Guild Wars 2

Vlad Morbius.1759:

Jemmi.6058:

Vlad Morbius.1759:

Old person…new to the internet is an oxymoron or is that too complex for you to understand. As far as ownership of the pixels in the game, what i do with them is my right as long as i do not break any of the terms of agreement and when i read them…yes some of us do that, nowhere did it say i must parcel out my character information to anyone named Jemmi or anyone else for that matter see for yourself; https://www.guildwars2.com/en/legal/guild-wars-2-content-terms-of-use/
Also if “it” is bowing down to pressure from those of the me gen well I hate to disappoint you but that isn’t going to happen anytime soon.

It is not an oxymoron. Do you know what oxymorons are?
Oxymoron is a figure of speech that includes contradictory terms that appear in conjunction, such as “living dead” or “jumbo shrimp”

The phrase “an old person who is new to the internet” does not have two contradictory terms in conjunction . Additionally, an old person can be new to something without it being contradictory.

For the link you provided me, the only mention of ownership is the following quote

You acknowledge and agree that no title nor any other form of ownership to the content has been or will be transferred to you from ArenaNet nor from anyone else

How about an old person who has been on the internet since it was first introduced, does that qualify as an oxymoron? Pathetic, old does not mean inexperienced of the internet. anyway the argument was entitlement and you nor anyone else has any when it comes to knowing anything about my character beyond the look i sport or the name i use.

If an old person meant that they were inexperienced on the internet, it would be redundant for me to use both adjectives. Consequently, I used both adjectives. I am assuming from your response that you are old and are experienced on the internet. By first introduced, do you mean you were using the internet in the 1960’s, or when personal computers became popular in the 90’s? Also, It still doesn’t qualify as an oxymoron.

If you wish to argue entitlement. My counter was that you are acting entitled, in that you feel you have ownership over your character, which you don’t. I may have to read more of the terms to say this with 100% certainty, but from that quote before, it sure seems like that is the case.

I could also argue that with your same logic, one should not be able to know what spells I am casting. Therefore, all spell effects should be removed, so you don’t know what I am doing, as that is not really any of your business.

Do you not think that it would be better for everyone to share this information, so that we can all learn from one another and improve upon ourselves?

For your convenience I found the appropriate user terms regarding intellectual property rights: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/legal/guild-wars-2-user-agreement/ CTRL F to “Property” I’ve quoted the part that I feel is most relevant.

You acknowledge, and further agree, that You have no IP right related to any Account ID, any Account Display Name, any NCSOFT Message Board ID, any communication or information on any NCSOFT Message Board provided by You or anyone else, any information, feedback or communication related to the Game, any Character ID or characteristics related to a Character ID

Jemmi.6058:

From my summary, at this time, the Pro’s seem to outweigh the Con’s.

Hrm…

Pros:
1) Elitists can be more elite
2) People wanting to be carried through dungeons can have an easier time of it
3) I can’t actually see a good argument for why you would even want this? (1 freebie pro!)

Cons:
1) Players can get turned off of the game the first time they try to run a dungeon and get booted because their gear wasn’t good enough
2) The entrance into getting gear will become far more steep. It will become a catch 22 of “you need good gear to run the instance, but you need to run the instance to get good gear”.
3) If you ever find a good look, you will suddenly find a dozen people who look exactly like you.
4) “Link me ur purples”
5) Random messages from ignorant fools who read that some build is the best ever, and without doing any math themselves believe it. Therefor anyone with a better build who simply doesn’t want to share it with anyone will get kittened at constantly by said people QQing because they don’t understand your gear layout
6) Not that your build being secret would be a problem anymore, because- oh yea. That would likely be part of the inspect too.

From my summary, at this time, the Cons seem to outweigh the Pros.

See what I did there? Making a biased “argument” post and then declaring a victor based on your own bias wont achieve much…

Mirta.5029:

ProxyDamage.9826:

Do you also try to stop people in the street from looking at you? No? Why not? They’re invading your “privacy” just as much. They certainly didn’t pay for your life! I don’t see you asking for the ability to just blank out your character so others can’t see it. Why not?

Did you know that in many societies you’re not legally allowed to hide your identity in public? Are you going to make an uproar and fight against that? No? Why not?

When you can answer that you’ll understand why your entire argument is simply dishonest bullkitten.

How many people that I pass trough on the street are able to know what level of education do I have, where I work and what my age is? Imagine if we had a tool to just scan all of that extra information. Now imagine if we based our decisions on that information. “No sir, you don’t get to buy this newspaper, you work as a salesman and we want our newspaper to be prestigious. Come back and ask for it again when you’re a bank manager at least!”.
“you are very attractive, I would talk to you and get to know you but this device says that you’re 25. My ideal age range is 20 to 24. You’re over the limit. Sorry”.

No one give a rat about your level of education on the street. But if you want to try out for a job you need a resume.

The only reason “I” care about other people’s gear is because I have to group with them.

goldenwing.8473:

For those trying to shame/ belittle those advocating a healthy boundary normally found in society (the right to share or not share information), your curiosity, your need for your convenience, your demand for having things your way for your benefit (e.g. your erroneous sense of entitlement) stops at the door of my right to choose whether or not to share (privacy).

You have the right to play the game the way you choose within the bounds of the EULA. If you demand that I share information before joining a group, then I have the right to not do so and face the consequences of not doing so.

Oh and btw, I am elite. I am a min/maxer. I am not an elitist. I am also a person who values privacy and the right to set that healthy boundary.

Privacy has nothing to do with quality of gear/specs, playstyle, perceived or otherwise.

It’s a core value. If you are interested in my gear/specs, you can certainly ask. I have the right to choose whether or not to respond. And I may choose not to respond for a variety of reasons. I may choose to be friendly and helpful. I get to make that choice. Just because you demand an answer does not guarantee you will receive one. That implies that, somehow, you have the right to that information. You do not.

As to /inspect itself. Again, I repeat myself:

/Inspect enables if not creates an environment that damages, degrades, and destroys community, as well as arguably both build and gameplay diversity.

My argument is that /inspect has no place in GW2 because the concept of inspect itself is fundamentally flawed.

In reality, the only real purposes that are served by /inspect are abusive and divisive. And an invasion of privacy.

My favourite post! well said!

laokoko.7403:

Mirta.5029:

ProxyDamage.9826:

Do you also try to stop people in the street from looking at you? No? Why not? They’re invading your “privacy” just as much. They certainly didn’t pay for your life! I don’t see you asking for the ability to just blank out your character so others can’t see it. Why not?

Did you know that in many societies you’re not legally allowed to hide your identity in public? Are you going to make an uproar and fight against that? No? Why not?

When you can answer that you’ll understand why your entire argument is simply dishonest bullkitten.

How many people that I pass trough on the street are able to know what level of education do I have, where I work and what my age is? Imagine if we had a tool to just scan all of that extra information. Now imagine if we based our decisions on that information. “No sir, you don’t get to buy this newspaper, you work as a salesman and we want our newspaper to be prestigious. Come back and ask for it again when you’re a bank manager at least!”.
“you are very attractive, I would talk to you and get to know you but this device says that you’re 25. My ideal age range is 20 to 24. You’re over the limit. Sorry”.

No one give a rat about your level of education on the street. But if you want to try out for a job you need a resume.

The only reason “I” care about other people’s gear is because I have to group with them.

It doesn’t mean you need an inspect tool to achieve this, though. Just form your usual LFG supposedly “leet” groups. There are many like you who will accommodate you, and others will see the exclusivism in your post and just avoid your group (no offense, you are entitled to play whichever way you want.) Why some people believe they really “need” an inspect tool evades me, since you can still play with “pro-gear” equipped players just as well right now.

Making it “convenient” for the few is not worth sacrificing the whole community. It simply would affect everybody in the long run, whether they care or not about the way you play-CoF 1 being pocket evidence of this.

Star Ace.5207:

laokoko.7403:

Mirta.5029:

ProxyDamage.9826:

Do you also try to stop people in the street from looking at you? No? Why not? They’re invading your “privacy” just as much. They certainly didn’t pay for your life! I don’t see you asking for the ability to just blank out your character so others can’t see it. Why not?

Did you know that in many societies you’re not legally allowed to hide your identity in public? Are you going to make an uproar and fight against that? No? Why not?

When you can answer that you’ll understand why your entire argument is simply dishonest bullkitten.

How many people that I pass trough on the street are able to know what level of education do I have, where I work and what my age is? Imagine if we had a tool to just scan all of that extra information. Now imagine if we based our decisions on that information. “No sir, you don’t get to buy this newspaper, you work as a salesman and we want our newspaper to be prestigious. Come back and ask for it again when you’re a bank manager at least!”.
“you are very attractive, I would talk to you and get to know you but this device says that you’re 25. My ideal age range is 20 to 24. You’re over the limit. Sorry”.

No one give a rat about your level of education on the street. But if you want to try out for a job you need a resume.

The only reason “I” care about other people’s gear is because I have to group with them.

It doesn’t mean you need an inspect tool to achieve this, though. Just form your usual LFG supposedly “leet” groups. There are many like you who will accommodate you, and others will see the exclusivism in your post and just avoid your group (no offense, you are entitled to play whichever way you want.) Why some people believe they really “need” an inspect tool evades me, since you can still play with “pro-gear” equipped players just as well right now.

Making it “convenient” for the few is not worth sacrificing the whole community. It simply would affect everybody in the long run, whether they care or not about the way you play-CoF 1 being pocket evidence of this.

I don’t know why you think those people are the bad guy. It is usually the other way around. People form those requirement group and people dont’ meet those requirement still join.

I’m not even about kicking people. I hope to know people’s gear before hand so I know to quit the group if I think the group is terrible. But really those achievement points already shows that.

And dont’ look at me funny. Because as far as I see, there are far too many rage quiters in dungeon group. I know so because I ran many pug dungeon.

This thread is cute. For those wondering why an inspect command wasn’t in the beta it’s probably because everyone was a noob then and equips weren’t built to farm(each beta was a weekend right?). Every person here asking for builds/equips has been there when 2 crackheads join an FOTM 20 and 1 started the dungeon- then he quits because he can’t run the cliffside fractal. We’ve played COF p1 farm with crappy warriors who screw us over. And then they never stop saying stuff like, “it doesn’t matter what i use, you should just accept me”. No kids, we don’t have to accept you, this isn’t childhood soccer where everyone gets a trophy. Play to Win, Build to Win or gtfo.

Jemmi.6058:

Mepheles.2087:

Ha, this is not discussion, this is just a polite argument. Seriously. 8-9 months without the need for Inspect, why ask for it now? Why not 8-9 months ago? Or in beta? Obviously no one minded, why is this even an issue. As long as people are divided, this idea is going no where. In my opinion, however the cons of this feature far outweigh any “Pros” for it to be of any use to the game.

PROS:
1 Can be selective in grouping for those who wish to be selective
2 Assist with helping guildmates and friends who are new to 80
3 Determine what certain weapon or armoor skins are that you see people sporting
4 Explore different builds on other players for ideas on your own character

CONS:
5 Could possibly increase elitism (no evidence for or against this)
6 Privacy concerns
7 EDIT: FROM TOLMOS: Players can be turned off the game after being booted at a dungeon for having sub-optimal gear

Arguments against
1 Being selective is rude and will ruin my gameplay

2 Why would one argue against helping guild mates or friends?

3 “I don’t want people to know what I am wearing, because I want to be unique in my appearance”

4 Unsure why one would be against this, but perhaps privacy argument?

5 There is no evidence to support this. At this point it is all speculation.
5b People can party up with friends or guildees, or be specific on gw2lfg.com what they are looking for. Inspect can only help enforce any requirements gw2lfg.com specified.
5c There are already elitist people in this game and there is nothing being done against this

6 You do not own your character, and thus hold no privacy rights to the character.
6b Your privacy concerns are not a serious concern, because they are not protecting real world information (such as SSN, SIN, Credit card, address info etc)

7 Players may be turned off the game from having super hard dungeons that they run in sub optimal gear, and that their guildmates will have a harder time helping them pass this given the no inspect feature

I may have missed something, but have been following this thread for awhile and tried to some up every argument from both sides of the pro’s and con’s. Please let me know if I missed and I will edit and add.

From my summary, at this time, the Pro’s seem to outweigh the Con’s.

I have been following this thread since the beginning, and this seems to be an accurate account of all the feelings that have been discussed. I’m glad someone was keeping score. You were even nice enough to include that guy that was worried about “people stealing his look,” haha.

Edit; In an attempt to add a little levity to this discussion…argument…discussument…lol. In WoW, i used to run with “show target’s target” on, so the target you had selected also showed their target.

So, i’d find myself hanging out in IF, /inspecting someones gear…not really thinking about it, then suddenly I would pop up as that person’s target. It would be an awkward moment where i realized that that person just realized i had been staring at them or /inspecting them. At that point i would quickly mount up and take off…i dunno it felt just as awkward as if you were just caught staring at someone IRL…haha. Good times…

Scrambles.2604:

Jemmi.6058:

Mepheles.2087:

Ha, this is not discussion, this is just a polite argument. Seriously. 8-9 months without the need for Inspect, why ask for it now? Why not 8-9 months ago? Or in beta? Obviously no one minded, why is this even an issue. As long as people are divided, this idea is going no where. In my opinion, however the cons of this feature far outweigh any “Pros” for it to be of any use to the game.

PROS:
1 Can be selective in grouping for those who wish to be selective
2 Assist with helping guildmates and friends who are new to 80
3 Determine what certain weapon or armoor skins are that you see people sporting
4 Explore different builds on other players for ideas on your own character

CONS:
5 Could possibly increase elitism (no evidence for or against this)
6 Privacy concerns
7 EDIT: FROM TOLMOS: Players can be turned off the game after being booted at a dungeon for having sub-optimal gear

Arguments against
1 Being selective is rude and will ruin my gameplay

2 Why would one argue against helping guild mates or friends?

3 “I don’t want people to know what I am wearing, because I want to be unique in my appearance”

4 Unsure why one would be against this, but perhaps privacy argument?

5 There is no evidence to support this. At this point it is all speculation.
5b People can party up with friends or guildees, or be specific on gw2lfg.com what they are looking for. Inspect can only help enforce any requirements gw2lfg.com specified.
5c There are already elitist people in this game and there is nothing being done against this

6 You do not own your character, and thus hold no privacy rights to the character.
6b Your privacy concerns are not a serious concern, because they are not protecting real world information (such as SSN, SIN, Credit card, address info etc)

7 Players may be turned off the game from having super hard dungeons that they run in sub optimal gear, and that their guildmates will have a harder time helping them pass this given the no inspect feature

I may have missed something, but have been following this thread for awhile and tried to some up every argument from both sides of the pro’s and con’s. Please let me know if I missed and I will edit and add.

From my summary, at this time, the Pro’s seem to outweigh the Con’s.

I have been following this thread since the beginning, and this seems to be an accurate account of all the feelings that have been discussed. I’m glad someone was keeping score. You were even nice enough to include that guy that was worried about “people stealing his look,” haha.

Edit; In an attempt to add a little levity to this discussion…argument…discussument…lol. In WoW, i used to run with “show target’s target” on, so the target you had selected also showed their target.

So, i’d find myself hanging out in IF, /inspecting someones gear…not really thinking about it, then suddenly I would pop up as that person’s target. It would be an awkward moment where i realized that that person just realized i had been staring at them or /inspecting them. At that point i would quickly mount up and take off…i dunno it felt just as awkward as if you were just caught staring at someone IRL…haha. Good times…

It’s a pretty accurate assessment of the PRO side of the discussion, but it leaves a great deal lacking for the CON side of the discussion. All together it is an exceptionally biased post that ignores many of the points made in the thread.

I have to ask the folks that want /inspect as a tool for putting together groups, which player would you prefer? The one in all level 80 berserker exotic with the so-called optimal build that has never run the dungeon before , or the one with less (in your opinion) optimal gear that has run this particular dungeon hundreds of times?

I think the folks that want /inspect for PUG selection are asking for the wrong feature. You should be asking for some sort of “dungeoneer” rating not gear inspection. Maybe you should be asking for badges that indicate how many times a player has successfully completed a particular path of a particular dungeon, with some supplemental badges for doing it quickly, and doing it without dying etc.

Instead of asking players to ping gear, you should be asking them to prove they have some number tokens from that dungeon. Other than having an inspect to find out what skins someone used (you should just ask them though), the whole point of wanting inspect is to select players for fast dungeon runs, right? Wouldn’t experience matter more than gear? You can buy gear, you can’t buy a badge awarded for some in-game achievement.

Pandemoniac.4739:

I have to ask the folks that want /inspect as a tool for putting together groups, which player would you prefer? The one in all level 80 berserker exotic with the so-called optimal build that has never run the dungeon before , or the one with less (in your opinion) optimal gear that has run this particular dungeon hundreds of times?

I think the folks that want /inspect for PUG selection are asking for the wrong feature. You should be asking for some sort of “dungeoneer” rating not gear inspection. Maybe you should be asking for badges that indicate how many times a player has successfully completed a particular path of a particular dungeon, with some supplemental badges for doing it quickly, and doing it without dying etc.

Instead of asking players to ping gear, you should be asking them to prove they have some number tokens from that dungeon. Other than having an inspect to find out what skins someone used (you should just ask them though), the whole point of wanting inspect is to select players for fast dungeon runs, right? Wouldn’t experience matter more than gear? You can buy gear, you can’t buy a badge awarded for some in-game achievement.

Because there is no such thing you suggested so people pick the next best option. There is no dungeon ratting and there is no experience ratting.

There is just the achievement point.

laokoko.7403:

Because there is no such thing you suggested so people pick the next best option. There is no dungeon ratting and there is no experience ratting.

There’s no such thing as /inspect in GW2, that’s not stopping folks from asking for it. My point is that there are more effective ways to get to the end goal of quickly selecting folks for a dungeon speed run.

Pandemoniac.4739:

laokoko.7403:

Because there is no such thing you suggested so people pick the next best option. There is no dungeon ratting and there is no experience ratting.

There’s no such thing as /inspect in GW2, that’s not stopping folks from asking for it. My point is that there are more effective ways to get to the end goal of quickly selecting folks for a dungeon speed run.

Many other game does have “gear check option”. But I can’t think of any game that have “dungeon ratting check”. So people just think gear check is a common thing in mmorpg.

Not needed and if it ever is implemented then Anet seriously failed in their key objective which was to make an MMO that wasn’t gear dependent, period. If this happens, there will be a mass exodus of many players who came here to escape that whole elitist mentality.
P.S. in case anyone doubts the end result, how do you suppose sites like “elitistjerks.com” came to be.

Vlad Morbius.1759:

Not needed and if it ever is implemented then Anet seriously failed in their key objective which was to make an MMO that wasn’t gear dependent, period. If this happens, there will be a mass exodus of many players who came here to escape that whole elitist mentality.
P.S. in case anyone doubts the end result, how do you suppose sites like “elitistjerks.com” came to be.

As far as I know, there are so many more “rage quitters” in this game. People in this game are more elitist than other game I played.

Oh, I never die so much in this dungeon. You guys sucks. Rage quit.

laokoko.7403:

Vlad Morbius.1759:

Not needed and if it ever is implemented then Anet seriously failed in their key objective which was to make an MMO that wasn’t gear dependent, period. If this happens, there will be a mass exodus of many players who came here to escape that whole elitist mentality.
P.S. in case anyone doubts the end result, how do you suppose sites like “elitistjerks.com” came to be.

As far as I know, there are so many more “rage quitters” in this game. People in this game are more elitist than other game I played.

Oh, I never die so much in this dungeon. You guys sucks. Rage quit.

Not relevant, and neither is this stupid thread.

Pandemoniac.4739:

laokoko.7403:

Because there is no such thing you suggested so people pick the next best option. There is no dungeon rating and there is no experience rating.

There’s no such thing as /inspect in GW2, that’s not stopping folks from asking for it. My point is that there are more effective ways to get to the end goal of quickly selecting folks for a dungeon speed run.

Don’t bother suggesting other options or compromise solutions. The majority on both sides are not interested.

laokoko.7403:

Pandemoniac.4739:

laokoko.7403:

Because there is no such thing you suggested so people pick the next best option. There is no dungeon ratting and there is no experience ratting.

There’s no such thing as /inspect in GW2, that’s not stopping folks from asking for it. My point is that there are more effective ways to get to the end goal of quickly selecting folks for a dungeon speed run.

Many other game does have “gear check option”. But I can’t think of any game that have “dungeon ratting check”. So people just think gear check is a common thing in mmorpg.

Why limit yourself to what you’ve seen before? If the solution is always what has been done before, we’d probably be playing Pong with really fancy graphics.

Badges for accomplishing certain feats in game is not some bizarre unheard of mechanic. You get titles awarded for different in-game achievements. It’s not that far a stretch to make them apply to things the dungeon runners care about, and it would be a much better measure of skill than a gear check.

The only folks that would have to worry about it are the folks that aren’t accurately representing their experience with a particular dungeon to the team.

After 12 pages I think the question has been answered in every possible way…

Gizmo.9178:

After 12 pages I think the question has been answered in every possible way…

Actually it was answered every possible way about 2 months and 9 pages ago

But the topic never dies:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-1/first#post1357523
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/GW2-Armory-or-inspect
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-Characters
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Please-Add-An-Option-To-Inspect-Other-Players/381589
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-Gear-Option-REQUIRED/1294689
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/players/Armor-Inspecting/49067

et cetera et cetera and so on

laokoko.7403:

Pandemoniac.4739:

laokoko.7403:

Because there is no such thing you suggested so people pick the next best option. There is no dungeon ratting and there is no experience ratting.

There’s no such thing as /inspect in GW2, that’s not stopping folks from asking for it. My point is that there are more effective ways to get to the end goal of quickly selecting folks for a dungeon speed run.

Many other game does have “gear check option”. But I can’t think of any game that have “dungeon ratting check”. So people just think gear check is a common thing in mmorpg.

The difference is that in many MMOs, gear matters, whereas on GW2, skill and experience is king. No way a beginning player with supposedly optimal Berserker’s gear (or whatever may be deemed “optimal” in the future) is “better” at running a dungeon than someone with “bad”, full Rabid gear that knows the game inside out (more or less.) You can have “bad” gear and do well, when in most other games you refer to, that usually can’t be the case.

In short, wanting an inspect tool is more of a holdover from other games that “needed” the tool, but luckily, it’s not needed at all in here (the minor “inconvenience” towards those who want the tool is not worth sacrificing the whole community’s atmosphere.)

Saying “there will always be elitists” is no argument, because an inspect tool will spread pseudo-elitism (players with “pro-gear” but that are not as good as they would like to think) and make it the norm over time-the main reason it doesn’t fit GW2 as it may have the other games you used to enjoy playing.

I would personally love to see this feature implemented.

The only people crying about it are those with something to hide….

whether it is MF instead of team-contributing stats.
…or greens and yellows instead of orange and pink.

Pandemoniac.4739:

Gizmo.9178:

After 12 pages I think the question has been answered in every possible way…

Actually it was answered every possible way about 2 months and 9 pages ago

But the topic never dies:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-1/first#post1357523
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/GW2-Armory-or-inspect
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-Characters
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Please-Add-An-Option-To-Inspect-Other-Players/381589
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-Gear-Option-REQUIRED/1294689
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/players/Armor-Inspecting/49067

et cetera et cetera and so on

I see a funny pattern that those advocating an inspect feature since they are forced to play with others are the kind of person I don’t want to play with. Why don’t all of them join the same guild and keep updated listing of all gear each other is using, based on periodically checking in-game? Would remove their “need” to play with other, common players and instead allow themselves to play with similarly-minded people. For as much good as that would do.

Erasculio.2914:

Pandemoniac.4739:

Gizmo.9178:

After 12 pages I think the question has been answered in every possible way…

Actually it was answered every possible way about 2 months and 9 pages ago

But the topic never dies:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-1/first#post1357523
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/GW2-Armory-or-inspect
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-Characters
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Please-Add-An-Option-To-Inspect-Other-Players/381589
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-Gear-Option-REQUIRED/1294689
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/players/Armor-Inspecting/49067

et cetera et cetera and so on

I see a funny pattern that those advocating an inspect feature since they are forced to play with others are the kind of person I don’t want to play with. Why don’t all of them join the same guild and keep updated listing of all gear each other is using, based on periodically checking in-game? Would remove their “need” to play with other, common players and instead allow themselves to play with similarly-minded people. For as much good as that would do.

It’s a win-win situation.

You don’t want to play with us “elitists” if we are going to exclude you for wearing sub-par gear.

…and we “elitists” certainly don’t want to play with you if you are wearing sub-par gear.

:)

TheBlackLeech.9360:

I would personally love to see this feature implemented.

The only people crying about it are those with something to hide….

whether it is MF instead of team-contributing stats.
…or greens and yellows instead of orange and pink.

This is either a troll post, or misinformed. No offense if it is the latter, but you clearly didn’t read many of the posts that oppose the tool even if they never use MF gear or green/yellows on Dungeons-we just think it’s a totally unneeded feature that will bring more harm than good overall to everyone in the community.

Does ANet has something to hide? Because they are the ones that aren’t implementing it, and oppose putting such a tool in the game.

There’s much more to the world than black and white, and that extends itself to GW2 as well.

(Nobody is crying about it, because it will never be implemented… the ones “crying” are actually those who would want it for no other reason than personal convenience. Ironically, they are fighting against themselves, because what would happen is that many players would adopt the gear they want JUST to get into a party as a PUG, regardless of “skill”, and ultimately make their dungeon runs harder, because gear won’t determine the success of a run unlike many other games-character awareness, experience, and skill will.)

TheBlackLeech.9360:

Erasculio.2914:

Pandemoniac.4739:

Gizmo.9178:

After 12 pages I think the question has been answered in every possible way…

Actually it was answered every possible way about 2 months and 9 pages ago

But the topic never dies:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-1/first#post1357523
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/GW2-Armory-or-inspect
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-Characters
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Please-Add-An-Option-To-Inspect-Other-Players/381589
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Inspect-Gear-Option-REQUIRED/1294689
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/players/Armor-Inspecting/49067

et cetera et cetera and so on

I see a funny pattern that those advocating an inspect feature since they are forced to play with others are the kind of person I don’t want to play with. Why don’t all of them join the same guild and keep updated listing of all gear each other is using, based on periodically checking in-game? Would remove their “need” to play with other, common players and instead allow themselves to play with similarly-minded people. For as much good as that would do.

It’s a win-win situation.

You don’t want to play with us “elitists” if we are going to exclude you for wearing sub-par gear.

…and we “elitists” certainly don’t want to play with you if you are wearing sub-par gear.

:)

No, it’s a lose-lose.

You think gear makes up for lacking skill. You will be wildly disappointed. It will become the norm that people will want to use the gear you prescribe for them to use, ultimately “forcing” them to play your way. That’s fine, but you’ll get plenty of players with the “right” gear and lacking experience. Since skill matters more than gear, this will bite you back hard. You lose, because you will never be able to “inspect” someone’s ability or experience (not even achievement points tell the whole story). Many of those players that you would consider “baddies” (horrible pejorative term, BTW) will infiltrate your “leet” ranks with the gear you want, but won’t make up for it with the proper experience/knowledge of game/specific dungeon mechanics.

It’s a lose for the community, because build diversity would be crushed, and intolerance among the community will reach new heights. Players will leave due to this, especially many who stopped playing other games for similar reasons.

In fact, it all boils down to people ignoring that on GW2, gear ONLY helps, but isn’t essential to victory. Many have been brainwashed into thinking that it’s all about gear, so they become too paranoid about what everybody uses, rather than just playing the game and being successful whichever way they please-what others choose to wear is irrelevant, and won’t take any fun away from the way you choose to play (and if it bothers you this much, just play with friends/people that think like you, no inspect tool required at all.)

Lastly, no offense but I never consider any player “elite” just through gear, so I don’t think of you at all as elite. Still I wouldn’t join you, because you seem to be an exclusivist elitist, which I don’t hang out with either in real-life-however, that’s fair, because you wouldn’t want to group with “baddie me” anyway. No inspect tool is necessary for us to avoid each other, you see?

Star Ace.5207:

TheBlackLeech.9360:

I would personally love to see this feature implemented.

The only people crying about it are those with something to hide….

whether it is MF instead of team-contributing stats.
…or greens and yellows instead of orange and pink.

This is either a troll post, or misinformed. No offense if it is the latter, but you clearly didn’t read many of the posts that oppose the tool even if they never use MF gear or green/yellows on Dungeons-we just think it’s a totally unneeded feature that will bring more harm than good overall to everyone in the community.

Does ANet has something to hide? Because they are the ones that aren’t implementing it, and oppose putting such a tool in the game.

There’s much more to the world than black and white, and that extends itself to GW2 as well.

(Nobody is crying about it, because it will never be implemented… the ones “crying” are actually those who would want it for no other reason than personal convenience. Ironically, they are fighting against themselves, because what would happen is that many players would adopt the gear they want JUST to get into a party as a PUG, regardless of “skill”, and ultimately make their dungeon runs harder, because gear won’t determine the success of a run unlike many other games-character awareness, experience, and skill will.)

If I am creating a team, I can choose to exclude whoever I wish for whatever reason I wish, as it is my party.

I could exclude Asurans if I so pleased simply because I do not like them.

…but to do so would be foolish.

Excluding players who are running magic find gear, or greens/yellows on the other hand is something I would definitely do.

Ideally, everyone should strive to be the most efficient while in a group.

If you are taking steps in the wrong direction and knowingly take away from the efficiency of a team, I definitely don’t want you in my party.

I won’t exclude a player for running knights instead of zerkers.

I won’t exclude a player for running runes of the flock instead of a more practical rune.

I WILL exclude a player for sacrificing 1/3 of their stats to get better drops, while everyone else is contributing their 100%

…and I will exclude a player for not having appropriate armor rating for their armor class.

Most people are probably against it because they love bad gear.

I had a PUG recently for a fract 30+, a random guy did ping his weapons, he had terrible sigil so i made a comment on that, he responded “who cares about sigils?”, and most of the group agreed with him they had terrible sigils too.

We did finish the fractal without major problem, but i still think it’s very odd to not care about sigils, may be they think the same about runes and stats on gear who knows…

ps : sorry for bad english, i am trying to improve it on forums

TheBlackLeech.9360:

Star Ace.5207:

TheBlackLeech.9360:

I would personally love to see this feature implemented.

The only people crying about it are those with something to hide….

whether it is MF instead of team-contributing stats.
…or greens and yellows instead of orange and pink.

This is either a troll post, or misinformed. No offense if it is the latter, but you clearly didn’t read many of the posts that oppose the tool even if they never use MF gear or green/yellows on Dungeons-we just think it’s a totally unneeded feature that will bring more harm than good overall to everyone in the community.

Does ANet has something to hide? Because they are the ones that aren’t implementing it, and oppose putting such a tool in the game.

There’s much more to the world than black and white, and that extends itself to GW2 as well.

(Nobody is crying about it, because it will never be implemented… the ones “crying” are actually those who would want it for no other reason than personal convenience. Ironically, they are fighting against themselves, because what would happen is that many players would adopt the gear they want JUST to get into a party as a PUG, regardless of “skill”, and ultimately make their dungeon runs harder, because gear won’t determine the success of a run unlike many other games-character awareness, experience, and skill will.)

If I am creating a team, I can choose to exclude whoever I wish for whatever reason I wish, as it is my party.

I could exclude Asurans if I so pleased simply because I do not like them.

…but to do so would be foolish.

Excluding players who are running magic find gear, or greens/yellows on the other hand is something I would definitely do.

Ideally, everyone should strive to be the most efficient while in a group.

If you are taking steps in the wrong direction and knowingly take away from the efficiency of a team, I definitely don’t want you in my party.

I won’t exclude a player for running knights instead of zerkers.

I won’t exclude a player for running runes of the flock instead of a more practical rune.

I WILL exclude a player for sacrificing 1/3 of their stats to get better drops, while everyone else is contributing their 100%

…and I will exclude a player for not having appropriate armor rating for their armor class.

You are entitled to your opinions, even if I disagree, but the fact remains that what you posted has no bearing with the game “needing” an inspect tool. It simply doesn’t, and ANet realizes it. You can still play with like-minded people now (some people lie, but it doesn’t make everyone a liar, and certainly it’s unfair for the whole community to suffer for the “sins” of the few liars out there.)

(Be aware too that elitism often breeds an active, anti-elitist reaction from a few players, and you may be getting grieved in-game to counteract what they think is silly behavior on your part. That’s why you may be getting a “leecher” on MF gear-he/she may be trolling you for disagreeing with your requirements. He/she may be a great player, and may even have Berserker’s gear (for instance), but just wants to annoy you for deeming you a nuisance. I would never do that myself, as I leave people to their own delusions of grandeur alone, and just don’t group with them. Even these few players with a trolling agenda don’t warrant that the whole community pays the price of an Inspect tool, though.)

Again, MANY of those who oppose the tool are not MF gear users, or green/yellow users-though I wouldn’t still discriminate against them, because who knows, they may know what they are doing more than I do (perhaps they are playing an alt, etc.)

Star Ace.5207:

You are entitled to your opinions, even if I disagree, but the fact remains that what you posted has no bearing with the game “needing” an inspect tool. It simply doesn’t, and ANet realizes it. You can still play with like-minded people now (some people lie, but it doesn’t make everyone a liar, and certainly it’s unfair for the whole community to suffer for the “sins” of the few liars out there.)

I never said the game needed this feature.
I said:
“I would personally love to see this feature implemented.”

“personally” of course, referencing my own preference.

Star Ace.5207:

(Be aware too that elitism often breeds an active, anti-elitist reaction from a few players, and you may be getting grieved in-game to counteract what they think is silly behavior on your part. That’s why you may be getting a “leecher” on MF gear-he/she may be trolling you for disagreeing with your requirements. He/she may be a great player, and may even have Berserker’s gear (for instance), but just wants to annoy you for deeming you a nuisance. I would never do that myself, as I leave people to their own delusions of grandeur alone, and just don’t group with them. Even these few players with a trolling agenda don’t warrant that the whole community pays the price of an Inspect tool, though.)

Again, MANY of those who oppose the tool are not MF gear users, or green/yellow users-though I wouldn’t still discriminate against them, because who knows, they may know what they are doing more than I do (perhaps they are playing an alt, etc.)

If what you say is true, and “many” of these users are not MF or green/yellow users, what is there to be ashamed of or hide?

Is there some overwhelming fear of constructive criticism about your build/runes/sigils/stat choices…. from your peers?

Are you afraid of the fact that there might be a more efficient way of doing something, and you are xenophobic to the point where you don’t want to change it to be better? …or maybe you just really like doing things inefficiently simply because it is more entertaining for you.

Constructive criticism only helps players.

It is only when players intentionally avoid the consensus on what is viable, do they begin to fear said criticism.

I would compare it to cutting your grass with scissors in the middle of the night so that your neighbor doesn’t see you and recommend that you instead use a lawnmower.

You, yourself, know that what you are doing is foolish, so why even attempt to hide it? Why not do it efficiently and properly?

It just boils down to players who have a problem with being corrected or told they are wrong.

Again, we all play Guild Wars 2 to have fun, and I am not trying to prevent anyone from having said fun.

People don’t like being told they are doing things in a strange way, because they are enjoying themselves… and it would bring them down.

You wanna run torch on a mesmer?
Go right ahead.

…and that is ok.

The game for me is not about enjoying the journey from point A to point B, it is about getting to the rewards waiting at point B as efficiently and as quick as possible.

…so play however you wish, but you have no space reserved in my party, and I will avoid you and your strange character builds like the plague.

TheBlackLeech.9360:

Is there some overwhelming fear of constructive criticism about your build/runes/sigils/stat choices…. from your peers?

Are you afraid of the fact that there might be a more efficient way of doing something, and you are xenophobic to the point where you don’t want to change it to be better? …or maybe you just really like doing things inefficiently simply because it is more entertaining for you.

Constructive criticism only helps players.

It is only when players intentionally avoid the consensus on what is viable, do they begin to fear said criticism.

I don’t fear constructive criticism from my peers. However, the vast majority of the players in this game are A) not my peers, and B) not offering constructive criticism.

I choose not to be judged by random strangers who want to offer me unsolicited advice about a build they don’t understand. I put quite a bit of thought into my builds and my goal is almost never maximum DPS, which is what the the consensus has apparently decided is the only viable build.

The consensus not that long ago was that the world was flat. Just because there’s a consensus, doesn’t mean it’s correct in all situations. Unless you were trying to get from the far Western part of the world to the far Eastern part, assuming the world was flat was a fine approximation of the truth. If all you’re interested in is dungeon speed runs, maximum DPS may be the only viable build for that purpose, but it doesn’t make it the only viable build.

I respect the way you want to play, and you will never have to concern yourself with me and my unconventional builds trying to sneak onto your team. I don’t want to be on your team. You don’t want to be on mine. That’s perfectly fine.

However, gear inspection is not going to prevent the folks that want you to carry them to the end rewards from getting on your team. It actually makes it easier for them to get on the team. Get in a guild of like minded players where you can kick out the folks that are wasting your time regardless of the gear they’re wearing. There are lots and lots of players that want to play exactly the same way you do. How come y’all haven’t banded together yet?

Darth Llama.9217:

Inspect is a horrible idea.

If it was added, it should be for cosmetics only. So if you see someone and wonder what style of armor they are wearing, that would be fine. Otherwise, as everyone else said it would lead to nothing but elitism and division among the player base. As it is, when people ask me to ‘ping my gear,’ I just leave even if I know my gear is up to par. I can’t stand that attitude where you have to be the most efficient gear/build possible or you’re not wanted. An inspect option would magnify that problem by a factor of a thousand.

yeah.. i want use my build and my itens.. .dont want ppl saying what i need to do….. if you want inspect, addons and etc… back to wow…

Tolmos.8395:

Jemmi.6058:

From my summary, at this time, the Pro’s seem to outweigh the Con’s.

Hrm…

Pros:
1) Elitists can be more elite
2) People wanting to be carried through dungeons can have an easier time of it
3) I can’t actually see a good argument for why you would even want this? (1 freebie pro!)

Cons:
1) Players can get turned off of the game the first time they try to run a dungeon and get booted because their gear wasn’t good enough
2) The entrance into getting gear will become far more steep. It will become a catch 22 of “you need good gear to run the instance, but you need to run the instance to get good gear”.
3) If you ever find a good look, you will suddenly find a dozen people who look exactly like you.
4) “Link me ur purples”
5) Random messages from ignorant fools who read that some build is the best ever, and without doing any math themselves believe it. Therefor anyone with a better build who simply doesn’t want to share it with anyone will get kittened at constantly by said people QQing because they don’t understand your gear layout
6) Not that your build being secret would be a problem anymore, because- oh yea. That would likely be part of the inspect too.

From my summary, at this time, the Cons seem to outweigh the Pros.

See what I did there? Making a biased “argument” post and then declaring a victor based on your own bias wont achieve much…

I do not think that my post was nearly as bias as yours. It is, of course, impossible to fully get rid of any bias. You purposefully left out legit pro’s that I had posted and posted non arguments such as “link me purples” and this argument…

The entrance into getting gear will become far more steep. It will become a catch 22 of “you need good gear to run the instance, but you need to run the instance to get good gear”.

…has nothing to do with inspect. For one, you do not need to run instances to get good gear. For two, adding inspect does not change the nature of that statement. If you are saying that people will be blocked from entering the dungeon, than that is included in the elitism argument that you and I both listed.

I purposefully asked that if I missed anything, that you let me know and I will add it. After reading your post, I only saw 1 legit missing argument, and so I added it. I added this because I recognized that I can be bias and that I may miss something.

TheBlackLeech.9360:

If what you say is true, and “many” of these users are not MF or green/yellow users, what is there to be ashamed of or hide?

Is there some overwhelming fear of constructive criticism about your build/runes/sigils/stat choices…. from your peers?

There is something wrong with unsolicited constructive criticism. If people want build help, there are plenty of resources online. There’s also destructive criticism, which might or might not be common.

Fact is, if people would respect others, then /inspect would be irrelevant. Players would respect your request for “X only” and other players would not PM random strangers and say, “Noob, Carrien is teh kitten, u ned to lern to gear.” I have no fear of such, but I would find such communication annoying — more annoying than I would find someone in less than perfect gear for a dungeon.

If I could ensure that the only people who applied to your groups were geared as you wish, I would. I can’t, no more than you can ensure that people would not abuse the feature you’re requesting. This is why I support a “one-button ping all equipped gear” feature, not unsolicited inspect.

This whole thread is just hilarious… and no I am not in favor of any kind of /inspect. The simple solution for those that want /inspect is DONT PUG. Seriously, get together a team of friends to do your silly dungeons with and do it with them only. If you choose to PUG or bring PUG’s into groups… just expect the worst and make the best of it.

Aazo.2841:

This whole thread is just hilarious… and no I am not in favor of any kind of /inspect. The simple solution for those that want /inspect is DONT PUG. Seriously, get together a team of friends to do your silly dungeons with and do it with them only. If you choose to PUG or bring PUG’s into groups… just expect the worst and make the best of it.

If only we could use common sense such as this.

Common sense is such a fleeting trait now a days it’s soon to become a virtue. : /

TheUndefined.1720:

Aazo.2841:

This whole thread is just hilarious… and no I am not in favor of any kind of /inspect. The simple solution for those that want /inspect is DONT PUG. Seriously, get together a team of friends to do your silly dungeons with and do it with them only. If you choose to PUG or bring PUG’s into groups… just expect the worst and make the best of it.

If only we could use common sense such as this.

Common sense is such a fleeting trait now a days it’s soon to become a virtue. : /

I feel it is possible you two may have missed the majority of my points.

My reasoning for wanting inspect are not related to PUGing

TheUndefined.1720:

Aazo.2841:

This whole thread is just hilarious… and no I am not in favor of any kind of /inspect. The simple solution for those that want /inspect is DONT PUG. Seriously, get together a team of friends to do your silly dungeons with and do it with them only. If you choose to PUG or bring PUG’s into groups… just expect the worst and make the best of it.

If only we could use common sense such as this.

Common sense is such a fleeting trait now a days it’s soon to become a virtue. : /

Or we could have inspect, check their build and see if it’s completely crap. No need to expect anything.

That’s what I would call common sense.

I’d be open to an inspect option only if they included an option to block inspections.

Jemmi.6058:

Mepheles.2087:

Ha, this is not discussion, this is just a polite argument. Seriously. 8-9 months without the need for Inspect, why ask for it now? Why not 8-9 months ago? Or in beta? Obviously no one minded, why is this even an issue. As long as people are divided, this idea is going no where. In my opinion, however the cons of this feature far outweigh any “Pros” for it to be of any use to the game.

PROS:
1 Can be selective in grouping for those who wish to be selective
2 Assist with helping guildmates and friends who are new to 80
3 Determine what certain weapon or armoor skins are that you see people sporting
4 Explore different builds on other players for ideas on your own character

A simpler solution, I think to the overall /inspect argument, would be to either have /inspect added with the additional option to disable it (as I would), have /inspect only for cosmetic purposes, or implement an easier way to ping all gear into the chat. With that said…

1. Players who choose to be selective could simply ask all members to ping their gear or else be kicked.

2. Ask the newbie to ping their gear.

3. Use the cosmetic-only /inspect.

4. Google search the dozens of different builds (including gear) that are available online or whisper the player to ping their gear in response. If they don’t respond, move on and use the internet (there’s a good chance it’ll be on there).

Also, just because there are 4 pros and only 3 cons, in your opinion, does not mean that the pros outweigh the cons. The first “pro” you listed is not exclusively a pro in favor of your argument, but could just as easily be added to the pro of the other side: “Players who do not want inspect can play without inspect if they choose to.” Otherwise, there is no reason to have inspect when all of your Pros (except arguably the fourth one) can be compensated through other features that won’t produce as many cons.

Jemmi.6058:

I feel it is possible you two may have missed the majority of my points.

My reasoning for wanting inspect are not related to PUGing

If you don’t want to type them all again you can link back to the post. I’ll quote it:

Jemmi.6058:

I want it for:
1. Finding out the names of aesthetically pleasing gear when I pass strangers, sometimes when I whisper and ask what they are wearing they do not respond
2. Assisting friends and guildmates fine tune their gear and identify areas for improvement
3. To inspect better players, so that I can identify my own areas of weakness and/or come up with new ideas for builds
(snip)

I would also like Inspect to show more than just gear, but the side panel as well – where you can see all the stats of the hero panel. If you could even see traits, that would be awesome, but I understand that this may be undesirable for many.

There is a much better way to explore builds:
http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/
I also like this one for strictly skills and no gear: http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/

The builders let you swap gear and traits and see the effect that it has on your character in many different ways, and is much more useful than any inspect type function would be.

You aren’t going to sit in Lion’s Arch and waste your time rummaging through random players’ builds. You’re either going to look on the forums/fan sites or talk to someone you know to be an effective player to get some advice. In my opinion, you could take exactly the same gear and skills as a “good” player and still not be more effective if you don’t understand what the build is about. What if you can’t get one of the bits of gear they have on? What are you going to substitute for it if you don’t understand why they chose what they chose? What if it’s just a placeholder for a piece of gear they’re working on getting?

If you’re helping someone with their gear/build, it’s really easy for them to fill out what they have, give you the link, you make the tweaks you would recommend, and send them a link back for them to play around with. My husband, the Build Master, and I did this with my guardian even though we were sitting in the same room. I took his build, understood it, and adapted it to how I like to play.

As far as finding out what skins/dyes folks are wearing, I would like to be able to see that too, especially since so much of GW2 is about cosmetics. Contrary to inspecting gear for stats, I think a cosmetic inspection would actually be a good thing. It would inspire folks to look for skins or dyes that they might not have even known they wanted until they saw it on someone else’s character.

Pandemoniac.4739:

You aren’t going to sit in Lion’s Arch and waste your time rummaging through random players’ builds.

I thought the whole point was not wanting to be told how to play the game. Yet, here you are, telling us how to play the game. While trying to argue that /inspect will force people to play the game in ways they dont want to.

Maybe it really is the behavior of individual players that causes this all along, and /inspect has nothing to do with it. Maybe controlling people will always be controlling, and no addition or subtraction of useful, in-game tools will change that.

Wethospu.6437:

TheUndefined.1720:

Aazo.2841:

This whole thread is just hilarious… and no I am not in favor of any kind of /inspect. The simple solution for those that want /inspect is DONT PUG. Seriously, get together a team of friends to do your silly dungeons with and do it with them only. If you choose to PUG or bring PUG’s into groups… just expect the worst and make the best of it.

If only we could use common sense such as this.

Common sense is such a fleeting trait now a days it’s soon to become a virtue. : /

Or we could have inspect, check their build and see if it’s completely crap. No need to expect anything.

That’s what I would call common sense.

Common sense would dictate even further that since you already have a tool available tool to do exactly this, arguing for something that takes this a step further…

Say, an invasive /inspect function, is an effort to push a negative elitist influence into an otherwise healthy and inclusive community.

Elitists exist as is.

You can choose to be an elitist. You have what’s needed to be one mechanic wise. It certainly wasn’t intended that way, but people will be people.

You should not want to foster this mindset onto the community as a whole, even if you consider yourself such a person.

It is lose/lose if you value originality and build diversity even a little bit, even in a min/max way. Other games that have such a tool suffer for it.

You must run A, maybe B, if you are C or GTFO. I prefer to be something more then a means to an end for other people.

I don’t mind if it’s consensual and I’m having fun, but having the community collective force this from me or log off… that’s not fun. That’s something else.

If you like GW2, you shouldn’t want this.

I want game to be convenient. Is it common sense to ask about every little bit when I could just simply check it out by myself? Not to mention possibility to lie, etc.

So I’m an elitist when I care about people I’m playing with. But you aren’t, when you are telling how everyone should play/behave?
Personally I find it extremely selfish that every player should be ready to carry you, if you just want to stay bad/use “creative” build.

CETheLucid.3964:

Wethospu.6437:

Or we could have inspect, check their build and see if it’s completely crap. No need to expect anything.

That’s what I would call common sense.

Common sense would dictate even further that since you already have a tool available tool to do exactly this, arguing for something that takes this a step further…

Say, an invasive /inspect function, is an effort to push a negative elitist influence into an otherwise healthy and inclusive community.

Elitists exist as is.

You can choose to be an elitist. You have what’s needed to be one mechanic wise. It certainly wasn’t intended that way, but people will be people.

You should not want to foster this mindset onto the community as a whole, even if you consider yourself such a person.

It is lose/lose if you value originality and build diversity even a little bit, even in a min/max way. Other games that have such a tool suffer for it.

You must run A, maybe B, if you are C or GTFO. I prefer to be something more then a means to an end for other people.

I don’t mind if it’s consensual and I’m having fun, but having the community collective force this from me or log off… that’s not fun. That’s something else.

If you like GW2, you shouldn’t want this.

Wethospu.6437:

I want game to be convenient. Is it common sense to ask about every little bit when I could just simply check it out by myself? Not to mention possibility to lie, etc.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Why-no-inspect/2123217
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Why-no-inspect/2123389
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Why-no-inspect/2123274

CETheLucid.3964:

I’m still trying to understand your logic here: You consider it inconvenient to CTRL click your gear into chat, yet you want an option to type out /inspect to gain the same result?

Seriously?

Well, you know what? I just solved everyone’s problem: If typing /inspect literally just CTRL clicked all your gear in chat for folks to see, I’d be okay with it.

If it’s something that can be forced out of a player or used on the player without the players consent, that’s not okay.

I respect the right a min/max gamer has to play the game in anyway they see fit, but that right ends where my freedom of choice and a right to privacy begins.

It’s none of your business what I’m using or what I’m running unless I choose to share with you.

Making an elaborate gear check mechanism beyond what is already in place is folly.

You talk to folks, you get to know them, you get together with honest and like minded individuals to do whatever you want in the game.

Gear ping works wonderfully to that end. It’s a perfect compromise between things. You can share or choose not too.

Wethospu.6437:

So I’m an elitist when I care about people I’m playing with. But you aren’t, when you are telling how everyone should play/behave?

Are you? Alright. That may be true of you in particular.

But do you really want to argue that caring about other people is the reason in general when it comes to efficiency minded people excluding others from their CoF speedruns?

And not say, efficiency? Because their gear and build isn’t up to par or what was requested of them?

Because if you are, I have a bridge I’d like to sell to you.

BTW, I never once told you how you should play the game. You should be a decent person and behave as such.

But if you don’t want to do that, you can choose to behave in anyway you see fit and suffer the consequences of that.

It’s on your head. Not mine. You’re responsible for your own actions. I’m responsible for mine.

Wethospu.6437:

Personally I find it extremely selfish that every player should be ready to carry you, if you just want to stay bad/use “creative” build.

I’m not asking to be carried by anyone. Most casual players do not want to be a burden to your efficiency run.

The people that lie to you in CoF speed runs, or any run requiring a berserker warrior, are MF warriors who try to pass themselves off as berserkers.

If you want berserker warriors and mesmer only, you’re free to make that request.

If an errant ele tries to join your party, you can deny them. If a MF warrior got in, lesson learned. Don’t play with that guy. They’re a sleazeball. Block them.

If you want specific builds only for whatever you’re trying to do, you can already orchestrate that and check their gear.

If you honestly care about others gamers and want to help them improve their builds, you can already do that with the tools the game provides to you. You can talk to them.

OK top reason for no inspect. Why spend time on an inspect, which maybe 50% of the community are vehemently against, when the time could be spent on things which would improve the game for 100% of the community.

• Fix right click targeting
• Add better guild controls
• Secondary character setups

Until all those things are added why spend time on a feature only a small amount of the community wants and a lot are against.

@CETheLucid:
First of all, details are details, System can always be tweaked to meet those requirements. Obviously there shouldn’t be a command called /inspect (we are not living in 1990 anymore) but simply clicking a player could give you the option.
Also lying will be very risky if you can constantly inspect your party members. If you aren’t still convinced, they can add an icon to show that gear has changed since last inspect. Or even better, nuke whole magic find.
If privacy is a concern, sure, I’m all for the option to block inspect. It doesn’t really affect me, but as you can see, I’m not screaming everyone to be like me.

Also you can’t ping your traits. So instead of me clicking once or twice to see all their stuff, they have to click ~20 times AND write their traits.

Good build =/= good players. And having /inspect will not change that fact. The number 1 argument people for this inspect lies on the assumption that “all things being equal” or “player skill being equal”, then a better gear/build will be better for the party. This certainly is true.

But that’s their biggest mistake: making an assumption about people’s skills being equal, when in fact, player skill takes more into consideration in an efficient and successful run than any other gear. That berzerker gear/cookie-cutter build will not save you if you cannot dodge out of Kholer’s pull/spin.

You must realize that if that assumption fails, the whole argument falls apart. If we assume that player skill is NOT equal (and this is a highly plausible and realistic assumption than the opposite), how then does gear and build come into the equation? We have to consider various permutations factoring in skill, build and gear, where one might have one, but not the other, and so forth, and moreover, the varying degrees one has with skill or build or gear. Since there really is no way to inspect a player’s skill beforehand, or no way to create a reliable rubric for such, there’s very little /inspect brings to the table. Yes you know about player X’s build. But will that tell you if they are new to the run? If they are familiar with their builds for pve setup? If they know how to coordinate with other party members in using combos? Nope. But you know one feature that will tell you? /s or /p.

If it were some other game where player’s skill is less important, and gear is more important, then it certainly is acceptable to have it. But in this game, the focus is on the reverse, where you can have people in their level 35-40s finishing AC explo faster than another group of full lvl 80 exotic partymates.

And before we devolve into the adage that “gw2 pve is so easy I can do it in my sleep”, consider that not everyone is as “pr0” as you are, and majority of the people you will meet will probably be less skillful than you are.

Except you can detect the worst combination. Bad build → bad skill/troll.

Wethospu.6437:

Except you can detect the worst combination. Bad build -> bad skill/troll.

How can you know he’s unskillful even before you play with him?