unique skin and/or title/achievement that is only attainable by those who complete said content.

If people aren’t interested in completing content without the reward being progressively strong loot; then the fact is they’re not interested in the content at all, but merely interested in the loot.

Every big patch for every big MMO that introduced some sort of new mechanic of thingamajig, an outcry of buttmad people just start SCREAMING. What we want is for the best! You are betraying my expectations! I’m quitting!

Then patch day comes around. Everyone logs in, and finds out oh hey this isn’t the doomsday I thought it would be, I sure feel silly.

History repeats itself, it’ll happen again. I’ll see all you whiny people Saturday.

Also, this thread is mostly people arguing. If on average most people posted here 5+ times, we have about 1,000 people in here complaining. Oh wait, some people are happy for it too, so not all 1,000 people are mad. You’re all acting like you’re some sort of majority and what you say goes. Protip: majority does not equal the loudest population.

Excuse me while I go and play with the hundreds of thousands of players perfectly content with the game, regardless of future patches.

I wonder if ascended items van be sold on TP. If so the economy will so crash…..

Miragee.3604:

jboynton.7894:

Shunsui Jiraiya.9103:

Anyone heard of an MMO that you can put down, play some single player games for a few months and come back to still be at top stats?

I would love a game where time invested is fun with some visuals being the byproduct reward.

Maybe a day one game where the designers dont need to add bodge treadmills to keep sub’s coming in.

Also it would be awesome to have lots of epic skins to buy for either £/$ or in game currency.

Man, that would be toast-balloons.

Will keep an eye out for some type of manifesto that sets the scene for a game like this to be created over a 5 year period. They may even start a blog to reinforce their ideals…. What could go wrong…..

GW1. It’s still available for purchase here .

And GW1 is, sadly, not blessed with getting new content. Some of us played this game 7 years and saw about everything in this game. Yes I will go back but I’m realistic and say: Not for a very long time again. If there comes a new addon, I would definately buy it (ok, implies that it is a GW1 Addon, not another random mmo addon).
The problem with viable games of that type is, that they need some new content at some point and in this case there aren’t real options.

I was simply posting that in reply to his sarcastic comment that a game does not exist with no vertical gear progression. When in fact one does. GW1.

Serpenti.6753:

The new changes sound great! Can ya’ll stop QQ’ing when the game continues to get a little more challenging? Like for real.. you blew the forums up about the “challenging” Clock tower not giving you free loot. And now you’re QQ’ing about the need to go into another dungeon to have fun. What do you want? To sit in LA? Maybe they can add some chess tournaments in LA for your pleasure and you’ll stop the QQ.

You claim that adding more powerful equipment makes the game harder? You sir, are a very bad troll.

In GW1 they just made the game harder without adding equipment to make it easy. We had to be clever and play well to survive in places like UW and DoA. No one would complain if they were making the game harder, but they are doing the exact opposite of that.

matts.8320:

So I haven’t posted on the forums before but I dislike the Ascended gear enough to make my fist post. I do not want this in a game I play. I’m not saying I’ll “quit” because of this but it had definitely made me reconsider things.

If the Ascended gear had the same stats as Exotics (base stats + gem) and an infusion slot (which only helped in Dungeons) then I’d be fine with it but the extra tier of gear…. No thanks.

It would be that easy.
Just keep a stat cap as GW1 did.

You could infuse for Karka, defuse for Aliens, do whatever you want lore-wise.. but keep fixed stats cap!

fractal.7039:

The incessant whining is hilarious.

The people that think they are entitled to anything and everything are the biggest whiners.

The fact that they are adding more carrots is just a great thing. The increase is small on the item they showed… They haven’t even showed any armor yet.

If the armor they show eventually is 8% better on the base stats but lacks a rune slot…what would the whiners say then?

A euphemism about a pot and kettle comes to mind with the above post.

Meh, even though I’m not really fond of this new Ascended armour, I got a fitting title to it at least.

RoChan.1926:

Lomax.2463:

good god you people cant read !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i am amazed there so so many that cant comprehend what Anet is doing

OK FOR THOSE THAT HAVE NO CLUE.

1. There is no stat increase !!!!!! they took away the upgrade slot and put the points that you would have gotten from the upgrade slot into the main stats of the item!
that is right Ascended armor is worse then exotic as it is not as customizable as normal armor!

2. Infusion slot is for negating a new condition call Agony that will only be in this dungeon! that is right it is worthless in WvW or any place outside this dungeon.

3. getting exotic gear is easy and is full customizable with upgrade slots, Ascended armor is hard to get is less useful as real exotic gear outside of this dungeon.

4. this is a cool great new dungeon , it is scalable for the progression players but none of it is any use outside of this one dungeon. it will allow player to brag about i hit 27th level of infusion !!! woot for me but as infusion does nothing outside of the dungeon why would a WvW player even care ?

this is like a PVE dungeon version of the PVP ranking , i think its great .

False. Let’s re-read the blog shall we? I shall disprove your points with facts straight out of the horse’s mouth.

“Eventually, you’ll be able to kit yourself out with a full set of Ascended gear and high end Infusions to help give you the edge in end game content.”

Not an increase? Why then would they say it’s to give me an edge on end game content?

“You’ll also see more Legendary items in the future and an update to our existing Legendary weapons. Legendary items were always intended to be on par with other “best-in-slot” items. So fear not, all existing Legendary weapons, which are currently on par with Exotics, will be upgraded to be on par with Ascended weapons at the same time that we add Ascended weapons to the game. Thus Legendaries will remain “best-in-slot” items.”

Ok let’s do some math with words! It’s called the pathogram theory and this is how it works! If A = B and B = C then A = C. So if Legendaries are the best-in-slot items and they are going to mimic/reflect Ascended weapons wouldn’t that mean that Ascended weapons are also the best-in-slot items? Hmm… sounds to me like a stat increase!

The other half of this math is that they said that Legendaries would be on par with bes tin slot going forward. If they are changing to Ascended, perhaps that is the final change. You know… maybe.

Maybe the real plan is for us to eventually have a full set of legendary everything that keeps up with each tier of gear. That wouldn’t be so bad. You could get one set of gear forever if you want to (like I do) or just keep getting new pieces each tier. It COULD be a win-win.

The small amout of people of complained that there was nothing to do is way less than the majority of people who didnt complain about that as seen by so many posts in this thread.
There is a lot Anet can come up with for something to do. Not just come up with gear grind as “something to do” Do something creative. Gear grind is something to do yes. Most dont want to “do” it. They want to “do” something fun.
I cant suggest what would be fun that is your job Anet. Examples. Different modes of SPVP. Different in game events, like some aspects of Halloween. Implement Guild vs Guild etc. Adding new events, quests. You guys are supposed to come up with these type of stuff for us to “do” Other players may have good ideas about that and I am sure you guys have great ideas. But gear grinding is not good just to come up with something else to “do”.

MikeTsa.7396:

Colin Johanson wrote:
“The rarest items in the game are not more powerful than
other items, so you don’t need them to be the best. The rarest items
have unique looks to help your character feel that sense of
accomplishment, but it’s not required to play the game. We don’t need to
make mandatory gear treadmills, we make all of it optional, so those
who find it fun to chase this prestigious gear can do so, but those who
don’t are just as powerful and get to have fun too.”

Less than 3 months after launch :“In November we’ll unveil the first Ascended items. This new rarity type
falls between Exotic and Legendary on the spectrum of rarity and has
slightly higher stats than Exotics.”

I guess anet just proved they’re just like every other company out there, tend to the whiners follow the money ^^

Oh and Ascended items are not just “slightly better” than exotics. From the picture of the rings they posted you can see an extra +10 stat and a +3% magic find wich is 67 stat points on exotics right now if you put some other stat there.
Pretty sure they posted the item with the magic find % on purpose so the difference doesn’t show that much wich is probably +77 stat points from just a ring.
Imagine a full set when or if they implement it…

They also said that legendary items were going to be retooled to be exactly in line with ascended items and that new legendaries going forward would also be equal to ascended gear.

If i was Anet i would be both horrified and happy.

Horrified that the 1st new piece of content is being largely negativly received due to a design choice with regards to gear grind.

Happy that so many people are actully defending the original design manifesto when it comes to gear grind.
—
In saying that, if i was Anet this gear grind would have never happened in the 1st place.

Was really that hard to put some awesome armor/weapon skins from gw1 as reward for this new dungeon?
In before ascendent armor on gemstore also…

jboynton.7894:

Miragee.3604:

jboynton.7894:

Shunsui Jiraiya.9103:

Anyone heard of an MMO that you can put down, play some single player games for a few months and come back to still be at top stats?

I would love a game where time invested is fun with some visuals being the byproduct reward.

Maybe a day one game where the designers dont need to add bodge treadmills to keep sub’s coming in.

Also it would be awesome to have lots of epic skins to buy for either £/$ or in game currency.

Man, that would be toast-balloons.

Will keep an eye out for some type of manifesto that sets the scene for a game like this to be created over a 5 year period. They may even start a blog to reinforce their ideals…. What could go wrong…..

GW1. It’s still available for purchase here .

And GW1 is, sadly, not blessed with getting new content. Some of us played this game 7 years and saw about everything in this game. Yes I will go back but I’m realistic and say: Not for a very long time again. If there comes a new addon, I would definately buy it (ok, implies that it is a GW1 Addon, not another random mmo addon).
The problem with viable games of that type is, that they need some new content at some point and in this case there aren’t real options.

I was simply posting that in reply to his sarcastic comment that a game does not exist with no vertical gear progression. When in fact one does. GW1.

Yeah, I got your post wrong. See my post more for a general information than.

Lomax.2463:

good god you people cant read !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i am amazed there so so many that cant comprehend what Anet is doing

OK FOR THOSE THAT HAVE NO CLUE.

1. There is no stat increase !!!!!! they took away the upgrade slot and put the points that you would have gotten from the upgrade slot into the main stats of the item!
that is right Ascended armor is worse then exotic as it is not as customizable as normal armor!

2. Infusion slot is for negating a new condition call Agony that will only be in this dungeon! that is right it is worthless in WvW or any place outside this dungeon.

3. getting exotic gear is easy and is full customizable with upgrade slots, Ascended armor is hard to get is less useful as real exotic gear outside of this dungeon.

4. this is a cool great new dungeon , it is scalable for the progression players but none of it is any use outside of this one dungeon. it will allow player to brag about i hit 27th level of infusion !!! woot for me but as infusion does nothing outside of the dungeon why would a WvW player even care ?

this is like a PVE dungeon version of the PVP ranking , i think its great .

1. Look closer, there is a major stat increase.
2. the entire infusion mechanic is a Gear Gate. We were led to believe this game would not have content gates.
3. They’ve said they want Ascended items to take more effort to get than exotics and less than Legendaries. This is not acceptable. We were told we would not need to grind for the best gear just to keep on par. Some people consider getting Exotic gear a grind already.
4. The new gear is most definately useful outside the new dungeon.

As someone with a clue, this is appalling. I won’t quit, since there’s no sub fee, but I won’t ever buy more gems or expansions, i will log on for much less time overall and do much less content. If we were paying a sub fee for this game, the loss of revenue would immediately kill the game. It seems foolish to assume this will keep gear grinders happy or lure them away from superior gear grind games.

It’s sad really, for the foreseeable future I will simply log on after reset, do my dailies for my karma jug and coin, then log off. One of my guild members exclaimed, “omg you can’t quit! you play more often than 3/4 of the guild!” Not anymore

Let’s calm down a bit here and discuss this, are people really going to give up customized runes for a small state increase? All we’ve seen bundled in is magic find…

OK so I understand why people are getting so upset about this, but dam how does anyone know that this is not the only time they will do something like this?

The addition of infusion is great and prob would of been much harder to implement on existing gear, so making a new level of gear was a smarter choice IMHO.

Now if you feel that the 8% stat boost will really make a difference then what game have you been playing? The combat system itself is a counter to this stat buff because if you have more skill in playing your character then your opponent then you will almost always win the fight even if hes decked in all exotics and a legendary weapon.

So stop complaining and saying that Arena Net has given in and is becoming a WoW clone because there is absolutely no evidence to that as of yet and you all just jumping to conclusions. Now if this were to happen again then yes I will give up on Arena Net but for now I will just watch what they are doing with a cautious eye.

Miragee.3604:

jboynton.7894:

Miragee.3604:

jboynton.7894:

Shunsui Jiraiya.9103:

Anyone heard of an MMO that you can put down, play some single player games for a few months and come back to still be at top stats?

I would love a game where time invested is fun with some visuals being the byproduct reward.

Maybe a day one game where the designers dont need to add bodge treadmills to keep sub’s coming in.

Also it would be awesome to have lots of epic skins to buy for either £/$ or in game currency.

Man, that would be toast-balloons.

Will keep an eye out for some type of manifesto that sets the scene for a game like this to be created over a 5 year period. They may even start a blog to reinforce their ideals…. What could go wrong…..

GW1. It’s still available for purchase here .

And GW1 is, sadly, not blessed with getting new content. Some of us played this game 7 years and saw about everything in this game. Yes I will go back but I’m realistic and say: Not for a very long time again. If there comes a new addon, I would definately buy it (ok, implies that it is a GW1 Addon, not another random mmo addon).
The problem with viable games of that type is, that they need some new content at some point and in this case there aren’t real options.

I was simply posting that in reply to his sarcastic comment that a game does not exist with no vertical gear progression. When in fact one does. GW1.

Yeah, I got your post wrong. See my post more for a general information than.

No worries!

Wintyre Fraust.6534:

They were going to do this all along. That’s why it’s coming out before any cash shop expansion and without any real polling of the customer base. It has nothing to do with a lack of revenue or “customer feedback”. There’s no logic to those claims.

Good post. This can’t be something they developed a couple weeks ago as a response. This took time to design. They are not being truthful.

Never.6014:

RoChan.1926:

Lomax.2463:

good god you people cant read !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i am amazed there so so many that cant comprehend what Anet is doing

OK FOR THOSE THAT HAVE NO CLUE.

1. There is no stat increase !!!!!! they took away the upgrade slot and put the points that you would have gotten from the upgrade slot into the main stats of the item!
that is right Ascended armor is worse then exotic as it is not as customizable as normal armor!

2. Infusion slot is for negating a new condition call Agony that will only be in this dungeon! that is right it is worthless in WvW or any place outside this dungeon.

3. getting exotic gear is easy and is full customizable with upgrade slots, Ascended armor is hard to get is less useful as real exotic gear outside of this dungeon.

4. this is a cool great new dungeon , it is scalable for the progression players but none of it is any use outside of this one dungeon. it will allow player to brag about i hit 27th level of infusion !!! woot for me but as infusion does nothing outside of the dungeon why would a WvW player even care ?

this is like a PVE dungeon version of the PVP ranking , i think its great .

False. Let’s re-read the blog shall we? I shall disprove your points with facts straight out of the horse’s mouth.

“Eventually, you’ll be able to kit yourself out with a full set of Ascended gear and high end Infusions to help give you the edge in end game content.”

Not an increase? Why then would they say it’s to give me an edge on end game content?

“You’ll also see more Legendary items in the future and an update to our existing Legendary weapons. Legendary items were always intended to be on par with other “best-in-slot” items. So fear not, all existing Legendary weapons, which are currently on par with Exotics, will be upgraded to be on par with Ascended weapons at the same time that we add Ascended weapons to the game. Thus Legendaries will remain “best-in-slot” items.”

Ok let’s do some math with words! It’s called the pathogram theory and this is how it works! If A = B and B = C then A = C. So if Legendaries are the best-in-slot items and they are going to mimic/reflect Ascended weapons wouldn’t that mean that Ascended weapons are also the best-in-slot items? Hmm… sounds to me like a stat increase!

The other half of this math is that they said that Legendaries would be on par with bes tin slot going forward. If they are changing to Ascended, perhaps that is the final change. You know… maybe.

Maybe the real plan is for us to eventually have a full set of legendary everything that keeps up with each tier of gear. That wouldn’t be so bad. You could get one set of gear forever if you want to (like I do) or just keep getting new pieces each tier. It COULD be a win-win.

Except they stated in the blog they want to add new types of infusions in the future. Meaning you will need Armor A for Dungeon A, Armor B for Dungeon B and so on ad infinitum.

It’s bad design. It would have been better the GW1 way to run a series of quests to get your current armor infused. I’d still dislike it though as it still gates content behind specific armor requirements.

I wasn’t bored with the game yet and no one in WvWvW or anywhere else were complaining in chat about being bored. If we needed something more or different, we could have used more or different areas in W3 with more and different skins obtained with badges of honor. They’ve already taken things out of W3 without a solid idea to replace those features yet and here comes a new, required as far as we know, dungeon. It’s like the dev monster is gobbling up pieces of WvWvW and leaving a steaming pile of pve on the ground.

Sawyer.9713:

OK so I understand why people are getting so upset about this, but dam how does anyone know that this is not the only time they will do something like this?

Well, the blog post about it says “we’ll be adding more of this in the future” so assuming that this will be the only change in this fashion is an astronomically large stretch of the imagination, if not outright wrong.

veldt.5032:

Every big patch for every big MMO that introduced some sort of new mechanic of thingamajig, an outcry of buttmad people just start SCREAMING. What we want is for the best! You are betraying my expectations! I’m quitting!

Then patch day comes around. Everyone logs in, and finds out oh hey this isn’t the doomsday I thought it would be, I sure feel silly.

History repeats itself, it’ll happen again. I’ll see all you whiny people Saturday.

Also, this thread is mostly people arguing. If on average most people posted here 5+ times, we have about 1,000 people in here complaining. Oh wait, some people are happy for it too, so not all 1,000 people are mad. You’re all acting like you’re some sort of majority and what you say goes. Protip: majority does not equal the loudest population.

Excuse me while I go and play with the hundreds of thousands of players perfectly content with the game, regardless of future patches.

You forget to mention: some of those updates are actually bad and companies retract from them, after time. Funny enough, two updates in mechanic very much alike have been introduced in the past by major MMOs and both companies retracted them (WoW and LotRO).

Also, you seem to assume that everyone who doesn’t like the change is posting here, which is wrong. The fact is: majority of people posting in this thread dislike the change. It’s actually realistic that the majority of player base actually dislikes it, than the opposite.
The margin of error might be quite high in this case indeed, but no way is it high enough for you to warrant your implied statement that people who dislike the change are not the majority.

Also, it’s not true that “what majority says goes”.
In this case, Anet – unfortunately – listened to the minority.

I’m glad you’re content with GW2 being “just like every other MMO out there”.
I am however bored with them all being exactly the same and I came to this game because it was supposed to be “different”.

jboynton.7894:

Miragee.3604:

jboynton.7894:

Shunsui Jiraiya.9103:

Anyone heard of an MMO that you can put down, play some single player games for a few months and come back to still be at top stats?

I would love a game where time invested is fun with some visuals being the byproduct reward.

Maybe a day one game where the designers dont need to add bodge treadmills to keep sub’s coming in.

Also it would be awesome to have lots of epic skins to buy for either £/$ or in game currency.

Man, that would be toast-balloons.

Will keep an eye out for some type of manifesto that sets the scene for a game like this to be created over a 5 year period. They may even start a blog to reinforce their ideals…. What could go wrong…..

GW1. It’s still available for purchase here .

And GW1 is, sadly, not blessed with getting new content. Some of us played this game 7 years and saw about everything in this game. Yes I will go back but I’m realistic and say: Not for a very long time again. If there comes a new addon, I would definately buy it (ok, implies that it is a GW1 Addon, not another random mmo addon).
The problem with viable games of that type is, that they need some new content at some point and in this case there aren’t real options.

I was simply posting that in reply to his sarcastic comment that a game does not exist with no vertical gear progression. When in fact one does. GW1.

You miss understood my post, or rather I did not clearly explain.

Im a GW1 fan and followed GW2’s development for years. My dig was the developers seems to have forgotten about their ideals.

Anyways. Im resigning on this tread to get some sleep.

I honestly hope that the post was written poorly and its 1 new tier what will never be replaced. maybe its just a single extra tier as the exotics was far too easy to be the Plato.

I posted a few suggestions back at the double figure pages so wont re-post again but I believe they need to get the PR team out to either offer apologies for the misunderstanding or admit they are scrapping their original core ideals.

Also signature will be updated once I know the outcome

Sawyer.9713:

OK so I understand why people are getting so upset about this, but dam how does anyone know that this is not the only time they will do something like this?

“The new additions in November are just the start of our item progression initiative.” – Murdock’s closing paragraph in the blog.

This is just the start…

If the only way to get the gear is through the dungeon, then bad Anet no bisect. You guys finally broke the stupid gear-grinding-dungeon treadmill I hated. Don’t make me run a dungeon to get best in slot gear when I don’t want to! Give me alternatives just like you did with day one, can some one smack the intern that thought of this?

jboynton.7894:

RobinotX.1604:

jboynton.7894:

What does a new tier of gear have to do with having something to do? Do you mean to say that you can’t craft, PvP, PvE, or Explore without the reward of progressively better gear at max level?

No, but people need to get some sort of a goal.

For example I have many goals I have put myself, making Mystic Forge weapons instead of Legendary. Or making a legendary en get my characters all on the armor I want for them.

Some people have to hold a hand to know where they have to go.
WoW for example has goals. Goals where all people go for.

Guild Wars 2, puts you, a measly human, charr, norn, asura or sylvari in a wide world. And says, go and play. They say nothing about.

Before you can do this dungeon, you have to do this one. And after that, you have to dungeon X, But before you can dungeon X you have to level again in Area V…

Here it is, you can do whatever you want..

Now they have put one dungeon in it where you have to do something (sort of a must if you wanna do that specific dungeon), and go for it. You get a goal.

I see and I do respect what people think about the future, but I am not afraid yet. I wait till this patch comes out and see what it will do with the whole game. Maybe we are laying eggs for nothing.

Isn’t the goal to complete the content though? The reward for completing is then a unique skin and/or title/achievement that is only attainable by those who complete said content.

If people aren’t interested in completing content without the reward being progressively strong loot; then the fact is they’re not interested in the content at all, but merely interested in the loot.

Yeah that’s the name for it. You actually clear the content for it.

And yeah, there are people who don’t care about the loot. I also don’t care about the loot. I care about how it looks. I am really looking to get that shadow shield for my Engineer. (Grinning Shield).

But I have to farm some then !.

Conner.4702:

Never.6014:

RoChan.1926:

Lomax.2463:

good god you people cant read !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i am amazed there so so many that cant comprehend what Anet is doing

OK FOR THOSE THAT HAVE NO CLUE.

1. There is no stat increase !!!!!! they took away the upgrade slot and put the points that you would have gotten from the upgrade slot into the main stats of the item!
that is right Ascended armor is worse then exotic as it is not as customizable as normal armor!

2. Infusion slot is for negating a new condition call Agony that will only be in this dungeon! that is right it is worthless in WvW or any place outside this dungeon.

3. getting exotic gear is easy and is full customizable with upgrade slots, Ascended armor is hard to get is less useful as real exotic gear outside of this dungeon.

4. this is a cool great new dungeon , it is scalable for the progression players but none of it is any use outside of this one dungeon. it will allow player to brag about i hit 27th level of infusion !!! woot for me but as infusion does nothing outside of the dungeon why would a WvW player even care ?

this is like a PVE dungeon version of the PVP ranking , i think its great .

False. Let’s re-read the blog shall we? I shall disprove your points with facts straight out of the horse’s mouth.

“Eventually, you’ll be able to kit yourself out with a full set of Ascended gear and high end Infusions to help give you the edge in end game content.”

Not an increase? Why then would they say it’s to give me an edge on end game content?

“You’ll also see more Legendary items in the future and an update to our existing Legendary weapons. Legendary items were always intended to be on par with other “best-in-slot” items. So fear not, all existing Legendary weapons, which are currently on par with Exotics, will be upgraded to be on par with Ascended weapons at the same time that we add Ascended weapons to the game. Thus Legendaries will remain “best-in-slot” items.”

Ok let’s do some math with words! It’s called the pathogram theory and this is how it works! If A = B and B = C then A = C. So if Legendaries are the best-in-slot items and they are going to mimic/reflect Ascended weapons wouldn’t that mean that Ascended weapons are also the best-in-slot items? Hmm… sounds to me like a stat increase!

The other half of this math is that they said that Legendaries would be on par with bes tin slot going forward. If they are changing to Ascended, perhaps that is the final change. You know… maybe.

Maybe the real plan is for us to eventually have a full set of legendary everything that keeps up with each tier of gear. That wouldn’t be so bad. You could get one set of gear forever if you want to (like I do) or just keep getting new pieces each tier. It COULD be a win-win.

Except they stated in the blog they want to add new types of infusions in the future. Meaning you will need Armor A for Dungeon A, Armor B for Dungeon B and so on ad infinitum.

It’s bad design. It would have been better the GW1 way to run a series of quests to get your current armor infused. I’d still dislike it though as it still gates content behind specific armor requirements.

Oh, I’m with you on bad design; I’m just trying to see enough of a bright side to keep enjoying the game if this turns out to be as bad as it looks.