Guild Wars 2

Yup that’s actually what anet is going to do. They think that will fix this broken short cd skill that does 5-8k damage.
Who here thinks that this will balance the single skill that makes revenant by far the strongest class in the game?
Just freaking revert the change and make it a 3s cd kitten . This change is stupid and will never ever ever ever work.
I don’t care if PZ and abjured tell you that they NEED precision strike or else the meta will be bad. Freaking nerf the kitten out of this skill its so kittenING kittenED

I think it needs a shave. But don’t completely revert the changes. This skill was useless before other than using in a combo field for burning or something.

Booms.2594:

Yup that’s actually what anet is going to do. They think that will fix this broken short cd skill that does 5-8k damage.
Who here thinks that this will balance the single skill that makes revenant by far the strongest class in the game?
Just freaking revert the change and make it a 3s cd kitten . This change is stupid and will never ever ever ever work.
I don’t care if PZ and abjured tell you that they NEED precision strike or else the meta will be bad. Freaking nerf the kitten out of this skill its so kittenING kittenED

What needs a nerf is staff 5. Mate, I know you’ve been wrecked by it…

That in conjunction with sword 2 is HELL to face as a guard

BeepBoopBop.5403:

I think it needs a shave. But don’t completely revert the changes. This skill was useless before other than using in a combo field for burning or something.

Maybe for you.. it was great at slowing down people that tried to kite you.
Thing is they nerfed UA and autoattack and moved damage from these abilities to #2 which created this issue. Op skill 1v1 but trash 1vX. I hope they change sword this patch bc its pathetic in current state.

Oh btw, lets also not forget that damage on sword skills is bugged and deals less than intended

Burtnik.5218:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

I think it needs a shave. But don’t completely revert the changes. This skill was useless before other than using in a combo field for burning or something.

Maybe for you.. it was great at slowing down people that tried to kite you.
Thing is they nerfed UA and autoattack and moved damage from these abilities to #2 which created this issue. Op skill 1v1 but trash 1vX. I hope they change sword this patch bc its pathetic in current state.

Oh btw, lets also not forget that damage on sword skills is bugged and deals less than intended

yeah 10k damage on a skill that causes people to double dodge and is an evade itself needs a buff.
as does the highest dps auto attacks in the game when used with quickness.
definitely need to buff harder

If the meta wasn’t condi shiro glint rev would be god. Only thing keeping them from being gods is the lack of condi clear.

Sooo let me get this straight.

You guys mind been hit for 8-9k by precision strike

But you are perfectly fine getting shot for 10k+ by true shot on similar cooldown by DH?

Makes kittening sense yo.

Also before complaining about revenant, try playing one. See how many kills you make and how many times you die. You are bad on it and you are bad against it.

Just facts of life.

P.S: Necromancers are a lot more powerful than revenants.

There are multiple things that should be changed in Revenant. There is need for nerfs, but there is also huge need for various buffs, updates and redesigns.

Riposting Shadows endurance restoration and Precision Strike 1v1 surely are a problem in PvP, but…if they just keep on nerfing Revenant without actually making effort and updating things long overdue (entire Salvation traitline, Ventari, Jalis, promised Mallyx rework, Sword OH, half of the traits in Corruption that don’t make sense and multiple other pre-specialization patch traits scattered around all specializations except Herald) the Revenant can quickly become a barren wasteland.

There are also other bad outcomes – nerfing Sword damage won’t help PvE. Revenant is already at the edge of being worth bringing to raid, many groups just don’t take 1 anymore and, let’s be honest, it’s pretty kittening dull playstyle already being reduced to Chronomancer’s kitten.

Tl;dr – Revenant needs updates because when third part of it is OP in PvP, the rest is somewhere in beta state, left in dust. And if you keep on nerfing and not giving any alternatives in exchange, as Balance Team seems to be doing, this will end badly for both PvP and PvE.

Ravenmoon.5318:

Sooo let me get this straight.

You guys mind been hit for 8-9k by precision strike

But you are perfectly fine getting shot for 10k+ by true shot on similar cooldown by DH?

Makes kittening sense yo.

Also before complaining about revenant, try playing one. See how many kills you make and how many times you die. You are bad on it and you are bad against it.

Just facts of life.

P.S: Necromancers are a lot more powerful than revenants.

While I agree with you generally your last statement in the PS is BS. In the most crucial moment of a match, the beginning, necromancers are crippled thanks to empty LF bar and usually end up focused and killed, after which they start again with empty LF bar. Revs on the other hand are able to put forward their full power from the get go, they can burst like a nuclear bomber and block damage like a tank. Even if we assume and its a big if, that equally played a Necro with full LF is more powerful than a Rev, you’d still start a match with an empty tank as a necro and that balances things out.

the problem here is that you can’t really hard nerf revenant skills, becouse the class handles other op stuff.
So in case ANet decides to only shave specs like paladin scrapper, cleric auraheal-bot, etc… you donna need reve powerhouse and necro to make things actually die.

till the overall powercreep shrinks i’d go with changes like this:
acts like every other projectile skill and casting fails if you are not facing towards your target.
increase cast time to AL LEAST 3/4.
For me the most annying part of the skill besides the 4sec cd, 6kdmg or the bug that makes you take damage if you teleport out of range is that it can be hidden into animations or visual noise this easy. The cast time is so short it can’t even be interrupted. Increasing the casttime would help with counterplay a lot and couse less hidden animations.

XxsdgxX.8109:

Oh look, the weekly Rev hate thread is finally here.

yeah people need to learn to play ^^
i main rev atm and i just played druid for a few days, didnt lose to one rev. its just people crying about crap they dont play because they dont know how to fight it.

Crying about being killed by a class that has virtually no condition management.
That’s the trade off, good damage and ways to avoid it, but when you do get hit it hurts.
As the baove says, why complain about precision strike, why not true shot? why not complaingin about perma dodge condi thiefes or 20 stacks torment condition mesmers? i think its just salt from being outplayed :P

To me the main issue with Rev is that every trait lines have both sustain and damage in high amount so choosing one trait line does not really take something from you. You don’t really have to choose, you get everything, maybe free beer as well xD

For example, in Shiro line you get ferocity bonus in high amount and life steal. Glint is the same… well Herald as a whole is a way more powerful upgrade to a profession than any other elite spec. But hey that is a way to compensate for the ones that are not good.

The problem comes from how it stacks its effect.

The skill creates 3 projectiles, and these projectiles can hit the same target. The damage of the hits is the same regardless of how many hits go to the same target.

Instead, each projectile should do a bit more damage than now when it’s the first time it hits an enemy, but when an enemy has been already hit by the skill activation, further hits from the same activation should do less and less damage the more of the hits end up against the same target, and no chilled.

This way, if all hits go to one enemy, it will still deal more damage than if it’s spread, but not as much as now, and won’t stack chilled so much.

With such a change, the number of projectiles could even be increased to 5, and the recharge kept as it is, and it’ll balance itself on the fly.

Trepidation Lost.3469:

why not complaingin about perma dodge condi thiefes

I took you seriously until this quote. As a thief main, this is the most useless and trolling build. It’s worse than the Vault spamming thieves. Which is kinda the new heartseeker spammers. Problem here is though, ANet actually designed it this way, hoping for people to spam vault

T_T

No Rev nerf until the lame Necro and Scrappers get hit, I don’t care about precision strike or surge of the mists, but please, nerf that stupid condi bot and sustain bot!

hitting for 10k with quickness and might – I’m a revenant you guessed it right

Amineo.8951:

No Rev nerf until the lame Necro and Scrappers get hit, I don’t care about precision strike or surge of the mists, but please, nerf that stupid condi bot and sustain bot!

No Necro or Scrapper nerft until the lame revenant gets hit, I don’t care about chilldamage or the sustain, but please, nerf that stupid dmg bot!

Do you see how dumb this sentence is?

Luto.1938:

Cynz.9437:

Luto.1938:

Ravenmoon.5318:

Sooo let me get this straight.

You guys mind been hit for 8-9k by precision strike

But you are perfectly fine getting shot for 10k+ by true shot on similar cooldown by DH?

Makes kittening sense yo.

Also before complaining about revenant, try playing one. See how many kills you make and how many times you die. You are bad on it and you are bad against it.

Just facts of life.

P.S: Necromancers are a lot more powerful than revenants.

8-9k precision strike, 10k true shot… here I am over here threatening you with my wet noodle dagger with a 3k backstab crit.

^^so much this

Anet claimed that thieves are strong due to their mobility and high dmg hence why they lack everything else. Then they make revs that do more dmg than most classes, have survival than most classes, have mobility of the thief (yes they don’t have sb5 but their chasing ability, which can be used for +1 as well, is way better imo) and have great team support. Oh and they slapped 6 sec revealed on 20 sec Cd on top of it. How do you even name actions from devs like this?

Lets also compare Jade Winds to Basilisk Venom.

Jade Winds – 3 sec. stun 5 targets

Basilisk Venom – 2 sec. stun 1 target

Oh and btw, that’s just 1 of 2 elite abilities Rev can carry, not to mention 2 heals.

Jade Winds which is a risky move due to the fact it eats whole energy bar. And i cant believe ppl still think 2 heals are op.. espesially when we look at Shiro which has no real healing skill but more a dps boost that can be reflected to heal yourself.
Or Jalis heal – 5k hp, 30 cd. OP af nerf nao

Burtnik.5218:

Luto.1938:

Cynz.9437:

Luto.1938:

Ravenmoon.5318:

Sooo let me get this straight.

You guys mind been hit for 8-9k by precision strike

But you are perfectly fine getting shot for 10k+ by true shot on similar cooldown by DH?

Makes kittening sense yo.

Also before complaining about revenant, try playing one. See how many kills you make and how many times you die. You are bad on it and you are bad against it.

Just facts of life.

P.S: Necromancers are a lot more powerful than revenants.

8-9k precision strike, 10k true shot… here I am over here threatening you with my wet noodle dagger with a 3k backstab crit.

^^so much this

Anet claimed that thieves are strong due to their mobility and high dmg hence why they lack everything else. Then they make revs that do more dmg than most classes, have survival than most classes, have mobility of the thief (yes they don’t have sb5 but their chasing ability, which can be used for +1 as well, is way better imo) and have great team support. Oh and they slapped 6 sec revealed on 20 sec Cd on top of it. How do you even name actions from devs like this?

Lets also compare Jade Winds to Basilisk Venom.

Jade Winds – 3 sec. stun 5 targets

Basilisk Venom – 2 sec. stun 1 target

Oh and btw, that’s just 1 of 2 elite abilities Rev can carry, not to mention 2 heals.

Jade Winds which is a risky move due to the fact it eats whole energy bar. And i cant believe ppl still think 2 heals are op.. espesially when we look at Shiro which has no real healing skill but more a dps boost that can be reflected to heal yourself.
Or Jalis heal – 5k hp, 30 cd. OP af nerf nao

Rev sustain is just wild. It’s not about them having 2 heals. They have access to a mini version of Sigil of Blood that has a much lower CD, several evades, blocks, stun breaks, and blinding skills, and synergize crazily well with boons… all while doing great damage with sword 2 and 3, and creating great openings with well used staff 5s

I mean revs (HERALDS actually) are really good, yes. But I would put them bottom of the really good pack so to speak.

There are several more carrying, more game changing classes ahead of herald that need a tuning more quickly IMO.

No support, Herald has been nerfed into the ground time and time again, you realize herald only does like 15k dps in pve right? Ele can do nearly 2x that.

Pvp changes affect all aspects of the game. If anything revenants need a buff and to revert the stupid changes to the sheild skill.

Ravenmoon.5318:

Sooo let me get this straight.

You guys mind been hit for 8-9k by precision strike

But you are perfectly fine getting shot for 10k+ by true shot on similar cooldown by DH?

Makes kittening sense yo.

Also before complaining about revenant, try playing one. See how many kills you make and how many times you die. You are bad on it and you are bad against it.

Just facts of life.

P.S: Necromancers are a lot more powerful than revenants.

DH sucks compared to rev though.

Mightybird.6034:

I mean revs (HERALDS actually) are really good, yes. But I would put them bottom of the really good pack so to speak.

There are several more carrying, more game changing classes ahead of herald that need a tuning more quickly IMO.

necros are maybe better than rev, probably not. nothing else comes close.

Zelda.6325:

Ravenmoon.5318:

Sooo let me get this straight.

You guys mind been hit for 8-9k by precision strike

But you are perfectly fine getting shot for 10k+ by true shot on similar cooldown by DH?

Makes kittening sense yo.

Also before complaining about revenant, try playing one. See how many kills you make and how many times you die. You are bad on it and you are bad against it.

Just facts of life.

P.S: Necromancers are a lot more powerful than revenants.

DH sucks compared to rev though.

Sooo are we agreeing that there are double standards when the community cries like a little baby?

Whaaa, whaa i can’t keel reve 1v1 T_T

Make one then, and become my fodder <3

I much prefer fighting teams of multiple revs than teams with multiple reapers …

Did you see what I did there?

Yes, my favorite class (the thief) has been intentionally nerfed to make revenant look more appealing. But if they didn’t do that, who in their right mind would pick revenant over thief? Thief is still versatile, if they boost the sustain of the thief and add some passive condi management the revenant will be history, even though precision strike is critting for 10k.

Ravenmoon.5318:

Sooo let me get this straight.

You guys mind been hit for 8-9k by precision strike

But you are perfectly fine getting shot for 10k+ by true shot on similar cooldown by DH?

What classes other than Thief or Mesmer have issues with True Shot…? None.
didn’t add war cause they’re bad in everything

Druids > DH
Revs > DH
Scraps > DH

True Shot is fine… you know.. we’ll nerf it if you give the above listed classes a nerf as well.

P.S
Everything on Guardian is OP to a Thief so this convo of yours isn’t going very far… mainly because no other class experiences what you do

Ravenmoon.5318:

Sooo let me get this straight.

You guys mind been hit for 8-9k by precision strike

But you are perfectly fine getting shot for 10k+ by true shot on similar cooldown by DH?

Makes kittening sense yo.

Also before complaining about revenant, try playing one. See how many kills you make and how many times you die. You are bad on it and you are bad against it.

Just facts of life.

P.S: Necromancers are a lot more powerful than revenants.

I play Rev but main guard.

TS needs a target and it roots you with clear animation, and hitting for 8k-10k true shots requires a Berserkers Amulet leaving you with 11k Health to deal with pressure.

Precision Strike can hit . for upwards 6-8k assuming all projectiles crit and it’s with a gd marauders amulet against said squishy classes. Always normally combo’d as Enchanted Daggers->Phase Traversal-> Surging Mists/Precision Strike/Unrelenting assault->Legend Swap Hydromancy/Equilibrium proc mid UA. There’s also the really funny thing about it is I can be running away from someone and use it and have all three projectiles fire behind me without stopping. Also can be used against stealth.

As it stands now Precision strike needs a shave, a medium shave but at least make it so all three projectiles are going to the same target with chance of body blocking. Granted Scrapper, Reaper, and The new Chrono build need some work first.

Lucentfir.7430:

Ravenmoon.5318:

Sooo let me get this straight.

You guys mind been hit for 8-9k by precision strike

But you are perfectly fine getting shot for 10k+ by true shot on similar cooldown by DH?

Makes kittening sense yo.

Also before complaining about revenant, try playing one. See how many kills you make and how many times you die. You are bad on it and you are bad against it.

Just facts of life.

P.S: Necromancers are a lot more powerful than revenants.

I play Rev but main guard.

TS needs a target and it roots you with clear animation, and hitting for 8k-10k true shots requires a Berserkers Amulet leaving you with 11k Health to deal with pressure.

Precision Strike can hit . for upwards 6-8k assuming all projectiles crit and it’s with a gd marauders amulet against said squishy classes. Always normally combo’d as Enchanted Daggers->Phase Traversal-> Surging Mists/Precision Strike/Unrelenting assault->Legend Swap Hydromancy/Equilibrium proc mid UA. There’s also the really funny thing about it is I can be running away from someone and use it and have all three projectiles fire behind me without stopping. Also can be used against stealth.

As it stands now Precision strike needs a shave, a medium shave but at least make it so all three projectiles are going to the same target with chance of body blocking. Granted Scrapper, Reaper, and The new Chrono build need some work first.

Every channeling ability hits in stealth, its a fact of life and ANet are not going to change that. This ability seems to copy physics from blinding blade that actually is able to trace targets in stealth.

The swap issue you bring up is not only related to revenant. I agree, passive procs are way too over the top, be it through life saving traits that proc super often or sigil/rune procs. Do you remember rune of vamp #6? That was real funny ….

And to avoid the revenants combo you have to block and dodge. Something that any class in the meta is doing anyway. I’m perfectly able to dodge all this on a thief and mesmer and scrapper for example. Granted I have issues finishing revenants on scrapper (because I’m not very good with it to begin with) but they can’t kill me either through all the blocks/reflects/heals I’m able to pull off.

pls stop comparing precision strike with true shot. neither the dh has the same survivability and mobility nor he is able to deal an additional 6k hit by swaping legends and weapons instantly.
Not to mention that the animation of true shot is much more obvious than the animation of precision strike.

Oh wow apparently saying that backstab does 3k dmg while prec strike dishes out 6-8k dmg w/o any set up is against forum rules now. DW mods i can type it out again:

Precision strike ignores LOS, walls, range limit, you need 2 dodges for it or thief dash to actually avoid it, it goes around corners (even 270 angle), low CD/low costs extremely high dmg spell with 0 set up and with auto targeting (ignores stealth as well), almost impossible to interrupt as well. Meanwhile thief has to waste either long CDs or most of the initiative just to get in stealth, eat all the cleave aoe, get behind the target and pray that backstab actually crits… for measy 3k!!!!!

What did Anet say? Oh yeah, thieves are strong because of their moblity and high (lol) dmg hence why they are so squishy and offer little team support. Then they add revs that can deal extremely high dmg, have extremely high survival ( i was able to keep enemy point decapped for like half match while facing 3 enemies by myself AND i got away in the end, all that while wearing marauder amy) AND high mobility (yes they don’t have sb 5 but they have absurd +1 and chasing capability) …. AND great team support. OH!! and while we are at it let’s slap 6 sec reveal on 20 sec CD just cuz we can!

So where did that logic go that brought thief to current state? Why wasn’t it used on revs eh? OH rigghhhhhhtttttt we gotta sell HoT. Let’s just give revs a button that one shots everything on map and name it: WE WANT TO SELL HOT. Why even pretend you are attempting to balance?

Lies, lies, so many lies. I can’t believe how many lies (there is great word for it starting with T) been told to us. MMr reset begin of season 1? Was a lie. Elites bring build variety? What a lie. But hey this wasn’t enough, lets show how much we hate thief/warrior/guardian players and create a class that is literary a walking middle finger to those classes.

People cry about amount of necros in lower divisions but diamond/legend is literary flooded with revs. There is multiple revs on every team. The class may be not completely faceroll like reaper but couple days of practice will do it. Stupidly forgiving, stupidly overloaded (the only classes that exceeds at that is beloved gold spooned child of Anet aka scrappers). If there was no class stacking rule in Pro League we would see multiple revs per team (WHICH DID HAPPEN in the past). But heyyyyyyy class is fine yo, L2P yo.

dominik.9721:

pls stop comparing precision strike with true shot. neither the dh has the same survivability and mobility nor he is able to deal an additional 6k hit by swaping legends and weapons instantly.
Not to mention that the animation of true shot is much more obvious than the animation of precision strike.

Except that 6k hit by swapping legends requires the Rev to store more energy than they have when they start the fight.

Rev doesn’t have a CC “time out” box like DH does, nor does it have good ranged pressure. Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.

BeepBoopBop.5403:

dominik.9721:

pls stop comparing precision strike with true shot. neither the dh has the same survivability and mobility nor he is able to deal an additional 6k hit by swaping legends and weapons instantly.
Not to mention that the animation of true shot is much more obvious than the animation of precision strike.

Except that 6k hit by swapping legends requires the Rev to store more energy than they have when they start the fight.

Rev doesn’t have a CC “time out” box like DH does, nor does it have good ranged pressure. Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.

Are you seriously claiming that DH is anywhere good as rev lol? DH may be terror of lower divisions but in higher divisions they usually spend whole game at spawn point. Rev on other hand can carry game pretty hard.

P.S. and no, i never touched DH in my life (besides beta).

dominik.9721:

pls stop comparing precision strike with true shot. neither the dh has the same survivability and mobility nor he is able to deal an additional 6k hit by swaping legends and weapons instantly.
Not to mention that the animation of true shot is much more obvious than the animation of precision strike.

Oh look, you bring the weapon swap and passive procs mechanics again…

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

dominik.9721:

pls stop comparing precision strike with true shot. neither the dh has the same survivability and mobility nor he is able to deal an additional 6k hit by swaping legends and weapons instantly.
Not to mention that the animation of true shot is much more obvious than the animation of precision strike.

Except that 6k hit by swapping legends requires the Rev to store more energy than they have when they start the fight.

Rev doesn’t have a CC “time out” box like DH does, nor does it have good ranged pressure. Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.

Are you seriously claiming that DH is anywhere good as rev lol? DH may be terror of lower divisions but in higher divisions they usually spend whole game at spawn point. Rev on other hand can carry game pretty hard.

P.S. and no, i never touched DH in my life (besides beta).

Don’t put words in my mouth. I said “Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.” If DH was better than Rev, it would be meta. But Rev is not the only bullkitten in the game.

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

dominik.9721:

pls stop comparing precision strike with true shot. neither the dh has the same survivability and mobility nor he is able to deal an additional 6k hit by swaping legends and weapons instantly.
Not to mention that the animation of true shot is much more obvious than the animation of precision strike.

Except that 6k hit by swapping legends requires the Rev to store more energy than they have when they start the fight.

Rev doesn’t have a CC “time out” box like DH does, nor does it have good ranged pressure. Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.

Are you seriously claiming that DH is anywhere good as rev lol? DH may be terror of lower divisions but in higher divisions they usually spend whole game at spawn point. Rev on other hand can carry game pretty hard.

P.S. and no, i never touched DH in my life (besides beta).

Don’t put words in my mouth. I said “Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.” If DH was better than Rev, it would be meta. But Rev is not the only bullkitten in the game.

I agree rev isn’t only overtuned crap atm. Doesn’t excuse their state though. They are one of the biggest offenders out there. But, frankly, all elites need massive nerfs.

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

dominik.9721:

pls stop comparing precision strike with true shot. neither the dh has the same survivability and mobility nor he is able to deal an additional 6k hit by swaping legends and weapons instantly.
Not to mention that the animation of true shot is much more obvious than the animation of precision strike.

Except that 6k hit by swapping legends requires the Rev to store more energy than they have when they start the fight.

Rev doesn’t have a CC “time out” box like DH does, nor does it have good ranged pressure. Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.

Are you seriously claiming that DH is anywhere good as rev lol? DH may be terror of lower divisions but in higher divisions they usually spend whole game at spawn point. Rev on other hand can carry game pretty hard.

P.S. and no, i never touched DH in my life (besides beta).

Don’t put words in my mouth. I said “Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.” If DH was better than Rev, it would be meta. But Rev is not the only bullkitten in the game.

I agree rev isn’t only overtuned crap atm. Doesn’t excuse their state though. They are one of the biggest offenders out there. But, frankly, all elites need massive nerfs.

Without Rev’s massive damage at the moment, we would go back to S1s bunk wars 2 (now with condi!). And do you REALLY trust Anet to make all of the balance changes necessary to nerf all elite specs and not somehow kitten up in the process?

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

dominik.9721:

pls stop comparing precision strike with true shot. neither the dh has the same survivability and mobility nor he is able to deal an additional 6k hit by swaping legends and weapons instantly.
Not to mention that the animation of true shot is much more obvious than the animation of precision strike.

Except that 6k hit by swapping legends requires the Rev to store more energy than they have when they start the fight.

Rev doesn’t have a CC “time out” box like DH does, nor does it have good ranged pressure. Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.

Are you seriously claiming that DH is anywhere good as rev lol? DH may be terror of lower divisions but in higher divisions they usually spend whole game at spawn point. Rev on other hand can carry game pretty hard.

P.S. and no, i never touched DH in my life (besides beta).

Don’t put words in my mouth. I said “Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.” If DH was better than Rev, it would be meta. But Rev is not the only bullkitten in the game.

I agree rev isn’t only overtuned crap atm. Doesn’t excuse their state though. They are one of the biggest offenders out there. But, frankly, all elites need massive nerfs.

Without Rev’s massive damage at the moment, we would go back to S1s bunk wars 2 (now with condi!). And do you REALLY trust Anet to make all of the balance changes necessary to nerf all elite specs?

Celestial amy doesn’t exist. Nobody says that rev should be only class (or rather their elite) to be nerfed. Nothing stops Anet from touching reaper, condichrono, ele nor scrapper (besides personal bias which was showing for years now).

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

dominik.9721:

pls stop comparing precision strike with true shot. neither the dh has the same survivability and mobility nor he is able to deal an additional 6k hit by swaping legends and weapons instantly.
Not to mention that the animation of true shot is much more obvious than the animation of precision strike.

Except that 6k hit by swapping legends requires the Rev to store more energy than they have when they start the fight.

Rev doesn’t have a CC “time out” box like DH does, nor does it have good ranged pressure. Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.

Are you seriously claiming that DH is anywhere good as rev lol? DH may be terror of lower divisions but in higher divisions they usually spend whole game at spawn point. Rev on other hand can carry game pretty hard.

P.S. and no, i never touched DH in my life (besides beta).

Don’t put words in my mouth. I said “Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.” If DH was better than Rev, it would be meta. But Rev is not the only bullkitten in the game.

I agree rev isn’t only overtuned crap atm. Doesn’t excuse their state though. They are one of the biggest offenders out there. But, frankly, all elites need massive nerfs.

Without Rev’s massive damage at the moment, we would go back to S1s bunk wars 2 (now with condi!). And do you REALLY trust Anet to make all of the balance changes necessary to nerf all elite specs?

Celestial amy doesn’t exist. Nobody says that rev should be only class (or rather their elite) to be nerfed. Nothing stops Anet from touching reaper, condichrono, ele nor scrapper (besides personal bias which was showing for years now).

Which goes back to my other point. Do you really trust Anet to make all of the balance changes necessary to nerf all the elite specs without kittening up in the process?

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Cynz.9437:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

dominik.9721:

pls stop comparing precision strike with true shot. neither the dh has the same survivability and mobility nor he is able to deal an additional 6k hit by swaping legends and weapons instantly.
Not to mention that the animation of true shot is much more obvious than the animation of precision strike.

Except that 6k hit by swapping legends requires the Rev to store more energy than they have when they start the fight.

Rev doesn’t have a CC “time out” box like DH does, nor does it have good ranged pressure. Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.

Are you seriously claiming that DH is anywhere good as rev lol? DH may be terror of lower divisions but in higher divisions they usually spend whole game at spawn point. Rev on other hand can carry game pretty hard.

P.S. and no, i never touched DH in my life (besides beta).

Don’t put words in my mouth. I said “Let’s not talk about only one class’s toys here.” If DH was better than Rev, it would be meta. But Rev is not the only bullkitten in the game.

I agree rev isn’t only overtuned crap atm. Doesn’t excuse their state though. They are one of the biggest offenders out there. But, frankly, all elites need massive nerfs.

Without Rev’s massive damage at the moment, we would go back to S1s bunk wars 2 (now with condi!). And do you REALLY trust Anet to make all of the balance changes necessary to nerf all elite specs?

Celestial amy doesn’t exist. Nobody says that rev should be only class (or rather their elite) to be nerfed. Nothing stops Anet from touching reaper, condichrono, ele nor scrapper (besides personal bias which was showing for years now).

Which goes back to my other point. Do you really trust Anet to make all of the balance changes necessary to nerf all the elite specs without kittening up in the process?

No, especially as thief main, i totally don’t. But accepting current state that was brought by HOT isn’t ok either. If it was up to me, i would just disable all elites in pvp. They brought nothing good to pvp but reduced amount of viable builds, made pvp very boring and extremely imbalanced (yes even compared to imbalance we had in the past years).

Revenant without Herald would be garbage like hell. But besides that. I dont get the point that people think that thief and also other power based builds should be able to win against Revenants. This class is designed with close to zero condi cleanse and all skills to beat power specs. protection uptime, weakness apllycation, evades and no cast time blind.
the power revenant is designed to beat other power builds. if you take this away from power revenant you will see them not longer in pvp. Precision strike is so strong, because everyone asked for sword AA and UA nerfs. To be still able to pull out some high damage that was placed to sowrd 2. Yes, it is to high damage. sure. but we not only have pvp, they have also think about PvE. And Revenant is allready bottom there.

Themistokles.1238:

Revenant without Herald would be garbage like hell. But besides that. I dont get the point that people think that thief and also other power based builds should be able to win against Revenants. This class is designed with close to zero condi cleanse and all skills to beat power specs. protection uptime, weakness apllycation, evades and no cast time blind.
the power revenant is designed to beat other power builds. if you take this away from power revenant you will see them not longer in pvp. Precision strike is so strong, because everyone asked for sword AA and UA nerfs. To be still able to pull out some high damage that was placed to sowrd 2. Yes, it is to high damage. sure. but we not only have pvp, they have also think about PvE. And Revenant is allready bottom there.

That is why we need pve and pvp split. Who said that revs should beat other power builds? What you described actually is what thief was until Anet nerfed them to the ground to create revs. Not to mention we are talking about team based pvp here and power of revs lies not only in 1v1.
But, ok, let’s assume revs were suppose to beat power builds. Where does it leave guards, wars, thieves, sf eles, shatter mes etc.? Should they just be deleted from game since they don’t have other roles? In balanced game all those builds/classes should have relative equal chance to beat each other while having their own strengths and weakness.

Revs AA and UA were never ok from begin with, they did NOT need compensation for the nerfs on first place. Why are revs so delusional about it and think they deserve ANY compensation for any nerfs lol?

Revenant w/o herad would be still really strong given that other classes wouldn’t have elite specs either.

I would love to see a PvP an d PvE split. That is what i pray for since i started playing this game.

Look at Revenant. In special here the Power Build. This build cant do kitten against conditions and has all tools he need to beat other Power Specs. Warrior can pull out some nice CC chains, Revenant can easy get away thx to Shiro. No class was able to chase a Thief. Revenant got a Port on 5 Sec CD. At the start there was no CD.
Dragonhunter can burst you down. Revenant has a Heal (Glint) that negates that. Power Shatter Mesmer can burst you down. Revenant has Retribution Trait Line so when he drops to 50% he negates most of the damage. Also Revenant got Staff to Block and Evade even more attacks. But if a Rev gets hit from a Condi Spec he will die and cant do anything against it.
On the Other Hand a Condi Rev has great tools against other condi Specs. Not as strong then it was before the nerfs. but still solid. And a condi Rev can be spiked down.
The design is strange in many points. But this is what a Rev is. Hammer Range etc…
I would like to see some adjustments to Revenants. But this has to be done extremly carefull. Revenant could become useless with the wrong adjustments in an instant.
Tbh. ANet has alot to do. So many classes are garbage or totaly op.

Booms.2594:

Mightybird.6034:

I mean revs (HERALDS actually) are really good, yes. But I would put them bottom of the really good pack so to speak.

There are several more carrying, more game changing classes ahead of herald that need a tuning more quickly IMO.

necros are maybe better than rev, probably not. nothing else comes close.

If I was picking/ordering meta builds for an ideal soloq team, it’d be rev last. It’d go something like Reaper, tempest, chrono, scrapper, druid, then rev.

The support or bunkeryness or team fightyness of the above go way farther than what a rev brings…

You guys are talking as if this is a dueling server. Your delusional if you think rev really brings more to the table.

I’ve never once gone “Guys we need a rev!”

The five classess you would bring to a game are all good in support and holding a point. But you also need damage to be able to kill someone. And the best class for that is a rev. The mobility is higher and he can chase targets all over the map. Nice if you fight on a point that you allready control with you classes. but what if your opponents control two points. you have to wipe them. with your five classes only Scrapper (Marauder) and Necro can deal enough Damage in a Teamfight. But Necro can be negatet from Druid or Tempest on ther opponents Team. Also a Necro can absorb the Condis and give it to your Scrapper.

Themistokles.1238:

I would love to see a PvP an d PvE split. That is what i pray for since i started playing this game.

Look at Revenant. In special here the Power Build. This build cant do kitten against conditions and has all tools he need to beat other Power Specs. Warrior can pull out some nice CC chains, Revenant can easy get away thx to Shiro. No class was able to chase a Thief. Revenant got a Port on 5 Sec CD. At the start there was no CD.
Dragonhunter can burst you down. Revenant has a Heal (Glint) that negates that. Power Shatter Mesmer can burst you down. Revenant has Retribution Trait Line so when he drops to 50% he negates most of the damage. Also Revenant got Staff to Block and Evade even more attacks. But if a Rev gets hit from a Condi Spec he will die and cant do anything against it.
On the Other Hand a Condi Rev has great tools against other condi Specs. Not as strong then it was before the nerfs. but still solid. And a condi Rev can be spiked down.
The design is strange in many points. But this is what a Rev is. Hammer Range etc…
I would like to see some adjustments to Revenants. But this has to be done extremly carefull. Revenant could become useless with the wrong adjustments in an instant.
Tbh. ANet has alot to do. So many classes are garbage or totaly op.

From what you are claiming says that revs need to be toned down/nerfed if they are shutting down all power based builds, and dominating the roles of 3 separate classes, they have higher damage than thieves with equivalent mobility, they have high sustain more so than Guardian/DH, and they have high CC uptime while providing group support on top of all of that. Yes power revs are weak to Condi but that means only 2 classes actually have a chance to beat them without having to be at a higher skill level being Reaper and Condi Mesmer. And then they have the choice to spec Condi which covers their Condi weakness but still makes them viable with the current meta.

I made it easy. In detail it is more difficult over all the classes. Revenant is one of many many problems at the moment. When it comes to condition classes there are more classes that can perform extrem well until one point. they meet a Necro/Reaper. Thanks to all the Condi Transfer Necro is not only a good condi build, he keeps alot of condi builds out of the meta or in other words. they are not viable because necro is maybe the most played class. Burn Guard, Condi Warri or even a Condi Engi cant be played to a high lvl thanks to Necro. Mesmer is a Condi Build and can be played extrem well at the moment. But he has to take defensiv traitlines with high condi cleanse to be viable. As Warrior you can have alot of resistance. But, yeah, Boonstripping is a thing.
Like i said. Im not one of these guys that say Rev is fine. It isnt. But he has one strong Point on the Power Build. He is able to kill other Power Builds but not Condi Builds. If we bring him to a Point were he is weak against Condis and only “ok” against power, he will turn out to be useless.
Thats why i only say we have to be extrem carefull with this class or we will have Warrior 2.0.

Booms.2594:

Yup that’s actually what anet is going to do. They think that will fix this broken short cd skill that does 5-8k damage.

Don’t forget that they implemented this change when they intended to nerf revenant. They cut back like 5-10% on a few skill and gave this skill +200%dmg at the same so it ended up being a buff for power revs overall.

Conclusion: be happy with a 4s to 5s nerf, and hope they don’t compensate the Precision Strike nerf by adding 20x[the lost damage] to the shiro heal.

Themistokles.1238:

I made it easy. In detail it is more difficult over all the classes. Revenant is one of many many problems at the moment. When it comes to condition classes there are more classes that can perform extrem well until one point. they meet a Necro/Reaper. Thanks to all the Condi Transfer Necro is not only a good condi build, he keeps alot of condi builds out of the meta or in other words. they are not viable because necro is maybe the most played class. Burn Guard, Condi Warri or even a Condi Engi cant be played to a high lvl thanks to Necro. Mesmer is a Condi Build and can be played extrem well at the moment. But he has to take defensiv traitlines with high condi cleanse to be viable. As Warrior you can have alot of resistance. But, yeah, Boonstripping is a thing.
Like i said. Im not one of these guys that say Rev is fine. It isnt. But he has one strong Point on the Power Build. He is able to kill other Power Builds but not Condi Builds. If we bring him to a Point were he is weak against Condis and only “ok” against power, he will turn out to be useless.
Thats why i only say we have to be extrem carefull with this class or we will have Warrior 2.0.

Ok I can see the point you were making, but if they brought all Elite specs down in terms of power. That does not excuse the fact that currently Revs have all the benefits of classes like Thieves in terms of Mobility with burst similar to DH and with high sustain, if they removed the sustain they would be fine and share the same roles as thieves if they nerfed the mobility they would share same role as DH and Scrapper. But with them allowing them to do extremely well in all 3 departments is where they have a problem. Hopefully they tone Down all Elites this “balance” patch which is highly unlikely, they would be able to bring the Rev in line.

And about the Presicion Strike it has a lot of issues that need addressing I.e. Find stealthed targets, exceeding skill supposed range limit and ignoring LoS, on top of the amount of damage it has with such a short CD and resource cost.

First of all. They removed not 5-10%. They removed from AA 11, 20, 10%. UA lost two Hits and got 10% Buff.
That dosnt mean that Precision Strike isn’t to strong. But it was totaly useless before the Rework. Now it is to strong and needs again a rework.
Second. Revenant has not the same mobility then a Thief has. Not even close. He can only make use of his Mobility if there is a target on the point. Outside of that. He is just like everyone else. Yes, he has great sustain. But only against direct Damage. He has not the same options then other classes. There is no way to add some condicleanses. That is allways something to think about. He must have better sustain to power just because he cant adjust to condi builds like, let me say, a DH can with something like Contemplation of Purity or Engi with something like Elixir C or even a Warrior (i know, dont complain with a Warrior) with Berserker Stance or Signet of Stamina.

Ravenmoon.5318:

dominik.9721:

pls stop comparing precision strike with true shot. neither the dh has the same survivability and mobility nor he is able to deal an additional 6k hit by swaping legends and weapons instantly.
Not to mention that the animation of true shot is much more obvious than the animation of precision strike.

Oh look, you bring the weapon swap and passive procs mechanics again…

No I’m just considering the whole picture instead of comparing 2 skills seperated from the classes like you do.
Saying that true shot is pretty equal to precision strike because of the cooldown and the damage coefficents while ignoring everything else is just super short minded. Even in PvE it’s not that simple lmao

What are you guys talking about, its a balanced skill. Reasonable damage, easy to interrupt…oh wait… /s