Guild Wars 2

Naoko.7096:

-snip-

Big Difference. One is vertical progression, while the other is horizontal progression.

Skins don’t affect gameplay, but stats do. Having the “best” skin doesn’t give you any advantages, but having the best stats does. Now, this so called “fashion treadmill” is only a treadmill if you make it out to be, since beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Nobody is required to chase after any existing skin since it affects nothing in the game, but some are required to chase after the highest level of gear if they desire to attain maximum combat effectiveness. And if they introduce a new tier (and in the case of GW2, the Ascended tier), we would have a gear treadmill forming: you either (1) try getting that newest tier and stay where you were before (maximum combat effectiveness), or (2) you don’t and get moved backward as a result. You’re not going anywhere by having any skin.

TheWarKeeper.5374:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

IceCold.5172:

I personally is looking forward to a new dungeon. And the new gear. Cant see what the fuzz is all about if people dont want to grind DONT do it. Stop kittening and whining like little kids lol.

The problem here is that someone with a full set of ascended will have quite higher stats. For example 1000+ hp, 5%+ crit chance, 30%+ crit damage. Those are examples but over all each piece will give you 8% more stats. When some items are over 100 stats already that 8% is massive in power boost. This is what people dont realize. In order to stay useful you will have to grind.

Well, the fact of the matter is that you can’t know that. I’m not saying that it’s impossible that we will have to grind, but I’m saying that it’s possible that we don’t have to grind. I mean everyone here says that GW2 is about enjoying the journey, playing for fun and all that. What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

Alright, what if people are just trying to do the other dungeons? what if they want to go with their alt in another part of that dungeon rather than grind it all over again just so he/she is able to join his/her party?
Also, we can know that, it has been already officially stated there will be more gear grind in the future, a middle term, to poor of a grind for grinders to enjoy, too broken for casual players who just want to do the high end content they were promissed they were able without gear grinding.

Once again, you can’t know any of that for sure. They said that they will add a new gear tier (ascended), you don’t know if they will add another or not. And even if they did, you still wouldn’t know how hard it would be to acquire it. Maybe you would just have to do the dungeon once, maybe not.

You must understand why they added a new tier, and right now you think it’s because some people complained on the forums. I think differently but whatever (I already expressed my thoughts on the previous page), let’s assume that what you say is true and that the forums were the cause. Then you don’t have anything to worry about. Now don’t think that I’m saying that you should go whine as much as possible because then the developers will listen. What one should do in the case of lack of certainty, is to embrace possibilities and simply state that “IF the game becomes like this, or IF there is a major grind, then I will be displeased”, not to assume something and quit altogether.

Dedalus.3065:

What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

The original blog post specifically says that part of the reason for rolling out Ascended gear is that players had finished getting Exotic gear “much sooner than [ArenaNet] expected”.
The dev comment in this thread states that Ascended gear is intended to not have a “massive jump in reward” between them and Legendaries. Since we know that there is currently zero mechanical reward for having a Legendary, one can only infer that this is talking about a “massive jump” in the acquisition time/effort.

It’s not assuming anything to think that Ascended gear is going to be more of a grind than Exotic gear. It’s basically a stated design goal.

Krustydog.1043:

[…] I bet they had hoped to wait longer to release it but for who knows what reason they are releasing it now. […]

they’ve already said it (more or less)
its because people obtained the legendaries sooner as the dev’s had thought, so its time to give " us* " something new to obtain

there are plenty of players who had left the game because there is no progression in stats and i guess this is the main reason why they’ve rushed, or lets just say launched this earlier as they may have intended to do
just dont forget that not every player comes here to the forums to disclose their opinion!

there is one thing i would really like to see
a monitoring of the actual numbers of the players that are online (in total, not only “my” server)

a little counter somewhere in the menu:
players online / actual registered accounts
780.000/2.150.000 (<- only fictitious numbers)
and mybe the highest # of players online at the same time

one more thing to think about is, that decreasing numbers is not good at all
because in the end it affects everyone

*us, as players of gw2, here I’m including myself – I dont have a legendary (…yet) and actually it doesnt bother me that I’ve maxed out the main stats already
there are plenty of different builds, skills, runes, sigills I want to try in different combinations so I dont see any need of a gear with higher stats
(maybe at some time in the future, who knows)
but thats just my opinion

The silence from Anet tells me more and more that I can’t trust this Anet. So if I can’t trust them to keep their word, than why would I trust them with my money.

Dedalus.3065:

TheWarKeeper.5374:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

IceCold.5172:

I personally is looking forward to a new dungeon. And the new gear. Cant see what the fuzz is all about if people dont want to grind DONT do it. Stop kittening and whining like little kids lol.

The problem here is that someone with a full set of ascended will have quite higher stats. For example 1000+ hp, 5%+ crit chance, 30%+ crit damage. Those are examples but over all each piece will give you 8% more stats. When some items are over 100 stats already that 8% is massive in power boost. This is what people dont realize. In order to stay useful you will have to grind.

Well, the fact of the matter is that you can’t know that. I’m not saying that it’s impossible that we will have to grind, but I’m saying that it’s possible that we don’t have to grind. I mean everyone here says that GW2 is about enjoying the journey, playing for fun and all that. What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

Alright, what if people are just trying to do the other dungeons? what if they want to go with their alt in another part of that dungeon rather than grind it all over again just so he/she is able to join his/her party?
Also, we can know that, it has been already officially stated there will be more gear grind in the future, a middle term, to poor of a grind for grinders to enjoy, too broken for casual players who just want to do the high end content they were promissed they were able without gear grinding.

Once again, you can’t know any of that for sure. They said that they will add a new gear tier (ascended), you don’t know if they will add another or not. And even if they did, you still wouldn’t know how hard it would be to acquire it. Maybe you would just have to do the dungeon once, maybe not.

You must understand why they added a new tier, and right now you think it’s because some people complained on the forums. I think differently but whatever (I already expressed my thoughts on the previous page), let’s assume that what you say is true and that the forums were the cause. Then you don’t have anything to worry about. Now don’t think that I’m saying that you should go whine as much as possible because then the developers will listen. What one should do in the case of lack of certainty, is to embrace possibilities and simply state that “IF the game becomes like this, or IF there is a major grind, then I will be displeased”, not to assume something and quit altogether.

Yes i do know because they said they will, just not every 3 months, read their replies before asking or making these statements please.
They have added gear by popular demand of the annihilation of the only thing that was Guild Wars like, after this is changed, theres absolutely 0 that makes this game in any way similar to Guild Wars.
Theres is no and never was any need for more gear grinding, softening up with u get 2 pieces now and 3 pieces later is not a bait im going to fall for because in the end i grinded for it.
I do not have to know for certain, when you are the one who is in doubt, i think this is easy to understand.

BondageBill.4021:

IMO, ANet can make 90% of the people in this thread happy with two relatively simple changes:

1. Make Ascended base stats equal to those of Exotics.
2. Make a toggle for whether Agony (and the subsequent loot bonuses) affects your group. This could be a party vote, similar to exp. paths today.

These two changes make excellent compromises for both the crowd that does not want stat inflation and the crowd that wants gear progression.

Anti stat inflation: Ascended gear remains equal in power to current Exotics. New dungeon content is available with Agony turned off to allow for casual runs with limited loot-potential (read: current dungeon reward level). All content is available to this group without invalidating previous gearing efforts or introducing power creep through stats.

Gear progression: Ascended gear grows in power (for dungeons) through infusions, providing continued gear progression. More difficult dungeons (as far as Agony inflates difficulty) provide better loot rewards. This group gets a progressive, and potentially competitive, PvE mode.

Even better:

trash ascended gear entirely and give infusion slots to all max lvl exotics, either automatically or via quest/event/mission/whatever

OR

transform max lvl exotics into equivalent ascended items via quest/event/mission/whatever

The progression will still be there in the form of collecting infusions and new ascended gear but at least they won’t make all exotics obsolete all of a sudden.

The idea of agony/infusion was taken from GW1, but the fundamental difference was that there you could infuse any max level armor by doing a mission. You dind’t need a new special tier of rarity.

SiNoS.2147:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

IceCold.5172:

I personally is looking forward to a new dungeon. And the new gear. Cant see what the fuzz is all about if people dont want to grind DONT do it. Stop kittening and whining like little kids lol.

The problem here is that someone with a full set of ascended will have quite higher stats. For example 1000+ hp, 5%+ crit chance, 30%+ crit damage. Those are examples but over all each piece will give you 8% more stats. When some items are over 100 stats already that 8% is massive in power boost. This is what people dont realize. In order to stay useful you will have to grind.

Well, the fact of the matter is that you can’t know that. I’m not saying that it’s impossible that we will have to grind, but I’m saying that it’s possible that we don’t have to grind. I mean everyone here says that GW2 is about enjoying the journey, playing for fun and all that. What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

This new tier is being put in so gear grinders have something to grind. According to how they have covered it this new gear is going to take time. More so than exotic’s, and less than legendary’s in order to try to hold off the content locust. So by that we can assume its infact not easy to get this gear, and will infact be time consuming in order to grind it out.

They stated that the tier is between exotic’s and legendaries, correct. But you must remember that there’s a big difference in the acquisition of legendaries and exotics. For legendaries, you need to grind every part of the game. For exotics, you need to grind one part of the game. Their goal could very well be to eliminate the grind that exotics require by spreading it out across all aspects of the game (like legendaries).

Urxx.6840:

The idea of agony/infusion was taken from GW1, but the fundamental difference was that there you could infuse any max level armor by doing a mission. You dind’t need a new special tier of rarity.

Well it seems that you can infuse any max level armor in GW2 too. It’s just that the definition of max level armor changes with this patch.

Was loitering around LA today and to my shock found 6 dudes with legendaries having a chat.

Another player passing by asked how they got them which a couple of them pretty much said they just went to a gold seller and bought most of the mats needed to make it. Then they started complaining about ANet crushing bots of recent and hoping they come back so they don’t have to grind…

Not saying all legendary owners bought gold to short cut the process but a bunch infact did…

Like I knew a guy in another F2P MMO who dropped 2 grand, 2 grand to get a better weapon than I did which took me around 2 months of solid grinding to make. People with that sort of disposable income will spend as much as needed to be better than others and or not have to grind.

When legendaries get dmg buffs, these are the people that benefit the most and seemingly the player base they are now catering too? That conversation was kinda depressing if not sickening to listen too, I logged off after that in disgust.

I just hope ascended weapons are not that hard to get and equal to legendaries. I really don’t want to play another game that devolves into who spends the most wins.

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

IceCold.5172:

I personally is looking forward to a new dungeon. And the new gear. Cant see what the fuzz is all about if people dont want to grind DONT do it. Stop kittening and whining like little kids lol.

The problem here is that someone with a full set of ascended will have quite higher stats. For example 1000+ hp, 5%+ crit chance, 30%+ crit damage. Those are examples but over all each piece will give you 8% more stats. When some items are over 100 stats already that 8% is massive in power boost. This is what people dont realize. In order to stay useful you will have to grind.

Well, the fact of the matter is that you can’t know that. I’m not saying that it’s impossible that we will have to grind, but I’m saying that it’s possible that we don’t have to grind. I mean everyone here says that GW2 is about enjoying the journey, playing for fun and all that. What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

This new tier is being put in so gear grinders have something to grind. According to how they have covered it this new gear is going to take time. More so than exotic’s, and less than legendary’s in order to try to hold off the content locust. So by that we can assume its infact not easy to get this gear, and will infact be time consuming in order to grind it out.

They stated that the tier is between exotic’s and legendaries, correct. But you must remember that there’s a big difference in the acquisition of legendaries and exotics. For legendaries, you need to grind every part of the game. For exotics, you need to grind one part of the game. Their goal could very well be to eliminate the grind that exotics require by spreading it out across all aspects of the game (like legendaries).

Which forces me to grind content i do not want to do. Any way you look at it is a massive time sink into content you may not like. I have dabbled in about everything out there. I personally do have area’s i will not touch ever again. If it forces me into these area’s i will leave. Thing is im not alown here. A large core of players will do the same thing.

stof.9341:

Urxx.6840:

The idea of agony/infusion was taken from GW1, but the fundamental difference was that there you could infuse any max level armor by doing a mission. You dind’t need a new special tier of rarity.

Well it seems that you can infuse any max level armor in GW2 too. It’s just that the definition of max level armor changes with this patch.

Any armor could be infused in GW1. Not just max.

fixit.7189:

Was loitering around LA today and to my shock found 6 dudes with legendaries having a chat.

Another player passing by asked how they got them which a couple of them pretty much said they just went to a gold seller and bought most of the mats needed to make it. Then they started complaining about ANet crushing bots of recent and hoping they come back so they don’t have to grind…

Not saying all legendary owners bought gold to short cut the process but a bunch infact did…

Like I knew a guy in another F2P MMO who dropped 2 grand, 2 grand to get a better weapon than I did which took me around 2 months of solid grinding to make. People with that sort of disposable income will spend as much as needed to be better than others and or not have to grind.

When legendaries get dmg buffs, these are the people that benefit the most and seemingly the player base they are now catering too? That conversation was kinda depressing if not sickening to listen too, I logged off after that in disgust.

I just hope ascended weapons are not that hard to get and equal to legendaries. I really don’t want to play another game that devolves into who spends the most wins.

If you had it on record of them saying it you should have reported them. To late now unless you screenshotted it.

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

IceCold.5172:

I personally is looking forward to a new dungeon. And the new gear. Cant see what the fuzz is all about if people dont want to grind DONT do it. Stop kittening and whining like little kids lol.

The problem here is that someone with a full set of ascended will have quite higher stats. For example 1000+ hp, 5%+ crit chance, 30%+ crit damage. Those are examples but over all each piece will give you 8% more stats. When some items are over 100 stats already that 8% is massive in power boost. This is what people dont realize. In order to stay useful you will have to grind.

Well, the fact of the matter is that you can’t know that. I’m not saying that it’s impossible that we will have to grind, but I’m saying that it’s possible that we don’t have to grind. I mean everyone here says that GW2 is about enjoying the journey, playing for fun and all that. What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

Here are some of my problems, and other people probably feel the same way.

In gw1 you hit max level pretty early and get max gear pretty fast. After that you just farm for custom skins.

Gw2 was sold to us as the same type of thing.

So, I had planned on leveling 1 of each class to level 80 and buy them all multiple sets of exotic gear and weapons. Then I was going to mostly play them in WvW and then sometimes explore pve for fun and skins, as new content came out.

A lot of people had already gotten far enough to make lots of sets of exotics and used transmutation stones, believing that this gear would have max stats forever. Some spending a fair amount of money on this and now feel it was wasted and are upset.

The problem now is that the precedent has been set for new tiers of gear being added into the game.

I no longer believe that I will be able to level all classes to 80 and get all of the different sets of gear for them in the time that I want to spend with the game.

Even if I decided I could live with this new gear and filled the inventory of my characters with lots of different sets of gear for WvW, they could then just decide to add a new tier of gear and all my time would have been semi wasted and I would need to farm new gear. I would never be able to trust that my gear had the best stats and I would never use transmutation stones either.

So, pretty much, with this update, the game will no longer be the game that I wanted to play and I will have to quit.

For me to play the way I had planned on playing the game would have to have a firm max tier, or, WvW will have to use pvp gear… or both.

Conner.4702:

stof.9341:

Urxx.6840:

The idea of agony/infusion was taken from GW1, but the fundamental difference was that there you could infuse any max level armor by doing a mission. You dind’t need a new special tier of rarity.

Well it seems that you can infuse any max level armor in GW2 too. It’s just that the definition of max level armor changes with this patch.

Any armor could be infused in GW1. Not just max.

Not only any armor could be infused in GW1, but any armor from any world of it could, all u had to do was to a mission which takes less than 1 hour and bam, ure now practically immune with ur max stat armor.

Mhyrria.4160:

Punk.4072:

I think its an awesome idea, Gear upgrade really motivates players to keep playing to achieve a better equipment, and besides we’ll have more end-game content to focus in.
i hope every BIG patch, they introduce new gear quality aswell as Max Level increased and new skills.

For QQ’ers : – Remenber Legendary weapons are stronger than Exotics, So stop QQ.

Did any of you guys read this? Wow, just wow.. And these are the type of people Anet wants to cater. Punk guy, Legendaries are not stronger than Exotics. Go back to your panda please

Edit: Wrong Information. Removed.

Now that thought about it, i think their main fault here is increasing the base stats of
ascended items, aside from that it could be a solution that would make everyone happy.
We have limited information about the system right now, but it could work like this:

You get 3 infusion slots on ascended gear and the NPC in the main hub can add/
replace infusion on your gear depending on your progress/farming there.
If you go deeper, you need more infusion. 24/7 gamers might reach level 100+ or
something. normal gamers possibly only 20+. But everyone saw every boss.

Then later they add a new dungeon like this with a new infusion type and 3 new items.
Progress in the old dungeon doesn’t matter, because of a new infusion type that is
easy to change in the main hub. You also have extra slots now, so you outclass the old
dungeon because you have extra slots, just how progress gamers want it.

It might not be what we will see in the game, but i guess something like that was the
basic idea of the whole thing. And then, somewhere, the idea of higher base stats for
these items slipped in.

Dedalus.3065:

Once again, you can’t know any of that for sure. They said that they will add a new gear tier (ascended), you don’t know if they will add another or not. And even if they did, you still wouldn’t know how hard it would be to acquire it. Maybe you would just have to do the dungeon once, maybe not.

You must understand why they added a new tier, and right now you think it’s because some people complained on the forums. I think differently but whatever (I already expressed my thoughts on the previous page), let’s assume that what you say is true and that the forums were the cause. Then you don’t have anything to worry about. Now don’t think that I’m saying that you should go whine as much as possible because then the developers will listen. What one should do in the case of lack of certainty, is to embrace possibilities and simply state that “IF the game becomes like this, or IF there is a major grind, then I will be displeased”, not to assume something and quit altogether.

And you must understand that with a cash shop you are a part of an ecosystem. You chose to invest in a game if you have a long-term plan playing. Revenue doesn’t come from the content locusts, revenue comes from dedicated fans and long-term players.

When a company preaches their game design philosophy for several years and changes it 3 months after release that trust is gone and integrity lost.

I don’t want to wait and see because it’s irrelevant. If they want to get revenue from me they have to provide me with a clear set of goals and direction they are taking. I would never expect Blizzard to change WoW to a game without gear progression. It’s their bread and butter and they are good at it.

I chose this game for a specific clame made by the developers about their goals regarding gear progression. I’ve already spent quite a lot of money in the gem shop because I thought I was here for the long-run.

Is this really so hard to understand? Their revenue model is not sub based, it’s based on players buying stuff from the gem store. Do you really think all those people prasing this decision with statements like “amagad!!!!!1111111oneeleven, I will reinstall the game for this patch, gear grind, woot!!!!1111oneeleven” will spend a dime in the gem store?

No they won’t, they will just uninstall the game again and wait for the next tier of gear. Happens all the time in other MMOs. A big influx of people for the patch and then it slowly dies out again.

Anet figuratively speaking got caught by their wife while banging an 18 year old call girl on the kitchen table.

Even if it is a one time stand and Anet loves his wife, the marriage may still be over. And even if it isn’t over, it will be going through some real tough times with serious trust issues. The marriage will never go back to what it used to be.

Dedalus.3065:

They stated that the tier is between exotic’s and legendaries, correct. But you must remember that there’s a big difference in the acquisition of legendaries and exotics. For legendaries, you need to grind every part of the game. For exotics, you need to grind one part of the game. Their goal could very well be to eliminate the grind that exotics require by spreading it out across all aspects of the game (like legendaries).

How much gring will be required to get ascended gear is completely irrelevant IMO.
The problem here is not how difficult or time consuming it is to get ascended gear.

The problem is rather that the introduction of ascended gear constitutes a very bad business decision.

1) it alienates casual players, who most realistically invested real money into their now obsolete exotics via gems and who would have continued to spend money and support the game if ANet didn’t spit on their past effort.

2) It pleases hardcore gamers, but they will be here whining because they are bored one week after the patch goes live.

What happens is that to please a fraction of the player base which is virtually impossible to please, they are alienating those who factually support the game via gem store.

Also in doing all this they break their own previous design phylosophy and promises which were to have cosmetic improvement instead of power creep. They are stepping on Blizzard’s ground, were they will be destroyed because Blizzard is much better than them at the threadmill game.

Pants.8315:

Actually, the Legendary weapons do have more damage/stats on them:

Legendary >> http://www.gw2db.com/items/63469-twilight << 1011-1117, +182 Power, +130 Toughness, +130 Vitality

Exotic >> http://www.gw2db.com/items/48101-invaders-greatsword << 995-1100, +179 Power, +128 Toughness, + 128 Vitality.

Comparing Twilight to the WvWvW Exotic GS: That’s +16 -17 to damage range, + 3 power, +2 Toughness and + 3 Vitality. Which is actually about the same stats creep we’re seeing in the Ascended items.

Taking that into account, if Anet introduce legendary items for every slot, then realistically Ascended items won’t have had any stats creep at all, they will just match the Legendary stats creep that’s already a feature of the game.

Legendaries aren’t more powerful than Exotics at the moment. That information is wrong.

Crater.1625:

Dedalus.3065:

What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

The original blog post specifically says that part of the reason for rolling out Ascended gear is that players had finished getting Exotic gear “much sooner than [ArenaNet] expected”.
The dev comment in this thread states that Ascended gear is intended to not have a “massive jump in reward” between them and Legendaries. Since we know that there is currently zero mechanical reward for having a Legendary, one can only infer that this is talking about a “massive jump” in the acquisition time/effort.

It’s not assuming anything to think that Ascended gear is going to be more of a grind than Exotic gear. It’s basically a stated design goal.

People finished it faster because they grinded it out, Anets intention could be to introduce a new tier in order to reduce the grind that exotics require. You think that the only aspect that differentiates exotics from legendaries is time and grind. Whilst it is true that legendaries do require more time and grind, it is not true that it is the only aspect that seperates them from exotics. Legendaries currently require materials, karma, experience, money, dungeon tokens, basically everything the game has to offer. Exotic gear can however be gained through only repeating dungeon runs, or only farming karma, or only buying it from the TP. Doing a single thing over and over again is what constitutes a grind. Spreading the requirements for the new gear alike a legendary (I.e. covering all aspects of the PvE game), ensures that it will feel like less of a grind.

Once again, I cannot be certain that this will be the way. I could very well be wrong and it will be a huge grind. As I’ve stated in my previous posts, with lack of certainty you must embrace possibilities.

I think the biggest problem now is the lack of communication. Even though we got the blog posts they don’t go into details. Even the post in here does not really explain anything beyond “no it’s not gear progression” statement. Players have a lot of concers and nothing is really answered. Their need to keep everything a surprise baffles me – even the Jon Peters post in ranger section didn’t give any specific information on fixes because “it might be a spoiler”. Seriously? Bug fixes shouldn’t come as a surprise thing to us.

Conner.4702:

The silence from Anet tells me more and more that I can’t trust this Anet. So if I can’t trust them to keep their word, than why would I trust them with my money.

I can’t imagine this massive, almost entirely unanimous feedback thread had no influence on them at all, that’s why I’m still waiting with my refund request.
I was worried that I won’t be able to get one since I pre-purchased with PayPal months ago, but apparently my friend just got one, so I too can “speak with my wallet”.

The article about content locust really depressed me further since it’s exactly what happened here in GW2. It’s even more sad since a company with over a decade of experience with MMO community – and Blizzard experience to build upon, too!- fell for that.
What’s even more surprising is that GW2 financial model was explicitly based on targeting casual and dedicated players! Why on earth would one antagonize those groups, caving it to requests from the minority that will not buy Gems for real money, because they have enough gold to buy them off casuals-suppliers?

So I’m waiting for a proper communication, not some word-smithing and spin doctor act about “ANet not wanting to introduce treadmill, so they ain’t going to name it that” and other completely void stuff.
I explicitly have not bought a game with gear treadmill and no, naming it “gear progression” does not change a single thing.
I will not “wait and see and trust you this is a good direction for your game”, because primo, I can’t trust you any more and secundo, for the nth time in this thread, this is not what the product advertised to me was to be.

I know what gear treadmill/vertical progression is and I know what gear gating is, I’ve experienced them both and I find nothing, absolutely nothing good about them. The lack of both is why I chose your product.

I bet the infusion gems can be created in the Mythical Forge and need shop itemes to create.

Pants.8315:

Mhyrria.4160:

Punk.4072:

I think its an awesome idea, Gear upgrade really motivates players to keep playing to achieve a better equipment, and besides we’ll have more end-game content to focus in.
i hope every BIG patch, they introduce new gear quality aswell as Max Level increased and new skills.

For QQ’ers : – Remenber Legendary weapons are stronger than Exotics, So stop QQ.

Did any of you guys read this? Wow, just wow.. And these are the type of people Anet wants to cater. Punk guy, Legendaries are not stronger than Exotics. Go back to your panda please

Actually, the Legendary weapons do have more damage/stats on them:

Legendary >> http://www.gw2db.com/items/63469-twilight << 1011-1117, +182 Power, +130 Toughness, +130 Vitality

Exotic >> http://www.gw2db.com/items/48101-invaders-greatsword << 995-1100, +179 Power, +128 Toughness, + 128 Vitality.

Comparing Twilight to the WvWvW Exotic GS: That’s +16 -17 to damage range, + 3 power, +2 Toughness and + 3 Vitality. Which is actually about the same stats creep we’re seeing in the Ascended items.

Taking that into account, if Anet introduce legendary items for every slot, then realistically Ascended items won’t have had any stats creep at all, they will just match the Legendary stats creep that’s already a feature of the game.

Nope.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Twilight

+179 Power.png Power
+128 Toughness.png Toughness
+128 Vitality.png Vitality
Upgrade Slot Sigil of Superior Leeching.png Sigil of Superior Leeching

They have the same stats as exotics, or are supposed to. Not sure what is up with gw2db… maybe an early build or something.

Euthil.5209:

Pants.8315:

Actually, the Legendary weapons do have more damage/stats on them:

Legendary >> http://www.gw2db.com/items/63469-twilight << 1011-1117, +182 Power, +130 Toughness, +130 Vitality

Exotic >> http://www.gw2db.com/items/48101-invaders-greatsword << 995-1100, +179 Power, +128 Toughness, + 128 Vitality.

Comparing Twilight to the WvWvW Exotic GS: That’s +16 -17 to damage range, + 3 power, +2 Toughness and + 3 Vitality. Which is actually about the same stats creep we’re seeing in the Ascended items.

Taking that into account, if Anet introduce legendary items for every slot, then realistically Ascended items won’t have had any stats creep at all, they will just match the Legendary stats creep that’s already a feature of the game.

Legendaries aren’t more powerful than Exotics at the moment. That information is wrong.

Further research does in fact show I’m wrong, my bad, shouldn’t trust gw2db, will edit my post out.

Dedalus.3065:

Then I’m definitely surprised that you’re still here, since you do not automatically get exotics when you hit 80 in the current game.

I did – I think I was about lvl 74 when I bought my first exotic set (ready for when I hit 80). I enjoy exploring and gathering, but wasn’t hooked by crafting, so I made a lot of gold selling materials during those first few weeks.

Dedalus.3065:

And I understand what you’re saying, but the funny part is that it’s in the current game that you have to grind for BiS. I’m suggesting that BiS be a reward for experiencing the game, not grinding it. It’s motivation for people to try out that which they haven’t done before. The new dungeon will be more randomized and therefore feel less grindy than the others. something which I think Anet should implement across all dungeons to mitigate the grind in the current dungeons.

The problem with that, is that being forced into (OK, encouraged to experience ) areas of the game you don’t enjoy for an hour or two, is still grind, even if you only have to do it a few times. I just don’t personally like the 5-man format and I won’t tolerate LFGing for groups. It’s all good, dungeons just aren’t for me, the same way WvW or SPvP are not liked by some players. It’s Anet trying to force players into areas they don’t enjoy that creates an issue for me. My mood toward these zones switches from respecting them as there for others to enjoy, to something I resent, as impacting on my game.

Dedalus.3065:

Anyway, it’s too soon for us to exclaim our worries of the difficulty of getting the new gear, since we can’t know exactly how hard it will be. Ultimately, the mystic forge recipes will probably depend on the things you gather on your journey to max level, I.e. like a legendary but much less grindy (hopefully).

Alas, I suspect they’ll throw a dungeon “gift” in any recipes they add, since that’s what they’ve been doing so far.

SiNoS.2147:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

IceCold.5172:

I personally is looking forward to a new dungeon. And the new gear. Cant see what the fuzz is all about if people dont want to grind DONT do it. Stop kittening and whining like little kids lol.

The problem here is that someone with a full set of ascended will have quite higher stats. For example 1000+ hp, 5%+ crit chance, 30%+ crit damage. Those are examples but over all each piece will give you 8% more stats. When some items are over 100 stats already that 8% is massive in power boost. This is what people dont realize. In order to stay useful you will have to grind.

Well, the fact of the matter is that you can’t know that. I’m not saying that it’s impossible that we will have to grind, but I’m saying that it’s possible that we don’t have to grind. I mean everyone here says that GW2 is about enjoying the journey, playing for fun and all that. What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

This new tier is being put in so gear grinders have something to grind. According to how they have covered it this new gear is going to take time. More so than exotic’s, and less than legendary’s in order to try to hold off the content locust. So by that we can assume its infact not easy to get this gear, and will infact be time consuming in order to grind it out.

They stated that the tier is between exotic’s and legendaries, correct. But you must remember that there’s a big difference in the acquisition of legendaries and exotics. For legendaries, you need to grind every part of the game. For exotics, you need to grind one part of the game. Their goal could very well be to eliminate the grind that exotics require by spreading it out across all aspects of the game (like legendaries).

Which forces me to grind content i do not want to do. Any way you look at it is a massive time sink into content you may not like. I have dabbled in about everything out there. I personally do have area’s i will not touch ever again. If it forces me into these area’s i will leave. Thing is im not alown here. A large core of players will do the same thing.

But the main selling point of GW2 end game was that the entire game was the end game. Isn’t it logical then that the rewards for experiencing the end game covers all of it? And I know that you will say that the reward for experiencing the end game is fun, but the previous reward was actually exotic gear, but the acquisition of exotic gear is flawed since it didn’t cover the entire end game. And I have to ask another thing, is doing a dungeon once considered grinding?

pregnable.1954:

Pants.8315:

Mhyrria.4160:

Punk.4072:

I think its an awesome idea, Gear upgrade really motivates players to keep playing to achieve a better equipment, and besides we’ll have more end-game content to focus in.
i hope every BIG patch, they introduce new gear quality aswell as Max Level increased and new skills.

For QQ’ers : – Remenber Legendary weapons are stronger than Exotics, So stop QQ.

Did any of you guys read this? Wow, just wow.. And these are the type of people Anet wants to cater. Punk guy, Legendaries are not stronger than Exotics. Go back to your panda please

Actually, the Legendary weapons do have more damage/stats on them:

Legendary >> http://www.gw2db.com/items/63469-twilight << 1011-1117, +182 Power, +130 Toughness, +130 Vitality

Exotic >> http://www.gw2db.com/items/48101-invaders-greatsword << 995-1100, +179 Power, +128 Toughness, + 128 Vitality.

Comparing Twilight to the WvWvW Exotic GS: That’s +16 -17 to damage range, + 3 power, +2 Toughness and + 3 Vitality. Which is actually about the same stats creep we’re seeing in the Ascended items.

Taking that into account, if Anet introduce legendary items for every slot, then realistically Ascended items won’t have had any stats creep at all, they will just match the Legendary stats creep that’s already a feature of the game.

Nope.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Twilight

+179 Power.png Power
+128 Toughness.png Toughness
+128 Vitality.png Vitality
Upgrade Slot Sigil of Superior Leeching.png Sigil of Superior Leeching

They have the same stats as exotics, or are supposed to. Not sure what is up with gw2db… maybe an early build or something.

Indeed. My fault, removed the original post as it’s misleading. Though, interesting point, if it is from an earlier build, was this stats increase already there?

I’m a guild leader of an old GW1 Guild, created in May, 1st, 2005, that was reborn in GW2. We have ca. 30 Members in our guild, ranging from 24 to 58 years old. We all are standing in the middle of our lifes, have jobs, families and we were very happy with all what ArenaNet has provided to us in this wonderful game so far. Sure there were a few bugs in the beginning, but nothing to complain about. We were happy to play und that was exact what we did, playing and enjoing our small amount of free time in Guild Wars 2.
There was no need to post about the bugs in forums wildly, no need to make complains and / or suggestions, we simply trusted in Arenanet to solve the problems and keep up with their good work as they did since 2005.
Our guild is a part oft the silent majority of players in GW2. Content, silent, and therefore unnoticed. Until now.

At this point, our guild has convinced me, that is time to come out oft the shadow, and tell you our opinion:
With this new coming update, with the introduction of a complete new tier between exotics and legendaries, you, ArenaNet has broken your own words.

“Here’s what we believe: If someone wants to play for a thousand hours to get an item that is so rare that other players can’t realistically acquire it, that rare item should be differentiated by its visual appearance and rarity alone, not by being more powerful than everything else in the game. Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games — we leave the grind to other MMOs.”
-Mike Obrien, President of Arenanet

Fun impacts loot collection. The rarest items in the game are not more powerful than other items, so you don’t need them to be the best. The rarest items have unique looks to help your character feel that sense of accomplishment, but it’s not required to play the game. We don’t need to make mandatory gear treadmills, we make all of it optional, so those who find it fun to chase this prestigious gear can do so, but those who don’t are just as powerful and get to have fun too.”
– Colin Johanson

You stated many times, that in GW2 there will be no item grinding, no gear treatmill. But thats exact what you are introducing now.

And you know it!

There was no Colin Johanson, no Mike Obrien, no Martin Kerstein, who tell us the „new future of item progression“. No, you pick a new fresh name, a „redshirt“ to tell the world, how your betray your own MMO-Manifesto.

And to calm down the ongoing storm in the forums, their was another „redshirt“ called for duty, and again there was only silence from the writers of the manifesto.

My opinion is, the opinion of all members in our guild is:
You have broken your word, you have broken our trust in you and you have broken seven years of faith in you that ArenaNet is listening to their community.

The only thing left, is sadness.

ANET needs to clarify their stance further. If you agree, sign the petition by clicking on the link in my sig

Dedalus.3065:

And I have to ask another thing, is doing a dungeon once considered grinding?

If you always get a piece of Ascended gear on the first run through of fractals, I will literally eat my own face off.

I STRONGLY suspect that getting Yakkington’s Ring will require:

Multiple runs.
Luck from RNG.
A trip to the Mystic Forge.
Several other expensive items not from the Dungeon.

And other such GRIND-TASTIC things.

Dedalus.3065:

Once again, I cannot be certain that this will be the way. I could very well be wrong and it will be a huge grind. As I’ve stated in my previous posts, with lack of certainty you must embrace possibilities.

There isn’t really a lack of certainty, either. They’ve explicitly stated that the Ascended Rings will come from the FotM dungeon (here’s hoping that doesn’t become one of those oddly-appropriate acronyms), and the back braces are obtained through special Mystic Forge recipes.

So the Ascended Rings are going to impose more of a requirement that the player participate in a specific kind of content than Exotics do, and the Ascended back braces may or may not require the player to split his or her efforts between different gameplay modes. All of them are practically guaranteed to require more time and effort to acquire than their Exotic equivalents.

this may prove to be a very fatal error on their part. ALOT of people came to this game from WoW to get away from the grind (myself included)

so let’s see,stay here and grind from scratch OR go back to WoW and grind on toons i have been invested in for YEARS.

people are invested in their WoW toons, they still have friends/guilds there. if you make them choose between grinding here or back with Blizzard, i’d bet this game will go down in flames.

How many games have tried to be WoW and died for it? This one will be no different.

cherrie.8907:

Conner.4702:

The silence from Anet tells me more and more that I can’t trust this Anet. So if I can’t trust them to keep their word, than why would I trust them with my money.

I can’t imagine this massive, almost entirely unanimous feedback thread had no influence on them at all, that’s why I’m still waiting with my refund request.
I was worried that I won’t be able to get one since I pre-purchased with PayPal months ago, but apparently my friend just got one, so I too can “speak with my wallet”.

The article about content locust really depressed me further since it’s exactly what happened here in GW2. It’s even more sad since a company with over a decade of experience with MMO community – and Blizzard experience to build upon, too!- fell for that.
What’s even more surprising is that GW2 financial model was explicitly based on targeting casual and dedicated players! Why on earth would one antagonize those groups, caving it to requests from the minority that will not buy Gems for real money, because they have enough gold to buy them off casuals-suppliers?

So I’m waiting for a proper communication, not some word-smithing and spin doctor act about “ANet not wanting to introduce treadmill, so they ain’t going to name it that” and other completely void stuff.
I explicitly have not bought a game with gear treadmill and no, naming it “gear progression” does not change a single thing.
I will not “wait and see and trust you this is a good direction for your game”, because primo, I can’t trust you any more and secundo, for the nth time in this thread, this is not what the product advertised to me was to be.

I know what gear treadmill/vertical progression is and I know what gear gating is, I’ve experienced them both and I find nothing, absolutely nothing good about them. The lack of both is why I chose your product.

The biggest thing is in GW1 they had no official forum for the content locust to complain on.

cherrie.8907:

Conner.4702:

The silence from Anet tells me more and more that I can’t trust this Anet. So if I can’t trust them to keep their word, than why would I trust them with my money.

I can’t imagine this massive, almost entirely unanimous feedback thread had no influence on them at all, that’s why I’m still waiting with my refund request.

Well, this is the kind of messages one can find on ArenaNet’s twitters if you know where to look :

“In response to your article, as much as I wish you were right, most of the time the screaming angry mob is what gets heard”

“I can assure you that this is not the case”

Pants.8315:

pregnable.1954:

Pants.8315:

Mhyrria.4160:

Punk.4072:

I think its an awesome idea, Gear upgrade really motivates players to keep playing to achieve a better equipment, and besides we’ll have more end-game content to focus in.
i hope every BIG patch, they introduce new gear quality aswell as Max Level increased and new skills.

For QQ’ers : – Remenber Legendary weapons are stronger than Exotics, So stop QQ.

Did any of you guys read this? Wow, just wow.. And these are the type of people Anet wants to cater. Punk guy, Legendaries are not stronger than Exotics. Go back to your panda please

Actually, the Legendary weapons do have more damage/stats on them:

Legendary >> http://www.gw2db.com/items/63469-twilight << 1011-1117, +182 Power, +130 Toughness, +130 Vitality

Exotic >> http://www.gw2db.com/items/48101-invaders-greatsword << 995-1100, +179 Power, +128 Toughness, + 128 Vitality.

Comparing Twilight to the WvWvW Exotic GS: That’s +16 -17 to damage range, + 3 power, +2 Toughness and + 3 Vitality. Which is actually about the same stats creep we’re seeing in the Ascended items.

Taking that into account, if Anet introduce legendary items for every slot, then realistically Ascended items won’t have had any stats creep at all, they will just match the Legendary stats creep that’s already a feature of the game.

Nope.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Twilight

+179 Power.png Power
+128 Toughness.png Toughness
+128 Vitality.png Vitality
Upgrade Slot Sigil of Superior Leeching.png Sigil of Superior Leeching

They have the same stats as exotics, or are supposed to. Not sure what is up with gw2db… maybe an early build or something.

Indeed. My fault, removed the original post as it’s misleading. Though, interesting point, if it is from an earlier build, was this stats increase already there?

Yeah, no biggie.

I am really not sure about the stats. Maybe they knew something we did not all along… or found the higher stats in the game files.

I am not raging about this change, but it will cause me to quit the game for reasons I stated in an earlier post.

No QQ, but the game will no longer be the game I wanted to play and it will prevent me from playing in the way that I have planned and desired. So naturally I will move onto another game.

mordred.4609:

this may prove to be a very fatal error on their part. ALOT of people came to this game from WoW to get away from the grind (myself included)

so let’s see,stay here and grind from scratch OR go back to WoW and grind on toons i have been invested in for YEARS.

people are invested in their WoW toons, they still have friends/guilds there. if you make them choose between grinding here or back with Blizzard, i’d bet this game will go down in flames.

How many games have tried to be WoW and died for it? This one will be no different.

THIS!!!

In the opening sequence of the “Our Time is Now” trailer we see a player petrified in a chair as a representation of the MMO playerbase being frozen/stuck in the stagnant MMO culture that has become mainstream for the past decade. With the introduction of GW2 he is able to break free of this petrified state & defy existing conventions.

How is this trailer now relevant to GW2’s design philosophy? With the introduction of a “progressive” tier system the player is still petrified to stone, lingering in the same old MMO culture that GW2 vowed to defy.

By changing one of the founding principles that have been touted to its fanbase for over 5+ years in the first content patch is shows a severe lack of confidence in the developers vision that brought us all here in the first place.

You are trying to appease a audience that can never be satiated. Ever. Once they obtain the best loot in the game, they will once again claim “There is no endgame” to which your response will be to add more loot with better stats & the process will go on forever. All the while rendering previous content/time/effort void & aliening players who play on a casual basis.

This is a crossroads. You have the opportunity to change the industry. To change everything, which is why we are all here. We supported your original vision. Don’t divide the community like this. Please reconsider this decision.

I didn’t know so many people playing this MMO would rather jump ship from a great game because of a new and improved gear… I understand many of the points made… But I still don’t get it.

It’s not super super important to me to have the best of the best, but I happen to get a full exotic set which is the best so far… I was actually a little disappointed at how easy it was to obtain. I got the same gear almost every level 80 has who didn’t just hit 80 yay? I don’t see people saying LFGM with ascended gear only anytime soon, People don’t even say that about exotic gear or could probably point out that dude using a rare set instead of exotic. Guild wars “life” will go on weather you get this set or not.

Well to each his own I ain’t trying to bash y’all who are horrified for more tiers of gear even if I did a bit? I’m just flustered about how much rage a new rare armor is creating.

I welcome this new armor, maybe I won’t once it shows up but I have no idea what it will be or how hard it will be to get. Which intrigues me.

Bring it on!

Dedalus.3065:

Crater.1625:

Dedalus.3065:

What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

The original blog post specifically says that part of the reason for rolling out Ascended gear is that players had finished getting Exotic gear “much sooner than [ArenaNet] expected”.
The dev comment in this thread states that Ascended gear is intended to not have a “massive jump in reward” between them and Legendaries. Since we know that there is currently zero mechanical reward for having a Legendary, one can only infer that this is talking about a “massive jump” in the acquisition time/effort.

It’s not assuming anything to think that Ascended gear is going to be more of a grind than Exotic gear. It’s basically a stated design goal.

People finished it faster because they grinded it out, Anets intention could be to introduce a new tier in order to reduce the grind that exotics require. You think that the only aspect that differentiates exotics from legendaries is time and grind. Whilst it is true that legendaries do require more time and grind, it is not true that it is the only aspect that seperates them from exotics. Legendaries currently require materials, karma, experience, money, dungeon tokens, basically everything the game has to offer. Exotic gear can however be gained through only repeating dungeon runs, or only farming karma, or only buying it from the TP. Doing a single thing over and over again is what constitutes a grind. Spreading the requirements for the new gear alike a legendary (I.e. covering all aspects of the PvE game), ensures that it will feel like less of a grind.

Once again, I cannot be certain that this will be the way. I could very well be wrong and it will be a huge grind. As I’ve stated in my previous posts, with lack of certainty you must embrace possibilities.

I like your logic, so besides ur speculation about anet reducing grind in ascended beying false as youve just stated they want u to grind more, this helps us grind less because we already grinded enough for the exotics and now we grind again, dat makes sense.

As ive said before, because u are uncertain doesnt mean that everyone around u doesnt have to be aswell, we can read what they say and what they want to do with the game.

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

IceCold.5172:

I personally is looking forward to a new dungeon. And the new gear. Cant see what the fuzz is all about if people dont want to grind DONT do it. Stop kittening and whining like little kids lol.

The problem here is that someone with a full set of ascended will have quite higher stats. For example 1000+ hp, 5%+ crit chance, 30%+ crit damage. Those are examples but over all each piece will give you 8% more stats. When some items are over 100 stats already that 8% is massive in power boost. This is what people dont realize. In order to stay useful you will have to grind.

Well, the fact of the matter is that you can’t know that. I’m not saying that it’s impossible that we will have to grind, but I’m saying that it’s possible that we don’t have to grind. I mean everyone here says that GW2 is about enjoying the journey, playing for fun and all that. What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

This new tier is being put in so gear grinders have something to grind. According to how they have covered it this new gear is going to take time. More so than exotic’s, and less than legendary’s in order to try to hold off the content locust. So by that we can assume its infact not easy to get this gear, and will infact be time consuming in order to grind it out.

They stated that the tier is between exotic’s and legendaries, correct. But you must remember that there’s a big difference in the acquisition of legendaries and exotics. For legendaries, you need to grind every part of the game. For exotics, you need to grind one part of the game. Their goal could very well be to eliminate the grind that exotics require by spreading it out across all aspects of the game (like legendaries).

Which forces me to grind content i do not want to do. Any way you look at it is a massive time sink into content you may not like. I have dabbled in about everything out there. I personally do have area’s i will not touch ever again. If it forces me into these area’s i will leave. Thing is im not alown here. A large core of players will do the same thing.

But the main selling point of GW2 end game was that the entire game was the end game. Isn’t it logical then that the rewards for experiencing the end game covers all of it? And I know that you will say that the reward for experiencing the end game is fun, but the previous reward was actually exotic gear, but the acquisition of exotic gear is flawed since it didn’t cover the entire end game. And I have to ask another thing, is doing a dungeon once considered grinding?

Exactly, the main selling point of GW2 was the end game, u reached it quick and then u were free to do whatever u wanted from there, now they have upped the end game so we have to reach end game again.
If its logical for the rewards for experiencing the end game covers all of it? u mean better stats? no because then its no longer the end game and still your work in progress to achieve it.
As for the dungeon question, where did u get this information from? if its just a random question then i cant help u sorry.

Crater.1625:

Dedalus.3065:

Once again, I cannot be certain that this will be the way. I could very well be wrong and it will be a huge grind. As I’ve stated in my previous posts, with lack of certainty you must embrace possibilities.

There isn’t really a lack of certainty, either. They’ve explicitly stated that the Ascended Rings will come from the FotM dungeon (here’s hoping that doesn’t become one of those oddly-appropriate acronyms), and the back braces are obtained through special Mystic Forge recipes.

So the Ascended Rings are going to impose more of a requirement that the player participate in a specific kind of content than Exotics do, and the Ascended back braces may or may not require the player to split his or her efforts between different gameplay modes. All of them are practically guaranteed to require more time and effort to acquire than their Exotic equivalents.

Actually, If I’m not mistaken or if I’m lacking a different source, they said that you can acquire the ring from the dungeon. They didn’t state that it’s the only way, nor that you will have to do the dungeon a certain amount of times. Granted, based on previous experience in this game, one would not be entirely with fault for assuming that one would have to do this dungeon many times. But since they have said that there will be mystic forge recipes, I believe that their utmost intention is to spread the requirements for BiS, as I’ve stated, to reduce the feeling of grind. If this is indeed their intention, then it would not be one’s fault to assume that there won’t be a severe grind for the new tier. Add along to this, the fact that the new dungeon will be more randomized, and you’ll have a way of gaining the BiS that’s not a grind.

I find it humorous that the Ascended gear was probably a response to people feeling that exotic gear was too grindy, and then everyone assumes that there will be even more grind. However, as I’ve said before, people are not with fault for assuming this. But I still think that since these developers have provided an entertaining product, that they deserve some trust and not utmost and fast dismissal of their integrity and legitimacy.

Hopefully, after this patch, new people trying to get the BiS will not feel the grind that we felt the first time we got our exotics.

stof.9341:

cherrie.8907:

Conner.4702:

The silence from Anet tells me more and more that I can’t trust this Anet. So if I can’t trust them to keep their word, than why would I trust them with my money.

I can’t imagine this massive, almost entirely unanimous feedback thread had no influence on them at all, that’s why I’m still waiting with my refund request.

Well, this is the kind of messages one can find on ArenaNet’s twitters if you know where to look :

“In response to your article, as much as I wish you were right, most of the time the screaming angry mob is what gets heard”

“I can assure you that this is not the case”

Actions speak louder than word do.

Back when I believed ANet to be a trustworthy company, I’d swallow that.
I’m sorry, but when you loose credibility, you loose it all the way.
And seriously, “I can assure you it’s not the screaming mob getting into our hear.”, after admitting in your blog post that the reason for switching your principles was indeed players complaining the game was exactly like advertised, but not what they wanted?
Please. Don’t embarrass yourself further, ANet.

ReeferKeeper.1865:

I didn’t know so many people playing this MMO would rather jump ship from a great game because of a new and improved gear… I understand many of the points made… But I still don’t get it.

It’s not super super important to me to have the best of the best, but I happen to get a full exotic set which is the best so far… I was actually a little disappointed at how easy it was to obtain. I got the same gear almost every level 80 has who didn’t just hit 80 yay? I don’t see people saying LFGM with ascended gear only anytime soon, People don’t even say that about exotic gear or could probably point out that dude using a rare set instead of exotic. Guild wars “life” will go on weather you get this set or not.

Well to each his own I ain’t trying to bash y’all who are horrified for more tiers of gear even if I did a bit? I’m just flustered about how much rage a new rare armor is creating.

I welcome this new armor, maybe I won’t once it shows up but I have no idea what it will be or how hard it will be to get. Which intrigues me.

Bring it on!

Yeah, a lot of this has to do with people who like to pvp and want things to be fair.

Spvp has been lacking so a lot of us play a fair amount of WvW.

WvW uses pve gear and this was not a problem with how the game was said to work, but with expanding tiers it does become a problem, as we do not want to have to refarm all 5 sets of max level armor for each of our WvW characters.. lol.

Had we know this sooner, we would have asked for WvW to use pvp gear in the beta and then it would not have been that give of a deal.

When we pvp we want the best gear and we want the other player to have the best gear.

As a player who gets enjoyment from having multiple characters and armor sets, this sucks. How many new pieces of gear am I going to have to round up to get back into the competitive groups I was already in?

Dedalus.3065:

Crater.1625:

Dedalus.3065:

Once again, I cannot be certain that this will be the way. I could very well be wrong and it will be a huge grind. As I’ve stated in my previous posts, with lack of certainty you must embrace possibilities.

There isn’t really a lack of certainty, either. They’ve explicitly stated that the Ascended Rings will come from the FotM dungeon (here’s hoping that doesn’t become one of those oddly-appropriate acronyms), and the back braces are obtained through special Mystic Forge recipes.

So the Ascended Rings are going to impose more of a requirement that the player participate in a specific kind of content than Exotics do, and the Ascended back braces may or may not require the player to split his or her efforts between different gameplay modes. All of them are practically guaranteed to require more time and effort to acquire than their Exotic equivalents.

Actually, If I’m not mistaken or if I’m lacking a different source, they said that you can acquire the ring from the dungeon. They didn’t state that it’s the only way, nor that you will have to do the dungeon a certain amount of times. Granted, based on previous experience in this game, one would not be entirely with fault for assuming that one would have to do this dungeon many times. But since they have said that there will be mystic forge recipes, I believe that their utmost intention is to spread the requirements for BiS, as I’ve stated, to reduce the feeling of grind. If this is indeed their intention, then it would not be one’s fault to assume that there won’t be a severe grind for the new tier. Add along to this, the fact that the new dungeon will be more randomized, and you’ll have a way of gaining the BiS that’s not a grind.

I find it humorous that the Ascended gear was probably a response to people feeling that exotic gear was too grindy, and then everyone assumes that there will be even more grind. However, as I’ve said before, people are not with fault for assuming this. But I still think that since these developers have provided an entertaining product, that they deserve some trust and not utmost and fast dismissal of their integrity and legitimacy.

Hopefully, after this patch, new people trying to get the BiS will not feel the grind that we felt the first time we got our exotics.

Ur logic is all over the floor, they added this because exotic was too easy, u will actually grind ALOT more for these than u do for exotics, its intended and officially stated, u will get the illusion u grind less, quite possibly because ull take half the time u did to get a full exotic set and jewelry wasted into 2 mediocre pieces called “ascended”.
So no, by no means this is a funner way to get exotics nor it can patch the past by making us grind more in the future despite the fact that we already grinded for it. Its simply contradictory and irrational to even think about it that way, youre right about 1 thing though, the remaining ppl bothering with the game will not feel the grind that we did, they will feel it worse.

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

IceCold.5172:

I personally is looking forward to a new dungeon. And the new gear. Cant see what the fuzz is all about if people dont want to grind DONT do it. Stop kittening and whining like little kids lol.

The problem here is that someone with a full set of ascended will have quite higher stats. For example 1000+ hp, 5%+ crit chance, 30%+ crit damage. Those are examples but over all each piece will give you 8% more stats. When some items are over 100 stats already that 8% is massive in power boost. This is what people dont realize. In order to stay useful you will have to grind.

Well, the fact of the matter is that you can’t know that. I’m not saying that it’s impossible that we will have to grind, but I’m saying that it’s possible that we don’t have to grind. I mean everyone here says that GW2 is about enjoying the journey, playing for fun and all that. What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

This new tier is being put in so gear grinders have something to grind. According to how they have covered it this new gear is going to take time. More so than exotic’s, and less than legendary’s in order to try to hold off the content locust. So by that we can assume its infact not easy to get this gear, and will infact be time consuming in order to grind it out.

They stated that the tier is between exotic’s and legendaries, correct. But you must remember that there’s a big difference in the acquisition of legendaries and exotics. For legendaries, you need to grind every part of the game. For exotics, you need to grind one part of the game. Their goal could very well be to eliminate the grind that exotics require by spreading it out across all aspects of the game (like legendaries).

Which forces me to grind content i do not want to do. Any way you look at it is a massive time sink into content you may not like. I have dabbled in about everything out there. I personally do have area’s i will not touch ever again. If it forces me into these area’s i will leave. Thing is im not alown here. A large core of players will do the same thing.

But the main selling point of GW2 end game was that the entire game was the end game. Isn’t it logical then that the rewards for experiencing the end game covers all of it? And I know that you will say that the reward for experiencing the end game is fun, but the previous reward was actually exotic gear, but the acquisition of exotic gear is flawed since it didn’t cover the entire end game. And I have to ask another thing, is doing a dungeon once considered grinding?

Actually the main selling points was no gear grind. Top end gear available from every area of the game. You could do any part of the game but were not forced into any part of it. It was always known that highest stat gear would be easy to get as thats not the reward. The reward was the hard to get skins. Frankly hard to get skins are still exactly that. Thats why not everyone is in t3 culture gear and wielding legendary’s.

Dedalus.3065:

And I have to ask another thing, is doing a dungeon once considered grinding?

There’s very little ways to please me with that mess. If I knew I could get some ring better than any exotics I bought for just a single dungeon run, I for sure would NEVER have put 2.5g to buy one. And I bought 4 XD 2 different sets, 2 rings each.

Wouldn’t you be pissed of if you just bought 10g worth of uselessness? But wait, it’s even better ! ArenaNet promised that soon enough, the rest of my jewelry will ALSO become as obsolete. So we are looking at 25g in total of planed uselessness. There’s still a tiiiny hope that the armor and weapon sets I bought won’t be 100% useless on the spot if you really cannot put runes of sigils in the ascended ones which I doubt.